[RBW] Re: Silver Shifter 2 project revived

[Bill Lindsay]

The BLUG today documents a method to get slightly
more cable pull out of a Silver shifter.  

BL

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[RBW] Re: New Greenlantis/ seatpost size?/ crazy pack job

[Bill Lindsay]

Thicker wall thickness means a smaller hole.  All steel seat tubes are 28.6mm 
outside diameter. Frames thy take a 27.2mm seat post have 0.7mm wall thickness. 
 Frames that take a 26.8mm seatpost have a 0.9mm wall thickness. For a stout, 
reliable bike like an Atlantis which should last for 50 years, it makes sense. 
Not that they had a bunch of failures with thin walled seat tubes

Bill Lindsay 
El Cerrito, Ca

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[RBW] Re: New Greenlantis/ seatpost size?/ crazy pack job

[drew]

Interesting. I'll give them a call tomorrow. What's behind a move to 28.6?

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[RBW] Re: New Greenlantis/ seatpost size?/ crazy pack job

[Bob B]

Also—sweet bike!

Bob
Brooklyn, NY

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[RBW] Re: New Greenlantis/ seatpost size?/ crazy pack job

[Bob B]

I can confirm what Bill said. Same thing happened to me when I got my hunq in 
2016. It needs a 26.8. I wish Riv’s geometry chart had that!

Bob
Brooklyn, NY

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[RBW] Re: New Greenlantis/ seatpost size?/ crazy pack job

[Bill Lindsay]

I think it's 26.8mm nowadays.   

On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 6:53:22 PM UTC-8, drew wrote:
>
> I got my long awaited 650b hunq-green Atlantis frame today. Its real 
> pretty and has some nice little details that I wasn't expecting. I'm 
> building it up with parts from the hunqapillar I recently sold, and for the 
> foreseeable future, it will be the one bike I have (in the city where I 
> live). 
>
> 1- this is the third bike I've had shipped to me by rivendell and the 
> packing was great on the other two, but the packing on this one completely 
> blew those others out of the water. I don't know who is packing bikes over 
> there but they are upping their game. Serious OCD design masterwork 
> happening. It's almost a shame to unpack it.
>
> 2- how hard should it be for a seatpost to go in on a new frame? Using a 
> 27.2 nitto that's been on a few bikes and I can't get it much more than a 
> cm in without feeling like I'm gonna break something in me or the bike. Is 
> it possible that it takes a 27.0?
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

I was fine with no foot retention and flat pedals when trying fixed early on... 
until I hit a steep hill with my “too low for the road 63” gear” and decided to 
try and see how well I could just “coast”... relax the legs and spin like the 
wind.  It wasn’t long before I couldn’t keep up and feet went flying off.  With 
front and rear brakes installed it was easy to slow down enough to a cadence 
where I could just place my feet back on the pedals while still in motion so no 
harm done... but it was uncomfortable enough to make me want to consider some 
kind retention so I wouldn’t hesitate to ride fixed for longer rides where I’d 
face even more and even steeper hills.  I have since found holdfast straps to 
be a great option.  They work with many flat pedals and the wide velcro strap 
holds its shape rather easily for easy in/our and is easily adjusted to 
accommodate shoes of varied thickness 

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[RBW] Re: New Greenlantis/ seatpost size?/ crazy pack job

[twowheeledtexan]

Drew,

I had a Hunq that turned out to take a 27. Call Rivendell, when I talked to 
Will he said some of the frames were reamed to 27, and he sent me a post right 
away.

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[RBW] Brake-Area Rack =/

[William!]

I just found out the hard way that a Hub Area Rack mounted on a disc fork 
does not fully clear the disc caliper (at least not the Paul Klampers which 
are extrmely wide). With a couple washers it mounts OK but the 
caliper still interferes with the little mounting pocket on the back of the 
Hub Area Bags.

Sure, I could go with a different low-ride rack and/or bags, but I figured 
I'd check in with the list first. Anyone worked around this or a similar 
issue before? Thoughts on how far out I could space the rack (stretching 
the hoop and/or creating asymmetry) before things become problematic?

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Richard Rios]

while i am no expert I have given fixed riding a go and found that with brakes 
riding fixed with no foot retention is fine. Fixed sans brakes and foot 
retention is no bueno! 

best,
Richard

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[RBW] Re: FS: 58 cm Hunqapillar fork for 26" wheels

[iamkeith]

Here it is.  Send him a PM.   

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/rbw-owners-bunch/tony$20xo-2$20fork%7Csort:date/rbw-owners-bunch/XzUkZ8LS6sM/-f-NvmvBBAAJ



On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 6:28:43 PM UTC-7, iamkeith wrote:
>
> Seems like there was somebody else recently, on this list or the ibob 
> list, looking for a fork with more clearance and enough steerer tube for a 
> 59cm XO-2.  Tony, perhaps?  Maybe somebody else will remember, or I can 
> find the thread.  
>
> On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 8:44:38 AM UTC-7, Conway Bennett wrote:
>>
>> House cleaning, bike purchase and relationship maintenance requires me to 
>> sell this fork.  It was from a grey bean Hunqapillar and I had comrade 
>> cycles in Chicago drop the canti posts to briefly run really fat 26" wheels 
>> on a '93 XO-2.  I never repainted the area where the work was done but it 
>> never saw any weather.  $290, shipped!
>>
>>
>> Fair winds,
>>
>> Captain Conway 
>> Chicago
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: FS: 58 cm Hunqapillar fork for 26" wheels

[iamkeith]

Seems like there was somebody else recently, on this list or the ibob list, 
looking for a fork with more clearance and enough steerer tube for a 59cm 
XO-2.  Tony, perhaps?  Maybe somebody else will remember, or I can find the 
thread.  

On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 8:44:38 AM UTC-7, Conway Bennett wrote:
>
> House cleaning, bike purchase and relationship maintenance requires me to 
> sell this fork.  It was from a grey bean Hunqapillar and I had comrade 
> cycles in Chicago drop the canti posts to briefly run really fat 26" wheels 
> on a '93 XO-2.  I never repainted the area where the work was done but it 
> never saw any weather.  $290, shipped!
>
>
> Fair winds,
>
> Captain Conway 
> Chicago
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Deacon Patrick]

Ha! Sounds like we’re in violent agreement. Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Eric Norris]

“… even if this reason doesn’t apply to every rider.”

So true. So very true.

--Eric Norris
campyonly...@me.com
@CampyOnlyguy (Twitter/Instagram)

> On Dec 12, 2017, at 4:00 PM, Patrick Moore  wrote:
> 
> There are reasons for this, even if this reason doesn't apply to every rider. 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Patrick Moore]

I can generate a lot of additional power by pulling back and up; and in
those instances were I've pulled my foot out of shoe, or shoe out of pedal
retention, I've more than a few times come close to falling over. I very
definitely feel and use the additional torque generated in this way.

But even at cruising speeds, on flats, I routinely accelerate, or power up
inclines, by doing the same; and yes, there is a noticeable effect.

Foot retention appeared very early in the history of bicycles, and people
have used it and insisted on using it ever since. There are reasons for
this, even if this reason doesn't apply to every rider. Rather like drop
bars: they've been around for so long for good reasons.

On Tue, Dec 12, 2017 at 4:43 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:

> Lee, yes. Our eating table is 16” high or so. I just sit on thin cusions
> on a tile floor. My desk is a kneeling desk, roughly the same height.
>
> Eric, I understand. But it sure seems overstated that pedal retention is
> required to ride safely or well. As a rider preferance, makes perfect sense
> either way. Are Phil and I the only ones riding fixed and platforms?
> Minorty of a minor minorty of a minor minority. Grin.
>
> Patrick of the Moore, I’m not sure how you can answer this, but I’m
> curious how much are you able to actually lift/power on the upstroke? I
> presume that is mainly at low RPM, where you can feel pedal drag behind
> your foot pulling up, as opposed to faster RPMs where you foot is more
> likely just carrying it’s own weight (at least that’s what the studies I’ve
> seen show, I think Grant pointed to the somewhere?). In my own experience I
> do better powering the down stroke. When I’m on something too steep to do
> that, I’m faster walking anyway. Grin.
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
>
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Steve Palincsar]

On 12/12/2017 06:48 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:

You are right, Steve, in the event of a foot coming off a pedal, legs would 
need to splay outward


and quickly, too


and front brake engaged until pedals slowed down enough to safely (without 
maiming). I actually practiced this (and other ways to screw up safely) early 
on, though not since. Not fun, not painful,


until you misjudge it...


easily doable. I may again now that I’ve been at it a few weeks.


Be careful.  A whirling fixed gear crank and pedal can be as dangerous 
as an aircraft propeller.




I did chisel ice off my pedals to clear the cleats for full engagement several 
times on rides, if that helps you feel better (THAT’S what those uber wee allan 
wrenches are for!). Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick



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USA

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Deacon Patrick]

You are right, Steve, in the event of a foot coming off a pedal, legs would 
need to splay outward and front brake engaged until pedals slowed down enough 
to safely (without maiming). I actually practiced this (and other ways to screw 
up safely) early on, though not since. Not fun, not painful, easily doable. I 
may again now that I’ve been at it a few weeks.

I did chisel ice off my pedals to clear the cleats for full engagement several 
times on rides, if that helps you feel better (THAT’S what those uber wee allan 
wrenches are for!). Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Deacon Patrick]

Lee, yes. Our eating table is 16” high or so. I just sit on thin cusions on a 
tile floor. My desk is a kneeling desk, roughly the same height.

Eric, I understand. But it sure seems overstated that pedal retention is 
required to ride safely or well. As a rider preferance, makes perfect sense 
either way. Are Phil and I the only ones riding fixed and platforms? Minorty of 
a minor minorty of a minor minority. Grin. 

Patrick of the Moore, I’m not sure how you can answer this, but I’m curious how 
much are you able to actually lift/power on the upstroke? I presume that is 
mainly at low RPM, where you can feel pedal drag behind your foot pulling up, 
as opposed to faster RPMs where you foot is more likely just carrying it’s own 
weight (at least that’s what the studies I’ve seen show, I think Grant pointed 
to the somewhere?). In my own experience I do better powering the down stroke. 
When I’m on something too steep to do that, I’m faster walking anyway. Grin. 

With abandon,
Patrick



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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Steve Palincsar]

On 12/12/2017 06:16 PM, Deacon Patrick wrote:

Ha, Chris! Conventional wisdom is an oxymoron. Which is either a moron on 
oxygen or oxycodon. Grin. I can’t see a reason why pedal retention is required 
to make fixed safe.


Well, consider for a second the situation if your foot /does/ slip off 
(even though that's not supposed to happen).   Until you slow down, is 
there any way to get back on the pedal that doesn't risk maiming?  (And 
I do mean that literally.)


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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Patrick Moore]

One other plus for tight retention is climbing steep hills. I stopped using
cleatless shoes when I found myself routinely pulingl my feet out of
semi-tight straps (or pulling my feet out of shoes tightened into the
straps) when torquing hard -- pulling back and up -- on very steep hills at
very low rpm; this with street shoes. Slotted cleats with
pretty-much-tightened straps worked -- I could still pull shoe out in
emergencies; but clipless is far more convenient.

This sort of pull back and up low rpm torquing is, at least in my riding,
rather common.

And yes, spinning fast downill -- I'd much rather have my feet tight in
shoes, my shoes tight on the pedals.

On Tue, Dec 12, 2017 at 4:20 PM, Eric Norris  wrote:

> Deacon:
>
> For some people (myself included), it’s safer to have one’s feet attached
> to the pedals when going fast and “coasting” on a fixed gear. When the
> pedals start going very, very fast, I would rather not lose contact with
> the pedals, because it’s quite hard to reconnect when the pedals are
> flailing around on their own … you’re then stuck with all your weight on
> the saddle, in a bad position for stability and handling.
>
> Kudos to you for never having your feet come off. Not everyone can do that.
>
> --Eric Norris
> campyonly...@me.com
> @CampyOnlyguy (Twitter/Instagram)
>
> On Dec 12, 2017, at 3:16 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:
>
> Ha, Chris! Conventional wisdom is an oxymoron. Which is either a moron on
> oxygen or oxycodon. Grin. I can’t see a reason why pedal retention is
> required to make fixed safe. I can see why people who like it on
> freewheeled bikes like it on fixed bikes. My feet haven’t come off the
> pedals unbidden once.
>
> On the vertigo note, feel free to write me off group, but have you tried
> nutty things like floor living and minimalist shoes?
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
>
>
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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Eric Norris]

Deacon:

For some people (myself included), it’s safer to have one’s feet attached to 
the pedals when going fast and “coasting” on a fixed gear. When the pedals 
start going very, very fast, I would rather not lose contact with the pedals, 
because it’s quite hard to reconnect when the pedals are flailing around on 
their own … you’re then stuck with all your weight on the saddle, in a bad 
position for stability and handling.

Kudos to you for never having your feet come off. Not everyone can do that.

--Eric Norris
campyonly...@me.com
@CampyOnlyguy (Twitter/Instagram)

> On Dec 12, 2017, at 3:16 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:
> 
> Ha, Chris! Conventional wisdom is an oxymoron. Which is either a moron on 
> oxygen or oxycodon. Grin. I can’t see a reason why pedal retention is 
> required to make fixed safe. I can see why people who like it on freewheeled 
> bikes like it on fixed bikes. My feet haven’t come off the pedals unbidden 
> once.
> 
> On the vertigo note, feel free to write me off group, but have you tried 
> nutty things like floor living and minimalist shoes?
> 
> With abandon,
> Patrick
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Lee Legrand]

Hi Deacon,

I have a question to the last part.  Do you eat off a low table since you
are floor living?

On Tue, Dec 12, 2017 at 6:16 PM, Deacon Patrick  wrote:

> Ha, Chris! Conventional wisdom is an oxymoron. Which is either a moron on
> oxygen or oxycodon. Grin. I can’t see a reason why pedal retention is
> required to make fixed safe. I can see why people who like it on
> freewheeled bikes like it on fixed bikes. My feet haven’t come off the
> pedals unbidden once.
>
> On the vertigo note, feel free to write me off group, but have you tried
> nutty things like floor living and minimalist shoes?
>
> With abandon,
> Patrick
>
>
>
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[RBW] Re: Riv Suggested Max Rider Weight per Model; Separate question about Sam sizing

[Mike Packard]

There was one in Reader #44. Here's a pic:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4cmkuqpss259bga/File%20Dec%2012%2C%205%2015%2032%20PM.jpeg?dl=0

Mike


On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 4:15:57 PM UTC-6, RDS wrote:
>
> Does anyone have a link or screenshot to the info where it showed the 
> suggested max rider weight per Rivendell model?  I can't remember where I 
> originally saw the info .. may have been a rivendell reader.
>
> I sometimes see people list Sam's for sale in size 56.  What was the next 
> size down previous to the current model sizing?  Meaning was there a 52 or 
> 54 or ???  Current Sam's are 51 and 55 .. just curious to what the previous 
> sizes were prior to the current sizing.
>

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[RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Deacon Patrick]

Ha, Chris! Conventional wisdom is an oxymoron. Which is either a moron on 
oxygen or oxycodon. Grin. I can’t see a reason why pedal retention is required 
to make fixed safe. I can see why people who like it on freewheeled bikes like 
it on fixed bikes. My feet haven’t come off the pedals unbidden once.

On the vertigo note, feel free to write me off group, but have you tried nutty 
things like floor living and minimalist shoes?

With abandon,
Patrick

 

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[RBW] Re: Riv Suggested Max Rider Weight per Model; Separate question about Sam sizing

[Bill Lindsay]

I don't recall Rivendell ever posting a max rider weight vs Riv model.  I 
do recall them posting a list of tire widths for rider weight.  Tire width 
certainly implies bike model.  Like if you are 350 pounds and if Riv thinks 
a 350 pounder should be running 60mm tires on the road, then you shouldn't 
be looking at a Roadini or a Hillborne because they can't take 60mm tires.  
A Hunqapillar will take 60mm tires, though.  Maybe you should call Riv and 
talk it over.

There's never been a 54cm Hillborne.  There was a 52 back when it went 48, 
52, 56, 60.

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 2:15:57 PM UTC-8, RDS wrote:
>
> Does anyone have a link or screenshot to the info where it showed the 
> suggested max rider weight per Rivendell model?  I can't remember where I 
> originally saw the info .. may have been a rivendell reader.
>
> I sometimes see people list Sam's for sale in size 56.  What was the next 
> size down previous to the current model sizing?  Meaning was there a 52 or 
> 54 or ???  Current Sam's are 51 and 55 .. just curious to what the previous 
> sizes were prior to the current sizing.
>

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[RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Philip Williamson]

I only use flat pedals fixed, and have for years. I haven't encountered a 
downside yet. I had straps, then clipless, then I made pedal decks that 
snapped into the clipless, and then I went to BMX pedals. Each iteration 
was an improvement. My Ross just has old mtb caged pedals, and also works 
fine. 

Philip
www.biketinker.com

On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 9:44:51 AM UTC-8, Christopher Cote wrote:
>
> As a fellow vertigo sufferer (although not nearly as bad!) I can identify 
> with the preference to a direct connection with your bike, the earth, etc. 
> I have noticed that the more direct feedback of a rigid or hardtail 
> mountain bike is preferable for me, as compared to a motorcycle or even a 
> full suspension bike. I've thought it was the effect of seeing a root or 
> rock for example, and then not feeling it through the bike that confuses 
> the brain. I can see how the tighter feedback loop of a fixed gear would be 
> even better. Sadly, my knees can no longer handle a fixed gear. Maybe if I 
> put a really low gear on it... I don't care much about speed these days.
>
> You're using flat pedals with fixed gear? Conventional wisdom says that's 
> a bad thing.
>
> Chris "round and round we go..." 
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 5:39:31 AM UTC-5, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>>
>> Interesting, Philip. I feel connected with the ground, through the bike. 
>> But I’m highly sensitive, rather like a canary in a coal mine. Lots of 
>> examples, but I’ll focus on chairs, for example. Science is discovering 
>> they are poor for circulation and thus heart health. I suspect they are 
>> poor for a lot of other reasons. If I sit in a chair, feet on the floor, I 
>> have no idea where I am in space. If the sitting platform is big enough, I 
>> sit cross-legged in the same chair, and presuming it’s flat and solid wood 
>> with no cushion I instantly relax all over because my proprioception can 
>> fully engage again. Why can’t it in chair postion? I have no idea. 
>>
>> I’ve gotten a few questions about my vertigo and what proprioception does 
>> for me (all of us, actually, if we let it loose). Quick version: I have 
>> damage in my brain stem that prevents my brain processing spacial awareness 
>> properly, so I constantly experience two axes of motion, like I’m in a 
>> roller coaster that can (and does) go any direction any time, strapped into 
>> a “da Vinci” man gyroscope twirly chair (like used to train fighter pilots 
>> for g-forces and disorientation) that twirls about randomly on the roller 
>> coaster. Proprioception is the ability of the body to know where it is in 
>> space without (necessarily) the brain having a clue, through tactile input. 
>> Lots of “noice” inhibits proprioception for most people, especially shoes 
>> that have cushion, raised heel, support, or does not allow for free motion 
>> of the foot. 
>>
>> Chain tension: I haven’t snugged the rear axel and thought the chain was 
>> too tight, but I also doubt I’ve achieved “binding”. Snug, but not 
>> stretched (though someone riding a loose chain may disagree. Grin.). 
>>
>> With abandon, 
>> Patrick 
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Riv Suggested Max Rider Weight per Model; Separate question about Sam sizing

[blakcloud]

I can't answer most of your questions but I did purchase a 52 cm Sam before 
the size change. If I recall correctly it was 52, then 56. 


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[RBW] Riv Suggested Max Rider Weight per Model; Separate question about Sam sizing

[RDS]

Does anyone have a link or screenshot to the info where it showed the 
suggested max rider weight per Rivendell model?  I can't remember where I 
originally saw the info .. may have been a rivendell reader.

I sometimes see people list Sam's for sale in size 56.  What was the next 
size down previous to the current model sizing?  Meaning was there a 52 or 
54 or ???  Current Sam's are 51 and 55 .. just curious to what the previous 
sizes were prior to the current sizing.

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[RBW] FS: Touring Goodies (Panniers / H'Bar Bags / Rack -- Ortlieb / Tubus / Jandd)

[Jack K]

Hey Riv-folk,


Hoping to convert my excess touring gear into cash for other cycling 
goodies. What iBOB wouldn't want to wake up to Ortlieb under the tree on 
Christmas morning?  Also the perfect Christmas gift for your spouse (if you 
like sleeping on the couch)!  ;)


I'll try to do actual shipping, if that doesn't get too complicated. Should 
be $10-ish for bar bags and $15-ish for panniers to most points in the 
ConUS. Less if you're close to NC, more if you're in Hawaii or Alaska.


The stuff ...


*Handlebar Bags:*


   - *LN Ortlieb Ultimate 6 M Classic Handlebar Bag*: Highly visible 
   yellow/black color, indistinguishable from new other than installation 
   cable has normal kink from being installed, 1 key for bar lock. Installed 
   and rode a few times with it empty to test, has never carried a load, been 
   wet or even slightly dusty. *$80 + shipping*
   - *E**C** Jandd Touring Handlebar Bag*: Used on a couple of weeklong 
   tours, but in great shape. Mounting system is brilliant, goes on or off in 
   seconds. Current mount fits quill stems and standard size bars, but an 
   inexpensive adapter for threadless stems and oversized bars is readily 
   available from Jandd.  No shoulder strap is supplied by Jandd, but I'll 
   include the very nice one I purchased for it at a luggage shop. MSRP $105.  
*$65 
   + shipping*
   
*Panniers:*


   - *NEW-IN-BOX Ortlieb Back-Roller Classic Panniers:* Highly visible 
   yellow/black color, matches Ortlieb handlebar bag above. New-in-box, 
   current model with QL2.1 mounting system, 40 L, super waterproof roll top 
   closure and just about indestructible. MSRP $180.  *$150 + shipping*
   - *NEW “Old Style” Ortlieb Bikepacker Plus Rear Panniers:* Black, extra 
   $ “Plus” model with lighter weight 100% waterproof fabric. Older version 
   with very useful exterior mesh pockets and 2 horizontal + 2 vertical 
   compression straps that are lacking on current model. 42 liters, QL1 
   mounting hardware. Current MSRP $240.  *$170 + shipping*
   - *NEW “Old Style” Ortlieb Mini-Biker Lite Front Panniers:* Front 
   pannier matching the “Old Style” Bikepacker Plus listed above. Black, extra 
   $ lightweight “Plus” fabric. Older version that’s very similar to the 
   current Sport-Packer Plus model, but with very useful horizontal & vertical 
   compression straps that are lacking on current model. 20-25 liters, QL1 
   mounting hardware.  MSRP $165 when they were available.  *$140 + 
   shipping*

*Racks:*


   - *LN Tubus Cosmo Stainless Rear Rack (with low-ish rider mounts):* 
Installed, 
   then removed without ever having a pannier mounted on it less than 100 
   miles later. Indistinguishable from new other than marking on adjustable 
   seat-stay mounting arms where they were clamped by the rack hardware. 
   Original version of the Cosmo, so slightly different than current model. 
   Included is the $13 Tubus "Lower Rack Mounting Kit", which can be used to 
   position the rack slightly further back to increase clearance for heels or 
   disc brakes, or help on bikes with short-ish chainstays. Paid $210+$13=$223 
   at TheTouringStore.Com a couple of years ago.  *$135 + shipping for 
   everything*

Cheers and safe riding,

-Jack K.
Raleigh, NC

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[RBW] Re: SOLD FS: Large SaddleSack Olive

[J Imler]

Sold.

On Friday, December 8, 2017 at 5:23:46 PM UTC-8, J Imler wrote:
>
> Sale pending.
>
> On Friday, December 8, 2017 at 2:15:42 PM UTC-8, J Imler wrote:
>>
>> No I didn't realize that. Mainly going off the bag's condition. I must 
>> say the leather on this guy is legit.
>> Price drop $200 plus shipping.
>>
>> On Friday, December 8, 2017 at 1:59:50 PM UTC-8, Dave Small wrote:
>>>
>>> The bag looks perfect, but do you realize that if the buyer pays $10 for 
>>> shipping then the price to the buyer is $3 more than the post-Rivendollar, 
>>> post-$10-off-coupon price of a new one from Rivendell?
>>>



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[RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Christopher Cote]

As a fellow vertigo sufferer (although not nearly as bad!) I can identify 
with the preference to a direct connection with your bike, the earth, etc. 
I have noticed that the more direct feedback of a rigid or hardtail 
mountain bike is preferable for me, as compared to a motorcycle or even a 
full suspension bike. I've thought it was the effect of seeing a root or 
rock for example, and then not feeling it through the bike that confuses 
the brain. I can see how the tighter feedback loop of a fixed gear would be 
even better. Sadly, my knees can no longer handle a fixed gear. Maybe if I 
put a really low gear on it... I don't care much about speed these days.

You're using flat pedals with fixed gear? Conventional wisdom says that's a 
bad thing.

Chris "round and round we go..." 



On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 5:39:31 AM UTC-5, Deacon Patrick wrote:
>
> Interesting, Philip. I feel connected with the ground, through the bike. 
> But I’m highly sensitive, rather like a canary in a coal mine. Lots of 
> examples, but I’ll focus on chairs, for example. Science is discovering 
> they are poor for circulation and thus heart health. I suspect they are 
> poor for a lot of other reasons. If I sit in a chair, feet on the floor, I 
> have no idea where I am in space. If the sitting platform is big enough, I 
> sit cross-legged in the same chair, and presuming it’s flat and solid wood 
> with no cushion I instantly relax all over because my proprioception can 
> fully engage again. Why can’t it in chair postion? I have no idea. 
>
> I’ve gotten a few questions about my vertigo and what proprioception does 
> for me (all of us, actually, if we let it loose). Quick version: I have 
> damage in my brain stem that prevents my brain processing spacial awareness 
> properly, so I constantly experience two axes of motion, like I’m in a 
> roller coaster that can (and does) go any direction any time, strapped into 
> a “da Vinci” man gyroscope twirly chair (like used to train fighter pilots 
> for g-forces and disorientation) that twirls about randomly on the roller 
> coaster. Proprioception is the ability of the body to know where it is in 
> space without (necessarily) the brain having a clue, through tactile input. 
> Lots of “noice” inhibits proprioception for most people, especially shoes 
> that have cushion, raised heel, support, or does not allow for free motion 
> of the foot. 
>
> Chain tension: I haven’t snugged the rear axel and thought the chain was 
> too tight, but I also doubt I’ve achieved “binding”. Snug, but not 
> stretched (though someone riding a loose chain may disagree. Grin.). 
>
> With abandon, 
> Patrick 
>

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[RBW] Re: Grocery Run - No Trailer Test

[Ty Smith]

Good job! Your load rivals what I can carry on my Xtracycle on a normal 
grocery run, Very Impressive!

For an extreme approach, below shows my Xtracycle four years ago when I 
tried to really push it weight-wise: Two 28 lb boxes of kitty litter, 8 
gallons of distilled water, two big bags of chips and four quarts of coffee 
creamer.

Very wobbly-wobbly! Never hauled quite this much again. 


 
 


 

 


 


 
 




Fast forward below to last week for my preferred load ;) . 


*Rivendell reference:* Note the "HUGE" Wald basket and small safety 
triangle, both purchased just last month. Should have gotten the basket *years 
*ago.



 

 

 






On Sunday, December 10, 2017 at 8:35:06 PM UTC-8, J Imler wrote:
>
> Click here 
> 
>  
> if you are inclined. 
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Patrick Moore]

Ted's hypothesis seems to fit with experience, in that it would account for
the "pedaling in squares" symptom when going back to a fw or S3X hubbed
bike after riding real fixed for a while; that is, you have to "regain" the
mental-cum-physiological habit of "keeping your feet ahead of drivetrain
kick." For a freewheel drivetrain, there is no such kick, so you have to
learn to accommodate that lack by keeping the feet going but --- and here
it gets vague -- without the "threat" of the crank to "kick" your legs.

???

Still puzzling.

Givens, in any event: 1. There is a smoothness about fixed gear pedaling
that one doesn't find with a freewheel; (2) at least when there is some
slack in the chain, the wheel isn't acting as a flywheel in the ordinary
sense of the term.

On Mon, Dec 11, 2017 at 9:09 PM, ted  wrote:

> I try to minimize the lash without having the chain actually tight. My
> sense of what is unique about a fixed gear is that its so noticeable (and a
> bit disconcerting) when the lash goes all the way the other way and the
> wheel forces your foot up and or over, that you train yourself to keep your
> feet moving very consistently round and round to avoid it. Any slight
> hesitation in your pedal stroke and a fixed gear will remind you "hey don't
> do that". Even if you're smooth enough to avoid those reminders, someplace
> in the back of your mind you know if you get sloppy ...
> I think that's consistent with the old school admonition to ride fixed
> gear in the off season to improve your spin.
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: 50 Miles on the Quickbeam today - thoughts on 40x18

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

Interestingly, I also started out fixed with about a 63" high gear 
(40x17/19 dingle with 170 cranks and 700x32) and also quickly ramped up to 
70" by increasing chainrings to 42t, then 44t.  I'm in central NJ and 63" 
feels great in my local park (expansive network of flattish trails right 
outside my neighborhood) but once I get out on the roads and venture 
further away from my usual leisure routes and on more rolling terrain it 
feels way too low with too much spinning for my taste.

Starting with 63" was more a result of just having the 40t 170 crank and 
wanting a dingle to start.  17-19 was the smallest Surly dingle cog 
available and a perfect match to the available WI Eno 17-19 freewheel.

I've messed around with this gearing quite a bit the past couple years and 
more recently divided the fixed cog and freewheel between two different 
wheelsets and replaced the 170 crank with a 172.5 39t I scored in a trade 
and running this with the WI Eno 17/19 for approx. 61-62" high which has 
felt fine while freewheel only on my recent rides.  

When I convert back to fixed (Still deciding which of 3 frames will get 
exclusive winter duty this year) I'll go with the Surly 17/19 cog paired 
with the original 170t double crank and 44/46 chainrings for approx. 63" 
low and "72-73" high to get the best of both worlds.

If I had a Quickbeam with the long, angled rear ends I'd consolidate back 
to one wheelset with the matching 17/19 fixed/free flip flop but use an 
"Inverse Double Dingle" set up I previously tested by installing the larger 
of 2 chainrings on the INSIDE and the smaller chainring on the OUTSIDE of 
the double crank since the fixed cog sits further inboard of the hub vs the 
thicker WI freewheel so their chainline is actually off between the two 
sides and this would allow higher fixed gearing and lower freewheel gearing 
with the same cogs in back but cleaner chainline in each with the preferred 
chainring size.

I came up with this after learning about the chainline difference between 
the surly cog and ENO freewheel the first time I tried a 40/42 x 17/19 
dingle drivetrain.

Brian Cole
Lawrenceville, NJ



On Monday, December 11, 2017 at 11:25:16 PM UTC-5, ted wrote:

> Ian, unsolicited advice (I'm not a Patrick) but ...
>
> Gearing, particularly fixed gear gearing, is very particular to the rider. 
> How strong are you, what cadences are you comfortable with, etc.
> The best way to get a handle on where to start is to pay attention to what 
> gears you use on your multi-speed bike, and try putting it in one gear and 
> leave it there for a while. Also accept the idea that in time you will 
> likely end up with a collection of rings and cogs, which can be a good 
> thing and not really all that expensive as bike fetishes go.
>
> On Monday, December 11, 2017 at 12:38:20 PM UTC-8, Ian A wrote:
>>
>> Patrick,
>>
>> Slight thread drift:
>>
>> Was the ramp up in gear inches from 67 to 71 and 76 due to an increase in 
>> strength/familiarity with riding fixed? Or was it the result of trial and 
>> error.
>>
>> I'm planning a fixie build, once the Christmas season passes and finances 
>> settle, and I'm wondering about my best gearing options off the bat. I live 
>> in a relatively flat city, that has a few noticeable acute climbs (river 
>> valley topography).
>>
>> Also, it looks like there are more options in the 3/32 chain width 
>> standard for cogs. Can I get away with using 8 speed chain rings, or is 
>> that asking for derailment issues?
>>
>> Thanks for any insights
>> IanA
>>
>>

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[RBW] Sold: Small Sackville TrunkSack

[Jorge Espada Vick]

Sold.

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[RBW] FS: 58 cm Hunqapillar fork for 26" wheels

[Conway Bennett]

House cleaning, bike purchase and relationship maintenance requires me to sell 
this fork.  It was from a grey bean Hunqapillar and I had comrade cycles in 
Chicago drop the canti posts to briefly run really fat 26" wheels on a '93 
XO-2.  I never repainted the area where the work was done but it never saw any 
weather.  $290, shipped!


Fair winds,

Captain Conway 
Chicago

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[RBW] FS: 56 cm Sam Hillborne frameset w/ Paul brakes

[Conway Bennett]

I bought a Hunqapillar and need to be proactive about freeing up space so for 
sale is my most ridden bike, a 56 cm double tt Samuel Hillborne frameset WITH 
Paul Components center pull brakes.  

I bought this new from Riv in August of 2013.  It was a web special with the 
non cream headtube which I preferred as I thought it was more understated and 
less delicate looking.  

The bike is well loved but cared for.  I always locked it up on the drive side 
so the most wear are on the decals there.  I last framesaved it in the spring 
and the tubes were just free.  

I would like $900 or $1100 with velocity atlas 36/36 wheelset with upgraded atb 
rear hub.  Front wheel is from 2013, rear was a warranty replacement from 2015.

The bike will be packed in the original box and packing it came in from Riv.  
Bike flights shipping is on the buyer.


Fair winds,

Captain Conway
Chicago

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Re: [RBW] perforated bar wrap

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

I should amend my prior comments to add that my cloth tape preference is 
not due to any increased cushion vs. leather but a textural and 
convenience preference (cloth is just more forgiving and easier to wrap)... 
I've often doubled up the cotton cloth tape to increase cushion and 
thickness but still not very cushiony.  I haven't used shellac as I've 
unwrapped and rewrapped the same cloth tape several times while trying 
different bar/stem/levers the past couple of years and it holds up rather 
well aside from color fade.  When it does tear/fray/wear out it's 
affordable and easy to replace at $5/roll for Newbaums.   I also just like 
the way it feels without shellac.

The Brooks leather tape did not offer any more or less cushion than cloth 
but I did initially expect it to feel slightly more cushiony, which it did 
not.  I still have leather on my moustache barred single speed and no issue 
really other than the annoyance of the torn seam during a prior 
installation and it's cost is just too high vs. affordable cloth that 
otherwise suits my needs.

I still have some VO Elkhide wraps that get stitched/sewn on but haven't 
tried it yet and waiting until I've settled in with a bar that I won't want 
to change when the cloth has also worn out.

Brian Cole
Lawrenceville, NJ


On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 9:11:41 AM UTC-5, Tim Gavin wrote:

> I've sweat-soaked my Brooks perforated leather tape several times on 
> RAGBRAI.  It's holding up pretty well.
>
>
> What corrosion are you worried about?  Aluminum doesn't corrode 
> significantly without galvanic contact with another metal (like steel).
>
>
> I did not like the feel nor the stiffness of cloth tape with shellac.
>
> On Mon, Dec 11, 2017 at 9:06 PM, ted  
> wrote:
>
>> Hey all,
>>
>> I've got a best practices question I hope you can help me with. I am 
>> planing to try some perforated leather handlebar wrap, and it occurred to 
>> me that sweat might accumulate in the holes along the tops of my drop bars 
>> thereby leading to corrosion problems. Is that an unwarranted concern? 
>> Would it make sense to put on a layer of cloth tape with shellac  under the 
>> perforated leather? Anybody here have experience with that sort of thing?
>>
>> thnks
>> ted
>>
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>>
>
>

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[RBW] perforated bar wrap

[iamkeith]

The perforations should allow the tape to breathe and dry out after a ride, 
meaning LESS moisture buildup, if anything.  I always thought that was the 
reason for the perforations in the first place.

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Re: [RBW] perforated bar wrap

[Tim Gavin]

I've sweat-soaked my Brooks perforated leather tape several times on
RAGBRAI.  It's holding up pretty well.


What corrosion are you worried about?  Aluminum doesn't corrode
significantly without galvanic contact with another metal (like steel).


I did not like the feel nor the stiffness of cloth tape with shellac.

On Mon, Dec 11, 2017 at 9:06 PM, ted  wrote:

> Hey all,
>
> I've got a best practices question I hope you can help me with. I am
> planing to try some perforated leather handlebar wrap, and it occurred to
> me that sweat might accumulate in the holes along the tops of my drop bars
> thereby leading to corrosion problems. Is that an unwarranted concern?
> Would it make sense to put on a layer of cloth tape with shellac  under the
> perforated leather? Anybody here have experience with that sort of thing?
>
> thnks
> ted
>
> --
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[RBW] Re: perforated bar wrap

[Philip Kim]

i used the brooks tape and it hasn't been a problem.

though the cotton with the shellac is not a bad idea to give some cushion, 
the brooks leather bar tape is pretty firm and stiff until it breaks in.

On Monday, December 11, 2017 at 10:06:33 PM UTC-5, ted wrote:
>
> Hey all,
>
> I've got a best practices question I hope you can help me with. I am 
> planing to try some perforated leather handlebar wrap, and it occurred to 
> me that sweat might accumulate in the holes along the tops of my drop bars 
> thereby leading to corrosion problems. Is that an unwarranted concern? 
> Would it make sense to put on a layer of cloth tape with shellac  under the 
> perforated leather? Anybody here have experience with that sort of thing?
>
> thnks
> ted
>

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[RBW] Re: perforated bar wrap

[Coal Bee Rye Anne]

As someone who sweats heavily and has come to prefer cloth bar tape I don’t 
think perforated leather would be any more of an issue than highly absorbent 
cotton cloth and I’ve never had an issue although my mileage has been limited 
and bar wraps short lived anyway with lots of recent bar changing 
experiments...  I do have one wrap with brooks leather and also find it very 
firm and smooth and less cushiony than expected but what I found more annoying 
was the long strips are not always one uninterrupted strip and instead have a 
stitched/glued/beveled seam piecing together two smaller pieces and I pulled 
one apart during installation since the leather didn’t stretch much and I was 
pulling taught to get it to lay flat and the seam was a weak spot.

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[RBW] Fixed Flywheel for the Brain

[Deacon Patrick]

Interesting, Philip. I feel connected with the ground, through the bike. But 
I’m highly sensitive, rather like a canary in a coal mine. Lots of examples, 
but I’ll focus on chairs, for example. Science is discovering they are poor for 
circulation and thus heart health. I suspect they are poor for a lot of other 
reasons. If I sit in a chair, feet on the floor, I have no idea where I am in 
space. If the sitting platform is big enough, I sit cross-legged in the same 
chair, and presuming it’s flat and solid wood with no cushion I instantly relax 
all over because my proprioception can fully engage again. Why can’t it in 
chair postion? I have no idea.

I’ve gotten a few questions about my vertigo and what proprioception does for 
me (all of us, actually, if we let it loose). Quick version: I have damage in 
my brain stem that prevents my brain processing spacial awareness properly, so 
I constantly experience two axes of motion, like I’m in a roller coaster that 
can (and does) go any direction any time, strapped into a “da Vinci” man 
gyroscope twirly chair (like used to train fighter pilots for g-forces and 
disorientation) that twirls about randomly on the roller coaster. 
Proprioception is the ability of the body to know where it is in space without 
(necessarily) the brain having a clue, through tactile input. Lots of “noice” 
inhibits proprioception for most people, especially shoes that have cushion, 
raised heel, support, or does not allow for free motion of the foot.

Chain tension: I haven’t snugged the rear axel and thought the chain was too 
tight, but I also doubt I’ve achieved “binding”. Snug, but not stretched 
(though someone riding a loose chain may disagree. Grin.).

With abandon,
Patrick

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[RBW] Re: perforated bar wrap

[Dave Small]

Hi Ted,

I wear gloves when riding, so don't have the sweat issue you described but 
I also don't see the holes getting gunked up with dirt of any other type. 
 But the few times I've ridden short distances I've found Brooks leather 
tape to be kinda slick, not as grippy as it feels with gloves.  If I were 
gonna ride skin-to-tape on a regular basis I'm not sure I'd go with 
leather, despite its other advantages.  

Dave

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