Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Joe Bernard]

"... maybe Leah Peterson is a maniac who's just as fast on a Clem! Let's 
find out!!!"

We have our answer. 18-20mph. On a Clem!!!

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 8:15:46 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> 
> Here’s my write-up from tonight’s Clubbing with the Clem. Attached in the 
> next post (which makes this message too large) will also be a video (it’s 
> funny) and a photo in case you can’t be bothered with goofball videos.
>
> Clubbing with the Clem:
>
> My Racing Platypus is in need of new shoes. Those shipped today, and I am 
> not above praying that they arrive before Friday’s club ride. 
>
> I rode in the women’s group tonight, and they are the fastest group I ride 
> with. People are getting used to the weird bikes I drag to club rides, but 
> I thought this romantic step-through might be pushing it. “Isn’t that the 
> bike you always ride?” one woman asked. 
>
> The choices: 8-12 mph, 15-16 mph or 17+. I fell in with the 15-16 group 
> and the ride leader said, “My cyclometer isn’t working, so I might have 
> trouble keeping the pace.” 
>
> Good, I thought. It is NINETY degrees, humid, and there is a 14 mph wind. 
> And I’m on this here Clem, which is wider than the van I used to drive it 
> here and probably as heavy.
>
> The leader peeled out of the parking lot and hit a nice cruising speed of 
> 18-20 mph My heart rate was immediately in the 180s and I thought, Leah 
> you fool. Turn this Clem around right now and go home. But I had run my big 
> mouth saying I was taking my Clem to a club ride, and now I was committed. 
> The written words of Grant Petersen flitted through my mind. He was 
> extolling the virtues of the Clem and then added, “But don’t take it on 
> club rides or anything.” 
>
> And here I was. Doing the very thing - the only thing - that the bike’s 
> creator never intended.
>
> I panicked a little bit. My heart has this annoying thing it does where if 
> I’m pushing too hard/stressed it will beat irregularly. I felt the little 
> PACs start to flutter inside my chest. I drank more water and prayed not to 
> die on my bike tonight since that would really mess up the pace for the 
> group.
>
> The winds were brutal, loud enough that it was hard to have conversation 
> with the woman next to me. Ride leaders often switch on windy nights, but 
> not this little dynamo. She pulled us along anywhere from 17-20 mph for 
> much of that ride. We got stuck at a stop which put a 0.2 mile gap between 
> us and the riders in front of us - I hate when that happens and I always 
> rush to catch back up. But today it took me miles to close that gap. 
>
> We got to our halfway point where we hydrate/eat/admire each other’s 
> accessories. “The best part of the ride is when we discuss the colors of 
> our accoutrements,” I said. 
>
> The roadie next to me disagreed. “The best part of the ride is when we 
> pull into the parking lot at the end.” 
>
> That gave me pause. Is that how people feel about rides? Because I usually 
> enjoy myself so much - weather can be a bummer, sure, but I’ve yet to have 
> a bad ride on my Platypus. 
>
> I often learn something on a ride. At the start, I was short of breath 
> from working so hard and worrying about failure. I was using a lot of upper 
> body. By the end, I was still except for legs and core and that seemed to 
> propel me along without zapping my energy and breath. I wonder if that is a 
> real phenomenon or if I made that up. Someone will know. 
>
> The Clem saw me safely home but I’m going to feel it in the morning. 
> Still, I’m glad we did it. This bike has seen me through 2020 and the grief 
> I expunged on it when we lost Dad. It was my only bike for that year and we 
> rode nearly 3,000 miles together. And now, it has taken me on a club ride; 
> though it was never intended for one. I said let’s go and it took me. 
> That’s love.
>
> On May 31, 2022, at 2:42 PM, Doug H.  wrote:
>
> 
>
> Yes! Represent all the Clem's out there in the wild.
> Doug
>
> On Tue, May 31, 2022 at 2:35 PM JohnS  wrote:
>
>> Good luck and hope it goes well. I'm planning on doing a group ride this 
>> evening and it's supposed to be a hot one as well, plenty of fluids!
>>
>> JohnS
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 2:23:41 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> All good options, everyone. Except the ones that suggested I skip this 
>>> week because I am definitely going. 
>>>
>>>  I’ll ride the women’s ride tonight (this group tends to be pretty fast, 
>>> maybe 16 mph but often up at 18 or 19 when they really get a flat stretch) 
>>> and I am taking….my Clem.  I miss it, and it deserves a good, hard ride 
>>> like we had in 2019-2020, when we tore through the desert, just the two of 
>>> us. Flashback to 2,000 miles with it in 2020:
>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>
>>> This is maybe a huge mistake because it is a sweltering 88 degrees, 
>>> humid, and I have eaten a lot of crap over Memorial Day Weekend. I spent 
>>> the weekend at a  

[RBW] FYI: Marin Bike Swap

[Paul M]

The Marin Museum of Bicycling/Mountain Bike Hall of Fame located in Fairfax 
CA is hosting a bike swap in their parking lot this Sat. from 9am-2pm. 
There will be 30 plus vendors selling and swapping at this 7th annual cycle 
swap. Admission to the museum will be half-priced. Yes, a Rivendell could 
be had there.

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[RBW] Re: Ride Report: Izu Oshima- Gojira's Keep

[Bones]

Great timing John, I've been watching all the old Godzilla movies with my 
son these past few weeks. I'm glad he's down there in his fiery prison and 
not out destroying the beautiful countryside. As always, fantastic 
pictures. Keep 'em coming.

Bones

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 2:00:34 AM UTC-4 John Rinker wrote:

> Takashi,
>
> Japan is absolutely full of 'must ride' places, and because my time here 
> is limited I will leave with a very long 'must ride' list. I hope to come 
> back again someday and experience more. 
>
> Just returned from a weekend ride in Okutama where the clear rivers cut 
> very deep, steep valleys into the lush mountainsides. The swimming was fast 
> and cold and breathtaking (in more ways than one).
>
> [image: IMG_0062.jpeg] [image: IMG_0064.jpeg]
>
> Cheers,
> John
>
> On Saturday, May 28, 2022 at 10:12:23 PM UTC+9 Takashi wrote:
>
>> Oh, I remember reading Blue Lug Blog about trip to Izu Oshima.
>> The island surely looks like a 'must ride' place. Your description and 
>> photos make me want to visit there.
>> Thank you for sharing!
>>
>> Takashi
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Leah Peterson]

Here’s my write-up from tonight’s Clubbing with the Clem. Attached in the next 
post (which makes this message too large) will also be a video (it’s funny) and 
a photo in case you can’t be bothered with goofball videos.

Clubbing with the Clem:

My Racing Platypus is in need of new shoes. Those shipped today, and I am not 
above praying that they arrive before Friday’s club ride. 

I rode in the women’s group tonight, and they are the fastest group I ride 
with. People are getting used to the weird bikes I drag to club rides, but I 
thought this romantic step-through might be pushing it. “Isn’t that the bike 
you always ride?” one woman asked. 

The choices: 8-12 mph, 15-16 mph or 17+. I fell in with the 15-16 group and the 
ride leader said, “My cyclometer isn’t working, so I might have trouble keeping 
the pace.” 

Good, I thought. It is NINETY degrees, humid, and there is a 14 mph wind. And 
I’m on this here Clem, which is wider than the van I used to drive it here and 
probably as heavy.

The leader peeled out of the parking lot and hit a nice cruising speed of 18-20 
mph My heart rate was immediately in the 180s and I thought, Leah you fool. 
Turn this Clem around right now and go home. But I had run my big mouth saying 
I was taking my Clem to a club ride, and now I was committed. The written words 
of Grant Petersen flitted through my mind. He was extolling the virtues of the 
Clem and then added, “But don’t take it on club rides or anything.” 

And here I was. Doing the very thing - the only thing - that the bike’s creator 
never intended.

I panicked a little bit. My heart has this annoying thing it does where if I’m 
pushing too hard/stressed it will beat irregularly. I felt the little PACs 
start to flutter inside my chest. I drank more water and prayed not to die on 
my bike tonight since that would really mess up the pace for the group.

The winds were brutal, loud enough that it was hard to have conversation with 
the woman next to me. Ride leaders often switch on windy nights, but not this 
little dynamo. She pulled us along anywhere from 17-20 mph for much of that 
ride. We got stuck at a stop which put a 0.2 mile gap between us and the riders 
in front of us - I hate when that happens and I always rush to catch back up. 
But today it took me miles to close that gap. 

We got to our halfway point where we hydrate/eat/admire each other’s 
accessories. “The best part of the ride is when we discuss the colors of our 
accoutrements,” I said. 

The roadie next to me disagreed. “The best part of the ride is when we pull 
into the parking lot at the end.” 

That gave me pause. Is that how people feel about rides? Because I usually 
enjoy myself so much - weather can be a bummer, sure, but I’ve yet to have a 
bad ride on my Platypus. 

I often learn something on a ride. At the start, I was short of breath from 
working so hard and worrying about failure. I was using a lot of upper body. By 
the end, I was still except for legs and core and that seemed to propel me 
along without zapping my energy and breath. I wonder if that is a real 
phenomenon or if I made that up. Someone will know. 

The Clem saw me safely home but I’m going to feel it in the morning. Still, I’m 
glad we did it. This bike has seen me through 2020 and the grief I expunged on 
it when we lost Dad. It was my only bike for that year and we rode nearly 3,000 
miles together. And now, it has taken me on a club ride; though it was never 
intended for one. I said let’s go and it took me. That’s love.

> On May 31, 2022, at 2:42 PM, Doug H.  wrote:
> 
> Yes! Represent all the Clem's out there in the wild.
> Doug
> 
> On Tue, May 31, 2022 at 2:35 PM JohnS  wrote:
>> Good luck and hope it goes well. I'm planning on doing a group ride this 
>> evening and it's supposed to be a hot one as well, plenty of fluids!
>> 
>> JohnS
>> 
>> 
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 2:23:41 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:
>>> All good options, everyone. Except the ones that suggested I skip this week 
>>> because I am definitely going. 
>>> 
>>>  I’ll ride the women’s ride tonight (this group tends to be pretty fast, 
>>> maybe 16 mph but often up at 18 or 19 when they really get a flat stretch) 
>>> and I am taking….my Clem.  I miss it, and it deserves a good, hard ride 
>>> like we had in 2019-2020, when we tore through the desert, just the two of 
>>> us. Flashback to 2,000 miles with it in 2020:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> This is maybe a huge mistake because it is a sweltering 88 degrees, humid, 
>>> and I have eaten a lot of crap over Memorial Day Weekend. I spent the 
>>> weekend at a  family fishing tournament and not in the saddle, so I’m not 
>>> in fighting form. But, I love a challenge. If I keel over on my bike 
>>> tonight and you read about it in the paper, just know that I went out 
>>> spectacularly. 
>>> 
>>> Leah
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On May 31, 2022, at 10:07 AM, Jingy  wrote:
 Another option is to skip the group ride 

[RBW] Re: WTB: Hurricane Ridge

[Bones]

I don't have a pair for sale but I do have a pair in the endurance casing 
and I think they're great. They don't roll quite as smoothly as the lighter 
casings but they definitely do not feel like they will tear. Great tough 
all-around tire for a Hillborne. Good luck.

Bones

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 2:55:41 PM UTC-4 Adam wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> If anyone has a used set--or single--RH Hurricane Ridge that you want to 
> clear out, let me know.
>
> I recently bought a used set of black ELs from the list and really liked 
> the feel of these on the one ride they survived before tearing a sidewall. 
> As it stands, I'm not entirely convinced I want to shell out $90/tire for 
> the endurance casing, but they really fit the Hillborne nicely.
>
> If anyone has a pair, or single, in whatever casing, I'd love to try them 
> a bit more before dropping the $$$ on a new pair.
>
> THANKS!
>
> Adam
>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: FS: 52cm Bombadil, 56cm Hillborne, 45cm Clem

[Matt Beecher]

They are great bikes and if it does not work out, they are as rare as hens 
teeth, highly sought out, and sell quickly.  I saw the one on Ebay over the 
weekend and assume that is what you bought.  

The long low tempted me quite a bit more, but ultimately decided against it 
and noticed it was gone an hour later.  I probably should have bought it 
and sold my Ram, but the bad photos of the tape measurements were hard to 
read appropriately.   

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 4:38:05 PM UTC-5 Karl wrote:

> Thanks Matt! Hoping it is all I have it built up to be!
>
> Karl
>
> On Tue, May 31, 2022 at 4:29 PM Matt Beecher  wrote:
>
>> Congratulations!  I recently bought back my old silver Saluki, after 
>> failing to find an Atlantis at a reasonable price.  Now I have that to 
>> rebuild, along with a Gitane TdF.  
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Matt Beecher
>>
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>> 
>> .
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: FS: 52cm Bombadil, 56cm Hillborne, 45cm Clem

[Karl Worley]

Thanks Matt! Hoping it is all I have it built up to be!

Karl

On Tue, May 31, 2022 at 4:29 PM Matt Beecher  wrote:

> Congratulations!  I recently bought back my old silver Saluki, after
> failing to find an Atlantis at a reasonable price.  Now I have that to
> rebuild, along with a Gitane TdF.
>
> Best regards,
> Matt Beecher
>
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> 
> .
>

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[RBW] Re: FS: 52cm Bombadil, 56cm Hillborne, 45cm Clem

[Matt Beecher]

Congratulations!  I recently bought back my old silver Saluki, after 
failing to find an Atlantis at a reasonable price.  Now I have that to 
rebuild, along with a Gitane TdF.  

Best regards,
Matt Beecher

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[RBW] Re: FS: 54cm Hunqapillar (green) in SF

[Nikko in Oakland]

Forgot... I'll ship if needed! I'd drop off the bike at Luckyduck Bicycle 
cafe in Oakland to ship it, and I'd ask the buyer to pay for shipping. 

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 1:30:09 PM UTC-7 Nikko in Oakland wrote:

> A friendly bump. Photos of beausage here. 
> 
> I'm willing to take offers, so if you really want it, shoot me an offer. I 
> will not break up main parts of the bike (drivetrain/wheels/frame/cockpit), 
> but will gladly remove racks cages, etc for a different price. 
>
> On Saturday, May 28, 2022 at 8:30:04 PM UTC-7 Nikko in Oakland wrote:
>
>> [image: FC25E736-717B-4953-BA03-0A1C2DF99F16.jpeg]
>>
>> My 54cm Hunq is officially for sale. Has some beausage, as I’m not one to 
>> baby my bikes, but I will supply touch up paint from Waterford. 
>>
>> $2800, prefer local sale. 
>>
>> Frame:
>> - 54cm Hunq
>>
>> Wheels:
>> - Synergy to LX hubs (2000 miles) 
>> - Fleecer Ridge tires
>>
>> Drivetrain:
>> - Riv Silver 38t/24t Cranks
>> - 11-34t SRAM 970 cassette
>> - Some XT FD
>> - Deore RD
>> - Paul Love Levers and right thumbie (silver ano) w/ 9sp dura ace bar end 
>> shifter 
>> - Paul MotoLites (polished) 
>>
>> Cockpit:
>> - 100mm Technomic Stem
>> - Albatrosses (scratches at the clamp because of a shim)
>> - Black bolt-on Ourys
>> - You're going to get a Mische post (keeping the S65)
>> - Brooks B17
>> - Housing is the nice Blue Lug Nissei (I think) housing
>>
>> Extras
>> - VO Flat Pat Rack front rack
>> - Marks Rack Rear
>> - SimWorks Flat Fenders
>> - LiterCage
>>
>> Can include filet brazed Riv bullmoose bars if that's interesting for 
>> you. 
>>
>> Does not include: dyno, basket, lights, frame pump, bell, S65 post, 
>> pedals, or bags. I could sell bags, pedals, rear dyno light, and basket for 
>> additional cash if interested.
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: FS: 54cm Hunqapillar (green) in SF

[Nikko in Oakland]

A friendly bump. Photos of beausage here. 

I'm willing to take offers, so if you really want it, shoot me an offer. I 
will not break up main parts of the bike (drivetrain/wheels/frame/cockpit), 
but will gladly remove racks cages, etc for a different price. 

On Saturday, May 28, 2022 at 8:30:04 PM UTC-7 Nikko in Oakland wrote:

> [image: FC25E736-717B-4953-BA03-0A1C2DF99F16.jpeg]
>
> My 54cm Hunq is officially for sale. Has some beausage, as I’m not one to 
> baby my bikes, but I will supply touch up paint from Waterford. 
>
> $2800, prefer local sale. 
>
> Frame:
> - 54cm Hunq
>
> Wheels:
> - Synergy to LX hubs (2000 miles) 
> - Fleecer Ridge tires
>
> Drivetrain:
> - Riv Silver 38t/24t Cranks
> - 11-34t SRAM 970 cassette
> - Some XT FD
> - Deore RD
> - Paul Love Levers and right thumbie (silver ano) w/ 9sp dura ace bar end 
> shifter 
> - Paul MotoLites (polished) 
>
> Cockpit:
> - 100mm Technomic Stem
> - Albatrosses (scratches at the clamp because of a shim)
> - Black bolt-on Ourys
> - You're going to get a Mische post (keeping the S65)
> - Brooks B17
> - Housing is the nice Blue Lug Nissei (I think) housing
>
> Extras
> - VO Flat Pat Rack front rack
> - Marks Rack Rear
> - SimWorks Flat Fenders
> - LiterCage
>
> Can include filet brazed Riv bullmoose bars if that's interesting for you. 
>
> Does not include: dyno, basket, lights, frame pump, bell, S65 post, 
> pedals, or bags. I could sell bags, pedals, rear dyno light, and basket for 
> additional cash if interested.
>
>

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[RBW] FS: 52cm Bombadil, 56cm Hillborne, 45cm Clem

[Karl]

Hello Group,

I finally landed my 58cm Saluki, so time to make a little room (and my 
daughter finally outgrew her Clem) I didn't want to muck up a big post, so 
links to the craigslist ads. Located in Nashville. If I do not have to deal 
with shipping, I would take $500 off the Bombadil or Hillborne and $250 off 
the Clem. Will gladly drop them at Halcyon for boxing or can deliver to 
Cincinnati, Pittsburg, Hudson Valley, or Portland Maine in the next couple 
of weeks. If taking PayPal, friends and family. Thanks for looking. 
Questions answered slow, but honest.

Karl in Nashville, TN

Bombadil 52cm:
nashville.craigslist.org/bik/d/nashville-rivendell-bombadil-52cm-medium/7490610081.html

Hillborne 56CM:
nashville.craigslist.org/bik/d/nashville-rivendell-sam-hillborne-56cm/7490615079.html

Clem 45cm:
nashville.craigslist.org/bik/d/nashville-rivendell-clem-45cm/7490617600.html

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[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[George Schick]

Thanks Bill - I believe that you and Garth both point to the free hub body 
correctly.  I'll take a look at that, though if the pawl's in the free hub 
body are sticking (apparently common on some manf's of these) then one 
would expect the pawls not to be engaging the ratchet teeth properly, 
therefore a slipping free hub, not a false engaging of a gear and a 
subsequent loud crunching sound.  I'll check the tightness of the bolt that 
holds the free hub body onto the hub to see if that might be loose.  BTW, 
the cassette on this hub is the second one since purchasing the bike.  I 
did not like the gear combination on the one that came with the bike.  But, 
of course, the free hub body onto which it was installed is the original.

Otherwise, thanks to all y'all who chimed in with recommendations about 
what might be wrong.  That's what I like about this blog site - everyone 
chips in to help out everyone else who posts with a problem.

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 1:32:42 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> OK, well if there has been something wrong with your bike's set-up and 
> you've used it for 18 years with that wrong set-up, then it's probably a 
> pretty good bet that whatever is set up wrong will need to be replaced by 
> now.  If you think that the wonky part contributed to a chain breakage then 
> at minimum you should replace your cassette.  If you believe you've 
> eliminated the BB, crankset, pedals and headset, then that leaves the rear 
> wheel.  The last maintenance checklist item that has not been addressed in 
> this thread is the bolt that holds the freehub body onto the rear hub.  
> You'd snug that up with a 10mm allen key next time your rear axle is out.  
> I imagine that could make a noise under hard pedaling if it was loose.  
>
> I don't recall if you've said so, but are you friction shifting or index 
> shifting?  Barcons, or downtube, or brifter?  
>
> I'd still recommend riding the bike with a different rear wheel.  130mm 
> OLD rear wheels with 9-speed cassettes are totally common.  
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:31:42 AM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Bill - oh, there has definitely been something going on all these years 
>> that's just not right vs. a perceived but unrealized perfection associated 
>> with a high-end bike.  The reason why I'm assuming that the 
>> crunching/grinding had to do with the chain breakage is because it was 
>> starting to make the noise when the chain snapped.  If I could just get it 
>> to happen when I have it on the work stand I could then see what's going on 
>> between the chain and the rear cogs or the chain ring.  'Course, part (or 
>> maybe even most) of the reason why it won't happen on the work stand is 
>> because nothing on the drive train is under a load.
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 11:14:22 AM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> George
>>>
>>> Getting back to the problem you are trying to solve:  Does your instinct 
>>> tell you that there's something broken or incorrect, and that faulty 
>>> condition is warning you with sound?  -OR- is this sound more of something 
>>> you just notice.  You feel an expensive bike should be silent and sometimes 
>>> you hear something, and you'd prefer to hear nothing from your expensive 
>>> bike?  
>>>
>>> Do you have an instinct on this?  There are definitely a lot of cyclists 
>>> of a certain age who recall having ridden a silent bicycle back in the day, 
>>> who now dislike anything newer or more modern on the grounds that it's no 
>>> longer silent.  Back in the eearly to mid 1990s I was largely a Campy-guy, 
>>> purely on the grounds that a Campy drivetrain in that era (8sp ergo) was 
>>> silent while pedaling.  Shimano definitely shifted better but Shimano was 
>>> not as silent "in gear" as Campy was.  The pedaling feedback into my feet 
>>> was one of fluidity.  With Shimano, I felt that the sound and the feel 
>>> would constantly remind me I was operating a chain-drive drive train.  
>>> Campy allowed me to forget that.  I couldn't feel it, and I associated that 
>>> with "quality".  
>>>
>>> Could that be part of what's going on here?
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:11:19 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 Bill - you raise a good point.  None of the cogs wiggle, but I can't 
 remember if they're keyed as they slide onto the free hub splines.  
 Looking 
 at the way the teeth on the cogs are arranged as the free hub turns makes 
 me wonder if they get into a certain position and "think" they need to 
 shift, but then can't, making a loud unforgiving sound.  IOW, a link may 
 be 
 getting caught crossways between shifting and not shifting, causing not 
 only the sound, but leading ultimately to the broken side plates.  Not 
 sure 
 what to do about this.  Placing the bike on a work stand with new chain 
 installed and moving the RD through all of the cassette gears, rotating 
 the 

[RBW] WTB: Hurricane Ridge

[Adam]

Hi all,

If anyone has a used set--or single--RH Hurricane Ridge that you want to 
clear out, let me know.

I recently bought a used set of black ELs from the list and really liked 
the feel of these on the one ride they survived before tearing a sidewall. 
As it stands, I'm not entirely convinced I want to shell out $90/tire for 
the endurance casing, but they really fit the Hillborne nicely.

If anyone has a pair, or single, in whatever casing, I'd love to try them a 
bit more before dropping the $$$ on a new pair.

THANKS!

Adam



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Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Doug H.]

Yes! Represent all the Clem's out there in the wild.
Doug

On Tue, May 31, 2022 at 2:35 PM JohnS  wrote:

> Good luck and hope it goes well. I'm planning on doing a group ride this
> evening and it's supposed to be a hot one as well, plenty of fluids!
>
> JohnS
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 2:23:41 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding!
> wrote:
>
>> All good options, everyone. Except the ones that suggested I skip this
>> week because I am definitely going.
>>
>>  I’ll ride the women’s ride tonight (this group tends to be pretty fast,
>> maybe 16 mph but often up at 18 or 19 when they really get a flat stretch)
>> and I am taking….my Clem.  I miss it, and it deserves a good, hard ride
>> like we had in 2019-2020, when we tore through the desert, just the two of
>> us. Flashback to 2,000 miles with it in 2020:
>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>
>> This is maybe a huge mistake because it is a sweltering 88 degrees,
>> humid, and I have eaten a lot of crap over Memorial Day Weekend. I spent
>> the weekend at a  family fishing tournament and not in the saddle, so I’m
>> not in fighting form. But, I love a challenge. If I keel over on my bike
>> tonight and you read about it in the paper, just know that I went out
>> spectacularly.
>>
>> Leah
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On May 31, 2022, at 10:07 AM, Jingy  wrote:
>>
>> Another option is to skip the group ride this week and lone wolf it.
>>
>> Jim
>>
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:01:10 AM UTC-5 jeffrey kane wrote:
>>
>>> Great stories, as usual - I'm pretty sure I remember suggesting that you
>>> should consider converting that ol' Betty Foy into your drop bar go-fast
>>> bike a long time back ...
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, April 6, 2022 at 10:10:18 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding
>>> Ding! wrote:
>>>
 [image: 6982042D-DB05-4044-8AC4-9076A708539B.jpeg][image:
 0221807D-FECC-440C-AE2E-AF03DDB70770.jpeg]We moved to Michigan 4
 months ago. After years of being a Lone Wolf I did the unthinkable and
 joined the local bike club. The club was founded by racers 50 (FIFTY!)
 years ago, but they seemed welcoming enough. Having never ridden in a
 group, I lacked knowledge of my pace and skill, did not knowif I’d enjoy
 club riding. I’ve never been a road rider. The West has always offered me
 bike lanes and bike paths - riding with cars going 55 mph seemed suicidal.
 Would it be stressful? Would I be accepted? Would I be slow? My raspberry
 Platypus is my lightest build. I don’t know how much it weighs, but it has
 a lightweight Nitto rear rack, a Bag Boy Saddlesack (not pictured), and too
 many things on the handlebars. Meet my club ride bike.

 My Racing Platypus. 

 One of the board members took me under her wing. She invited her good
 friend and organized a ride for the 3 of us. She taught me club etiquette
 on the road. They rode carbon bikes with drop bars, but they did not
 question my bike. It went great. Bolstered by that ride, I accepted her
 invite to the first club ride of the season, provided we could ride in the
 same group. “They’ll never believe it when you show up with that bike,
 Leah, but you’re strong and you can definitely do club rides.” I have stars
 in my eyes for this woman; she is admirable in every way. If she said I
 could do it, I would try.

 I pulled into the park and it was carbon and drop bars as far as the
 eye could see. A wave of nausea washed over me as I walked my Platypus to
 the group huddle. Billie Bars on full display, Grant Safety triangle
 clasped around my waist, looking like a true Lone Wolf, I stood in the
 circle. The older members were very welcoming and found nice things to say
 about the Racing Platypus. The younger racers…well, they ignored it. I’m
 just as guilty; I find them terrifying, so I didn’t say hello, either.

 My mentor put us in the 12-14 mph group. A good place to start. It
 proved too easy and I coasted much of that 20 miles. We decided we’d do the
 15-16 mph group next time. That day came and due to bad weather it was a
 small turnout. We joined the slow group again because they would have only
 had 2 riders otherwise. We chose the route famous for its “rollers” (“What
 are rollers?” the Platypus rider asked.) and conquered them in cold weather
 with a headwind. The Racing Platypus, baptized on the mountains and hills
 of Las Vegas, took no issue with those rollers.

 The next night was the women’s ride - the first of the season. About 10
 women, all experienced riders. Triathletes and marathoners, most. All on
 drop bar carbon or aluminum. Wondering if they should create a slow and a
 fast group, my mentor interrupted and said we’ll be one 15-16 mph group.
 Leah can hang.

 I hadn’t realized *I* was the reason they were considering a slow
 group, but there it was.

 That was a challenging ride. Those women were fast. The 

Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[JohnS]

Good luck and hope it goes well. I'm planning on doing a group ride this 
evening and it's supposed to be a hot one as well, plenty of fluids!

JohnS


On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 2:23:41 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> All good options, everyone. Except the ones that suggested I skip this 
> week because I am definitely going. 
>
>  I’ll ride the women’s ride tonight (this group tends to be pretty fast, 
> maybe 16 mph but often up at 18 or 19 when they really get a flat stretch) 
> and I am taking….my Clem.  I miss it, and it deserves a good, hard ride 
> like we had in 2019-2020, when we tore through the desert, just the two of 
> us. Flashback to 2,000 miles with it in 2020:
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> This is maybe a huge mistake because it is a sweltering 88 degrees, humid, 
> and I have eaten a lot of crap over Memorial Day Weekend. I spent the 
> weekend at a  family fishing tournament and not in the saddle, so I’m not 
> in fighting form. But, I love a challenge. If I keel over on my bike 
> tonight and you read about it in the paper, just know that I went out 
> spectacularly. 
>
> Leah
>
>
>
>
>
> On May 31, 2022, at 10:07 AM, Jingy  wrote:
>
> Another option is to skip the group ride this week and lone wolf it.
>
> Jim
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:01:10 AM UTC-5 jeffrey kane wrote:
>
>> Great stories, as usual - I'm pretty sure I remember suggesting that you 
>> should consider converting that ol' Betty Foy into your drop bar go-fast 
>> bike a long time back ... 
>>
>> On Wednesday, April 6, 2022 at 10:10:18 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> [image: 6982042D-DB05-4044-8AC4-9076A708539B.jpeg][image: 
>>> 0221807D-FECC-440C-AE2E-AF03DDB70770.jpeg]We moved to Michigan 4 months 
>>> ago. After years of being a Lone Wolf I did the unthinkable and joined the 
>>> local bike club. The club was founded by racers 50 (FIFTY!) years ago, but 
>>> they seemed welcoming enough. Having never ridden in a group, I lacked 
>>> knowledge of my pace and skill, did not knowif I’d enjoy club riding. I’ve 
>>> never been a road rider. The West has always offered me bike lanes and bike 
>>> paths - riding with cars going 55 mph seemed suicidal. Would it be 
>>> stressful? Would I be accepted? Would I be slow? My raspberry Platypus is 
>>> my lightest build. I don’t know how much it weighs, but it has a 
>>> lightweight Nitto rear rack, a Bag Boy Saddlesack (not pictured), and too 
>>> many things on the handlebars. Meet my club ride bike. 
>>>
>>> My Racing Platypus. 
>>>
>>> One of the board members took me under her wing. She invited her good 
>>> friend and organized a ride for the 3 of us. She taught me club etiquette 
>>> on the road. They rode carbon bikes with drop bars, but they did not 
>>> question my bike. It went great. Bolstered by that ride, I accepted her 
>>> invite to the first club ride of the season, provided we could ride in the 
>>> same group. “They’ll never believe it when you show up with that bike, 
>>> Leah, but you’re strong and you can definitely do club rides.” I have stars 
>>> in my eyes for this woman; she is admirable in every way. If she said I 
>>> could do it, I would try.
>>>
>>> I pulled into the park and it was carbon and drop bars as far as the eye 
>>> could see. A wave of nausea washed over me as I walked my Platypus to the 
>>> group huddle. Billie Bars on full display, Grant Safety triangle clasped 
>>> around my waist, looking like a true Lone Wolf, I stood in the circle. The 
>>> older members were very welcoming and found nice things to say about the 
>>> Racing Platypus. The younger racers…well, they ignored it. I’m just as 
>>> guilty; I find them terrifying, so I didn’t say hello, either. 
>>>
>>> My mentor put us in the 12-14 mph group. A good place to start. It 
>>> proved too easy and I coasted much of that 20 miles. We decided we’d do the 
>>> 15-16 mph group next time. That day came and due to bad weather it was a 
>>> small turnout. We joined the slow group again because they would have only 
>>> had 2 riders otherwise. We chose the route famous for its “rollers” (“What 
>>> are rollers?” the Platypus rider asked.) and conquered them in cold weather 
>>> with a headwind. The Racing Platypus, baptized on the mountains and hills 
>>> of Las Vegas, took no issue with those rollers. 
>>>
>>> The next night was the women’s ride - the first of the season. About 10 
>>> women, all experienced riders. Triathletes and marathoners, most. All on 
>>> drop bar carbon or aluminum. Wondering if they should create a slow and a 
>>> fast group, my mentor interrupted and said we’ll be one 15-16 mph group. 
>>> Leah can hang. 
>>>
>>> I hadn’t realized *I* was the reason they were considering a slow group, 
>>> but there it was.
>>>
>>> That was a challenging ride. Those women were fast. The route was 24 
>>> miles and the wind was strong. I was able to stay in 2nd and 3rd position 
>>> but I was working to do it. I loved it; such fun to 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Bill Lindsay]

OK, well if there has been something wrong with your bike's set-up and 
you've used it for 18 years with that wrong set-up, then it's probably a 
pretty good bet that whatever is set up wrong will need to be replaced by 
now.  If you think that the wonky part contributed to a chain breakage then 
at minimum you should replace your cassette.  If you believe you've 
eliminated the BB, crankset, pedals and headset, then that leaves the rear 
wheel.  The last maintenance checklist item that has not been addressed in 
this thread is the bolt that holds the freehub body onto the rear hub.  
You'd snug that up with a 10mm allen key next time your rear axle is out.  
I imagine that could make a noise under hard pedaling if it was loose.  

I don't recall if you've said so, but are you friction shifting or index 
shifting?  Barcons, or downtube, or brifter?  

I'd still recommend riding the bike with a different rear wheel.  130mm OLD 
rear wheels with 9-speed cassettes are totally common.  

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:31:42 AM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Bill - oh, there has definitely been something going on all these years 
> that's just not right vs. a perceived but unrealized perfection associated 
> with a high-end bike.  The reason why I'm assuming that the 
> crunching/grinding had to do with the chain breakage is because it was 
> starting to make the noise when the chain snapped.  If I could just get it 
> to happen when I have it on the work stand I could then see what's going on 
> between the chain and the rear cogs or the chain ring.  'Course, part (or 
> maybe even most) of the reason why it won't happen on the work stand is 
> because nothing on the drive train is under a load.
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 11:14:22 AM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> George
>>
>> Getting back to the problem you are trying to solve:  Does your instinct 
>> tell you that there's something broken or incorrect, and that faulty 
>> condition is warning you with sound?  -OR- is this sound more of something 
>> you just notice.  You feel an expensive bike should be silent and sometimes 
>> you hear something, and you'd prefer to hear nothing from your expensive 
>> bike?  
>>
>> Do you have an instinct on this?  There are definitely a lot of cyclists 
>> of a certain age who recall having ridden a silent bicycle back in the day, 
>> who now dislike anything newer or more modern on the grounds that it's no 
>> longer silent.  Back in the eearly to mid 1990s I was largely a Campy-guy, 
>> purely on the grounds that a Campy drivetrain in that era (8sp ergo) was 
>> silent while pedaling.  Shimano definitely shifted better but Shimano was 
>> not as silent "in gear" as Campy was.  The pedaling feedback into my feet 
>> was one of fluidity.  With Shimano, I felt that the sound and the feel 
>> would constantly remind me I was operating a chain-drive drive train.  
>> Campy allowed me to forget that.  I couldn't feel it, and I associated that 
>> with "quality".  
>>
>> Could that be part of what's going on here?
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:11:19 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> Bill - you raise a good point.  None of the cogs wiggle, but I can't 
>>> remember if they're keyed as they slide onto the free hub splines.  Looking 
>>> at the way the teeth on the cogs are arranged as the free hub turns makes 
>>> me wonder if they get into a certain position and "think" they need to 
>>> shift, but then can't, making a loud unforgiving sound.  IOW, a link may be 
>>> getting caught crossways between shifting and not shifting, causing not 
>>> only the sound, but leading ultimately to the broken side plates.  Not sure 
>>> what to do about this.  Placing the bike on a work stand with new chain 
>>> installed and moving the RD through all of the cassette gears, rotating the 
>>> pedals both forward and backward (freewheeling) yields no kind of sound 
>>> whatsoever.
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:13:33 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
 George

 I'm in California

 Just to rule it out, grab a middle-ish cog in the cogset and give it a 
 wiggle.  Does it wiggle relative to the other cogs or are they all really 
 secure relative to one another?  If it wiggles, then maybe the lockring is 
 loose.  If the lockring is tight but the cogs wiggle then maybe the stack 
 up of the cassette is too short for the length of the freehub and you need 
 to add a spacer.

 Bill Lindsay
 El Cerrito, CA

 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>
> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>
> I can't 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[George Schick]

Joe - not that I can tell.  First of all, I'd likely see it if that 
happened.  Secondly, it would occur much more frequently than this 
sporadic, isolated business. 

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 12:22:39 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Is the chain jamming between the big ring and a too-low front derailleur?
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:31:42 AM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Bill - oh, there has definitely been something going on all these years 
>> that's just not right vs. a perceived but unrealized perfection associated 
>> with a high-end bike.  The reason why I'm assuming that the 
>> crunching/grinding had to do with the chain breakage is because it was 
>> starting to make the noise when the chain snapped.  If I could just get it 
>> to happen when I have it on the work stand I could then see what's going on 
>> between the chain and the rear cogs or the chain ring.  'Course, part (or 
>> maybe even most) of the reason why it won't happen on the work stand is 
>> because nothing on the drive train is under a load.
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 11:14:22 AM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> George
>>>
>>> Getting back to the problem you are trying to solve:  Does your instinct 
>>> tell you that there's something broken or incorrect, and that faulty 
>>> condition is warning you with sound?  -OR- is this sound more of something 
>>> you just notice.  You feel an expensive bike should be silent and sometimes 
>>> you hear something, and you'd prefer to hear nothing from your expensive 
>>> bike?  
>>>
>>> Do you have an instinct on this?  There are definitely a lot of cyclists 
>>> of a certain age who recall having ridden a silent bicycle back in the day, 
>>> who now dislike anything newer or more modern on the grounds that it's no 
>>> longer silent.  Back in the eearly to mid 1990s I was largely a Campy-guy, 
>>> purely on the grounds that a Campy drivetrain in that era (8sp ergo) was 
>>> silent while pedaling.  Shimano definitely shifted better but Shimano was 
>>> not as silent "in gear" as Campy was.  The pedaling feedback into my feet 
>>> was one of fluidity.  With Shimano, I felt that the sound and the feel 
>>> would constantly remind me I was operating a chain-drive drive train.  
>>> Campy allowed me to forget that.  I couldn't feel it, and I associated that 
>>> with "quality".  
>>>
>>> Could that be part of what's going on here?
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:11:19 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 Bill - you raise a good point.  None of the cogs wiggle, but I can't 
 remember if they're keyed as they slide onto the free hub splines.  
 Looking 
 at the way the teeth on the cogs are arranged as the free hub turns makes 
 me wonder if they get into a certain position and "think" they need to 
 shift, but then can't, making a loud unforgiving sound.  IOW, a link may 
 be 
 getting caught crossways between shifting and not shifting, causing not 
 only the sound, but leading ultimately to the broken side plates.  Not 
 sure 
 what to do about this.  Placing the bike on a work stand with new chain 
 installed and moving the RD through all of the cassette gears, rotating 
 the 
 pedals both forward and backward (freewheeling) yields no kind of sound 
 whatsoever.

 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:13:33 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> George
>
> I'm in California
>
> Just to rule it out, grab a middle-ish cog in the cogset and give it a 
> wiggle.  Does it wiggle relative to the other cogs or are they all really 
> secure relative to one another?  If it wiggles, then maybe the lockring 
> is 
> loose.  If the lockring is tight but the cogs wiggle then maybe the stack 
> up of the cassette is too short for the length of the freehub and you 
> need 
> to add a spacer.
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>>
>> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
>> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain 
>> is 
>> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
>> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>>
>> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike 
>> for 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear 
>> with 
>> a Park chain gauge.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>>
>> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>>
>> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
>> hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, 
>> 

Re: [RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[Patrick Moore]

Blue.

[image: image.png]


On Tue, May 31, 2022 at 10:30 AM J J  wrote:

> ... Which loc tite [Loctite] variety do you suggest for the shifters?

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[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Joe Bernard]

Is the chain jamming between the big ring and a too-low front derailleur?

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:31:42 AM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Bill - oh, there has definitely been something going on all these years 
> that's just not right vs. a perceived but unrealized perfection associated 
> with a high-end bike.  The reason why I'm assuming that the 
> crunching/grinding had to do with the chain breakage is because it was 
> starting to make the noise when the chain snapped.  If I could just get it 
> to happen when I have it on the work stand I could then see what's going on 
> between the chain and the rear cogs or the chain ring.  'Course, part (or 
> maybe even most) of the reason why it won't happen on the work stand is 
> because nothing on the drive train is under a load.
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 11:14:22 AM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> George
>>
>> Getting back to the problem you are trying to solve:  Does your instinct 
>> tell you that there's something broken or incorrect, and that faulty 
>> condition is warning you with sound?  -OR- is this sound more of something 
>> you just notice.  You feel an expensive bike should be silent and sometimes 
>> you hear something, and you'd prefer to hear nothing from your expensive 
>> bike?  
>>
>> Do you have an instinct on this?  There are definitely a lot of cyclists 
>> of a certain age who recall having ridden a silent bicycle back in the day, 
>> who now dislike anything newer or more modern on the grounds that it's no 
>> longer silent.  Back in the eearly to mid 1990s I was largely a Campy-guy, 
>> purely on the grounds that a Campy drivetrain in that era (8sp ergo) was 
>> silent while pedaling.  Shimano definitely shifted better but Shimano was 
>> not as silent "in gear" as Campy was.  The pedaling feedback into my feet 
>> was one of fluidity.  With Shimano, I felt that the sound and the feel 
>> would constantly remind me I was operating a chain-drive drive train.  
>> Campy allowed me to forget that.  I couldn't feel it, and I associated that 
>> with "quality".  
>>
>> Could that be part of what's going on here?
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:11:19 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> Bill - you raise a good point.  None of the cogs wiggle, but I can't 
>>> remember if they're keyed as they slide onto the free hub splines.  Looking 
>>> at the way the teeth on the cogs are arranged as the free hub turns makes 
>>> me wonder if they get into a certain position and "think" they need to 
>>> shift, but then can't, making a loud unforgiving sound.  IOW, a link may be 
>>> getting caught crossways between shifting and not shifting, causing not 
>>> only the sound, but leading ultimately to the broken side plates.  Not sure 
>>> what to do about this.  Placing the bike on a work stand with new chain 
>>> installed and moving the RD through all of the cassette gears, rotating the 
>>> pedals both forward and backward (freewheeling) yields no kind of sound 
>>> whatsoever.
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:13:33 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>>
 George

 I'm in California

 Just to rule it out, grab a middle-ish cog in the cogset and give it a 
 wiggle.  Does it wiggle relative to the other cogs or are they all really 
 secure relative to one another?  If it wiggles, then maybe the lockring is 
 loose.  If the lockring is tight but the cogs wiggle then maybe the stack 
 up of the cassette is too short for the length of the freehub and you need 
 to add a spacer.

 Bill Lindsay
 El Cerrito, CA

 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>
> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>
> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike 
> for 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear 
> with 
> a Park chain gauge.
>
> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>
> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>
> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>
> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
> hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, 
> and 
> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never 
> noticed 
> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>
> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*
>
> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally 
> had a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did 

Re: [RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[Wesley]

Use blue Loctite.

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:30:54 AM UTC-7 J J wrote:

> Thanks for the recommendations, all. Which loc tite variety do you suggest 
> for the shifters?
>
> @Mackenzy, I’ve experienced the same slippage with a NOS Rapid Rise RD and 
> a modern, new high normal RD. In both cases it was with the same new 
> shifter cables, liners, and housing, and new chainrings, cassette, and 
> chain. I’m looking forward to trying loc tite. 
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 11:58:55 AM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>
>> This is good info. I don’t mind needing to use loc-tite because the 
>> shifter is smooth and looks good. But, maybe Riv should make this a 
>> recommendation or pre install it on the bolt. I’ll try it and report back. 
>> Doug
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On May 31, 2022, at 11:24 AM, Mackenzy Albright  
>> wrote:
>>
>> I installed a suntour barcon on my clem build with an ALTUS rear dr. Not 
>> sure if it's a stronger modern spring but find it's slipping more than 
>> normal. I previously had it paired with an older generation XTR reverse 
>> rapid rise which worked fine. But I think the reverse rapid rise has less 
>> return tension. 
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:06:24 AM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Doug, you're likely already aware that there's different levels of 
>>> loc-tite, but just make sure you use the less permanent option on those 
>>> shifters of yours.
>>> Happy shifting!
>>> -Kai
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:38:46 AM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>>>
 I was just looking at shifters on the Rivendell website and found this 
 blurb in the description of the wing bolts that can replace the d-ring 
 bolt 
 that comes with the Silver2 shifter... "*Put some loc-tite on them and 
 you'll likely never have to mess with them. If your shifter loses a little 
 tension, turn it at the next stop or even while you're riding, if you're 
 careful."  *So, I think I will try a little loc-tite on the bolt to 
 see if that helps with slippage.
 Doug 


 On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:08:03 AM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:

> Man, I grew up with friction shifters & have been yearning for the 
> Silver shifters to replace my Microshift units that came on the bike. But 
> these things work flawlessly & I’d forgotten about “slippage”. I think I 
> shall resist the nostalgic trip down memory lane and save $170.00!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 30, 2022, at 8:50 PM, J J  wrote:
>
> 
>
> Hi Doug, thanks for the nice write up. CeeCee looks great!
>
> About the Silver2 shifters: I’ve had the same problem of gears 
> slipping. I find that I have to tighten the D ring screw so much to 
> prevent 
> slipping that it makes it hard to move the shift levers. I haven’t 
> thought 
> of using thread lock. I’ve just kind of accepted the slipping as reality 
> for these shifters. It seems like I constantly have to fiddle with them. 
>
> I’d love to hear suggestions from anyone else who might be reading 
> this. I prefer friction shifting. But the slipping with these brand new 
> Silver2s has me considering index shifting for the first time. Grant says 
> these are the best shifters in the world. If these are the best….surely 
> they should not slip?? 
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:14:29 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>
>> I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to 
>> share some thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I 
>> call 
>> it my Clem Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but 
>> CeeCee 
>> may work. Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions to 
>> ponder. 
>> Am I faster or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes I've 
>> ridden? 
>> It doesn't feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at how it tracks up 
>> hills with ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery which gives me a 
>> greater degree of feeling safe as well.  I'm really happy with how the 
>> Clem 
>> rides on asphalt, dirt or gravel.
>>
>> I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used 
>> dynamo but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag 
>> from 
>> the hub and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my mind 
>> for 
>> other thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes with a 
>> Kasai 
>> hub. My rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with an unbranded 
>> hub. 
>> The mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I think. 
>>
>> My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and 
>> grippy. They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today 
>> wearing my Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and 
>> grip. 
>> Speaking of grip, I 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[George Schick]

Bill - oh, there has definitely been something going on all these years 
that's just not right vs. a perceived but unrealized perfection associated 
with a high-end bike.  The reason why I'm assuming that the 
crunching/grinding had to do with the chain breakage is because it was 
starting to make the noise when the chain snapped.  If I could just get it 
to happen when I have it on the work stand I could then see what's going on 
between the chain and the rear cogs or the chain ring.  'Course, part (or 
maybe even most) of the reason why it won't happen on the work stand is 
because nothing on the drive train is under a load.


On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 11:14:22 AM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> George
>
> Getting back to the problem you are trying to solve:  Does your instinct 
> tell you that there's something broken or incorrect, and that faulty 
> condition is warning you with sound?  -OR- is this sound more of something 
> you just notice.  You feel an expensive bike should be silent and sometimes 
> you hear something, and you'd prefer to hear nothing from your expensive 
> bike?  
>
> Do you have an instinct on this?  There are definitely a lot of cyclists 
> of a certain age who recall having ridden a silent bicycle back in the day, 
> who now dislike anything newer or more modern on the grounds that it's no 
> longer silent.  Back in the eearly to mid 1990s I was largely a Campy-guy, 
> purely on the grounds that a Campy drivetrain in that era (8sp ergo) was 
> silent while pedaling.  Shimano definitely shifted better but Shimano was 
> not as silent "in gear" as Campy was.  The pedaling feedback into my feet 
> was one of fluidity.  With Shimano, I felt that the sound and the feel 
> would constantly remind me I was operating a chain-drive drive train.  
> Campy allowed me to forget that.  I couldn't feel it, and I associated that 
> with "quality".  
>
> Could that be part of what's going on here?
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:11:19 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Bill - you raise a good point.  None of the cogs wiggle, but I can't 
>> remember if they're keyed as they slide onto the free hub splines.  Looking 
>> at the way the teeth on the cogs are arranged as the free hub turns makes 
>> me wonder if they get into a certain position and "think" they need to 
>> shift, but then can't, making a loud unforgiving sound.  IOW, a link may be 
>> getting caught crossways between shifting and not shifting, causing not 
>> only the sound, but leading ultimately to the broken side plates.  Not sure 
>> what to do about this.  Placing the bike on a work stand with new chain 
>> installed and moving the RD through all of the cassette gears, rotating the 
>> pedals both forward and backward (freewheeling) yields no kind of sound 
>> whatsoever.
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:13:33 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> George
>>>
>>> I'm in California
>>>
>>> Just to rule it out, grab a middle-ish cog in the cogset and give it a 
>>> wiggle.  Does it wiggle relative to the other cogs or are they all really 
>>> secure relative to one another?  If it wiggles, then maybe the lockring is 
>>> loose.  If the lockring is tight but the cogs wiggle then maybe the stack 
>>> up of the cassette is too short for the length of the freehub and you need 
>>> to add a spacer.
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...

 *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
 actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
 likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
 frequently, and the noise never changes?*

 I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 
 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a 
 Park chain gauge.

 *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*

 Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.

 *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*

 No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
 hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
 re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
 any uneven wear on the bearing races.

 *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*

 The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally 
 had a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same 
 thing then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride 
 in the larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is 
 only used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to 
 ridges at the top.

Re: [RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[J J]

Thanks for the recommendations, all. Which loc tite variety do you suggest 
for the shifters?

@Mackenzy, I’ve experienced the same slippage with a NOS Rapid Rise RD and 
a modern, new high normal RD. In both cases it was with the same new 
shifter cables, liners, and housing, and new chainrings, cassette, and 
chain. I’m looking forward to trying loc tite. 

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 11:58:55 AM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:

> This is good info. I don’t mind needing to use loc-tite because the 
> shifter is smooth and looks good. But, maybe Riv should make this a 
> recommendation or pre install it on the bolt. I’ll try it and report back. 
> Doug
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 31, 2022, at 11:24 AM, Mackenzy Albright  
> wrote:
>
> I installed a suntour barcon on my clem build with an ALTUS rear dr. Not 
> sure if it's a stronger modern spring but find it's slipping more than 
> normal. I previously had it paired with an older generation XTR reverse 
> rapid rise which worked fine. But I think the reverse rapid rise has less 
> return tension. 
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:06:24 AM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY wrote:
>
>> Doug, you're likely already aware that there's different levels of 
>> loc-tite, but just make sure you use the less permanent option on those 
>> shifters of yours.
>> Happy shifting!
>> -Kai
>>
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:38:46 AM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>>
>>> I was just looking at shifters on the Rivendell website and found this 
>>> blurb in the description of the wing bolts that can replace the d-ring bolt 
>>> that comes with the Silver2 shifter... "*Put some loc-tite on them and 
>>> you'll likely never have to mess with them. If your shifter loses a little 
>>> tension, turn it at the next stop or even while you're riding, if you're 
>>> careful."  *So, I think I will try a little loc-tite on the bolt to see 
>>> if that helps with slippage.
>>> Doug 
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:08:03 AM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 Man, I grew up with friction shifters & have been yearning for the 
 Silver shifters to replace my Microshift units that came on the bike. But 
 these things work flawlessly & I’d forgotten about “slippage”. I think I 
 shall resist the nostalgic trip down memory lane and save $170.00!

 Sent from my iPhone

 On May 30, 2022, at 8:50 PM, J J  wrote:

 

 Hi Doug, thanks for the nice write up. CeeCee looks great!

 About the Silver2 shifters: I’ve had the same problem of gears 
 slipping. I find that I have to tighten the D ring screw so much to 
 prevent 
 slipping that it makes it hard to move the shift levers. I haven’t thought 
 of using thread lock. I’ve just kind of accepted the slipping as reality 
 for these shifters. It seems like I constantly have to fiddle with them. 

 I’d love to hear suggestions from anyone else who might be reading 
 this. I prefer friction shifting. But the slipping with these brand new 
 Silver2s has me considering index shifting for the first time. Grant says 
 these are the best shifters in the world. If these are the best….surely 
 they should not slip?? 

 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:14:29 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:

> I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to 
> share some thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I 
> call 
> it my Clem Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but 
> CeeCee 
> may work. Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions to ponder. 
> Am I faster or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes I've ridden? 
> It doesn't feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at how it tracks up 
> hills with ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery which gives me a 
> greater degree of feeling safe as well.  I'm really happy with how the 
> Clem 
> rides on asphalt, dirt or gravel.
>
> I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used 
> dynamo but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag 
> from 
> the hub and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my mind for 
> other thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes with a 
> Kasai 
> hub. My rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with an unbranded 
> hub. 
> The mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I think. 
>
> My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and 
> grippy. They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today 
> wearing my Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and 
> grip. 
> Speaking of grip, I really like the Ergon Biokork grips.  
>
> I wrapped Newbaum cloth tape on my chainstay  as a protector even 
> though it already had a clear one...I like the looks of it. I've put two 
> stickers on it and ordered a 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Joe Bernard]

Bill (this is Joe, not George), I've had that noise madness with SRAM 
cassettes. Chains sound all rattly and crunchy on them and I'm just not 
into it! 

Joe Bernard

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:14:22 AM UTC-7 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> George
>
> Getting back to the problem you are trying to solve:  Does your instinct 
> tell you that there's something broken or incorrect, and that faulty 
> condition is warning you with sound?  -OR- is this sound more of something 
> you just notice.  You feel an expensive bike should be silent and sometimes 
> you hear something, and you'd prefer to hear nothing from your expensive 
> bike?  
>
> Do you have an instinct on this?  There are definitely a lot of cyclists 
> of a certain age who recall having ridden a silent bicycle back in the day, 
> who now dislike anything newer or more modern on the grounds that it's no 
> longer silent.  Back in the eearly to mid 1990s I was largely a Campy-guy, 
> purely on the grounds that a Campy drivetrain in that era (8sp ergo) was 
> silent while pedaling.  Shimano definitely shifted better but Shimano was 
> not as silent "in gear" as Campy was.  The pedaling feedback into my feet 
> was one of fluidity.  With Shimano, I felt that the sound and the feel 
> would constantly remind me I was operating a chain-drive drive train.  
> Campy allowed me to forget that.  I couldn't feel it, and I associated that 
> with "quality".  
>
> Could that be part of what's going on here?
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:11:19 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Bill - you raise a good point.  None of the cogs wiggle, but I can't 
>> remember if they're keyed as they slide onto the free hub splines.  Looking 
>> at the way the teeth on the cogs are arranged as the free hub turns makes 
>> me wonder if they get into a certain position and "think" they need to 
>> shift, but then can't, making a loud unforgiving sound.  IOW, a link may be 
>> getting caught crossways between shifting and not shifting, causing not 
>> only the sound, but leading ultimately to the broken side plates.  Not sure 
>> what to do about this.  Placing the bike on a work stand with new chain 
>> installed and moving the RD through all of the cassette gears, rotating the 
>> pedals both forward and backward (freewheeling) yields no kind of sound 
>> whatsoever.
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:13:33 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> George
>>>
>>> I'm in California
>>>
>>> Just to rule it out, grab a middle-ish cog in the cogset and give it a 
>>> wiggle.  Does it wiggle relative to the other cogs or are they all really 
>>> secure relative to one another?  If it wiggles, then maybe the lockring is 
>>> loose.  If the lockring is tight but the cogs wiggle then maybe the stack 
>>> up of the cassette is too short for the length of the freehub and you need 
>>> to add a spacer.
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...

 *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
 actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
 likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
 frequently, and the noise never changes?*

 I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 
 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a 
 Park chain gauge.

 *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*

 Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.

 *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*

 No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
 hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
 re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
 any uneven wear on the bearing races.

 *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*

 The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally 
 had a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same 
 thing then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride 
 in the larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is 
 only used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to 
 ridges at the top.

 *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*

 The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
 indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
 occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though 
 quieter) 
 and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
 with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Bill Lindsay]

George

Getting back to the problem you are trying to solve:  Does your instinct 
tell you that there's something broken or incorrect, and that faulty 
condition is warning you with sound?  -OR- is this sound more of something 
you just notice.  You feel an expensive bike should be silent and sometimes 
you hear something, and you'd prefer to hear nothing from your expensive 
bike?  

Do you have an instinct on this?  There are definitely a lot of cyclists of 
a certain age who recall having ridden a silent bicycle back in the day, 
who now dislike anything newer or more modern on the grounds that it's no 
longer silent.  Back in the eearly to mid 1990s I was largely a Campy-guy, 
purely on the grounds that a Campy drivetrain in that era (8sp ergo) was 
silent while pedaling.  Shimano definitely shifted better but Shimano was 
not as silent "in gear" as Campy was.  The pedaling feedback into my feet 
was one of fluidity.  With Shimano, I felt that the sound and the feel 
would constantly remind me I was operating a chain-drive drive train.  
Campy allowed me to forget that.  I couldn't feel it, and I associated that 
with "quality".  

Could that be part of what's going on here?

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:11:19 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Bill - you raise a good point.  None of the cogs wiggle, but I can't 
> remember if they're keyed as they slide onto the free hub splines.  Looking 
> at the way the teeth on the cogs are arranged as the free hub turns makes 
> me wonder if they get into a certain position and "think" they need to 
> shift, but then can't, making a loud unforgiving sound.  IOW, a link may be 
> getting caught crossways between shifting and not shifting, causing not 
> only the sound, but leading ultimately to the broken side plates.  Not sure 
> what to do about this.  Placing the bike on a work stand with new chain 
> installed and moving the RD through all of the cassette gears, rotating the 
> pedals both forward and backward (freewheeling) yields no kind of sound 
> whatsoever.
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:13:33 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> George
>>
>> I'm in California
>>
>> Just to rule it out, grab a middle-ish cog in the cogset and give it a 
>> wiggle.  Does it wiggle relative to the other cogs or are they all really 
>> secure relative to one another?  If it wiggles, then maybe the lockring is 
>> loose.  If the lockring is tight but the cogs wiggle then maybe the stack 
>> up of the cassette is too short for the length of the freehub and you need 
>> to add a spacer.
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>>>
>>> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
>>> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
>>> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
>>> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>>>
>>> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike for 
>>> 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear with a 
>>> Park chain gauge.
>>>
>>> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>>>
>>> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>>>
>>> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>>>
>>> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
>>> hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, and 
>>> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never noticed 
>>> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>>>
>>> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*
>>>
>>> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally 
>>> had a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same 
>>> thing then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride 
>>> in the larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is 
>>> only used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to 
>>> ridges at the top.
>>>
>>> *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*
>>>
>>> The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
>>> indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
>>> occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though quieter) 
>>> and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
>>> with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was an Axxis 
>>> and the clunking noise was present even then.
>>>
>>> *Sometimes, a headset problem can feel like drive train noise.*
>>>
>>> The headset on this bike had indeed indexed a number of years ago, but I 
>>> swapped it for an IRC roller drive and it's been fine ever since.
>>>
>>> *If you don't want to dive into iterative and time-consuming 
>>> 

Re: [RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[Doug Hansford]

This is good info. I don’t mind needing to use loc-tite because the shifter is 
smooth and looks good. But, maybe Riv should make this a recommendation or pre 
install it on the bolt. I’ll try it and report back. 
Doug

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 31, 2022, at 11:24 AM, Mackenzy Albright  
> wrote:
> 
> I installed a suntour barcon on my clem build with an ALTUS rear dr. Not 
> sure if it's a stronger modern spring but find it's slipping more than 
> normal. I previously had it paired with an older generation XTR reverse rapid 
> rise which worked fine. But I think the reverse rapid rise has less return 
> tension. 
> 
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:06:24 AM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY wrote:
>> Doug, you're likely already aware that there's different levels of loc-tite, 
>> but just make sure you use the less permanent option on those shifters of 
>> yours.
>> Happy shifting!
>> -Kai
>> 
>>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:38:46 AM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>>> I was just looking at shifters on the Rivendell website and found this 
>>> blurb in the description of the wing bolts that can replace the d-ring bolt 
>>> that comes with the Silver2 shifter... "Put some loc-tite on them and 
>>> you'll likely never have to mess with them. If your shifter loses a little 
>>> tension, turn it at the next stop or even while you're riding, if you're 
>>> careful."  So, I think I will try a little loc-tite on the bolt to see if 
>>> that helps with slippage.
>>> Doug 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:08:03 AM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
 Man, I grew up with friction shifters & have been yearning for the Silver 
 shifters to replace my Microshift units that came on the bike. But these 
 things work flawlessly & I’d forgotten about “slippage”. I think I shall 
 resist the nostalgic trip down memory lane and save $170.00!
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
>> On May 30, 2022, at 8:50 PM, J J  wrote:
>> 
> 
 
> Hi Doug, thanks for the nice write up. CeeCee looks great!
> 
> About the Silver2 shifters: I’ve had the same problem of gears slipping. 
> I find that I have to tighten the D ring screw so much to prevent 
> slipping that it makes it hard to move the shift levers. I haven’t 
> thought of using thread lock. I’ve just kind of accepted the slipping as 
> reality for these shifters. It seems like I constantly have to fiddle 
> with them. 
> 
> I’d love to hear suggestions from anyone else who might be reading this. 
> I prefer friction shifting. But the slipping with these brand new 
> Silver2s has me considering index shifting for the first time. Grant says 
> these are the best shifters in the world. If these are the best….surely 
> they should not slip?? 
> 
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:14:29 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>>> I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to share 
>>> some thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I call it 
>>> my Clem Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but 
>>> CeeCee may work. Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions 
>>> to ponder. Am I faster or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes 
>>> I've ridden? It doesn't feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at 
>>> how it tracks up hills with ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery 
>>> which gives me a greater degree of feeling safe as well.  I'm really 
>>> happy with how the Clem rides on asphalt, dirt or gravel.
>>> 
>>> I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used 
>>> dynamo but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag 
>>> from the hub and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my 
>>> mind for other thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes 
>>> with a Kasai hub. My rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with 
>>> an unbranded hub. The mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I 
>>> think. 
>>> 
>>> My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and 
>>> grippy. They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today 
>>> wearing my Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and 
>>> grip. Speaking of grip, I really like the Ergon Biokork grips.  
>>> 
>>> I wrapped Newbaum cloth tape on my chainstay  as a protector even 
>>> though it already had a clear one...I like the looks of it. I've put 
>>> two stickers on it and ordered a couple from Path Less Pedaled to 
>>> sticker it up a little more. This is a fun bike to ride and tinker with 
>>> for sure.
>>> 
>>> I'm digging friction shifting but I have gotten slippage from the 
>>> Silver2 shifter. The bolt comes loose and my gears slip at times. I 
>>> guess I need to find just the right tension but it is a little 
>>> frustrating. Should I use 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Ian A]

Maybe take a close look at the right-side dropout to make sure it does not 
have a crack in it. Normally, if a dropout cracks, failure is soon behind, 
so it's unlikely to be the problem in your case, but it is something to 
rule out.  My friend had his go on his old Raleigh, on the drive side, but 
I don't recall it making worrying noises before it went. 

IanA Alberta Canada

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 7:21:58 AM UTC-6 George Schick wrote:

> Garth - I have not done anything to the freehub body.  That's a good 
> recommendation and I'll have to address it.
>
> Bill S - good point.  This frame is one of Grant's "tweeners'; somewhere 
> between 130 and 135mm spacing so it will accommodate either road or MTB 
> hubs.  I don't think that will cause any issues, though, but it might be 
> worthwhile taking it to an LBS and have them check to make sure the 
> dropouts are parallel.
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 7:13:08 AM UTC-5 Bill Schairer wrote:
>
>> It wouldn't hurt to check the alignment of the dropouts and derailleur 
>> hanger.
>>
>> Bill S 
>> San Diego
>>
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 2:05:45 AM UTC-7 Garth wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> George, Have you ever cleaned/relubed the cassette/freewheel(whichever 
>>> the DA is) body itself ?  I know you've mentioned the bearings, but not the 
>>> cog host body. 
>>>
>>> I'm with you about the "more gears and wider dropouts" nonsense . I have 
>>> a good selection of Sachs and Suntour Ultra 6 and 7 speed freewheels of 
>>> which I'm seriously considering using for my upcoming Franklin custom. I'm 
>>> really not fond of anything to do with cassettes.The cassette so-called 
>>> "solution" was but a self-fullfilling sales pitch/excuse for "more more 
>>> more". Hah hah.  I have 2 sets of Specialized 126mm hubs of which I have 
>>> converted in the past to 135mm using a solid axle. I could have the frame 
>>> spec'd to whatever I want though, and buying more vintage NOS hubs of 
>>> various widths is not a problem. 
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:05:48 PM UTC-4 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 Joe - the chain is rarely, if at all, on the smallest cog next to the 
 chain stay.  It is normally in either cog 4 or 5, counting from the 
 largest 
 cog outward.  I can remember when a company by the name of Sedis 
 (Sedisport?) first introduced a narrower chain back in the late 70's in 
 order to squeeze more gears onto a freewheel with normal 120-126mm rear 
 dropout spacing.  In my opinion, it's been downhill ever since with 
 manufacturers trying to outdo one another with wider and wider dropout 
 spacing and 9+ cogs.  OTOH, I have an old '71/'72 Fuji Finest on which I'm 
 running a 5-speed freewheel on a 120mm PW hub, friction shifted, and 
 everything works just fine all the time.


 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:36:40 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Huh, I'm stumped. It crunches under hard pedaling and this time the 
> chain snapped, which sounds like the chain wanted to keep going and 
> something back there didn't want to budge. How's the clearance between 
> small cog and chainstay? This is my last shot at a wild guess..maybe 
> under 
> heavy power the cassette is contacting the frame at the dropout. 
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:16:12 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Joe - I thought about that and have since replaced the chain, but in 
>> all likely hood the cassette should still be OK.  It's not the original 
>> with the bike; I replaced the one with which the bike shipped with 
>> another 
>> (same manf.) that has slightly different gearing.  The previous cassette 
>> had the same problems.
>>
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:09:00 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> It could be anything but what I think we know now is the chain is 
>>> busted and chain and cassette are both probably pretty old. Based on my 
>>> supposition - pulled out of thin air - that your chain never mated well 
>>> with that cassette I would replace both now and see what happens. 
>>>
>>> Joe Bernard
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...

 *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and 
 you actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire 
 drivetrain 
 is likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your 
 chain 
 frequently, and the noise never changes?*

 I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike 
 for 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear 
 with 
 a Park chain gauge.

 *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*

 Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.

 

Re: [RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[Mackenzy Albright]

I installed a suntour barcon on my clem build with an ALTUS rear dr. Not 
sure if it's a stronger modern spring but find it's slipping more than 
normal. I previously had it paired with an older generation XTR reverse 
rapid rise which worked fine. But I think the reverse rapid rise has less 
return tension. 

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:06:24 AM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY wrote:

> Doug, you're likely already aware that there's different levels of 
> loc-tite, but just make sure you use the less permanent option on those 
> shifters of yours.
> Happy shifting!
> -Kai
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:38:46 AM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>
>> I was just looking at shifters on the Rivendell website and found this 
>> blurb in the description of the wing bolts that can replace the d-ring bolt 
>> that comes with the Silver2 shifter... "*Put some loc-tite on them and 
>> you'll likely never have to mess with them. If your shifter loses a little 
>> tension, turn it at the next stop or even while you're riding, if you're 
>> careful."  *So, I think I will try a little loc-tite on the bolt to see 
>> if that helps with slippage.
>> Doug 
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:08:03 AM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Man, I grew up with friction shifters & have been yearning for the 
>>> Silver shifters to replace my Microshift units that came on the bike. But 
>>> these things work flawlessly & I’d forgotten about “slippage”. I think I 
>>> shall resist the nostalgic trip down memory lane and save $170.00!
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On May 30, 2022, at 8:50 PM, J J  wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> Hi Doug, thanks for the nice write up. CeeCee looks great!
>>>
>>> About the Silver2 shifters: I’ve had the same problem of gears slipping. 
>>> I find that I have to tighten the D ring screw so much to prevent slipping 
>>> that it makes it hard to move the shift levers. I haven’t thought of using 
>>> thread lock. I’ve just kind of accepted the slipping as reality for these 
>>> shifters. It seems like I constantly have to fiddle with them. 
>>>
>>> I’d love to hear suggestions from anyone else who might be reading this. 
>>> I prefer friction shifting. But the slipping with these brand new Silver2s 
>>> has me considering index shifting for the first time. Grant says these are 
>>> the best shifters in the world. If these are the best….surely they should 
>>> not slip?? 
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:14:29 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>>>
 I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to share 
 some thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I call it my 
 Clem Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but CeeCee may 
 work. Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions to ponder. Am I 
 faster or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes I've ridden? It 
 doesn't feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at how it tracks up 
 hills 
 with ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery which gives me a greater 
 degree of feeling safe as well.  I'm really happy with how the Clem rides 
 on asphalt, dirt or gravel.

 I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used 
 dynamo but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag 
 from 
 the hub and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my mind for 
 other thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes with a Kasai 
 hub. My rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with an unbranded hub. 
 The mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I think. 

 My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and 
 grippy. They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today 
 wearing my Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and grip. 
 Speaking of grip, I really like the Ergon Biokork grips.  

 I wrapped Newbaum cloth tape on my chainstay  as a protector even 
 though it already had a clear one...I like the looks of it. I've put two 
 stickers on it and ordered a couple from Path Less Pedaled to sticker it 
 up 
 a little more. This is a fun bike to ride and tinker with for sure.

 I'm digging friction shifting but I have gotten slippage from the 
 Silver2 shifter. The bolt comes loose and my gears slip at times. I guess 
 I 
 need to find just the right tension but it is a little frustrating. Should 
 I use thread-locker? Anyone else had this issue?

 All in all the Clem is a well-designed bicycle that rides so nice on 
 any surface. Just Ride.

 Here is a link to some photos if you are interested Clem Cruiser 
 

 Doug
 Athens, GA

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Re: [RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[Patrick Moore]

I used several pairs of the first-gen Silver bar end shifters extensively
and always ended up putting blue Loctite on the mounting bolts to prevent
loosening. I daresay beeswax would work too.

Silvers are hardly the only shifters that require this treatment, IME.

Patrick Moore, currently using Suntour Barcons ... with blue Loctite, in
ABQ, NM


On Tue, May 31, 2022 at 7:08 AM Richard Rose  wrote:

> Man, I grew up with friction shifters & have been yearning for the Silver
> shifters to replace my Microshift units that came on the bike. But these
> things work flawlessly & I’d forgotten about “slippage”. I think I shall
> resist the nostalgic trip down memory lane and save $170.00!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 30, 2022, at 8:50 PM, J J  wrote:
>
> 
> Hi Doug, thanks for the nice write up. CeeCee looks great!
>
> About the Silver2 shifters: I’ve had the same problem of gears slipping. I
> find that I have to tighten the D ring screw so much to prevent slipping
> that it makes it hard to move the shift levers. I haven’t thought of using
> thread lock. I’ve just kind of accepted the slipping as reality for these
> shifters. It seems like I constantly have to fiddle with them.
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY]

Doug, you're likely already aware that there's different levels of 
loc-tite, but just make sure you use the less permanent option on those 
shifters of yours.
Happy shifting!
-Kai

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:38:46 AM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:

> I was just looking at shifters on the Rivendell website and found this 
> blurb in the description of the wing bolts that can replace the d-ring bolt 
> that comes with the Silver2 shifter... "*Put some loc-tite on them and 
> you'll likely never have to mess with them. If your shifter loses a little 
> tension, turn it at the next stop or even while you're riding, if you're 
> careful."  *So, I think I will try a little loc-tite on the bolt to see 
> if that helps with slippage.
> Doug 
>
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:08:03 AM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Man, I grew up with friction shifters & have been yearning for the Silver 
>> shifters to replace my Microshift units that came on the bike. But these 
>> things work flawlessly & I’d forgotten about “slippage”. I think I shall 
>> resist the nostalgic trip down memory lane and save $170.00!
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On May 30, 2022, at 8:50 PM, J J  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> Hi Doug, thanks for the nice write up. CeeCee looks great!
>>
>> About the Silver2 shifters: I’ve had the same problem of gears slipping. 
>> I find that I have to tighten the D ring screw so much to prevent slipping 
>> that it makes it hard to move the shift levers. I haven’t thought of using 
>> thread lock. I’ve just kind of accepted the slipping as reality for these 
>> shifters. It seems like I constantly have to fiddle with them. 
>>
>> I’d love to hear suggestions from anyone else who might be reading this. 
>> I prefer friction shifting. But the slipping with these brand new Silver2s 
>> has me considering index shifting for the first time. Grant says these are 
>> the best shifters in the world. If these are the best….surely they should 
>> not slip?? 
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:14:29 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>>
>>> I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to share 
>>> some thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I call it my 
>>> Clem Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but CeeCee may 
>>> work. Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions to ponder. Am I 
>>> faster or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes I've ridden? It 
>>> doesn't feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at how it tracks up hills 
>>> with ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery which gives me a greater 
>>> degree of feeling safe as well.  I'm really happy with how the Clem rides 
>>> on asphalt, dirt or gravel.
>>>
>>> I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used 
>>> dynamo but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag from 
>>> the hub and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my mind for 
>>> other thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes with a Kasai 
>>> hub. My rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with an unbranded hub. 
>>> The mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I think. 
>>>
>>> My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and grippy. 
>>> They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today wearing my 
>>> Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and grip. Speaking of 
>>> grip, I really like the Ergon Biokork grips.  
>>>
>>> I wrapped Newbaum cloth tape on my chainstay  as a protector even though 
>>> it already had a clear one...I like the looks of it. I've put two stickers 
>>> on it and ordered a couple from Path Less Pedaled to sticker it up a little 
>>> more. This is a fun bike to ride and tinker with for sure.
>>>
>>> I'm digging friction shifting but I have gotten slippage from the 
>>> Silver2 shifter. The bolt comes loose and my gears slip at times. I guess I 
>>> need to find just the right tension but it is a little frustrating. Should 
>>> I use thread-locker? Anyone else had this issue?
>>>
>>> All in all the Clem is a well-designed bicycle that rides so nice on any 
>>> surface. Just Ride.
>>>
>>> Here is a link to some photos if you are interested Clem Cruiser 
>>> 
>>>
>>> Doug
>>> Athens, GA
>>>
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>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/f9e3f6d5-35b8-40ac-a784-655b8001fbc8n%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: 65cm Clem Smith Jr Build / First ride

[Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY]

That there's a well worn B Lumotec IQ. It's lit up a lot of paths over 
the years, but my IQ-X is better looking...
-Kai

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 3:59:39 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:

> That Clem H is great! Can't wait to get a handful of years of adventure 
> and tape on it. What headlamp are you using? 
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:36:18 PM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY wrote:
>
>> The low is the way to go, here's my 65 high for reference- 
>> https://photos.app.goo.gl/uxqm63W2nB5scvmg7
>> Sturdy bike for sure, rides a lot bier than other 65s out there.
>> -Kai
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 1:33:55 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:
>>
>>> oh! you are right - 64. I think I measured seat tube center to top which 
>>> is about 65 and it stuck in my brain :) 
>>>
>>> The length is only 25mm difference between the 59 and the 64. That was 
>>> my biggest determining factor, as Will confirmed the seatpost would be able 
>>> to be low enough to accommodate my PBH. Plenty of room for stopping and 
>>> jumping off mid climb :) 
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 11:22:59 AM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 “6’1” on a 65 Clem Smith Jr?!”, is what I said to myself in disbelief 
 﫢, but seeing the photo wiped away my fears. To be overly technical, 65s 
 only came in H, H as in the top tube was all the way there, and as someone 
 on the upper end of the 6’s with a 65 Clem H, I feared for your abrupt 
 stops…
 But yeah, photos tell all, and specifically, that’s a 64, and a 
 beautiful one at that.
 Enjoy!
 -Kai

 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:19:19 PM UTC-4 Mackenzy Albright wrote:

> Howdy all, 
>
> We are in new bike season, and hope to see lots of posts soon! Came 
> across it for sale from a RBW poster this winter. Third hand I think. 
> Since 
> I spent most of my disposable income on it, Ive been doing my best to 
> build 
> it as inexpensively as possible given costs of parts in Canada are 
> outrageous and hard to find, Coops are still difficult to access and 
> short 
> of nicer parts because of shortages. I put my bike snob self aside to 
> build 
> the cheapest possible version keeping to somewhat RIV spirit. 
>
> 65cm frame (im about 6ft 1in) I love the fit. 
> Alex Adventurer 2 rims laced to used XTR disc, and 2nd hand SON disc 
> (my biggest expense) Random recut spokes for budgets. 
> Hand me down Racing Ralph and Nobby Nic
> Brooks ive had for 15+ years 
> Altus rear DR 
> Suntour barcon (doesnt seem to like the spring of the altus) 
> 2x KMC chains - because I guess that is a thing 
> Cheap AVID levers
> Losco Bars, my favorite bar ever. 
> 120mm nitto stem with shim that creaks non stop 
> ALIEXPRESS cranks mimicing the Silver cranks gearing and sprocket 
> guard 
> Cheapest Shimano V brakes 
> AliExpress brake lever converters that I just use as a pulley now 
> ESI grips 
> Odyssey BMX petals 
> Sinkhole Montreal Custom Bar Bag 
>
> The pink parts started off as a joke and because they're spares from a 
> BMX bike project that got canned. Now I am kind of into it. I need to 
> find 
> a cheapish headlight, and would like to splurge on Simworks Flat 65 
> fenders 
> for when I move back to the coast. 
>
> Once I get some camping trips in I need to decide how to carry camping 
> gear. Front and rear bags only? Front basket and panniers? who knows! 
> half 
> the fun. 
>
> Speaking of fun. I cannot believe how nice this rides. It tracks great 
> at speed, grips well on loose steep climbs, front end stays down during 
> climbing. And in general just so comfortable. I was skeptical going for 
> the 
> 65 frame being only a bit over 6ft. With advice from Will at Riv, I was 
> able to get a good enough estimate to know I'd fit minimally. It's nice 
> having so much leeway to move the bars up and down and a good amount of 
> forward and backwards for leverage and comfort. I honestly just really 
> like 
> this bike. I cant wait to get camping.
>
> [image: PXL_20220530_144915904.jpg]
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Jingy]

Another option is to skip the group ride this week and lone wolf it.
Jim

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:01:10 AM UTC-5 jeffrey kane wrote:

> Great stories, as usual - I'm pretty sure I remember suggesting that you 
> should consider converting that ol' Betty Foy into your drop bar go-fast 
> bike a long time back ... 
>
> On Wednesday, April 6, 2022 at 10:10:18 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> [image: 6982042D-DB05-4044-8AC4-9076A708539B.jpeg][image: 
>> 0221807D-FECC-440C-AE2E-AF03DDB70770.jpeg]We moved to Michigan 4 months 
>> ago. After years of being a Lone Wolf I did the unthinkable and joined the 
>> local bike club. The club was founded by racers 50 (FIFTY!) years ago, but 
>> they seemed welcoming enough. Having never ridden in a group, I lacked 
>> knowledge of my pace and skill, did not knowif I’d enjoy club riding. I’ve 
>> never been a road rider. The West has always offered me bike lanes and bike 
>> paths - riding with cars going 55 mph seemed suicidal. Would it be 
>> stressful? Would I be accepted? Would I be slow? My raspberry Platypus is 
>> my lightest build. I don’t know how much it weighs, but it has a 
>> lightweight Nitto rear rack, a Bag Boy Saddlesack (not pictured), and too 
>> many things on the handlebars. Meet my club ride bike. 
>>
>> My Racing Platypus. 
>>
>> One of the board members took me under her wing. She invited her good 
>> friend and organized a ride for the 3 of us. She taught me club etiquette 
>> on the road. They rode carbon bikes with drop bars, but they did not 
>> question my bike. It went great. Bolstered by that ride, I accepted her 
>> invite to the first club ride of the season, provided we could ride in the 
>> same group. “They’ll never believe it when you show up with that bike, 
>> Leah, but you’re strong and you can definitely do club rides.” I have stars 
>> in my eyes for this woman; she is admirable in every way. If she said I 
>> could do it, I would try.
>>
>> I pulled into the park and it was carbon and drop bars as far as the eye 
>> could see. A wave of nausea washed over me as I walked my Platypus to the 
>> group huddle. Billie Bars on full display, Grant Safety triangle clasped 
>> around my waist, looking like a true Lone Wolf, I stood in the circle. The 
>> older members were very welcoming and found nice things to say about the 
>> Racing Platypus. The younger racers…well, they ignored it. I’m just as 
>> guilty; I find them terrifying, so I didn’t say hello, either. 
>>
>> My mentor put us in the 12-14 mph group. A good place to start. It proved 
>> too easy and I coasted much of that 20 miles. We decided we’d do the 15-16 
>> mph group next time. That day came and due to bad weather it was a small 
>> turnout. We joined the slow group again because they would have only had 2 
>> riders otherwise. We chose the route famous for its “rollers” (“What are 
>> rollers?” the Platypus rider asked.) and conquered them in cold weather 
>> with a headwind. The Racing Platypus, baptized on the mountains and hills 
>> of Las Vegas, took no issue with those rollers. 
>>
>> The next night was the women’s ride - the first of the season. About 10 
>> women, all experienced riders. Triathletes and marathoners, most. All on 
>> drop bar carbon or aluminum. Wondering if they should create a slow and a 
>> fast group, my mentor interrupted and said we’ll be one 15-16 mph group. 
>> Leah can hang. 
>>
>> I hadn’t realized *I* was the reason they were considering a slow group, 
>> but there it was.
>>
>> That was a challenging ride. Those women were fast. The route was 24 
>> miles and the wind was strong. I was able to stay in 2nd and 3rd position 
>> but I was working to do it. I loved it; such fun to ride with bike people 
>> and to let them plan the route. We passed by 4 lakes. We saw tons of 
>> wildlife. Cars were nice to us and it felt safe to ride on roads with the 
>> group. I got the “wow, a vintage bike” and “I’d like a cruiser bike, too” 
>> comments, and one comment that assumed I must not be able to afford a 
>> carbon bike. They don’t know how it’s possible not to be clipped in. They 
>> marveled at my kickstand. But, I don’t mind because it’s so much fun to 
>> ride with them.
>>
>> Observations and Things I’m learning: 
>> 1. Bike diversity is healthy. 
>> It is good for racers to see Rivendells and similar style bikes in their 
>> club rides. It is good for me to appreciate other kinds of bikes and other 
>> riding styles. I can be as guilty as them for thinking my way/bike are best.
>>
>> 2. Bringing your practical, Just Ride mentality to a club is good. 
>> It seems racer types don’t know about USING a bike. You cannot have your 
>> carbon frame knocked about in a bike rack, so errands by bike/commuting 
>> isn’t popular. I have been active on the club’s FB discussion page, and 
>> been posting the 30 Days of Biking challenge. I’ve got pics of my huge 
>> grocery hauls on my Shopping Platypus and the like. 

[RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

['jeffrey kane' via RBW Owners Bunch]

Great stories, as usual - I'm pretty sure I remember suggesting that you 
should consider converting that ol' Betty Foy into your drop bar go-fast 
bike a long time back ... 

On Wednesday, April 6, 2022 at 10:10:18 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> [image: 6982042D-DB05-4044-8AC4-9076A708539B.jpeg][image: 
> 0221807D-FECC-440C-AE2E-AF03DDB70770.jpeg]We moved to Michigan 4 months 
> ago. After years of being a Lone Wolf I did the unthinkable and joined the 
> local bike club. The club was founded by racers 50 (FIFTY!) years ago, but 
> they seemed welcoming enough. Having never ridden in a group, I lacked 
> knowledge of my pace and skill, did not knowif I’d enjoy club riding. I’ve 
> never been a road rider. The West has always offered me bike lanes and bike 
> paths - riding with cars going 55 mph seemed suicidal. Would it be 
> stressful? Would I be accepted? Would I be slow? My raspberry Platypus is 
> my lightest build. I don’t know how much it weighs, but it has a 
> lightweight Nitto rear rack, a Bag Boy Saddlesack (not pictured), and too 
> many things on the handlebars. Meet my club ride bike. 
>
> My Racing Platypus. 
>
> One of the board members took me under her wing. She invited her good 
> friend and organized a ride for the 3 of us. She taught me club etiquette 
> on the road. They rode carbon bikes with drop bars, but they did not 
> question my bike. It went great. Bolstered by that ride, I accepted her 
> invite to the first club ride of the season, provided we could ride in the 
> same group. “They’ll never believe it when you show up with that bike, 
> Leah, but you’re strong and you can definitely do club rides.” I have stars 
> in my eyes for this woman; she is admirable in every way. If she said I 
> could do it, I would try.
>
> I pulled into the park and it was carbon and drop bars as far as the eye 
> could see. A wave of nausea washed over me as I walked my Platypus to the 
> group huddle. Billie Bars on full display, Grant Safety triangle clasped 
> around my waist, looking like a true Lone Wolf, I stood in the circle. The 
> older members were very welcoming and found nice things to say about the 
> Racing Platypus. The younger racers…well, they ignored it. I’m just as 
> guilty; I find them terrifying, so I didn’t say hello, either. 
>
> My mentor put us in the 12-14 mph group. A good place to start. It proved 
> too easy and I coasted much of that 20 miles. We decided we’d do the 15-16 
> mph group next time. That day came and due to bad weather it was a small 
> turnout. We joined the slow group again because they would have only had 2 
> riders otherwise. We chose the route famous for its “rollers” (“What are 
> rollers?” the Platypus rider asked.) and conquered them in cold weather 
> with a headwind. The Racing Platypus, baptized on the mountains and hills 
> of Las Vegas, took no issue with those rollers. 
>
> The next night was the women’s ride - the first of the season. About 10 
> women, all experienced riders. Triathletes and marathoners, most. All on 
> drop bar carbon or aluminum. Wondering if they should create a slow and a 
> fast group, my mentor interrupted and said we’ll be one 15-16 mph group. 
> Leah can hang. 
>
> I hadn’t realized *I* was the reason they were considering a slow group, 
> but there it was.
>
> That was a challenging ride. Those women were fast. The route was 24 miles 
> and the wind was strong. I was able to stay in 2nd and 3rd position but I 
> was working to do it. I loved it; such fun to ride with bike people and to 
> let them plan the route. We passed by 4 lakes. We saw tons of wildlife. 
> Cars were nice to us and it felt safe to ride on roads with the group. I 
> got the “wow, a vintage bike” and “I’d like a cruiser bike, too” comments, 
> and one comment that assumed I must not be able to afford a carbon bike. 
> They don’t know how it’s possible not to be clipped in. They marveled at my 
> kickstand. But, I don’t mind because it’s so much fun to ride with them.
>
> Observations and Things I’m learning: 
> 1. Bike diversity is healthy. 
> It is good for racers to see Rivendells and similar style bikes in their 
> club rides. It is good for me to appreciate other kinds of bikes and other 
> riding styles. I can be as guilty as them for thinking my way/bike are best.
>
> 2. Bringing your practical, Just Ride mentality to a club is good. 
> It seems racer types don’t know about USING a bike. You cannot have your 
> carbon frame knocked about in a bike rack, so errands by bike/commuting 
> isn’t popular. I have been active on the club’s FB discussion page, and 
> been posting the 30 Days of Biking challenge. I’ve got pics of my huge 
> grocery hauls on my Shopping Platypus and the like. Surprisingly, they did 
> not know about this national challenge, and several of them are now joining 
> me, including my mentor!  Riding for pleasure and errands is a foreign 
> concept to most. They ride to go fast and get miles and be 

Re: [RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[Doug H.]

I was just looking at shifters on the Rivendell website and found this 
blurb in the description of the wing bolts that can replace the d-ring bolt 
that comes with the Silver2 shifter... "*Put some loc-tite on them and 
you'll likely never have to mess with them. If your shifter loses a little 
tension, turn it at the next stop or even while you're riding, if you're 
careful."  *So, I think I will try a little loc-tite on the bolt to see if 
that helps with slippage.
Doug 


On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 9:08:03 AM UTC-4 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:

> Man, I grew up with friction shifters & have been yearning for the Silver 
> shifters to replace my Microshift units that came on the bike. But these 
> things work flawlessly & I’d forgotten about “slippage”. I think I shall 
> resist the nostalgic trip down memory lane and save $170.00!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 30, 2022, at 8:50 PM, J J  wrote:
>
> 
>
> Hi Doug, thanks for the nice write up. CeeCee looks great!
>
> About the Silver2 shifters: I’ve had the same problem of gears slipping. I 
> find that I have to tighten the D ring screw so much to prevent slipping 
> that it makes it hard to move the shift levers. I haven’t thought of using 
> thread lock. I’ve just kind of accepted the slipping as reality for these 
> shifters. It seems like I constantly have to fiddle with them. 
>
> I’d love to hear suggestions from anyone else who might be reading this. I 
> prefer friction shifting. But the slipping with these brand new Silver2s 
> has me considering index shifting for the first time. Grant says these are 
> the best shifters in the world. If these are the best….surely they should 
> not slip?? 
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:14:29 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>
>> I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to share 
>> some thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I call it my 
>> Clem Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but CeeCee may 
>> work. Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions to ponder. Am I 
>> faster or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes I've ridden? It 
>> doesn't feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at how it tracks up hills 
>> with ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery which gives me a greater 
>> degree of feeling safe as well.  I'm really happy with how the Clem rides 
>> on asphalt, dirt or gravel.
>>
>> I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used 
>> dynamo but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag from 
>> the hub and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my mind for 
>> other thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes with a Kasai 
>> hub. My rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with an unbranded hub. 
>> The mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I think. 
>>
>> My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and grippy. 
>> They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today wearing my 
>> Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and grip. Speaking of 
>> grip, I really like the Ergon Biokork grips.  
>>
>> I wrapped Newbaum cloth tape on my chainstay  as a protector even though 
>> it already had a clear one...I like the looks of it. I've put two stickers 
>> on it and ordered a couple from Path Less Pedaled to sticker it up a little 
>> more. This is a fun bike to ride and tinker with for sure.
>>
>> I'm digging friction shifting but I have gotten slippage from the Silver2 
>> shifter. The bolt comes loose and my gears slip at times. I guess I need to 
>> find just the right tension but it is a little frustrating. Should I use 
>> thread-locker? Anyone else had this issue?
>>
>> All in all the Clem is a well-designed bicycle that rides so nice on any 
>> surface. Just Ride.
>>
>> Here is a link to some photos if you are interested Clem Cruiser 
>> 
>>
>> Doug
>> Athens, GA
>>
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[George Schick]

Garth - I have not done anything to the freehub body.  That's a good 
recommendation and I'll have to address it.

Bill S - good point.  This frame is one of Grant's "tweeners'; somewhere 
between 130 and 135mm spacing so it will accommodate either road or MTB 
hubs.  I don't think that will cause any issues, though, but it might be 
worthwhile taking it to an LBS and have them check to make sure the 
dropouts are parallel.


On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 7:13:08 AM UTC-5 Bill Schairer wrote:

> It wouldn't hurt to check the alignment of the dropouts and derailleur 
> hanger.
>
> Bill S 
> San Diego
>
> On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 2:05:45 AM UTC-7 Garth wrote:
>
>>
>> George, Have you ever cleaned/relubed the cassette/freewheel(whichever 
>> the DA is) body itself ?  I know you've mentioned the bearings, but not the 
>> cog host body. 
>>
>> I'm with you about the "more gears and wider dropouts" nonsense . I have 
>> a good selection of Sachs and Suntour Ultra 6 and 7 speed freewheels of 
>> which I'm seriously considering using for my upcoming Franklin custom. I'm 
>> really not fond of anything to do with cassettes.The cassette so-called 
>> "solution" was but a self-fullfilling sales pitch/excuse for "more more 
>> more". Hah hah.  I have 2 sets of Specialized 126mm hubs of which I have 
>> converted in the past to 135mm using a solid axle. I could have the frame 
>> spec'd to whatever I want though, and buying more vintage NOS hubs of 
>> various widths is not a problem. 
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:05:48 PM UTC-4 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> Joe - the chain is rarely, if at all, on the smallest cog next to the 
>>> chain stay.  It is normally in either cog 4 or 5, counting from the largest 
>>> cog outward.  I can remember when a company by the name of Sedis 
>>> (Sedisport?) first introduced a narrower chain back in the late 70's in 
>>> order to squeeze more gears onto a freewheel with normal 120-126mm rear 
>>> dropout spacing.  In my opinion, it's been downhill ever since with 
>>> manufacturers trying to outdo one another with wider and wider dropout 
>>> spacing and 9+ cogs.  OTOH, I have an old '71/'72 Fuji Finest on which I'm 
>>> running a 5-speed freewheel on a 120mm PW hub, friction shifted, and 
>>> everything works just fine all the time.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:36:40 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 Huh, I'm stumped. It crunches under hard pedaling and this time the 
 chain snapped, which sounds like the chain wanted to keep going and 
 something back there didn't want to budge. How's the clearance between 
 small cog and chainstay? This is my last shot at a wild guess..maybe under 
 heavy power the cassette is contacting the frame at the dropout. 

 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:16:12 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Joe - I thought about that and have since replaced the chain, but in 
> all likely hood the cassette should still be OK.  It's not the original 
> with the bike; I replaced the one with which the bike shipped with 
> another 
> (same manf.) that has slightly different gearing.  The previous cassette 
> had the same problems.
>
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:09:00 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> It could be anything but what I think we know now is the chain is 
>> busted and chain and cassette are both probably pretty old. Based on my 
>> supposition - pulled out of thin air - that your chain never mated well 
>> with that cassette I would replace both now and see what happens. 
>>
>> Joe Bernard
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>>>
>>> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and 
>>> you actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire 
>>> drivetrain 
>>> is likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your 
>>> chain 
>>> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>>>
>>> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike 
>>> for 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear 
>>> with 
>>> a Park chain gauge.
>>>
>>> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>>>
>>> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>>>
>>> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>>>
>>> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura 
>>> Ace hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, 
>>> cleaned, 
>>> and re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never 
>>> noticed any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>>>
>>> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are 
>>> in?*
>>>
>>> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It 
>>> originally 

Re: [RBW] Re: Clem Smith Jr Update

[Richard Rose]

Man, I grew up with friction shifters & have been yearning for the Silver 
shifters to replace my Microshift units that came on the bike. But these things 
work flawlessly & I’d forgotten about “slippage”. I think I shall resist the 
nostalgic trip down memory lane and save $170.00!

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 30, 2022, at 8:50 PM, J J  wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Doug, thanks for the nice write up. CeeCee looks great!
> 
> About the Silver2 shifters: I’ve had the same problem of gears slipping. I 
> find that I have to tighten the D ring screw so much to prevent slipping that 
> it makes it hard to move the shift levers. I haven’t thought of using thread 
> lock. I’ve just kind of accepted the slipping as reality for these shifters. 
> It seems like I constantly have to fiddle with them. 
> 
> I’d love to hear suggestions from anyone else who might be reading this. I 
> prefer friction shifting. But the slipping with these brand new Silver2s has 
> me considering index shifting for the first time. Grant says these are the 
> best shifters in the world. If these are the best….surely they should not 
> slip?? 
> 
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 4:14:29 PM UTC-4 Doug H. wrote:
>> I now have several hundred miles on my Clem Smith Jr so wanted to share some 
>> thoughts. I feel like I'm cruising around when I ride so I call it my Clem 
>> Cruiser, or CeeCee for short. I've never named a bike but CeeCee may work. 
>> Is it fast or slow? Those aren't the right questions to ponder. Am I faster 
>> or slower on the Clem as compared to other bikes I've ridden? It doesn't 
>> feel like it and I don't care! I'm amazed at how it tracks up hills with 
>> ease. I sit upright and enjoy the scenery which gives me a greater degree of 
>> feeling safe as well.  I'm really happy with how the Clem rides on asphalt, 
>> dirt or gravel.
>> 
>> I recently had Rich build a dynamo wheel for me as I had never used dynamo 
>> but wanted to give it a shot. I'm hooked. I don't feel any drag from the hub 
>> and not having to worry about recharging lights frees my mind for other 
>> thoughts. The wheel is a Velocity Cliffhanger 32 spokes with a Kasai hub. My 
>> rear wheel is still the stock Alex 36 spoke with an unbranded hub. The 
>> mismatched wheels are kinda cool and Clem-like I think. 
>> 
>> My pedals are One Up aluminum platform pedals that are large and grippy. 
>> They are perfect for the Clem and my big ole feet. I rode today wearing my 
>> Merrell sandals and the pedals gave plenty of support and grip. Speaking of 
>> grip, I really like the Ergon Biokork grips.  
>> 
>> I wrapped Newbaum cloth tape on my chainstay  as a protector even though it 
>> already had a clear one...I like the looks of it. I've put two stickers on 
>> it and ordered a couple from Path Less Pedaled to sticker it up a little 
>> more. This is a fun bike to ride and tinker with for sure.
>> 
>> I'm digging friction shifting but I have gotten slippage from the Silver2 
>> shifter. The bolt comes loose and my gears slip at times. I guess I need to 
>> find just the right tension but it is a little frustrating. Should I use 
>> thread-locker? Anyone else had this issue?
>> 
>> All in all the Clem is a well-designed bicycle that rides so nice on any 
>> surface. Just Ride.
>> 
>> Here is a link to some photos if you are interested Clem Cruiser
>> 
>> Doug
>> Athens, GA
> 
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Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[lconley]

I would put a tube in the Racing Platypus tire, possibly from one of the 
other bikes if you don't have a spare.

Laing

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:02:02 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> 
> This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
> really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
> if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
> controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
> ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
> me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
> conversation for your consideration.
>
> Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of tiny 
> pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my Racing 
> Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was that my 
> poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. Below: 
> left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear tire, wet 
> and holey and with very worn tread.
>
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
> holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
> tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
> checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
> because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
> ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
> because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. BUT, 
> the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
> Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Bill Schairer]

Swap a tire from one of the other bikes?

Bill S
San Diego

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:28:39 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Update to my advice, I also send my regards! ‍♂️
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:58:38 PM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I think the Clem is the way. Maybe you're a little slower this week and 
>> they can wait a minute, maybe Leah Peterson is a maniac who's just as fast 
>> on a Clem! Let's find out!!!
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 3:02:02 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> 
>>> This thread has been so fun for me to write, but I keep thinking, what 
>>> really else is there to say? We have covered the bases by now; we wondered 
>>> if a Raspberry Platypus could become a Racing Platypus, considered the 
>>> controversy, battled insecurities, confronted our (my) own preconceived 
>>> ideas, learned some new things from the racers. It’s been an adventure for 
>>> me, and thank you! But today, wouldn’t you know, I’ve got another bit of 
>>> conversation for your consideration.
>>>
>>> Last week I realized my rear tire was dripping sealant. A myriad of tiny 
>>> pin-prick holes that I have never noticed revealed themselves as my Racing 
>>> Platypus hung, inert on the wall. The only reason I caught it was that my 
>>> poor Shopping Platypus below it was catching the dripping sealant. Below: 
>>> left, front tire, with its tread still decent. Right, the rear tire, wet 
>>> and holey and with very worn tread.
>>>
>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>
>>> Turns out, the tire is toast. The rubber is thin enough that it is not 
>>> holding the sealant, and it is leaking through in minuscule holes and 
>>> tears. I never thought it would be worn out already - I’d never have 
>>> checked. I can’t tell you how many miles it took to make this happen 
>>> because I don’t track miles per bike - I just have a running total of 
>>> ridden miles. And between 2021-present, that number is…well, never mind, 
>>> because the calculator app crashed and I’m not totaling them up again. BUT, 
>>> the tires are only a year and a few month old! I got 5 years out of the 
>>> Betty Foy tires before I sat next to it one day and noticed this:
>>> [image: image2.jpeg]
>>>
>>> The bike shop had nothing as wide or even close as the 44 mm tires on 
>>> the Racing Platypus, and the Ultradynamico tires I ultimately settled on 
>>> haven’t yet shipped. I hope they’re good! I got the gray 42 mm Cava Race. 
>>>
>>> But what am I going to take to club rides this week? I can’t see taking 
>>> the Racing Platypus without new tires. The other contenders: A 2019 
>>> Rivendell Clem L and the 2020 Shopping Platypus. Both are heavy. Neither is 
>>> set up for speed. Good grief, look at these two:
>>>
>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>
>>> [image: image3.jpeg]
>>>
>>> You are thinking, just strip the Shopping Plat and ride that. Ah, but 
>>> the lights are attached to the racks, so those stay and they are HEAVY. 
>>> That Platypus is the heaviest of my trio! I can strip bags, but how much 
>>> does that really help? The gearing is different on it; it is a 1x and the 
>>> gearing is not as “right” as my Racing Plat. I don’t have technical terms 
>>> for this - I can only say that the Rivendell drive train always gives me 
>>> the “right” gear - the Shopping Plat often feels too hard or too easy. I 
>>> don’t want to be fiddling around with that while chasing club riders. But 
>>> that isn’t even the deal-killer for me…
>>>
>>> It’s that basket. 
>>>
>>> Listen, I have weathered the silent prejudice as I wheeled the Racing 
>>> Platypus to the huddle. The Saddlesack and Billie Bars always invoke 
>>> judgment in this scenario, but a BASKET. I don’t think I can do it.
>>>
>>> That leaves the Clem. A bike that Grant, while extolling its virtues and 
>>> its versatility, said, “Just don’t take it on your club rides or anything.” 
>>> The Clem, with its ultra-high and proud Bosco Bars and its step-through, 
>>> beefy frame. I shudder to think of what they will think. I don’t even know 
>>> how fast I can ride it. I think maybe fast because it was my only bike 
>>> during 2020 and I rode it hard. But, it is unproven at club rides and I’ve 
>>> got hesitation.
>>>
>>> I don’t know which bike to take for certain, but you are free to send 
>>> your advice and/or regards.
>>> Leah
>>>
>>> On May 27, 2022, at 10:56 AM, Joe T  wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> Another great story by Leah! From Vegas to Michigan life. Beautiful 
>>> Michigan, enjoy!
>>> On Thursday, April 7, 2022 at 10:25:24 AM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Kevin,

 Their slow group was slow. I was glad to be in the faster class on the 
 women’s ride. I kept pace, rode in 2nd and 3rd position, and it wasn’t 
 effortless. I don’t think I will fall victim to the Lycra; I’m perfectly 
 happy with the workout wear I find at Target - highly recommend their All 
 In Motion brand, for anyone looking. 

 As far as fitness, don’t 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Bill Schairer]

It wouldn't hurt to check the alignment of the dropouts and derailleur 
hanger.

Bill S 
San Diego

On Tuesday, May 31, 2022 at 2:05:45 AM UTC-7 Garth wrote:

>
> George, Have you ever cleaned/relubed the cassette/freewheel(whichever the 
> DA is) body itself ?  I know you've mentioned the bearings, but not the cog 
> host body. 
>
> I'm with you about the "more gears and wider dropouts" nonsense . I have a 
> good selection of Sachs and Suntour Ultra 6 and 7 speed freewheels of which 
> I'm seriously considering using for my upcoming Franklin custom. I'm really 
> not fond of anything to do with cassettes.The cassette so-called "solution" 
> was but a self-fullfilling sales pitch/excuse for "more more more". Hah 
> hah.  I have 2 sets of Specialized 126mm hubs of which I have converted in 
> the past to 135mm using a solid axle. I could have the frame spec'd to 
> whatever I want though, and buying more vintage NOS hubs of various widths 
> is not a problem. 
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:05:48 PM UTC-4 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Joe - the chain is rarely, if at all, on the smallest cog next to the 
>> chain stay.  It is normally in either cog 4 or 5, counting from the largest 
>> cog outward.  I can remember when a company by the name of Sedis 
>> (Sedisport?) first introduced a narrower chain back in the late 70's in 
>> order to squeeze more gears onto a freewheel with normal 120-126mm rear 
>> dropout spacing.  In my opinion, it's been downhill ever since with 
>> manufacturers trying to outdo one another with wider and wider dropout 
>> spacing and 9+ cogs.  OTOH, I have an old '71/'72 Fuji Finest on which I'm 
>> running a 5-speed freewheel on a 120mm PW hub, friction shifted, and 
>> everything works just fine all the time.
>>
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:36:40 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Huh, I'm stumped. It crunches under hard pedaling and this time the 
>>> chain snapped, which sounds like the chain wanted to keep going and 
>>> something back there didn't want to budge. How's the clearance between 
>>> small cog and chainstay? This is my last shot at a wild guess..maybe under 
>>> heavy power the cassette is contacting the frame at the dropout. 
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:16:12 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>>
 Joe - I thought about that and have since replaced the chain, but in 
 all likely hood the cassette should still be OK.  It's not the original 
 with the bike; I replaced the one with which the bike shipped with another 
 (same manf.) that has slightly different gearing.  The previous cassette 
 had the same problems.


 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:09:00 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:

> It could be anything but what I think we know now is the chain is 
> busted and chain and cassette are both probably pretty old. Based on my 
> supposition - pulled out of thin air - that your chain never mated well 
> with that cassette I would replace both now and see what happens. 
>
> Joe Bernard
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>
>> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>>
>> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
>> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain 
>> is 
>> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
>> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>>
>> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike 
>> for 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear 
>> with 
>> a Park chain gauge.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>>
>> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>>
>> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>>
>> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
>> hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, 
>> and 
>> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never 
>> noticed 
>> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>>
>> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are 
>> in?*
>>
>> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally 
>> had a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the 
>> same 
>> thing then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I 
>> ride 
>> in the larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring 
>> is 
>> only used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to 
>> ridges at the top.
>>
>> *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*
>>
>> The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
>> indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you 

[RBW] Re: Mystery Sound and Broken Chain

[Garth]

George, Have you ever cleaned/relubed the cassette/freewheel(whichever the 
DA is) body itself ?  I know you've mentioned the bearings, but not the cog 
host body. 

I'm with you about the "more gears and wider dropouts" nonsense . I have a 
good selection of Sachs and Suntour Ultra 6 and 7 speed freewheels of which 
I'm seriously considering using for my upcoming Franklin custom. I'm really 
not fond of anything to do with cassettes.The cassette so-called "solution" 
was but a self-fullfilling sales pitch/excuse for "more more more". Hah 
hah.  I have 2 sets of Specialized 126mm hubs of which I have converted in 
the past to 135mm using a solid axle. I could have the frame spec'd to 
whatever I want though, and buying more vintage NOS hubs of various widths 
is not a problem. 
On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 10:05:48 PM UTC-4 George Schick wrote:

> Joe - the chain is rarely, if at all, on the smallest cog next to the 
> chain stay.  It is normally in either cog 4 or 5, counting from the largest 
> cog outward.  I can remember when a company by the name of Sedis 
> (Sedisport?) first introduced a narrower chain back in the late 70's in 
> order to squeeze more gears onto a freewheel with normal 120-126mm rear 
> dropout spacing.  In my opinion, it's been downhill ever since with 
> manufacturers trying to outdo one another with wider and wider dropout 
> spacing and 9+ cogs.  OTOH, I have an old '71/'72 Fuji Finest on which I'm 
> running a 5-speed freewheel on a 120mm PW hub, friction shifted, and 
> everything works just fine all the time.
>
>
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:36:40 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Huh, I'm stumped. It crunches under hard pedaling and this time the chain 
>> snapped, which sounds like the chain wanted to keep going and something 
>> back there didn't want to budge. How's the clearance between small cog and 
>> chainstay? This is my last shot at a wild guess..maybe under heavy power 
>> the cassette is contacting the frame at the dropout. 
>>
>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:16:12 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:
>>
>>> Joe - I thought about that and have since replaced the chain, but in all 
>>> likely hood the cassette should still be OK.  It's not the original with 
>>> the bike; I replaced the one with which the bike shipped with another (same 
>>> manf.) that has slightly different gearing.  The previous cassette had the 
>>> same problems.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:09:00 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>>
 It could be anything but what I think we know now is the chain is 
 busted and chain and cassette are both probably pretty old. Based on my 
 supposition - pulled out of thin air - that your chain never mated well 
 with that cassette I would replace both now and see what happens. 

 Joe Bernard

 On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 12:23:13 PM UTC-7 George Schick wrote:

> Bill - thanks for the quick response.  Bill asks...
>
> *(have you been) riding the same SRAM 971 chain for 18 years, and you 
> actually ride the bike a decent amount, (if so) your entire drivetrain is 
> likely toast.  Is that what's going on?  Or, do you replace your chain 
> frequently, and the noise never changes?*
>
> I can't recall whether I've had that same chain in use on that bike 
> for 18 years.  I regularly clean and lube it and check the chain wear 
> with 
> a Park chain gauge.
>
> *Have you tried riding your bike with different pedals?*
>
> Yes, and it has still occurred over the years.
>
> *Have you tried riding your bike with a different rear wheel?*
>
> No, this bike has always had that same rear wheel, a Shimano Dura Ace 
> hub, a Velocity OC rim, and Wheelsmith spokes.  I've removed, cleaned, 
> and 
> re-lubed the rear axle several times over the years and I've never 
> noticed 
> any uneven wear on the bearing races.
>
> *Is the noise the same regardless of which front chainring you are in?*
>
> The crank has a Velo Orange Cru with 48/34 chainrings.  It originally 
> had a TA Syrius crankset with similar chainring sizes and it did the same 
> thing then.  Because of the relatively flat terrain in NE Illinois I ride 
> in the larger 48 tooth chainring 95% of the time.  The small chainring is 
> only used for longer steep climbs such as ones up from river bottoms to 
> ridges at the top.
>
> *Have you pulled the crank arms of and checked the BB bearings?*
>
> The BB on this bike now is a Phil Wood and it has never given any 
> indication of a problem.  I have pulled the crank arms of, as you say, on 
> occasion when I noticed a different kind of clunking noise (though 
> quieter) 
> and found that the fixing rings were loose.  I took care of that problem 
> with LocTite and it has not occurred since.  The original BB was an Axxis 
> and the clunking noise was present even