Re: [RBW] Re: Riv Ride in Asheville NC?

[MTR]

I would love to be put down for a poster. still unsure if I can pull of the 
ride but would love a poster

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 11:31:54 AM UTC-4 EverRed wrote:

> Sounds great!  Please put me down for one.
>
> John
> Black Mountain
>
>
> On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 9:18:28 PM UTC-4 brok...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> The posters will be 16” x 20”, signed and numbered. I’m actually hand 
>> printing them this weekend. For those who cannot make the trip to 
>> Asheville, afterwards I’ll be putting any remaining posters up online with 
>> an Etsy link to purchase.
>>
>> - Brian
>>
>> On Jun 28, 2023, at 8:58 PM, EverRed  wrote:
>>
>> 
>>
>> What are the dimensions of the poster?
>>
>> Many thanks
>> John
>>
>> On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 3:23:18 PM UTC-4 Gary L wrote:
>>
>>> Sorry to miss you next weekend Dick, but I'll let Brian know you'd like 
>>> to be on the list for one of his posters (which are so great!).
>>>
>>> If anyone else is interested in a poster (see details in my last post) 
>>> pls let me know asap so I can give Brian a heads up on how many to print.
>>> Gary
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 27, 2023 at 2:30:43 PM UTC-4 Dick Pahle wrote:
>>>
 I can't make the ride that wkend but I'd sure like one of those posters 
 (nicely done, Brian!!). 

 Dick
 Brevard, NC

 On Monday, June 26, 2023 at 11:03:38 AM UTC-4 Gary L wrote:

> Hi from Asheville!
>
> Looks like we're going to have a fun turnout for our Riv get together 
> July 7-9. We are going to be finalizing plans next week and will get the 
> details out to everyone, but until then here is an awesome poster that 
> one 
> of our participants, Brian Turner came up with (Thank you Brian!!!). He 
> runs a graphic design and printing company and is offering to print up 
> posters for anyone coming to the gathering who may want one. He estimates 
> that they will cost about $20-25 and if you're interested please let me 
> know asap so I can let him know.
>
> Also, if anyone wants more info about the weekend now that you've been 
> tempted by Brian's amazing work, please contact me.
> [image: Unknown-1.jpeg]
> On Friday, June 23, 2023 at 6:52:25 PM UTC-4 Carl wrote:
>
>> Gary, did you say there's an extra 55cm Cheviot lying around here in 
>> Asheville? I could maybe help with that . . . 
>>
>> On Wednesday, June 14, 2023 at 9:19:20 AM UTC-4 Gary L wrote:
>>
>>> Leah,
>>>
>>> What a great offer - it would be an honor to have a video made by 
>>> you!  But better yet, why don’t you come join us? I know of an extra 
>>> 55cm 
>>> Cheviot lying around here in Asheville :)
>>>
>>> Gary
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 2:32:25 PM UTC-4 steve...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Dick, sorry you won't be able to make it that weekend. 

 "40 mm Little Big Ben's...Could I do those Bent Creek area forest 
 roads on that bike?" 

 Absolutely!!!Come on up from Brevard and give it a go!

 On Tue, Jun 13, 2023 at 1:03 PM Dick Pahle  
 wrote:

> I've been following this for a while hoping I could commit to 
> joining in. Knew that week in July was problematic and now know for 
> sure I 
> can't make it. Ratz!!
>
> I'm in Brevard and ride a Homer with 40 mm Little Big Ben's. 90 % 
> on roads and paved trails. Could I do those Bent Creek area forest 
> roads on 
> that bike? If so, I may try and join those of you who ride there on a 
> regular basis some other time, if ok to join ya.
>
> Sorry I'll miss meeting/riding with all of you and sorry to miss 
> Pam,  a good friend and my Cycling Savvy instructor from Charlotte. 
>
> Dick
>
> On Wednesday, April 5, 2023 at 11:58:12 AM UTC-4 Gary L wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>> There was some talk about a Riv ride in Asheville this spring but 
>> a May date won't work for lots of people. If there's still any 
>> interest in 
>> a meetup, how would a July or mid-Sept weekend work for folks?  If 
>> there's 
>> enough people interested I would be happy to try to nail down a date 
>> for 
>> whatever month seems to work for most everyone.
>> Gary
>>
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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[brizbarn]

I started with SimWorks Little Nick bars with a 80mm 7 shaped stem on my 
Appaloosa. Decided to try Billie bars after a few months just to see if I 
would like a more upright position.  For me, they felt too upright, and 
made pedaling hard / standing up to climb feel awkward. I put the SimWorks 
bars back, but changed to a Nitto Periscopa stem and have been happy with 
that. 

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 5:30:11 PM UTC-7 Doug Van Cleve wrote:

> I clearly too WAY too long pondering my response, Garth nailed it here 
> IMHO...
>
> Doug
>
> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 4:27 PM Garth  wrote:
>
>> Now that I see Ted's bike the picture is more clear. the VO bars are the 
>> Grand Randonneur version which is markedly different from the Nouveau 
>> version.  The difference in reach is 35mm, 120mm down to 85mm. I was going 
>> to mention this but I assumed you had the Nouveau version. That bar or one 
>> like it, as there are many shorter reach and relatively normal looking drop 
>> bars these days, plus a bit more narrow width @46cm(hoods) may be enough 
>> without a different stem. The Salsa Cowbell, Zipp Service Course 70 XPLR, 
>> and some Ritchey versions come to mind as having 68-70mm reach and very 
>> slight flares. 
>>
>> see here : https://bikepacking.com/index/gravel-bars/ 
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Most Discreet Bell Placement

[John Dewey]

Looks really nice on your beautiful Mercian, Rich. BTW, y’all should look 
into Micro-Mesh Touch Up Sticks. You could polish your bell, Rich, and make 
it look like fine 24 karat gold jewelry. You can find them at Stew-Mac, a 
site selling luthier’s fine finishing tools. They’re the bee’s knees. You 
can quickly achieve a mirror-like finish on virtually any dull, corroded, 
scratched up silver bicycle bit. This, of course, if you have some extra 
time for mindless self-indulgence.

https://www.stewmac.com/luthier-tools-and-supplies/supplies/sanding-and-polishing/sandpaper-and-finishing-papers/micro-mesh-touch-up-stick/?msclkid=467ff275848f1903c48696eba1659477_source=bing_medium=cpc_campaign=CP%20%7C%20MF%20%7C%20BNG%20%7C%20SHOP%20%7C%20NBR%20%7C%20All%20Products_term=4578572576575381_content=All%20Products

BEST / Jock

On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 2:44:45 PM UTC-7 RichS wrote:

> I'll chime in here:-) This is as discrete as I can get given that the 
> Crane bell is chunkier than the elegant little Spurcycle gem. The tone that 
> this hammer strike model provides is pretty sonorous though. Much better 
> and more consistent than the tinny sound the spring lever version provides. 
>
> Best,
> Rich in ATL
> [image: IMG_0594.jpg]
>
>
> On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 12:25:34 PM UTC-4 John Dewey wrote:
>
>> Here's nice image of most discreet placement of the best looking, smartly 
>> engineered richest sounding, bicycle bell *ever* made. That's my story 
>> and I'm sticking to it  *;  )*
>>
>> Jock
>>
>> [image: IMG_0810.jpeg]
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Doug Van Cleve]

I clearly too WAY too long pondering my response, Garth nailed it here
IMHO...

Doug

On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 4:27 PM Garth  wrote:

> Now that I see Ted's bike the picture is more clear. the VO bars are the
> Grand Randonneur version which is markedly different from the Nouveau
> version.  The difference in reach is 35mm, 120mm down to 85mm. I was going
> to mention this but I assumed you had the Nouveau version. That bar or one
> like it, as there are many shorter reach and relatively normal looking drop
> bars these days, plus a bit more narrow width @46cm(hoods) may be enough
> without a different stem. The Salsa Cowbell, Zipp Service Course 70 XPLR,
> and some Ritchey versions come to mind as having 68-70mm reach and very
> slight flares.
>
> see here : https://bikepacking.com/index/gravel-bars/
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Ted,

Pretty sure your pic confirms my suspicion...  Those bars have quite a long
reach and a fair bit of drop.  Even keeping the stem, something like a Soma
Highway One in 44 or 46cm would shorten your reach and drop a decent
amount:
https://www.somafabshop.com/shop/soma-handlebar-hwy-one-road-bar-4369?page=2=783#attr=3003,1855,2365
(I think ;^)

Doug


On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 3:37 PM Ted W  wrote:

> Well, if we’re sharing pictures. I don’t have any glamor shots yet but
> here’s what I’ve got right now (pardon the messy house, just moved).
>
> From back to front:
> * Velocity Cliffhanger rear wheel with Velo-Orange hub
> * 10spd 11-36 cassette
> * Deore derailleur
> * Shimano Alivio T4000 v-brakes
> * B17 saddle w/ Randy Joe Fab waxed canvas cover
> * Kaloy seatpost
> * Velo-Orange 1x crank with 42T ring
> * 60mm stem
> * Velo-Orange Rando bars
> * Grepp bar cotton wrap
> * Tektro aero levers
> * Velo-Orange rack
> * Cliffhanger rim, Shutter Precision PD-8 hub
>
> Riding on 29x2.2 SimWorks Super Yummy tires
> Bag by The Spindle ATL.
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Garth]

Now that I see Ted's bike the picture is more clear. the VO bars are the 
Grand Randonneur version which is markedly different from the Nouveau 
version.  The difference in reach is 35mm, 120mm down to 85mm. I was going 
to mention this but I assumed you had the Nouveau version. That bar or one 
like it, as there are many shorter reach and relatively normal looking drop 
bars these days, plus a bit more narrow width @46cm(hoods) may be enough 
without a different stem. The Salsa Cowbell, Zipp Service Course 70 XPLR, 
and some Ritchey versions come to mind as having 68-70mm reach and very 
slight flares. 

see here : https://bikepacking.com/index/gravel-bars/

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[jaredwilson]

Slick build, Ted.

Although I just ordered a pair of Albatross bars yesterday for my Platypus 
I'm gonna throw in a vote for keeping the drop bars and going with a 
shorter stem. I would like to try drops on my Platy at some point but can't 
shake the visual aspect of drops on a "trip thru" frame, it just doesn't 
jive for me.

If you're on Instagram I recommend checking out user "aquietpractice" for 
images of his Atlantis 2 with what seems to be a 0mm Discord w(Right) stem, 
looks pretty comfortable to me.

Keep us posted with what you decide to do.

Best,

Jared

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 3:37:17 PM UTC-7 ted.l...@gmail.com wrote:

> Well, if we’re sharing pictures. I don’t have any glamor shots yet but 
> here’s what I’ve got right now (pardon the messy house, just moved).
>
> From back to front:
> * Velocity Cliffhanger rear wheel with Velo-Orange hub
> * 10spd 11-36 cassette
> * Deore derailleur 
> * Shimano Alivio T4000 v-brakes
> * B17 saddle w/ Randy Joe Fab waxed canvas cover
> * Kaloy seatpost 
> * Velo-Orange 1x crank with 42T ring
> * 60mm stem
> * Velo-Orange Rando bars
> * Grepp bar cotton wrap
> * Tektro aero levers
> * Velo-Orange rack
> * Cliffhanger rim, Shutter Precision PD-8 hub
>
> Riding on 29x2.2 SimWorks Super Yummy tires
> Bag by The Spindle ATL.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 6:16 PM Stephen  wrote:
>
>> I'm a joe appaloosa rider and I've had mine set up at different times 
>> with: Loscos, Riv Bullmoose, Nitto B802AA, and currently its got the 
>> classic albatross.
>>
>> [image: appaloosa.jpg]
>> Pic for reference because all threads need bike pictures :)
>>
>> I'm going to be devil's advocate and support shortening the stem and 
>> making your drops work. 
>>
>>- First off its the most affordable and quickest solution, granted 
>>you are pleased with all other aspects of the handlebar setup. Also, you 
>>can get a pretty good idea of how much to shorten your stem since its the 
>>only variable changing. 
>>- Secondly, I selfishly want to see some more drop bar set up 
>>appaloosas. It seems really rare to do so, but lately I've been thinking 
>> it 
>>could work really well on the bike. I've seen more modern atlantis' with 
>>drops, and if anything the Joe is a slightly more road oriented version 
>> of 
>>that bike. List member Takahashi's Hunqapillar set up with drops also 
>> comes 
>>to mind.
>>- Thirdly, I don't think the Joe is so super long that it needs to be 
>>dedicated to swept back bars. This depends on your body's relation to 
>> your 
>>frame size of course, but on my 60cm, loscos + 11cm stem felt too 
>>short/cramped. For myself I've realized that if I go with swept back bars 
>> I 
>>need ones that sweep forward too, like the albatross.
>>
>> Another opinion with regards to albastache/mustache bars: if you are 
>> thinking of running them with flat bar type levers I'd say scrap that idea 
>> and just get albatrosses. thats a case of using something in a way it 
>> wasn't designed to be used and i think youd be happier with albatrosses. I 
>> have a set of albastache and I'd say it works best with the classic road 
>> brake lever setup and bar end shifters, or possibly bar end brake levers. 
>> and as previously stated they require a slightly shorter stem than an 
>> equivalent drop bar setup.
>>
>> And finally, to devil's advocate my devil's advocate... Rivendells are 
>> such fun bikes to experiment with different setups on. I love playing 
>> around with different handlebars and parts to spice up my bike and make it 
>> feel new again. Different handlebars are better at different things, and 
>> I've learned theres no perfect pick. I'm always gonna be swapping 
>> handlebars, sometimes to meet a certain situation, or just because I'm 
>> bored. if swept backs are calling your name, you might as well answer (i 
>> vote albatross or billie). 
>> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 4:48:01 PM UTC-4 Garth wrote:
>>
>>> I take all claims of a certain frame supposedly being designed for a 
>>> certain type of bar with a grain of salt as there are endless variables 
>>> that come in to play. The first is the rider themselves, not just body 
>>> proportions but flexibility, core strength and their ability to ride in a 
>>> position suitable for them. Same with bars and stems, none are limited to 
>>> or by each other, a given frame or rider. It's really up to the rider to 
>>> play around with their bike as no one else experiences your bike from your 
>>> unique perspective. I realize this is a online group to talk about stuff 
>>> and throw ideas around though, so playing a game of "what if" inevitable. 
>>>
>>> All that said, I looked at the geo charts @ bikeinsights and I don't see 
>>> the Appa as being particularly long in reach at all. I compared it to a 
>>> bike I have, a 60 Bomba, and a road frame I do not have, the Sam. the sizes 
>>> can be changed of course. The Bomba has 24mm reach than a 

Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Stephen]

Also, I recommend looking at whatbars.com to compare handlebar shapes! 

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 6:16:17 PM UTC-4 Stephen wrote:

> I'm a joe appaloosa rider and I've had mine set up at different times 
> with: Loscos, Riv Bullmoose, Nitto B802AA, and currently its got the 
> classic albatross.
>
> [image: appaloosa.jpg]
> Pic for reference because all threads need bike pictures :)
>
> I'm going to be devil's advocate and support shortening the stem and 
> making your drops work. 
>
>- First off its the most affordable and quickest solution, granted you 
>are pleased with all other aspects of the handlebar setup. Also, you can 
>get a pretty good idea of how much to shorten your stem since its the only 
>variable changing. 
>- Secondly, I selfishly want to see some more drop bar set up 
>appaloosas. It seems really rare to do so, but lately I've been thinking 
> it 
>could work really well on the bike. I've seen more modern atlantis' with 
>drops, and if anything the Joe is a slightly more road oriented version of 
>that bike. List member Takahashi's Hunqapillar set up with drops also 
> comes 
>to mind.
>- Thirdly, I don't think the Joe is so super long that it needs to be 
>dedicated to swept back bars. This depends on your body's relation to your 
>frame size of course, but on my 60cm, loscos + 11cm stem felt too 
>short/cramped. For myself I've realized that if I go with swept back bars 
> I 
>need ones that sweep forward too, like the albatross.
>
> Another opinion with regards to albastache/mustache bars: if you are 
> thinking of running them with flat bar type levers I'd say scrap that idea 
> and just get albatrosses. thats a case of using something in a way it 
> wasn't designed to be used and i think youd be happier with albatrosses. I 
> have a set of albastache and I'd say it works best with the classic road 
> brake lever setup and bar end shifters, or possibly bar end brake levers. 
> and as previously stated they require a slightly shorter stem than an 
> equivalent drop bar setup.
>
> And finally, to devil's advocate my devil's advocate... Rivendells are 
> such fun bikes to experiment with different setups on. I love playing 
> around with different handlebars and parts to spice up my bike and make it 
> feel new again. Different handlebars are better at different things, and 
> I've learned theres no perfect pick. I'm always gonna be swapping 
> handlebars, sometimes to meet a certain situation, or just because I'm 
> bored. if swept backs are calling your name, you might as well answer (i 
> vote albatross or billie). 
> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 4:48:01 PM UTC-4 Garth wrote:
>
>> I take all claims of a certain frame supposedly being designed for a 
>> certain type of bar with a grain of salt as there are endless variables 
>> that come in to play. The first is the rider themselves, not just body 
>> proportions but flexibility, core strength and their ability to ride in a 
>> position suitable for them. Same with bars and stems, none are limited to 
>> or by each other, a given frame or rider. It's really up to the rider to 
>> play around with their bike as no one else experiences your bike from your 
>> unique perspective. I realize this is a online group to talk about stuff 
>> and throw ideas around though, so playing a game of "what if" inevitable. 
>>
>> All that said, I looked at the geo charts @ bikeinsights and I don't see 
>> the Appa as being particularly long in reach at all. I compared it to a 
>> bike I have, a 60 Bomba, and a road frame I do not have, the Sam. the sizes 
>> can be changed of course. The Bomba has 24mm reach than a Appa to for me 
>> running a drop bar would be easy. Ted says the reach was too far, but I'd 
>> want to know if the saddles were int he same relative position ? The Appa 
>> has a 71.5d STA and the Bomba a 72. That equates to about a 6.5mm 
>> difference. So if you didn't know and just set up your saddles on the same 
>> positions on the rails you wouldn't even know that one was further back by 
>> 6.5mm. While that may not seem like much, it does all add up. 
>>
>> If you do choose a swept back bar nay to the Billie in my opnion, it's 
>> too long rearward for your modest needs. An Albastache bar would also 
>> require a very short stem to get a shorter reach, so if you're gonna do 
>> that you may as try a shorter stem for the drop bars first. I've had both 
>> steel and AL Albatross bars and I prefer the steel as I use it with bar end 
>> brake levers and thumbshifters mounted around the inside of the curve so I 
>> have the entire bar free. It "may" have more rise than you want though. I 
>> tried it flipped before and it wasn't what I expected, I hated it. The top 
>> curve actually feels better with the rise up and I thought reverso may feel 
>> better, but it didn't. It looks cool, but felt awful. I have no experience 
>> with a Choco bar, but there's no way in 

[RBW] FS: Legolas 54 FFHS - back on the market!

[Valerie Yates]

Were you sad you missed out on the lightning fast sale of my beautiful, 
yellow Legolas?  Through no fault of its own, it is back on the market. The 
buyer had a turn of events that made it the wrong time to be buying a bike 
so I refunded his payment. I was excited for the sale because he was 
actually planning to race it. I'm copying my original message below with 
the details of sale.  Let me know if you are interested. 

On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 10:29:09 AM UTC-6 Valerie Yates wrote:

I am offering for sale one of the legendary Legolas: frame, fork, Chris 
King threadless headset, and bottom bracket. Anyone interested likely 
already knows this bike was designed for cyclocross racing and thus is 
super lightweight, nimble, and fun. You also know that Riv is not taking 
custom orders at present and that they are out of decals for this model. 
The yellow is striking. It is a very racy yellow. Pictures here 
.

Seat tube is 54 c-t. Top tube is 54.5 c-c.  I’’m 5’7” with an 82 PBH and I 
used a 60 stem. The person I bought it from was 5’10” and he had a 110 stem 
on it.  We both had the saddle at 72 (as shown in pics). It takes 700c 
wheels and is shown with 700x38 tires.

It has various chips in the paint and some wrinkling of the decal on the 
seat tube.  In this size frame, there is some toe overlap. This is an issue 
only when making very tight turns at very slow speeds. It is not apparent 
at riding speeds. If either of these aspects will bother you, this is not 
the frame for you.

Price is $1800. Add $100 if you want the pair of Paul canti brakes with 
moon units. Add another $100 if you want the Rotor crankset (170 length) 
and Sugino chain rings (40-34). Everything else is omitted from sale. I 
will pay for it to be professionally packed. Buyer to arrange and pay for 
shipping. Local pickup is available in/near Boulder CO.

Questions? Ask away. Interested? Send me a private message.

Best,
Val in Boulder CO

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Garth]

I take all claims of a certain frame supposedly being designed for a 
certain type of bar with a grain of salt as there are endless variables 
that come in to play. The first is the rider themselves, not just body 
proportions but flexibility, core strength and their ability to ride in a 
position suitable for them. Same with bars and stems, none are limited to 
or by each other, a given frame or rider. It's really up to the rider to 
play around with their bike as no one else experiences your bike from your 
unique perspective. I realize this is a online group to talk about stuff 
and throw ideas around though, so playing a game of "what if" inevitable. 

All that said, I looked at the geo charts @ bikeinsights and I don't see 
the Appa as being particularly long in reach at all. I compared it to a 
bike I have, a 60 Bomba, and a road frame I do not have, the Sam. the sizes 
can be changed of course. The Bomba has 24mm reach than a Appa to for me 
running a drop bar would be easy. Ted says the reach was too far, but I'd 
want to know if the saddles were int he same relative position ? The Appa 
has a 71.5d STA and the Bomba a 72. That equates to about a 6.5mm 
difference. So if you didn't know and just set up your saddles on the same 
positions on the rails you wouldn't even know that one was further back by 
6.5mm. While that may not seem like much, it does all add up. 

If you do choose a swept back bar nay to the Billie in my opnion, it's too 
long rearward for your modest needs. An Albastache bar would also require a 
very short stem to get a shorter reach, so if you're gonna do that you may 
as try a shorter stem for the drop bars first. I've had both steel and AL 
Albatross bars and I prefer the steel as I use it with bar end brake levers 
and thumbshifters mounted around the inside of the curve so I have the 
entire bar free. It "may" have more rise than you want though. I tried it 
flipped before and it wasn't what I expected, I hated it. The top curve 
actually feels better with the rise up and I thought reverso may feel 
better, but it didn't. It looks cool, but felt awful. I have no experience 
with a Choco bar, but there's no way in h-e-double toothpicks I'd ever get 
a bar fixed to a stem. Again, looks cool, but offers zero flexibility. I 
don't suppose a Choco was made in steel, but I recall Blue Lug having a 
steel bar somewhat similar, a M356 ? Yeah, that's it ! 
https://global.bluelug.com/nitto-b356-m-s-bar-silver.html. Sure shipping is 
like $46 but you gotta look at overall cost, plus there may be other stuff 
you'd like. That looks like it's quite versatile to various stem heights 
and lengths and won't be a wet noodle. With thumbshifters at the top inside 
angled section and bar end levers you're free to find the best position at 
any given time. Needless to say, I'm highly biased against mtb levers as 
they're always in the way of the hands on the bars, and what's room on a 
bar for but to move your hands around ? DOH ! 

That's how it goes with asking for "advice" though huh, you get everyone's 
wishlist thrown at you as to what to do !  Ahahahahaha !!


https://bikeinsights.com/compare?geometries=646ed3ba6c60a90021cb6aa6,5b8578f448f3a30004789ad8,

https://bikeinsights.com/compare?geometries=646ed3ba6c60a90021cb6aa6,638a1581423463001c996236,




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[RBW] Re: FS: Ortlieb panniers

[Joe Bernard]

SOLD

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 9:02:05 AM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> I bought these here recently cuz I was just sure I'm a pannier guy now, 
> but of course I ended up using my trusty Sackville Saddlesack Medium that I 
> always use for everything why do I keep buying panniers?? 臘
>
> Original style, cool retro-looking Ortlieb Waterproof Outdoor Gear logos, 
> I paid $100 shipped, you pay $100 shipped. 
>
> Thanks, 
> Joe Bernard
> joeremi62 gmail com
> text 415 786 4623 <(415)%20786-4623>
> [image: Screenshot_20230629_085912.jpg]
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Johnny Alien]

I need to learn to proofread better considering I can't edit my posts here.

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 4:09:21 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:

> Unless there is a reason to need the stiffness there isn't much of a 
> reason to go with the moose version of the choco bar over a standard 
> bar/stem combo. WAY more flexibility that way. Now if you need the 
> robustness or stiffness that the moose version is very nice but it IS 
> overbuilt or most applications with a huge trade off in set up options. But 
> I agree they should be a solid first choice option for an Appaloosa.
>
> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 2:31:45 PM UTC-4 eric...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> If between the Billie and Alba I'd go Billie, having run both. Much 
>> prefer the longer sweep back of the Billie and greater real estate for 
>> shifters, levers and the "hooks" position on the bars which for me is 
>> critical for climbing or spirited riding. 
>>
>> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 2:02:12 PM UTC-4 Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Ted.
>>>
>>> Not sure if you mean the OG Moustache or the Albastache, but I can tell 
>>> you the OG requires a very short stem compared to drops.  It's because the 
>>> main hand position is the full reach, there really isn't a good tops 
>>> position like drops.  I gather that Albastache was designed mostly to 
>>> shorten the reach...  Also, you can't use upright bar stuff on either of 
>>> them so a flipped Albatross, Billie or Choco would seem to be best.
>>>
>>> Doug
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 9:18 AM Ted W  wrote:
>>>
 That's an interesting idea, Doug. I would have never considered 
 flipping Albatross bars like that. Another option I've considered is 
 Mustache bars with flat bar levers near the back instead of the typical 
 road levers up front. It seems to me like those are similar, if narrower, 
 than something like the Albatross bar but have a similar (slightly more 
 accentuated) curve. And, like flipping the albatross bars, would give a 
 drop instead of a rise... I might play with that idea a bit tonight.

 On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 11:36 AM Doug Van Cleve  
 wrote:

> Hey Ted.
>
> I personally wouldn't run a super short stem, but those wide drops 
> (and if I'm not mistaken relatively long reach) are making things worse 
> for 
> you.  A narrower modern bend, short and shallow drop bar would reduce the 
> reach a fair bit, I think.  That said, I don't think any of the current 
> super long chainstay RBW bikes are really suited for drops.  I just put 
> together a JA that came with Albatross' and a Technomic, 9cm I think, and 
> it feels too close and too tall in front.  It's a 51cm IIRC, whichever 
> size 
> is 650B, and the PBH size chart would have put me one size smaller.  I 
> have 
> a Choco-Moose waiting to go on it, I'm hoping that slammed it will give 
> me 
> more reach and lower bar height.
>
> Doug
>
> P.S.  You might consider flipped Albatross' as well, less reach and 
> drop than any actual drop bar but still some...
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 7:08 AM Ted W  wrote:
>
>> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it 
>> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The 
>> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive; 
>> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to 
>> channel the wisdom of the group.
>>
>> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O 
>> Randonneur). However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is 
>> really built with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a 
>> stem 
>> that's about half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels 
>> like 
>> quite a reach to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, 
>> this is where my question starts:
>>
>> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do 
>> I give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I 
>> go 
>> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco 
>> bars 
>> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want 
>> to 
>> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I 
>> was 
>> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so 
>> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. 
>> I'm 
>> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see 
>> what 
>> y'all think.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -- 
>> Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com > 
>>
> -- 
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> To unsubscribe from this group and stop 

Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Johnny Alien]

Unless there is a reason to need the stiffness there isn't much of a reason 
to go with the moose version of the choco bar over a standard bar/stem 
combo. WAY more flexibility that way. Now if you need the robustness or 
stiffness that the moose version is very nice but it IS overbuilt or most 
applications with a huge trade off in set up options. But I agree they 
should be a solid first choice option for an Appaloosa.

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 2:31:45 PM UTC-4 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> If between the Billie and Alba I'd go Billie, having run both. Much prefer 
> the longer sweep back of the Billie and greater real estate for shifters, 
> levers and the "hooks" position on the bars which for me is critical for 
> climbing or spirited riding. 
>
> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 2:02:12 PM UTC-4 Doug Van Cleve wrote:
>
>> Hey Ted.
>>
>> Not sure if you mean the OG Moustache or the Albastache, but I can tell 
>> you the OG requires a very short stem compared to drops.  It's because the 
>> main hand position is the full reach, there really isn't a good tops 
>> position like drops.  I gather that Albastache was designed mostly to 
>> shorten the reach...  Also, you can't use upright bar stuff on either of 
>> them so a flipped Albatross, Billie or Choco would seem to be best.
>>
>> Doug
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 9:18 AM Ted W  wrote:
>>
>>> That's an interesting idea, Doug. I would have never considered flipping 
>>> Albatross bars like that. Another option I've considered is Mustache bars 
>>> with flat bar levers near the back instead of the typical road levers up 
>>> front. It seems to me like those are similar, if narrower, than something 
>>> like the Albatross bar but have a similar (slightly more accentuated) 
>>> curve. And, like flipping the albatross bars, would give a drop instead of 
>>> a rise... I might play with that idea a bit tonight.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 11:36 AM Doug Van Cleve  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Hey Ted.

 I personally wouldn't run a super short stem, but those wide drops (and 
 if I'm not mistaken relatively long reach) are making things worse for 
 you.  A narrower modern bend, short and shallow drop bar would reduce the 
 reach a fair bit, I think.  That said, I don't think any of the current 
 super long chainstay RBW bikes are really suited for drops.  I just put 
 together a JA that came with Albatross' and a Technomic, 9cm I think, and 
 it feels too close and too tall in front.  It's a 51cm IIRC, whichever 
 size 
 is 650B, and the PBH size chart would have put me one size smaller.  I 
 have 
 a Choco-Moose waiting to go on it, I'm hoping that slammed it will give me 
 more reach and lower bar height.

 Doug

 P.S.  You might consider flipped Albatross' as well, less reach and 
 drop than any actual drop bar but still some...


 On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 7:08 AM Ted W  wrote:

> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it 
> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The 
> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive; 
> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to 
> channel the wisdom of the group.
>
> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur). 
> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built 
> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's 
> about 
> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a 
> reach 
> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where 
> my 
> question starts:
>
> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do 
> I give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I 
> go 
> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco 
> bars 
> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to 
> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I 
> was 
> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so 
> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. 
> I'm 
> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what 
> y'all think.
>
> Cheers,
> -- 
> Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com > 
>
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[RBW] Re: Most Discreet Bell Placement

[Bill Lindsay]

I bought three (3!!!) bells at Blue Heron yesterday.  I've got a number of 
bell-less bikes and the shame has become too much.  All three were Japanese 
Crane models. 

1. A hand painted one will clamp to the stem quill on my Quickbeam
2. A "Spur-Like" ENE model will go on my Hetchins
3. A headset-spacer model will get disassembled, and I'm going to drill and 
tap an M5 hole into the side of my CNC aluminum Cinelli Sesamo stem on my 
Single Speed Lightning Bolt.  That will be my entry for "most discreet".  

Pics or it didn't happen
Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 9:25:34 AM UTC-7 John Dewey wrote:

> Here's nice image of most discreet placement of the best looking, smartly 
> engineered richest sounding, bicycle bell *ever* made. That's my story 
> and I'm sticking to it  *;  )*
>
> Jock
>
> [image: IMG_0810.jpeg]
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Eric Marth]

If between the Billie and Alba I'd go Billie, having run both. Much prefer 
the longer sweep back of the Billie and greater real estate for shifters, 
levers and the "hooks" position on the bars which for me is critical for 
climbing or spirited riding. 

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 2:02:12 PM UTC-4 Doug Van Cleve wrote:

> Hey Ted.
>
> Not sure if you mean the OG Moustache or the Albastache, but I can tell 
> you the OG requires a very short stem compared to drops.  It's because the 
> main hand position is the full reach, there really isn't a good tops 
> position like drops.  I gather that Albastache was designed mostly to 
> shorten the reach...  Also, you can't use upright bar stuff on either of 
> them so a flipped Albatross, Billie or Choco would seem to be best.
>
> Doug
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 9:18 AM Ted W  wrote:
>
>> That's an interesting idea, Doug. I would have never considered flipping 
>> Albatross bars like that. Another option I've considered is Mustache bars 
>> with flat bar levers near the back instead of the typical road levers up 
>> front. It seems to me like those are similar, if narrower, than something 
>> like the Albatross bar but have a similar (slightly more accentuated) 
>> curve. And, like flipping the albatross bars, would give a drop instead of 
>> a rise... I might play with that idea a bit tonight.
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 11:36 AM Doug Van Cleve  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Ted.
>>>
>>> I personally wouldn't run a super short stem, but those wide drops (and 
>>> if I'm not mistaken relatively long reach) are making things worse for 
>>> you.  A narrower modern bend, short and shallow drop bar would reduce the 
>>> reach a fair bit, I think.  That said, I don't think any of the current 
>>> super long chainstay RBW bikes are really suited for drops.  I just put 
>>> together a JA that came with Albatross' and a Technomic, 9cm I think, and 
>>> it feels too close and too tall in front.  It's a 51cm IIRC, whichever size 
>>> is 650B, and the PBH size chart would have put me one size smaller.  I have 
>>> a Choco-Moose waiting to go on it, I'm hoping that slammed it will give me 
>>> more reach and lower bar height.
>>>
>>> Doug
>>>
>>> P.S.  You might consider flipped Albatross' as well, less reach and drop 
>>> than any actual drop bar but still some...
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 7:08 AM Ted W  wrote:
>>>
 Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it 
 today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The 
 ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive; 
 nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to 
 channel the wisdom of the group.

 Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur). 
 However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built 
 with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's 
 about 
 half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach 
 to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where 
 my 
 question starts:

 Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I 
 give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go 
 with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars 
 on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to 
 be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I 
 was 
 thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so 
 similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. 
 I'm 
 probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what 
 y'all think.

 Cheers,
 -- 
 Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com > 

>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAK64jTE-PhzxBf%2BjqmNnK_NyPKu7kDL0QpzkbDBVjocGeEci2g%40mail.gmail.com
>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com >
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CANCvSho00h-9xNqPDtXLLdiP21oGSmu%3DzPm4JaQ%3DKbnguGvn0g%40mail.gmail.com
>>  
>> 

Re: [RBW] Northern Hemisphere Summer Riding Photos 2023

[greenteadrinkers]

Hello Takashi,
Looking at your (excellent) recent images, would you mind telling me what 
your bar and stem combo is, and a quick summation of the handling?
Thanks,
Scott

On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 8:35:43 PM UTC-4 John Rinker wrote:

> Takashi,
>
> Your beautiful photos always make me miss Japan. Keep 'em coming!
>
> Cheers, John
>
> On Friday, June 23, 2023 at 7:26:48 AM UTC-7 Takashi wrote:
>
>> Visited the town of Hida Furukawa last weekend.
>>
>> A majestic *sanmon* (main gate of a Buddhist temple):
>> [image: DSC03134.jpg]
>>
>> An alley:
>> [image: DSC03128.jpg]
>>
>> A half-hour ride from the center of the town brought me to a steep land; 
>> I assume reclamation was a hard work here.
>> [image: DSC03123.jpg]
>>
>> Takashi
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Modifying my Hillborne

[greenteadrinkers]

Hi wrigap1,
Just wanted to chime in with my experience using bar-ends and a Bosco Bar 
on my Sam, the combo works! You do need to be a little careful when doing a 
sharp turn while riding at 2 mph, otherwise, I love the combination on my 
Sam. The Bar-ends keep the bars open giving your hands a little more 
freedom. 
Best
Scott

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 10:10:28 AM UTC-4 Olivier Chételat wrote:

> Hello Wrigap1,
> the good folks at Parktool have taken bike repair tutorials very seriously 
> and the mustachioed man in their videos sure helped me going from barely 
> being able to adjust a saddle to building bikes from the frame up. 
> Here's the link: https://www.parktool.com/en-us/
> This should make swapping handlebars, brake levers and shifters a 
> relatively easy and painless operation. And fun to boot.
> Good luck!
> Oli in SF
> On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 11:10:25 PM UTC-7 wri...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Good morning folks!
>>
>> I’ve recently been inspired by Eric Marth’s build videos on YouTube and 
>> want to change my Sam up a bit, mainly moving from road bars/bar end 
>> shifters to something like a Bosco or albatross with thumbies.  Problem is 
>> I’m not very familiar with changing parts out like brake levers, shifters 
>> etc.  Can anyone recommend some good resources to better understand this 
>> work, these parts and what’s compatible with what?  YouTube, books, 
>> whatever ya got. Truly appreciate any help y’all can give me.
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Ted.

Not sure if you mean the OG Moustache or the Albastache, but I can tell you
the OG requires a very short stem compared to drops.  It's because the main
hand position is the full reach, there really isn't a good tops position
like drops.  I gather that Albastache was designed mostly to shorten the
reach...  Also, you can't use upright bar stuff on either of them so a
flipped Albatross, Billie or Choco would seem to be best.

Doug


On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 9:18 AM Ted W  wrote:

> That's an interesting idea, Doug. I would have never considered flipping
> Albatross bars like that. Another option I've considered is Mustache bars
> with flat bar levers near the back instead of the typical road levers up
> front. It seems to me like those are similar, if narrower, than something
> like the Albatross bar but have a similar (slightly more accentuated)
> curve. And, like flipping the albatross bars, would give a drop instead of
> a rise... I might play with that idea a bit tonight.
>
> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 11:36 AM Doug Van Cleve 
> wrote:
>
>> Hey Ted.
>>
>> I personally wouldn't run a super short stem, but those wide drops (and
>> if I'm not mistaken relatively long reach) are making things worse for
>> you.  A narrower modern bend, short and shallow drop bar would reduce the
>> reach a fair bit, I think.  That said, I don't think any of the current
>> super long chainstay RBW bikes are really suited for drops.  I just put
>> together a JA that came with Albatross' and a Technomic, 9cm I think, and
>> it feels too close and too tall in front.  It's a 51cm IIRC, whichever size
>> is 650B, and the PBH size chart would have put me one size smaller.  I have
>> a Choco-Moose waiting to go on it, I'm hoping that slammed it will give me
>> more reach and lower bar height.
>>
>> Doug
>>
>> P.S.  You might consider flipped Albatross' as well, less reach and drop
>> than any actual drop bar but still some...
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 7:08 AM Ted W  wrote:
>>
>>> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it
>>> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The
>>> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive;
>>> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to
>>> channel the wisdom of the group.
>>>
>>> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur).
>>> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built
>>> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about
>>> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach
>>> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my
>>> question starts:
>>>
>>> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I
>>> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go
>>> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars
>>> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to
>>> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was
>>> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so
>>> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm
>>> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what
>>> y'all think.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> --
>>> Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >
>>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CAK64jTE-PhzxBf%2BjqmNnK_NyPKu7kDL0QpzkbDBVjocGeEci2g%40mail.gmail.com
>> 
>> .
>>
>
>
> --
> Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> 
> .
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Ted W]

I have an old tig welded bullmoose-style bar I got from a scrap bike many
years ago. Maybe I should give that bar a try given all the praise *-moose
style bars are receiving here... Doesn't have much sweep, though.

On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 1:22 PM lconley  wrote:

> $91 shipping charge for the Chocomoose from Blue Lug - total of $176.20 -
> big awkward box no doubt. They were in stock at Rivendell until a month or
> two ago. I had been thinking about trying some out, and then they were
> gone. I have fillet-brazed Boscomoose and Bullmoose, and I also love the
> solid feel of the one piece bar and stem combos.
>
> Laing
>
> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 1:00:03 PM UTC-4 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> In my opinion, the bars that the very first Appaloosas originally came
>> with are still the best choice:  Choco-moose.  I don't understand the
>> supply-chain realities, but here we are with Riv listing them at $210 and
>> out of stock, but Blue Lug sells them for $85.20 and they are in stock.
>> There is no question that is the bar I would run on an Appaloosa.
>>
>> There are many flavors of handwringers, though.  One flavor of
>> handwringer would wring hands over not being able to adjust the angle of a
>> Moose bar.  Another flavor of handwringer would wring hands over an
>> independent Choco bar being too flexy.  I'm the second kind, and LOVE the
>> rock solid feel of the Choco moose.  When I had an Appaloosa, I needed to
>> slam that stem to get them as low as I wanted.
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 7:08:44 AM UTC-7 ted.l...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it
>>> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The
>>> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive;
>>> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to
>>> channel the wisdom of the group.
>>>
>>> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur).
>>> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built
>>> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about
>>> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach
>>> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my
>>> question starts:
>>>
>>> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I
>>> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go
>>> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars
>>> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to
>>> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was
>>> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so
>>> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm
>>> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what
>>> y'all think.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> --
>>> Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com >
>>>
>> --
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> .
>


-- 
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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Build Opinions

[lconley]

$91 shipping charge for the Chocomoose from Blue Lug - total of $176.20 - 
big awkward box no doubt. They were in stock at Rivendell until a month or 
two ago. I had been thinking about trying some out, and then they were 
gone. I have fillet-brazed Boscomoose and Bullmoose, and I also love the 
solid feel of the one piece bar and stem combos.

Laing

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 1:00:03 PM UTC-4 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> In my opinion, the bars that the very first Appaloosas originally came 
> with are still the best choice:  Choco-moose.  I don't understand the 
> supply-chain realities, but here we are with Riv listing them at $210 and 
> out of stock, but Blue Lug sells them for $85.20 and they are in stock.  
> There is no question that is the bar I would run on an Appaloosa.  
>
> There are many flavors of handwringers, though.  One flavor of handwringer 
> would wring hands over not being able to adjust the angle of a Moose bar.  
> Another flavor of handwringer would wring hands over an independent Choco 
> bar being too flexy.  I'm the second kind, and LOVE the rock solid feel of 
> the Choco moose.  When I had an Appaloosa, I needed to slam that stem to 
> get them as low as I wanted.  
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 7:08:44 AM UTC-7 ted.l...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it 
>> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The 
>> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive; 
>> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to 
>> channel the wisdom of the group.
>>
>> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur). 
>> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built 
>> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about 
>> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach 
>> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my 
>> question starts:
>>
>> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I 
>> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go 
>> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars 
>> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to 
>> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was 
>> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so 
>> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm 
>> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what 
>> y'all think.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -- 
>> Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com >
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: FS: Legolas 54 FFHS

[Patrick Moore]

That's interesting to know. I expect that the Roadeo handles much like the
Ram and I've owned one of the last which gives me a point of comparison.
Certainly the Ram handled "seamlessly".

On Wed, Jun 28, 2023 at 6:10 PM Valerie Yates  wrote:

> ...  I have a Roadeo and compared to the Legolas, I'd say the Roadeo has
>> smoother and more elegant handling. It is a joy. For me, it is the perfect
>> road bike for paved rides.  Roadeo is more stable. Legolas more nimble and
>> tending towards twitchy. That could be because of the short stem I had on
>> it. The Roadeo feels more like a Soma San Marcos -- another really fine
>> road bike -- than the Legolas.
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Bill Lindsay]

In my opinion, the bars that the very first Appaloosas originally came with 
are still the best choice:  Choco-moose.  I don't understand the 
supply-chain realities, but here we are with Riv listing them at $210 and 
out of stock, but Blue Lug sells them for $85.20 and they are in stock.  
There is no question that is the bar I would run on an Appaloosa.  

There are many flavors of handwringers, though.  One flavor of handwringer 
would wring hands over not being able to adjust the angle of a Moose bar.  
Another flavor of handwringer would wring hands over an independent Choco 
bar being too flexy.  I'm the second kind, and LOVE the rock solid feel of 
the Choco moose.  When I had an Appaloosa, I needed to slam that stem to 
get them as low as I wanted.  

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 7:08:44 AM UTC-7 ted.l...@gmail.com wrote:

> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it 
> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The 
> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive; 
> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to 
> channel the wisdom of the group.
>
> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur). 
> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built 
> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about 
> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach 
> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my 
> question starts:
>
> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I 
> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go 
> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars 
> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to 
> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was 
> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so 
> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm 
> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what 
> y'all think.
>
> Cheers,
> -- 
> Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com >
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Ted W]

That's an interesting idea, Doug. I would have never considered flipping
Albatross bars like that. Another option I've considered is Mustache bars
with flat bar levers near the back instead of the typical road levers up
front. It seems to me like those are similar, if narrower, than something
like the Albatross bar but have a similar (slightly more accentuated)
curve. And, like flipping the albatross bars, would give a drop instead of
a rise... I might play with that idea a bit tonight.

On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 11:36 AM Doug Van Cleve  wrote:

> Hey Ted.
>
> I personally wouldn't run a super short stem, but those wide drops (and if
> I'm not mistaken relatively long reach) are making things worse for you.  A
> narrower modern bend, short and shallow drop bar would reduce the reach a
> fair bit, I think.  That said, I don't think any of the current super long
> chainstay RBW bikes are really suited for drops.  I just put together a JA
> that came with Albatross' and a Technomic, 9cm I think, and it feels too
> close and too tall in front.  It's a 51cm IIRC, whichever size is 650B, and
> the PBH size chart would have put me one size smaller.  I have a
> Choco-Moose waiting to go on it, I'm hoping that slammed it will give me
> more reach and lower bar height.
>
> Doug
>
> P.S.  You might consider flipped Albatross' as well, less reach and drop
> than any actual drop bar but still some...
>
>
> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 7:08 AM Ted W  wrote:
>
>> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it
>> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The
>> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive;
>> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to
>> channel the wisdom of the group.
>>
>> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur).
>> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built
>> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about
>> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach
>> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my
>> question starts:
>>
>> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I
>> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go
>> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars
>> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to
>> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was
>> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so
>> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm
>> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what
>> y'all think.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> --
>> Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >
>>
> --
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> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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> 
> .
>


-- 
Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >

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[RBW] Still ISO/WTT/WTB Soma Supple Vitesse SL tires in 48 mm width

[Patrick Moore]

Again, SL model, 48 mm width.

Just posted Big Ones (and Wabi Woolens jersey) for sale and willing to
trade; or interested in purchase.

Thanks.

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] ISO 54 Roadini

[Stephen L.]

Hey Andrew,

I have an orange complete Roadini I was planning to sell (waiting on a road
frame from a different company). I'm the second owner of this Roadini, it's
the previous generation ~2018, has a little less tire clearance. Let me
know if you're interested and I'll send you pictures. I'm located in
Oakland, CA and can ship it if all works out.

Stephen

On Wed, Jun 28, 2023, 07:31 Andrew Huston 
wrote:

> I know there is a new batch on the way but thought I’d see if there is
> anything on the market now. Would consider frame or complete. I also have a
> neat black sheep klunker I would use as a barter if interested. Located in
> Michigan.
>
> That new green does look pretty amazing tho…
>
> --
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> 
> .
>

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[RBW] Re: WTB: Silver 170 triple crank

[bo richardson]

I think i have one
Ill go check

On Saturday, June 24, 2023 at 10:12:54 AM UTC-7 Doug Van Cleve wrote:

> Howdy folks.
>
> Anybody holding an unwanted Silver 170mm triple crank in good condition?  
> I might buy a new one, now that they're back in stock, but I wouldn't hate 
> saving some dough either.
>
> On a related note, what width BB would I need for a Silver triple on a Joe 
> Appa?  The bike currently has a Sugino triple, it would be swell if the 
> same BB would work (well)...
>
> Thanks, Doug
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Doug Van Cleve]

Hey Ted.

I personally wouldn't run a super short stem, but those wide drops (and if
I'm not mistaken relatively long reach) are making things worse for you.  A
narrower modern bend, short and shallow drop bar would reduce the reach a
fair bit, I think.  That said, I don't think any of the current super long
chainstay RBW bikes are really suited for drops.  I just put together a JA
that came with Albatross' and a Technomic, 9cm I think, and it feels too
close and too tall in front.  It's a 51cm IIRC, whichever size is 650B, and
the PBH size chart would have put me one size smaller.  I have a
Choco-Moose waiting to go on it, I'm hoping that slammed it will give me
more reach and lower bar height.

Doug

P.S.  You might consider flipped Albatross' as well, less reach and drop
than any actual drop bar but still some...


On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 7:08 AM Ted W  wrote:

> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it
> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The
> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive;
> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to
> channel the wisdom of the group.
>
> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur).
> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built
> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about
> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach
> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my
> question starts:
>
> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I
> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go
> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars
> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to
> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was
> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so
> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm
> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what
> y'all think.
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Riv Ride in Asheville NC?

[EverRed]

Sounds great!  Please put me down for one.

John
Black Mountain


On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 9:18:28 PM UTC-4 brok...@gmail.com wrote:

> The posters will be 16” x 20”, signed and numbered. I’m actually hand 
> printing them this weekend. For those who cannot make the trip to 
> Asheville, afterwards I’ll be putting any remaining posters up online with 
> an Etsy link to purchase.
>
> - Brian
>
> On Jun 28, 2023, at 8:58 PM, EverRed  wrote:
>
> 
>
> What are the dimensions of the poster?
>
> Many thanks
> John
>
> On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 3:23:18 PM UTC-4 Gary L wrote:
>
>> Sorry to miss you next weekend Dick, but I'll let Brian know you'd like 
>> to be on the list for one of his posters (which are so great!).
>>
>> If anyone else is interested in a poster (see details in my last post) 
>> pls let me know asap so I can give Brian a heads up on how many to print.
>> Gary
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 27, 2023 at 2:30:43 PM UTC-4 Dick Pahle wrote:
>>
>>> I can't make the ride that wkend but I'd sure like one of those posters 
>>> (nicely done, Brian!!). 
>>>
>>> Dick
>>> Brevard, NC
>>>
>>> On Monday, June 26, 2023 at 11:03:38 AM UTC-4 Gary L wrote:
>>>
 Hi from Asheville!

 Looks like we're going to have a fun turnout for our Riv get together 
 July 7-9. We are going to be finalizing plans next week and will get the 
 details out to everyone, but until then here is an awesome poster that one 
 of our participants, Brian Turner came up with (Thank you Brian!!!). He 
 runs a graphic design and printing company and is offering to print up 
 posters for anyone coming to the gathering who may want one. He estimates 
 that they will cost about $20-25 and if you're interested please let me 
 know asap so I can let him know.

 Also, if anyone wants more info about the weekend now that you've been 
 tempted by Brian's amazing work, please contact me.
 [image: Unknown-1.jpeg]
 On Friday, June 23, 2023 at 6:52:25 PM UTC-4 Carl wrote:

> Gary, did you say there's an extra 55cm Cheviot lying around here in 
> Asheville? I could maybe help with that . . . 
>
> On Wednesday, June 14, 2023 at 9:19:20 AM UTC-4 Gary L wrote:
>
>> Leah,
>>
>> What a great offer - it would be an honor to have a video made by 
>> you!  But better yet, why don’t you come join us? I know of an extra 
>> 55cm 
>> Cheviot lying around here in Asheville :)
>>
>> Gary
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 2:32:25 PM UTC-4 steve...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Dick, sorry you won't be able to make it that weekend. 
>>>
>>> "40 mm Little Big Ben's...Could I do those Bent Creek area forest 
>>> roads on that bike?" 
>>>
>>> Absolutely!!!Come on up from Brevard and give it a go!
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jun 13, 2023 at 1:03 PM Dick Pahle  wrote:
>>>
 I've been following this for a while hoping I could commit to 
 joining in. Knew that week in July was problematic and now know for 
 sure I 
 can't make it. Ratz!!

 I'm in Brevard and ride a Homer with 40 mm Little Big Ben's. 90 % 
 on roads and paved trails. Could I do those Bent Creek area forest 
 roads on 
 that bike? If so, I may try and join those of you who ride there on a 
 regular basis some other time, if ok to join ya.

 Sorry I'll miss meeting/riding with all of you and sorry to miss 
 Pam,  a good friend and my Cycling Savvy instructor from Charlotte. 

 Dick

 On Wednesday, April 5, 2023 at 11:58:12 AM UTC-4 Gary L wrote:

> Hi,
> There was some talk about a Riv ride in Asheville this spring but 
> a May date won't work for lots of people. If there's still any 
> interest in 
> a meetup, how would a July or mid-Sept weekend work for folks?  If 
> there's 
> enough people interested I would be happy to try to nail down a date 
> for 
> whatever month seems to work for most everyone.
> Gary
>
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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[DavidP]

Albatross bars are pretty versatile  with a large range of positions and 
work well on roadish bikes that see some dirt. I've found that using a stem 
30-40mm longer than my drop bar stem puts the grips of the Albatross bar in 
a more upright position than the tops of the drop bar, and moving my hands 
up to the bends feels like riding on the hoods. You can get even lower by 
moving into the hooks of the Albatross bar and bending your elbows.

A brake lever with a low profile clamp is nice as it lets you place your 
hands anywhere from the grips to the bends comfortably.

-Dave

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 11:05:07 AM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:

> If you don't want to be too upright and want to maintain a bit of the feel 
> of drops I highly recommend the choco or losco bars.
>
> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 10:37:51 AM UTC-4 Valerie Yates wrote:
>
>> For me, when in doubt, try Albatross. Other bars can be hit or miss for 
>> me on different frames. The albatross never disappoints me. I just switched 
>> my Joe to from Chocomoose to albatross and they feel terrific - free and 
>> easy.  
>>
>> I don’t see a benefit in using a really short stem to maintain drop bars 
>> on a Joe. 
>>
>> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 8:23:52 AM UTC-6 brok...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> My limited experience with these bikes is that it's probably best to set 
>>> them up the way they were designed. That reach is such an important factor 
>>> in the comfort of a bike. I've been considering Joes and Sams and 
>>> Altantises a lot lately, and if I were to choose a Joe, it would definitely 
>>> have either Toscos or Billie bars. I can never imagine my Gus being 
>>> comfortable with anything other than upright, swept-back bars (like my 
>>> Toscos with a 110 stem), because the reach on the frame is so long. 
>>> Even classic models like the Atlantis and the Homer have changed so much 
>>> with the extended stays and longer reaches, that I feel like you see less 
>>> and less of these newer models with drops these days. Of course, there's 
>>> many different body types and styles of riding to factor into it, so to 
>>> each their own. Personally, I can't see myself owning another Rivendell 
>>> with drop bars unless it was an older, more traditionally designed model.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 10:08 AM Ted W  wrote:
>>>
 Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it 
 today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The 
 ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive; 
 nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to 
 channel the wisdom of the group.

 Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur). 
 However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built 
 with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's 
 about 
 half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach 
 to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where 
 my 
 question starts:

 Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I 
 give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go 
 with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars 
 on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to 
 be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I 
 was 
 thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so 
 similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. 
 I'm 
 probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what 
 y'all think.

 Cheers,
 -- 
 Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com >

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 .

>>>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Johnny Alien]

If you don't want to be too upright and want to maintain a bit of the feel 
of drops I highly recommend the choco or losco bars.

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 10:37:51 AM UTC-4 Valerie Yates wrote:

> For me, when in doubt, try Albatross. Other bars can be hit or miss for me 
> on different frames. The albatross never disappoints me. I just switched my 
> Joe to from Chocomoose to albatross and they feel terrific - free and easy. 
>  
>
> I don’t see a benefit in using a really short stem to maintain drop bars 
> on a Joe. 
>
> On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 8:23:52 AM UTC-6 brok...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> My limited experience with these bikes is that it's probably best to set 
>> them up the way they were designed. That reach is such an important factor 
>> in the comfort of a bike. I've been considering Joes and Sams and 
>> Altantises a lot lately, and if I were to choose a Joe, it would definitely 
>> have either Toscos or Billie bars. I can never imagine my Gus being 
>> comfortable with anything other than upright, swept-back bars (like my 
>> Toscos with a 110 stem), because the reach on the frame is so long. 
>> Even classic models like the Atlantis and the Homer have changed so much 
>> with the extended stays and longer reaches, that I feel like you see less 
>> and less of these newer models with drops these days. Of course, there's 
>> many different body types and styles of riding to factor into it, so to 
>> each their own. Personally, I can't see myself owning another Rivendell 
>> with drop bars unless it was an older, more traditionally designed model.
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 10:08 AM Ted W  wrote:
>>
>>> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it 
>>> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The 
>>> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive; 
>>> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to 
>>> channel the wisdom of the group.
>>>
>>> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur). 
>>> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built 
>>> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about 
>>> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach 
>>> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my 
>>> question starts:
>>>
>>> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I 
>>> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go 
>>> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars 
>>> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to 
>>> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was 
>>> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so 
>>> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm 
>>> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what 
>>> y'all think.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -- 
>>> Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com >
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CANCvShpXY3fGzrS2nt3t6ZBeHeaFsi2dFhAiHFLykU5J9rGQCA%40mail.gmail.com
>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Valerie Yates]

For me, when in doubt, try Albatross. Other bars can be hit or miss for me 
on different frames. The albatross never disappoints me. I just switched my 
Joe to from Chocomoose to albatross and they feel terrific - free and easy. 
 

I don’t see a benefit in using a really short stem to maintain drop bars on 
a Joe. 

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 8:23:52 AM UTC-6 brok...@gmail.com wrote:

> My limited experience with these bikes is that it's probably best to set 
> them up the way they were designed. That reach is such an important factor 
> in the comfort of a bike. I've been considering Joes and Sams and 
> Altantises a lot lately, and if I were to choose a Joe, it would definitely 
> have either Toscos or Billie bars. I can never imagine my Gus being 
> comfortable with anything other than upright, swept-back bars (like my 
> Toscos with a 110 stem), because the reach on the frame is so long. 
> Even classic models like the Atlantis and the Homer have changed so much 
> with the extended stays and longer reaches, that I feel like you see less 
> and less of these newer models with drops these days. Of course, there's 
> many different body types and styles of riding to factor into it, so to 
> each their own. Personally, I can't see myself owning another Rivendell 
> with drop bars unless it was an older, more traditionally designed model.
>
> On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 10:08 AM Ted W  wrote:
>
>> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it 
>> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The 
>> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive; 
>> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to 
>> channel the wisdom of the group.
>>
>> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur). 
>> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built 
>> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about 
>> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach 
>> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my 
>> question starts:
>>
>> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I 
>> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go 
>> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars 
>> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to 
>> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was 
>> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so 
>> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm 
>> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what 
>> y'all think.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -- 
>> Ted Wood < ted.l...@gmail.com >
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CANCvShpXY3fGzrS2nt3t6ZBeHeaFsi2dFhAiHFLykU5J9rGQCA%40mail.gmail.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Brian Turner]

My limited experience with these bikes is that it's probably best to set
them up the way they were designed. That reach is such an important factor
in the comfort of a bike. I've been considering Joes and Sams and
Altantises a lot lately, and if I were to choose a Joe, it would definitely
have either Toscos or Billie bars. I can never imagine my Gus being
comfortable with anything other than upright, swept-back bars (like my
Toscos with a 110 stem), because the reach on the frame is so long.
Even classic models like the Atlantis and the Homer have changed so much
with the extended stays and longer reaches, that I feel like you see less
and less of these newer models with drops these days. Of course, there's
many different body types and styles of riding to factor into it, so to
each their own. Personally, I can't see myself owning another Rivendell
with drop bars unless it was an older, more traditionally designed model.

On Thu, Jun 29, 2023 at 10:08 AM Ted W  wrote:

> Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it
> today. First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The
> ride is amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive;
> nimble yet stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to
> channel the wisdom of the group.
>
> Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur).
> However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built
> with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about
> half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach
> to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my
> question starts:
>
> Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I
> give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go
> with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars
> on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to
> be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was
> thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so
> similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm
> probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what
> y'all think.
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/CANCvShpXY3fGzrS2nt3t6ZBeHeaFsi2dFhAiHFLykU5J9rGQCA%40mail.gmail.com
> 
> .
>

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[RBW] Re: Modifying my Hillborne

[Olivier Chételat]

Hello Wrigap1,
the good folks at Parktool have taken bike repair tutorials very seriously 
and the mustachioed man in their videos sure helped me going from barely 
being able to adjust a saddle to building bikes from the frame up. 
Here's the link: https://www.parktool.com/en-us/
This should make swapping handlebars, brake levers and shifters a 
relatively easy and painless operation. And fun to boot.
Good luck!
Oli in SF
On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 11:10:25 PM UTC-7 wri...@gmail.com wrote:

> Good morning folks!
>
> I’ve recently been inspired by Eric Marth’s build videos on YouTube and 
> want to change my Sam up a bit, mainly moving from road bars/bar end 
> shifters to something like a Bosco or albatross with thumbies.  Problem is 
> I’m not very familiar with changing parts out like brake levers, shifters 
> etc.  Can anyone recommend some good resources to better understand this 
> work, these parts and what’s compatible with what?  YouTube, books, 
> whatever ya got. Truly appreciate any help y’all can give me.
>

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[RBW] Appaloosa Build Opinions

[Ted W]

Got my Appa on Monday, built it yesterday and commuted to work on it today.
First impressions are that it's exactly what I had hoped for. The ride is
amazing and it feels so plush while still remaining responsive; nimble yet
stable. But I think it could still be better and I want to channel the
wisdom of the group.

Currently, I have the bike built with drop bars (50cm V/O Randonneur).
However, I know this frame, like many of the Riv frames, is really built
with swept back bars in mind. Knowing this, I went with a stem that's about
half my "typical" length. Unfortunately, it still feels like quite a reach
to get on the hoods, not impossible, but not "normal". So, this is where my
question starts:

Do I continue to try shortening the stem, say to maybe 30-40mm, or do I
give in to my swept bar destiny and spring for some new bars? And if I go
with sweeps, which bars do people like on the Appa? I have 65mm Tosco bars
on my Gus and it's wonderful on that bike, but being that I don't want to
be quite so upright (and there's not quite as much room) on the Appa. I was
thinking of going with either Billie or Albatross bars. The two are so
similar, however, that I'm having a hard time deciding between the two. I'm
probably splitting hairs, as usual, but I'm genuinely curious to see what
y'all think.

Cheers,
-- 
Ted Wood < ted.l.w...@gmail.com >

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[RBW] Re: FS: Sackville Happisack Saddlebag

[Michael Ullmer]

And sold

On Tuesday, June 27, 2023 at 4:08:13 PM UTC-5 Michael Ullmer wrote:

> In great shape, just didn't fit my needs for the family tandem (a bit too 
> big). I believe this is the tan color, but could be khaki? Hard to tell for 
> sure.
>
> $160 plus shipping via Pirateship
>
> Pics here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/xGm5bASPKSPZefyWA
>
> Mike in Minneapolis
>
>

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[RBW] WTB Nitto Fillet Faceplater 225/25.4/110mm CR60-3F

[Stephanie A.]

Hi there! I think Rivendell has been sold out of these for a while and I'm 
not sure when they'll be back in stock. If anyone has one of these stems 
sitting around in their parts bin that they'd like to sell, please let me 
know.

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[RBW] Re: FS: Atlantis 54.5 (Waterford) in Exceptional Condition

[ADH]

HI,
I'll reply with a DM to your gmail address. 

Thanks, Alan

On Thursday, June 29, 2023 at 2:10:27 AM UTC-4 gravelr...@gmail.com wrote:

> Hey there I am also in MA and am interested. What is your height? I was 
> reading on Rivendell's size charts that they would actually put me on a 
> 55... but that is according to the new sizes. If this is an older model it 
> might change, but what is the minimum pbh for this? Happy to go out and 
> test ride it too!
>
> On Friday, June 23, 2023 at 1:59:11 PM UTC-4 ADH wrote:
>
>> This is very painful. I purchased my Atlantis in 2008 directly from Grant 
>> who specified components. It is in excellent condition. Some of the 
>> components are Nitto Noodle, Dura Ace bar ends, Paul cantilevers, Honjo 
>> hammered fenders, Schwalbe Marathons, Shimano XT derailleurs, 36 spoke 
>> Mavic rims, Nitto rear rack. Bars are canvas tape with Bullseye shellac. 
>>
>> I have taken excellent care of my Atlantis. I'm gettin' old and got a new 
>> hip a few years ago. I can't ride like I used to and I am reluctantly 
>> switching to an ebike. 
>>
>> As far as blems go, the chain jumped once and nicked the chainstay and 
>> bottom bracket. I covered the chainstay with hockey tape and shellacked it. 
>> I touched up the nick in the bottom bracket with Testor 2135 (the bottle I 
>> have comes with the bike). There is a tiny ding in one of the Honjos. 
>>
>> You can see the original build on my Flickr account which is ahurvitz. 
>> The seat has mellowed and the bars have been re-wrapped, but the bike looks 
>> great. 
>>
>> I haven't set a price yet or officially put it up for sale. I'm 
>> considering Craigslist and eBay. But I thought I'd post this here first, 
>> because I know you all care about RBW and I want it to go to a good home. 
>> I'm not desperate to sell and (I think) I know what the bike is worth. If 
>> anyone is interested, feel free to contact me. I live in the Boston area. 
>> Pick-up would be great, but I'm also happy to ship. I'll take new pics as 
>> well.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Alan
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Modifying my Hillborne

[Andrew Wright]

Good morning folks!

I’ve recently been inspired by Eric Marth’s build videos on YouTube and 
want to change my Sam up a bit, mainly moving from road bars/bar end 
shifters to something like a Bosco or albatross with thumbies.  Problem is 
I’m not very familiar with changing parts out like brake levers, shifters 
etc.  Can anyone recommend some good resources to better understand this 
work, these parts and what’s compatible with what?  YouTube, books, 
whatever ya got. Truly appreciate any help y’all can give me.

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[RBW] Re: FS: Atlantis 54.5 (Waterford) in Exceptional Condition

[NR MR]

Hey there I am also in MA and am interested. What is your height? I was 
reading on Rivendell's size charts that they would actually put me on a 
55... but that is according to the new sizes. If this is an older model it 
might change, but what is the minimum pbh for this? Happy to go out and 
test ride it too!

On Friday, June 23, 2023 at 1:59:11 PM UTC-4 ADH wrote:

> This is very painful. I purchased my Atlantis in 2008 directly from Grant 
> who specified components. It is in excellent condition. Some of the 
> components are Nitto Noodle, Dura Ace bar ends, Paul cantilevers, Honjo 
> hammered fenders, Schwalbe Marathons, Shimano XT derailleurs, 36 spoke 
> Mavic rims, Nitto rear rack. Bars are canvas tape with Bullseye shellac. 
>
> I have taken excellent care of my Atlantis. I'm gettin' old and got a new 
> hip a few years ago. I can't ride like I used to and I am reluctantly 
> switching to an ebike. 
>
> As far as blems go, the chain jumped once and nicked the chainstay and 
> bottom bracket. I covered the chainstay with hockey tape and shellacked it. 
> I touched up the nick in the bottom bracket with Testor 2135 (the bottle I 
> have comes with the bike). There is a tiny ding in one of the Honjos. 
>
> You can see the original build on my Flickr account which is ahurvitz. The 
> seat has mellowed and the bars have been re-wrapped, but the bike looks 
> great. 
>
> I haven't set a price yet or officially put it up for sale. I'm 
> considering Craigslist and eBay. But I thought I'd post this here first, 
> because I know you all care about RBW and I want it to go to a good home. 
> I'm not desperate to sell and (I think) I know what the bike is worth. If 
> anyone is interested, feel free to contact me. I live in the Boston area. 
> Pick-up would be great, but I'm also happy to ship. I'll take new pics as 
> well.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Alan
>
>
>
>
>

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[RBW] Bicycle Quarterly Issues? Swap or sell?

[Nathan Barlow]

Hey all 


I am looking to buy some Bicycle Quarterly issues from the last 2 years. 

I have some older issues that I could swap if people are interested :)

Thanks in advance for helping me get some nice summer reading

Would need shipped t0 01746

Best
Nathan 

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Re: [RBW] Plush old 531 steel frames (was being precious)

[Andrew Scherer]

I hear variants of "plush" used when folks discuss steel and particularly 
531 but I'm not sure what to make of it. I have 6 bikes with 531 frames and 
I ride them all: 1970 Raleigh Pro Mk I, a Falcon San Remo of undetermined 
age but likely 1969-1971, a 1971 Raleigh International, a 1972 PX-10, a 
1972 Paramount, and a 1987 531c Mercian Professional. Sizes are 62-63cm for 
reference, and most of them run Compass or similar Panaracer tires. Each 
has different characteristics related to how the bike responds to steering 
effort delivered at the front end or through shifting weight/center of 
gravity, and a general sense of what I'll call rigidity. Perhaps it's 
because they're all the same base material, but I wonder if geometry, 
wheelbase, and tires makes more of a difference than materials. They all 
feel "comfortable" but the range is significant. The PX10 and the Falcon 
have a strong self-centering steering feel and the PX10 requires more 
effort to change direction. I'd say "steady and predictable". At the other 
end of the spectrum the Mercian has criterium geometry and feels very 
light, the steering is super responsive and at the same time the whole bike 
feels more solid/rigid than the others. I didn't like riding it on 
rough/urban roads until I changed the tires from 23c Michelin Pros to 28c 
(that barely fit) Soma Supple VItesse. The Raleigh Pro and International 
fall somewhere towards the PX10 to different degrees, and the Paramount 
seems to be smack in the middle. FWIW I've had the Mercian since it was new 
and if I could only keep one, that would be it. 

Anecdotally, the International was the first of the above I added to the 
fleet some 7 years ago after a friend convinced me to buy the frame. I 
built it to more or less the catalog spec and took a first ride with him. 
As we came up to a small pothole on a descent I used my Mercian reflexes to 
shift the bike around it and ended up sailing right through it...not enough 
"oomph" for that setup!

Andy
On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 8:08:22 AM UTC-4 lconley wrote:

> How about a plush NEW 531 frame - my Pashley Guv'nor 3 speed (shifter 
> mounted on seatpost). I need to measure the frame angles on this. I have 
> switched to a Sturmey Archer Dyno-Hub w/90mm drum brake from the standard 
> front 70mm drum brake since this picture was taken.
>
> [image: IMG_1535s.jpg]
>
> Laing
>
> On Wednesday, June 28, 2023 at 7:27:38 AM UTC-4 wboe...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> This thread makes me appreciate my vintage 531 bike all the more.  It's a 
>> Raleigh Lenton Gran Prix from the 60s.  Shod with Barlow Pass, it truly 
>> floats over everything.  Set up as a simple 3-speed path racer, it reduces 
>> the riding experience to simple moving along.  I've been thinking about 
>> having a low-rider single-sided rack made to fit the lamp bracket and 
>> fender boss but have not gotten around to it.
>>
>> [image: 20230131_155539 (1).jpg]
>>
>> On Monday, June 26, 2023 at 7:39:33 PM UTC-4 mr.wa...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Patrick was correct on the bracket on the fork of the Jack Taylor. That 
>>> was the bracket for the headlamp. The fitting on the top of the stem is an 
>>> integral center-pull brake cable hanger and adjuster. I had it set up with 
>>> some long reach Mafac brakes and it worked beautifully. Here's a close-up. 
>>> The rear brake hanger was nicely done as well.
>>>
>>> [image: DSCF9308.jpeg][image: DSCF9310.jpeg]
>>> [image: DSCF9311.jpeg]
>>>
>>> On Monday, June 26, 2023 at 3:57:49 PM UTC-7 Garth wrote:
>>>
 [image: P1011691.JPG]




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Re: [RBW] Craigslist, etc 2023

[kw]

https://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/bik/d/new-york-rivendell-atlantis-53cm/7635482928.html

On Sunday, June 18, 2023 at 1:38:33 PM UTC-4 jad...@gmail.com wrote:

>
> https://missoula.craigslist.org/bik/d/missoula-rivendell-sam-hillborne-60cm/7633643955.html
> On Wednesday, June 14, 2023 at 9:57:41 AM UTC-6 RichS wrote:
>
>> Valerie,
>>
>> The description says it was built in Japan, so Toyo origin. It would have 
>> come with 26" wheels; must be a conversion.
>>
>> Best,
>> Rich in ATL
>>
>> On Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 10:44:27 AM UTC-4 Valerie Yates wrote:
>>
>>> Re the Atlantis 53, did Riv sell a 650B version in that size or was it a 
>>> conversion? I have one and it has 26” wheels.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, June 13, 2023 at 7:18:41 AM UTC-6 Hoch in ut wrote:
>>>

 Toyo Atlantis size 53. 650b with dynamo (F). This looks like a 
 fantastic deal. I have no relation to the seller. Just happen to see it. 

 https://classifieds.ksl.com/listing/72037052
 On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:17:54 PM UTC-6 Kainalu V. -Brooklyn NY 
 wrote:

> 64cm top tube on that Clem, but not a 64cm frame. Biggies in the H 
> came in at 65cm. This one above is probably a 59?
> -Kai (who saw the most beautiful red Quickbeam this morning on the 
> Queensboro bridge, who’s owner said “you haven’t sold that yet?”, 
> regarding 
> my Rosco, to which I replied “It’s the other Rosco I’ve been thinking 
> about 
> selling”. But wow, those Roscos are fun fun fun, and measure 64cm and are 
> considerably zippier feeling that the Clem 65, which I also rode today. I 
> should send one West to the Wasatch Front for yearly shreds, but I 
> shouldn’t….)
>
>
> On Tuesday, June 6, 2023 at 4:18:44 PM UTC-4 Matthew Williams wrote:
>
>> Clem Smith Jr. H
>> 64cm
>> 2200
>> Pleasanton, CA
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/pleasanton-rivendell-clem-smith-jr-64cm/7629580864.html
>>
>

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