[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-07-18 Thread Reid Echols 
I’m so glad it arrived in one piece, and that you’re digging the ride! Does my 
heart good to see a frame on the road instead of on my wall. Time to take the 
Homer out! 

Reid in Austin 

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-07-17 Thread Greg J 
that's a great looking bike!  congrats!  it is exactly what I would have 
suggested in the first place also.  Lots of older, nice riding frames with 
clearance for bigger tires.

best, Greg

On Friday, July 17, 2020 at 1:22:56 PM UTC-7, Andrew Turner wrote:
>
> First ride report for the FW Evans frame! 
> Long story short, I simply couldn't be happier with how the bike performs. 
> It rides most similar to the Roadini I had a while back with it's springy 
> front-end and general Cadillac feel but with the added bonus of lugs. I do 
> suspect it has a lower trail, though. There's a slight twitchiness unloaded 
> in the front as you see it here but that will be resolved soon. Things left 
> to do on the bike include installing the front fender, an M12 rack + 
> basket, and upgrading the tires to some Jack Brown's. There's a chance I'll 
> replace the VO Nouveau Randonneur Handlebar as well. They're nice but 
> incredibly different than what I'm used to feeling, mainly due to how sharp 
> the swoops are. 
> [image: B1.jpg]
> On Monday, June 29, 2020 at 10:47:10 PM UTC-5 Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, CA 
> wrote:
>
>> On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 1:19:47 PM UTC-7, Brady Smith wrote:
>>>
>>> If you decide low trail is what you want, you might consider the Soma 
>>> Grand Randonneur. Designed by the Boulder Bicycle people, but way, way 
>>> cheaper than their All-Road.…
>>>
>>
>> …not to mention that Boulder Bicycle had kinda stopped making frames 
>>  
>> to concentrate on their vintage parts offerings.
>>
>> Andrew (the OP) is familiar with Velo-Orange, so I don't know why he 
>> didn't put the Pass Hunter on his list. It's got all his wants, except for 
>> rim brakes. OK, maybe a 35mm ø steel downtube isn't going to plane…
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-29 Thread Benz Ouyang, Sunnyvale, CA 
On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 1:19:47 PM UTC-7, Brady Smith wrote:
>
> If you decide low trail is what you want, you might consider the Soma 
> Grand Randonneur. Designed by the Boulder Bicycle people, but way, way 
> cheaper than their All-Road.…
>

…not to mention that Boulder Bicycle had kinda stopped making frames 
 
to concentrate on their vintage parts offerings.

Andrew (the OP) is familiar with Velo-Orange, so I don't know why he didn't 
put the Pass Hunter on his list. It's got all his wants, except for rim 
brakes. OK, maybe a 35mm ø steel downtube isn't going to plane…

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-29 Thread Ian A 
The thread can't close until you post photos and ride report

IanA Alberta Canada

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-29 Thread ted 
Wahoo. Gotta love that.
Time to go buy a lottery ticket while your luck is hot.
Congratulations.

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-29 Thread Andrew Turner 
The search has come to an end. Ironically, the person I bought the BMC 
monster cross frame from messaged me with an offer I couldn't refuse. It's 
a like-new 90's FW Evans with sport touring geometry, 531 lugged steel, 
canti-brakes, and accommodations for racks + fenders. As long as it arrives 
in one piece, I think I've really lucked out and it'll most likely 
consolidate my stable back to one bike. 

Happy riding, 
Andrew
On Monday, June 29, 2020 at 11:51:09 AM UTC-5 Craig Montgomery wrote:

> Poor Andrew, 
>  Are you confused yet Bucko? As you can see, this subject is just rife 
> with opinion and subjectivity (and fun). We could go on for days. I 
> realized I misinterpreted your original post and needs, so I'm gonna say go 
> with Paul's suggestion #1. Get out there and test the field as cheaply as 
> you can. 
>  
>  You need to decide what you like (find out what front end geometry 
> makes you happy) and that takes getting on different bikes. Your lankiness 
> really throws a monkey wrench into things. Gain 50 pounds (I'll give you 
> some of mine). It'll be easier to find a bike. What Paul or Mark or I 
> experience on the same bike could come up with three different 
> interpretations of its ride quality. 
>  
>  These days I can pretty much get on a bike blindfolded, ride it 
> around the block, and give you a basic run down of its geometry. That's 
> only taken 30 years but I've narrowed my own preferences down to 2 or 3 
> geometry types. And they all include low-mid-high trail, long-short 
> chainstays, long-short top tubes, head-seat angles of from 70 to 75 degrees 
> and a variety of tube sizes and thicknesses. Shazam! So have patience.
>  
>  Grab up that Motobecane or something like this Nashbar (offer two 
> bills-it was originally going for $167 a couple years back). 
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Nashbar-Toure-Vintage-Road-Bike-Frame-59cm-Large-Japan-Maruishi-Tange-Charity/264690704098?hash=item3da0cb9ee2:g:t40AAOSw6CBcqp0w
>  
>  Ride your buddie's bikes. Just make sure each bike is different or 
> you'll never learn. If you don't have the bikes specs all you can do is 
> ride it and take some basic measurements. After a while you should be able 
> to give a bike a side glance and be able to tell about how it'll ride.  And 
> when you decide, open up this thread again. I'd like to know what you got 
> and how it rides for you. 
>
> Craig in Tucson
>
>
> On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 4:11:35 PM UTC-7, Andrew Turner wrote:
>>
>> Thank you all for the incredible information. I really do appreciate the 
>> time spent on my hunt for a glass hammer! Iv'e got a couple candidates so 
>> far, one being a local seller with a 93' (same age as me!) RB-1 frameset 
>> and another with a Mercian I'd like to get additional info on. The longer 
>> wheelbase of the Mercian is very tempting but I've also heard the RB-1 
>> rides stable for it's geo so more to come. 
>>
>> Wishing everyone good health, 
>> Andrew
>>
>> On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 3:19:47 PM UTC-5 Brady Smith wrote:
>>
>>> If you decide low trail is what you want, you might consider the Soma 
>>> Grand Randonneur. Designed by the Boulder Bicycle people, but way, way 
>>> cheaper than their All-Road. If I had funds for a third bike, it would 
>>> probably be the one I'd choose. 
>>>
>>> On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 10:06:09 PM UTC-4, Andrew Turner wrote:
>>>
 Hello Group.
 Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
 and I'll add the backstory after. 

- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 
tires 
- rim brake
- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
- DT shifter braze-ons 
- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
- Frames of all ages welcome 
- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
saddlebag)

 Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 

- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than 
I need.
- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig 
welded though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. 
 On my 
list of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for 
 my 
first riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed 
 headset. 

 I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
 Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
 Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
 especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
 rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing

[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-29 Thread Craig Montgomery 
Poor Andrew, 
 Are you confused yet Bucko? As you can see, this subject is just rife 
with opinion and subjectivity (and fun). We could go on for days. I 
realized I misinterpreted your original post and needs, so I'm gonna say go 
with Paul's suggestion #1. Get out there and test the field as cheaply as 
you can. 
 
 You need to decide what you like (find out what front end geometry 
makes you happy) and that takes getting on different bikes. Your lankiness 
really throws a monkey wrench into things. Gain 50 pounds (I'll give you 
some of mine). It'll be easier to find a bike. What Paul or Mark or I 
experience on the same bike could come up with three different 
interpretations of its ride quality. 
 
 These days I can pretty much get on a bike blindfolded, ride it around 
the block, and give you a basic run down of its geometry. That's only taken 
30 years but I've narrowed my own preferences down to 2 or 3 geometry 
types. And they all include low-mid-high trail, long-short chainstays, 
long-short top tubes, head-seat angles of from 70 to 75 degrees and a 
variety of tube sizes and thicknesses. Shazam! So have patience.
 
 Grab up that Motobecane or something like this Nashbar (offer two 
bills-it was originally going for $167 a couple years back). 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Nashbar-Toure-Vintage-Road-Bike-Frame-59cm-Large-Japan-Maruishi-Tange-Charity/264690704098?hash=item3da0cb9ee2:g:t40AAOSw6CBcqp0w
 
 Ride your buddie's bikes. Just make sure each bike is different or 
you'll never learn. If you don't have the bikes specs all you can do is 
ride it and take some basic measurements. After a while you should be able 
to give a bike a side glance and be able to tell about how it'll ride.  And 
when you decide, open up this thread again. I'd like to know what you got 
and how it rides for you. 

Craig in Tucson


On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 4:11:35 PM UTC-7, Andrew Turner wrote:
>
> Thank you all for the incredible information. I really do appreciate the 
> time spent on my hunt for a glass hammer! Iv'e got a couple candidates so 
> far, one being a local seller with a 93' (same age as me!) RB-1 frameset 
> and another with a Mercian I'd like to get additional info on. The longer 
> wheelbase of the Mercian is very tempting but I've also heard the RB-1 
> rides stable for it's geo so more to come. 
>
> Wishing everyone good health, 
> Andrew
>
> On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 3:19:47 PM UTC-5 Brady Smith wrote:
>
>> If you decide low trail is what you want, you might consider the Soma 
>> Grand Randonneur. Designed by the Boulder Bicycle people, but way, way 
>> cheaper than their All-Road. If I had funds for a third bike, it would 
>> probably be the one I'd choose. 
>>
>> On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 10:06:09 PM UTC-4, Andrew Turner wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Group.
>>> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
>>> and I'll add the backstory after. 
>>>
>>>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 
>>>tires 
>>>- rim brake
>>>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>>>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>>>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>>>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>>>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>>>saddlebag)
>>>
>>> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>>>
>>>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than 
>>>I need.
>>>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
>>>wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>>>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig 
>>>welded though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. On 
>>> my 
>>>list of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for 
>>> my 
>>>first riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed 
>>> headset. 
>>>
>>> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
>>> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
>>> Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
>>> especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
>>> rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
>>> descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
>>> particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
>>> that ;) 
>>>
>>> All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
>>> ears! 
>>>
>>> Thanks Group, 
>>> Andrew
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-28 Thread Brian Campbell 
I have a 1974 Motobecane Grand Record frame 60cm. Full 531. Takes 38mm 
tires and will easily take 35 and fenders. Paint is a bit rough but if you 
have an interest let me know and I will send pictures.

On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 9:48:32 PM UTC-4, Mark Roland wrote:
>
> I thought some years RB-1s maxed out at about 28mm tires, though I could 
> be wrong. I think the issue would be the bottom of the brake calipers. But 
> maybe the '93 was one that took wider tires.
>
> While I would agree with Paul that some of the touring frames mentioned 
> would be a bit portly, a 70s/80s 531 frame in 60cm I think would be just 
> fine with one of those mini handlebar bags from VO or a Banana Sack, if you 
> want to be a rando kid.
>
> On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 7:11:35 PM UTC-4, Andrew Turner wrote:
>>
>> Thank you all for the incredible information. I really do appreciate the 
>> time spent on my hunt for a glass hammer! Iv'e got a couple candidates so 
>> far, one being a local seller with a 93' (same age as me!) RB-1 frameset 
>> and another with a Mercian I'd like to get additional info on. The longer 
>> wheelbase of the Mercian is very tempting but I've also heard the RB-1 
>> rides stable for it's geo so more to come. 
>>
>> Wishing everyone good health, 
>> Andrew
>>
>> On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 3:19:47 PM UTC-5 Brady Smith wrote:
>>
>>> If you decide low trail is what you want, you might consider the Soma 
>>> Grand Randonneur. Designed by the Boulder Bicycle people, but way, way 
>>> cheaper than their All-Road. If I had funds for a third bike, it would 
>>> probably be the one I'd choose. 
>>>
>>> On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 10:06:09 PM UTC-4, Andrew Turner wrote:
>>>
 Hello Group.
 Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
 and I'll add the backstory after. 

- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 
tires 
- rim brake
- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
- DT shifter braze-ons 
- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
- Frames of all ages welcome 
- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
saddlebag)

 Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 

- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than 
I need.
- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig 
welded though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. 
 On my 
list of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for 
 my 
first riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed 
 headset. 

 I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
 Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
 Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
 especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
 rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
 descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
 particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
 that ;) 

 All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
 ears! 

 Thanks Group, 
 Andrew



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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-28 Thread Mark Roland 
I thought some years RB-1s maxed out at about 28mm tires, though I could be 
wrong. I think the issue would be the bottom of the brake calipers. But 
maybe the '93 was one that took wider tires.

While I would agree with Paul that some of the touring frames mentioned 
would be a bit portly, a 70s/80s 531 frame in 60cm I think would be just 
fine with one of those mini handlebar bags from VO or a Banana Sack, if you 
want to be a rando kid.

On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 7:11:35 PM UTC-4, Andrew Turner wrote:
>
> Thank you all for the incredible information. I really do appreciate the 
> time spent on my hunt for a glass hammer! Iv'e got a couple candidates so 
> far, one being a local seller with a 93' (same age as me!) RB-1 frameset 
> and another with a Mercian I'd like to get additional info on. The longer 
> wheelbase of the Mercian is very tempting but I've also heard the RB-1 
> rides stable for it's geo so more to come. 
>
> Wishing everyone good health, 
> Andrew
>
> On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 3:19:47 PM UTC-5 Brady Smith wrote:
>
>> If you decide low trail is what you want, you might consider the Soma 
>> Grand Randonneur. Designed by the Boulder Bicycle people, but way, way 
>> cheaper than their All-Road. If I had funds for a third bike, it would 
>> probably be the one I'd choose. 
>>
>> On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 10:06:09 PM UTC-4, Andrew Turner wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Group.
>>> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
>>> and I'll add the backstory after. 
>>>
>>>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 
>>>tires 
>>>- rim brake
>>>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>>>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>>>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>>>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>>>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>>>saddlebag)
>>>
>>> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>>>
>>>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than 
>>>I need.
>>>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
>>>wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>>>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig 
>>>welded though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. On 
>>> my 
>>>list of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for 
>>> my 
>>>first riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed 
>>> headset. 
>>>
>>> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
>>> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
>>> Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
>>> especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
>>> rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
>>> descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
>>> particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
>>> that ;) 
>>>
>>> All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
>>> ears! 
>>>
>>> Thanks Group, 
>>> Andrew
>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-28 Thread S 
I agree with this advice. I would add: Rivendell Rambouillet and A Homer 
Hilsen. Somewhat rare, but they do turn up every once in a while on eBay 
and craigslist. They are not front load oriented, but you said a saddlebag 
might be OK, so I think they are worth considering. For what it's worth, I 
switched to using a saddlebag for lighter loads and I now prefer it. 
On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 9:07:24 PM UTC-7 Craig Montgomery wrote:

> Go vintage. Can't go wrong in frame design but finish is dicey. Paramount 
> P15 or one of the Japanese classics like a Miyata 1000 or Centurion 
> ProTour. English from 60's. 70's would thrill you. You'd love a Holdsworth 
> Mistral. Trek 520's, 620's, 720's. Of course, locating one of these gems 
> might be a bit problematic. 
>
> Craig in Tucson
>
>
>
>
>
> On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 7:06:09 PM UTC-7, Andrew Turner wrote:
>
>> Hello Group.
>> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
>> and I'll add the backstory after. 
>>
>>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 
>>tires 
>>- rim brake
>>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>>saddlebag)
>>
>> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>>
>>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than I 
>>need.
>>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
>>wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig welded 
>>though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. On my list 
>>of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for my 
>> first 
>>riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed headset. 
>>
>> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
>> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
>> Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
>> especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
>> rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
>> descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
>> particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
>> that ;) 
>>
>> All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
>> ears! 
>>
>> Thanks Group, 
>> Andrew
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-28 Thread Andrew Turner 
Thank you all for the incredible information. I really do appreciate the 
time spent on my hunt for a glass hammer! Iv'e got a couple candidates so 
far, one being a local seller with a 93' (same age as me!) RB-1 frameset 
and another with a Mercian I'd like to get additional info on. The longer 
wheelbase of the Mercian is very tempting but I've also heard the RB-1 
rides stable for it's geo so more to come. 

Wishing everyone good health, 
Andrew

On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 3:19:47 PM UTC-5 Brady Smith wrote:

> If you decide low trail is what you want, you might consider the Soma 
> Grand Randonneur. Designed by the Boulder Bicycle people, but way, way 
> cheaper than their All-Road. If I had funds for a third bike, it would 
> probably be the one I'd choose. 
>
> On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 10:06:09 PM UTC-4, Andrew Turner wrote:
>
>> Hello Group.
>> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
>> and I'll add the backstory after. 
>>
>>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 
>>tires 
>>- rim brake
>>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>>saddlebag)
>>
>> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>>
>>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than I 
>>need.
>>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
>>wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig welded 
>>though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. On my list 
>>of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for my 
>> first 
>>riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed headset. 
>>
>> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
>> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
>> Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
>> especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
>> rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
>> descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
>> particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
>> that ;) 
>>
>> All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
>> ears! 
>>
>> Thanks Group, 
>> Andrew
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-28 Thread Brady Smith 
If you decide low trail is what you want, you might consider the Soma Grand 
Randonneur. Designed by the Boulder Bicycle people, but way, way cheaper 
than their All-Road. If I had funds for a third bike, it would probably be 
the one I'd choose. 

On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 10:06:09 PM UTC-4, Andrew Turner wrote:
>
> Hello Group.
> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
> and I'll add the backstory after. 
>
>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 tires 
>- rim brake
>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>saddlebag)
>
> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>
>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than I 
>need.
>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
>wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig welded 
>though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. On my list 
>of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for my 
> first 
>riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed headset. 
>
> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
> Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
> especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
> rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
> descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
> particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
> that ;) 
>
> All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
> ears! 
>
> Thanks Group, 
> Andrew
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-28 Thread jack loudon 
I would add the Rawland Nordavinden to your list.  It meets every one of 
your criteria (except tigged frame) and its standard diameter thinwall 
tubing would complement your light weight.  It's low trail though, so as 
Paul said, it's important to know your preferences.  I eventually decided 
low trail wasn't for me but liked the frame so much I had a mid-high trail 
fork built for it, and now can't think of another production frame that 
would meet my needs as well, at any price.  

Jack - Seattle

On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 7:06:09 PM UTC-7, Andrew Turner wrote:
>
> Hello Group.
> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
> and I'll add the backstory after.
>
>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 tires 
>- rim brakes
>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>saddlebag)
>
> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>
>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than I 
>need.
>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
>wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig welded 
>though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. On my list 
>of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for my 
> first 
>riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed headset. 
>
> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
> Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
> especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
> rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
> descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
> particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
> that ;) 
>
> All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
> ears! 
>
> Thanks Group, 
> Andrew
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-28 Thread Paul Brodek 
My retentiveness is having issues with how wide you're throwing your net, 
especially regarding handling, and where you want to put your weight. I 
wouldn't want to drop serious $$$ into a frame meant for long-distance 
comfort and handling till I knew what geometry works best for me.

My base prejudices: I don't do brevets/randos, I don't like low-trail 
handling, I prefer small-shop, handbuilt frames to production frames. The 
first two kinda don't matter, I think, because I'm not recommending any 
specific builders or geometry. But you did ask for feedback from rando 
kids, and I'm about as far away as you could get from either of those 
words. And it helps explain why I'm not necessarily making specific recs. 
The third does matter, which you'll see below.

My advice:
#1. Decide whether you want low-trail or med-/hi-trail. Don't spend serious 
$$$ until you know this
#2. If you can't decide #1 yet, drop your budget to $200-$300 and get a few 
lower-end, heavier frames to figure out #1
#3. Once you've decided #1, put lugs further down on your list
#4. Work to see if you can get your budget up at least a few $hundred 
higher than $1k
#5. If you can do #4, look for a builder who can either build custom in 
that price range, or is building small-batch frames in that price range
#6. If you can't do #4, look for folks selling those small-batch frames 
used, and throw a wider net. Include paceline, velocipede salon, ebay, 
pinkbike, craigslist, +++
#7. If you're looking at buying used, putting WTB ads in the classifieds 
doesn't hurt, just don't be obnoxious. Bunch o' folks have frames sitting 
around not on the front burner to sell, but if someone pipes up and wants 
something just like that, well, you could shake something loose 

I think knowing your preferred geo/handling is key, don't want to sound 
like a broken record, so I'll leave it there.

Putting lugs further down your list means you're open to more small-batch 
builders who are doing tig'd construction.

Small-batch vs production: If I wanted a really nice low-trail, 
brevet-ready bike, I'd rather be on the lookout for an Ocean Air Rambler, 
Boulder Allround, Lyons L'av (too lazy to google the spelling), 
Norther/Lyons joint frame, etc than a vintage production almost anything. 
No disrespect to Craig M. and his awesome vintage machines and his 
expertise, but for me the production Paramounts, Miyatas, Bridgestones, 
etc, would be my test beds for the really nice frame. And gol darn I'd 
rather have something that came from a small, scrappy builder who knows how 
to torch a purpose-built frame than any '70s-'80s Trek production frame. 
I'd gladly give up lugs for that.  

BTW, if you decide you'd rather have mid-trail, and more weight in the 
back, there's not only likely equivalents of the frames I mentioned above, 
but maybe even more stuff available.

And I'm not really up on the gravel/groad scene, but if you decide 
mid-trail is better than lo-trail, should be lots of 1st-/2nd-gen groad 
frames out there that don't have disc brakes and carbon forks and disc 
brakes and thru-axles that might work well.  

Last thing that comes to mind is that very few tall production frames from 
the late-'70s through '80s were designed with 6'+ riders who only weighed 
132lbs in mind, and they were built to minimize warranty claims when ridden 
sloppily by big lunks. And if they were '80s touring frames, they were 
built assuming you'd have 40lbs+ lashed to front/rear racks. "Nimble" is 
not the adjective that comes to mind.

Guess that's all the words I have on this for now.

Paul Brodek
Hillsdale, NJ USA


On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 10:06:09 PM UTC-4, Andrew Turner wrote:
>
> Hello Group.
> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
> and I'll add the backstory after. 
>
>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 tires 
>- rim brake
>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>saddlebag)
>
> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>
>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than I 
>need.
>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
>wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig welded 
>though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. On my list 
>of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for my 
> first 
>riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed headset. 
>
> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
> Campeur a year ago made me realize

[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-28 Thread Mark Roland 

Oops, one more and I promise to stop Shopping Vicariously. Just a few past 
the Bob Jackson is a Trek 620. Still overpriced in my view (though again, 
if you use it, it's still cheaper than a new tigged frame and will last at 
least as long), but a known geometry.

Trek 520's, 620's, 720's. Of course, locating one of these gems might be a 
bit problematic. 

>
 Craig in Tucson





 On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 7:06:09 PM UTC-7, Andrew Turner wrote:

> Hello Group.
> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching 
> for and I'll add the backstory after. 
>
>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 
>tires 
>- rim brake
>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>saddlebag)
>
> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>
>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter 
>than I need.
>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame 
>really wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig 
>welded though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. 
> On my 
>list of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment 
> for my 
>first riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed 
> headset. 
>
> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
> Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
> especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
> rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
> descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down 
> a 
> particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
> that ;) 
>
> All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm 
> all ears! 
>
> Thanks Group, 
> Andrew
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-28 Thread Mark Roland 
I just looked at a few of the close ups, this one probably sports a bit too 
much patina for the price. (Though it certainly wouldn't put me off if I 
could get a better deal on it, or if I knew it would be a keeper.) Happy 
hunting!

On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 2:40:33 PM UTC-4, Mark Roland wrote:
>
> Here is one more your size and price range--under a grand for complete 
> bike. In my experience, these types of bikes will handle a light handlebar 
> bag fine, but you did say saddlebag. The Banana Sack from Riv goes both 
> ways. And if you don't like the vintage Dura Ace parts, you can sell them 
> for a few dollars. I believe this comes with 27" wheels, which, in my 
> experience, means you will almost certainly clear 32mm, probably 35mm.
>
> [image: bob jackson.jpg]
>
>
> On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 2:31:23 PM UTC-4, Mark Roland wrote:
>>
>>
>> Craig wrote: 
>> *Of course, locating one of these gems might be a bit problematic. *
>>
>> Not really. Just type in Reynolds 531 
>> 
>>  
>> and watch them appear before your eyes. This load even includes a 
>> Holdworth, though it's a Professional, not a Mistral.
>>
>> Here's my favorite from the ones I got to. Too bad it is from a seller 
>> that consistently prices too high--I guess because they are a charity? 
>> Sadly, 3x over your budget. And why they call it a "Professional Tourer" 
>> who knows. Sweet though! Love that color (I might take the decals off the 
>> fork.):
>>
>> [image: lime green tigra.jpg]
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sunday, June 28, 2020 at 12:07:24 AM UTC-4, Craig Montgomery wrote:
>>>
>>> Go vintage. Can't go wrong in frame design but finish is dicey. 
>>> Paramount P15 or one of the Japanese classics like a Miyata 1000 or 
>>> Centurion ProTour. English from 60's. 70's would thrill you. You'd love a 
>>> Holdsworth Mistral. Trek 520's, 620's, 720's. Of course, locating one of 
>>> these gems might be a bit problematic. 
>>>
>>> Craig in Tucson
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 7:06:09 PM UTC-7, Andrew Turner wrote:
>>>
 Hello Group.
 Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
 and I'll add the backstory after. 

- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 
tires 
- rim brake
- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
- DT shifter braze-ons 
- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
- Frames of all ages welcome 
- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
saddlebag)

 Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 

- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than 
I need.
- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig 
welded though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. 
 On my 
list of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for 
 my 
first riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed 
 headset. 

 I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
 Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
 Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
 especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
 rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
 descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
 particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
 that ;) 

 All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
 ears! 

 Thanks Group, 
 Andrew



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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-27 Thread Craig Montgomery 
Go vintage. Can't go wrong in frame design but finish is dicey. Paramount 
P15 or one of the Japanese classics like a Miyata 1000 or Centurion 
ProTour. English from 60's. 70's would thrill you. You'd love a Holdsworth 
Mistral. Trek 520's, 620's, 720's. Of course, locating one of these gems 
might be a bit problematic. 

Craig in Tucson





On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 7:06:09 PM UTC-7, Andrew Turner wrote:

> Hello Group.
> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
> and I'll add the backstory after. 
>
>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 tires 
>- rim brake
>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>saddlebag)
>
> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>
>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than I 
>need.
>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
>wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig welded 
>though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. On my list 
>of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for my 
> first 
>riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed headset. 
>
> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
> Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
> especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
> rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
> descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
> particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
> that ;) 
>
> All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
> ears! 
>
> Thanks Group, 
> Andrew
>
>

-- 
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[RBW] Re: Bike frame suggestions for longish distance 95% road comfort

2020-06-27 Thread ted 
I'd suggest a right sized roadini, note the latest email says they are 
going to start letting buyers take care of frame prep and headset install, 
either themselves or via a shop they trust.
Or a Black Mountain Cycles Road. Heck of a good value for your $.
Were I buying new with your priorities I'd pick between those two based on 
aesthetic and stem style preference.

I'm very happy with my BMC Road V3, very well behaved, quite zippy. I also 
really like the looks of my wife's Roadini though I've not ridden it.


On Saturday, June 27, 2020 at 7:06:09 PM UTC-7, Andrew Turner wrote:
>
> Hello Group.
> Maybe I'll just start this conversation off with what I'm searching for 
> and I'll add the backstory after. 
>
>- steel frame + fork (lugged preferably) that could clear 700x32 tires 
>- rim brake
>- lightish tubing ( I weigh a scant 132lbs at 6'1") 
>- DT shifter braze-ons 
>- Trying to keep the price to no more than $1000 for frame + fork
>- Frames of all ages welcome 
>- Designed to hold weight in the front (but I can make do with a 
>saddlebag)
>
> Bikes I've had in the past to try to fit these requirements: 
>
>- VO Campeur: way better suited for heavy touring. Way stouter than I 
>need.
>- Black Mtn Cycles monster cross: pretty nice but that frame really 
>wanted tires in the 38mm+ range which is overkill for me. 
>- Rivendell Roadini: damn fine frame and very comfortable. Tig welded 
>though and I might've gotten too large of frame with the 61cm. On my list 
>of possibilities though. The quality was also a disappointment for my 
> first 
>riv, chipped paint out of the box and very poorly installed headset. 
>
> I just got done with my first longer ride on a 58cm Gazelle Champion 
> Mondial AA frame . I built it up because riding my first brevet on the VO 
> Campeur a year ago made me realize how important a more nimble bike, 
> especially for majority road use, is. But I might've gone too far. It's a 
> rocket no doubt but I found it fatiguing having to stay so vigilant on 
> descents. And putting the weight up front lead to a very close call down a 
> particularly sketchy downhill. I think slacker geometry might help with 
> that ;) 
>
> All this to say, if any of you rando kids have some suggestions I'm all 
> ears! 
>
> Thanks Group, 
> Andrew
>
>

-- 
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