Re: [RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[James M]

Another Choco-moose lover here.  I had a set of Ortho bars from the first 
run that I sold off.  I just couldn't keep them from slipping in the stem 
on trails - so much leverage!  Switching over to a moose-style bar has been 
perfect for me - they ain't going anywhere!

James

On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 9:44:18 AM UTC-5 Paul M wrote:

> I've been riding with the Choco-Moose handlebar for years and the "narrow 
> 55cm" width has been fine for on road and off. Even though in the back of 
> my mind, the general cycling community has been pushing wider handlebars. 
> This moose style handlebar has a fixed rise, reach, width and downward tilt 
> of the bars which is perfect for me. It does need a longish top tube to 
> work best.
>
> On Monday, 4 December 2023 at 17:48:44 UTC-8 Chris Halasz wrote:
>
>> Thanks to all for the great input on different bars and their 
>> applications. 
>>
>> When I first tried Albatross bars on my Bleriot, I could not get 
>> comfortable with them. Fifteen years later the Albatross bars are my 
>> favorite. I use them on a 58cm LHT. 
>>
>> I recently experienced shoulder pain when I tried (much) wider upright 
>> bars. I swam long distances for decades and am now careful with my worn 
>> shoulders. Somewhere I read that it's important to keep the arms 'in the 
>> box' (i.e. within the width of the box established by the shoulders) during 
>> exercise. It seems to work very well with this scrawny six-foot-tall 
>> person. I'm fairly upright on the LHT, with the bars about 2.5" above the 
>> B68 saddle. 
>>
>> I'm curious to try some of the narrower Toscos sometime. The way the bars 
>> can be tilted so that the grips tilt toward the downtube is intriguing. No 
>> rush, but someday. 
>>
>> On Monday, December 4, 2023 at 1:02:28 PM UTC-8 brok...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> If you were to overlay Toscos (the 650mm version) over top of some 
>>> Orthos like that, you would find them nearly the same in just about every 
>>> way... for anyone pining for some unobtainable Ortho bars.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Dec 4, 2023 at 3:46 PM Richard Rose  wrote:
>>>
 I am late to this party & I may not be much help but… I’ve been running 
 Bosco bars on my two bikes - a Clem & a Gus. They are pretty much perfect. 
 Except that the Gus begs to be ridden harder on singletrack than I was 
 comfortable with. After much deliberation I took a flyer & installed a 
 “Albacore” handlebar from Hope Cyclery. It’s wide @ 785. It has a forward 
 sweep before coming back & a very comfortable & confidence inspiring 50-60 
 degrees. It necessitated ditching my 90mm stem for a 35mm one. These 
 changes transformed the Gus. The part of this that might apply to your 
 situation; wide bars feel great on the trails, experimentation can be fun 
 & 
 rewarding.
 [image: image0.jpeg]
 Sent from my iPhone

 On Dec 4, 2023, at 1:35 PM, Chris K  wrote:

 J, question about your mothbars - do you find yourself ever using 
 other hand positions?

 Intrigued by this bar but it looks like holding on anywhere but the 
 ends would be awkward with such a wide bar.

 On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 4:20:31 PM UTC-6 J wrote:

> I've always had problems with swept back bars, tried many over the 
> years from Riv, Velo O, Soma and the Albatross bar lasted the longest (6 
> months?) on any bike but they were never really comfortable either. 
> Everything always felt too narrow for my shoulder width and gave me neck 
> pain. I had an opportunity to try the Tumbleweed Persuader bars on my 
> hardtail, and even though the back sweep threw the fit off it still got 
> my 
> gears turning about wider swoopy bars. I widened some Albatross bars in a 
> vice and really felt like I was getting somewhere but started having 
> saddle 
> comfort issues from riding upright again, an issue I've always had. Last 
> year I got to try Ron's Ortho bars on his Atlantis and they felt 
> ridiculous 
> in the moment, but a day later I was still thinking about them. They'd 
> been 
> sold out for so long I gave up and sourced some Magic Components 
> Mothbars, 
> and they've been great! They turned an old aluminum mtb I wasn't riding 
> into a bike I'd happily take for a casual ride under 30 miles. 
>
> [image: 2xzuKpol[1].jpg]
> [image: JMRTj5Ql[1].jpg]
> [image: 6ySLdfsl[1].jpg]
> [image: TPvZVebl[1].jpg]
>
> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 3:01:00 PM UTC-4 exliontamer wrote:
>
>> The Albatross is my favorite upright bar. I'm a fairly tall guy with 
>> fairly big hands and it really only has 1 1/2 hand positions for me but 
>> I 
>> love the feel of it. It's stiff enough for trails, upright enough to 
>> commute on, etc. They live on my older Toyo Atlantis. I do think the 
>> newer 
>> revisions like the Billie work a lot better for newer 

Re: [RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Sarah Carlson]

Minh, I love both. I have albatross on my more compact bike, but I sized up 
on my Platypus and got Billie's and it feels so spacious. People say there 
are more hand position options, but I realized I never change positions, 
but I do like to put stuff all over my handlebars so there is more space 
for that.

On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 11:44:41 AM UTC-8 Minh wrote:

> i"m down to a single big bike and only ride albatross but have been very 
> tempted by the billie.   this discussion always reminds me of this t-shirt 
> from blue lug. 
>
> https://global.bluelug.com/blue-lug-nitto-handlebar-t-shirt-white.html
>
> On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 9:44:18 AM UTC-5 Paul M wrote:
>
>> I've been riding with the Choco-Moose handlebar for years and the "narrow 
>> 55cm" width has been fine for on road and off. Even though in the back of 
>> my mind, the general cycling community has been pushing wider handlebars. 
>> This moose style handlebar has a fixed rise, reach, width and downward tilt 
>> of the bars which is perfect for me. It does need a longish top tube to 
>> work best.
>>
>> On Monday, 4 December 2023 at 17:48:44 UTC-8 Chris Halasz wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks to all for the great input on different bars and their 
>>> applications. 
>>>
>>> When I first tried Albatross bars on my Bleriot, I could not get 
>>> comfortable with them. Fifteen years later the Albatross bars are my 
>>> favorite. I use them on a 58cm LHT. 
>>>
>>> I recently experienced shoulder pain when I tried (much) wider upright 
>>> bars. I swam long distances for decades and am now careful with my worn 
>>> shoulders. Somewhere I read that it's important to keep the arms 'in the 
>>> box' (i.e. within the width of the box established by the shoulders) during 
>>> exercise. It seems to work very well with this scrawny six-foot-tall 
>>> person. I'm fairly upright on the LHT, with the bars about 2.5" above the 
>>> B68 saddle. 
>>>
>>> I'm curious to try some of the narrower Toscos sometime. The way the 
>>> bars can be tilted so that the grips tilt toward the downtube is 
>>> intriguing. No rush, but someday. 
>>>
>>> On Monday, December 4, 2023 at 1:02:28 PM UTC-8 brok...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 If you were to overlay Toscos (the 650mm version) over top of some 
 Orthos like that, you would find them nearly the same in just about every 
 way... for anyone pining for some unobtainable Ortho bars.

 On Mon, Dec 4, 2023 at 3:46 PM Richard Rose  wrote:

> I am late to this party & I may not be much help but… I’ve been 
> running Bosco bars on my two bikes - a Clem & a Gus. They are pretty much 
> perfect. Except that the Gus begs to be ridden harder on singletrack than 
> I 
> was comfortable with. After much deliberation I took a flyer & installed 
> a 
> “Albacore” handlebar from Hope Cyclery. It’s wide @ 785. It has a forward 
> sweep before coming back & a very comfortable & confidence inspiring 
> 50-60 
> degrees. It necessitated ditching my 90mm stem for a 35mm one. These 
> changes transformed the Gus. The part of this that might apply to your 
> situation; wide bars feel great on the trails, experimentation can be fun 
> & 
> rewarding.
> [image: image0.jpeg]
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Dec 4, 2023, at 1:35 PM, Chris K  wrote:
>
> J, question about your mothbars - do you find yourself ever using 
> other hand positions?
>
> Intrigued by this bar but it looks like holding on anywhere but the 
> ends would be awkward with such a wide bar.
>
> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 4:20:31 PM UTC-6 J wrote:
>
>> I've always had problems with swept back bars, tried many over the 
>> years from Riv, Velo O, Soma and the Albatross bar lasted the longest (6 
>> months?) on any bike but they were never really comfortable either. 
>> Everything always felt too narrow for my shoulder width and gave me neck 
>> pain. I had an opportunity to try the Tumbleweed Persuader bars on my 
>> hardtail, and even though the back sweep threw the fit off it still got 
>> my 
>> gears turning about wider swoopy bars. I widened some Albatross bars in 
>> a 
>> vice and really felt like I was getting somewhere but started having 
>> saddle 
>> comfort issues from riding upright again, an issue I've always had. Last 
>> year I got to try Ron's Ortho bars on his Atlantis and they felt 
>> ridiculous 
>> in the moment, but a day later I was still thinking about them. They'd 
>> been 
>> sold out for so long I gave up and sourced some Magic Components 
>> Mothbars, 
>> and they've been great! They turned an old aluminum mtb I wasn't riding 
>> into a bike I'd happily take for a casual ride under 30 miles. 
>>
>> [image: 2xzuKpol[1].jpg]
>> [image: JMRTj5Ql[1].jpg]
>> [image: 6ySLdfsl[1].jpg]
>> [image: TPvZVebl[1].jpg]
>>
>> On 

Re: [RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Minh]

i"m down to a single big bike and only ride albatross but have been very 
tempted by the billie.   this discussion always reminds me of this t-shirt 
from blue lug. 

https://global.bluelug.com/blue-lug-nitto-handlebar-t-shirt-white.html

On Tuesday, December 5, 2023 at 9:44:18 AM UTC-5 Paul M wrote:

> I've been riding with the Choco-Moose handlebar for years and the "narrow 
> 55cm" width has been fine for on road and off. Even though in the back of 
> my mind, the general cycling community has been pushing wider handlebars. 
> This moose style handlebar has a fixed rise, reach, width and downward tilt 
> of the bars which is perfect for me. It does need a longish top tube to 
> work best.
>
> On Monday, 4 December 2023 at 17:48:44 UTC-8 Chris Halasz wrote:
>
>> Thanks to all for the great input on different bars and their 
>> applications. 
>>
>> When I first tried Albatross bars on my Bleriot, I could not get 
>> comfortable with them. Fifteen years later the Albatross bars are my 
>> favorite. I use them on a 58cm LHT. 
>>
>> I recently experienced shoulder pain when I tried (much) wider upright 
>> bars. I swam long distances for decades and am now careful with my worn 
>> shoulders. Somewhere I read that it's important to keep the arms 'in the 
>> box' (i.e. within the width of the box established by the shoulders) during 
>> exercise. It seems to work very well with this scrawny six-foot-tall 
>> person. I'm fairly upright on the LHT, with the bars about 2.5" above the 
>> B68 saddle. 
>>
>> I'm curious to try some of the narrower Toscos sometime. The way the bars 
>> can be tilted so that the grips tilt toward the downtube is intriguing. No 
>> rush, but someday. 
>>
>> On Monday, December 4, 2023 at 1:02:28 PM UTC-8 brok...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> If you were to overlay Toscos (the 650mm version) over top of some 
>>> Orthos like that, you would find them nearly the same in just about every 
>>> way... for anyone pining for some unobtainable Ortho bars.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Dec 4, 2023 at 3:46 PM Richard Rose  wrote:
>>>
 I am late to this party & I may not be much help but… I’ve been running 
 Bosco bars on my two bikes - a Clem & a Gus. They are pretty much perfect. 
 Except that the Gus begs to be ridden harder on singletrack than I was 
 comfortable with. After much deliberation I took a flyer & installed a 
 “Albacore” handlebar from Hope Cyclery. It’s wide @ 785. It has a forward 
 sweep before coming back & a very comfortable & confidence inspiring 50-60 
 degrees. It necessitated ditching my 90mm stem for a 35mm one. These 
 changes transformed the Gus. The part of this that might apply to your 
 situation; wide bars feel great on the trails, experimentation can be fun 
 & 
 rewarding.
 [image: image0.jpeg]
 Sent from my iPhone

 On Dec 4, 2023, at 1:35 PM, Chris K  wrote:

 J, question about your mothbars - do you find yourself ever using 
 other hand positions?

 Intrigued by this bar but it looks like holding on anywhere but the 
 ends would be awkward with such a wide bar.

 On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 4:20:31 PM UTC-6 J wrote:

> I've always had problems with swept back bars, tried many over the 
> years from Riv, Velo O, Soma and the Albatross bar lasted the longest (6 
> months?) on any bike but they were never really comfortable either. 
> Everything always felt too narrow for my shoulder width and gave me neck 
> pain. I had an opportunity to try the Tumbleweed Persuader bars on my 
> hardtail, and even though the back sweep threw the fit off it still got 
> my 
> gears turning about wider swoopy bars. I widened some Albatross bars in a 
> vice and really felt like I was getting somewhere but started having 
> saddle 
> comfort issues from riding upright again, an issue I've always had. Last 
> year I got to try Ron's Ortho bars on his Atlantis and they felt 
> ridiculous 
> in the moment, but a day later I was still thinking about them. They'd 
> been 
> sold out for so long I gave up and sourced some Magic Components 
> Mothbars, 
> and they've been great! They turned an old aluminum mtb I wasn't riding 
> into a bike I'd happily take for a casual ride under 30 miles. 
>
> [image: 2xzuKpol[1].jpg]
> [image: JMRTj5Ql[1].jpg]
> [image: 6ySLdfsl[1].jpg]
> [image: TPvZVebl[1].jpg]
>
> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 3:01:00 PM UTC-4 exliontamer wrote:
>
>> The Albatross is my favorite upright bar. I'm a fairly tall guy with 
>> fairly big hands and it really only has 1 1/2 hand positions for me but 
>> I 
>> love the feel of it. It's stiff enough for trails, upright enough to 
>> commute on, etc. They live on my older Toyo Atlantis. I do think the 
>> newer 
>> revisions like the Billie work a lot better for newer Rivs with longer 
>> top 
>> 

[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[J]

To: Chris K (I have no idea how to quote your question and reply)

  I tend to move around a lot on bars and it's no different with the 
Mothbars, I definitely see them as 3 position bars. I spend quite a lot of 
time up in the bends in front of the shifters, the width is about identical 
to my favorite drop bar hood position.

On Monday, December 4, 2023 at 1:35:33 PM UTC-5 Chris K wrote:

> J, question about your mothbars - do you find yourself ever using other 
> hand positions?
>
> Intrigued by this bar but it looks like holding on anywhere but the ends 
> would be awkward with such a wide bar.
>
> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 4:20:31 PM UTC-6 J wrote:
>
>> I've always had problems with swept back bars, tried many over the years 
>> from Riv, Velo O, Soma and the Albatross bar lasted the longest (6 months?) 
>> on any bike but they were never really comfortable either. Everything 
>> always felt too narrow for my shoulder width and gave me neck pain. I had 
>> an opportunity to try the Tumbleweed Persuader bars on my hardtail, and 
>> even though the back sweep threw the fit off it still got my gears turning 
>> about wider swoopy bars. I widened some Albatross bars in a vice and really 
>> felt like I was getting somewhere but started having saddle comfort issues 
>> from riding upright again, an issue I've always had. Last year I got to try 
>> Ron's Ortho bars on his Atlantis and they felt ridiculous in the moment, 
>> but a day later I was still thinking about them. They'd been sold out for 
>> so long I gave up and sourced some Magic Components Mothbars, and they've 
>> been great! They turned an old aluminum mtb I wasn't riding into a bike I'd 
>> happily take for a casual ride under 30 miles. 
>>
>> [image: 2xzuKpol[1].jpg]
>> [image: JMRTj5Ql[1].jpg]
>> [image: 6ySLdfsl[1].jpg]
>> [image: TPvZVebl[1].jpg]
>>
>> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 3:01:00 PM UTC-4 exliontamer wrote:
>>
>>> The Albatross is my favorite upright bar. I'm a fairly tall guy with 
>>> fairly big hands and it really only has 1 1/2 hand positions for me but I 
>>> love the feel of it. It's stiff enough for trails, upright enough to 
>>> commute on, etc. They live on my older Toyo Atlantis. I do think the newer 
>>> revisions like the Billie work a lot better for newer Rivs with longer top 
>>> tubes. The Billie in particular is incredible. It would just have too much 
>>> sweepback for me on the Atlantis without using a comically long stem and I 
>>> would lose that forward bend position without having to lean a lot.
>>> As to Ortho bars I don't know how well they work for smaller statured 
>>> riders. I just put a pair on my Cheviot and they feel good out of the gate 
>>> but for someone who doesn't have broad shoulders they could be overkill. 
>>> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 11:22:34 AM UTC-5 Glen wrote:
>>>
 I'm a Billie Bar convert thanks to a kind list member and prefer them 
 for the extra hand position in front of the brake levers. Yes they could 
 look nicer with some extra rise, I'd prefer to look at a swooped up bar 
 than a tall stem but that doesn't impact my ride only my gaze when looking 
 at my bike instead of riding it. 

 Regarding the usability of the front hand position. I find myself there 
 when I need one of two things, getting out of the wind while fighting a 
 head wind or giving myself a good long stretch while still seated. With a 
 13cm stem and Billies I can get a really good stretch without getting off 
 the bike. 

 FWIW my Billies are on a 64cm Atlantis

 On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 6:00:25 PM UTC+2 kirkebc...@gmail.com 
 wrote:

> I've been riding Billie bars on my 90s Novara mtb for about two years 
> and absolutely love them for all the reasons Eric mentioned. 
> I have two critiques: I wish they had a little bit more rise and they 
> just aren't quite as aesthetically appealing as Albatross bars, which 
> just 
> seem to have a smoother overall curvature and shape. I'd love it if 
> someone 
> made a handlebar that was an Albatross with essentially the same width 
> and 
> extended sweep back of the Billie bars. 
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 2:34:41 PM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi David — I've run Albatross, Billie and Ortho bars on different 
>> bikes and have enjoyed them all. I think that the Billies are the sweet 
>> spot, more sweep back and wider than the Albatross and not out there in 
>> mutant territory like the Orthos. 
>>
>> All three bars have a similar shape but each has more sweep back than 
>> the next and they get wider along the scale as well. I do like having 
>> more 
>> sweep back to accommodate levers, thumb-mounted shifters *and *to 
>> have a nice long grip position in the hooks which I find good for 
>> spirited 
>> riding and climbing out of the saddle. 
>>
>> I 

[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[J]

I tend to move around a lot on bars and it's no different with the 
Mothbars, I definitely see them as 3 position bars. I spend quite a lot of 
time up in the bends in front of the shifters, the width is about identical 
to my favorite drop bar hood position.

On Monday, December 4, 2023 at 1:35:33 PM UTC-5 Chris K wrote:

> J, question about your mothbars - do you find yourself ever using other 
> hand positions?
>
> Intrigued by this bar but it looks like holding on anywhere but the ends 
> would be awkward with such a wide bar.
>
> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 4:20:31 PM UTC-6 J wrote:
>
>> I've always had problems with swept back bars, tried many over the years 
>> from Riv, Velo O, Soma and the Albatross bar lasted the longest (6 months?) 
>> on any bike but they were never really comfortable either. Everything 
>> always felt too narrow for my shoulder width and gave me neck pain. I had 
>> an opportunity to try the Tumbleweed Persuader bars on my hardtail, and 
>> even though the back sweep threw the fit off it still got my gears turning 
>> about wider swoopy bars. I widened some Albatross bars in a vice and really 
>> felt like I was getting somewhere but started having saddle comfort issues 
>> from riding upright again, an issue I've always had. Last year I got to try 
>> Ron's Ortho bars on his Atlantis and they felt ridiculous in the moment, 
>> but a day later I was still thinking about them. They'd been sold out for 
>> so long I gave up and sourced some Magic Components Mothbars, and they've 
>> been great! They turned an old aluminum mtb I wasn't riding into a bike I'd 
>> happily take for a casual ride under 30 miles. 
>>
>> [image: 2xzuKpol[1].jpg]
>> [image: JMRTj5Ql[1].jpg]
>> [image: 6ySLdfsl[1].jpg]
>> [image: TPvZVebl[1].jpg]
>>
>> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 3:01:00 PM UTC-4 exliontamer wrote:
>>
>>> The Albatross is my favorite upright bar. I'm a fairly tall guy with 
>>> fairly big hands and it really only has 1 1/2 hand positions for me but I 
>>> love the feel of it. It's stiff enough for trails, upright enough to 
>>> commute on, etc. They live on my older Toyo Atlantis. I do think the newer 
>>> revisions like the Billie work a lot better for newer Rivs with longer top 
>>> tubes. The Billie in particular is incredible. It would just have too much 
>>> sweepback for me on the Atlantis without using a comically long stem and I 
>>> would lose that forward bend position without having to lean a lot.
>>> As to Ortho bars I don't know how well they work for smaller statured 
>>> riders. I just put a pair on my Cheviot and they feel good out of the gate 
>>> but for someone who doesn't have broad shoulders they could be overkill. 
>>> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 11:22:34 AM UTC-5 Glen wrote:
>>>
 I'm a Billie Bar convert thanks to a kind list member and prefer them 
 for the extra hand position in front of the brake levers. Yes they could 
 look nicer with some extra rise, I'd prefer to look at a swooped up bar 
 than a tall stem but that doesn't impact my ride only my gaze when looking 
 at my bike instead of riding it. 

 Regarding the usability of the front hand position. I find myself there 
 when I need one of two things, getting out of the wind while fighting a 
 head wind or giving myself a good long stretch while still seated. With a 
 13cm stem and Billies I can get a really good stretch without getting off 
 the bike. 

 FWIW my Billies are on a 64cm Atlantis

 On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 6:00:25 PM UTC+2 kirkebc...@gmail.com 
 wrote:

> I've been riding Billie bars on my 90s Novara mtb for about two years 
> and absolutely love them for all the reasons Eric mentioned. 
> I have two critiques: I wish they had a little bit more rise and they 
> just aren't quite as aesthetically appealing as Albatross bars, which 
> just 
> seem to have a smoother overall curvature and shape. I'd love it if 
> someone 
> made a handlebar that was an Albatross with essentially the same width 
> and 
> extended sweep back of the Billie bars. 
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 2:34:41 PM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi David — I've run Albatross, Billie and Ortho bars on different 
>> bikes and have enjoyed them all. I think that the Billies are the sweet 
>> spot, more sweep back and wider than the Albatross and not out there in 
>> mutant territory like the Orthos. 
>>
>> All three bars have a similar shape but each has more sweep back than 
>> the next and they get wider along the scale as well. I do like having 
>> more 
>> sweep back to accommodate levers, thumb-mounted shifters *and *to 
>> have a nice long grip position in the hooks which I find good for 
>> spirited 
>> riding and climbing out of the saddle. 
>>
>> I don't think I'll run *Albatross* bars again, despite their beauty 

Re: [RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Chris Halasz]

Thanks to all for the great input on different bars and their applications. 

When I first tried Albatross bars on my Bleriot, I could not get 
comfortable with them. Fifteen years later the Albatross bars are my 
favorite. I use them on a 58cm LHT. 

I recently experienced shoulder pain when I tried (much) wider upright 
bars. I swam long distances for decades and am now careful with my worn 
shoulders. Somewhere I read that it's important to keep the arms 'in the 
box' (i.e. within the width of the box established by the shoulders) during 
exercise. It seems to work very well with this scrawny six-foot-tall 
person. I'm fairly upright on the LHT, with the bars about 2.5" above the 
B68 saddle. 

I'm curious to try some of the narrower Toscos sometime. The way the bars 
can be tilted so that the grips tilt toward the downtube is intriguing. No 
rush, but someday. 

On Monday, December 4, 2023 at 1:02:28 PM UTC-8 brok...@gmail.com wrote:

> If you were to overlay Toscos (the 650mm version) over top of some Orthos 
> like that, you would find them nearly the same in just about every way... 
> for anyone pining for some unobtainable Ortho bars.
>
> On Mon, Dec 4, 2023 at 3:46 PM Richard Rose  wrote:
>
>> I am late to this party & I may not be much help but… I’ve been running 
>> Bosco bars on my two bikes - a Clem & a Gus. They are pretty much perfect. 
>> Except that the Gus begs to be ridden harder on singletrack than I was 
>> comfortable with. After much deliberation I took a flyer & installed a 
>> “Albacore” handlebar from Hope Cyclery. It’s wide @ 785. It has a forward 
>> sweep before coming back & a very comfortable & confidence inspiring 50-60 
>> degrees. It necessitated ditching my 90mm stem for a 35mm one. These 
>> changes transformed the Gus. The part of this that might apply to your 
>> situation; wide bars feel great on the trails, experimentation can be fun & 
>> rewarding.
>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Dec 4, 2023, at 1:35 PM, Chris K  wrote:
>>
>> J, question about your mothbars - do you find yourself ever using other 
>> hand positions?
>>
>> Intrigued by this bar but it looks like holding on anywhere but the ends 
>> would be awkward with such a wide bar.
>>
>> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 4:20:31 PM UTC-6 J wrote:
>>
>>> I've always had problems with swept back bars, tried many over the years 
>>> from Riv, Velo O, Soma and the Albatross bar lasted the longest (6 months?) 
>>> on any bike but they were never really comfortable either. Everything 
>>> always felt too narrow for my shoulder width and gave me neck pain. I had 
>>> an opportunity to try the Tumbleweed Persuader bars on my hardtail, and 
>>> even though the back sweep threw the fit off it still got my gears turning 
>>> about wider swoopy bars. I widened some Albatross bars in a vice and really 
>>> felt like I was getting somewhere but started having saddle comfort issues 
>>> from riding upright again, an issue I've always had. Last year I got to try 
>>> Ron's Ortho bars on his Atlantis and they felt ridiculous in the moment, 
>>> but a day later I was still thinking about them. They'd been sold out for 
>>> so long I gave up and sourced some Magic Components Mothbars, and they've 
>>> been great! They turned an old aluminum mtb I wasn't riding into a bike I'd 
>>> happily take for a casual ride under 30 miles. 
>>>
>>> [image: 2xzuKpol[1].jpg]
>>> [image: JMRTj5Ql[1].jpg]
>>> [image: 6ySLdfsl[1].jpg]
>>> [image: TPvZVebl[1].jpg]
>>>
>>> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 3:01:00 PM UTC-4 exliontamer wrote:
>>>
 The Albatross is my favorite upright bar. I'm a fairly tall guy with 
 fairly big hands and it really only has 1 1/2 hand positions for me but I 
 love the feel of it. It's stiff enough for trails, upright enough to 
 commute on, etc. They live on my older Toyo Atlantis. I do think the newer 
 revisions like the Billie work a lot better for newer Rivs with longer top 
 tubes. The Billie in particular is incredible. It would just have too much 
 sweepback for me on the Atlantis without using a comically long stem and I 
 would lose that forward bend position without having to lean a lot.
 As to Ortho bars I don't know how well they work for smaller statured 
 riders. I just put a pair on my Cheviot and they feel good out of the gate 
 but for someone who doesn't have broad shoulders they could be overkill. 
 On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 11:22:34 AM UTC-5 Glen wrote:

> I'm a Billie Bar convert thanks to a kind list member and prefer them 
> for the extra hand position in front of the brake levers. Yes they could 
> look nicer with some extra rise, I'd prefer to look at a swooped up bar 
> than a tall stem but that doesn't impact my ride only my gaze when 
> looking 
> at my bike instead of riding it. 
>
> Regarding the usability of the front hand position. I find myself 
> there when I need one of 

[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Chris K]

J, question about your mothbars - do you find yourself ever using other 
hand positions?

Intrigued by this bar but it looks like holding on anywhere but the ends 
would be awkward with such a wide bar.

On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 4:20:31 PM UTC-6 J wrote:

> I've always had problems with swept back bars, tried many over the years 
> from Riv, Velo O, Soma and the Albatross bar lasted the longest (6 months?) 
> on any bike but they were never really comfortable either. Everything 
> always felt too narrow for my shoulder width and gave me neck pain. I had 
> an opportunity to try the Tumbleweed Persuader bars on my hardtail, and 
> even though the back sweep threw the fit off it still got my gears turning 
> about wider swoopy bars. I widened some Albatross bars in a vice and really 
> felt like I was getting somewhere but started having saddle comfort issues 
> from riding upright again, an issue I've always had. Last year I got to try 
> Ron's Ortho bars on his Atlantis and they felt ridiculous in the moment, 
> but a day later I was still thinking about them. They'd been sold out for 
> so long I gave up and sourced some Magic Components Mothbars, and they've 
> been great! They turned an old aluminum mtb I wasn't riding into a bike I'd 
> happily take for a casual ride under 30 miles. 
>
> [image: 2xzuKpol[1].jpg]
> [image: JMRTj5Ql[1].jpg]
> [image: 6ySLdfsl[1].jpg]
> [image: TPvZVebl[1].jpg]
>
> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 3:01:00 PM UTC-4 exliontamer wrote:
>
>> The Albatross is my favorite upright bar. I'm a fairly tall guy with 
>> fairly big hands and it really only has 1 1/2 hand positions for me but I 
>> love the feel of it. It's stiff enough for trails, upright enough to 
>> commute on, etc. They live on my older Toyo Atlantis. I do think the newer 
>> revisions like the Billie work a lot better for newer Rivs with longer top 
>> tubes. The Billie in particular is incredible. It would just have too much 
>> sweepback for me on the Atlantis without using a comically long stem and I 
>> would lose that forward bend position without having to lean a lot.
>> As to Ortho bars I don't know how well they work for smaller statured 
>> riders. I just put a pair on my Cheviot and they feel good out of the gate 
>> but for someone who doesn't have broad shoulders they could be overkill. 
>> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 11:22:34 AM UTC-5 Glen wrote:
>>
>>> I'm a Billie Bar convert thanks to a kind list member and prefer them 
>>> for the extra hand position in front of the brake levers. Yes they could 
>>> look nicer with some extra rise, I'd prefer to look at a swooped up bar 
>>> than a tall stem but that doesn't impact my ride only my gaze when looking 
>>> at my bike instead of riding it. 
>>>
>>> Regarding the usability of the front hand position. I find myself there 
>>> when I need one of two things, getting out of the wind while fighting a 
>>> head wind or giving myself a good long stretch while still seated. With a 
>>> 13cm stem and Billies I can get a really good stretch without getting off 
>>> the bike. 
>>>
>>> FWIW my Billies are on a 64cm Atlantis
>>>
>>> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 6:00:25 PM UTC+2 kirkebc...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I've been riding Billie bars on my 90s Novara mtb for about two years 
 and absolutely love them for all the reasons Eric mentioned. 
 I have two critiques: I wish they had a little bit more rise and they 
 just aren't quite as aesthetically appealing as Albatross bars, which just 
 seem to have a smoother overall curvature and shape. I'd love it if 
 someone 
 made a handlebar that was an Albatross with essentially the same width and 
 extended sweep back of the Billie bars. 
 On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 2:34:41 PM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Hi David — I've run Albatross, Billie and Ortho bars on different 
> bikes and have enjoyed them all. I think that the Billies are the sweet 
> spot, more sweep back and wider than the Albatross and not out there in 
> mutant territory like the Orthos. 
>
> All three bars have a similar shape but each has more sweep back than 
> the next and they get wider along the scale as well. I do like having 
> more 
> sweep back to accommodate levers, thumb-mounted shifters *and *to 
> have a nice long grip position in the hooks which I find good for 
> spirited 
> riding and climbing out of the saddle. 
>
> I don't think I'll run *Albatross* bars again, despite their beauty 
> and the classic shape. Just not enough room for levers, thumb shifters 
> and 
> the hooks grip position for me. I'd consider it with bar end shifters but 
> don't see myself running swept back bars and bar-ends together anytime 
> soon. The image below, from Rivendell Catalog No. 20, is how I fell in 
> love 
> with the Albatross bar. 
>
> [image: Screenshot 2023-08-25 at 3.12.33 PM.png]
>

[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[J S]

I switched to Choco bars in 2020 from Albatross bars. I have never 
regretted the switch, seems like I have extra hand room and added comfort. 

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:

> Hi there,
>
> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>
> Thanks hive mind!
>
>  
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Davey Two Shoes]

I rode albatross on a couple different bikes over the years and I never 
really got on with them. I used the Terminal bar for a bit and I really 
liked that. 
Then the orthos came in stock and I bought them without thought of what I'd 
actually do with them.

I've been running them on my Karate Monkey which is used as my toddler 
hauler and mountain bike. I've got a couple days out on the single track I 
normally ride and I've never had more fun. The width and flex of these bars 
add a suppleness that has always been missing from the KM despite the wheel 
and tire set up I would use. Combined with a B17 flyer I am so pleased. 

I do need to up my frame size as the Medium is really just barely big 
enough for me with a more traditional mtb set up. I like the bars enough to 
change the frame.

If you're going to use the bike for more chonky gravel and some single 
track I think this is where the argument for an Ortho over other options 
really gains traction.

Thinking about building up a geared Surly LowSide for the Orthos.

On Sunday, August 27, 2023 at 9:18:16 PM UTC-4 joshm...@gmail.com wrote:

> I've been running Albas on my Bike Friday with tektro inverse levers and 
> suntour stem shifters and the hand positions are endless. 
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/WKCgLGpuq4Pxvv7K8
>
> JB NYC 
>
> On Fri, Aug 25, 2023, 3:34 PM Eric Marth  wrote:
>
>> Hi David — I've run Albatross, Billie and Ortho bars on different bikes 
>> and have enjoyed them all. I think that the Billies are the sweet spot, 
>> more sweep back and wider than the Albatross and not out there in mutant 
>> territory like the Orthos. 
>>
>> All three bars have a similar shape but each has more sweep back than the 
>> next and they get wider along the scale as well. I do like having more 
>> sweep back to accommodate levers, thumb-mounted shifters *and *to have a 
>> nice long grip position in the hooks which I find good for spirited riding 
>> and climbing out of the saddle. 
>>
>> I don't think I'll run *Albatross* bars again, despite their beauty and 
>> the classic shape. Just not enough room for levers, thumb shifters and the 
>> hooks grip position for me. I'd consider it with bar end shifters but don't 
>> see myself running swept back bars and bar-ends together anytime soon. The 
>> image below, from Rivendell Catalog No. 20, is how I fell in love with the 
>> Albatross bar. 
>>
>> [image: Screenshot 2023-08-25 at 3.12.33 PM.png]
>>
>> I don't have any pictures handy but I ran mine just like this on my Surly 
>> LHT. 
>>
>> I had the *Billie* bars on my Appaloosa for a while before I swapped to 
>> the Ortho bars. Great hooks position, nice shape, plenty of sweep back. 
>>
>> [image: Screenshot 2023-08-25 at 3.30.59 PM.png]
>>
>> The *Ortho* bars are very flexy and the long sweep back requires a 12cm 
>> or 13cm stem to get them far enough away from you. This will depend on how 
>> big your frames are. They're 69cm wide, mine measure 29" outside to 
>> outside. I sometimes struggle to fit the bars through my shed door but it's 
>> only a 2-8 (32") door. I think on a smaller frame they might teeter on true 
>> absurdity. I've found mine to be overall pretty comfortable though not 
>> life-changing. I won't rant or rave about them. I think I'd be just as 
>> happy with the Billie bars. The Ortho is based on a set of Bosco bars that 
>> Ron bent and flattened out, you can sort of see it in their overall shape. 
>> Here's a picture of the bike with the Ortho bars. 
>>
>> [image: Appaloosa-updates-3-scaled.jpg]
>>
>> Here's a quick overlay with my Billie bars strapped to my Ortho bars for 
>> comparison. 
>>
>> [image: IMG_7187.JPG]
>>
>> The last round of Orthos were out of stock for over a year and then 
>> quickly sold out. I haven't heard any rumors about how soon Crust will have 
>> another shipment in. If they're unavailable I think the Billies would be 
>> worthwhile. 
>>
>> Best of luck and let us know what you do! 
>>
>> Eric
>>
>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>>
>>> Hi there,
>>>
>>> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
>>> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
>>> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
>>> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>>>
>>> Thanks hive mind!
>>>
>>>  
>>>
>> -- 
>>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
>>
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/e9ca6328-ab3c-4411-a373-ead7e04af8a7n%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>

-- 
You received this message because you are 

[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[exliontamer]

The Albatross is my favorite upright bar. I'm a fairly tall guy with fairly 
big hands and it really only has 1 1/2 hand positions for me but I love the 
feel of it. It's stiff enough for trails, upright enough to commute on, 
etc. They live on my older Toyo Atlantis. I do think the newer revisions 
like the Billie work a lot better for newer Rivs with longer top tubes. The 
Billie in particular is incredible. It would just have too much sweepback 
for me on the Atlantis without using a comically long stem and I would lose 
that forward bend position without having to lean a lot.
As to Ortho bars I don't know how well they work for smaller statured 
riders. I just put a pair on my Cheviot and they feel good out of the gate 
but for someone who doesn't have broad shoulders they could be overkill. 
On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 11:22:34 AM UTC-5 Glen wrote:

> I'm a Billie Bar convert thanks to a kind list member and prefer them for 
> the extra hand position in front of the brake levers. Yes they could look 
> nicer with some extra rise, I'd prefer to look at a swooped up bar than a 
> tall stem but that doesn't impact my ride only my gaze when looking at my 
> bike instead of riding it. 
>
> Regarding the usability of the front hand position. I find myself there 
> when I need one of two things, getting out of the wind while fighting a 
> head wind or giving myself a good long stretch while still seated. With a 
> 13cm stem and Billies I can get a really good stretch without getting off 
> the bike. 
>
> FWIW my Billies are on a 64cm Atlantis
>
> On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 6:00:25 PM UTC+2 kirkebc...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> I've been riding Billie bars on my 90s Novara mtb for about two years and 
>> absolutely love them for all the reasons Eric mentioned. 
>> I have two critiques: I wish they had a little bit more rise and they 
>> just aren't quite as aesthetically appealing as Albatross bars, which just 
>> seem to have a smoother overall curvature and shape. I'd love it if someone 
>> made a handlebar that was an Albatross with essentially the same width and 
>> extended sweep back of the Billie bars. 
>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 2:34:41 PM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Hi David — I've run Albatross, Billie and Ortho bars on different bikes 
>>> and have enjoyed them all. I think that the Billies are the sweet spot, 
>>> more sweep back and wider than the Albatross and not out there in mutant 
>>> territory like the Orthos. 
>>>
>>> All three bars have a similar shape but each has more sweep back than 
>>> the next and they get wider along the scale as well. I do like having more 
>>> sweep back to accommodate levers, thumb-mounted shifters *and *to have 
>>> a nice long grip position in the hooks which I find good for spirited 
>>> riding and climbing out of the saddle. 
>>>
>>> I don't think I'll run *Albatross* bars again, despite their beauty and 
>>> the classic shape. Just not enough room for levers, thumb shifters and the 
>>> hooks grip position for me. I'd consider it with bar end shifters but don't 
>>> see myself running swept back bars and bar-ends together anytime soon. The 
>>> image below, from Rivendell Catalog No. 20, is how I fell in love with the 
>>> Albatross bar. 
>>>
>>> [image: Screenshot 2023-08-25 at 3.12.33 PM.png]
>>>
>>> I don't have any pictures handy but I ran mine just like this on my 
>>> Surly LHT. 
>>>
>>> I had the *Billie* bars on my Appaloosa for a while before I swapped to 
>>> the Ortho bars. Great hooks position, nice shape, plenty of sweep back. 
>>>
>>> [image: Screenshot 2023-08-25 at 3.30.59 PM.png]
>>>
>>> The *Ortho* bars are very flexy and the long sweep back requires a 12cm 
>>> or 13cm stem to get them far enough away from you. This will depend on how 
>>> big your frames are. They're 69cm wide, mine measure 29" outside to 
>>> outside. I sometimes struggle to fit the bars through my shed door but it's 
>>> only a 2-8 (32") door. I think on a smaller frame they might teeter on true 
>>> absurdity. I've found mine to be overall pretty comfortable though not 
>>> life-changing. I won't rant or rave about them. I think I'd be just as 
>>> happy with the Billie bars. The Ortho is based on a set of Bosco bars that 
>>> Ron bent and flattened out, you can sort of see it in their overall shape. 
>>> Here's a picture of the bike with the Ortho bars. 
>>>
>>> [image: Appaloosa-updates-3-scaled.jpg]
>>>
>>> Here's a quick overlay with my Billie bars strapped to my Ortho bars for 
>>> comparison. 
>>>
>>> [image: IMG_7187.JPG]
>>>
>>> The last round of Orthos were out of stock for over a year and then 
>>> quickly sold out. I haven't heard any rumors about how soon Crust will have 
>>> another shipment in. If they're unavailable I think the Billies would be 
>>> worthwhile. 
>>>
>>> Best of luck and let us know what you do! 
>>>
>>> Eric
>>>
>>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>>>
 Hi there,

 

[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Glen]

I'm a Billie Bar convert thanks to a kind list member and prefer them for 
the extra hand position in front of the brake levers. Yes they could look 
nicer with some extra rise, I'd prefer to look at a swooped up bar than a 
tall stem but that doesn't impact my ride only my gaze when looking at my 
bike instead of riding it. 

Regarding the usability of the front hand position. I find myself there 
when I need one of two things, getting out of the wind while fighting a 
head wind or giving myself a good long stretch while still seated. With a 
13cm stem and Billies I can get a really good stretch without getting off 
the bike. 

FWIW my Billies are on a 64cm Atlantis

On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 6:00:25 PM UTC+2 kirkebc...@gmail.com wrote:

> I've been riding Billie bars on my 90s Novara mtb for about two years and 
> absolutely love them for all the reasons Eric mentioned. 
> I have two critiques: I wish they had a little bit more rise and they just 
> aren't quite as aesthetically appealing as Albatross bars, which just seem 
> to have a smoother overall curvature and shape. I'd love it if someone made 
> a handlebar that was an Albatross with essentially the same width and 
> extended sweep back of the Billie bars. 
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 2:34:41 PM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Hi David — I've run Albatross, Billie and Ortho bars on different bikes 
>> and have enjoyed them all. I think that the Billies are the sweet spot, 
>> more sweep back and wider than the Albatross and not out there in mutant 
>> territory like the Orthos. 
>>
>> All three bars have a similar shape but each has more sweep back than the 
>> next and they get wider along the scale as well. I do like having more 
>> sweep back to accommodate levers, thumb-mounted shifters *and *to have a 
>> nice long grip position in the hooks which I find good for spirited riding 
>> and climbing out of the saddle. 
>>
>> I don't think I'll run *Albatross* bars again, despite their beauty and 
>> the classic shape. Just not enough room for levers, thumb shifters and the 
>> hooks grip position for me. I'd consider it with bar end shifters but don't 
>> see myself running swept back bars and bar-ends together anytime soon. The 
>> image below, from Rivendell Catalog No. 20, is how I fell in love with the 
>> Albatross bar. 
>>
>> [image: Screenshot 2023-08-25 at 3.12.33 PM.png]
>>
>> I don't have any pictures handy but I ran mine just like this on my Surly 
>> LHT. 
>>
>> I had the *Billie* bars on my Appaloosa for a while before I swapped to 
>> the Ortho bars. Great hooks position, nice shape, plenty of sweep back. 
>>
>> [image: Screenshot 2023-08-25 at 3.30.59 PM.png]
>>
>> The *Ortho* bars are very flexy and the long sweep back requires a 12cm 
>> or 13cm stem to get them far enough away from you. This will depend on how 
>> big your frames are. They're 69cm wide, mine measure 29" outside to 
>> outside. I sometimes struggle to fit the bars through my shed door but it's 
>> only a 2-8 (32") door. I think on a smaller frame they might teeter on true 
>> absurdity. I've found mine to be overall pretty comfortable though not 
>> life-changing. I won't rant or rave about them. I think I'd be just as 
>> happy with the Billie bars. The Ortho is based on a set of Bosco bars that 
>> Ron bent and flattened out, you can sort of see it in their overall shape. 
>> Here's a picture of the bike with the Ortho bars. 
>>
>> [image: Appaloosa-updates-3-scaled.jpg]
>>
>> Here's a quick overlay with my Billie bars strapped to my Ortho bars for 
>> comparison. 
>>
>> [image: IMG_7187.JPG]
>>
>> The last round of Orthos were out of stock for over a year and then 
>> quickly sold out. I haven't heard any rumors about how soon Crust will have 
>> another shipment in. If they're unavailable I think the Billies would be 
>> worthwhile. 
>>
>> Best of luck and let us know what you do! 
>>
>> Eric
>>
>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>>
>>> Hi there,
>>>
>>> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
>>> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
>>> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
>>> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>>>
>>> Thanks hive mind!
>>>
>>>  
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Kirke Campbell]

I've been riding Billie bars on my 90s Novara mtb for about two years and 
absolutely love them for all the reasons Eric mentioned. 
I have two critiques: I wish they had a little bit more rise and they just 
aren't quite as aesthetically appealing as Albatross bars, which just seem 
to have a smoother overall curvature and shape. I'd love it if someone made 
a handlebar that was an Albatross with essentially the same width and 
extended sweep back of the Billie bars. 
On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 2:34:41 PM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com wrote:

> Hi David — I've run Albatross, Billie and Ortho bars on different bikes 
> and have enjoyed them all. I think that the Billies are the sweet spot, 
> more sweep back and wider than the Albatross and not out there in mutant 
> territory like the Orthos. 
>
> All three bars have a similar shape but each has more sweep back than the 
> next and they get wider along the scale as well. I do like having more 
> sweep back to accommodate levers, thumb-mounted shifters *and *to have a 
> nice long grip position in the hooks which I find good for spirited riding 
> and climbing out of the saddle. 
>
> I don't think I'll run *Albatross* bars again, despite their beauty and 
> the classic shape. Just not enough room for levers, thumb shifters and the 
> hooks grip position for me. I'd consider it with bar end shifters but don't 
> see myself running swept back bars and bar-ends together anytime soon. The 
> image below, from Rivendell Catalog No. 20, is how I fell in love with the 
> Albatross bar. 
>
> [image: Screenshot 2023-08-25 at 3.12.33 PM.png]
>
> I don't have any pictures handy but I ran mine just like this on my Surly 
> LHT. 
>
> I had the *Billie* bars on my Appaloosa for a while before I swapped to 
> the Ortho bars. Great hooks position, nice shape, plenty of sweep back. 
>
> [image: Screenshot 2023-08-25 at 3.30.59 PM.png]
>
> The *Ortho* bars are very flexy and the long sweep back requires a 12cm 
> or 13cm stem to get them far enough away from you. This will depend on how 
> big your frames are. They're 69cm wide, mine measure 29" outside to 
> outside. I sometimes struggle to fit the bars through my shed door but it's 
> only a 2-8 (32") door. I think on a smaller frame they might teeter on true 
> absurdity. I've found mine to be overall pretty comfortable though not 
> life-changing. I won't rant or rave about them. I think I'd be just as 
> happy with the Billie bars. The Ortho is based on a set of Bosco bars that 
> Ron bent and flattened out, you can sort of see it in their overall shape. 
> Here's a picture of the bike with the Ortho bars. 
>
> [image: Appaloosa-updates-3-scaled.jpg]
>
> Here's a quick overlay with my Billie bars strapped to my Ortho bars for 
> comparison. 
>
> [image: IMG_7187.JPG]
>
> The last round of Orthos were out of stock for over a year and then 
> quickly sold out. I haven't heard any rumors about how soon Crust will have 
> another shipment in. If they're unavailable I think the Billies would be 
> worthwhile. 
>
> Best of luck and let us know what you do! 
>
> Eric
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
>> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
>> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
>> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>>
>> Thanks hive mind!
>>
>>  
>>
>

-- 
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Re: [RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Johnny Alien]

My problem with a sweptback extending forward before coming back is that, 
yes, it offers a hand position in front of the stem similar to drops but 
the stems are so long to accommodate the sweepback that the forward 
position is way to far out to be really useful.

On Saturday, August 26, 2023 at 8:19:40 AM UTC-4 mrg...@gmail.com wrote:

> One thing about Albatross bars is the bend extends forward enough to have 
> a hand position ahead of the stem clamp. This is something I miss on the 
> other sweepy bars. 
>
> Anyway I am having fun experimenting with the Rons bars. Based on the 
> metric of how much of a Big Dumb Smile I have on my face while riding, the 
> super wide bars are great. Not sure if it's just a novelty and will wear 
> off eventually. It is kind of silly in a good way how big they are. I did 
> have to buy a new stem (11mm) and it could even be longer.
>
> Mike in Austin
>
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 8:07:13 PM UTC-5 eliot...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I have some new silver Ortho bars that I don’t really have a use for. DM 
>> me if you want them. Also have some other goodies (XTR m960 9 speed 
>> shifters with aluminum triggers, REAL design brake levers, Ritchey Force 
>> 130mm stem etc) 
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 25, 2023 at 5:50 PM Eric Marth  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi David — You've got a big old LHT and you're quite tall so I'd say the 
>>> wide bars will do you well. The Trucker looks like a great ride! 
>>>
>>> After first suggesting Billie bars I'd like to make and amendment and 
>>> change to the Toscos, I'd say snag some from Riv and if you don't like them 
>>> you can sell them here quick and easy, I would think. As to the What Bars 
>>> overlay, yeah, the Billie and Albatross bars are quite similar. 
>>>  
>>> There might be a chance some Ortho bars pop up here or on the Crust 
>>> classifieds sometime soon, I'm sure a fair number of people bought them 
>>> without a specific use in mind. But it'll be a seller's market with others 
>>> who missed out ready to pounce. 
>>>
>>> @DavidP makes a good point about the Ortho bars — they are not bar-end 
>>> compatible. You wouldn't want bar ends on 'em anyway, too much opportunity 
>>> for conflict. Dave makes a good point about your existing shifters being 
>>> compatible with the Riv shifter mounts. Soma and VO both sell some 
>>> Silver-compatible mounts as well but they are not quite as good as the ones 
>>> from Riv, they don't have as many options for lever positioning. I think 
>>> the Riv ones have 16 positions, the others have less. 
>>>
>>> My favorite thumb shifters are the Suntour Power Thumb shifters. 
>>> Frustratingly expensive on eBay most of the time but some of the time they 
>>> pop up at a reasonable price. Real nice when reverse mounted. 
>>>
>>> [image: Screen Shot 2023-08-25 at 8.37.27 PM.png]
>>>
>>> I don't have any videos or builds in the queue but thanks for asking! 
>>>
>>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 8:03:07 PM UTC-4 Michael Connors wrote:
>>>

 Blue Lug carries the Nitto Kite, which is essentially an albatross with 
 only 40 degree sweep. Width is 630 and rise is about 1 inch. 


 [image: nitto_kite.jpg]

 -- 
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[David Pulsipher]

Anyone have experience with the Velo Orange Granola Bar? Looks really close 
to the family.

https://velo-orange.com/products/granola-bar?_pos=1&_sid=492f7836c&_ss=r

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 5:20:12 PM UTC-6 David Pulsipher wrote:

> That's a great recommendation re: Toscos - and with availability. Thank 
> you!
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 4:24:19 PM UTC-6 brok...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I have both Tosco and Orthos, and they are both very very similar bars. 
>> Orthos have gentler curves… and of course the clamp diameter… but that’s 
>> about the only difference. Aside from stem use, you’re not going to see 
>> much difference in those two.
>>
>> On Aug 25, 2023, at 3:53 PM, 'Sean, PNW' via RBW Owners Bunch <
>> rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>
>> https://whatbars.com/
>>
>>
>>
>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 12:37:56 PM UTC-7 DavidP wrote:
>>
>>> We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and 
>>> recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross bars 
>>> on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with 
>>> wider tires that see more dirt. 
>>>
>>> The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross 
>>> throughout the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far 
>>> forward as the Albatross).
>>>
>>> The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
>>> wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
>>> except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.
>>>
>>> Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) is 
>>> the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
>>> them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.
>>>
>>> What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?
>>>
>>> -Dave
>>>
>>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>>>
 Hi there,

 I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
 immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
 much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
 would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.

 Thanks hive mind!

  

>>> -- 
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[David Pulsipher]

That's a great recommendation re: Toscos - and with availability. Thank you!

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 4:24:19 PM UTC-6 brok...@gmail.com wrote:

> I have both Tosco and Orthos, and they are both very very similar bars. 
> Orthos have gentler curves… and of course the clamp diameter… but that’s 
> about the only difference. Aside from stem use, you’re not going to see 
> much difference in those two.
>
> On Aug 25, 2023, at 3:53 PM, 'Sean, PNW' via RBW Owners Bunch <
> rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>
> https://whatbars.com/
>
>
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 12:37:56 PM UTC-7 DavidP wrote:
>
>> We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and 
>> recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross bars 
>> on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with 
>> wider tires that see more dirt. 
>>
>> The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross 
>> throughout the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far 
>> forward as the Albatross).
>>
>> The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
>> wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
>> except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.
>>
>> Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) is 
>> the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
>> them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.
>>
>> What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?
>>
>> -Dave
>>
>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>>
>>> Hi there,
>>>
>>> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
>>> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
>>> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
>>> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>>>
>>> Thanks hive mind!
>>>
>>>  
>>>
>> -- 
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Brian Turner]

I have both Tosco and Orthos, and they are both very very similar bars. Orthos have gentler curves… and of course the clamp diameter… but that’s about the only difference. Aside from stem use, you’re not going to see much difference in those two.On Aug 25, 2023, at 3:53 PM, 'Sean, PNW' via RBW Owners Bunch  wrote:https://whatbars.com/On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 12:37:56 PM UTC-7 DavidP wrote:We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross bars on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with wider tires that see more dirt. The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross throughout the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far forward as the Albatross).The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) is the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?-DaveOn Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:Hi there,I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.Thanks hive mind! 



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[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Mackenzy Albright]

I've found my sweet spot of swept back bars with the 54cm width range. I 
really like the fit of albatross, loscos, and chocomoose. I found toscos 
(and kind of bosco) to be too wide and somewhat bothersome to my shoulder 
and neck issues.  

I really like how tosco and ortho looks, but am personally not in the least 
tempted. 

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 3:05:07 PM UTC-7 DavidP wrote:

> David - it looks like your bar ends are Silver2s? If so Riv has Silver 
> shifter thumb mounts 
>  in 
> stock - you could just move the shifters from the bar end pods to the thumb 
> mounts.
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 5:41:09 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>
>> Thanks for all the suggestions guys. Eric - when I put the Albatross and 
>> Billie on top of each other on Whatbars, they look almost identical in 
>> width, just with a little more grip area which in turn makes them slightly 
>> wider. I'm actually ok on grip area, just looking for more width in 
>> general. I hear you on the bar-ends - I'm currently using the rivendell bar 
>> ends and would likely convert them to thumbies. Might have to scour the 
>> interweb to see if anyone is selling them, bummer they are sold out.
>>
>> While I have you, when do we get your next video? ; )
>>
>>
>>
>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 3:26:14 PM UTC-6 Paul M wrote:
>>
>>> Having used the Albatross and Choco-moose handlebars for years and 
>>> enjoying them, I recently put the Sycip Singles bar on my Kona Dr. Dew. I 
>>> really like the extra width (650mm) and sweep (45 degree) of this bar. It 
>>> has 200mm of straight grip area, unlike the Ortho and Tosco that don't have 
>>> enough grip length before the bend for spreading out the brake and shifter 
>>> controls. I would ride gravel but not mtb with these bars. Available on 
>>> Soma Fabrication's web site.
>>>
>>> On Friday, 25 August 2023 at 13:03:51 UTC-7 David Pulsipher wrote:
>>>
 Man Eric - what an epistle! Truly you have given me some deep things to 
 ponder.
 Right now I was thinking of putting them on my Surly Long Haul Trucker 
 - it's a 62cm. I'm 6'4 (and full of muscles).

 https://www.instagram.com/p/Ch7Y77ruZob/?img_index=1

 I ride 45 schwalbe marathons, but am up-sizing to 47's shortly.

 I use it for a commuter and touring set up - and ride about about 32 
 miles daily on my commute. Have been intrigued by the wider set up.

 On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:37:56 PM UTC-6 DavidP wrote:

> We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, 
> and recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the 
> Albatross 
> bars on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes 
> with wider tires that see more dirt. 
>
> The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross 
> throughout the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far 
> forward as the Albatross).
>
> The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
> wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
> except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.
>
> Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) 
> is the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
> them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.
>
> What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?
>
> -Dave
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love 
>> it immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going 
>> wider, 
>> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
>> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>>
>> Thanks hive mind!
>>
>>  
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[DavidP]

David - it looks like your bar ends are Silver2s? If so Riv has Silver 
shifter thumb mounts 
 in 
stock - you could just move the shifters from the bar end pods to the thumb 
mounts.

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 5:41:09 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:

> Thanks for all the suggestions guys. Eric - when I put the Albatross and 
> Billie on top of each other on Whatbars, they look almost identical in 
> width, just with a little more grip area which in turn makes them slightly 
> wider. I'm actually ok on grip area, just looking for more width in 
> general. I hear you on the bar-ends - I'm currently using the rivendell bar 
> ends and would likely convert them to thumbies. Might have to scour the 
> interweb to see if anyone is selling them, bummer they are sold out.
>
> While I have you, when do we get your next video? ; )
>
>
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 3:26:14 PM UTC-6 Paul M wrote:
>
>> Having used the Albatross and Choco-moose handlebars for years and 
>> enjoying them, I recently put the Sycip Singles bar on my Kona Dr. Dew. I 
>> really like the extra width (650mm) and sweep (45 degree) of this bar. It 
>> has 200mm of straight grip area, unlike the Ortho and Tosco that don't have 
>> enough grip length before the bend for spreading out the brake and shifter 
>> controls. I would ride gravel but not mtb with these bars. Available on 
>> Soma Fabrication's web site.
>>
>> On Friday, 25 August 2023 at 13:03:51 UTC-7 David Pulsipher wrote:
>>
>>> Man Eric - what an epistle! Truly you have given me some deep things to 
>>> ponder.
>>> Right now I was thinking of putting them on my Surly Long Haul Trucker - 
>>> it's a 62cm. I'm 6'4 (and full of muscles).
>>>
>>> https://www.instagram.com/p/Ch7Y77ruZob/?img_index=1
>>>
>>> I ride 45 schwalbe marathons, but am up-sizing to 47's shortly.
>>>
>>> I use it for a commuter and touring set up - and ride about about 32 
>>> miles daily on my commute. Have been intrigued by the wider set up.
>>>
>>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:37:56 PM UTC-6 DavidP wrote:
>>>
 We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and 
 recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross 
 bars 
 on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with 
 wider tires that see more dirt. 

 The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross 
 throughout the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far 
 forward as the Albatross).

 The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
 wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
 except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.

 Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) 
 is the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
 them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.

 What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?

 -Dave

 On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:

> Hi there,
>
> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love 
> it immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going 
> wider, 
> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>
> Thanks hive mind!
>
>  
>


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[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[David Pulsipher]

Thanks for all the suggestions guys. Eric - when I put the Albatross and 
Billie on top of each other on Whatbars, they look almost identical in 
width, just with a little more grip area which in turn makes them slightly 
wider. I'm actually ok on grip area, just looking for more width in 
general. I hear you on the bar-ends - I'm currently using the rivendell bar 
ends and would likely convert them to thumbies. Might have to scour the 
interweb to see if anyone is selling them, bummer they are sold out.

While I have you, when do we get your next video? ; )



On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 3:26:14 PM UTC-6 Paul M wrote:

> Having used the Albatross and Choco-moose handlebars for years and 
> enjoying them, I recently put the Sycip Singles bar on my Kona Dr. Dew. I 
> really like the extra width (650mm) and sweep (45 degree) of this bar. It 
> has 200mm of straight grip area, unlike the Ortho and Tosco that don't have 
> enough grip length before the bend for spreading out the brake and shifter 
> controls. I would ride gravel but not mtb with these bars. Available on 
> Soma Fabrication's web site.
>
> On Friday, 25 August 2023 at 13:03:51 UTC-7 David Pulsipher wrote:
>
>> Man Eric - what an epistle! Truly you have given me some deep things to 
>> ponder.
>> Right now I was thinking of putting them on my Surly Long Haul Trucker - 
>> it's a 62cm. I'm 6'4 (and full of muscles).
>>
>> https://www.instagram.com/p/Ch7Y77ruZob/?img_index=1
>>
>> I ride 45 schwalbe marathons, but am up-sizing to 47's shortly.
>>
>> I use it for a commuter and touring set up - and ride about about 32 
>> miles daily on my commute. Have been intrigued by the wider set up.
>>
>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:37:56 PM UTC-6 DavidP wrote:
>>
>>> We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and 
>>> recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross bars 
>>> on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with 
>>> wider tires that see more dirt. 
>>>
>>> The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross 
>>> throughout the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far 
>>> forward as the Albatross).
>>>
>>> The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
>>> wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
>>> except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.
>>>
>>> Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) is 
>>> the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
>>> them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.
>>>
>>> What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?
>>>
>>> -Dave
>>>
>>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>>>
 Hi there,

 I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
 immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
 much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
 would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.

 Thanks hive mind!

  

>>>

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[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[DavidP]

Great looking LHT - wider bars will fit right in on that rig. You may want 
to consider a longer stem to avoid knee contact, also Orthos are not bar 
end shifter compatible so you'd need to switch the shifters to thumb mounts 
or something.

-Dave

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 4:03:51 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:

> Man Eric - what an epistle! Truly you have given me some deep things to 
> ponder.
> Right now I was thinking of putting them on my Surly Long Haul Trucker - 
> it's a 62cm. I'm 6'4 (and full of muscles).
>
> https://www.instagram.com/p/Ch7Y77ruZob/?img_index=1
>
> I ride 45 schwalbe marathons, but am up-sizing to 47's shortly.
>
> I use it for a commuter and touring set up - and ride about about 32 miles 
> daily on my commute. Have been intrigued by the wider set up.
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:37:56 PM UTC-6 DavidP wrote:
>
>> We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and 
>> recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross bars 
>> on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with 
>> wider tires that see more dirt. 
>>
>> The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross 
>> throughout the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far 
>> forward as the Albatross).
>>
>> The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
>> wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
>> except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.
>>
>> Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) is 
>> the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
>> them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.
>>
>> What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?
>>
>> -Dave
>>
>> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>>
>>> Hi there,
>>>
>>> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
>>> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
>>> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
>>> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>>>
>>> Thanks hive mind!
>>>
>>>  
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[David Pulsipher]

Man Eric - what an epistle! Truly you have given me some deep things to 
ponder.
Right now I was thinking of putting them on my Surly Long Haul Trucker - 
it's a 62cm. I'm 6'4 (and full of muscles).

https://www.instagram.com/p/Ch7Y77ruZob/?img_index=1

I ride 45 schwalbe marathons, but am up-sizing to 47's shortly.

I use it for a commuter and touring set up - and ride about about 32 miles 
daily on my commute. Have been intrigued by the wider set up.

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:37:56 PM UTC-6 DavidP wrote:

> We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and 
> recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross bars 
> on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with 
> wider tires that see more dirt. 
>
> The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross throughout 
> the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far forward as 
> the Albatross).
>
> The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
> wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
> except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.
>
> Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) is 
> the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
> them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.
>
> What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?
>
> -Dave
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
>> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
>> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
>> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>>
>> Thanks hive mind!
>>
>>  
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

['Sean, PNW' via RBW Owners Bunch]

https://whatbars.com/

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 12:37:56 PM UTC-7 DavidP wrote:

> We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and 
> recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross bars 
> on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with 
> wider tires that see more dirt. 
>
> The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross throughout 
> the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far forward as 
> the Albatross).
>
> The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
> wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
> except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.
>
> Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) is 
> the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
> them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.
>
> What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?
>
> -Dave
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
>> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
>> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
>> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>>
>> Thanks hive mind!
>>
>>  
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[Eric Marth]

David: Good point on the 65cm Toscos, forgot about those! 

Other monster swept back bars: the Albacore bar 

 
from Hope has on offer, the Golden Pliers x Sim Works x Nitto Ramble Bar 
 and Doom 
Bars  has some stock models but I've heard 
they do custom sizes, shapes and bends. 

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 3:37:56 PM UTC-4 DavidP wrote:

> We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and 
> recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross bars 
> on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with 
> wider tires that see more dirt. 
>
> The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross throughout 
> the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far forward as 
> the Albatross).
>
> The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
> wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
> except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.
>
> Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) is 
> the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
> them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.
>
> What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?
>
> -Dave
>
> On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:
>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
>> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
>> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
>> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>>
>> Thanks hive mind!
>>
>>  
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Ron's Ortho vs. Nitto Albatross

[DavidP]

We have two bikes with Albatross bars, a 65cm Tosco on my Platypus, and 
recently picked up an Ortho bar for another bike. I like the Albatross bars 
on roadish bikes and wider bars like the Orthos and Toscos on bikes with 
wider tires that see more dirt. 

The 69cm Orthos are significantly wider than the 55cm Albatross throughout 
the grip range and come back further (they don't extend as far forward as 
the Albatross).

The Orthos are actually very similar to the 65cm Toscos - just a touch 
wider and with a bit more rise. There'd be nothing in swap between them 
except the stem (26.0 vs 31.8) and some weight.

Another (inexpensive) bar that is very close to the Ortho (and Tosco) is 
the Wald 896. I mocked up my build using these and was very happy with 
them, though the price difference is apparent in the finish and weight.

What bike would they be going on? What size tires and how is it used?

-Dave

On Friday, August 25, 2023 at 1:51:07 PM UTC-4 David Pulsipher wrote:

> Hi there,
>
> I've been using the Nitto Albatross now for over 13 years - and love it 
> immensely. But recently I've been intrigued by the idea of going wider, 
> much wider. Was wondering if any one had made a similar transition and 
> would mind sharing their thoughts, reflections.
>
> Thanks hive mind!
>
>  
>

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