Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[jay]

Back to the original question. 

1. FXR/A has generator support, turn it on if its not on.  And the FXR/A has a 
generator setting for AC input that and I don’t really understand how smooths 
out this issue, but it can.  
I had a issue somewhat like this, 8Kw radian and 12kw genset.  Radian or 
generator worked the stove ( gas stove, just the electronic controls and some 
LED lights).  But when the inverter was charging, the stove wouldn’t work. 
Setting it to GENERATOR for ACINPUT solved the issue.  Further programming 
would be to check that the low AC volts isn’t too low.  I set it around 108 as 
the low usually, and that might be too low for this unit, so try setting that 
up higher. 

2. possible programing issues might be solved or at least tested by turning 
down the AC generator input, or charger amps.  Its my first test to confirm if 
the generator is being overloaded.  Also try with reduced loads. 

3. has the generate been serviced lately?  oil change, air filter, etc.  Often 
the reason for things not working well.

4. installing capacitors would be my last option. 

As someone who’s run a full sized house for 14 years with a FX 3524, and a 
honda EU2000 as my only generator, I can say categorically that it works just 
fine. Washer, refrigerator, freezer, all the  standard appliances.  
Would a larger generator speed up the charging, yes, does this work yes.  Would 
a larger inverter help, for me only with battery charging, not with loads, I’ve 
got no issues with running my house.  

I don’t know why this person has a 2812.  I know of lots of people who have an 
existing system that works well for them, and really only upgrade to pure sine 
because of the new appliances.  And with more high efficiency appliances:  
battery powered vacuum cleaners and tools:  front load soft start washers, 
water pumps, variable compressor refrigerators, etc  more and more can be done 
with less and less inverter power.  

Yea sure, if you want more power, then totally agree with going 24/48v is the 
way to go. 

Let us know what the fix turns out to be.

Cheers,

jay 

peltz power





> On Aug 17, 2020, at 12:06 PM, Ray  wrote:
> 
> I'll third the recommendation of a larger generator.  I quit trying the tiny 
> genset setup 15 years ago.  My rule of thumb is the genset needs to be 50% 
> larger than the inverter rating (6kw for a 4 kw inverter) plus the altitude 
> derating.  Here in Colorado, you pretty much need a 8 kw genset with a 4 kw 
> inverter.  Besides altitude, most gensets do not run right or put out clean 
> power at full load.  
> 
> I've recently found that fuel efficiency is not as bad as you might think for 
> the bigger gen sets running at 50% rating.  The tiny bit of extra cost and 
> fuel consumption is a small price to pay for reliable back up power. 
> 
> Ray Walters
> Remote Solar
> 303 505-8760
> On 8/17/20 12:05 PM, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar wrote:
>> Many of these issues also were solved with an inverter that had gen support 
>> or load shave.
>> 
>> Time for a new inverter or a generator that is twice the load wattage. This 
>> was common back in the day and as Steve said, some cases just can't be 
>> fixed. Another reason many have abandoned 12v inverter/chargers except for 
>> RV use.
>> 
>>  
>> Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
>> "we go where powerlines don't"
>> http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/ 
>> e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net 
>> text 209 813 0060
>> On Mon, 17 Aug 2020 10:54:11 -0700, Steve Higgins  
>>  wrote:
>> 
>>> Wrenches, 
>>> 
>>> When the inverter charger charges the battery bank and runs loads this can 
>>> affect the harmonics of the generator output. 
>>> 
>>> Not much you can do about it other than putting in a larger generator to 
>>> handle the inverter/charging load along with the loads of the system, and 
>>> even in some of those cases depending on the generator dosn't even fix 
>>> that. 
>>> 
>>> I have seen some successful with filter caps on the output / Input of the 
>>> inverter, but that is pretty hit an miss..
>>>  
>>> 
>>>  
>>> 
>>>  
>>> Steve Higgins ⋅ Technical Services Manager
>>> t +1.902.597.4020  m +1.206.790.5840
>>> f +1.902.597.8447  e st...@surrette.com 
>>>    
>>>   
>>>   
>>>  
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Become a Certified PV Professional. Register for NABCEP CEC 2020 
>>>  using promo code 20RBE 
>>>  
>>> CONFIDENTIALITY: The information transmitted herein is intended only for 
>>> the addressee and may contain confidential, proprietary and/or privileged 
>>> material. Any unauthorized 

Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Steve Higgins]

Wrenches,

When the inverter charger charges the battery bank and runs loads this can
affect the harmonics of the generator output.

Not much you can do about it other than putting in a larger generator to
handle the inverter/charging load along with the loads of the system, and
even in some of those cases depending on the generator dosn't even fix
that.

I have seen some successful with filter caps on the output / Input of the
inverter, but that is pretty hit an miss..




 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Steve Higgins ⋅ Technical Services Manager
t +1.902.597.4020  m +1.206.790.5840
f +1.902.597.8447  e st...@surrette.com
<#SignatureSanitizer_SafeHtmlFilter_> 
 






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 *using promo code* *20RBE*

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On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 10:42 AM Will White  wrote:

> I've seen that same issue too. I assumed that the battery charging, house
> base loads, and the microwave were too much power for the small generator.
> The voltage drops big time which I assume is what was causing the issue
> with the microwave and most likely with the dryer too.
>
> On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 11:51 AM Dan Fink  wrote:
>
>> I have the same problem at my place, and a couple client's systems, with
>> Magnum inverter/chargers and small ~2-3kw generators (not just Honda). But
>> the problem appliance is microwave ovens, doesn't matter which microwave
>> brand. They run fine straight from the generator, and fine from the
>> inverter with no generator running, but make a strange, loud hum, dim
>> internal light, and food doesn't heat if the generator is also charging the
>> battery bank. I'll try to figure out how to capture a waveform photo with
>> my scopemeter and post it.
>> Dan Fink
>> Executive Director, Buckville Energy Consulting
>> NABCEP PV Associate
>> NABCEP Certified PV System Inspector
>> IREC Certified Instructor™ for:
>> ~ PV Installation Professional
>> ~ Small Wind Installer
>> NABCEP Registered Continuing Education Providers
>> d anbo...@gmail.com
>> 970-672-4342
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 9:37 AM Kent Osterberg 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Matt,
>>>
>>> I haven't looked at what the FXR does to the waveform of a 3000-watt
>>> Honda, but I have used an oscilloscope to look at the waveform of a small
>>> generator while an FX inverter is charging batteries -- it pretty much
>>> makes an ugly mess of the voltage waveform. Not surprised to hear that some
>>> loads don't like to operate when the FXR is charging batteries from a small
>>> generator. The FX charger has a poor power factor and little filtering of
>>> the current waveform, it is a tough load on a small generator. The
>>> generator responds with lots of harmonic voltages and high frequency noise.
>>>
>>> Kent Osterberg
>>> Blue Mountain Solar
>>>
>>>
>>> On 8/15/2020 8:06 AM, Matt Sherald wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello All,
>>>
>>> My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer complaint.  I'm hoping
>>> someone has bumped up against this issue before.
>>>
>>> The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.
>>> Her gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter.
>>> It runs properly on the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed)
>>> It will not run when the gen is on and battery charging is taking place.
>>>
>>> All the other AC loads (including the washing machine) run properly
>>> during battery charging with the gen.
>>> The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit.  The dryer worked as it
>>> should with the Trace during battery charging.
>>>
>>> Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance!
>>>
>>> --
>>> Matt Sherald
>>> PIMBY Energy, LLC
>>> NABCEP Certified Solar 

Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Ray]

I'll third the recommendation of a larger generator.  I quit trying the 
tiny genset setup 15 years ago.  My rule of thumb is the genset needs to 
be 50% larger than the inverter rating (6kw for a 4 kw inverter) plus 
the altitude derating.  Here in Colorado, you pretty much need a 8 kw 
genset with a 4 kw inverter.  Besides altitude, most gensets do not run 
right or put out clean power at full load.


I've recently found that fuel efficiency is not as bad as you might 
think for the bigger gen sets running at 50% rating.  The tiny bit of 
extra cost and fuel consumption is a small price to pay for reliable 
back up power.


Ray Walters
Remote Solar
303 505-8760

On 8/17/20 12:05 PM, Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar wrote:


Many of these issues also were solved with an inverter that had gen 
support or load shave.


Time for a new inverter or a generator that is twice the load wattage. 
This was common back in the day and as Steve said, some cases just 
can't be fixed. Another reason many have abandoned 12v 
inverter/chargers except for RV use.


  
*Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar "we go where powerlines don't" 
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/ e-mail offgridso...@sti.net 
 text 209 813 0060*


On Mon, 17 Aug 2020 10:54:11 -0700, Steve Higgins  
wrote:



Wrenches,

When the inverter charger charges the battery bank and runs loads 
this can affect the harmonics of the generator output.


Not much you can do about it other than putting in a larger 
generator to handle the inverter/charging load along with the loads 
of the system, and even in some of those cases depending on the 
generator dosn't even fix that.


I have seen some successful with filter caps on the output / Input of 
the inverter, but that is pretty hit an miss..




Steve Higgins ⋅ Technical Services Manager
t+1.902.597.4020 m +1.206.790.5840
f+1.902.597.8447 est...@surrette.com 
 
 
 




*Become a Certified PV Professional. Register forNABCEP CEC 2020* 
*using promo code* *20RBE* 



CONFIDENTIALITY: The information transmitted herein is intended only 
for the addressee and may contain confidential, proprietary and/or 
privileged material. Any unauthorized review, distribution or other 
use of or the taking of any action in reliance upon this information 
is prohibited. If you receive this email in error, please contact the 
sender and delete or destroy this message and all copies.



On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 10:42 AM Will White > wrote:


I've seen that same issue too. I assumed that the battery
charging, house base loads, and the microwave were too much power
for the small generator. The voltage drops big time which I
assume is what was causing the issue with the microwave and most
likely with the dryer too.

On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 11:51 AM Dan Fink mailto:danbo...@gmail.com>> wrote:

I have the same problem at my place, and a couple client's
systems, with Magnum inverter/chargers and small ~2-3kw
generators (not just Honda). But the problem appliance is
microwave ovens, doesn't matter which microwave brand. They
run fine straight from the generator, and fine from the
inverter with no generator running, but make a strange, loud
hum, dim internal light, and food doesn't heat if the
generator is also charging the battery bank. I'll try to
figure out how to capture a waveform photo with my scopemeter
and post it.
Dan Fink
Executive Director, Buckville Energy Consulting
NABCEP PV Associate
NABCEP Certified PV System Inspector
IREC Certified Instructor™ for:
~ PV Installation Professional
~ Small Wind Installer
NABCEP Registered Continuing Education Providers
d
anbo...@gmail.com

970-672-4342


On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 9:37 AM Kent Osterberg
mailto:k...@coveoregon.com>> wrote:

Matt,

I haven't looked at what the FXR does to the waveform of
a 3000-watt Honda, but I have used an oscilloscope to
look at the waveform of a small generator while an FX
inverter is charging batteries -- it pretty much makes an
ugly mess of the voltage waveform. Not surprised to hear
that some 

Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar]

Many of these issues also were solved with an inverter that had gen
support or load shave. 

Time for a new inverter or a generator that is
twice the load wattage. This was common back in the day and as Steve said,
some cases just can't be fixed. Another reason many have abandoned 12v
inverter/chargers except for RV use.  

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go
where powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/ [1]
e-mail
offgridso...@sti.net [2]
text 209 813 0060

On Mon, 17 Aug 2020 10:54:11
-0700, Steve Higgins  wrote:  Wrenches, 

When the inverter charger charges
the battery bank and runs loads this can affect the harmonics of the
generator output. 

Not much you can do about it other than putting in a
larger generator to handle the inverter/charging load along with the loads
of the system, and even in some of those cases depending on the generator
dosn't even fix that. 

I have seen some successful with filter caps on the
output / Input of the inverter, but that is pretty hit an miss..   

  
Steve Higgins ⋅ Technical Services Manager  t +1.902.597.4020 m
+1.206.790.5840 f +1.902.597.8447 e st...@surrette.com [4]


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 BECOME A CERTIFIED PV PROFESSIONAL. REGISTER
FOR NABCEP CEC 2020 [10] USING PROMO CODE 20RBE [11]

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 CONFIDENTIALITY: The information transmitted
herein is intended only for the addressee and may contain confidential,
proprietary and/or privileged material. Any unauthorized review,
distribution or other use of or the taking of any action in reliance upon
this information is prohibited. If you receive this email in error, please
contact the sender and delete or destroy this message and all copies.

-

  On Mon, Aug 17, 2020 at 10:42 AM Will White 
wrote:  I've seen that same issue too. I assumed that the battery charging,
house base loads, and the microwave were too much power for the small
generator. The voltage drops big time which I assume is what was causing
the issue with the microwave and most likely with the dryer too.  
  On
Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 11:51 AM Dan Fink  wrote:  I have the same problem at
my place, and a couple client's systems, with Magnum inverter/chargers and
small ~2-3kw generators (not just Honda). But the problem appliance is
microwave ovens, doesn't matter which microwave brand. They run fine
straight from the generator, and fine from the inverter with no generator
running, but make a strange, loud hum, dim internal light, and food doesn't
heat if the generator is also charging the battery bank. I'll try to figure
out how to capture a waveform photo with my scopemeter and post it.
   
Dan Fink  Executive Director, Buckville Energy Consulting NABCEP PV
Associate
 NABCEP Certified PV System Inspector IREC Certified
Instructor(tm) for:  ~ PV Installation Professional ~ Small Wind Installer
NABCEP Registered Continuing Education Providers d [14]anbo...@gmail.com
[15] 970-672-4342  

  On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 9:37 AM Kent Osterberg 
wrote:  Matt,

 I haven't looked at what the FXR does to the waveform of a
3000-watt Honda, but I have used an oscilloscope to look at the waveform of
a small generator while an FX inverter is charging batteries -- it pretty
much makes an ugly mess of the voltage waveform. Not surprised to hear that
some loads don't like to operate when the FXR is charging batteries from a
small generator. The FX charger has a poor power factor and little
filtering of the current waveform, it is a tough load on a small generator.
The generator responds with lots of harmonic voltages and high frequency
noise.

 Kent Osterberg
 Blue Mountain Solar

 On 8/15/2020 8:06 AM, Matt
Sherald wrote:   Hello All,   My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer
complaint. I'm hoping someone has bumped up against this issue before.  
The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.  Her gas clothes
dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter. It runs properly on the Honda gen
(when the inverter is bypassed) It will not run when the gen is on and
battery charging is taking place.   All the other AC loads (including the
washing machine) run properly during battery charging with the gen. The OB
inverter replaced an old Trace unit. The dryer worked as it should with the
Trace during battery charging.   Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance!  
 -- 
 Matt Sherald PIMBY Energy, LLC NABCEP
Certified Solar PV Installer(R) 304-704-5943
  www.getpimby.blogspot.com
[17]
 www.getpimby.com [18] 


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Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Will White]

I've seen that same issue too. I assumed that the battery charging, house
base loads, and the microwave were too much power for the small generator.
The voltage drops big time which I assume is what was causing the issue
with the microwave and most likely with the dryer too.

On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 11:51 AM Dan Fink  wrote:

> I have the same problem at my place, and a couple client's systems, with
> Magnum inverter/chargers and small ~2-3kw generators (not just Honda). But
> the problem appliance is microwave ovens, doesn't matter which microwave
> brand. They run fine straight from the generator, and fine from the
> inverter with no generator running, but make a strange, loud hum, dim
> internal light, and food doesn't heat if the generator is also charging the
> battery bank. I'll try to figure out how to capture a waveform photo with
> my scopemeter and post it.
> Dan Fink
> Executive Director, Buckville Energy Consulting
> NABCEP PV Associate
> NABCEP Certified PV System Inspector
> IREC Certified Instructor™ for:
> ~ PV Installation Professional
> ~ Small Wind Installer
> NABCEP Registered Continuing Education Providers
> d anbo...@gmail.com
> 970-672-4342
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 9:37 AM Kent Osterberg 
> wrote:
>
>> Matt,
>>
>> I haven't looked at what the FXR does to the waveform of a 3000-watt
>> Honda, but I have used an oscilloscope to look at the waveform of a small
>> generator while an FX inverter is charging batteries -- it pretty much
>> makes an ugly mess of the voltage waveform. Not surprised to hear that some
>> loads don't like to operate when the FXR is charging batteries from a small
>> generator. The FX charger has a poor power factor and little filtering of
>> the current waveform, it is a tough load on a small generator. The
>> generator responds with lots of harmonic voltages and high frequency noise.
>>
>> Kent Osterberg
>> Blue Mountain Solar
>>
>>
>> On 8/15/2020 8:06 AM, Matt Sherald wrote:
>>
>> Hello All,
>>
>> My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer complaint.  I'm hoping
>> someone has bumped up against this issue before.
>>
>> The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.
>> Her gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter.
>> It runs properly on the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed)
>> It will not run when the gen is on and battery charging is taking place.
>>
>> All the other AC loads (including the washing machine) run properly
>> during battery charging with the gen.
>> The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit.  The dryer worked as it
>> should with the Trace during battery charging.
>>
>> Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance!
>>
>> --
>> Matt Sherald
>> PIMBY Energy, LLC
>> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
>> 304-704-5943
>>
>> www.getpimby.blogspot.com
>> www.getpimby.com
>>
>>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Mick Abraham]

Hello, Mechanix~ Matt Sherald wrote about his dryer puzzle. I suggest the
run capacitor solution discussed near the bottom of this webpage:

http://mvvikingstar.blogspot.com/2013/03/summery-and-conclusion-compatibility.html

The Wrench List is the Bomb!

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www.abrahamsolar.com

Landline: 970-731-4675
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Jay]

Check power factor, it might be getting pretty poor during charging. 

Jay

Peltz power. 

> On Aug 15, 2020, at 8:06 AM, Matt Sherald  wrote:
> 
> 
> Hello All,
> 
> My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer complaint.  I'm hoping someone 
> has bumped up against this issue before.
> 
> The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.  
> Her gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter.
> It runs properly on the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed)
> It will not run when the gen is on and battery charging is taking place.
> 
> All the other AC loads (including the washing machine) run properly during 
> battery charging with the gen.
> The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit.  The dryer worked as it should 
> with the Trace during battery charging.
> 
> Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance!
> 
> -- 
> Matt Sherald
> PIMBY Energy, LLC
> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
> 304-704-5943
> 
> www.getpimby.blogspot.com
> www.getpimby.com
> 
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Jerry Shafer]

Look at the programming, view the inverter during the charge
Jerry

On Sat, Aug 15, 2020, 8:06 AM Matt Sherald  wrote:

> Hello All,
>
> My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer complaint.  I'm hoping
> someone has bumped up against this issue before.
>
> The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.
> Her gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter.
> It runs properly on the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed)
> It will not run when the gen is on and battery charging is taking place.
>
> All the other AC loads (including the washing machine) run properly during
> battery charging with the gen.
> The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit.  The dryer worked as it should
> with the Trace during battery charging.
>
> Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance!
>
> --
> Matt Sherald
> PIMBY Energy, LLC
> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
> 304-704-5943
>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[William Miller]

Matt/Colleagues:



This could be a case of elevated THD on the voltage waveform during battery
charging.  We wrote a case study on this problem.  See this link
<https://millersolar.com/MillerSolar/case_studies/case_studies.html>, Case
Study number 25.  I hope information contained in this study helps you
resolve this issue.



Miller Solar

17395 Oak Road, Atascadero, CA 93422

805-438-5600

www.millersolar.com

CA Lic. 773985



*From:* RE-wrenches [mailto:re-wrenches-boun...@lists.re-wrenches.org] *On
Behalf Of *Matt Sherald
*Sent:* Saturday, August 15, 2020 8:06 AM
*To:* RE-wrenches
*Subject:* [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery
charging



Hello All,



My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer complaint.  I'm hoping someone
has bumped up against this issue before.



The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.

Her gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter.

It runs properly on the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed)

It will not run when the gen is on and battery charging is taking place.



All the other AC loads (including the washing machine) run properly during
battery charging with the gen.

The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit.  The dryer worked as it should
with the Trace during battery charging.



Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance!


-- 

Matt Sherald

PIMBY Energy, LLC

NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®

304-704-5943

www.getpimby.blogspot.com
www.getpimby.com
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Chris Schaefer]

My bet is these clients are on a budget given the battery voltage and small
inverters. So there probably isn't any PV at the moment. I've been coming
across a lot of these types of systems lately. Came across a Generac 120v,
6kw Eco Gen with 3,500 hours on it! Ouch and the clients just won't add PV.
Yet they pay a gen service company to come out once a month and service the
unit on top of propane cost.

Christopher

On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 12:18 PM Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar <
offgridso...@sti.net> wrote:

> Ouch ! 2812 inverter. As a pro, you need to get them away from 12V IMHO.
>
> A home with appliances needs 24v and 4kw, both minimum.
>
> As Kent said, for now you can't do both gen charging and drying clothes.
> Why do you need a genset this time of year?
>
>
>
> *Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
> "we go where powerlines don't"
> http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/ 
> e-mail  offgridso...@sti.net 
> text 209 813 0060*
>
> On Sat, 15 Aug 2020 11:06:26 -0400, Matt Sherald 
> wrote:
>
> Hello All,
>
> My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer complaint.  I'm hoping
> someone has bumped up against this issue before.
>
> The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.
> Her gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter.
> It runs properly on the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed)
> It will not run when the gen is on and battery charging is taking place.
>
> All the other AC loads (including the washing machine) run properly during
> battery charging with the gen.
> The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit.  The dryer worked as it should
> with the Trace during battery charging.
>
> Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance!
>
> --
> Matt Sherald
> PIMBY Energy, LLC
> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
> 304-704-5943
>
> www.getpimby.blogspot.com
> www.getpimby.com
>
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-- 

Chris Schaefer’s


*Tel/Fax 585-229-2083 or Cell 585-748-1870 *
*5115 South Hill Road ~ Canandaigua New York 14424**www.solarandwindfx.com
 ~ E-mail: ch...@solarandwindfx.com
*


Thomas Jefferson, the author of our great Constitution, once said,
"democracy" will cease to exist when you take away from those who are
willing to work and give to those who would not."
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar]

Ouch ! 2812 inverter. As a pro, you need to get them away from 12V IMHO.


A home with appliances needs 24v and 4kw, both minimum.  

As Kent said,
for now you can't do both gen charging and drying clothes. Why do you need
a genset this time of year?  

Dave Angelini Offgrid Solar
"we go where
powerlines don't"
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/ [1]
e-mail
offgridso...@sti.net [2]
text 209 813 0060

On Sat, 15 Aug 2020 11:06:26
-0400, Matt Sherald  wrote:   Hello All,   My curiosity was piqued by a
recent customer complaint. I'm hoping someone has bumped up against this
issue before.   The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.  Her
gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter. It runs properly on
the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed) It will not run when the gen
is on and battery charging is taking place.   All the other AC loads
(including the washing machine) run properly during battery charging with
the gen. The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit. The dryer worked as it
should with the Trace during battery charging.   Any thoughts are greatly
appreciated. Thanks in advance!  
-- 
 Matt Sherald PIMBY Energy, LLC
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer(R) 304-704-5943


www.getpimby.blogspot.com [3]
www.getpimby.com [4]  

Links:
--
[1]
http://members.sti.net/offgridsolar/
[2] mailto:offgridso...@sti.net
[3]
http://www.getpimby.blogspot.com
[4] http://www.getpimby.com
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Dan Fink]

I have the same problem at my place, and a couple client's systems, with
Magnum inverter/chargers and small ~2-3kw generators (not just Honda). But
the problem appliance is microwave ovens, doesn't matter which microwave
brand. They run fine straight from the generator, and fine from the
inverter with no generator running, but make a strange, loud hum, dim
internal light, and food doesn't heat if the generator is also charging the
battery bank. I'll try to figure out how to capture a waveform photo with
my scopemeter and post it.
Dan Fink
Executive Director, Buckville Energy Consulting
NABCEP PV Associate
NABCEP Certified PV System Inspector
IREC Certified Instructor™ for:
~ PV Installation Professional
~ Small Wind Installer
NABCEP Registered Continuing Education Providers
d anbo...@gmail.com
970-672-4342




On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 9:37 AM Kent Osterberg  wrote:

> Matt,
>
> I haven't looked at what the FXR does to the waveform of a 3000-watt
> Honda, but I have used an oscilloscope to look at the waveform of a small
> generator while an FX inverter is charging batteries -- it pretty much
> makes an ugly mess of the voltage waveform. Not surprised to hear that some
> loads don't like to operate when the FXR is charging batteries from a small
> generator. The FX charger has a poor power factor and little filtering of
> the current waveform, it is a tough load on a small generator. The
> generator responds with lots of harmonic voltages and high frequency noise.
>
> Kent Osterberg
> Blue Mountain Solar
>
>
> On 8/15/2020 8:06 AM, Matt Sherald wrote:
>
> Hello All,
>
> My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer complaint.  I'm hoping
> someone has bumped up against this issue before.
>
> The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.
> Her gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter.
> It runs properly on the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed)
> It will not run when the gen is on and battery charging is taking place.
>
> All the other AC loads (including the washing machine) run properly during
> battery charging with the gen.
> The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit.  The dryer worked as it should
> with the Trace during battery charging.
>
> Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance!
>
> --
> Matt Sherald
> PIMBY Energy, LLC
> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
> 304-704-5943
>
> www.getpimby.blogspot.com
> www.getpimby.com
>
>
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Re: [RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Kent Osterberg]

Matt,

I haven't looked at what the FXR does to the waveform of a 3000-watt 
Honda, but I have used an oscilloscope to look at the waveform of a 
small generator while an FX inverter is charging batteries -- it pretty 
much makes an ugly mess of the voltage waveform. Not surprised to hear 
that some loads don't like to operate when the FXR is charging batteries 
from a small generator. The FX charger has a poor power factor and 
little filtering of the current waveform, it is a tough load on a small 
generator. The generator responds with lots of harmonic voltages and 
high frequency noise.


Kent Osterberg
Blue Mountain Solar


On 8/15/2020 8:06 AM, Matt Sherald wrote:

Hello All,

My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer complaint. I'm hoping 
someone has bumped up against this issue before.


The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.
Her gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter.
It runs properly on the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed)
It will not run when the gen is on and battery charging is taking place.

All the other AC loads (including the washing machine) run properly 
during battery charging with the gen.
The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit.  The dryer worked as it 
should with the Trace during battery charging.


Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance!

--
Matt Sherald
PIMBY Energy, LLC
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
304-704-5943

www.getpimby.blogspot.com 
www.getpimby.com 


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[RE-wrenches] Puzzle: Dryer does not work during FXR battery charging

[Matt Sherald]

Hello All,

My curiosity was piqued by a recent customer complaint.  I'm hoping someone
has bumped up against this issue before.

The customer has a OB FXR2812 and a 3,000W Honda gen.
Her gas clothes dryer runs just fine off the OB inverter.
It runs properly on the Honda gen (when the inverter is bypassed)
It will not run when the gen is on and battery charging is taking place.

All the other AC loads (including the washing machine) run properly during
battery charging with the gen.
The OB inverter replaced an old Trace unit.  The dryer worked as it should
with the Trace during battery charging.

Any thoughts are greatly appreciated.  Thanks in advance!

-- 
Matt Sherald
PIMBY Energy, LLC
NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer®
304-704-5943

www.getpimby.blogspot.com
www.getpimby.com
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