Re: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Running a Mastr II Repeater QRP
I've used these and they work real well: http://www.escalera.com/stairclimbing/index.htm When you are moving something heavy like a repeater cabinet a powered dolly is worth every penny of the rental expense. The 700 lb capacity model costs about $1700 new, and a couple of the local specialty rental companies have them. If you are going to rent one make sure it has the retractable load support option. Mike WA6ILQ At 05:05 PM 08/31/10, you wrote: WE did about the same thing but the cabinet was in the basement and it had to go up a circular staircase. Plus we did not have enough room to keep it away from the wall. So we spent a lot of time taking it apart and then going back together was easier. Much lighter with out everything in it. Butch, KE7FEL/r On Tue, Aug 31, 2010 at 10:21 AM, mailto:dmur...@verizon.netdmur...@verizon.net wrote: Installed a MSTR II VHF repeater in a six foot cabinet on top of a 17 story building. The elevator got me to the 14th floor but it took 4 of us to get it the other 3 flights. It is possible to haul without a hoist. Next time I do something like this I'm going to remove the repeater and power supply and carry the parts, not the whole repeater. ..._._ Aug 31, 2010 01:14:00 AM, mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com wrote: On 8/30/2010 7:01 PM, Paul Plack wrote: I already know I'd love to have a MII, and the bulk won't be an issue getting it home or storing it, but the proposed site is on a rooftop. That part could get interesting. I may need to devise a truss...and something to hoist the repeater, too! (Rimshot.) LOL! Especially if you're using the MASTR II power supply. Be aware that the M2 PS will draw quite a bit of current even at idle... if you're paying the power bill, or care about someone who does... I have one on in my basement for a link all the time, and live with it... :-) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3104 - Release Date: 08/30/10 23:34:00
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Running a Mastr II Repeater QRP
On 8/31/2010 12:34 PM, Chuck Kelsey wrote: Yes, a screwdriver is your friend. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From:dmur...@verizon.net To:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Cc:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2010 12:21 PM Subject: Re: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Running a Mastr II Repeater QRP Installed a MSTR II VHF repeater in a six foot cabinet on top of a 17 story building. The elevator got me to the 14th floor but it took 4 of us to get it the other 3 flights. It is possible to haul without a hoist. Next time I do something like this I'm going to remove the repeater and power supply and carry the parts, not the whole repeater. Try moving one of those Skytel 2-way transmitters up or down a flight of stairs.with 2 people.=:cO
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Duplexers
On 8/31/2010 2:05 PM, ka9qjg wrote: OK Great , Thanks to Everyone who answered , I will sleep better now one less thing to worry about Don KA9QJG Not the same thing, but something else to remember: Mount them vertically! If you mount them horizontally, you run the risk of the rods warping from gravity, which besides detuning, also results in uneven tuning when you try to touch them up again...
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Running a Mastr II Repeater QRP
A screwdriver is your friend... Try going to the repeater site leaving your tools at home. It only takes one stubborn screw to drive you nuts. Fortunately, friends took pity on my stupidity and brought my tools to the bottom of the hill. 10 seconds and the proper tool and life was good. A screw driver can be a major time saver! I won't say I will never do that again but I hope it does not happen. Not to mention my friend that was driving needs to carry tools in his truck! - Original Message - From: wd8chl To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2010 6:14 AM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Running a Mastr II Repeater QRP On 8/31/2010 12:34 PM, Chuck Kelsey wrote: Yes, a screwdriver is your friend. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From:dmur...@verizon.net To:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Cc:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2010 12:21 PM Subject: Re: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Running a Mastr II Repeater QRP Installed a MSTR II VHF repeater in a six foot cabinet on top of a 17 story building. The elevator got me to the 14th floor but it took 4 of us to get it the other 3 flights. It is possible to haul without a hoist. Next time I do something like this I'm going to remove the repeater and power supply and carry the parts, not the whole repeater. Try moving one of those Skytel 2-way transmitters up or down a flight of stairs.with 2 people.=:cO
[Repeater-Builder] Circular polarization for VHF repeaters?
Greetings, I am in a particularly sticky situation with one of my two meter repeaters in Lakewood, WA (Tacoma). I have generally great coverage, however there is a very annoying problem with multipath and raspy signals in a large portion of my coverage area. Since the Puget Sound area of Western Washington is very hilly and mountainous, multipath is very damaging to all forms of VHF communication. Over the years I have read about folks employing circular polarization to overcome fading, nulls, multipath, etc. There is so very little written about this topic in amateur circles so I thought I'd bring it up here and see what I could come up with. In the 80's there was a amateur radio repeater book by a fellow, Pasternak I believe, that took two gamma match style Cuschcraft Four Pole antennas, combined them, and did some magic with phasing lines to end up with a four bay circularly polarized repeater antenna. Unfortunately the description leaves much to be desired, at least for me, so I never built one. If he would have included specifics on phasing line lengths, cable types, etc, the job would have been a whole lot easier. Has anyone actually gone circular with Cushcraft Four Poles, and if so, could you please share it with me and/or this group? I have done some inquiring to commercial companies about a custom built two meter four bay circularly polarized array, but that is entirely out of the question. They want thousands of dollars. There must be an easier (and cheaper) way. Similarly, is anyone in this group running circular polarization on your amateur repeater(s), and if so, could you please share the details in a manner that could be duplicated without a lot of guess work? I know that I could easily solve my multipath problem by installing one or more remote receivers, however I would like to keep that as a last resort and shoot for a circularly polarized antenna system at the main repeater site. I do understand that there is approximately 3 db of loss as a result of this, but that is quite acceptable. The dividends would greatly outweigh the down side. Thanks for any constructive ideas, suggestions, links, etc, that you might be willing to share concerning this situation. Best regards, Gary, K7EK Personal Web Page: www.k7ek.net
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Circular polarization for VHF repeaters?
http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/cir_pol_rpt.html ? To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com From: gary.k...@yahoo.com Date: Thu, 2 Sep 2010 02:44:16 + Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Circular polarization for VHF repeaters? Greetings, I am in a particularly sticky situation with one of my two meter repeaters in Lakewood, WA (Tacoma). I have generally great coverage, however there is a very annoying problem with multipath and raspy signals in a large portion of my coverage area. Since the Puget Sound area of Western Washington is very hilly and mountainous, multipath is very damaging to all forms of VHF communication.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Circular polarization for VHF repeaters?
Gary, I am in Southern Oregon and I understand exactly what you are experiencing. We have very similar problems down here with our club's repeater. I have often talked about and even done some serious looking at remodeling a set of broadcast loops and harness for 2 Meters. I know there was a southern California repeater back in the 70's that used circular polarization with excellent results. They were able to provide much better coverage in their main service area, but did loose some long distance coverage outside their main coverage area. We have had the best success by using a lower gain antenna. We have been using the Telewave broadband two loop antennas with 2 - 4 degrees of downtilt, for both our 2 Meter and 440 MHz repeaters. I have found much better close in (0-30 Miles) coverage, less muti-path, and they cost quite a bit less than a Super Stationmaster. Good Luck and keep us posted with what you find for results. Joe - WA7JAW --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Gary - K7EK gary.k...@... wrote: Greetings, I am in a particularly sticky situation with one of my two meter repeaters in Lakewood, WA (Tacoma). I have generally great coverage, however there is a very annoying problem with multipath and raspy signals in a large portion of my coverage area. Since the Puget Sound area of Western Washington is very hilly and mountainous, multipath is very damaging to all forms of VHF communication.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Circular polarization for VHF repeaters?
On Thu, 2 Sep 2010, Gary - K7EK wrote: In the 80's there was a amateur radio repeater book by a fellow, Pasternak I believe, that took two gamma match style Cuschcraft Four Pole antennas, combined them, and did some magic with phasing lines to end up with a four bay circularly polarized repeater antenna. Unfortunately the description leaves much to be desired, at least for me, so I never built one. If he would have included specifics on phasing line lengths, cable types, etc, the job would have been a whole lot easier. Has anyone actually gone circular with Cushcraft Four Poles, and if so, could you please share it with me and/or this group? I have done some inquiring to commercial companies about a custom built two meter four bay circularly polarized array, but that is entirely out of the question. They want thousands of dollars. There must be an easier (and cheaper) way. Similarly, is anyone in this group running circular polarization on your amateur repeater(s), and if so, could you please share the details in a manner that could be duplicated without a lot of guess work? I know that I could easily solve my multipath problem by installing one or more remote receivers, however I would like to keep that as a last resort and shoot for a circularly polarized antenna system at the main repeater site. I do understand that there is approximately 3 db of loss as a result of this, but that is quite acceptable. The dividends would greatly outweigh the down side. Thanks for any constructive ideas, suggestions, links, etc, that you might be willing to share concerning this situation. There's also a recent article in QST about a passive Lindenblad using an active dipole as a center section and four passive aluminum wires suspended from a plastic mechanism. I've looked at that and said... that wire/plastic assembly, and one of the old Motorola TAD series dipoles ... would make a DC-grounded circularly polarized antenna that should be good for a few hundred watts, and a minimally preferential (non-circular) pattern. You're in unexplored territory. The best way in is to locate a low-power FM station that upgraded to a higher-power transmitter, buy the antenna from them, and get Jampro to cut it down for your frequency. Of course, that's real dollars... anything else will be improvised. It would be a good idea to look at the terrain you're trying to cover and see what beamwidth fits it best. If you have the money to spec out an antenna with some null-fill and a lot of gain, like a customized DB-228, you'll find that coverage is second to none. Typically speaking, you don't need much antenna gain to cover close in to the tower because the distance losses are less. And you can always address that with a 1/4 wave dipole on the top of the building connected to a voter reciever. Theoretically speaking, circular polarization results when the vertical and horizontal components are 90-degrees seperate from each other. The Cycloid dipole accomplishes this simply, using a vector sum of the two to make circular polarization. It's synthesized -- 1/2 horizontal + 1/2 vertical = so many degrees hypotenuse. It gets complicated to start working up in those regions, almost to the point of designing panel antennas and putting one on each side of the tower to get a decent pattern. It's difficult to phase antennas and preserve some form of a pattern with them. -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR Disinformation Analyst
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Circular polarization for VHF repeaters?
Hi, I remembered circular polarization was used for FM broadcast due to FM car radios, but when I looked it up I found out some interesting facts, see the link below, https://www.digitaltraders.com/index.php/index.php/components/com_kunena/template/default_ex/templates/ja_edenite/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=57Itemid=134 https://www.digitaltraders.com/index.php/index.php/components/com_kunena/template/default_ex/templates/ja_edenite/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=57Itemid=134Interesting white paper on FM Broadcast and why they had historically had circular polarization and why they are now changing to vertical polarization. Peter On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 1:22 AM, burkleoj joeburk...@hotmail.com wrote: Gary, I am in Southern Oregon and I understand exactly what you are experiencing. We have very similar problems down here with our club's repeater. I have often talked about and even done some serious looking at remodeling a set of broadcast loops and harness for 2 Meters. I know there was a southern California repeater back in the 70's that used circular polarization with excellent results. They were able to provide much better coverage in their main service area, but did loose some long distance coverage outside their main coverage area. We have had the best success by using a lower gain antenna. We have been using the Telewave broadband two loop antennas with 2 - 4 degrees of downtilt, for both our 2 Meter and 440 MHz repeaters. I have found much better close in (0-30 Miles) coverage, less muti-path, and they cost quite a bit less than a Super Stationmaster. Good Luck and keep us posted with what you find for results. Joe - WA7JAW --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com, Gary - K7EK gary.k...@... wrote: Greetings, I am in a particularly sticky situation with one of my two meter repeaters in Lakewood, WA (Tacoma). I have generally great coverage, however there is a very annoying problem with multipath and raspy signals in a large portion of my coverage area. Since the Puget Sound area of Western Washington is very hilly and mountainous, multipath is very damaging to all forms of VHF communication.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Circular polarization for VHF repeaters?
FM broadcast is NOT changing to vertical polarity! Most stations today are going on the air with either circular polarity or cross polarity (consisting of signal in BOTH the vertical and horizontal poles) With FCC licensing today, a FM station licensed for 10KW can have 10 KW in the vertical plane and 10 kW in the horizontal plane. So there would be no reason to only have the power in one plane. In the last 3 years, I have built 2 FM stations. Both used circular or cross polarity. -- Original Message -- Received: Wed, 01 Sep 2010 10:32:51 PM PDT From: petedcur...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Circular polarization for VHF repeaters? Hi, I remembered circular polarization was used for FM broadcast due to FM car radios, but when I looked it up I found out some interesting facts, see the link below, https://www.digitaltraders.com/index.php/index.php/components/com_kunena/template/default_ex/templates/ja_edenite/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=57Itemid=134 https://www.digitaltraders.com/index.php/index.php/components/com_kunena/template/default_ex/templates/ja_edenite/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=57Itemid=134Interesting white paper on FM Broadcast and why they had historically had circular polarization and why they are now changing to vertical polarization. Peter On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 1:22 AM, burkleoj joeburk...@hotmail.com wrote: Gary, I am in Southern Oregon and I understand exactly what you are experiencing. We have very similar problems down here with our club's repeater. I have often talked about and even done some serious looking at remodeling a set of broadcast loops and harness for 2 Meters. I know there was a southern California repeater back in the 70's that used circular polarization with excellent results. They were able to provide much better coverage in their main service area, but did loose some long distance coverage outside their main coverage area. We have had the best success by using a lower gain antenna. We have been using the Telewave broadband two loop antennas with 2 - 4 degrees of downtilt, for both our 2 Meter and 440 MHz repeaters. I have found much better close in (0-30 Miles) coverage, less muti-path, and they cost quite a bit less than a Super Stationmaster. Good Luck and keep us posted with what you find for results. Joe - WA7JAW --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com, Gary - K7EK gary.k...@... wrote: Greetings, I am in a particularly sticky situation with one of my two meter repeaters in Lakewood, WA (Tacoma). I have generally great coverage, however there is a very annoying problem with multipath and raspy signals in a large portion of my coverage area. Since the Puget Sound area of Western Washington is very hilly and mountainous, multipath is very damaging to all forms of VHF communication.
