[Repeater-Builder] Re: 24 vdc to 12vdc
Someone else mentioned the Astron converter. You can also buy inverters (usually online) designed for 24V input, and use that to run a small gel cell charger, with an appropriately sized gel cell. Neither the charger or the battery need to be big, unless you need to transmit a lot. The charge refills the battery when you're listening, or when the radio is off. Resistors are a bad idea, and tapping power from one battery is another bad idea, not just because of the damage to the high side battery, but the transients in a 24V system are double that in a 12V system, and your 12V radio has likely not been designed to live in that environment.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: LMR feedline revisited and revised!
That aluminum sloder paste doesn't work either and just makes a mess of your aluminum. I'll remember to tell our production guys, as they are soldering wires to aluminum tabs on Li-Poly cells daily with the stuff.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Advanced Receiver Research Preamp 144-148
For those who are inquiring minds and not up to all of the terminology, what is a golden screwdriver? Used to fix things, as in fixed like a cat. Now that it's fixed, it will never work again!
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Advanced Receiver Research Preamp 144-148
I used to do TV repair in hawaii, back in the good old days. Major Mac was a competing outfit. I could always tell when they had worked on a set before. Broken convergence coils hanging by their wires, cracked tuning slugs, solder joints that looked like they'd been done with a Bic. Definitely a golden screwdriver outfit. I would take the back off, spot their handywork, and immediately have the owner come look at it, so they knew that we hadn't butchered it like that.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Advanced Receiver Research Preamp 144-148
I've had to work on a number of radios where someone went in and tightened those screws... Dad used to get cameras where the owner had tried to fix them. Once or twice, the victim arrived in a paper bag, full of loose parts and screws. Arrgghh...
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Coverage Plot?
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, georgiaskywarn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I know this request has gone out before...so I am asking now ;-) I never can get Radio Mobile D. to run like it should. What is it that's giving you problems? Basically, set up your units first.. A repeater or two, and a couple of mobile radios, and HTs (VHF and UHF separately) Then go into networks, and set up a network with the appropriate units under membership, ie: Your UHF repeater should be in a network with a UHF mobile, and a UHF HT, then edit the system properties, your UHF repeater system is where the loss, power, rx sensitivity, etc are defined, and the same for the mobiles.. Then you need to select the units in the membership to use the proper system. Beware, the default is to use the first defined system, which is probably the repeater, this gets you an HT with a 200' high antenna :)
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
Ok, the sector thing is interesting, but we've drifted FAR away from the question I was trying to answer. Can anyone direct me to information, or modeling software (preferrably free) that can predict the pattern of an omni antenna, at various distances from a large cylindrical water tower? I'm looking to end up with an .ant file that I can use in radio mobile, but whatever the output form might be, I'm sure I can translate it one way or another.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A little OT perhaps...
As is likely the case for most people here, I learned how to drive with the steering wheel in one hand and a microphone in the other. If you can't do that, you do NOT belong on the road! Ah, but you see we are (largely) engineers, and suffer from the mindset that the way you fix a problem is to find the source and eliminate it. A lawyer would fix a leaky pipe by making drips illegal.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: I'm not that bold - new manufacturer?
Didn't China take over Taiwan back in the 80's or something? Not on your life. A very tense armed standoff has been in place for many many years.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
Normally for side-mounting on a normal tower, one wavelength will get you close to an omni pattern, I'm not trying to get to an omni pattern, I know that's impossible. What I want to do is approximate the pattern that I will get, and look at that (using RM) against the terrain, and see what distances work out best.. I'd still mount it facing towards the most important area to cover from that site, and vote it. Voting's not an option at this point.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: I'm not that bold - new manufacturer?
-- They promise the moon and almost deliver it. The radios work pretty well except they shoot themselves in the foot with what appears to be a 3-cent mic element. So the tx audio sounds like the user has a sock/rag (or equiv) in his/her mouth. If they get the tx audio problem fixed... we're going to see a heck of a lot more of them. I know the ones. There's a guy here with one, very distinctive audio. Still, they are pretty inexpensive, and I do like the red case option. I worry about the batteries though. I have had very bad and very exciting experiences with off-brand NIMH cells. As in rapid heating and explosive venting of boiling electrolyte. But that only happened in about 1% of the cells we got from china.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: I'm not that bold - new manufacturer?
I was thinking Hong Kongswitch to Emily Latela voicenevermind... Yup. Britain leased it from the chinese, and the lease ran out. I wonder what a country goes for these days? :)
[Repeater-Builder] Re: I'm not that bold - new manufacturer?
You could ask the guys at Sealand (http://www.sealandgov.org) - but they wouldn't sell to the Pirate's Bay last week. LOL. Hmm.. Would be an interesting site for a repeater. 1000' tower? Hmm, let me check with the zoning board. Hey ME, is it ok? Might be interesting when the weather gets rough though.
[Repeater-Builder] Antenna on the side of a water tower.
Wierd, I thought I sent this message already.. Anyway. I've been offered a site, but I would have to mount the antennas on the side of the water tower, not the top. That means within probably 3-6 feet of the side of the big metal can. I have docs from my antenna mfgr for pattern when I adjust the loop-mast spacing, but I need something that will show me what happens with distance between the mast and the water tower. I need this for VHF and UHF. Any pointers?
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower.
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, gervais fillion [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dave gave us the model of your antenna,is it the 4 loops on a 20 feets mast antenna? The VHF is a Telewave ANT150D9, and UHF is a DB-404 (unless I find something better before then)
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Steve Peg [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It is what you get when the county takes a free site, when better ones existed. Cheap, free is always better to people who know nothing and dollars count. Well, in my case, we've been looking for two years, and the only one that really responded was $2000/month. BIT steep for a ham repeater, in my opinion.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Iszak, Mike [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dave; Are you able to choose where on the side of the tank (IE, facing a particular direction) or are you stuck with a specific spot? I haven't seen the details yet, but as far as I know we can pick the spot. I would suggest 1/2 wave away from the surrounding metal as a minimum, but try and get as far away as you can. Yes, but what's bugging me is that I'm sure there are BAD distances, especially up close within 1-2 wavelengths
[Repeater-Builder] Re: 2 meter repeater
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, IF YOUR NICE I MAY TELL YOU [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi all another question do you need 1 0r 2 antenna's on a repeater. Thanks Yes! You can do it either way, but MOST systems use one antenna and a rather expensive device called a duplexer which separates the transmit and receive into two separate feedlines. Dual antennas can be done, but you need a lot of physical separation to make that work.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, skipp025 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Which reminds me that I should have mentioned the available scan of club using a series of yagi antennas around a wide tower to obtain a quasi omni pattern. You can probably find the info on the repeater builder antenna page along with the mounting offset paper I mentioned earlier. Somehow, I don't think the paper pointed to earlier is the one you are talking about.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
However, if that is all you can get, then go for it. I have seen guys mount a Rohn 25 type tower on the platform where the railing is, mount the antenna on top of the tower section(s) and then the top of the antenna will see over the top of the water tower. Problem is, there's a fire repeater on the top, and they want us on the side, specificially NOT above the side. I'm just looking for a way to predict the pattern(s) so I can plug that into RM, and see if it's worth spending a bucket of money to change to this site.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
More information would be helpful , when you say side is that same level as the tank or looking above it with side diplacement ? The first case, besittin' beside of it as Andy Griffith would say.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
More information would be helpful , when you say side is that same level as the tank or looking above it with side diplacement ? The first case, besittin' beside of it as Andy Griffith would say.
[Repeater-Builder] Antenna on the side of a water tower
Can anyone point me to something that will show me the antenna pattern for a VHF and UHF antenna mounted on the side of a water tank at different distances from the tank? I've been offered a site, but I can't have top mount, I have to go on the side. I have the mfgr's docs showing pattern with different distances between the loops and the mast, but I don't have any info on how the big metal tank reflection will disturb the pattern. I'm sure there's an optimal distance, but I don't know what it would be.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Battery backup
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Joe Montierth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The simplest way is just to get the IOTA supply and float it across the battery. Thats it, nothing else needed. Get an IOTA big enough to power whatever you have, and still have some left over for charging. You don't need (or want) diodes, resistors, or relays. I have one caveat with the Iota. In my system it resulted in a horrible noise because the repeater itself is located about 10' away from the antenna, and the Iota has some significant energy internally at about 600kHz. That mixed with my TX, and created two sidebands, one of which fed back into my RX. It would come and go dependent on load/temperature. If you're mounted far enough away, then that shouldn't be a problem.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Audio Distorted
The first thing that comes to mind is receiver drifting off frequency. Try having someone come in at +1 or -1 kHz, and see if they sound better. If the TX was off, I'd expect your receiver AFC to follow it up to a point. But that would be worth checking too. COULD be an electrolytic in the audio path that isn't much of a cap when it gets cold.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
It's hard to put into text. What I'd like to do, is get back to the more omni pattern if at all possible. The way everything is situated, if I put the antenna on the side of the tower facing through most of our coverage area, I think it will end up with too much gain in that direction, twoard another repeater to the northeast. Mostly, I'm just looking for a way to model what happens, ideally in something that radio mobile can digest, and I'll work it out from there.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, skipp025 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Depends a lot on the size of the water tank, then the type of antenna and its mounted distance from the tank. Not an easy guess unless you have a lot of math background with some serious extra time. I can deal with that, I have Mathcad, and I wouldn't be opposed to crunching it in that, or other ways. I thought about simulating it with Pov-Ray, but POV deals with light in a particle manner, not as a wave, and pov objects are typically enormous on the scale of light wavelengths.. Most people wing it' trying horizontal mount spacings from 1/4 to 1/2 wave (or multiples there of...) from the tower. Yeah, that's what I'm trying to avoid. It would not directly apply here but I have previously mentioned and passed out to group members a pdf file scan of a Sinclair Authored Paper showing basic antenna distance and space mounting. I have the one from telwave that covers distance between the loops and the mast, but if this one is something closer to my situation, I'd like to see it. It's still available to anyone for just requesting it once again by email direct from me. As above, if you think it will help, please email it to me. Thanks
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Antenna on the side of a water tower
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Mike Morris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's also at the repeater-builder web site on the antenna systems page, or directly at http://www.repeater-builder.com/antenna/antenna-mounting- guidelines.pdf Ok, no that dosen't really get me where I need to be. Thanks though.
[Repeater-Builder] Re: colinears as repeater antennas
I'm not a big fan of the fiberglass toothpick either. Put a 5 degree downtilt into radio mobile, and see what it does to your pattern over flat land. Now look at your toothpick, which is usually leaning a few degrees one way or the other due to wind. :-P I'd really like to change my antenna to the 4-bay that's sitting in the garage. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: colinears as repeater antennas
I'm not a big fan of the fiberglass toothpick either. Put a 5 degree downtilt into radio mobile, and see what it does to your pattern over flat land. Now look at your toothpick, which is usually leaning a few degrees one way or the other due to wind. :-P I'd really like to change my antenna to the 4-bay that's sitting in the garage. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Temp on a bridge rectifier, anyone know
Currently the temp of the rectifier is about 200 degrees, does this seem accurate, it is drawing about 6 milliamps at this time charging the batteries. Something's WAY wrong here. Try powering a light bulb with it, and see how it does. I wouldn't expect it to run more than warm, maybe 140-ish. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise: SOLVED
Well, in the end, it turned out to be the IOTA power converter. This is something that didn't show up in extensive testing here, and didn't show up at the site for a while either. With modern SMPS designs, you can't really use the term switching frequency, since the controllers do things like pulse skipping under light load, or frequency modulation to spread the noise making part 15 easier. Even an older switcher that runs at a fixed frequency, will be doing PWM, so there will be another frequency component that moves around under load. However that works out in the IOTA, it was apparent that this was the source. I was able to hear broad hash on my IC-R3 held close to the unit, and tuning up to the repeater input, I could hear the mix product as well. I replaced it with a linear supply since I had one handy, and the problem's been totally gone for over a week. :) I spoke to IOTAs technical people, who were pretty knowlegable. They offered to exchange the unit, and came up with the same probable fix that I did, ferrites on the line cord and DC cables. Since the unit is in a metal box, I think that this will likely solve the problem. Key symptoms of this problem: Comes and goes. Gets through CTCSS squelch, IF you encode the same tone you decode. (because it's mixing your output back in) Has audio that sounds like an echo or fast repeat, but the audio is rather weak. Cause: Repeater output mixing with switching power supply noise, producing a real carrier on the repeater input. Won't happen on a 440 machine, or probably a 220 machine, due to the wider splits. Switchers are increasing their operating frequencies to keep the magnetics small, so having significant noise at 1.2 MHz bothering a 220 machine isn't out of the realm of possibility. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise: SOLVED
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 5/2/2006 06:56, you wrote: Well, in the end, it turned out to be the IOTA power converter. :-(#) I thought you said you tried shutting down the switching supply. Yes, there may be another switcher close by. There is a 440 repeater in the same room, and various computers on the floor below. A hit from one of those probably gave me the idea that it wasn't coming from my box. the systems had to be heavily filtered. Turns out the 100 AH wet NiCd batteries only filter to ~400 kHz, above that they look inductive. Of course. :) That is one way to gage state of charge, by looking at their absorption spectrum. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: OT-- Parts Disease
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Mike Perryman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I call it the Parts Disease... and yes I have it as well!! Could I interest anyone in a 3-axis seismograph?? Wait a minute... I think that one got away already.. a minor rumbly last year sparked interest in that item. Damn, I would have liked that. :) Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Low Voltage Disconect
I've been looking for some dc low voltage disconnects and it apears Newmar has just the ticket. LVD-12-30LVD-12-70 are two very usable units. Sounds like a 6V relay, and a couple of resistors, maybe a zener. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A couple of questions about hard line
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, David [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Okay sorry about the spelling errors but the coax I have came from a guy who moved to Florida a year or so ago via another ham who's call is k4rjj the numbers on the heliax are as follows he believed that the guy used this hard line on a antenna system or repeater in Marietta, ga 84147 LDF5 50 ohm HELIAX COAXIL CABLE 52401 A04P I have three sections of this cable. one looks like it has a ground kit on it all sections appear to have connectors at both ends that have rubber protectors on it protect if from weather. Now I need to test this before I install it The tools I have on hand are Mfj 269 Diamond watt meter swr bridge 50 ohm dummy load and various radios Can I do a decent test with the above? If so how? Well, what you can do with what you have: Check the electrical length with the MFJ (it's in the manual) Connect your transmitter to one end, dummy load to the other, and using the watt meter, check for any noticable loss, looking at the difference between power into the cable, and power out at the other end. You didn't say the length, but with LDF-5, you can look up the specs for loss vs length and see if what you get is about right. Eventually I want to put a beam on the mast and a rotor. I figure I am going to have to use a jumper from the hard line to the antenna to get around the rotor I figure this will be about 10' long. What type of coax to use for this jumper? Is there a better way? A short length of flexible coax, with stranded copper center conductor. The plated aluminum center conductors won't hold up to the flexing. But... A beam on a repeater? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Anetenna Help
It's a real pity that their motor mounts aren't capable of holding these up. Of all the antennas that need them, these would be the ones. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Duplexer Wanted
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Nate Duehr [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: david vanhorn wrote: Look at http://www.repeater-builder.com/tech-info/effectivesens.html http://www.repeater-builder.com/tech- info/effectivesens.html - a writeup from Chris Boone WB5ITT, who happens to be a pretty sharp guy. Very good article. I got a 50dB sample pad from Telewave, and have it installed in the system. Makes it very handy to look at the transmitted spectrum, or do receiver adjustments. Actually I think it'd be a better article if it pointed out there are better ways than an Iso-T to inject that signal that are give better (more reproducible/consistent) results. Yes, that's why I went with the sampler. It's nearly flat across the band, and as you point out, it's not subject to drift. Just opinion, but I like having the variable part of the signal generation/SINAD measurement done at a device that has a calibrated output level, and no variability of an Iso-T. Well, an Iso-T and a foxhunting attenuator would be way better than nothing. I'd like to have a more portable sig gen, but I'm VERY glad to have my HP. I was checking my B radios yesterday, running the output of my 7L5's tracking generator into it's mod in port, set to 3kHz dev, nice to know that it just IS 3k Dev as the tone sweeps the band. What's the quote? The unexamined life is not worth living. Perhaps better stated: The unexamined repeater is not worth using. If you can't measure it, then you can't improve it! Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Mobile antenna installation help/fatigued metal
Don't just listen to your State Capitol - TELL them to stop playing mommie and daddy and that you don't need it. Exactly! Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A couple of questions about hard line
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, David [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have some hard line I that a friend gave me and was wondering how to determine if it is any good? and how to determine what connectors to get for it? What to look for to determine this? Well a big first step would be to figure out what sort of line it is. There should be a number printed on or embossed into the jacket every so often. Visual inspection for any damage to the copper jacket, kinks, water intrusion.. Hardline does not like to be bent, you need to observe a proper minimum bend radius that is specified for the type of cable. Connectors: Well, be prepared to be amazed at pricing. Ebay is a good source, but of course you need to know what sort of cable you have first. Many connectors can be re-used, but you need to carefully follow the directions to apply the connectors. It's easy to make an expensive mess by being sloppy or taking short cuts. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A couple of questions about hard line
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Of course !! CG = Channel Guard - General Electric PL = Private Line - Motorola QC = Quiet Channel - RCA All are commonly referred to by CTCSS If this gets too big, it's going to start looking like SPAM(tm) :) Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: TKB or TKR-720 on 220 Mhz band
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Hellewell, Byron [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi I received a new KPT-50 programmer for the Kenwood TKR-720 and 820, and TKB-720 and 820 radios. The manual for it indicates that the 720 series of radios can be programmed from 130 MHz up to 230 MHz. I wondered if anyone has programmed and retuned one of these radio to operate on the 222 MHz band? EEWW.. I know the 720 was made in at least two band splits, because we got the wrong one at first and it wouldn't come down into the ham band. Wether you can program it there is a very different question from wether it will operate there. Inherently broadbanded designs are inherently bad for repeater use. In our case, we were finally able to eke out 18W without the solder melting on the finals, after I replaced the regular solder with silver solder, and added small heat sink fins. The 720 we had also had a synth issue. After being in service for 3 months or so, it started hopping between our frequency and the local airport tower frequency. This happened very quickly, such that it appeared to be transmitting on both bands at once. The synth was madly signalling to the CPU that it was unlocked, and the CPU was blithely ignoring that. I'd be very surprised if there was a single 720 model that covered this spread. I'd be even more surprised if using it that way was a good idea. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A couple of questions about hard line
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, David [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And all I wanted to know was about my hard line it is amazing how this all got started I am going to go down and look at the hard line and see if I can get any info off it will a mfj-269 analyze the hard line? It will tell you velocity factor, but I don't think you can get loss information (damage/water). A TDR would be more interesting, but hard to get your hands on. There's a lot to learn about repeaters. At one level, it's two radios, one antenna, and a special filter, and then you start peeling the onion. :) Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Two bands, one antenna, many problems?
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Dick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dave, the problem with the diplexer that burned up is that its power rating was given in PEP and not CW. You need to find one rated for your total power in CW. As you know, PEP is a low duty cycle mode in SSB. I think your Comet unit was faulgty going in because it shouldn't have failed at those power levels. Looking at the components, anything over 50W seems pretty optimistic. I'm also looking for a higher quality solution though. The thing is pretty cheesy internally. Have a look at the Diamnd MX72D 100 W CW UHF; 150 W CW VHF Note that its power rating is fotr CW and not PEP. I'll have a look Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: telco and ctcss tones
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here is an age old question that has yet to be answered satisfactorly. What are the CTCSS frequencies derived from? Meaning why are they what they are? Like 123.0, 127.3, Why not 120, 125, 130 ETC? I just asked about that a few days ago. I haven't found any simple relationships between the tones. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: telco and ctcss tones
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Here is an age old question that has yet to be answered satisfactorly. What are the CTCSS frequencies derived from? Meaning why are they what they are? Like 123.0, 127.3, Why not 120, 125, 130 ETC? I just asked about that a few days ago. I haven't found any simple relationships between the tones. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: TKB or TKR-720 on 220 Mhz band
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Juan Tellez [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The one with two splits was the TK-710, the 720 can be programed to full bandwidth, only needs retuning the front end and the both VCO's.. Ours was definitely a TKR-720. Wouldn't tune into the ham band, although that's what we ordered, turned out they shipped the wrong unit. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: TKB or TKR-720 on 220 Mhz band
I can send you the parts LIST that you need to change in the TKR- 720S VCOs (Both TX and RX) to make it a K2 if you would like. That is what I have done with both of mine here and they work GREAT!! Thanks, but no. That's over and done with. Although the receiver was pretty good, the transmitter rather sucked, and it's the best kind of problem now (someone else's!) Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: telco and ctcss tones
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Chuck Kelsey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe that at least one of the reasons is that they were chosen to avoid musical notes. It may be that there simply is no easy integer relationship. I've toyed around with the idea of doing a PL encoder/decoder in software, but hadn't gotten around to it yet. Would make a good companion for my 8 pin DIP repeater controller. :) Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 08:58 PM 4/21/2006 -0400, you wrote: You wouldnt hear the sync buzz,your rx is to narrow! --I ABSOLUTE disagree with this. You can easily hear sync buzz on a NBFM receiver. I know. The narrow bandwidth dosen't prevent a smeared narrowband version coming through. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] That horrible noise
Two VHF repeaters in town have been bothered by this from time to time.. The first, which only occasionally gets it, but gets it LOUD when it happens, is 146.730- The second (mine) at 146.850- is getting it almost continuously now, but weak, ranging from will open squelch (even with PL!) to Will hold squelch but won't open it Unfortunately, it's putting enough energy out at low frequencies that the PL board is seeing a tone, so PL won't save me. The noise has an echoing quality that I think is VERY distinctive, but I can't figure where it's coming from. It's not happening in either repeater, we've had the opportunity to completely shut down the machines when it's happening. The two repeaters are maybe 1000' apart. I've only started having a problem with it since replacing my antenna so that I'm no longer stone deaf. I have a 5M wav file of the noise, if anyone's interested. It sounds like broadband noise at first, but then you notice the feedback-ish sound in it. At times we've heard what seems like bits of audio in the noise. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Anetenna Help
I use an SG-7900, which diamond tells me that they don't recommend for mobile use (where ELSE should I put it??) I had the same problem with the roof metal being too flexible. I used a Ryobi Weedeater blade inside, as a giant washer, and another conventional smaller washer on the top. This has been in place now for four years with no problems at all. You still don't want to hit anything low though.. With the expedition, and the SG, I top out at about 11' It hears GREAT though! Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd be interested in hearing the wav file you recorded, Dave But bear in mind that your comment that it's not coming from either repeater could easily be wrong. As a matter of fact, if you're running a delay in the audio path of either repeater, one of them is most definately involved. It sounds like a typical spur/mix/intermod issue to me, probably involving a 3rd party. Anyway, let's have a listen. Well, the same problem is happeing in two machines. Interestingly the one that does use a switcher to charge the battery is mine (the 85), and the problem happened on the other repeater long before I installed my switcher. The 73 uses an astron linear supply. I'm aware of the possibility of mixing with a switcher, but the problem also happens when mine is shut down. Back months ago, the 73 got hit with it really hard. We commanded the 85 off remotely, and the problem continued, and so we went up and disconnected power and antenna. No change. The 85 has it wether the 73 is active or not, and even when the 73 is totally offline. So how do I deliver the file? It's about 5 meg. This was taken on an Icom R-8500 in FM mode, listening to the output of the 85. I can't hear anything on the input from here. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
I agree... A quick verify test would be to bypass the delay line. I've not heard the audio in what I get on the 85. The 73 only gets it infrequently, so we'd have to wait months for it to happen. Although both machines run RC-210 controllers now, the 73 had the problem with a cat-1000 installed as well, and they've also changed out the transmitter and receiver, going from Kenwood TKR-720 to Kendecom. It sounds like a typical spur/mix/intermod issue to me, probably involving a 3rd party. This is pretty likely. I'm almost alone at my site, sharing with a low power UHF repeater. The 73 though is on a very hairy building, and a lot of that hair is relatively new. And the problem signal does not have to contain your ctcss or dcs code to fool/trick your decoder into falsing on. Like flying airplanes... sometimes you can't trust your eyes (/or ears). Yeah.. The decoder dosen't care what the waveshape is, it's pretty simpleminded. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You must cover a search radius of 1/4 to 1/2 of a mile from the antenna. Problem goes away when you run the repeater into a dummy load, right? I can't do that remotely, but commanding the transmitter off does NOT stop the noise. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 04:14 PM 4/21/2006 -, you wrote: This is pretty likely. I'm almost alone at my site, sharing with a low power UHF repeater. ---What's the freq(s) of the UHF machine? (that it's running low power has nothing to do with it g). I also assume none of the machines are running an isolator? 460-ish, and no, no isolators. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Scott Zimmerman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Guys, I think you're missing one detail here. 146.73 minus 146.85 is 1200 KHz. Twice the typical 2 meter split of 600Khz. I'm not sure EXACTLY why it's happening, but the math here has BAD written all over it. Anytime you deal with multiples of your input to output frequency separation, it's not a good thing. Yet another reason I'd like to weigh anchor and find a new site. The only sort-of offer we had was a naked water tower out in the country a bit, at $2000/month. Other than that last bit, it sounded like a deal. I wonder if the two repeaters are using the same PL tone? If so, does one, or both encode that tone as well? Yes and yes, but this was not always the case. In the old days, the 85 ran no PL at all. The 73 still encodes, but does not require. At this point, the 85 encodes, and optionally can require. In the old days, the 85 was deaf as a post, with bad antenna, bad feedline, maggiore TX/RX, mistuned, astron power supply, no backup, and a Daiwa mobile amplifier (with the FM/SSB switch). The 73 in those days was a TKR-720 with ARR preamp, sinclair brick wall VHF bandpass filter, wacom cans, and a good 4 bay dipole. At that point, the 85 never had the problem, but 73 would intermittently. Folks were blaming the 85 for the problem, claiming that they could key up the 85 and the problem would start up on the 73. Lots of experimenting was done on the 73, but at this time the 85 was a flying dutchman and nothing could be done with it. In more recent times, the 85 has been totally rebuilt. The only remaining components are the wacom cans, and the cabinet. It's all daniels gear, which is exceptionally clean on transmit. Current configuration is a no-name dual-band vertical, MFJ band splitter (the comet one burned up), Sinclair brick wall filter, wacom cans, Daniels VT-30 tx amp, and VT-2/VR-2 radios. The 73 has not heard the noise since going to the kendecom radios, but it didn't hear it very often in the first place, and typically only during rainy weather. I wouldn't say that it's definitely not hearing the noise at this point. Recent adjustments by a different tech committee have also left it rather deaf. I think Ken is on the right track with an audio delay causing a howl. It's not a howl, very hard to describe without you hearing it. It's not a necessity however because of the RF delay in the possible feedback path. Realize that even at the speed of light (in free space) RF transmission and reception are not instantaneous. At about 1000' that delay won't be doing anything in the audio domain. I think your best bet is to find a different frequency or location for one of the repeaters if possible. Would love to. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
With the UHF freqs in the equation, maybe something else will jump out Well, there are three UHF machines involved I guess. 444.375- at the 73 site, and 441.9 at the 85 site, plus this commercial one at my site, that I don't have the freq for. At the 73 site there is normally a 220 machine, but it's sitting on my desk at the moment, so I think we can rule it out. The 444.375 is very inactive, and isn't active when this problem is happening. The 441.9 is shut down. The commercial one is also rather inactive, and seems to make no difference. It's a black box about 3U high with freedom on the front, but no other identifying information. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
So, where I can hear the wav file? Can I email it somewhere? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Put it up on my anonymous FTP site. That way anyone who wants to hear it can download it: ftp://ftp.ah6le.net/incoming Once it's there, I'll move it to the /pub directory so everyone can access it It's there, enjoy. I've run it through spectrum analysis. The 60 Hz hum is in my soundcard/computer, and you can see the 127.3 PL, but that's encoded by the repeater. The rest is pretty indistinct in time or frequency, but I hear a repetitiveness to it at about 4 Hz. Kind of like listening to a short sequence pseudonoise generator. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sounds like a definate transmitter being heard by receiver with audio delay to me. Is it always that quieting? Wow I never hear it as loud (apparent deviation change?) as the 73. On the 73 it's a grab the volume control oh man my ears event. It's moderately strong today, holding squelch open almost all the time. The receiver opens at .18uV (6dB sinad) but I don't yet know what that equates to in signal at the antenna. 73 at this moment is in use, and hasn't had a ghost of it all week. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
I don't seem to be able to upload files at this point. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, DCFluX [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Actually it probably would of been better if I measured in octaves, but that would of taken too long and not of been so simple. Just currious, Do you have a AM radio station on 590, 600 or 610KHz in the vincinity? First copyable signal is at 801, with one at 1550, a good 20 mi away. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: That horrible noise
Yes, but now we're debugging a problem on your repeater, correct? If so, replace the switcher with a linear supply see if the problem continues. Keeps happening with the power supply at my site shut down. I have a relay that I can command from the controller, to shut off the AC input to the system. I don't remember what exactly the number was, but I did check this IOTA supply for any output around 600 khz before installing it. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Anetenna Help
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Top of my garage door is 10' high ... Mine's a bit lower than that. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Dayton Hamvention Reply back (as requested)
I do get a bit disturbed when I see the usual guys with the black cat and texas pride amps. I would expect that sort of thing to be stepped on pretty quick. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: back-up battery charging (Micor PS)
I'm very happy with my 55A (small) IOTA converter simply connected to my battery, and battery connected to the system bus. I'll grant that the IOTA could have been a quieter design, but I've had NO noise problem with it. I am always careful to connect things properly though. Thinking of the system bus as parallel rails, and anything connects anywhere, is how you get in trouble with noise. The charger connects directly to the battery, by separate #4 negative and positive leads. The battery then connects to the system by another set of #4 leads that run to a distribution block. I don't know exactly what this is normally called, but it's used for high power 240 VAC wiring. It accepts two #4 feeds on each terminal, and 16 #8 leads out the other side of each terminal, with individual screws to tighten them. Each terminal is a block of metal, roughly 1.5 x 1.5 x 2 inches. I have no measurable hum on the bus, and none shows up on the air, even using several different waterfall spectrum displays. It's nice having a scope mounted in your repeater cabinet! :) There are a lot of battery chargers out there. Automotive units are not typically designed to be left on the battery for any length of time. Their only real purpose is to get the battery charged enough to start the car, quickly. They are cheaply designed, and have no actual regulation or filtering at all. Left on a battery for a long time, they will boil it dry. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] TS-32 tone board
Anyone have a working one they'd like to part with? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] PL tones
While I'm at it, does anyone know the magic formula by which the PL tones are generated? This would be in the form of PL=(Xtal / X)/Y where X and Y are whole numbers and Xtal is something like 1.000 MHz or 3.579 MHz I've seen this somewhere, but I can't recall where. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: back-up battery charging
The diode is needed because some power supplies have a tendency to go into a crowbar shutdown mode if the AC input goes away (as during a power failure) while a DC voltage is maintained at its output by a battery. Such an event will blow fuses and will almost certainly shut down the repeater. Crowbar circuits protect against regulator failure in the power supply by forcing the output to ground, and blowing a fuse (you hope!) Paradoxically, using a series diode between the PS and battery makes it MORE likely that the crowbar will trip, beacuse you then have to raise the power supply voltage higher. A simple fuse here, set a bit above the power supply's maximum current rating, would work better. Alternately, use the diode, but remove the crowbar, or adjust the crowbar trip point appropriately. Unless the repeater operates almost continuously, the power supply does not need to match the current draw of the radio during transmit. I have a 50 watt base station set up this way that has a 26 Ah VRSLA battery floated by an Astron RS-10 power supply, and it has been 100% reliable through many power outages. Sure, I use this system a LOT in bench and repeater applications. In the end though, you still have something charging a battery that was not designed for that service. A proper battery charge system, designed to be floated across a battery and a load, is a better solution. The IOTA is also not all that expensive, and being a switcher, it is very small and efficient. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Kuggie
Kugige's evil twin has been busy today! Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Band-split units
I'd like to stick with N connectors on everything. The original system, such as it was, was PLs on everything, and the interim just slap 'er in there version had pretty much everything, but I am getting in converted. The last thing is the VHF cans, which are PL, but I guess I can leave those be. Isolation hasn't been a big concern for me because my systems have additional filtering that knocks out the remaining out of band signals. If your diplexer output goes straight to a broadband preamp, you may have to add a pass cavity. Yeah, I have Brick wall bandpass filters on each after the band- split unit, and before the duplexers, and the daniels transmitters are very clean. Dual helical resonators about 1x1x1.5 on each transmitter, before the final amp. So very little energy where you don't want it, in harmonics or in-band splatter. But I have nearby emitters outside the ham band that I need to squash. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Band-split units
Argh.. Found out what my duplexer problem was.. It wasn't the duplexer at all (HOORAY!) It was the comet MX-2000D band-split unit! A small adjustable cap connects the UHF feedline to the rest of the bandsplit filters. Or at least it used to. It's carbonized carcass dropped out of the bandsplit unit when I opened it up tonight after replacing it with an MFJ unit. (ok, it's friday night in muncie indiana, I don't really have any other options!) Looking at the plate on the comet unit, they rate it at 800W PEP on the UHF side. I guess that dosen't exactly work out to 50W CW, at least by their formula. Looking at the size of the cap, I am very dubious about it surviving 800W of sideband. Any recommendations on bandsplit units? (other than not to use them) I don't have antenna options, it's one dual band antenna, or move to another non-existent site. I know about the DCI unit (http://www.dci.ca/pdf/DCI-146-444-DX- DB.pdf) but santa's not due for another 8 months, and the tax man unfortunately IS here. :-P Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Aviation Problem Returns, Need Some Help, or a Tuned Stub
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, John J. Riddell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: David, the Fix for a Maggiore repeater working in to a duplexer becoming a comb generator is to put a small antenna tuner between the TX and the duplexer. We fixed a problem here by doing that. Tuning the transmitter fixes, filters mask. Unfortunately without a spectrum analyzer, you'll never know it's in comb mode. I've done this on three systems, two VHF and one 220, and they all act about the same. Tune the TX for max output, and you'll end up on or very near comb mode. Tune with an SA, and you can see the comb mode go away, as well as another mode with lots of noise within +/- 100 khz of the carrier go away, while getting to the same output power. The Z matcher that was discussed on here while back would work as well. Possibly, it also acts as a filter to some extent. The problems I am seeing are in the multiplier chain and many stages isolate them from the output, so I doubt they are sensitive to load impedance. There may also be spurs that you can get from the finals too, NOTHING would surprise me in these things. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: maggiore hi-pro rv4 220 squelch problem
A quickie on how the maggiore squelch circuit works. (when/if it decides to.) The five transistor chip is the heart of it, but not all of it. The first transistor is just a linear amplifier. The second is biased class C, and interacts a bit with the third. The third is a little interesting, I'll come back to it. The fourth provides COR output, which is faster than the audio mute. The fifth mutes the speaker locally with a short RC delay, and also feeds through the third to provide some hysteresis. But it's more fun than that! The circuit's performance is very sensitive to the IF bandwidth! On this 220 machine I'm looking at, I can get .170uV 12db sinad, but if I tune it to that, the squelch won't ever close. If I tune to about .2uV, then I can get the squelch to close at about .16 I have a 2M machine here to play with also, and it behaves the same although I would have called it a working machine as it's squelch actually closes somewhere nearer to optimum IF tuning. The interesting thing is that the second transistor being class c derives it's bias from the noise signal ampilitude. If you don't have enough noise getting in (small cap values in the base caps?) then you can't bias this transistor on. The third transistor pulls base bias away if the audio squelch (NOT THE COR!) is active. And a final thank you should go to the psychotic weasel who drew the schematic in such a manner as to preserve neither the functionality of the circuit, or the pinout of the chip.. I get offended by schematics that preserve the chip pinout and sacrifice meaning, but this one managed to sacrifice both of them in order to gain an artful wad of electric spaghetti. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Sinclair Q-201G duplexer
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Ken Arck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi folks I know the stock answer, but I'm looking for the non-stock one :- ) (and yes, I've read the manual!). But I was wondering (and checking my rationale here). in many Bp/Br cavities, the notch tuning actually tunes to a certain freq above or below the pass-tuned frequency. It's not proportional exactly. Moving the pass 1.00 MHz dosen't necessarily move the notch 1.00 MHz So, any time you change the pass, you have to readjust the notch, but you can move the notch without moving the pass. At least I can't see any effect with reasonable numbers. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] maggiore hi-pro rv4 220 squelch problem
Our club 220 machine has been giving a lot of trouble with the squelch. The problem is that the squelch works fine for a while, then quits. By that I mean that it will not squelch even with no input signal at all. No real clues, and the schematic is not very helpful. Any ideas? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] db 4072
Anyone know how much power this Br-Br duplexer is designed for? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Success!
I just got one of the newer Daniels MT-3 synthesized receivers over onto the 440 band. FWIW, here's what you have to do: When you open the receiver, you'll see the preselector, which will need to be retuned. Do the obvious thing there, the best you can with the equipment you have. DONT pump a lot of RF through this one, it's also the mixer! The receiver uses an IF of 21.4 or 45.0 MHz, and can be set up for 12.5 kHz or 25kHz. You'll see this in a pair of information jumpers on the bottom of the PCB, under the synthesizer (Huge can, can't miss it) 1: Figure out the magic number to program into the switches: The radio is natively a 16 channel radio. If you have more than one channel in it, that will be done by jumpers on the backplane, but the first channel is set by four switches, labeled MSB - - LSB You can't mess with the channel settings in EEPROM, but you CAN set the first channel to anything you like. The formula is F = Base + (IF * Switches) IF is either 12.5k or 25k Figuring out what base is can be a little tedious if you don't know what the receiver was set up for, but you can unscrew the cable out of the synth and run that to a counter or receiver and work out the proper settings.. For mine, 446.0 ends up at 1488 programmed to the switches. Once you have the switch number, undo the retaining screws, and unplug the synth from the board. Remove the cover, and reinstall on the board. Power up, and tune the small adjusting screw with a jeweler's screwdriver, till you see 3.5V on TP4 in the synth, then power down and reassemble the can, and put the synth back on the board. At this point you can do final adjustments on the preselector, and set the squelch. To set the squelch: R115 does hysteresys, and R88 does squelch level. Turn both way CCW, and start advancing R88 as you would a normal squelch control, then adjust R115 to prevent any jumping in and out. So there it is for posterity. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Tuning
Well, I should be able to answer those questions soon, as my Sinadder just arrived. No time to play tonight, but ASAP. I did a quick check, plugging it into the tone out on my HP generator where it shows 20dB with the 1kHz tone on, and 0 with the 400Hz tone on, pretty much as expected. But, it will have to wait as I'm on a crash project for work. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Tuning
So I snuck in a minute to play with the new toy. If my meter is reading right, I'm at 0.24uV for 12dB sinad. I tuned by ear, and got 0.26, so not THAT bad, but with the meter I don't have to listen to the tone and noise that drives me nuts. This is a Hae Dong meter, there are more on Ebay for $30 or thereabouts. It's used, and no manual, but hey, it's got a 110Vac plug and a BNC input. What manual do you need? :) Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Tuning
Just search on sinadder Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Tuning
Ok, I wasn't thinking in this direction before, but I do have an audio band spectrum analyzer handy. Question is, how can I translate this to a Sinad measurement? Looking at the receiver in question now, the second harmonic of the 1kHz tone is -40dB, and the noise is at about 5dB below that. It's an interesting study in using the wrong instrument for the job. I get a very detailed look at the spectrum of the audio output, but what I need is a very non-detailed measurement of out-of-band energy. Tried doing it on my scope too, which can subtract Chan 1 from chan 2, but there's almost 180 degrees phase shift, and the amplitudes are very different, and it would take some significant messing about to fix that up. I need a sinadder. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Low Power GE Phoenix...
It sure makes a difference when things are designed for low power. My whole daniels rig, receivers and transmitters for 2M and 440, draws about 80mA at idle. I have a mobile radio that I use for a control link, which draws about 300mA at idle. In the daniels, there's a lot of attention paid to power consumption, even the front panel LEDs are turned off unless needed. Audio amps are switched off unless in use, pretty much every trick taken to reduce power consumption. The receiver modules each draw 30mA. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Tuning
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Bob M. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I recall reading somewhere that the SINAD measurement is the residual signal after the 1kHz tone has been filtered out. Right When that level gets to 12dB below the no-signal noise level, you've reached the point of 12dB SINAD. Well, if everything were simple, that would be it. What I measure, is a noise floor that slopes 20dB between the lowest frequency I can measure (near 0) and 2kHz, with the 1kHz tone in the middle. So do I average that noise floor, or take the peak reading, or something else? A distortion analyzer is basically the same thing. A narrow filter notches out the fundamental, and the voltmeter reads what's left. HP331, 332, 333, and 334 units are fairly cheap and they can do triple duty as an AC voltmeter, distortion analyzer, and SINAD meter. That's why I was thinking of the SA in this application, because it gives a good measure of noise and distortion, but it gives me too much detail, and takes about 10 sec to do a sweep. With that audio spectrum analyzer, adjust it for full scale on the fundamental, and look at the noise and any harmonics. Increase the RF signal level until this drops to 25% (1/4) of the level of the 1kHz tone. :) I have to mod my receiver then, I can't adjust the squelch to hold in that low. These daniels receivers don't come with the ability to run open squelch, unless you hold down a front panel button, which I may change over to a toggle switch. A poor-man's SINAD would have an adjustable amplifier, a relatively sharp filter at 1 kHz, and a voltmeter following it. This might be easier to come up with than a real SINAD meter. I don't have any problem doing the filtering, but not a lot of data out there on how sharp the filter needs to be, or what frequency response the system should have outside the filter. One approach would be to do it with a boxcar integrator, which can act as almost an arbitrarily narrow filter. You average up a copy of the tone, and then subtract that from the output. Another way would be to do it in DSP, and not mess with the analog at all. I'm still an old-timer, and I prefer the 20dBQ method because it's easier to reproduce and only requires a simple AC Voltmeter. True, but it can end up with the bandwidth too narrow. I made that mistake here, and the local 2M club machine, not tuned by me, has the same problem. When the weak guys deviate a bit more than normal, they fall out of the squelch. They aren't over-deviating, it's just that the receiver does better on unmodulated carrier. Plus, I've learned that on MaxTracs, this level of quieting occurs when all the crackles on a dead carrier disappear. I don't even need a meter. If nothing else, it gives me a way of comparing one radio to another just by feeding in a weak signal. Yup, makes a good quick quality check., Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Receiver Tuning
I've noticed that I can get a lot better sensitivity on my receivers if the source I'm measuring against is either unmodulated, or I set the deviation to 1 or 2 kHz. When I get up to 3-5 kHz deviation, the apparent sensitivity of the receiver is significantly less. I notice this on many systems, where a weak station will be in until they talk a little louder, then they drop out. Is there a tuning method I can use to minimize this effect? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Tuning
Depending upon the symmetry of the IF and detector component responses, there will be a difference in the apparent sensitivity with different deviation levels. The operative word is apparent. If you intend to use the receiver for FM voice which averages about 3 kHz deviation, then you should use the EIA standard method of tuning to 12 dB SINAD with 3.0 kHz deviation of a 1 kHz tone. If you optimize the tuning on an unmodulated test signal, then the receiver's sensitivity to voice modulation will likely be poorer than it would be if tuned with a modulated signal. I hear ya, but no sinadder here. So, I can tune to min noise with 3k Dev tone, or anything else I can measure or hear. I wouldn't mind building a sinadder, but I don't know how I'd calibrate it. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Receiver Tuning
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Bob M. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I thought that's the whole idea behind the SINAD measurement method, and why it's so much better than the 20dB quieting method. It may well be, but for those of us without sinadders, then what? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A sad story
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Chuck Kelsey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But you say that the VSWR is good? To the antenna, yes. Cans, I don't know and I suspect not. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: ELT Receiver on Repeater
Anyway, you may have to get a receiver and build something to decode the yelp. If you find a simple way, I'd be interested in adding it again to my repeater network. Why would you need more than a receiver, and the equivalent of a VOX ckt? If you have carrier on 121.5, and there's audio persisting for more than a few seconds, then it's likely an ELT. If not, listening to the audio for a few seconds will resolve that. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A sad story
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Eric Lemmon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lemme see... Doesn't the TLE amplifier have an internal circulator and dummy load? Not that I can see. I could be wrong. If this PA was pumping 100 watts into an antenna system that was a very poor match due to water intrusion, I'd expect that the circulator was putting a lot of power into the load- which may now be a crispy critter. The wet antenna never did show a high SWR, I suspect it failed in dummy-load mode. I expect to open it up and find fried components. The internal construction of the comet GP-9 is pretty dissapointing. It and/or the circulator may have damage, and may be causing the smell. I'm pretty sure I don't have one, unless it's well hidden. I am also really leery of that Comet diplexer- never felt good about using such devices at a remote site. It's not all that remote, it's just a pita for me to get to. And, there's no choice, if we want to do VHF and UHF, we have to do it through one antenna. So.. This is a real head-scratcher! Please share your epilogue with the list, when you get there... I will. I'm hoping that whatever is damaged is something that I can repair/replace. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A sad story
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Chuck Kelsey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, I thought you said that you changed cabling and that's when this started happening. I had a cable on the input to the duplexer, that went to the power amp, that was a nasty chain of adaptors. I replaced that with a short BNC-N cable made with LDF1-50 Take it one step at a time. Starting at the transmitter, take a jumper and check VSWR to a dummy load, then check loss at the end of the jumper. Add one can terminated with the dummy load and check VSWR and then loss again. Keep going till you find where your transmit signal goes haywire. I didn't take it quite that far, but I am putting 100W into the TX side of the cans, and getting nothing measurable out. If your VSWR is good, I'd suspect somehow you've got some real lossy cables in the mix. Divide and conquer. The inter-can cables are the same ones throughout. They both get warm now, but I'm having a hard time believing that BOTH failed. I'll know more when I get it down here for a post-op. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A sad story
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Burt Lang [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is it the interconnect cable that is heating or is it the can that is heating and transferring heat to the cable? No, the cans themselves are cold. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: A sad story
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Jeff DePolo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Now the new cable is in place, and that power that was getting turned into heat is getting delivered to the cans. But, something smells funny, and the interconnect cables between the cans are noticably warm. How much power are you running into the cavities? Just over 100W, according to the bird. I can't think of anything inside the cans that would smell funny with power applied unless there was really something very wrong with them (like a shorted capacitor). At the end, i measured 100W in and nothing out. Not even budging the needle on a 5W slug. As a longshot, is there any chance that your PA is going spurious, which could a) cause excessive heat/loss in the cabling to the off-channel spurs creating high VSWR, and b) the smell could be a component failing in the PA, which could either be a victim of the oscillation, or the cause of the oscillation. Hmm.. This is a motorola TLE amplifier, it worked fine here on the bench, and I didn't see anything on the SA at all, but I did not have it connected with exactly the same cables. Or, the difference in cable length between the old conglomeration and the new patch cable has made the PA unhappy resulting in the spurious condition (again, this is a bit of a longshot, but a plausible explanation). Well, I'm going to pull both and bring them back here for diagnostics. The band-splitter unit (comet) is one that is rated for a kW, and seems ok, other than it had one internal short before that stopped my VHF output, but I don't think there's anything wrong with it now. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] A sad story
It all started when we went up to replace a failing antenna, and a mess of adaptors.. The antenna is a GP-9 that had some water in it, and was slowly turning into a dummy load. I'd had the UHF system running into it through the band coupler with the VHF system, but I could see the output on both systems getting weaker, and I was worried about SWR into the UHF amp, so I commanded that system offline a couple weeks ago. Then I got the flu, and the weather was nasty.. Friday, with clearing weather and head, we went up, thinking that after we replaced the antenna and adaptor mess, we could put the uhf system online. Antenna replacement went well, and then I replaced the adaptor mess with the 6 cable I made from BNC male to N male, replacing a handful of adaptors that I'd kludged into the system originally, to make the distance and two 90 degree bends that were required. This is the adaptor mess that was getting hot. Now the new cable is in place, and that power that was getting turned into heat is getting delivered to the cans. But, something smells funny, and the interconnect cables between the cans are noticably warm. I need to go back up there, and pull the amp and cans, and see what's going on.. I'm just kind of disgusted. These are Wacoms, I don't have the exact model number in front of me, but if I remember right, they were rated for 150W or thereabouts. I had tuned them before, and everything was looking good, but it appears that when the adaptor chain wasn't in the picture sucking up power, I crossed some threshold and damaged the cans. Anyone seen something like this? What are my prospects of repairing these cans? Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Failure to communicate.....
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, JOHN MACKEY [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It has been said that you aren't a REAL HAM until you have passed a 20 WPM morse code test have the license to prove it. A lot of things have been said. Some of them are true. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: What is A Repeater?
why do Hams NOT use an amplified microphone in the FM mode Most of my fm radio mics are amplified. Most of yours are probably amplified with an electret element. But not nearly enough buttons and knobs! :) Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Failure to communicate.....
--- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com, Mike Perryman K5JMP [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have to side with Joe on this one. Having spent time as an Army communicator in some of the worst $#*!-holes on earth with lives on the line... it is the content of the message that has to be communicated. Not punctuation and grammar. It is not a complex mathematical formulae that you are sending... it is communication. There are many different dialects, but the message is the same. Regardless of how it is conveyed. To illustrate the point of keying, waiting, then talking, we came up with this nice and simple test message: DONT SHOOT! You really want to make sure that first word dosen't get dropped! Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Failure to communicate.....
Yup, a sheet full of dots and dashes. Then she went back and translated each Morse character to it's appropriate letter, number, or punctuation. As far as I'm aware that's legal per the FCC. It's not up to the VE groups to arbitrarily tighten the requirements or change the testing procedures. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[Repeater-Builder] Re: Failure to communicate.....
It IS probably legal per the FCC, but do you think they'd give you all that time to decipher the dots and dashes if you went to an FCC office 30 years ago for a code test? They'd laugh you right out of your chair. The rules were different then, and they don't apply now. However, I have seen it explicitly stated that the technique described here is legal. If the intent is to show knowledge of the code, and/or fluency in using it, then you can't copy dots and dashes for 5 minutes and spend the next hour decoding it. There is a time limit. Something like 5 mins IIRC.. Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
