Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods
If you are using flooded lead acid cells, one thing to consider is the use of HydroCaps. These devices reduce both water consumption and gas generation. They are commonly used in both marine and solar power applications. I have used them in back up power applications and they work well as long as you remember that you still have to periodically check water levels.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods
Charging batteries at a site after an extended power failure can be a problem. There are not a lot of automotive/boat applications where the battery is completely discharged like what happens at a radio site after a long power failure. If the charging rate is not current limited a lot of gas can be generated at the site. I worked at Nextel sites where the batteries would actually swell up because of overcharging. A good sign of gassing is that many of the rubber products. like the safety rubber gloves, would get soft and sticky. Current limiting should help stop gassing, but the full charge recovery time will be very long. 73, Joe, K1ike
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods
Hi: I use a liquid I buy at an automotive repair shop that coats the battery connections. Cheap works well, just remember to use gloves when you apply it as it does not come off your skin easily. --- On Tue, 12/1/09, Paul Plack wrote: From: Paul Plack Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, December 1, 2009, 12:42 PM Bingo. My solar powered repeater developed charging issues, and when I went to check, it was due to corrosion on the homebrew charge controller's PC board. 73, Paul, AE4KR - Original Message - From: Mark To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 11:13 AM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods Tom and all, I think I’d be more worried about corrosion issues associated with H2S gas mixing with water vapor and creating sulfuric acid (H2SO4) Mark – N9WYS From: Repeater-Builder@ yahoogroups. com On Behalf Of Chris Quirk Well boats usually do not blow up or catch fire from hydorgen leaking from batteries. It is usually from gasoline vapors or leaking propane. The plastic battery box is a corrosion / spill containment issue. . You add to this that hydrogen rises very quickly as it is much lighter than air and you ask the question how much gas would stay in an enclosed area ? My guess is little to none. --- On Mon, 11/30/09, TGundo 2003 wrote:30, 2009, 3:35 PM Thanks to everyone for the feedback so far!
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods
Bingo. My solar powered repeater developed charging issues, and when I went to check, it was due to corrosion on the homebrew charge controller's PC board. 73, Paul, AE4KR - Original Message - From: Mark To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 11:13 AM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods Tom and all, I think I'd be more worried about corrosion issues associated with H2S gas mixing with water vapor and creating sulfuric acid (H2SO4) Mark - N9WYS From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Chris Quirk Well boats usually do not blow up or catch fire from hydorgen leaking from batteries. It is usually from gasoline vapors or leaking propane. The plastic battery box is a corrosion / spill containment issue. . You add to this that hydrogen rises very quickly as it is much lighter than air and you ask the question how much gas would stay in an enclosed area ? My guess is little to none. --- On Mon, 11/30/09, TGundo 2003 wrote:30, 2009, 3:35 PM Thanks to everyone for the feedback so far!
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods
Tom and all, I think I'd be more worried about corrosion issues associated with H2S gas mixing with water vapor and creating sulfuric acid (H2SO4) Mark - N9WYS From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Chris Quirk Well boats usually do not blow up or catch fire from hydorgen leaking from batteries. It is usually from gasoline vapors or leaking propane. The plastic battery box is a corrosion / spill containment issue. My Jaguar XJ8 L has the battery in the well sealed trunk of the vehicle, I have also owned several cars that the batteries were under the back seat. So Hydrogen gas and venting is a real issue but statically incidents are pretty low from what I can tell Like I said earlier there are repeaters in the same block house that mine is in and they place the batteries in the bottom of the cabinet with no real venting taking place, does not seem to be an issues and as most of the chargers are slow charge with trickle so not a lot of gas released anyway. You add to this that hydrogen rises very quickly as it is much lighter than air and you ask the question how much gas would stay in an enclosed area ? My guess is little to none. --- On Mon, 11/30/09, TGundo 2003 wrote: From: TGundo 2003 Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, November 30, 2009, 3:35 PM Thanks to everyone for the feedback so far! So here is what is bothering me this afternoon. Maybe someone here can shed some light on this for me. The battery I am thinking about using was one I bought a while ago for my boat, but I didn't use it because it was too big for the battery box in the boat (don't ask). I kept it knowing full well I had other uses for it. Thinking about this some more, by law any wet cell battery on a boat must be contained in a battery box. Thinking more about this, I realize that the standard plastic battery box is not really vented, nor completely sealed. In the case of my boat (24' pontoon)has two such batteries, one under the seat in the rear for the motor and the other under the seat in the front for the trolling motor. The compartments under the seats are enclosures in and of themselves. The rear one is charging off the engine during run time. On an afternoon cruise it could run for several hours charging the battery the whole time. So the wet cell battery, in the box by law, is charging in a box with little ventalation. Are boat owners everywhere sitting on ticking hydrogen bombs? Tom W9SRV No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.426 / Virus Database: 270.14.88/2537 - Release Date: 12/01/09 07:59:00 <>
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods
Well boats usually do not blow up or catch fire from hydorgen leaking from batteries. It is usually from gasoline vapors or leaking propane. The plastic battery box is a corrosion / spill containment issue. My Jaguar XJ8 L has the battery in the well sealed trunk of the vehicle, I have also owned several cars that the batteries were under the back seat. So Hydrogen gas and venting is a real issue but statically incidents are pretty low from what I can tell Like I said earlier there are repeaters in the same block house that mine is in and they place the batteries in the bottom of the cabinet with no real venting taking place, does not seem to be an issues and as most of the chargers are slow charge with trickle so not a lot of gas released anyway. You add to this that hydrogen rises very quickly as it is much lighter than air and you ask the question how much gas would stay in an enclosed area ? My guess is little to none. --- On Mon, 11/30/09, TGundo 2003 wrote: From: TGundo 2003 Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, November 30, 2009, 3:35 PM Thanks to everyone for the feedback so far! So here is what is bothering me this afternoon. Maybe someone here can shed some light on this for me. The battery I am thinking about using was one I bought a while ago for my boat, but I didn't use it because it was too big for the battery box in the boat (don't ask). I kept it knowing full well I had other uses for it. Thinking about this some more, by law any wet cell battery on a boat must be contained in a battery box. Thinking more about this, I realize that the standard plastic battery box is not really vented, nor completely sealed. In the case of my boat (24' pontoon)has two such batteries, one under the seat in the rear for the motor and the other under the seat in the front for the trolling motor. The compartments under the seats are enclosures in and of themselves. The rear one is charging off the engine during run time. On an afternoon cruise it could run for several hours charging the battery the whole time. So the wet cell battery, in the box by law, is charging in a box with little ventalation. Are boat owners everywhere sitting on ticking hydrogen bombs? Tom W9SRV
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods
Thanks to everyone for the feedback so far! So here is what is bothering me this afternoon. Maybe someone here can shed some light on this for me. The battery I am thinking about using was one I bought a while ago for my boat, but I didn't use it because it was too big for the battery box in the boat (don't ask). I kept it knowing full well I had other uses for it. Thinking about this some more, by law any wet cell battery on a boat must be contained in a battery box. Thinking more about this, I realize that the standard plastic battery box is not really vented, nor completely sealed. In the case of my boat (24' pontoon)has two such batteries, one under the seat in the rear for the motor and the other under the seat in the front for the trolling motor. The compartments under the seats are enclosures in and of themselves. The rear one is charging off the engine during run time. On an afternoon cruise it could run for several hours charging the battery the whole time. So the wet cell battery, in the box by law, is charging in a box with little ventalation. Are boat owners everywhere sitting on ticking hydrogen bombs? Tom W9SRV
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods
Hi I use a couple of fans that run costatly when the utility power is available, the air sweep is hgh enough to prevent any Hydrogen build up. One fan alone is enough in case one fails. Also have several other repeaters in with me that have deep cycle batteries in the cabinet with no venting. Not been a problem, well so far any way. --- On Sun, 11/29/09, tgundo2003 wrote: From: tgundo2003 Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Batteries for Backup- Methods To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Date: Sunday, November 29, 2009, 9:42 PM I am going to be installing a repeater that has capability for battery backup soon. I have room in the bottom of the cabinet for a couple of batteries. I know If I want to have them in the cabinet then i need to look at AGM type so I don't have to worry about venting & spillage. I can fit 2 120AH AGM batteries in the bottom of the rack, so that's my plan for permanent installation. However, there are "insufficent funds" available to purchase those right now. I do however have a Marine Deep Cycle 120AH battery at my disposal I could use for the time being. It would give me some run time in a power failure. I know that it could not be in the radio cabinet due to the hydrogen venting. My question for the group: Is there a way I can install this for the time being safely? The repeater is in the base of a large water tower that is far from airtight but still enclosed. How much venting would be required? Do I need to vent it outdoors for one battery? Is this a bad idea & I should just wait until I can get the AGM batteries I need? Thank you for any replies. I know we have covered some of this before but searching the archives failed to yield the answer I'm looking for. Tom W9SRV Yahoo! Groups Links
