Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Fernando Della Torre]

Hello Florent!
Congrats!

Your work makes life easier. I'm gonna try to install it ASAP.

Thanks so much!


Regards.

Fernando.


Fernando Della Torre

(16) 98137-1240




Em seg., 30 de nov. de 2020 às 16:12, Florent Peyraud <
fpeyr...@rivendell-fr.org> escreveu:

> OOops, the mail was sent a bit too fast !
>
> Let me add some details ;)
> Le 30/11/2020 à 19:22, Florent Peyraud a écrit :
>
> Hi Fred and all
> Le 24/11/2020 à 15:15, Fred Gleason a écrit :
>
> On Nov 23, 2020, at 20:30, Fernando Della Torre 
> wrote:
>
> I know it's easy to say and hard to do, but surely Rivendell would have a
> larger visibility if it were packed in 2 or more flavors, like RPM and DEB
> pointing to all dependencies it needs and ready for the modern distros,
> whether Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, Fedora, Centos 8, etc. Every time in the past
> I had to complite from source and every update was a kind of a pain.
>
>
> [...]
>
> This is actually a trope in the wider Linux software ecosystem. It is
> common for large applications there to have two layers of ‘developers’; a
> core group (often referred to as ‘upstream’) that does the primary
> application development, and a distribution group (aka ‘downstream’) that
> takes the source code output from upstream and turns it into installable
> packages for particular platforms (distros). So for example, using the
> above terminology, I am one of the 'upstream developers' for Rivendell; I
> am also the ‘downstream maintainer' for Rivendell's RHEL/CentOS
> integration. Rivendell has historically had other downstream maintainers
> for other distros —e.g. the Tryphon group that for many years maintained a
> very solid Debian integration. Unfortunately, when the Tryphon group
> disbanded a few years ago, support for that integration evaporated.
>
> I would welcome others coming aboard as downstream maintainers for their
> distro of choice. To be a downstream maintainer does not require extensive
> programming ability. What it does need is reasonable system administration
> skills, familiarity with building software from source code, and above all
> a good knowledge of the target platform's software packaging and
> distribution system. I will gladly:
>
> 1) Accept PRs from downstream maintainers aimed at making Rivendell work
> better on their platform of choice, and work with their authors to get them
> accepted into the standard Rivendell releases.
>
> 2) Provide space on servers in the ‘rivendellaudio.org’ domain for
> hosting packages, documentation and other materials for supporting
> Rivendell on their platform of choice.
>
> Anyone up for the challenge?
>
> As a former member (founder) of Tryphon company, I've rebooted the
> Rivendell 3 debian/ubuntu packaging with my new company : Draceo. The
> current status is a functional package set working on Ubuntu 18.04, but not
> on Ubuntu 20.04. The reason is dependencies. Some packages are not
> available anymore on Ubuntu 20.04.
>
> You can find informations on https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/
>
> Disclaimer : The ASI cards are not supported, and the manpages are broken.
> I plan to try sticking as close as possible to the rpm package
> segmentation, but for the time being, there are mostly 3 packages :
> rivendell, rivendell-server and librivendell, the doc package is
> rivendell-doc.
>
> As the packages are functional, but may require some more tuning to be
> considered as stable, they are in the UNRELEASED distribution.
>
> In order to install a working instance, the procedure is :
>
> wget -q -O - https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/release.asc | sudo apt-key add -
> echo "deb [ arch=amd64 ] https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/ UNRELEASED main"|sudo 
> tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/rivendell-fr.list
> sudo apt-get update
> sudo apt-get install mariadb-server
> sudo apt-get install rivendell rivendell-server
>
> Any feedback is welcome to help releasing the official package ! The
> current version is 3.4.1int0. but the 3.4.1int5 is ready and I've a working
> process to package upstream releases quite fast, so I'll try to keep as
> close to latest release as possible.
>
> Best regards
>
> Florent
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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Florent Peyraud]

Hi Fred

Le 01/12/2020 à 17:11, Fred Gleason a écrit :



On Nov 30, 2020, at 14:12, Florent Peyraud > wrote:


As the packages are functional, but may require some more tuning to 
be considered as stable, they are in the UNRELEASED distribution.


In order to install a working instance, the procedure is :

wget -q -O -https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/release.asc  | sudo apt-key add -
echo "deb [ arch=amd64 ]https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/  UNRELEASED main"|sudo 
tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/rivendell-fr.list
sudo apt-get update
sudo apt-get install mariadb-server
sudo apt-get install rivendell rivendell-server
This looks really cool. Is there a web page somewhere that contains 
this information? I’m thinking a link on the Rivendell wiki would be 
in order. (I could also simply put all this info into the wiki, but 
then we’ve potential issues with bit-rot when things inevitably change).
There is no such page as for today. I'll do it today or tomorrow and let 
you know, or even change the wiki by myself.



Any feedback is welcome to help releasing the official package ! The 
current version is 3.4.1int0. but the 3.4.1int5 is ready and I've a 
working process to package upstream releases quite fast, so I'll try 
to keep as close to latest release as possible.


FYI: those ‘int’ versions are interim test builds. By all means 
package them, but be aware that they shouldn’t be put into a ‘stable’ 
update stream as they have not been fully tested and could hence hand 
out unpleasant surprises on-air.


Thanks for the advice. I'm looking forward seeing a new stable tag on 
the github repo ;)


Cheers

Florent


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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Florent Peyraud]

Hi Rob

Le 03/12/2020 à 03:56, Rob Landry a écrit :

On Mon, 30 Nov 2020, Florent Peyraud wrote:


Some packages are not available anymore on Ubuntu 20.04.


That troubles me. Since Ubuntu is built on Debian Unstable, that means 
that we are probably no more than two Debian releases away from a time 
when it will no longer be possible to build Rivendell under Debian.


Debian used to be my platform of choice for Rivendell, but lately I've 
been using the CentOS installers. The one recent occasion I had to 
build Rivendell on Debian was on a Raspberry Pi 4, as an experiment. 
Rivendell 2.x would not compile, and while I did get Rivendell 3.x 
installed and running, the process was more complicated and there are 
a lot of new dependencies.


Do I understand correctly that just months after Fred completed the 
long process of porting Rivendell to Qt4, Ubuntu has dropped Qt4?


This is the case :(

Qt4 has been officially dropped in Ubuntu 20.04 LTS in order to 
"encourage" (understand "to force") developers to migrate to Qt6 [1][2]. 
Some PPA exist to install it anyway, but may conflict with some other 
packages. As I wanted to have a stable and maintainable platform with as 
few as possible hacks overriding obsolete packages, I sticked to Ubuntu 
18.04 which will be supported until 2028 (extended LTS). This should let 
us (well.. read "Fred Gleason" ;) ) the time to work on Qt6 migration 
before EoL of 18.04.


Nevertheless, there are also other packages missing, like libmp4v2 IIRC, 
maybe some more... As I needed a solution to upgrade my former customers 
still running 2.10.4 in a country where accentuated characters are so 
common, I focused on a stable transitional solution choosing 18.04. But 
I look forward migrating to 20.04+ ASAP !


Best regards

Florent

[1] 
https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Ubuntu-20.04-LTS-No-Qt4


[2] https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2019-August/004800.html

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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Rob Landry]

On Mon, 30 Nov 2020, Florent Peyraud wrote:


Some packages are not available anymore on Ubuntu 20.04.


That troubles me. Since Ubuntu is built on Debian Unstable, that means 
that we are probably no more than two Debian releases away from a time 
when it will no longer be possible to build Rivendell under Debian.


Debian used to be my platform of choice for Rivendell, but lately I've 
been using the CentOS installers. The one recent occasion I had to build 
Rivendell on Debian was on a Raspberry Pi 4, as an experiment. Rivendell 
2.x would not compile, and while I did get Rivendell 3.x installed and 
running, the process was more complicated and there are a lot of new 
dependencies.


Do I understand correctly that just months after Fred completed the long 
process of porting Rivendell to Qt4, Ubuntu has dropped Qt4?



Rob

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На труд и на подвиги нас вдохновил.
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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Fred Gleason]

> On Nov 30, 2020, at 14:12, Florent Peyraud  wrote:
> 
> As the packages are functional, but may require some more tuning to be 
> considered as stable, they are in the UNRELEASED distribution. 
> 
> In order to install a working instance, the procedure is :
> 
> wget -q -O - https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/release.asc 
>  | sudo apt-key add -
> echo "deb [ arch=amd64 ] https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/ 
>  UNRELEASED main"|sudo tee 
> /etc/apt/sources.list.d/rivendell-fr.list
> sudo apt-get update
> sudo apt-get install mariadb-server
> sudo apt-get install rivendell rivendell-server
This looks really cool. Is there a web page somewhere that contains this 
information? I’m thinking a link on the Rivendell wiki would be in order. (I 
could also simply put all this info into the wiki, but then we’ve potential 
issues with bit-rot when things inevitably change).


> Any feedback is welcome to help releasing the official package ! The current 
> version is 3.4.1int0. but the 3.4.1int5 is ready and I've a working process 
> to package upstream releases quite fast, so I'll try to keep as close to 
> latest release as possible.
> 
FYI: those ‘int’ versions are interim test builds. By all means package them, 
but be aware that they shouldn’t be put into a ‘stable’ update stream as they 
have not been fully tested and could hence hand out unpleasant surprises on-air.

Cheers!


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|   | Paravel Systems |
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| |
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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Florent Peyraud]

OOops, the mail was sent a bit too fast !

Let me add some details ;)

Le 30/11/2020 à 19:22, Florent Peyraud a écrit :


Hi Fred and all

Le 24/11/2020 à 15:15, Fred Gleason a écrit :
On Nov 23, 2020, at 20:30, Fernando Della Torre > wrote:


I know it's easy to say and hard to do, but surely Rivendell would 
have a larger visibility if it were packed in 2 or more flavors, 
like RPM and DEB pointing to all dependencies it needs and ready for 
the modern distros, whether Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, Fedora, Centos 8, 
etc. Every time in the past I had to complite from source and every 
update was a kind of a pain.



[...]
This is actually a trope in the wider Linux software ecosystem. It is 
common for large applications there to have two layers of 
‘developers’; a core group (often referred to as ‘upstream’) that 
does the primary application development, and a distribution group 
(aka ‘downstream’) that takes the source code output from upstream 
and turns it into installable packages for particular platforms 
(distros). So for example, using the above terminology, I am one of 
the 'upstream developers' for Rivendell; I am also the ‘downstream 
maintainer' for Rivendell's RHEL/CentOS integration. Rivendell has 
historically had other downstream maintainers for other distros —e.g. 
the Tryphon group that for many years maintained a very solid Debian 
integration. Unfortunately, when the Tryphon group disbanded a few 
years ago, support for that integration evaporated.


I would welcome others coming aboard as downstream maintainers for 
their distro of choice. To be a downstream maintainer does not 
require extensive programming ability. What it does need is 
reasonable system administration skills, familiarity with building 
software from source code, and above all a good knowledge of the 
target platform's software packaging and distribution system. I will 
gladly:


1) Accept PRs from downstream maintainers aimed at making Rivendell 
work better on their platform of choice, and work with their authors 
to get them accepted into the standard Rivendell releases.


2) Provide space on servers in the ‘rivendellaudio.org 
’ domain for hosting packages, 
documentation and other materials for supporting Rivendell on their 
platform of choice.


Anyone up for the challenge?


As a former member (founder) of Tryphon company, I've rebooted the 
Rivendell 3 debian/ubuntu packaging with my new company : Draceo. The 
current status is a functional package set working on Ubuntu 18.04, 
but not on Ubuntu 20.04. The reason is dependencies. Some packages are 
not available anymore on Ubuntu 20.04.


You can find informations on https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/

Disclaimer : The ASI cards are not supported, and the manpages are 
broken. I plan to try sticking as close as possible to the rpm package 
segmentation, but for the time being, there are mostly 3 packages : 
rivendell, rivendell-server and librivendell, the doc package is 
rivendell-doc.


As the packages are functional, but may require some more tuning to be 
considered as stable, they are in the UNRELEASED distribution.


In order to install a working instance, the procedure is :

wget -q -O - https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/release.asc | sudo apt-key add -
echo "deb [ arch=amd64 ] https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/ UNRELEASED main"|sudo 
tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/rivendell-fr.list
sudo apt-get update
sudo apt-get install mariadb-server
sudo apt-get install rivendell rivendell-server

Any feedback is welcome to help releasing the official package ! The 
current version is 3.4.1int0. but the 3.4.1int5 is ready and I've a 
working process to package upstream releases quite fast, so I'll try to 
keep as close to latest release as possible.


Best regards

Florent

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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Florent Peyraud]

Hi Fred and all

Le 24/11/2020 à 15:15, Fred Gleason a écrit :
On Nov 23, 2020, at 20:30, Fernando Della Torre > wrote:


I know it's easy to say and hard to do, but surely Rivendell would 
have a larger visibility if it were packed in 2 or more flavors, like 
RPM and DEB pointing to all dependencies it needs and ready for the 
modern distros, whether Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, Fedora, Centos 8, etc. 
Every time in the past I had to complite from source and every update 
was a kind of a pain.



[...]
This is actually a trope in the wider Linux software ecosystem. It is 
common for large applications there to have two layers of 
‘developers’; a core group (often referred to as ‘upstream’) that does 
the primary application development, and a distribution group (aka 
‘downstream’) that takes the source code output from upstream and 
turns it into installable packages for particular platforms (distros). 
So for example, using the above terminology, I am one of the 'upstream 
developers' for Rivendell; I am also the ‘downstream maintainer' for 
Rivendell's RHEL/CentOS integration. Rivendell has historically had 
other downstream maintainers for other distros —e.g. the Tryphon group 
that for many years maintained a very solid Debian integration. 
Unfortunately, when the Tryphon group disbanded a few years ago, 
support for that integration evaporated.


I would welcome others coming aboard as downstream maintainers for 
their distro of choice. To be a downstream maintainer does not require 
extensive programming ability. What it does need is reasonable system 
administration skills, familiarity with building software from source 
code, and above all a good knowledge of the target platform's software 
packaging and distribution system. I will gladly:


1) Accept PRs from downstream maintainers aimed at making Rivendell 
work better on their platform of choice, and work with their authors 
to get them accepted into the standard Rivendell releases.


2) Provide space on servers in the ‘rivendellaudio.org 
’ domain for hosting packages, 
documentation and other materials for supporting Rivendell on their 
platform of choice.


Anyone up for the challenge?


As a former member (founder) of Tryphon company, I've rebooted the 
Rivendell 3 debian/ubuntu packaging with my new company : Draceo. The 
current status is a functional package set working on Ubuntu 18.04, but 
not on Ubuntu 20.04. The reason is dependencies. Some packages are not 
available anymore on Ubuntu 20.04.


You can find informations on https://apt.rivendell-fr.org/

Disclaimer : The ASI cards are not supported, and the manpages are 
broken. I plan to try sticking as close as possible to the rpm package 
segmentation, but for the time being, there are mostly 3 packages : 
rivendell, rivendell-server and librivendell, the doc package is 
rivendell-doc.



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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Fred Gleason]

On Nov 23, 2020, at 20:30, Fernando Della Torre  wrote:

> I know it's easy to say and hard to do, but surely Rivendell would have a 
> larger visibility if it were packed in 2 or more flavors, like RPM and DEB 
> pointing to all dependencies it needs and ready for the modern distros, 
> whether Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, Fedora, Centos 8, etc. Every time in the past I 
> had to complite from source and every update was a kind of a pain.

Point taken. However, every one of those distributions have their own unique 
‘style’ (package manager, distribution channel, desktop, support philosophy, 
process management, etc, etc). I’ve concentrated on making Rivendell work 
easily on RHEL/CentOS not out of any sense that other distros are “bad”, but 
because of a simple, brutal fact of time management: the time I spend fiddling 
with distro compatibility is time *not* spent working on and improving the core 
Rivendell system. So, I’ve picked one distro (RHEL/CentOS, more-or-less at 
random) to be the ‘reference platform’ for Rivendell.

This is actually a trope in the wider Linux software ecosystem. It is common 
for large applications there to have two layers of ‘developers’; a core group 
(often referred to as ‘upstream’) that does the primary application 
development, and a distribution group (aka ‘downstream’) that takes the source 
code output from upstream and turns it into installable packages for particular 
platforms (distros). So for example, using the above terminology, I am one of 
the 'upstream developers' for Rivendell; I am also the ‘downstream maintainer' 
for Rivendell's RHEL/CentOS integration. Rivendell has historically had other 
downstream maintainers for other distros —e.g. the Tryphon group that for many 
years maintained a very solid Debian integration. Unfortunately, when the 
Tryphon group disbanded a few years ago, support for that integration 
evaporated.

I would welcome others coming aboard as downstream maintainers for their distro 
of choice. To be a downstream maintainer does not require extensive programming 
ability. What it does need is reasonable system administration skills, 
familiarity with building software from source code, and above all a good 
knowledge of the target platform's software packaging and distribution system. 
I will gladly:

1) Accept PRs from downstream maintainers aimed at making Rivendell work better 
on their platform of choice, and work with their authors to get them accepted 
into the standard Rivendell releases.

2) Provide space on servers in the ‘rivendellaudio.org’ domain for hosting 
packages, documentation and other materials for supporting Rivendell on their 
platform of choice.

Anyone up for the challenge?

Cheers!


|-|
| Frederick F. Gleason, Jr. | Chief Developer |
|   | Paravel Systems |
|-|
|  ... indifference is a militant thing ... when it goes away it  |
|  leaves smoking ruins, where lie citizens bayonetted through the|
|  throat. It is not a children's pastime like mere highway robbery.  |
| |
|  -- Stephen Crane   |
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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Fernando Della Torre]

Hello Robert!

I thank you for the explanations that made me understand important points
about Rivendell and how it is focused.

I had no idea of how hard it is to change a QT version and all the
implications that come with it.

I've been using Centos and other RHEL variants for a couple of years now as
a server operating system (no gui). I may have to tweak some things to make
it behavior as my users expect. They've been working on Ubuntu for the last
years, but now it's time to upgrade it.

I really appreciate all the points you made clear!

Thanks!


Fernando Della Torre

(16) 98137-1240




Em ter., 24 de nov. de 2020 às 00:01, Robert Jeffares <
jeffares.rob...@gmail.com> escreveu:

> Hi Fernando,
>
> Rivendell like all open source projects has developer(s) who have to make
> decisions, and have people to create and manage code.
>
> Linux is available in more distributions than you can count, and while
> many programs run on many distributions, not all will ever run on all.
>
> Each distribution has a team who determine how it will function and each
> distribution generally has a well stated focus. Same goes with
> applications.
>
> Rivendell's development team have made a decision to build on a stable
> platform, currently CentOS 7. CentOS has generally stable versions of
> useful algorithms, and the code runs reliably.
>
> This is important to some thousands of users.
>
> In the true spirit of open source there are versions maintained for Ubuntu
> and Debian, and report of builds on almost all of the possible platforms.
>
> Inevitably QT4 will reach an end date, and the code may have to be ported
> to QT5 or possibly QT6  which will involve a lot of effort because what
> worked previously has to be verified as compatible with the new QT or
> rebuilt from scratch.
>
> The Aegean Stables are nothing on this task.
>
> The new QT will not be like the old QT. Simple changes will create
> incompatibilities because the QT coders are not thinking of end users but
> end results.
>
> So what may look easy is probably a bit more complex. I believe it's being
> worked on.
>
> I don't think the goal of Rivendell is to be more visible. I believe it's
> purpose is to do a job well, incorporate well reasoned additional features,
> and above all maintain reliability.
>
> This is not about growing the market, this is about keeping things
> running. People will come along and be happy to join in.
>
> All of the distributions you mention have their strong points. You should
> be able to get Rivendell to run on any of them, with the fragility that
> comes from unheralded upstream changes that improve performance for
> something, but nuke Rivendell essentials.
>
> Rivendell is like a Lada. It may look ugly, and old tech, but it runs on
> almost anything, best on one or two platforms, and it gets there.
>
> I suggest the 'up to date distro like Ubuntu 20.04' may not be as flash as
> you imagine. I use Ubuntu elsewhere and have been through several
> iterations of stuff not working in "the new version" because this or that
> has changed. Finding the people to maintain various releases of Rivendell,
> when the basic version works fine, is going to be difficult. There are
> people who will make it run on something because they can. But for most
> it's "why?".
>
> You can still contribute to the project I am sure.
>
>
> regards
>
> Robert
>
>
> On 24/11/20 2:30 pm, Fernando Della Torre wrote:
>
> Hello folks.
>
> I've been away for a while and now I've tried to compile Rivendell using
> some up to date distro like Ubuntu 20.04 or Mint 20 with no success at all.
> It complains about QT4, specially about libqt4-sql-mysql.
>
> I'm not a dev (I wish I was) but as far as I understand QT4 it is being
> retired.
> Is there any Rivendell release using QT5 or any newer equivalent ?
>
> I know it's easy to say and hard to do, but surely Rivendell would have a
> larger visibility if it were packed in 2 or more flavors, like RPM and DEB
> pointing to all dependencies it needs and ready for the modern distros,
> whether Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, Fedora, Centos 8, etc. Every time in the past
> I had to complite from source and every update was a kind of a pain.
>
> As I said I wish I was a dev, but I'm just a sysadmin.
>
> I really appreciate the effort of the entire community working on
> Rivendell. Thanks a lot.
>
> Regards,
> Fernando Della Torre
>
> +55 (16) 98137-1240
>
>
>
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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Fernando Della Torre]

Hi Lorne!

Thank you so much for the explanations.

I have tried Rivendell on Centos 7 using the Paravell repositories too.
Works fine although I used set some things slighty different in the old
times (rivendell 2 over ubuntu 10.04, I think)

It's a pity QT has to be rewritten upon a new version, it would be amazing
if it was backward code compatible.

Yesterday I tried myself compiling Rivendell 3.4 using Ubuntu 18.04 and
Debian 10.6 (buster). Ubuntu fails at compile time and Debian fails at
install time. I didn't get time to get deeper.
Ubuntu 20.04 really seems very harder due QT4. I have found an unofficial
repository with QT4 packages but I could not find libqt4-sql-mysql. :(

Regards


Fernando Della Torre

(16) 98137-1240




Em seg., 23 de nov. de 2020 às 23:20, Lorne Tyndale 
escreveu:

> Hi Fernando,
>
> I can't speak for the developers or QT5, but from what I understand the
> current Version 3 branch will be staying with QT4.  Changing to a newer
> version of QT would be a significant update to code, so I would not
> expect to see migration to QT5 (or higher) until a Rivendell Version 4
> branch.
>
> Having said that, if you want an easy to install and update experience,
> the best option is to grab CentOS7 and install Rivendell from the
> Paravel repositories.  You can find instructions on this here:
>
>
> http://static.paravelsystems.com/rivendell-install-rd3/rivendell-install-rhel7.html
>
> I've done this and it really is a very smooth and easy installation.
> Furthermore when a new version comes out the command to update is very
> easy:
>
> yum update rivendell
>
> Otherwise if you want to run Rivendell on something else, then you're
> pretty much on your own to compile it or rely on others in the community
> and use their binaries (such as the Raspberry PI distribution).
>
> Rivendell does compile and run on Ubuntu 18.04 based distributions (and
> probably the version of Debian that 18.04 is based on, although I have
> not tried this).  I've actually started putting together some directions
> on how to compile on 18.04, I'm hoping to post these sometime this week
> on the wiki.  Ubuntu 20.04 might be more of a challenge due to its
> default QT packages being QT5.  I've seen some posts about repositories
> that contain QT4 for 20.04.  This might be a way to get Rivendell to run
> on 20.04, but I admit that I have not tried this so I don't know how
> well it'll work.
>
> Lorne Tyndale
>
> >
> >
> > Hello folks.
> >
> > I've been away for a while and now I've tried to compile Rivendell using
> > some up to date distro like Ubuntu 20.04 or Mint 20 with no success at
> all.
> > It complains about QT4, specially about libqt4-sql-mysql.
> >
> > I'm not a dev (I wish I was) but as far as I understand QT4 it is being
> > retired.
> > Is there any Rivendell release using QT5 or any newer equivalent ?
> >
> > I know it's easy to say and hard to do, but surely Rivendell would have a
> > larger visibility if it were packed in 2 or more flavors, like RPM and
> DEB
> > pointing to all dependencies it needs and ready for the modern distros,
> > whether Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, Fedora, Centos 8, etc. Every time in the
> past
> > I had to complite from source and every update was a kind of a pain.
> >
> > As I said I wish I was a dev, but I'm just a sysadmin.
> >
> > I really appreciate the effort of the entire community working on
> > Rivendell. Thanks a lot.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Fernando Della Torre
> >
> > +55 (16) 98137-1240___
> > Rivendell-dev mailing list
> > Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org
> > http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
>
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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Robert Jeffares]

Hi Fernando,

Rivendell like all open source projects has developer(s) who have to 
make decisions, and have people to create and manage code.


Linux is available in more distributions than you can count, and while 
many programs run on many distributions, not all will ever run on all.


Each distribution has a team who determine how it will function and each 
distribution generally has a well stated focus. Same goes with 
applications.


Rivendell's development team have made a decision to build on a stable 
platform, currently CentOS 7. CentOS has generally stable versions of 
useful algorithms, and the code runs reliably.


This is important to some thousands of users.

In the true spirit of open source there are versions maintained for 
Ubuntu and Debian, and report of builds on almost all of the possible 
platforms.


Inevitably QT4 will reach an end date, and the code may have to be 
ported to QT5 or possibly QT6  which will involve a lot of effort 
because what worked previously has to be verified as compatible with the 
new QT or rebuilt from scratch.


The Aegean Stables are nothing on this task.

The new QT will not be like the old QT. Simple changes will create 
incompatibilities because the QT coders are not thinking of end users 
but end results.


So what may look easy is probably a bit more complex. I believe it's 
being worked on.


I don't think the goal of Rivendell is to be more visible. I believe 
it's purpose is to do a job well, incorporate well reasoned additional 
features, and above all maintain reliability.


This is not about growing the market, this is about keeping things 
running. People will come along and be happy to join in.


All of the distributions you mention have their strong points. You 
should be able to get Rivendell to run on any of them, with the 
fragility that comes from unheralded upstream changes that improve 
performance for something, but nuke Rivendell essentials.


Rivendell is like a Lada. It may look ugly, and old tech, but it runs on 
almost anything, best on one or two platforms, and it gets there.


I suggest the 'up to date distro like Ubuntu 20.04' may not be as flash 
as you imagine. I use Ubuntu elsewhere and have been through several 
iterations of stuff not working in "the new version" because this or 
that has changed. Finding the people to maintain various releases of 
Rivendell, when the basic version works fine, is going to be difficult. 
There are people who will make it run on something because they can. But 
for most it's "why?".


You can still contribute to the project I am sure.


regards

Robert


On 24/11/20 2:30 pm, Fernando Della Torre wrote:

Hello folks.

I've been away for a while and now I've tried to compile Rivendell 
using some up to date distro like Ubuntu 20.04 or Mint 20 with no 
success at all.

It complains about QT4, specially about libqt4-sql-mysql.

I'm not a dev (I wish I was) but as far as I understand QT4 it is 
being retired.

Is there any Rivendell release using QT5 or any newer equivalent ?

I know it's easy to say and hard to do, but surely Rivendell would 
have a larger visibility if it were packed in 2 or more flavors, like 
RPM and DEB pointing to all dependencies it needs and ready for the 
modern distros, whether Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, Fedora, Centos 8, etc. 
Every time in the past I had to complite from source and every update 
was a kind of a pain.


As I said I wish I was a dev, but I'm just a sysadmin.

I really appreciate the effort of the entire community working on 
Rivendell. Thanks a lot.


Regards,
Fernando Della Torre

+55 (16) 98137-1240



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64 Warner Park Avenue
Laingholm
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New Zealand

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Re: [RDD] Rivendell Future

[Lorne Tyndale]

Hi Fernando,

I can't speak for the developers or QT5, but from what I understand the
current Version 3 branch will be staying with QT4.  Changing to a newer
version of QT would be a significant update to code, so I would not
expect to see migration to QT5 (or higher) until a Rivendell Version 4
branch.

Having said that, if you want an easy to install and update experience,
the best option is to grab CentOS7 and install Rivendell from the
Paravel repositories.  You can find instructions on this here:

http://static.paravelsystems.com/rivendell-install-rd3/rivendell-install-rhel7.html

I've done this and it really is a very smooth and easy installation. 
Furthermore when a new version comes out the command to update is very
easy: 

yum update rivendell

Otherwise if you want to run Rivendell on something else, then you're
pretty much on your own to compile it or rely on others in the community
and use their binaries (such as the Raspberry PI distribution).

Rivendell does compile and run on Ubuntu 18.04 based distributions (and
probably the version of Debian that 18.04 is based on, although I have
not tried this).  I've actually started putting together some directions
on how to compile on 18.04, I'm hoping to post these sometime this week
on the wiki.  Ubuntu 20.04 might be more of a challenge due to its
default QT packages being QT5.  I've seen some posts about repositories
that contain QT4 for 20.04.  This might be a way to get Rivendell to run
on 20.04, but I admit that I have not tried this so I don't know how
well it'll work.

Lorne Tyndale

> 
> 
> Hello folks.
> 
> I've been away for a while and now I've tried to compile Rivendell using
> some up to date distro like Ubuntu 20.04 or Mint 20 with no success at all.
> It complains about QT4, specially about libqt4-sql-mysql.
> 
> I'm not a dev (I wish I was) but as far as I understand QT4 it is being
> retired.
> Is there any Rivendell release using QT5 or any newer equivalent ?
> 
> I know it's easy to say and hard to do, but surely Rivendell would have a
> larger visibility if it were packed in 2 or more flavors, like RPM and DEB
> pointing to all dependencies it needs and ready for the modern distros,
> whether Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, Fedora, Centos 8, etc. Every time in the past
> I had to complite from source and every update was a kind of a pain.
> 
> As I said I wish I was a dev, but I'm just a sysadmin.
> 
> I really appreciate the effort of the entire community working on
> Rivendell. Thanks a lot.
> 
> Regards,
> Fernando Della Torre
> 
> +55 (16) 98137-1240___
> Rivendell-dev mailing list
> Rivendell-dev@lists.rivendellaudio.org
> http://caspian.paravelsystems.com/mailman/listinfo/rivendell-dev
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[RDD] Rivendell Future

[Fernando Della Torre]

Hello folks.

I've been away for a while and now I've tried to compile Rivendell using
some up to date distro like Ubuntu 20.04 or Mint 20 with no success at all.
It complains about QT4, specially about libqt4-sql-mysql.

I'm not a dev (I wish I was) but as far as I understand QT4 it is being
retired.
Is there any Rivendell release using QT5 or any newer equivalent ?

I know it's easy to say and hard to do, but surely Rivendell would have a
larger visibility if it were packed in 2 or more flavors, like RPM and DEB
pointing to all dependencies it needs and ready for the modern distros,
whether Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, Fedora, Centos 8, etc. Every time in the past
I had to complite from source and every update was a kind of a pain.

As I said I wish I was a dev, but I'm just a sysadmin.

I really appreciate the effort of the entire community working on
Rivendell. Thanks a lot.

Regards,
Fernando Della Torre

+55 (16) 98137-1240
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