Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
G'day, Many thanks to Heracles, Amos, James and Peter. I think, time will tell, I have got it working. Firstly I disabled by Firewall, hoping the modem's one is good enough. Turns out there is a problem with my modem. There are numerous threads about regarding it not connecting, something to with DNS serving. So I updated the firmware (from B02 to B13) and know everything is working as it should without have to change any settings from the norm, and the connection has stayed up. So, all is well with my Linux again :-) Thanks again, Muz. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Friday 14 September 2007 07:54:04 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don't know if this helps, but I have managed to disable the ADSL connection to my windows machine by installing a firewall. Enable it and I can't connect to the web, even though firefox is an allowed program. When I disable it, everything is working again. More head scratching... Typically your modem is a router giving DHCP information to the network machines. In this case a firewall does NOTHING positive for you: The modem forwards NOTHING to your machine, so no firewall is indicated. Ubuntu has no built in firewall, others need to have it turned off. You need to have DHCP enabled or else you must know all the network details: modem IP, DNS servers, your own IP etc. Likewise a firewall on your windows machine is valueless. Typically your firewall must allow ESTABLISHED,RELATED back but eg guarddog for ubuntu does not. Who knows what your firewall is doing. Don't use it. (The modem/router allows nothing from out to in and allows all inside stuff back [and it gets very complicated]) Now you can start: can you ping your modem? can you ping when you can't connect to internet? James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
G'day, Thanks for the description, I knew some of it, and this filled in the blanks. The reason I am swapping the phone plug is more laziness, that's the closest connection and I haven't bother to get all the plugs, leads, etc and set it properly yet. (Just moved into our new house, and also I don't want to leave leads running down the hallway where my kids can pull on them.) All the lights are doing what they are suppose to do. I have been using my broadband connection with Windows to send all these emails. So, its probably my setup then. I did have to add 10.1.1.1 to the hosts list to be able to talk to the modem in the first place. I couldn't connect just now until after I removed this. But my system connects 1 in 5 turns. So I downloaded my emails and did reply to your email. But before I could finish, my PC stopped communicating again. I haven't been able to get it up and running again, but all I did was deactived and reactive the ethO connection. The connection on my lappy, running Windows, has stayed up and running, so I'm retyping my reply on it. Now to tackle a software or authentication problem... Thanks again, Muz This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
G'day Don't know if this helps, but I have managed to disable the ADSL connection to my windows machine by installing a firewall. Enable it and I can't connect to the web, even though firefox is an allowed program. When I disable it, everything is working again. More head scratching... Muz. Quoting Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED]: G'day, Thanks for the description, I knew some of it, and this filled in the blanks. The reason I am swapping the phone plug is more laziness, that's the closest connection and I haven't bother to get all the plugs, leads, etc and set it properly yet. (Just moved into our new house, and also I don't want to leave leads running down the hallway where my kids can pull on them.) All the lights are doing what they are suppose to do. I have been using my broadband connection with Windows to send all these emails. So, its probably my setup then. I did have to add 10.1.1.1 to the hosts list to be able to talk to the modem in the first place. I couldn't connect just now until after I removed this. But my system connects 1 in 5 turns. So I downloaded my emails and did reply to your email. But before I could finish, my PC stopped communicating again. I haven't been able to get it up and running again, but all I did was deactived and reactive the ethO connection. The connection on my lappy, running Windows, has stayed up and running, so I'm retyping my reply on it. Now to tackle a software or authentication problem... Thanks again, Muz This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 20:53 +0800, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm a complete novice when it comes to setting up networks, and I'm running an ADSL router (D-Link 504T) on Ubuntu 6.06LTS (Drapper?). Turning of my firewall, through Firestarte, doesn't help. I wouldn't have a glue how to setup the network settings. When I was using a 504T as a router, the Linux clients on my network had a lot of problems with the modem's built-in nameserver. Windows clients would work just fine, OSX would work, but I seem to recall it logging errors with name resolution, and 9 times out of 10 Linux just wouldn't work with it at all. Somewhere else in the thread, Heracles talked about changing your Linux machine's DNS server. If that didn't help, I'd suggest checking your ISP's support pages for their name server address, and use that instead. Cheers, -- Pete -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 I know it is not ideal, but one thing to try is to check with your ISP and get the address of the DNSs. try these in the DNS area of the setup to see if that works. If it does then you will have to edit your dhclient.conf to make them stick. To do this you need to start a terminal then type sudo su - press enter and put in your password. This will make you root until you close the terminal or exit. cd /etc/dhcp3 vi dhclient.conf i //this takes you to insert mode move to the line that starts prepend... change the DNS from 127.0.0.1 to your ISPs DNS address press escape //This takes you back to command mode :wq //This is command write the file and quit vi //NOTE: the colon (:) is required Then exit and close the terminal. This is necessary because this file probes for DNS each time it is run (check out the line after the one you edited) and will change anything you put in your network settings dialog box. NOTE: If you do this and it works you will be bypassing your router and its firewall. Heracles Murray wrote: G'day Don't know if this helps, but I have managed to disable the ADSL connection to my windows machine by installing a firewall. Enable it and I can't connect to the web, even though firefox is an allowed program. When I disable it, everything is working again. More head scratching... Muz. Quoting Murray [EMAIL PROTECTED]: G'day, Thanks for the description, I knew some of it, and this filled in the blanks. The reason I am swapping the phone plug is more laziness, that's the closest connection and I haven't bother to get all the plugs, leads, etc and set it properly yet. (Just moved into our new house, and also I don't want to leave leads running down the hallway where my kids can pull on them.) All the lights are doing what they are suppose to do. I have been using my broadband connection with Windows to send all these emails. So, its probably my setup then. I did have to add 10.1.1.1 to the hosts list to be able to talk to the modem in the first place. I couldn't connect just now until after I removed this. But my system connects 1 in 5 turns. So I downloaded my emails and did reply to your email. But before I could finish, my PC stopped communicating again. I haven't been able to get it up and running again, but all I did was deactived and reactive the ethO connection. The connection on my lappy, running Windows, has stayed up and running, so I'm retyping my reply on it. Now to tackle a software or authentication problem... Thanks again, Muz This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFG6eeoybPcBAs9CE8RAjaZAJ9v/py80gBvxlnPNE/+lOPzkvGQWQCgl351 GzvvCSxZu2vXzoqxLuSNlp8= =s3Xs -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
On Friday 14 September 2007 07:54:04 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don't know if this helps, but I have managed to disable the ADSL connection to my windows machine by installing a firewall. Enable it and I can't connect to the web, even though firefox is an allowed program. When I disable it, everything is working again. More head scratching... Typically your modem is a router giving DHCP information to the network machines. In this case a firewall does NOTHING positive for you: The modem forwards NOTHING to your machine, so no firewall is indicated. Ubuntu has no built in firewall, others need to have it turned off. You need to have DHCP enabled or else you must know all the network details: modem IP, DNS servers, your own IP etc. Likewise a firewall on your windows machine is valueless. Typically your firewall must allow ESTABLISHED,RELATED back but eg guarddog for ubuntu does not. Who knows what your firewall is doing. Don't use it. (The modem/router allows nothing from out to in and allows all inside stuff back [and it gets very complicated]) Now you can start: can you ping your modem? can you ping when you can't connect to internet? James -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
G'day Heracles, This worked, but I'm not sure exactly which address the DNS of my modem is. There is a WAN address and a LAN address, I used both. Also, the connection drops out after a couple of minutes. So still something is a miss. To get it up and running again, I have to deactivate then reactive the eth0 connection. I'm happy to get my hands dirty in the command line, if this helps. Thanks for your help, Muz. Heracles wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Murray, Firstly, go to the System menu then Administration. - From the Administration menu select network. This brings up a dialog with both your ethernet card and modem. select the wired connection (this is eth0 usually) and click properties. Automatic configuration(DHCP) should be showing and no other entries. Next click OK and select the DNS tab. In here put the DNS of your D-Link router (ADSL modem). Click close and open Firefox. It may respond a little slowly, but it should work fine. Heracles [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: G'day Slug, Just upgraded to broadband, and discovered that I can't access the web through my Linux partition. To my disappointment Windows can :-( I can do ftp on Linux, so it must just be some setting somewhere (I hope) I'm a complete novice when it comes to setting up networks, and I'm running an ADSL router (D-Link 504T) on Ubuntu 6.06LTS (Drapper?). Turning of my firewall, through Firestarte, doesn't help. I wouldn't have a glue how to setup the network settings. Can some kind soul direct me on how to get Ubuntu talking to the net again? TIA. Murray -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFG5UzcybPcBAs9CE8RAkECAKCOur9Z9ydU4yxGh/tfvjhpm3MwewCfZNsA rkXzIzcXPG0/Oy0aUGm34GY= =+m34 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Murray, It should not drop out. However, two things to check: 1. Do you have an inline filter on all phones that connect to the same line as the router(you don't need one for the router)? If you don't this will cause problems such as poor connections and dropouts. 2. When the dropouts occur, does the router/modem drop the connection or just the computer? I should have remembered that dhclient.conf in the /etc/dhcp3 subdirectory resets it automatically when it poles so if you check the Network admin dialog you will see that the DNS has been corrected automatically for you. Hope that helps Heracles Murray Waldron wrote: G'day Heracles, This worked, but I'm not sure exactly which address the DNS of my modem is. There is a WAN address and a LAN address, I used both. Also, the connection drops out after a couple of minutes. So still something is a miss. To get it up and running again, I have to deactivate then reactive the eth0 connection. I'm happy to get my hands dirty in the command line, if this helps. Thanks for your help, Muz. Heracles wrote: Hi Murray, Firstly, go to the System menu then Administration. - From the Administration menu select network. This brings up a dialog with both your ethernet card and modem. select the wired connection (this is eth0 usually) and click properties. Automatic configuration(DHCP) should be showing and no other entries. Next click OK and select the DNS tab. In here put the DNS of your D-Link router (ADSL modem). Click close and open Firefox. It may respond a little slowly, but it should work fine. Heracles [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: G'day Slug, Just upgraded to broadband, and discovered that I can't access the web through my Linux partition. To my disappointment Windows can :-( I can do ftp on Linux, so it must just be some setting somewhere (I hope) I'm a complete novice when it comes to setting up networks, and I'm running an ADSL router (D-Link 504T) on Ubuntu 6.06LTS (Drapper?). Turning of my firewall, through Firestarte, doesn't help. I wouldn't have a glue how to setup the network settings. Can some kind soul direct me on how to get Ubuntu talking to the net again? TIA. Murray -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFG5ntbybPcBAs9CE8RAhtGAJsHANsPkpe4QF9e/bLnk4j6/xNE1QCeJCu1 nG+1iRY38+Fu57pweQLSwGw= =7bIm -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
On 11/09/2007, Murray Waldron [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: G'day Heracles, This worked, but I'm not sure exactly which address the DNS of my modem is. There is a WAN address and a LAN address, I used both. You should use LAN (stands for LOCAL Area Network), usually has one of 10.a.b.c or 192.168.x.y kind of addresses. And I suspect it was a typo on Heracles part and he meant to refer to the modem's internal IP address (again - LAN). --Amos -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
G'day Heracles, The connection dropping out was only a one off. It was the modem that dropped out. I had already set up the connections for eth0, and the computer picked the LAN address of the modem. 10.1.1.1. To get the connection to work, I needed to type in the WAN address. But this only worked once. Later on when I tried it I couldn't get it to work again. I have been unplugging the phone to plug in the modem. Typing in the WAN address doesn't seem right. To add to the mystery, my laptop, running Ubuntu 6.06, will work fine on my father-in-laws connection, but no dice on mine. Could there be some setting the modem/router thats not right? Thanks again, Muz. Quoting Heracles [EMAIL PROTECTED]: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Murray, It should not drop out. However, two things to check: 1. Do you have an inline filter on all phones that connect to the same line as the router(you don't need one for the router)? If you don't this will cause problems such as poor connections and dropouts. 2. When the dropouts occur, does the router/modem drop the connection or just the computer? I should have remembered that dhclient.conf in the /etc/dhcp3 subdirectory resets it automatically when it poles so if you check the Network admin dialog you will see that the DNS has been corrected automatically for you. Hope that helps Heracles Murray Waldron wrote: G'day Heracles, This worked, but I'm not sure exactly which address the DNS of my modem is. There is a WAN address and a LAN address, I used both. Also, the connection drops out after a couple of minutes. So still something is a miss. To get it up and running again, I have to deactivate then reactive the eth0 connection. I'm happy to get my hands dirty in the command line, if this helps. Thanks for your help, Muz. Heracles wrote: Hi Murray, Firstly, go to the System menu then Administration. - From the Administration menu select network. This brings up a dialog with both your ethernet card and modem. select the wired connection (this is eth0 usually) and click properties. Automatic configuration(DHCP) should be showing and no other entries. Next click OK and select the DNS tab. In here put the DNS of your D-Link router (ADSL modem). Click close and open Firefox. It may respond a little slowly, but it should work fine. Heracles [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: G'day Slug, Just upgraded to broadband, and discovered that I can't access the web through my Linux partition. To my disappointment Windows can :-( I can do ftp on Linux, so it must just be some setting somewhere (I hope) I'm a complete novice when it comes to setting up networks, and I'm running an ADSL router (D-Link 504T) on Ubuntu 6.06LTS (Drapper?). Turning of my firewall, through Firestarte, doesn't help. I wouldn't have a glue how to setup the network settings. Can some kind soul direct me on how to get Ubuntu talking to the net again? TIA. Murray -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFG5ntbybPcBAs9CE8RAhtGAJsHANsPkpe4QF9e/bLnk4j6/xNE1QCeJCu1 nG+1iRY38+Fu57pweQLSwGw= =7bIm -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Murray, The 10.1.1.1 LAN address is the one to use. Your ADSL modem is also a router and acts as the DNS (it actually points to your ISPs DNSs) and DHCP server for you. That is why you use its internal LAN address. Now let's go over a few things as I'm not sure of your familiarity with networking. If I cover stuff you know please forgive me. Firstly, I am assuming that you only have the one phone outlet in your home. You should have received a double adapter with your ADSL modem. This connects to the outlet socket and allows the connection of the phone and the modem at the same time. It should be clearly marked: |Phone Line| |ADSL NOTE: if there is another outlet to a phone in your home then it will need an inline filter as phones constantly draw a little power through the line. (This setup allows you to make calls at the same time as you are using your internet.) You said that you pull the phone out and use the socket for the modem. On the modem do the Power, Ethernet, ADSL and PPP lights come on and stay on (no blinking)? ( am also assuming you connect with Ethernet and not usb) If they don't then there is a problem in the physical layer. This is usually a poor connection, an unfiltered phone in the house or a noisy line. The first two we can usually check for and solve, the third is the Telco's problem. If all the noted lights are on we have a software or possibly authentication problem. This we can solve. Check these and let me know. Heracles [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: G'day Heracles, The connection dropping out was only a one off. It was the modem that dropped out. I had already set up the connections for eth0, and the computer picked the LAN address of the modem. 10.1.1.1. To get the connection to work, I needed to type in the WAN address. But this only worked once. Later on when I tried it I couldn't get it to work again. I have been unplugging the phone to plug in the modem. Typing in the WAN address doesn't seem right. To add to the mystery, my laptop, running Ubuntu 6.06, will work fine on my father-in-laws connection, but no dice on mine. Could there be some setting the modem/router thats not right? Thanks again, Muz. Quoting Heracles [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi Murray, It should not drop out. However, two things to check: 1. Do you have an inline filter on all phones that connect to the same line as the router(you don't need one for the router)? If you don't this will cause problems such as poor connections and dropouts. 2. When the dropouts occur, does the router/modem drop the connection or just the computer? I should have remembered that dhclient.conf in the /etc/dhcp3 subdirectory resets it automatically when it poles so if you check the Network admin dialog you will see that the DNS has been corrected automatically for you. Hope that helps Heracles Murray Waldron wrote: G'day Heracles, This worked, but I'm not sure exactly which address the DNS of my modem is. There is a WAN address and a LAN address, I used both. Also, the connection drops out after a couple of minutes. So still something is a miss. To get it up and running again, I have to deactivate then reactive the eth0 connection. I'm happy to get my hands dirty in the command line, if this helps. Thanks for your help, Muz. Heracles wrote: Hi Murray, Firstly, go to the System menu then Administration. - From the Administration menu select network. This brings up a dialog with both your ethernet card and modem. select the wired connection (this is eth0 usually) and click properties. Automatic configuration(DHCP) should be showing and no other entries. Next click OK and select the DNS tab. In here put the DNS of your D-Link router (ADSL modem). Click close and open Firefox. It may respond a little slowly, but it should work fine. Heracles [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: G'day Slug, Just upgraded to broadband, and discovered that I can't access the web through my Linux partition. To my disappointment Windows can :-( I can do ftp on Linux, so it must just be some setting somewhere (I hope) I'm a complete novice when it comes to setting up networks, and I'm running an ADSL router (D-Link 504T) on Ubuntu 6.06LTS (Drapper?). Turning of my firewall, through Firestarte, doesn't help. I wouldn't have a glue how to setup the network settings. Can some kind soul direct me on how to get Ubuntu talking to the net again? TIA. Murray - -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla -
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
On 12/09/2007, Heracles [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If they don't then there is a problem in the physical layer. This is usually a poor connection, an unfiltered phone in the house or a noisy line. The first two we can usually check for and solve, the third is the Or the modem being connected through a filter, too. The filter should only be used for anything BUT the ADSL modem. That's why you should put the filter after the splitter and only on the phone's cable. --Amos -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
[SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
G'day Slug, Just upgraded to broadband, and discovered that I can't access the web through my Linux partition. To my disappointment Windows can :-( I can do ftp on Linux, so it must just be some setting somewhere (I hope) I'm a complete novice when it comes to setting up networks, and I'm running an ADSL router (D-Link 504T) on Ubuntu 6.06LTS (Drapper?). Turning of my firewall, through Firestarte, doesn't help. I wouldn't have a glue how to setup the network settings. Can some kind soul direct me on how to get Ubuntu talking to the net again? TIA. Murray -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
Re: [SLUG] Can't access web through Broadband
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Hi Murray, Firstly, go to the System menu then Administration. - From the Administration menu select network. This brings up a dialog with both your ethernet card and modem. select the wired connection (this is eth0 usually) and click properties. Automatic configuration(DHCP) should be showing and no other entries. Next click OK and select the DNS tab. In here put the DNS of your D-Link router (ADSL modem). Click close and open Firefox. It may respond a little slowly, but it should work fine. Heracles [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: G'day Slug, Just upgraded to broadband, and discovered that I can't access the web through my Linux partition. To my disappointment Windows can :-( I can do ftp on Linux, so it must just be some setting somewhere (I hope) I'm a complete novice when it comes to setting up networks, and I'm running an ADSL router (D-Link 504T) on Ubuntu 6.06LTS (Drapper?). Turning of my firewall, through Firestarte, doesn't help. I wouldn't have a glue how to setup the network settings. Can some kind soul direct me on how to get Ubuntu talking to the net again? TIA. Murray -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFG5UzcybPcBAs9CE8RAkECAKCOur9Z9ydU4yxGh/tfvjhpm3MwewCfZNsA rkXzIzcXPG0/Oy0aUGm34GY= =+m34 -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- SLUG - Sydney Linux User's Group Mailing List - http://slug.org.au/ Subscription info and FAQs: http://slug.org.au/faq/mailinglists.html
