Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Ahmidou Lyazidi]

gt; I also wrote a dedicated clothing transfer tool
>> which allows weights
>> to be painted on our main character, then
>> transferred and refit onto
>> the other characters while accounting for changes
>> in proportions of
>> limbs and torso, for example.
>>
>>     It's a very solvable problem if you crack open the
>> script editor.
>>
>> Matt
>>
>> *From:*softimage-bounces@__listproc.autodesk.com
>> <mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
>> [mailto:softimage-bounces@__listproc.autodesk.com
>>
>> <mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>]
>> *On Behalf Of *Siew
>> Yi Liang
>> *Sent:* Monday, February 17, 2014 10:29 AM
>> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.__com
>> <mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: Paint weights across multiple
>> envelopes? And symmetry
>> mapping errors
>>
>> The problem is...my mesh is already split up into
>> pieces when i was
>> starting to weight them. The full body mesh
>> doesn't exist anymore, the
>> hidden faces are already gone. :X
>>
>> Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and
>> merging it together
>> while trying to preserve the existing weighting so
>> I could continue
>> working on it and then GATOR the weights back to
>> the seperated geo
>> later, but merging the geo together even while
>> transferring all
>> attributes seemed to remove the weighting from the
>> character
>> entirely...
>>
>> I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and
>> paint the weights
>> manually at this point via numerical input. It's a
>> pain, but right now
>> I don't know of any other method that wouldn't be
>> overly troublesome,
>> short of modeling the hidden polys again and
>> combining them back into
>> the body mesh. The lack of ability to mirror
>> weights on the head is
>> going to be a real pain to get the rig to behave
>> symmetrically though.
>>
>> Hopefully the paint tools get an update eventually
>> for this sort of
>> thing...I never even knew painting across multiple
>> meshes was an
>> issue, no wonder it's recommend to model unibody
>> in XSI. Oh well,
>> something new every day! :P
>>
>> Thanks for the advice all!
>>
>> Yours sincerely,
>> Siew Yi Liang
>>
>> On 2/17/2014 3:14 AM, Greg Maguire wrote:
>>
>> This is my preferred method too. ILM had a
>> really cool concept I'd
>> like to see in Soft. Instead of painting with
>> the radius of a
>> circle, make the brush three dimensional like
>> a ball. Wings can be
>> tricky, I generally chop the top or bottom
>> part of a wing off and
>> Gator everything. However a 3D ball would
>> remove that need.
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:08 AM, Mirko Jankovic
>> > <mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>
>> <mailto:mirkoj.animator@gmail.__com
>>
>> <mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>   

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Eric Thivierge]

Yeah it did, so get on compiling us some custom objects plug-ins with 
pretty icons Alan!!


On Tuesday, February 18, 2014 4:28:14 PM, Alan Fregtman wrote:

/>> Just wish there was the option to have more shapes for nulls.../

Didn't SI2014 come with a "custom primitive" SDK enhancement?



On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 3:32 PM, Adam Sale mailto:adamfs...@gmail.com>> wrote:

I've requested the primitive bone fix for sym maps about 6 times
now...
Nulls are it as an alternative. Just wish there was the option to
have more shapes for nulls as well as offsetting orientation in
the shadows.


On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Eric Thivierge
mailto:ethivie...@hybride.com>> wrote:

If you're using the implicit bones with success and don't need
any of the benefits of the Softimage bone chains just use
Nulls. It's typically what I"m using.

Eric T.


On Monday, February 17, 2014 3:16:29 PM, Siew Yi Liang wrote:

@Matt Morris: I didn't know that actually, that is
fantastic! Going to
try it ASAP~

@Matt Lind: I know, I should pick up more scripting
knowledge... I
only just started recently working with the XSI API (and
python in
general), so gimme a chance to catch up to you guys :D

@Eric: That explains it. I was wondering why it was
working with my
main biped rig but not with the facial rig. (my biped rig
is using
nulls for deformers but I found out about implicit bones
halfway and
wanted to use them to see if I could then have a distinct
type for
them so that my controls could be selected using the null
selection
filter and my deformers using the bone filter instead.) So
would  you
would recommend sticking with nulls/standard bones for
defomers?

Thanks a ton guys! Once I get a chance in the next few
days I'll try
GATORing the weights over to a merged mesh, edit them, and
then bring
them back to the main mesh.
Yours sincerely,
Siew Yi Liang
On 2/17/2014 11:37 AM, Eric Thivierge wrote:

In regards to the Symmetry Map not working, if you are
using the
implicit bones as you've said previously it won't work
because they
haven't fixed this script to compensate for using this
object type
which was only introduced with ICE Kinematics. It's
been requested
quite a few times but I haven't seen it fixed yet,
then again I don't
use the implicit bones much.

Eric T.

On Monday, February 17, 2014 2:27:26 PM, Matt Lind wrote:

I solved the problem for our pipeline by writing a
tool which is
similar to GATOR but runs as a command instead of
an operator. The
advantage is the tool can operate on selected
subcomponents instead of
the entire mesh.  A further embellishment I
exposed was different
methods for searching the source mesh for envelope
weights.  The user
was free to move between built-in methods such as
closest location,
raycast, closest vertex, … as well as other custom
criteria I devised
myself.

I also wrote a dedicated clothing transfer tool
which allows weights
to be painted on our main character, then
transferred and refit onto
the other characters while accounting for changes
in proportions of
limbs and torso, for example.

It’s a very solvable problem if you crack open the
script editor.

Matt

*From:*softimage-bounces@__listproc.autodesk.com
<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>
[mailto:softimage-bounces@__listproc.autodesk.com
<mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com>]
*On Behalf Of *Siew
Yi Liang
*Sent:* Monday, February 17, 2014 10:29 AM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.__com
    <mailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com>
    *Subject:* Re: Paint weights across multiple

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Alan Fregtman]

*>> Just wish there was the option to have more shapes for nulls...*

Didn't SI2014 come with a "custom primitive" SDK enhancement?



On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 3:32 PM, Adam Sale  wrote:

> I've requested the primitive bone fix for sym maps about 6 times now...
> Nulls are it as an alternative. Just wish there was the option to have
> more shapes for nulls as well as offsetting orientation in the shadows.
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Eric Thivierge 
> wrote:
>
>> If you're using the implicit bones with success and don't need any of the
>> benefits of the Softimage bone chains just use Nulls. It's typically what
>> I"m using.
>>
>> Eric T.
>>
>>
>> On Monday, February 17, 2014 3:16:29 PM, Siew Yi Liang wrote:
>>
>>> @Matt Morris: I didn't know that actually, that is fantastic! Going to
>>> try it ASAP~
>>>
>>> @Matt Lind: I know, I should pick up more scripting knowledge... I
>>> only just started recently working with the XSI API (and python in
>>> general), so gimme a chance to catch up to you guys :D
>>>
>>> @Eric: That explains it. I was wondering why it was working with my
>>> main biped rig but not with the facial rig. (my biped rig is using
>>> nulls for deformers but I found out about implicit bones halfway and
>>> wanted to use them to see if I could then have a distinct type for
>>> them so that my controls could be selected using the null selection
>>> filter and my deformers using the bone filter instead.) So would  you
>>> would recommend sticking with nulls/standard bones for defomers?
>>>
>>> Thanks a ton guys! Once I get a chance in the next few days I'll try
>>> GATORing the weights over to a merged mesh, edit them, and then bring
>>> them back to the main mesh.
>>> Yours sincerely,
>>> Siew Yi Liang
>>> On 2/17/2014 11:37 AM, Eric Thivierge wrote:
>>>
>>>> In regards to the Symmetry Map not working, if you are using the
>>>> implicit bones as you've said previously it won't work because they
>>>> haven't fixed this script to compensate for using this object type
>>>> which was only introduced with ICE Kinematics. It's been requested
>>>> quite a few times but I haven't seen it fixed yet, then again I don't
>>>> use the implicit bones much.
>>>>
>>>> Eric T.
>>>>
>>>> On Monday, February 17, 2014 2:27:26 PM, Matt Lind wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I solved the problem for our pipeline by writing a tool which is
>>>>> similar to GATOR but runs as a command instead of an operator. The
>>>>> advantage is the tool can operate on selected subcomponents instead of
>>>>> the entire mesh.  A further embellishment I exposed was different
>>>>> methods for searching the source mesh for envelope weights.  The user
>>>>> was free to move between built-in methods such as closest location,
>>>>> raycast, closest vertex, ... as well as other custom criteria I devised
>>>>> myself.
>>>>>
>>>>> I also wrote a dedicated clothing transfer tool which allows weights
>>>>> to be painted on our main character, then transferred and refit onto
>>>>> the other characters while accounting for changes in proportions of
>>>>> limbs and torso, for example.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's a very solvable problem if you crack open the script editor.
>>>>>
>>>>> Matt
>>>>>
>>>>> *From:*softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
>>>>> [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Siew
>>>>> Yi Liang
>>>>> *Sent:* Monday, February 17, 2014 10:29 AM
>>>>> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
>>>>> *Subject:* Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry
>>>>> mapping errors
>>>>>
>>>>> The problem is...my mesh is already split up into pieces when i was
>>>>> starting to weight them. The full body mesh doesn't exist anymore, the
>>>>> hidden faces are already gone. :X
>>>>>
>>>>> Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and merging it together
>>>>> while trying to preserve the existing weighting so I could continue
>>>>> working on it and then GATOR the weights back to the seperated geo
>>>>> later, but merging th

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Adam Sale]

I've requested the primitive bone fix for sym maps about 6 times now...
Nulls are it as an alternative. Just wish there was the option to have more
shapes for nulls as well as offsetting orientation in the shadows.


On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Eric Thivierge wrote:

> If you're using the implicit bones with success and don't need any of the
> benefits of the Softimage bone chains just use Nulls. It's typically what
> I"m using.
>
> Eric T.
>
>
> On Monday, February 17, 2014 3:16:29 PM, Siew Yi Liang wrote:
>
>> @Matt Morris: I didn't know that actually, that is fantastic! Going to
>> try it ASAP~
>>
>> @Matt Lind: I know, I should pick up more scripting knowledge... I
>> only just started recently working with the XSI API (and python in
>> general), so gimme a chance to catch up to you guys :D
>>
>> @Eric: That explains it. I was wondering why it was working with my
>> main biped rig but not with the facial rig. (my biped rig is using
>> nulls for deformers but I found out about implicit bones halfway and
>> wanted to use them to see if I could then have a distinct type for
>> them so that my controls could be selected using the null selection
>> filter and my deformers using the bone filter instead.) So would  you
>> would recommend sticking with nulls/standard bones for defomers?
>>
>> Thanks a ton guys! Once I get a chance in the next few days I'll try
>> GATORing the weights over to a merged mesh, edit them, and then bring
>> them back to the main mesh.
>> Yours sincerely,
>> Siew Yi Liang
>> On 2/17/2014 11:37 AM, Eric Thivierge wrote:
>>
>>> In regards to the Symmetry Map not working, if you are using the
>>> implicit bones as you've said previously it won't work because they
>>> haven't fixed this script to compensate for using this object type
>>> which was only introduced with ICE Kinematics. It's been requested
>>> quite a few times but I haven't seen it fixed yet, then again I don't
>>> use the implicit bones much.
>>>
>>> Eric T.
>>>
>>> On Monday, February 17, 2014 2:27:26 PM, Matt Lind wrote:
>>>
>>>> I solved the problem for our pipeline by writing a tool which is
>>>> similar to GATOR but runs as a command instead of an operator. The
>>>> advantage is the tool can operate on selected subcomponents instead of
>>>> the entire mesh.  A further embellishment I exposed was different
>>>> methods for searching the source mesh for envelope weights.  The user
>>>> was free to move between built-in methods such as closest location,
>>>> raycast, closest vertex, ... as well as other custom criteria I devised
>>>> myself.
>>>>
>>>> I also wrote a dedicated clothing transfer tool which allows weights
>>>> to be painted on our main character, then transferred and refit onto
>>>> the other characters while accounting for changes in proportions of
>>>> limbs and torso, for example.
>>>>
>>>> It's a very solvable problem if you crack open the script editor.
>>>>
>>>> Matt
>>>>
>>>> *From:*softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
>>>> [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Siew
>>>> Yi Liang
>>>> *Sent:* Monday, February 17, 2014 10:29 AM
>>>> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
>>>> *Subject:* Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry
>>>> mapping errors
>>>>
>>>> The problem is...my mesh is already split up into pieces when i was
>>>> starting to weight them. The full body mesh doesn't exist anymore, the
>>>> hidden faces are already gone. :X
>>>>
>>>> Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and merging it together
>>>> while trying to preserve the existing weighting so I could continue
>>>> working on it and then GATOR the weights back to the seperated geo
>>>> later, but merging the geo together even while transferring all
>>>> attributes seemed to remove the weighting from the character
>>>> entirely...
>>>>
>>>> I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and paint the weights
>>>> manually at this point via numerical input. It's a pain, but right now
>>>> I don't know of any other method that wouldn't be overly troublesome,
>>>> short of modeling the hidden polys again and combining them back into
>>

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Eric Thivierge]

If you're using the implicit bones with success and don't need any of 
the benefits of the Softimage bone chains just use Nulls. It's 
typically what I"m using.


Eric T.

On Monday, February 17, 2014 3:16:29 PM, Siew Yi Liang wrote:

@Matt Morris: I didn't know that actually, that is fantastic! Going to
try it ASAP~

@Matt Lind: I know, I should pick up more scripting knowledge... I
only just started recently working with the XSI API (and python in
general), so gimme a chance to catch up to you guys :D

@Eric: That explains it. I was wondering why it was working with my
main biped rig but not with the facial rig. (my biped rig is using
nulls for deformers but I found out about implicit bones halfway and
wanted to use them to see if I could then have a distinct type for
them so that my controls could be selected using the null selection
filter and my deformers using the bone filter instead.) So would  you
would recommend sticking with nulls/standard bones for defomers?

Thanks a ton guys! Once I get a chance in the next few days I'll try
GATORing the weights over to a merged mesh, edit them, and then bring
them back to the main mesh.
Yours sincerely,
Siew Yi Liang
On 2/17/2014 11:37 AM, Eric Thivierge wrote:

In regards to the Symmetry Map not working, if you are using the
implicit bones as you've said previously it won't work because they
haven't fixed this script to compensate for using this object type
which was only introduced with ICE Kinematics. It's been requested
quite a few times but I haven't seen it fixed yet, then again I don't
use the implicit bones much.

Eric T.

On Monday, February 17, 2014 2:27:26 PM, Matt Lind wrote:

I solved the problem for our pipeline by writing a tool which is
similar to GATOR but runs as a command instead of an operator. The
advantage is the tool can operate on selected subcomponents instead of
the entire mesh.  A further embellishment I exposed was different
methods for searching the source mesh for envelope weights.  The user
was free to move between built-in methods such as closest location,
raycast, closest vertex, … as well as other custom criteria I devised
myself.

I also wrote a dedicated clothing transfer tool which allows weights
to be painted on our main character, then transferred and refit onto
the other characters while accounting for changes in proportions of
limbs and torso, for example.

It’s a very solvable problem if you crack open the script editor.

Matt

*From:*softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Siew
Yi Liang
*Sent:* Monday, February 17, 2014 10:29 AM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry
mapping errors

The problem is...my mesh is already split up into pieces when i was
starting to weight them. The full body mesh doesn't exist anymore, the
hidden faces are already gone. :X

Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and merging it together
while trying to preserve the existing weighting so I could continue
working on it and then GATOR the weights back to the seperated geo
later, but merging the geo together even while transferring all
attributes seemed to remove the weighting from the character
entirely...

I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and paint the weights
manually at this point via numerical input. It's a pain, but right now
I don't know of any other method that wouldn't be overly troublesome,
short of modeling the hidden polys again and combining them back into
the body mesh. The lack of ability to mirror weights on the head is
going to be a real pain to get the rig to behave symmetrically though.

Hopefully the paint tools get an update eventually for this sort of
thing...I never even knew painting across multiple meshes was an
issue, no wonder it's recommend to model unibody in XSI. Oh well,
something new every day! :P

Thanks for the advice all!

Yours sincerely,
Siew Yi Liang

On 2/17/2014 3:14 AM, Greg Maguire wrote:

This is my preferred method too. ILM had a really cool concept I'd
like to see in Soft. Instead of painting with the radius of a
circle, make the brush three dimensional like a ball. Wings can be
tricky, I generally chop the top or bottom part of a wing off and
Gator everything. However a 3D ball would remove that need.

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:08 AM, Mirko Jankovic
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>>
wrote:

You dont even have to merge them, gator will manage just fine for
example:

paint weigh on full body mesh

duplicate body mesh and delete all non seen polys, you dont need
them, but you can jstu skip this and just keep full body mesh if
you dont mind having not seen polygons, maybe even better if cloth
materials have sometranslucency

then GATOR shirt, pants.. any other cloth or prop object.

It

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Alan Fregtman]

When gatoring between identical point placements, don't forget to change
your mode to "Closest Vertex" to get the most accurate transfer.



On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 3:16 PM, Siew Yi Liang  wrote:

>  @Matt Morris: I didn't know that actually, that is fantastic! Going to
> try it ASAP~
>
> @Matt Lind: I know, I should pick up more scripting knowledge... I only
> just started recently working with the XSI API (and python in general), so
> gimme a chance to catch up to you guys :D
>
> @Eric: That explains it. I was wondering why it was working with my main
> biped rig but not with the facial rig. (my biped rig is using nulls for
> deformers but I found out about implicit bones halfway and wanted to use
> them to see if I could then have a distinct type for them so that my
> controls could be selected using the null selection filter and my deformers
> using the bone filter instead.) So would  you would recommend sticking with
> nulls/standard bones for defomers?
>
> Thanks a ton guys! Once I get a chance in the next few days I'll try
> GATORing the weights over to a merged mesh, edit them, and then bring them
> back to the main mesh.
>
> Yours sincerely,
> Siew Yi Liang
>
> On 2/17/2014 11:37 AM, Eric Thivierge wrote:
>
> In regards to the Symmetry Map not working, if you are using the implicit
> bones as you've said previously it won't work because they haven't fixed
> this script to compensate for using this object type which was only
> introduced with ICE Kinematics. It's been requested quite a few times but I
> haven't seen it fixed yet, then again I don't use the implicit bones much.
>
> Eric T.
>
> On Monday, February 17, 2014 2:27:26 PM, Matt Lind wrote:
>
> I solved the problem for our pipeline by writing a tool which is
> similar to GATOR but runs as a command instead of an operator.  The
> advantage is the tool can operate on selected subcomponents instead of
> the entire mesh.  A further embellishment I exposed was different
> methods for searching the source mesh for envelope weights.  The user
> was free to move between built-in methods such as closest location,
> raycast, closest vertex, ... as well as other custom criteria I devised
> myself.
>
> I also wrote a dedicated clothing transfer tool which allows weights
> to be painted on our main character, then transferred and refit onto
> the other characters while accounting for changes in proportions of
> limbs and torso, for example.
>
> It's a very solvable problem if you crack open the script editor.
>
> Matt
>
> *From:*softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
> [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com]
> *On Behalf Of *Siew
> Yi Liang
> *Sent:* Monday, February 17, 2014 10:29 AM
> *To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
> *Subject:* Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry
> mapping errors
>
> The problem is...my mesh is already split up into pieces when i was
> starting to weight them. The full body mesh doesn't exist anymore, the
> hidden faces are already gone. :X
>
> Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and merging it together
> while trying to preserve the existing weighting so I could continue
> working on it and then GATOR the weights back to the seperated geo
> later, but merging the geo together even while transferring all
> attributes seemed to remove the weighting from the character entirely...
>
> I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and paint the weights
> manually at this point via numerical input. It's a pain, but right now
> I don't know of any other method that wouldn't be overly troublesome,
> short of modeling the hidden polys again and combining them back into
> the body mesh. The lack of ability to mirror weights on the head is
> going to be a real pain to get the rig to behave symmetrically though.
>
> Hopefully the paint tools get an update eventually for this sort of
> thing...I never even knew painting across multiple meshes was an
> issue, no wonder it's recommend to model unibody in XSI. Oh well,
> something new every day! :P
>
> Thanks for the advice all!
>
> Yours sincerely,
> Siew Yi Liang
>
> On 2/17/2014 3:14 AM, Greg Maguire wrote:
>
> This is my preferred method too. ILM had a really cool concept I'd
> like to see in Soft. Instead of painting with the radius of a
> circle, make the brush three dimensional like a ball. Wings can be
> tricky, I generally chop the top or bottom part of a wing off and
> Gator everything. However a 3D ball would remove that need.
>
> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:08 AM, Mirko Jankovic
>  <mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com&

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Siew Yi Liang]

@Matt Morris: I didn't know that actually, that is fantastic! Going to 
try it ASAP~


@Matt Lind: I know, I should pick up more scripting knowledge... I only 
just started recently working with the XSI API (and python in general), 
so gimme a chance to catch up to you guys :D


@Eric: That explains it. I was wondering why it was working with my main 
biped rig but not with the facial rig. (my biped rig is using nulls for 
deformers but I found out about implicit bones halfway and wanted to use 
them to see if I could then have a distinct type for them so that my 
controls could be selected using the null selection filter and my 
deformers using the bone filter instead.) So would  you would recommend 
sticking with nulls/standard bones for defomers?


Thanks a ton guys! Once I get a chance in the next few days I'll try 
GATORing the weights over to a merged mesh, edit them, and then bring 
them back to the main mesh.


Yours sincerely,
Siew Yi Liang

On 2/17/2014 11:37 AM, Eric Thivierge wrote:
In regards to the Symmetry Map not working, if you are using the 
implicit bones as you've said previously it won't work because they 
haven't fixed this script to compensate for using this object type 
which was only introduced with ICE Kinematics. It's been requested 
quite a few times but I haven't seen it fixed yet, then again I don't 
use the implicit bones much.


Eric T.

On Monday, February 17, 2014 2:27:26 PM, Matt Lind wrote:

I solved the problem for our pipeline by writing a tool which is
similar to GATOR but runs as a command instead of an operator. The
advantage is the tool can operate on selected subcomponents instead of
the entire mesh.  A further embellishment I exposed was different
methods for searching the source mesh for envelope weights.  The user
was free to move between built-in methods such as closest location,
raycast, closest vertex, … as well as other custom criteria I devised
myself.

I also wrote a dedicated clothing transfer tool which allows weights
to be painted on our main character, then transferred and refit onto
the other characters while accounting for changes in proportions of
limbs and torso, for example.

It’s a very solvable problem if you crack open the script editor.

Matt

*From:*softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Siew
Yi Liang
*Sent:* Monday, February 17, 2014 10:29 AM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry
mapping errors

The problem is...my mesh is already split up into pieces when i was
starting to weight them. The full body mesh doesn't exist anymore, the
hidden faces are already gone. :X

Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and merging it together
while trying to preserve the existing weighting so I could continue
working on it and then GATOR the weights back to the seperated geo
later, but merging the geo together even while transferring all
attributes seemed to remove the weighting from the character entirely...

I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and paint the weights
manually at this point via numerical input. It's a pain, but right now
I don't know of any other method that wouldn't be overly troublesome,
short of modeling the hidden polys again and combining them back into
the body mesh. The lack of ability to mirror weights on the head is
going to be a real pain to get the rig to behave symmetrically though.

Hopefully the paint tools get an update eventually for this sort of
thing...I never even knew painting across multiple meshes was an
issue, no wonder it's recommend to model unibody in XSI. Oh well,
something new every day! :P

Thanks for the advice all!

Yours sincerely,
Siew Yi Liang

On 2/17/2014 3:14 AM, Greg Maguire wrote:

This is my preferred method too. ILM had a really cool concept I'd
like to see in Soft. Instead of painting with the radius of a
circle, make the brush three dimensional like a ball. Wings can be
tricky, I generally chop the top or bottom part of a wing off and
Gator everything. However a 3D ball would remove that need.

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:08 AM, Mirko Jankovic
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>> 
wrote:


You dont even have to merge them, gator will manage just fine for
example:

paint weigh on full body mesh

duplicate body mesh and delete all non seen polys, you dont need
them, but you can jstu skip this and just keep full body mesh if
you dont mind having not seen polygons, maybe even better if cloth
materials have sometranslucency

then GATOR shirt, pants.. any other cloth or prop object.

It iwill follow full body mehsh just fine

Tweak here or there if needed but in mosta case it works pretty fine

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Peter Agg
mailto:peter@googlemail.com>> wrote:

Yep, I do as

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Eric Thivierge]

In regards to the Symmetry Map not working, if you are using the 
implicit bones as you've said previously it won't work because they 
haven't fixed this script to compensate for using this object type 
which was only introduced with ICE Kinematics. It's been requested 
quite a few times but I haven't seen it fixed yet, then again I don't 
use the implicit bones much.


Eric T.

On Monday, February 17, 2014 2:27:26 PM, Matt Lind wrote:

I solved the problem for our pipeline by writing a tool which is
similar to GATOR but runs as a command instead of an operator.  The
advantage is the tool can operate on selected subcomponents instead of
the entire mesh.  A further embellishment I exposed was different
methods for searching the source mesh for envelope weights.  The user
was free to move between built-in methods such as closest location,
raycast, closest vertex, … as well as other custom criteria I devised
myself.

I also wrote a dedicated clothing transfer tool which allows weights
to be painted on our main character, then transferred and refit onto
the other characters while accounting for changes in proportions of
limbs and torso, for example.

It’s a very solvable problem if you crack open the script editor.

Matt

*From:*softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Siew
Yi Liang
*Sent:* Monday, February 17, 2014 10:29 AM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry
mapping errors

The problem is...my mesh is already split up into pieces when i was
starting to weight them. The full body mesh doesn't exist anymore, the
hidden faces are already gone. :X

Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and merging it together
while trying to preserve the existing weighting so I could continue
working on it and then GATOR the weights back to the seperated geo
later, but merging the geo together even while transferring all
attributes seemed to remove the weighting from the character entirely...

I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and paint the weights
manually at this point via numerical input. It's a pain, but right now
I don't know of any other method that wouldn't be overly troublesome,
short of modeling the hidden polys again and combining them back into
the body mesh. The lack of ability to mirror weights on the head is
going to be a real pain to get the rig to behave symmetrically though.

Hopefully the paint tools get an update eventually for this sort of
thing...I never even knew painting across multiple meshes was an
issue, no wonder it's recommend to model unibody in XSI. Oh well,
something new every day! :P

Thanks for the advice all!

Yours sincerely,
Siew Yi Liang

On 2/17/2014 3:14 AM, Greg Maguire wrote:

This is my preferred method too. ILM had a really cool concept I'd
like to see in Soft. Instead of painting with the radius of a
circle, make the brush three dimensional like a ball. Wings can be
tricky, I generally chop the top or bottom part of a wing off and
Gator everything. However a 3D ball would remove that need.

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:08 AM, Mirko Jankovic
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>> wrote:

You dont even have to merge them, gator will manage just fine for
example:

paint weigh on full body mesh

duplicate body mesh and delete all non seen polys, you dont need
them, but you can jstu skip this and just keep full body mesh if
you dont mind having not seen polygons, maybe even better if cloth
materials have sometranslucency

then GATOR shirt, pants.. any other cloth or prop object.

It iwill follow full body mehsh just fine

Tweak here or there if needed but in mosta case it works pretty fine

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Peter Agg
mailto:peter@googlemail.com>> wrote:

Yep, I do as Mirko does for this stuff, the envelope tools are
fairly limited for a lot of this fiddly kind of things.

If you're merging existing geo together make sure everything is
welded - Polygon Islands are a pain to deal with as well. Ideally
you want some kind of single mesh body-glove for the 'master'
envelope.

On 17 February 2014 10:34, Mirko Jankovic
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Not sure how others deal with it but when having character that
will have cltoth weighted and simulated I like to have an mesh
with full body, and then 2nd mesh with only visible parts, hands,
neck, head etc...

Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing
everything else and then for animationa nd everything els using
only cloth and partialy bodu mesh, and full body mesh is left out
of model not used for anything esle but for painting and GATOR-ing
weights to all other meshes on characters.

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014

RE: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Matt Lind]

I solved the problem for our pipeline by writing a tool which is similar to 
GATOR but runs as a command instead of an operator.  The advantage is the tool 
can operate on selected subcomponents instead of the entire mesh.  A further 
embellishment I exposed was different methods for searching the source mesh for 
envelope weights.  The user was free to move between built-in methods such as 
closest location, raycast, closest vertex, ... as well as other custom criteria 
I devised myself.

I also wrote a dedicated clothing transfer tool which allows weights to be 
painted on our main character, then transferred and refit onto the other 
characters while accounting for changes in proportions of limbs and torso, for 
example.

It's a very solvable problem if you crack open the script editor.


Matt





From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com 
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Siew Yi Liang
Sent: Monday, February 17, 2014 10:29 AM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping 
errors

The problem is...my mesh is already split up into pieces when i was starting to 
weight them. The full body mesh doesn't exist anymore, the hidden faces are 
already gone. :X

Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and merging it together while trying 
to preserve the existing weighting so I could continue working on it and then 
GATOR the weights back to the seperated geo later, but merging the geo together 
even while transferring all attributes seemed to remove the weighting from the 
character entirely...

I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and paint the weights manually 
at this point via numerical input. It's a pain, but right now I don't know of 
any other method that wouldn't be overly troublesome, short of modeling the 
hidden polys again and combining them back into the body mesh. The lack of 
ability to mirror weights on the head is going to be a real pain to get the rig 
to behave symmetrically though.

Hopefully the paint tools get an update eventually for this sort of thing...I 
never even knew painting across multiple meshes was an issue, no wonder it's 
recommend to model unibody in XSI. Oh well, something new every day! :P

Thanks for the advice all!


Yours sincerely,

Siew Yi Liang
On 2/17/2014 3:14 AM, Greg Maguire wrote:
This is my preferred method too. ILM had a really cool concept I'd like to see 
in Soft. Instead of painting with the radius of a circle, make the brush three 
dimensional like a ball. Wings can be tricky, I generally chop the top or 
bottom part of a wing off and Gator everything. However a 3D ball would remove 
that need.

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:08 AM, Mirko Jankovic 
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>> wrote:
You dont even have to merge them, gator will manage just fine for example:

paint weigh on full body mesh

duplicate body mesh and delete all non seen polys, you dont need them, but you 
can jstu skip this and just keep full body mesh if you dont mind having not 
seen polygons, maybe even better if cloth materials have sometranslucency

then GATOR shirt, pants.. any other cloth or prop object.
It iwill follow full body mehsh just fine
Tweak here or there if needed but in mosta case it works pretty fine

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Peter Agg 
mailto:peter@googlemail.com>> wrote:
Yep, I do as Mirko does for this stuff, the envelope tools are fairly limited 
for a lot of this fiddly kind of things.

If you're merging existing geo together make sure everything is welded - 
Polygon Islands are a pain to deal with as well. Ideally you want some kind of 
single mesh body-glove for the 'master' envelope.

On 17 February 2014 10:34, Mirko Jankovic 
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Not sure how others deal with it but when having character that will have 
cltoth weighted and simulated I like to have an mesh with full body, and then 
2nd mesh with only visible parts, hands, neck, head etc...
Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing everything else and 
then for animationa nd everything els using only cloth and partialy bodu mesh, 
and full body mesh is left out of model not used for anything esle but for 
painting and GATOR-ing weights to all other meshes on characters.


On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Siew Yi Liang 
mailto:soni...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've just spent the better part 
of 3 hours trying to find a solution: is there actually a way in XSI to paint 
across multiple envelopes at the same time, assuming they have the same 
deformer influences? I've been searching around for a way to do so but it 
doesn't seem like I can, and the best I can hope for is to GATOR over the 
points I want?

The problem is that I have a character split up into several parts, so 
weighting the areas where

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Matt Morris]

You know you can gator from multiple sources right? So if you already have
your merged mesh, with the geo frozen (worth deleting any rogue clusters as
well) you can then select gator and pick all the enveloped meshes that make
up your character. Transfer the envelope weighting, then 'freeze modelling'
the mesh so that it freezes off the gator operator but keeps the envelope.
Make your weight edits, and then gator them back to the original meshes.
(delete the envelope from the original parts before gatoring).




On 17 February 2014 18:28, Siew Yi Liang  wrote:

>  The problem is...my mesh is already split up into pieces when i was
> starting to weight them. The full body mesh doesn't exist anymore, the
> hidden faces are already gone. :X
>
> Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and merging it together while
> trying to preserve the existing weighting so I could continue working on it
> and then GATOR the weights back to the seperated geo later, but merging the
> geo together even while transferring all attributes seemed to remove the
> weighting from the character entirely...
>
> I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and paint the weights
> manually at this point via numerical input. It's a pain, but right now I
> don't know of any other method that wouldn't be overly troublesome, short
> of modeling the hidden polys again and combining them back into the body
> mesh. The lack of ability to mirror weights on the head is going to be a
> real pain to get the rig to behave symmetrically though.
>
> Hopefully the paint tools get an update eventually for this sort of
> thing...I never even knew painting across multiple meshes was an issue, no
> wonder it's recommend to model unibody in XSI. Oh well, something new every
> day! :P
>
> Thanks for the advice all!
>
> Yours sincerely,
> Siew Yi Liang
>
> On 2/17/2014 3:14 AM, Greg Maguire wrote:
>
> This is my preferred method too. ILM had a really cool concept I'd like to
> see in Soft. Instead of painting with the radius of a circle, make the
> brush three dimensional like a ball. Wings can be tricky, I generally chop
> the top or bottom part of a wing off and Gator everything. However a 3D
> ball would remove that need.
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:08 AM, Mirko Jankovic <
> mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> You dont even have to merge them, gator will manage just fine for
>> example:
>>
>>  paint weigh on full body mesh
>>
>>  duplicate body mesh and delete all non seen polys, you dont need them,
>> but you can jstu skip this and just keep full body mesh if you dont mind
>> having not seen polygons, maybe even better if cloth materials have
>> sometranslucency
>>
>>  then GATOR shirt, pants.. any other cloth or prop object.
>> It iwill follow full body mehsh just fine
>> Tweak here or there if needed but in mosta case it works pretty fine
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Peter Agg wrote:
>>
>>>  Yep, I do as Mirko does for this stuff, the envelope tools are fairly
>>> limited for a lot of this fiddly kind of things.
>>>
>>>
>>>  If you're merging existing geo together make sure everything is welded
>>> - Polygon Islands are a pain to deal with as well. Ideally you want some
>>> kind of single mesh body-glove for the 'master' envelope.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 17 February 2014 10:34, Mirko Jankovic wrote:
>>>
 Not sure how others deal with it but when having character that will
 have cltoth weighted and simulated I like to have an mesh with full body,
 and then 2nd mesh with only visible parts, hands, neck, head etc...
 Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing everything
 else and then for animationa nd everything els using only cloth and
 partialy bodu mesh, and full body mesh is left out of model not used for
 anything esle but for painting and GATOR-ing weights to all other meshes on
 characters.



 On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Siew Yi Liang wrote:

>  Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've just spent the
> better part of 3 hours trying to find a solution: is there actually a way
> in XSI to paint across multiple envelopes at the same time, assuming they
> have the same deformer influences? I've been searching around for a way to
> do so but it doesn't seem like I can, and the best I can hope for is to
> GATOR over the points I want?
>
> The problem is that I have a character split up into several parts, so
> weighting the areas where neck meets shirt, torso meets pants etc. is a
> little annoying when I can't paint across them seamlessly. I've actually
> never had to deal with this before in XSI, so I have no idea if this is
> actually possible?
>
> Additionally, when trying to create a symmetry mapping template for a
> certain geometry, I'm getting:
>
> Application.CreateSymmetryMappingTemplate("", "", "", "")
> # ERROR : 2057-GetSkeleton - Input object is not a skeleton object -
>

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Siew Yi Liang]

The problem is...my mesh is already split up into pieces when i was 
starting to weight them. The full body mesh doesn't exist anymore, the 
hidden faces are already gone. :X


Also I tried duplicating all the geometry and merging it together while 
trying to preserve the existing weighting so I could continue working on 
it and then GATOR the weights back to the seperated geo later, but 
merging the geo together even while transferring all attributes seemed 
to remove the weighting from the character entirely...


I'm wondering if I should just bite the bullet and paint the weights 
manually at this point via numerical input. It's a pain, but right now I 
don't know of any other method that wouldn't be overly troublesome, 
short of modeling the hidden polys again and combining them back into 
the body mesh. The lack of ability to mirror weights on the head is 
going to be a real pain to get the rig to behave symmetrically though.


Hopefully the paint tools get an update eventually for this sort of 
thing...I never even knew painting across multiple meshes was an issue, 
no wonder it's recommend to model unibody in XSI. Oh well, something new 
every day! :P


Thanks for the advice all!

Yours sincerely,
Siew Yi Liang

On 2/17/2014 3:14 AM, Greg Maguire wrote:
This is my preferred method too. ILM had a really cool concept I'd 
like to see in Soft. Instead of painting with the radius of a circle, 
make the brush three dimensional like a ball. Wings can be tricky, I 
generally chop the top or bottom part of a wing off and Gator 
everything. However a 3D ball would remove that need.



On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:08 AM, Mirko Jankovic 
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>> wrote:


You dont even have to merge them, gator will manage just fine for
example:

paint weigh on full body mesh

duplicate body mesh and delete all non seen polys, you dont need
them, but you can jstu skip this and just keep full body mesh if
you dont mind having not seen polygons, maybe even better if cloth
materials have sometranslucency

then GATOR shirt, pants.. any other cloth or prop object.
It iwill follow full body mehsh just fine
Tweak here or there if needed but in mosta case it works pretty fine


On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Peter Agg
mailto:peter@googlemail.com>> wrote:

Yep, I do as Mirko does for this stuff, the envelope tools are
fairly limited for a lot of this fiddly kind of things.


If you're merging existing geo together make sure everything
is welded - Polygon Islands are a pain to deal with as well.
Ideally you want some kind of single mesh body-glove for the
'master' envelope.


On 17 February 2014 10:34, Mirko Jankovic
mailto:mirkoj.anima...@gmail.com>>
wrote:

Not sure how others deal with it but when having character
that will have cltoth weighted and simulated I like to
have an mesh with full body, and then 2nd mesh with only
visible parts, hands, neck, head etc...
Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing
everything else and then for animationa nd everything els
using only cloth and partialy bodu mesh, and full body
mesh is left out of model not used for anything esle but
for painting and GATOR-ing weights to all other meshes on
characters.



On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Siew Yi Liang
mailto:soni...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've
just spent the better part of 3 hours trying to find a
solution: is there actually a way in XSI to paint
across multiple envelopes at the same time, assuming
they have the same deformer influences? I've been
searching around for a way to do so but it doesn't
seem like I can, and the best I can hope for is to
GATOR over the points I want?

The problem is that I have a character split up into
several parts, so weighting the areas where neck meets
shirt, torso meets pants etc. is a little annoying
when I can't paint across them seamlessly. I've
actually never had to deal with this before in XSI, so
I have no idea if this is actually possible?

Additionally, when trying to create a symmetry mapping
template for a certain geometry, I'm getting:

Application.CreateSymmetryMappingTemplate("", "", "", "")
# ERROR : 2057-GetSkeleton - Input object is not a
skeleton object - [line 492 in C:\Program
Files\Autodesk\Softimage 2013
SP1\Application\DSScripts\enveloping.vbs]

The deformers affecting it are just implicit bones, so

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Greg Maguire]

This is my preferred method too. ILM had a really cool concept I'd like to
see in Soft. Instead of painting with the radius of a circle, make the
brush three dimensional like a ball. Wings can be tricky, I generally chop
the top or bottom part of a wing off and Gator everything. However a 3D
ball would remove that need.


On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:08 AM, Mirko Jankovic
wrote:

> You dont even have to merge them, gator will manage just fine for example:
>
> paint weigh on full body mesh
>
> duplicate body mesh and delete all non seen polys, you dont need them, but
> you can jstu skip this and just keep full body mesh if you dont mind having
> not seen polygons, maybe even better if cloth materials have
> sometranslucency
>
> then GATOR shirt, pants.. any other cloth or prop object.
> It iwill follow full body mehsh just fine
> Tweak here or there if needed but in mosta case it works pretty fine
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Peter Agg wrote:
>
>> Yep, I do as Mirko does for this stuff, the envelope tools are fairly
>> limited for a lot of this fiddly kind of things.
>>
>>
>> If you're merging existing geo together make sure everything is welded -
>> Polygon Islands are a pain to deal with as well. Ideally you want some kind
>> of single mesh body-glove for the 'master' envelope.
>>
>>
>> On 17 February 2014 10:34, Mirko Jankovic wrote:
>>
>>> Not sure how others deal with it but when having character that will
>>> have cltoth weighted and simulated I like to have an mesh with full body,
>>> and then 2nd mesh with only visible parts, hands, neck, head etc...
>>> Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing everything else
>>> and then for animationa nd everything els using only cloth and partialy
>>> bodu mesh, and full body mesh is left out of model not used for anything
>>> esle but for painting and GATOR-ing weights to all other meshes on
>>> characters.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Siew Yi Liang wrote:
>>>
  Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've just spent the
 better part of 3 hours trying to find a solution: is there actually a way
 in XSI to paint across multiple envelopes at the same time, assuming they
 have the same deformer influences? I've been searching around for a way to
 do so but it doesn't seem like I can, and the best I can hope for is to
 GATOR over the points I want?

 The problem is that I have a character split up into several parts, so
 weighting the areas where neck meets shirt, torso meets pants etc. is a
 little annoying when I can't paint across them seamlessly. I've actually
 never had to deal with this before in XSI, so I have no idea if this is
 actually possible?

 Additionally, when trying to create a symmetry mapping template for a
 certain geometry, I'm getting:

 Application.CreateSymmetryMappingTemplate("", "", "", "")
 # ERROR : 2057-GetSkeleton - Input object is not a skeleton object -
 [line 492 in C:\Program Files\Autodesk\Softimage 2013
 SP1\Application\DSScripts\enveloping.vbs]

 The deformers affecting it are just implicit bones, so I'm not sure
 what exactly the error is referring to -  I tried manually creating the
 symmetry template myself and mirroring the weights, but nothing happened.
 No error message appeared, but the weights didn't mirror either.

 The scene file is available at: http://1drv.ms/1cfWE34 , I'd really
 appreciate it if anyone has run into this situation before and could spare
 a few minutes to take a quick look! The head geometry is the one giving
 problems (I thought it might have had something to do with the ICE facial
 rig, but I froze those operators and tried doing the symmetry template
 again and it still gave the same issue...)

 --
 Yours sincerely,
 Siew Yi Liang


>>>
>>
>


-- 

*Greg Maguire* | Inlifesize
Mobile: +44 7512 361462 | Phone: +44 2890 204739
g...@inlifesize.com | www.inlifesize.com

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Martin Yara]

What I do is duplicate the object, and delete the polygons I don't need.
This way the envelope is copied and I don't need to use Gator.

I automatized this task with a couple of scripts:
https://vimeo.com/44115056

You could use gator to keep the transfer attributes alive and keep tweaking
the full body object.

I don't think you can prune unused deformers out of the box.
I use Oz_Clean_WeightsPlugin for that.

Martin


On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 7:43 PM, Peter Agg  wrote:

> Yep, I do as Mirko does for this stuff, the envelope tools are fairly
> limited for a lot of this fiddly kind of things.
>
>
> If you're merging existing geo together make sure everything is welded -
> Polygon Islands are a pain to deal with as well. Ideally you want some kind
> of single mesh body-glove for the 'master' envelope.
>
>
> On 17 February 2014 10:34, Mirko Jankovic wrote:
>
>> Not sure how others deal with it but when having character that will have
>> cltoth weighted and simulated I like to have an mesh with full body, and
>> then 2nd mesh with only visible parts, hands, neck, head etc...
>> Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing everything else
>> and then for animationa nd everything els using only cloth and partialy
>> bodu mesh, and full body mesh is left out of model not used for anything
>> esle but for painting and GATOR-ing weights to all other meshes on
>> characters.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Siew Yi Liang wrote:
>>
>>>  Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've just spent the
>>> better part of 3 hours trying to find a solution: is there actually a way
>>> in XSI to paint across multiple envelopes at the same time, assuming they
>>> have the same deformer influences? I've been searching around for a way to
>>> do so but it doesn't seem like I can, and the best I can hope for is to
>>> GATOR over the points I want?
>>>
>>> The problem is that I have a character split up into several parts, so
>>> weighting the areas where neck meets shirt, torso meets pants etc. is a
>>> little annoying when I can't paint across them seamlessly. I've actually
>>> never had to deal with this before in XSI, so I have no idea if this is
>>> actually possible?
>>>
>>> Additionally, when trying to create a symmetry mapping template for a
>>> certain geometry, I'm getting:
>>>
>>> Application.CreateSymmetryMappingTemplate("", "", "", "")
>>> # ERROR : 2057-GetSkeleton - Input object is not a skeleton object -
>>> [line 492 in C:\Program Files\Autodesk\Softimage 2013
>>> SP1\Application\DSScripts\enveloping.vbs]
>>>
>>> The deformers affecting it are just implicit bones, so I'm not sure what
>>> exactly the error is referring to -  I tried manually creating the symmetry
>>> template myself and mirroring the weights, but nothing happened. No error
>>> message appeared, but the weights didn't mirror either.
>>>
>>> The scene file is available at: http://1drv.ms/1cfWE34 , I'd really
>>> appreciate it if anyone has run into this situation before and could spare
>>> a few minutes to take a quick look! The head geometry is the one giving
>>> problems (I thought it might have had something to do with the ICE facial
>>> rig, but I froze those operators and tried doing the symmetry template
>>> again and it still gave the same issue...)
>>>
>>> --
>>> Yours sincerely,
>>> Siew Yi Liang
>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Mirko Jankovic]

You dont even have to merge them, gator will manage just fine for example:

paint weigh on full body mesh

duplicate body mesh and delete all non seen polys, you dont need them, but
you can jstu skip this and just keep full body mesh if you dont mind having
not seen polygons, maybe even better if cloth materials have
sometranslucency

then GATOR shirt, pants.. any other cloth or prop object.
It iwill follow full body mehsh just fine
Tweak here or there if needed but in mosta case it works pretty fine


On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:43 AM, Peter Agg wrote:

> Yep, I do as Mirko does for this stuff, the envelope tools are fairly
> limited for a lot of this fiddly kind of things.
>
>
> If you're merging existing geo together make sure everything is welded -
> Polygon Islands are a pain to deal with as well. Ideally you want some kind
> of single mesh body-glove for the 'master' envelope.
>
>
> On 17 February 2014 10:34, Mirko Jankovic wrote:
>
>> Not sure how others deal with it but when having character that will have
>> cltoth weighted and simulated I like to have an mesh with full body, and
>> then 2nd mesh with only visible parts, hands, neck, head etc...
>> Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing everything else
>> and then for animationa nd everything els using only cloth and partialy
>> bodu mesh, and full body mesh is left out of model not used for anything
>> esle but for painting and GATOR-ing weights to all other meshes on
>> characters.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Siew Yi Liang wrote:
>>
>>>  Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've just spent the
>>> better part of 3 hours trying to find a solution: is there actually a way
>>> in XSI to paint across multiple envelopes at the same time, assuming they
>>> have the same deformer influences? I've been searching around for a way to
>>> do so but it doesn't seem like I can, and the best I can hope for is to
>>> GATOR over the points I want?
>>>
>>> The problem is that I have a character split up into several parts, so
>>> weighting the areas where neck meets shirt, torso meets pants etc. is a
>>> little annoying when I can't paint across them seamlessly. I've actually
>>> never had to deal with this before in XSI, so I have no idea if this is
>>> actually possible?
>>>
>>> Additionally, when trying to create a symmetry mapping template for a
>>> certain geometry, I'm getting:
>>>
>>> Application.CreateSymmetryMappingTemplate("", "", "", "")
>>> # ERROR : 2057-GetSkeleton - Input object is not a skeleton object -
>>> [line 492 in C:\Program Files\Autodesk\Softimage 2013
>>> SP1\Application\DSScripts\enveloping.vbs]
>>>
>>> The deformers affecting it are just implicit bones, so I'm not sure what
>>> exactly the error is referring to -  I tried manually creating the symmetry
>>> template myself and mirroring the weights, but nothing happened. No error
>>> message appeared, but the weights didn't mirror either.
>>>
>>> The scene file is available at: http://1drv.ms/1cfWE34 , I'd really
>>> appreciate it if anyone has run into this situation before and could spare
>>> a few minutes to take a quick look! The head geometry is the one giving
>>> problems (I thought it might have had something to do with the ICE facial
>>> rig, but I froze those operators and tried doing the symmetry template
>>> again and it still gave the same issue...)
>>>
>>> --
>>> Yours sincerely,
>>> Siew Yi Liang
>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Peter Agg]

Yep, I do as Mirko does for this stuff, the envelope tools are fairly
limited for a lot of this fiddly kind of things.


If you're merging existing geo together make sure everything is welded -
Polygon Islands are a pain to deal with as well. Ideally you want some kind
of single mesh body-glove for the 'master' envelope.


On 17 February 2014 10:34, Mirko Jankovic  wrote:

> Not sure how others deal with it but when having character that will have
> cltoth weighted and simulated I like to have an mesh with full body, and
> then 2nd mesh with only visible parts, hands, neck, head etc...
> Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing everything else
> and then for animationa nd everything els using only cloth and partialy
> bodu mesh, and full body mesh is left out of model not used for anything
> esle but for painting and GATOR-ing weights to all other meshes on
> characters.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Siew Yi Liang  wrote:
>
>>  Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've just spent the
>> better part of 3 hours trying to find a solution: is there actually a way
>> in XSI to paint across multiple envelopes at the same time, assuming they
>> have the same deformer influences? I've been searching around for a way to
>> do so but it doesn't seem like I can, and the best I can hope for is to
>> GATOR over the points I want?
>>
>> The problem is that I have a character split up into several parts, so
>> weighting the areas where neck meets shirt, torso meets pants etc. is a
>> little annoying when I can't paint across them seamlessly. I've actually
>> never had to deal with this before in XSI, so I have no idea if this is
>> actually possible?
>>
>> Additionally, when trying to create a symmetry mapping template for a
>> certain geometry, I'm getting:
>>
>> Application.CreateSymmetryMappingTemplate("", "", "", "")
>> # ERROR : 2057-GetSkeleton - Input object is not a skeleton object -
>> [line 492 in C:\Program Files\Autodesk\Softimage 2013
>> SP1\Application\DSScripts\enveloping.vbs]
>>
>> The deformers affecting it are just implicit bones, so I'm not sure what
>> exactly the error is referring to -  I tried manually creating the symmetry
>> template myself and mirroring the weights, but nothing happened. No error
>> message appeared, but the weights didn't mirror either.
>>
>> The scene file is available at: http://1drv.ms/1cfWE34 , I'd really
>> appreciate it if anyone has run into this situation before and could spare
>> a few minutes to take a quick look! The head geometry is the one giving
>> problems (I thought it might have had something to do with the ICE facial
>> rig, but I froze those operators and tried doing the symmetry template
>> again and it still gave the same issue...)
>>
>> --
>> Yours sincerely,
>> Siew Yi Liang
>>
>>
>

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Siew Yi Liang]

OHHH. So just duplicate my mesh objects, merge them all together, use 
that to paint weights, and then GATOR over to individual pieces is what 
you're saying? Going to try that now! Hopefully I can workaround the 
symmetry problem that way as well...


(Speaking of which, does XSI have a way to prune deformers whose weight 
influence on the mesh is zero?)


Yours sincerely,
Siew Yi Liang

On 2/17/2014 2:34 AM, Mirko Jankovic wrote:
Not sure how others deal with it but when having character that will 
have cltoth weighted and simulated I like to have an mesh with full 
body, and then 2nd mesh with only visible parts, hands, neck, head etc...
Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing everything 
else and then for animationa nd everything els using only cloth and 
partialy bodu mesh, and full body mesh is left out of model not used 
for anything esle but for painting and GATOR-ing weights to all other 
meshes on characters.




On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Siew Yi Liang > wrote:


Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've just spent the
better part of 3 hours trying to find a solution: is there
actually a way in XSI to paint across multiple envelopes at the
same time, assuming they have the same deformer influences? I've
been searching around for a way to do so but it doesn't seem like
I can, and the best I can hope for is to GATOR over the points I
want?

The problem is that I have a character split up into several
parts, so weighting the areas where neck meets shirt, torso meets
pants etc. is a little annoying when I can't paint across them
seamlessly. I've actually never had to deal with this before in
XSI, so I have no idea if this is actually possible?

Additionally, when trying to create a symmetry mapping template
for a certain geometry, I'm getting:

Application.CreateSymmetryMappingTemplate("", "", "", "")
# ERROR : 2057-GetSkeleton - Input object is not a skeleton object
- [line 492 in C:\Program Files\Autodesk\Softimage 2013
SP1\Application\DSScripts\enveloping.vbs]

The deformers affecting it are just implicit bones, so I'm not
sure what exactly the error is referring to -  I tried manually
creating the symmetry template myself and mirroring the weights,
but nothing happened. No error message appeared, but the weights
didn't mirror either.

The scene file is available at: http://1drv.ms/1cfWE34 , I'd
really appreciate it if anyone has run into this situation before
and could spare a few minutes to take a quick look! The head
geometry is the one giving problems (I thought it might have had
something to do with the ICE facial rig, but I froze those
operators and tried doing the symmetry template again and it still
gave the same issue...)

-- 
Yours sincerely,

Siew Yi Liang

Re: Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Mirko Jankovic]

Not sure how others deal with it but when having character that will have
cltoth weighted and simulated I like to have an mesh with full body, and
then 2nd mesh with only visible parts, hands, neck, head etc...
Then painting weights on full body  mesh only, GATOR-ing everything else
and then for animationa nd everything els using only cloth and partialy
bodu mesh, and full body mesh is left out of model not used for anything
esle but for painting and GATOR-ing weights to all other meshes on
characters.



On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 11:30 AM, Siew Yi Liang  wrote:

>  Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've just spent the better
> part of 3 hours trying to find a solution: is there actually a way in XSI
> to paint across multiple envelopes at the same time, assuming they have the
> same deformer influences? I've been searching around for a way to do so but
> it doesn't seem like I can, and the best I can hope for is to GATOR over
> the points I want?
>
> The problem is that I have a character split up into several parts, so
> weighting the areas where neck meets shirt, torso meets pants etc. is a
> little annoying when I can't paint across them seamlessly. I've actually
> never had to deal with this before in XSI, so I have no idea if this is
> actually possible?
>
> Additionally, when trying to create a symmetry mapping template for a
> certain geometry, I'm getting:
>
> Application.CreateSymmetryMappingTemplate("", "", "", "")
> # ERROR : 2057-GetSkeleton - Input object is not a skeleton object - [line
> 492 in C:\Program Files\Autodesk\Softimage 2013
> SP1\Application\DSScripts\enveloping.vbs]
>
> The deformers affecting it are just implicit bones, so I'm not sure what
> exactly the error is referring to -  I tried manually creating the symmetry
> template myself and mirroring the weights, but nothing happened. No error
> message appeared, but the weights didn't mirror either.
>
> The scene file is available at: http://1drv.ms/1cfWE34 , I'd really
> appreciate it if anyone has run into this situation before and could spare
> a few minutes to take a quick look! The head geometry is the one giving
> problems (I thought it might have had something to do with the ICE facial
> rig, but I froze those operators and tried doing the symmetry template
> again and it still gave the same issue...)
>
> --
> Yours sincerely,
> Siew Yi Liang
>
>

Paint weights across multiple envelopes? And symmetry mapping errors....

[Siew Yi Liang]

Hi all, sorry for another silly question, but I've just spent the better 
part of 3 hours trying to find a solution: is there actually a way in 
XSI to paint across multiple envelopes at the same time, assuming they 
have the same deformer influences? I've been searching around for a way 
to do so but it doesn't seem like I can, and the best I can hope for is 
to GATOR over the points I want?


The problem is that I have a character split up into several parts, so 
weighting the areas where neck meets shirt, torso meets pants etc. is a 
little annoying when I can't paint across them seamlessly. I've actually 
never had to deal with this before in XSI, so I have no idea if this is 
actually possible?


Additionally, when trying to create a symmetry mapping template for a 
certain geometry, I'm getting:


Application.CreateSymmetryMappingTemplate("", "", "", "")
# ERROR : 2057-GetSkeleton - Input object is not a skeleton object - 
[line 492 in C:\Program Files\Autodesk\Softimage 2013 
SP1\Application\DSScripts\enveloping.vbs]


The deformers affecting it are just implicit bones, so I'm not sure what 
exactly the error is referring to -  I tried manually creating the 
symmetry template myself and mirroring the weights, but nothing 
happened. No error message appeared, but the weights didn't mirror either.


The scene file is available at: http://1drv.ms/1cfWE34 , I'd really 
appreciate it if anyone has run into this situation before and could 
spare a few minutes to take a quick look! The head geometry is the one 
giving problems (I thought it might have had something to do with the 
ICE facial rig, but I froze those operators and tried doing the symmetry 
template again and it still gave the same issue...)


--
Yours sincerely,
Siew Yi Liang