Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Ed Manning]

Yes, I AM ignoring the RAM requirements of Elysium-style scenes.  So none
of those in my scenario.


On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 10:15 AM, Ed Manning  wrote:

> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 6:04 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:
>
>> doesn't work like that... i have to convince someone to buy it for the
>> studio, then the graphics cards you guys talk about... 3 titans!? we don't
>> have those types of investments. we have an existing farm with cpus and
>> lots of ram. if i want to render a sequence with redshift... i have to
>> render it on workstations only. also, i am not going to convert elysium to
>> work for redshift on my free time ;)
>>
>> You might be able to write a script to convert the materials, since the
> parameters are pretty close to Arnold's (they're VERY similar to MR's so
> going from there would be relatively easy).
>
> One possible selling point to management -- since your workstations are
> probably pretty well-equipped in GPU, and those GPUs are idle all night,
> you'd be leveraging capacity that's already paid-for.  You wouldn't even
> need to take the workstations off the CPU farm, just earmark a couple of
> cores on each for scene loading and conversion for Redshift. Network and
> server might get stressed a bit, but that's kind of normal...
>
> Also see my other post on the costs to transition to GPU from CPU.
>  Speaking as a small business owner, I gotta say the GPU path looks MORE
> attractive financially.
>

Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Ed Manning]

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 6:04 PM, Steven Caron  wrote:

> doesn't work like that... i have to convince someone to buy it for the
> studio, then the graphics cards you guys talk about... 3 titans!? we don't
> have those types of investments. we have an existing farm with cpus and
> lots of ram. if i want to render a sequence with redshift... i have to
> render it on workstations only. also, i am not going to convert elysium to
> work for redshift on my free time ;)
>
> You might be able to write a script to convert the materials, since the
parameters are pretty close to Arnold's (they're VERY similar to MR's so
going from there would be relatively easy).

One possible selling point to management -- since your workstations are
probably pretty well-equipped in GPU, and those GPUs are idle all night,
you'd be leveraging capacity that's already paid-for.  You wouldn't even
need to take the workstations off the CPU farm, just earmark a couple of
cores on each for scene loading and conversion for Redshift. Network and
server might get stressed a bit, but that's kind of normal...

Also see my other post on the costs to transition to GPU from CPU.
 Speaking as a small business owner, I gotta say the GPU path looks MORE
attractive financially.

Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Matt Morris]

True dat.


On 17 February 2014 23:16, Steven Caron  wrote:

> i don't think they care what market, as long as people buy it ;)
>
> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 3:13 PM, Matt Morris  wrote:
>
>> Yeah it would involve quite an adjustment for a trad farm - rackmounts
>> would be a little useless. I also don't think RS is quite gunning for the
>> arnold market, its aiming for the smaller shops who don't have massive
>> render farms.
>>
>>


-- 
www.matinai.com

Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Emilio Hernandez]

Hey Matt cool scene!




2014-02-17 17:16 GMT-06:00 Steven Caron :

> i don't think they care what market, as long as people buy it ;)
>
> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 3:13 PM, Matt Morris  wrote:
>
>> Yeah it would involve quite an adjustment for a trad farm - rackmounts
>> would be a little useless. I also don't think RS is quite gunning for the
>> arnold market, its aiming for the smaller shops who don't have massive
>> render farms.
>>
>>

Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Steven Caron]

i don't think they care what market, as long as people buy it ;)

On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 3:13 PM, Matt Morris  wrote:

> Yeah it would involve quite an adjustment for a trad farm - rackmounts
> would be a little useless. I also don't think RS is quite gunning for the
> arnold market, its aiming for the smaller shops who don't have massive
> render farms.
>
>

Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Matt Morris]

Yeah it would involve quite an adjustment for a trad farm - rackmounts
would be a little useless. I also don't think RS is quite gunning for the
arnold market, its aiming for the smaller shops who don't have massive
render farms.

I rendered 10 million hairs on a character today, ended up using 20Gb of
system ram, as the gpu was only a quadro k4000, but it rendered pretty fast
still. The extraction was the longest part.

Also, just as a quick test, I've instanced 5000 trees using ice scatter,
each tree has 1.2 million polys, so that makes it 6 Billion(?), used 6 Gb
system ram. render stats below:

# INFO : [Redshift] Rendering frame 0
# INFO : [Redshift] Scene extraction time: 4.623 s
# INFO : [Redshift] Rendering time: 176.518 s (2 GPU(s) used)

just the usual deformed grid test, nothing exciting:
https://app.box.com/s/v3z5se5fl0a8zt1sw4ps

The ground texture was 20k, that took a little while to convert before the
render started, but after that, I was suprised by the system ram,
particularly as I couldn't even begin to view the instances in the
viewport, bounding box only...



On 17 February 2014 23:04, Steven Caron  wrote:

> doesn't work like that... i have to convince someone to buy it for the
> studio, then the graphics cards you guys talk about... 3 titans!? we don't
> have those types of investments. we have an existing farm with cpus and
> lots of ram. if i want to render a sequence with redshift... i have to
> render it on workstations only. also, i am not going to convert elysium to
> work for redshift on my free time ;)
>
> i am sold on the value of redshift, i can see the value clearly! i just
> wanting to see how well this 'out of core memory' feature really works.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 2:30 PM, Emilio Hernandez wrote:
>
>> Well Steven, for $100 bucks for the Beta maybe you can try it.  Will be
>> awsome to have some feedback on such scene as Elysium.
>>
>


-- 
www.matinai.com

Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Steven Caron]

doesn't work like that... i have to convince someone to buy it for the
studio, then the graphics cards you guys talk about... 3 titans!? we don't
have those types of investments. we have an existing farm with cpus and
lots of ram. if i want to render a sequence with redshift... i have to
render it on workstations only. also, i am not going to convert elysium to
work for redshift on my free time ;)

i am sold on the value of redshift, i can see the value clearly! i just
wanting to see how well this 'out of core memory' feature really works.


On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 2:30 PM, Emilio Hernandez  wrote:

> Well Steven, for $100 bucks for the Beta maybe you can try it.  Will be
> awsome to have some feedback on such scene as Elysium.
>

Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Steven Caron]

solid angle isn't some massive company either...


On Mon, Feb 17, 2014 at 2:38 PM, Eugen Sares  wrote:

>  If they really managed to render a scene like this... that would be
> something I'd say...
> A 3 guys company, in such a short time, and they blow everybody out of the
> lake? What's the Oscar for software development?
>
>
>

Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Eugen Sares]

just so you know... athens was a fraction of what we rendered for
elysium. so... i think you guys should be aiming high... i mean REALLY
high. if i don't see a billion somewhere (instancing is fine) then i am
still not convinced the gpu renderer has overcome the memory
limitations.

but it sounds like the scene you describe is a beast... can't wait to
see it!



If they really managed to render a scene like this... that would be
something I'd say...
A 3 guys company, in such a short time, and they blow everybody out of
the lake? What's the Oscar for software development?

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Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Emilio Hernandez]

Well Steven, for $100 bucks for the Beta maybe you can try it.  Will be
awsome to have some feedback on such scene as Elysium.




2014-02-17 16:28 GMT-06:00 Emilio Hernandez :

> Well there are some guys that are using Redshift with Royal Render without
> any issues.
>
> Just started playing with Melena and Redshift.
>
> 60,000 strands with 150 subdivisions in 99 seconds from sending the scene
> to redshift to final.
>
> After sending the scene the frame went down to 57 seconds.
>
> The scene extraction at the beginning took 22 seconds.
>
> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/49626349/Melena_prev_04.jpg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 2014-02-17 16:19 GMT-06:00 Andreas Bystrom :
>
> yep, looks nice.
>>
>> I'm also wondering if redshift can use the combined vram when using
>> several cards in sli mode, if you have 3 titans, can you use 3x6gb or just
>> 6gb for your scene?
>>
>> a tree scene like that, at that rez would probably take a few hours in
>> arnold or vray, so even at 30m in redshift it's still very fast..
>>
>> still, at 30m a frame you won't exactly be able to render full shots
>> without a farm, and once you work with even heavier scenes I imagine you
>> are looking at rendertimes of several hours per frame, and at that point I
>> don't think the gpu will speed anything up, quite the opposite.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:12 AM, Eugen Sares wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> To be clear, when Redshift goes out-of-core, it goes *into *your system
>>> ram. So in the end, you still need plenty of system ram for large scenes.
>>> But I've only got 20GB in my workstation and I'm getting very complex
>>> renders out of it without coming even close to that. More in the 6-8GB
>>> range so far. Proxies are awesome, and Redshift wisely had those from day
>>> one of the alpha.
>>>
>>> Now several months ago I rendered 
>>> this,
>>> but it's more along the lines of what Octavian posted. It's just one tree
>>> instanced a bunch of times. This rendered in about 30min at that
>>> resolution, on a GTX470.
>>>
>>> -Tim
>>>
>>> Very nice!! How did you light it? Sun + dome?
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>>
>>> Diese E-Mail ist frei von Viren und Malware, denn der avast! 
>>> AntivirusSchutz ist aktiv.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Andreas Byström
>> Weta Digital
>>
>
>

Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Emilio Hernandez]

Well there are some guys that are using Redshift with Royal Render without
any issues.

Just started playing with Melena and Redshift.

60,000 strands with 150 subdivisions in 99 seconds from sending the scene
to redshift to final.

After sending the scene the frame went down to 57 seconds.

The scene extraction at the beginning took 22 seconds.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/49626349/Melena_prev_04.jpg








2014-02-17 16:19 GMT-06:00 Andreas Bystrom :

> yep, looks nice.
>
> I'm also wondering if redshift can use the combined vram when using
> several cards in sli mode, if you have 3 titans, can you use 3x6gb or just
> 6gb for your scene?
>
> a tree scene like that, at that rez would probably take a few hours in
> arnold or vray, so even at 30m in redshift it's still very fast..
>
> still, at 30m a frame you won't exactly be able to render full shots
> without a farm, and once you work with even heavier scenes I imagine you
> are looking at rendertimes of several hours per frame, and at that point I
> don't think the gpu will speed anything up, quite the opposite.
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:12 AM, Eugen Sares wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> To be clear, when Redshift goes out-of-core, it goes *into *your system
>> ram. So in the end, you still need plenty of system ram for large scenes.
>> But I've only got 20GB in my workstation and I'm getting very complex
>> renders out of it without coming even close to that. More in the 6-8GB
>> range so far. Proxies are awesome, and Redshift wisely had those from day
>> one of the alpha.
>>
>> Now several months ago I rendered 
>> this,
>> but it's more along the lines of what Octavian posted. It's just one tree
>> instanced a bunch of times. This rendered in about 30min at that
>> resolution, on a GTX470.
>>
>> -Tim
>>
>> Very nice!! How did you light it? Sun + dome?
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>> Diese E-Mail ist frei von Viren und Malware, denn der avast! 
>> AntivirusSchutz ist aktiv.
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Andreas Byström
> Weta Digital
>

Re: Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Andreas Bystrom]

yep, looks nice.

I'm also wondering if redshift can use the combined vram when using several
cards in sli mode, if you have 3 titans, can you use 3x6gb or just 6gb for
your scene?

a tree scene like that, at that rez would probably take a few hours in
arnold or vray, so even at 30m in redshift it's still very fast..

still, at 30m a frame you won't exactly be able to render full shots
without a farm, and once you work with even heavier scenes I imagine you
are looking at rendertimes of several hours per frame, and at that point I
don't think the gpu will speed anything up, quite the opposite.


On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 11:12 AM, Eugen Sares  wrote:

>
>
> To be clear, when Redshift goes out-of-core, it goes *into *your system
> ram. So in the end, you still need plenty of system ram for large scenes.
> But I've only got 20GB in my workstation and I'm getting very complex
> renders out of it without coming even close to that. More in the 6-8GB
> range so far. Proxies are awesome, and Redshift wisely had those from day
> one of the alpha.
>
> Now several months ago I rendered 
> this,
> but it's more along the lines of what Octavian posted. It's just one tree
> instanced a bunch of times. This rendered in about 30min at that
> resolution, on a GTX470.
>
> -Tim
>
> Very nice!! How did you light it? Sun + dome?
>
>
> --
>
>
> Diese E-Mail ist frei von Viren und Malware, denn der avast! 
> AntivirusSchutz ist aktiv.
>
>


-- 
Andreas Byström
Weta Digital

Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Eugen Sares]

To be clear, when Redshift goes out-of-core, it goes into your system
ram. So in the end, you still need plenty of system ram for large
scenes. But I've only got 20GB in my workstation and I'm getting very
complex renders out of it without coming even close to that. More in
the 6-8GB range so far. Proxies are awesome, and Redshift wisely had
those from day one of the alpha.

Now several months ago I rendered this, but it's more along the lines
of what Octavian posted. It's just one tree instanced a bunch of times.
This rendered in about 30min at that resolution, on a GTX470.

-Tim

Very nice!! How did you light it? Sun + dome?

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Re[2]: Redshift3D Render

[Eugen Sares]

Don't have such heavy scenes, but did some architectural interiors, >
1-2 mio polys, 240 light sources with soft shadows... according to Panos
Zobolas, whom I sent the scene for testing, there was an extremely high
shadow ray count, which brought it to a crawl (6h for 1920x1920px,
GeForce 760).
That was 3 months ago - there might be improvements now in that regard.
And it did render...


-- Originalnachricht --
Von: "Andreas Bystrom" 
An: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Gesendet: 17.02.2014 20:48:35
Betreff: Re: Redshift3D Render


out of curiosity, has anyone tried a heavy production scene in
redshift? somewhere around 100-500m triangles with a bunch of 2k/4k
textures?

I'm seeing lots of single objects and simple scenes done with it,
rendering really fast, but what happens when you throw something
heavier at it?

-Andreas




On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 4:00 AM, Tim Crowson
 wrote:

"Lofted" strands aren't quite there yet, but are around the corner.
All in all, Redshift really is rocking our little corner of the
business. For us, it's been a game-changer.

-Tim


On 2/16/2014 6:33 PM, Emilio Hernandez wrote:

This is just XSI hair, but now it supports also strands.






2014-02-16 18:28 GMT-06:00 Steven Caron :

ice strands or just xsi hair?


On Sun, Feb 16, 2014 at 1:40 PM, Emilio Hernandez
 wrote:

Latest release of redshift with hair.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/49626349/hair_01.jpg




--








--
Andreas Byström
Weta Digital


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