RE: Pipe Schedule Systems
What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Pipe Schedule Systems
David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Pipe Schedule Systems
Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3137 - Release Date: 09/16/10 01:34:00 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Pipe Schedule Systems
What Matt said. David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Matthew J. Willis Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:00 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3137 - Release Date: 09/16/10 01:34:00 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Pipe Schedule Systems
I guess that makes sense.. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Matthew J. Willis Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:00 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3137 - Release Date: 09/16/10 01:34:00 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put
Re: Pipe Schedule Systems
The standard requires a minimum pressure be available at the highest/most remote sprinkler - is that the calc that's been requested? Still no requirement for a hose allowance though. Steve Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Matthew J. Willis m...@norredfire.com Sender: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org Date: Thu, 16 Sep 2010 08:59:48 To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Reply-To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3137 - Release Date: 09/16/10 01:34:00 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Pipe Schedule Systems
Sounds like the AHJ may be overstepping his boundries. Additions to Pipe schedule systems are allowed without calcs in #13. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of steve Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:10 AM To: AFSA Subject: Re: Pipe Schedule Systems The standard requires a minimum pressure be available at the highest/most remote sprinkler - is that the calc that's been requested? Still no requirement for a hose allowance though. Steve Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Matthew J. Willis m...@norredfire.com Sender: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org Date: Thu, 16 Sep 2010 08:59:48 To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Reply-To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3137 - Release Date: 09/16/10 01:34:00 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum
Re: Pipe Schedule Systems
Although within his authority the AHJ is being unreasonable to require the calcs. If minor modification is being done to pipe schedule systems than the pipe schedule should apply and your new work just needs to fit the schedule. The whole concept between pipe schedules and calculations is that with calculations you can have more flexibility of design and can more precisely predict performance and thereby possibly reduce cost by using less materials, in our case smaller diameter pipes. After you calc this scheduled system you'll see how over built it is just like the residential plumbers' rules of thumb for plumbing fixture pipe sizing. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 7:04 AM, Brian Harris br...@firstdefensefire.com wrote: I guess that makes sense.. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Matthew J. Willis Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:00 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3137 - Release Date: 09/16/10 01:34:00 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send
Re: Pipe Schedule Systems
But if there is a change in occupancy? At 10:19 AM 9/16/2010, you wrote: Although within his authority the AHJ is being unreasonable to require the calcs. If minor modification is being done to pipe schedule systems than the pipe schedule should apply and your new work just needs to fit the schedule. The whole concept between pipe schedules and calculations is that with calculations you can have more flexibility of design and can more precisely predict performance and thereby possibly reduce cost by using less materials, in our case smaller diameter pipes. After you calc this scheduled system you'll see how over built it is just like the residential plumbers' rules of thumb for plumbing fixture pipe sizing. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 7:04 AM, Brian Harris br...@firstdefensefire.com wrote: I guess that makes sense.. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Matthew J. Willis Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:00 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3137 - Release Date: 09/16/10 01:34:00 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical
Re: Pipe Schedule Systems
So what if the modifications are minor? Would the schedule mysteriously then not apply? Even OH to EH if the schedule meets EH. Or vice versa like my building. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 7:21 AM, Todd Williams t...@fpdc.com wrote: But if there is a change in occupancy? At 10:19 AM 9/16/2010, you wrote: Although within his authority the AHJ is being unreasonable to require the calcs. If minor modification is being done to pipe schedule systems than the pipe schedule should apply and your new work just needs to fit the schedule. The whole concept between pipe schedules and calculations is that with calculations you can have more flexibility of design and can more precisely predict performance and thereby possibly reduce cost by using less materials, in our case smaller diameter pipes. After you calc this scheduled system you'll see how over built it is just like the residential plumbers' rules of thumb for plumbing fixture pipe sizing. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 7:04 AM, Brian Harris br...@firstdefensefire.com wrote: I guess that makes sense.. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Matthew J. Willis Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:00 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ
RE: Pipe Schedule Systems
Then there's always the question of what C factor to use in your calc's of an old PS system? Have you seen the inside of these pipes? Do you use 120 or 100 or maybe even 80? There is really no guide on what's appropriate. I had one AHJ that just wanted the calc to fail, and required that we use a C of 80, when that calc still worked, he said oh I meant 60. There was a fight but we ended up doing an internal inspection of the pipe and he accepted the calc that used 80. (Still just a guess on his part.) Thom ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Pipe Schedule Systems
Not entirely George. Was the pipe schedule appropriate for the hazard when installed? Has the commodity changed? Odds are if it is PS it's old thus there have been many changes that rightfully should be investigated. You wouldn't be surprised how many old systems had no correlation to any standard on how to protect a hazard. I ran in to this often and always gave the owner (through his reps) a chance to show when it was installed 13, 231c, FM or anything else this was the appropriate installation. Chris -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of George Church Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:20 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org; st...@protectiondesign.com Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Sounds like the AHJ may be overstepping his boundries. Additions to Pipe schedule systems are allowed without calcs in #13. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of steve Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:10 AM To: AFSA Subject: Re: Pipe Schedule Systems The standard requires a minimum pressure be available at the highest/most remote sprinkler - is that the calc that's been requested? Still no requirement for a hose allowance though. Steve Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Matthew J. Willis m...@norredfire.com Sender: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org Date: Thu, 16 Sep 2010 08:59:48 To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Reply-To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http://www.pctools.com/ === ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Re: Pipe Schedule Systems
And what is the C factor of any given system but a guess? I just saw a picture of a relatively new system (five years) that had complete clogging of some pipes. C = 0? I'm surprised your AHJ didn't make you calculate for each pipe one diameter smaller than the installed size so as to adjust for age shrinkage. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 9:23 AM, Thom tmcma...@firetechinc.com wrote: Then there's always the question of what C factor to use in your calc's of an old PS system? Have you seen the inside of these pipes? Do you use 120 or 100 or maybe even 80? There is really no guide on what's appropriate. I had one AHJ that just wanted the calc to fail, and required that we use a C of 80, when that calc still worked, he said oh I meant 60. There was a fight but we ended up doing an internal inspection of the pipe and he accepted the calc that used 80. (Still just a guess on his part.) Thom ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Ron Greenman Instructor Fire Protection Engineering Technology Bates Technical College 1101 So. Yakima Ave. Tacoma, WA 98405 rgreen...@bates.ctc.edu http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/ 253.680.7346 253.576.9700 (cell) Member: AFSA, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, NFSA, AFAA, ASEE, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Pipe Schedule Systems
C value for new steel 140, we use 120 Wet, 100 Dry to allow for age. There are systems out there approaching 30 years that were calculated (+/-). I wonder the condition of these. Was the 120/100 used correct? I would think not based on the inside of piping I have seen over the years. The flushing required by 25 is a good starting point to control this. At what point though do we consider the C worse that the allotted for aging? R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Ron Greenman Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 11:30 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Pipe Schedule Systems And what is the C factor of any given system but a guess? I just saw a picture of a relatively new system (five years) that had complete clogging of some pipes. C = 0? I'm surprised your AHJ didn't make you calculate for each pipe one diameter smaller than the installed size so as to adjust for age shrinkage. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 9:23 AM, Thom tmcma...@firetechinc.com wrote: Then there's always the question of what C factor to use in your calc's of an old PS system? Have you seen the inside of these pipes? Do you use 120 or 100 or maybe even 80? There is really no guide on what's appropriate. I had one AHJ that just wanted the calc to fail, and required that we use a C of 80, when that calc still worked, he said oh I meant 60. There was a fight but we ended up doing an internal inspection of the pipe and he accepted the calc that used 80. (Still just a guess on his part.) Thom ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:Sprinklerforum- requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Ron Greenman Instructor Fire Protection Engineering Technology Bates Technical College 1101 So. Yakima Ave. Tacoma, WA 98405 rgreen...@bates.ctc.edu http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/ 253.680.7346 253.576.9700 (cell) Member: AFSA, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, NFSA, AFAA, ASEE, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.851 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3137 - Release Date: 09/16/10 01:34:00 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: supp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Re: Pipe Schedule Systems
Chris, But if this isn't the case, or if there's no criteria to assume extra corrosion then you just use what the code says. If you expect extra corrosion you have to look, and then, as Thom says, what is the arbitrary value you assign to C? And, if as I said in my first comment in this thread, schedules always are always based on empirical results of what has been observed to work and not work over time with allowance for the worst cases (those that didn't work) then most things end up over built when building to a schedule. Back in the early days of Friedrich Grinnell and John Wormald maximum coverage per head for ordinary hazard was 90 sqft and extra hazard was 60 sqft. We all know 3/4 pipe was used. Hopefully we all know that 52K and 40K maximum per system are based on how high the pipe schedule went. That the bell was by the FDC not so the FDC could be found but because the WMG was the ONLY alarm device, that it was cheapest to put it as close to the riser as possible, that it was cheapest to put the FDC as close to the riser as possible and so the bell and FDC were in the same spot for economic reasons. As you've said many times the AHJ can't just decide something based on whim. On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 9:28 AM, Chris Cahill fpech...@embarqmail.com wrote: Not entirely George. Was the pipe schedule appropriate for the hazard when installed? Has the commodity changed? Odds are if it is PS it's old thus there have been many changes that rightfully should be investigated. You wouldn't be surprised how many old systems had no correlation to any standard on how to protect a hazard. I ran in to this often and always gave the owner (through his reps) a chance to show when it was installed 13, 231c, FM or anything else this was the appropriate installation. Chris -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of George Church Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:20 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org; st...@protectiondesign.com Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Sounds like the AHJ may be overstepping his boundries. Additions to Pipe schedule systems are allowed without calcs in #13. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of steve Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 10:10 AM To: AFSA Subject: Re: Pipe Schedule Systems The standard requires a minimum pressure be available at the highest/most remote sprinkler - is that the calc that's been requested? Still no requirement for a hose allowance though. Steve Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Matthew J. Willis m...@norredfire.com Sender: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org Date: Thu, 16 Sep 2010 08:59:48 To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Reply-To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems Then it will no longer be a pipe schedule, but a calculated system. Which requires hose streams. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis, CET Automatic Fire Sprinklers Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-816-1087 Mobile 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum- boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:57 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems David- We are doing some minor work to an existing warehouse that was done with the pipe schedule method. Now the AHJ wants us to provide hydraulic calc's to show him if the existing system will work. Brian Harris FDFP Inc. -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Autry, David Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 9:39 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Pipe Schedule Systems What exactly would you add it to? David Autry Plans Examiner Nebraska State Fire Marshal's Office 246 S. 14th Street Lincoln, NE 68508 402-471-9659 402-471-3118 fax www.sfm.ne.gov ** Note new email address: david.au...@nebraska.gov -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Brian Harris Sent: Thursday, September 16, 2010 8:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Pipe Schedule Systems I swear I read somewhere that for a pipe schedule system you do not need to add hose allowance, Am I nuts? Brian Harris First Defense Fire Protection 11957 Ramah Church Road Huntersville, NC 28078 Phone: 704.948.3506 Fax: 704.948.3507 Nicet # 128476 === Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.15890) http
