Re: The SM2 downgrade
Martin Freitag wrote: Graham schrieb: Martin Freitag wrote: Graham schrieb: First there's the need to provide your master password when you start it. Yes, I know it's been complained about at length, but how on earth could something like that slip through the development process? Do the developers not use master passwords? If it only asks once, what'S your problem? Is it possible that you have fetching mails on start without opening MailNews enabled in the preferences and it needs your Master-PW for that? Because there are times when I do not want my passwords etc. to be automatically dished up by the browser. In other words, I want it to work like SM 1 did, which is to ask when the master password is first required (as the option states). If you fetch mail in start, wouldn't it be required then? It's possible that you have to disable that functionality in the preferences to get rid of an initial asking for the Master-PW. If I have to run the browser with the master password permanently permanently provided, then there's not a whole lot of point having a master password at all. Oh there is, it encrypts your passwords on the disk ;-) Second it is just mind-numbingly slow. It takes for ever to resolve site addresses and forever to download web pages. It often just times out. SM 1.1.18 has no problems at all, on the exact same system (neither does Opera). I've never heared that before about SM2 compared to SM1, I would recommend testing with another profile or in safe-mode. Nice to hear you tried... Flashblock will not install. It just gets itself into an install loop: every time you start SM 2.0.1, Flashblock tries to install again. Flashblock works like a charm in SM2, that's another reason I think your SM2-installation and/or profile is not ok. Well, it got itself into this state all by itself, and didn't work right from the very moment it was installed. Looks like you're not even willing to find a solution, but just complaining about the current state, this won't get you any further, sry. When flashblock works fine for all others you should consider your setup being corrupted somehow. This might even be your file-system and not SM itself. The new download progress dialog's ridiculous small buttons are another issue, but this has been beaten to death (and I wish this new design had been). As you already read about it, feel free to create an improved version ;) Ah yes, that childish response. The answer to all criticism of any open source project. Well I hear a bit too often, too. But there's some truth in it. I would prefer a different functionality too but I don't have the time/knoweledge (yet?) to change it myself. I'm using the download statusbar extension for now. regards Martin I tried status bar and while it works, despite Download Manager's tensey weensy buttons and indicators. I found download manager far better. After I got it to work. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
Martin Freitag wrote: If you fetch mail in start, wouldn't it be required then? It's possible that you have to disable that functionality in the preferences to get rid of an initial asking for the Master-PW. I'm not using it for mail, and it isn't checking anything at startup. Or at least, all the settings for doing so are off. I've never heared that before about SM2 compared to SM1, I would recommend testing with another profile or in safe-mode. Nice to hear you tried... I think I've found the problem. SM 2 appears to try to use a proxy even when told not to. This is a problem when the proxy doesn't exist (which is why it is told not to use it.) Flashblock will not install. It just gets itself into an install loop: every time you start SM 2.0.1, Flashblock tries to install again. Flashblock works like a charm in SM2, that's another reason I think your SM2-installation and/or profile is not ok. Well, it got itself into this state all by itself, and didn't work right from the very moment it was installed. Looks like you're not even willing to find a solution, but just complaining about the current state, this won't get you any further, sry. When flashblock works fine for all others you should consider your setup being corrupted somehow. This might even be your file-system and not SM itself. I simply stated what it did. I just expected so much more of SM2, and have ended up disappointed. (BTW, it is not my file system at fault.) The new download progress dialog's ridiculous small buttons are another issue, but this has been beaten to death (and I wish this new design had been). I would prefer a different functionality too but I don't have the time/knoweledge (yet?) to change it myself. I'm using the download statusbar extension for now. regards Sadly, using a multitude of extensions to fix what is broken is becoming more necessary. A disease that's carried over from Firefox in my opinion. Graham. ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
Graham schrieb: It's that bad. No, not THAT bad. ;-P First there's the need to provide your master password when you start it. Yes, I know it's been complained about at length, but how on earth could something like that slip through the development process? Do the developers not use master passwords? If it only asks once, what'S your problem? Is it possible that you have fetching mails on start without opening MailNews enabled in the preferences and it needs your Master-PW for that? Second it is just mind-numbingly slow. It takes for ever to resolve site addresses and forever to download web pages. It often just times out. SM 1.1.18 has no problems at all, on the exact same system (neither does Opera). I've never heared that before about SM2 compared to SM1, I would recommend testing with another profile or in safe-mode. Flashblock will not install. It just gets itself into an install loop: every time you start SM 2.0.1, Flashblock tries to install again. Flashblock works like a charm in SM2, that's another reason I think your SM2-installation and/or profile is not ok. The new download progress dialog's ridiculous small buttons are another issue, but this has been beaten to death (and I wish this new design had been). As you already read about it, feel free to create an improved version ;) regards Martin -- () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - http://www.asciiribbon.org/index-de.html ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
Martin Freitag wrote: Graham schrieb: It's that bad. No, not THAT bad. ;-P First there's the need to provide your master password when you start it. Yes, I know it's been complained about at length, but how on earth could something like that slip through the development process? Do the developers not use master passwords? If it only asks once, what'S your problem? Is it possible that you have fetching mails on start without opening MailNews enabled in the preferences and it needs your Master-PW for that? If you have a Master Password set, it is supposed to ask as soon as you open SM. What some are complaining of is that they never/ever had a Password set and that now they are required to supply one. Now you do need to supply you user name and password for each of your email addresses but your supposed to have SM to save those the first time so that you don't have to supply them each time you open your mailboxes. ---snip--- -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
Graham wrote: I've been reading the posts from people who have been quite adamant, even rude, about SeaMonkey 2's deficiencies. I held off from installing 2.0.0, and waited from 2.0.1. I thought there were bound to be some problems, but how could it be all that bad? It's that bad. First there's the need to provide your master password when you start it. Yes, I know it's been complained about at length, but how on earth could something like that slip through the development process? Do the developers not use master passwords? Second it is just mind-numbingly slow. It takes for ever to resolve site addresses and forever to download web pages. It often just times out. SM 1.1.18 has no problems at all, on the exact same system (neither does Opera). Flashblock will not install. It just gets itself into an install loop: every time you start SM 2.0.1, Flashblock tries to install again. The new download progress dialog's ridiculous small buttons are another issue, but this has been beaten to death (and I wish this new design had been). The forms manager (or lack thereof) is going to cause me problems, and is one reason I've avoided Firefox. I do understand that an enormous amount of effort has gone into SM 2, but I'm left wondering: for what? Firefox works much better than this, and I use a different email program anyway, so really all I use SeaMonkey for is newsgroups and the better user interface, but now the user interface of SeaMonkey has taken a sharp turn for the worse. I'm sorry, but I really can't use SM 2. With the end of maintenance to SM 1, I'm going to have to find myself an alternative. Opera seems to work quite well, it will take a bit of getting used to, the main drawbacks being no NoScript, no Flashblock, and no AdBlock+. I've begun to look at the latest Firefox, at least on my PC at work. It may be an acceptable alternative - after I play with it a bit on the PC I'll take a look at it on my Mac(s). Funny thing is that there are browser options available in Thunderbird which make me wonder why TB an FF aren't bundled into a suite, or at least give the user the option to make on call the other - they clearly share some options/hooks. I'm keeping up with SM 2.x.x on all but my main machine...but I'm sticking with 1.1.18 on my main iMac until I start seeing more things I like/prefer in this brave new 2.x world. -- - Rufus ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
Phillip Jones wrote: Martin Freitag wrote: Graham schrieb: It's that bad. No, not THAT bad. ;-P First there's the need to provide your master password when you start it. Yes, I know it's been complained about at length, but how on earth could something like that slip through the development process? Do the developers not use master passwords? If it only asks once, what'S your problem? Is it possible that you have fetching mails on start without opening MailNews enabled in the preferences and it needs your Master-PW for that? If you have a Master Password set, it is supposed to ask as soon as you open SM. What some are complaining of is that they never/ever had a Password set and that now they are required to supply one. Now you do need to supply you user name and password for each of your email addresses but your supposed to have SM to save those the first time so that you don't have to supply them each time you open your mailboxes. ---snip--- When and how SM asks for your Master really depends (or should depend) on how you have your prefs set - for ex.; I'm set for SM to ask for the Master the first time it's required, so it should not ask at startup because you haven't done anything - unless your Home page has a stored password for login, it should wait the user polls for new mail/messages in Mail/News, or visits a site with a stored password. So in theory, a user should be able to go for a whole session without ever having SM ask for the Master depending on what he's doing. But that doesn't seem to be the case, and I had to do the about:config workaround in spite of my Pref settings when I upgraded to 2.0. At least that's how it worked at one point, and it got broken sometime prior to and during SM 1.1.18, when SM started asking for my Master seemingly at random - and freezing the app; example - if I'm in the middle of trying to download something with a dialog box up, SM will often ask for my Master when it's not required and freeze - I have to do a Force Quit and start over. So far, I can't recall seeing this happen with 2.x.x - at least not the freezing part. -- - Rufus ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
Rufus wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Rufus wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Martin Freitag wrote: Graham schrieb: It's that bad. No, not THAT bad. ;-P First there's the need to provide your master password when you start it. Yes, I know it's been complained about at length, but how on earth could something like that slip through the development process? Do the developers not use master passwords? If it only asks once, what'S your problem? Is it possible that you have fetching mails on start without opening MailNews enabled in the preferences and it needs your Master-PW for that? If you have a Master Password set, it is supposed to ask as soon as you open SM. What some are complaining of is that they never/ever had a Password set and that now they are required to supply one. Now you do need to supply you user name and password for each of your email addresses but your supposed to have SM to save those the first time so that you don't have to supply them each time you open your mailboxes. ---snip--- When and how SM asks for your Master really depends (or should depend) on how you have your prefs set - for ex.; I'm set for SM to ask for the Master the first time it's required, so it should not ask at startup because you haven't done anything - unless your Home page has a stored password for login, it should wait the user polls for new mail/messages in Mail/News, or visits a site with a stored password. So in theory, a user should be able to go for a whole session without ever having SM ask for the Master depending on what he's doing. But that doesn't seem to be the case, and I had to do the about:config workaround in spite of my Pref settings when I upgraded to 2.0. At least that's how it worked at one point, and it got broken sometime prior to and during SM 1.1.18, when SM started asking for my Master seemingly at random - and freezing the app; example - if I'm in the middle of trying to download something with a dialog box up, SM will often ask for my Master when it's not required and freeze - I have to do a Force Quit and start over. So far, I can't recall seeing this happen with 2.x.x - at least not the freezing part. I have set the first time its needed. But it ask for Mater Password as soon as SeaMonkey is opened. Always worked for me this way in Communicator, Mozilla, and SeaMonkey 1.1.x why should it change now. And yes my Username and password are required to go into my email accounts. And I have SeaMonkey set to remember them so that I don't have to enter them. That's my point - it shouldn't, unless you're in a situation as I described above. I remember when it didn't work the way it's working now with 2.x.x (my 1.1.18 install never asks/asked at start up)...but the about:config workaround makes it work the way it should, and that's good enough. For now. Its always worked for me that way even back in communicator. -- Phillip M. Jones, C.E.T.If it's Fixed, Don't Break it http://www.phillipmjones.net http://www.vpea.org mailto:pjon...@kimbanet.com ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
Phillip Jones wrote: Rufus wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Rufus wrote: Phillip Jones wrote: Martin Freitag wrote: Graham schrieb: It's that bad. No, not THAT bad. ;-P First there's the need to provide your master password when you start it. Yes, I know it's been complained about at length, but how on earth could something like that slip through the development process? Do the developers not use master passwords? If it only asks once, what'S your problem? Is it possible that you have fetching mails on start without opening MailNews enabled in the preferences and it needs your Master-PW for that? If you have a Master Password set, it is supposed to ask as soon as you open SM. What some are complaining of is that they never/ever had a Password set and that now they are required to supply one. Now you do need to supply you user name and password for each of your email addresses but your supposed to have SM to save those the first time so that you don't have to supply them each time you open your mailboxes. ---snip--- When and how SM asks for your Master really depends (or should depend) on how you have your prefs set - for ex.; I'm set for SM to ask for the Master the first time it's required, so it should not ask at startup because you haven't done anything - unless your Home page has a stored password for login, it should wait the user polls for new mail/messages in Mail/News, or visits a site with a stored password. So in theory, a user should be able to go for a whole session without ever having SM ask for the Master depending on what he's doing. But that doesn't seem to be the case, and I had to do the about:config workaround in spite of my Pref settings when I upgraded to 2.0. At least that's how it worked at one point, and it got broken sometime prior to and during SM 1.1.18, when SM started asking for my Master seemingly at random - and freezing the app; example - if I'm in the middle of trying to download something with a dialog box up, SM will often ask for my Master when it's not required and freeze - I have to do a Force Quit and start over. So far, I can't recall seeing this happen with 2.x.x - at least not the freezing part. I have set the first time its needed. But it ask for Mater Password as soon as SeaMonkey is opened. Always worked for me this way in Communicator, Mozilla, and SeaMonkey 1.1.x why should it change now. And yes my Username and password are required to go into my email accounts. And I have SeaMonkey set to remember them so that I don't have to enter them. That's my point - it shouldn't, unless you're in a situation as I described above. I remember when it didn't work the way it's working now with 2.x.x (my 1.1.18 install never asks/asked at start up)...but the about:config workaround makes it work the way it should, and that's good enough. For now. Its always worked for me that way even back in communicator. Me too. But with the 2.x generation it got broken or fixed...and I just encountered a random request for my Master looking for the about:config workaround while browsing the SM site with SM 1.1.18...check Known Issues, item 5: http://www.seamonkey-project.org/releases/seamonkey2.0.1/ -- - Rufus ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
On 12/20/2009 11:31 AM, Rufus wrote: ... When and how SM asks for your Master really depends (or should depend) on how you have your prefs set - for ex.; I'm set for SM to ask for the Master the first time it's required, so it should not ask at startup because you haven't done anything - unless your Home page has a stored password for login, it should wait the user polls for new mail/messages in Mail/News, or visits a site with a stored password. So in theory, a user should be able to go for a whole session without ever having SM ask for the Master depending on what he's doing. But that doesn't seem to be the case, and I had to do the about:config workaround in spite of my Pref settings when I upgraded to 2.0. At least that's how it worked at one point, and it got broken sometime prior to and during SM 1.1.18, when SM started asking for my Master seemingly at random - and freezing the app; example - if I'm in the middle of trying to download something with a dialog box up, SM will often ask for my Master when it's not required and freeze - I have to do a Force Quit and start over. So far, I can't recall seeing this happen with 2.x.x - at least not the freezing part. https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=506638 [ Bug 506638 - migrated SM2 from SM1 is asking for master password after first start even when no master password was set in SM1.1.x ] ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
NoOp wrote: On 12/20/2009 11:31 AM, Rufus wrote: ... When and how SM asks for your Master really depends (or should depend) on how you have your prefs set - for ex.; I'm set for SM to ask for the Master the first time it's required, so it should not ask at startup because you haven't done anything - unless your Home page has a stored password for login, it should wait the user polls for new mail/messages in Mail/News, or visits a site with a stored password. So in theory, a user should be able to go for a whole session without ever having SM ask for the Master depending on what he's doing. But that doesn't seem to be the case, and I had to do the about:config workaround in spite of my Pref settings when I upgraded to 2.0. At least that's how it worked at one point, and it got broken sometime prior to and during SM 1.1.18, when SM started asking for my Master seemingly at random - and freezing the app; example - if I'm in the middle of trying to download something with a dialog box up, SM will often ask for my Master when it's not required and freeze - I have to do a Force Quit and start over. So far, I can't recall seeing this happen with 2.x.x - at least not the freezing part. https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=506638 [ Bug 506638 - migrated SM2 from SM1 is asking for master password after first start even when no master password was set in SM1.1.x ] Yes. It's also asking for it at seemingly random times when it is not required, when it is set - before I have navigated to a page with a stored password, or opened Mail/News. But I haven't seen it freeze 2.0.1 like I have with 1.1.18. As mentioned, I've used the about:config tweek to get around the startup issue...but it still asks at random during general browsing when it is not required. -- - Rufus ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
Re: The SM2 downgrade
Martin Freitag wrote: Graham schrieb: First there's the need to provide your master password when you start it. Yes, I know it's been complained about at length, but how on earth could something like that slip through the development process? Do the developers not use master passwords? If it only asks once, what'S your problem? Is it possible that you have fetching mails on start without opening MailNews enabled in the preferences and it needs your Master-PW for that? Because there are times when I do not want my passwords etc. to be automatically dished up by the browser. In other words, I want it to work like SM 1 did, which is to ask when the master password is first required (as the option states). If I have to run the browser with the master password permanently permanently provided, then there's not a whole lot of point having a master password at all. Second it is just mind-numbingly slow. It takes for ever to resolve site addresses and forever to download web pages. It often just times out. SM 1.1.18 has no problems at all, on the exact same system (neither does Opera). I've never heared that before about SM2 compared to SM1, I would recommend testing with another profile or in safe-mode. Flashblock will not install. It just gets itself into an install loop: every time you start SM 2.0.1, Flashblock tries to install again. Flashblock works like a charm in SM2, that's another reason I think your SM2-installation and/or profile is not ok. Well, it got itself into this state all by itself, and didn't work right from the very moment it was installed. The new download progress dialog's ridiculous small buttons are another issue, but this has been beaten to death (and I wish this new design had been). As you already read about it, feel free to create an improved version ;) Ah yes, that childish response. The answer to all criticism of any open source project. ___ support-seamonkey mailing list support-seamonkey@lists.mozilla.org https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/support-seamonkey
