Re: [Biofuel] 8 Electric-Car Myths Busted
Thanks for this one, Keith. Nice to finally see someone do some actual research before posting an article about the 'dark secrets' of electric vehicles. (I am spending a lot of time lately dispelling inaccurate information in a rash of anti-EV articles hitting the Web and MSM.) I would add a couple of clarifications related to myths 7 8. While we don't know precisely how long a battery in an EV will last, note that pretty much every automaker is offering an 8-year (or more) warranty on batteries in their hybrids and EVs. The Honda EV+ NiMH batteries are generally reaching over 100,000 miles now and more than 10 years, and there is no sign of general failures in those packs. When charging an EV (in North America) from a 240 volt source, the charge time is generally a quarter of the 120 volt charging time. This is because most 240 volt circuits are rated for at least 30 amps, while the 120 volt circuits tend to limited to delivering 12 amps (the continuous duty rating for a 15-amp circuit). Thus, 4 times the watts, and 1/4 the charging time. There is a lot of excitement and talk about fast chargers recently. Personally, I don't think there will be nearly as many of these as proponents would have you believe. Most people will figure out that they can charge relatively inexpensively overnight, every night, and the need for fast chargers will be quite limited. Darryl (driving electrics since 1979) On 29/11/2010 8:40 AM, Keith Addison wrote: http://motherjones.com/environment/2011/01/electric-car-myths 8 Electric-Car Myths Busted Will plug-in cars fry the grid? Bust your budget? Leave you stranded in the sticks? - By Kiera Butler January/February 2011 Issue I'm about as far from a gearhead as it gets, but even so, I was excited about the release of the nation's first two consumer plug-in electric vehicles: the Chevy Volt and the Nissan Leaf. The Volt can go 40 miles on battery power and another 310 thanks to an auxiliary gas engine, which kicked in smoothly as I floored it up a hill during a recent test drive. The Leaf is-even cooler-completely electric, with a range of about 100 miles. In 2011, Ford, Mitsubishi, and Mercedes-Benz plan to introduce their own tailpipe-free models. GE has ordered up thousands for its sales force, and the federal government has set a target for 1 million electric vehicles by 2015. (A good step, even considering the 246 million or so gas vehicles already on the road.) Are we finally ready after years of false starts? Despite widespread public jitters, the experts I polled said yes. Herewith, eight e-car worries not to spin your wheels over. 1. Our grid can't handle the added burden. While electric cars do use a great deal of juice, utilities have been working behind the scenes for years to make sure the cars don't fry the grid. Blackouts are extremely unlikely, notes Simon Mui, a scientist who studies clean vehicles and fuels for the Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC). Advanced charging technology will help distribute power loads more evenly, and many home charging stations will operate only during off-peak hours-which is more efficient and usually cheaper. Smart chargers, slated to hit the market in 2011, will decide when to charge based on the time and distance you commute, local rates, and electricity demand in your neighborhood. 2. My utility bill will skyrocket. Yep, you'll spend more on amperage, but your savings on gas will more than cover it. If you drive a battery-only car 12,000 miles a year at going power rates, you'll pay an extra $27 or so per month for electricity, but save about $97 on gas. Some utilities offer special rates during off-peak hours-in California, you might pay as little as $13 a month (roughly half-price) to charge up at night. The one drawback of cheaper fuel is, well, cheaper driving, which some experts worry will lure commuters away from public transit, carpools, and bikes. 3. Coal-burning utilities mean electric cars will make emissions worse. Hardly. Even in predominantly coal-burning regions, an electric car releases 35 to 60 percent less CO2 than a comparable conventional car, according to industry think tank Electric Power Research Institute (EPRI). In areas with an ecofriendly power mix, the emissions are up to 75 percent lower. EPRI transportation expert Mark Duvall points out that as the grid gets cleaner-which it almost certainly will-electric cars will get cleaner, too. Bonus: Unlike gas, which is refined largely from imported petroleum, electricity flows from domestic sources. 4. Electric cars already flopped once, so why should I believe they'll succeed? Climate worries, obviously, have gained traction since the 1990s, but the main reason to believe in a comeback is economic. Perhaps you've noticed that Detroit seems, uh, a little leaner than it was during the Clinton years. To compete with foreign automakers in places with
Re: [Biofuel] 8 Electric-Car Myths Busted
- Original Message - From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Monday, November 29, 2010 8:40:00 AM Subject: [Biofuel] 8 Electric-Car Myths Busted http://motherjones.com/environment/2011/01/electric-car-myths 8 Electric-Car Myths Busted I enjoyed this article, and coupled with this bit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSdnycHfLnQ makes it all look like EV's are the best thing since the 'taming' of fire. While all this tasty cornucopian goodness looks good to the last drop, I just remain unconvinced that cars are the answer to any problem at all. I don't care how the car is powered. I see them as the problem. Fun, yes, handy, yes (in the absence of some sensible transporation, like walking to the train station), and certainly enjoyable, but I just don't think the pros outweigh the cons. i just don't. But that's me. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] 8 Electric-Car Myths Busted
Chip, I tend to agree with you. Couple that to the tendency for electric cars to be best in the sorts of roles that we would least want to be played by cars, and the electric car begins to fill me with dread. Yes, the electric has a vast advantage over any sort of IC propulsion in that it consumes nothing at all sat still in gridlock, but do we then cultivate gridlock in order to have the benefit of that? A few points others might not have thought of: 1. Cheap mobility is a bit like cheap food. The latter doesn't solve world hunger: on the contrary, it undermines people's ability to generate food for themselves. Just so cheap(er) mobility won't make people mobile, it will much more tend to stimulate development that capitalises on greater available mobility, thereby increasing everyone's need for mobility. On balance we'll probably be further away from anything like surplus mobility. How much potential is there for urban expansion? We're very far from physically running out of space, so there is a lot of room for the problem to get worse. I for one don't want the Cape winelands to turn into suburbs. 2. Then, of course, an increase in the prevalent need for mobility translates into an increase in the need for electricity. Most do the math based on existing levels of mobility, but that isn't a given. Just like builders of power stations respond to anticipated demand for electricity as if that were something self-creating and inevitable. I've seen the typical number of light sources in a moderately luxurious living room go from four or five to sixty or so in response to efficient lighting. The overall current draw has increased. Just like the potential for generating new places we need to go is probably endless, we can likely go on dreaming up new needs for electricity for ever. 3. Most comparisons assume the sorts of batteries that are currently in use. Substituting a battery type that is more open to local small-scale manufacture, like the Edison cell, changes the picture entirely. And other types have serious manufacturing issues. Edison cells are really very well suited to static applications, but are huge and heavy for their current capacity. 4. Electric propulsion isn't really complex. That's why the major automakers have been holding back. That's why GM only leased their previous EV: they didn't want people modifying them (they certainly didn't want people sticking IC drivetrains in them!) The automakers were waiting for a way to make EVs complex enough (unobtanium-goofium batteries), and they wanted legislation to force them, in the way corporations provoke legislation in order to build positions of privilege. The major automakers really want to make EVs, as they're much more like cellphones than like grandfather clocks to make, and likely to be highly disposable to boot, but they don't want to open themselves up to competition from all kinds of upstart start-ups in the process. Electric vehicles have their place. Trams and tractors can best make use of electric propulsion, not cars. Given the right sort of battery we're looking at heavy, high-torque vehicles. In a car that's the old gently-humming phone booth type, which is a solution to the sort of problem that is far better solved by walking. Regards Dawie Coetzee From: Chip Mefford [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Mon, 29 November, 2010 21:11:23 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] 8 Electric-Car Myths Busted - Original Message - From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Monday, November 29, 2010 8:40:00 AM Subject: [Biofuel] 8 Electric-Car Myths Busted http://motherjones.com/environment/2011/01/electric-car-myths 8 Electric-Car Myths Busted I enjoyed this article, and coupled with this bit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSdnycHfLnQ makes it all look like EV's are the best thing since the 'taming' of fire. While all this tasty cornucopian goodness looks good to the last drop, I just remain unconvinced that cars are the answer to any problem at all. I don't care how the car is powered. I see them as the problem. Fun, yes, handy, yes (in the absence of some sensible transporation, like walking to the train station), and certainly enjoyable, but I just don't think the pros outweigh the cons. i just don't. But that's me. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20101130/7e6b2473/attachment.html
