Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
Thank you all for your input. It really has me considering possibilities. a new line of thinking is growing in my mind :) a few people have mentioned batteries as a storage facility which would allow a more constant provision of power without running the generator (or alternator) constantly. I like this idea. Zeke wrote: My personal recommendation would be to do a battery/inverter/DC charger system, using a 10 or 20 HP single cylinder diesel engine coupled to an alternator to DC charge the batteries for two or three hours a day, then operating from the batteries/inverter the rest of the day. My family is in the Auto Parts business, so I am thinking along those lines now. i am thinking that i can buy a diesel vehicle of some sort. Then I could accumulate some automotive batteries with a plan to build a battery bank and use the vehicle's alternator to charge them. I could even connect the batteries so that pairs are in series, add another battery in series to the vehicle and then upgrade to a 24v alternator. (the starter should spin the engine really fast, then :)) I could add a transfer switch to my main power feed from the power company, at my fuse box. Then I assume I would need a 24v inverter to go between my battery bank and transfer switch? I like this idea for a few reasons: 1. I can probably get a deal on automotive batteries. 2. The vehicle can also be used as a vehicle. 3. The vehicle can be made to be relatively quiet. 4. I can load the battery bank into the vehicle to take power to my parent's house. Charging them as i drive? :) 5. Vehicle in driveway would not draw any attention from anyone driving by. 6. Biodiesel can be put in vehicle's tank for storage. Can even add an extra tank if desired. 7. Can use the vehicle to pickup used oil. 8. I am envisioning something old and raggedy looking, that i wouldn't trust to take me on a long trip but maybe with a few more smokeless hours on the engine? If not, I could probably rebuild it. I have rebuilt a few automotive gasoline engines in my time but never diesel. I am watching an old chevy luv pickup on ebay that might do the trick. chevy luv... lol.. never envisioned having one of those. There are a couple of details that I haven't worked out yet, though, and I could use some more input... :) Please bear in mind that I am not an electrician, nor am I an electrical engineer, so please forgive my terminology. 1. Power comes to my house as 220V, then split at the fuse box into 110V. (or something like that :)) Do I need a DC inverter to output 110V or 220V? 2. I have seen alternator's blown out when the load placed on them is too great. Is this an issue in my case? In other words if I connect the vehicle's alternator (battery) to a battery bank with ten batteries in it, will it blow out the alternator? 20 batteries? 1000 batteries? lol... maybe I am getting ahead of myself. thanks, again, everyone for your input! -Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Zeke Yewdall Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2006 7:07 PM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator,input appreciated You are right David. Induction generators are essentially the same as AC induction motors. On 1/24/06, David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Paul S Cantrell wrote: Mark, I agree that a 50 kVA genset is overkill unless you live in a mansion, BUT you can check with your local utility (Reliant? or Coop?) about Net Metering. Since your meter would run backward, you could 'store' power into the grid when you run it and pull power from the grid when you aren't. Then during outages you could run it and disconnect from the grid, so you don't electrocute anyone! Anyway, the trick is convincing them that biodiesel will qualify as 'renewable,' which will depend somewhat on whether your account rep is a yokel or a semi-educated yokel. ;-) Is it as simple as this? My understanding is that you can't take your normal genset and connect it to the grid - getting it in phase and keeping it synced is a problem. You CAN just use a standard AC motor and overdrive it - if you turn it a little faster than its designed to run it produces electricity rather than consumes it, and it stays sync'd because the grid is providing the excitation. But that leaves you with a motor to feed the grid and a generator to power the house. Anybody know for sure? --- David ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
MarkNormally I wouldn't recommend using car batteries, because they are not deep cycle batteries, and will fail pretty quickly -- less than a year. But if you can get them for free I'd recommend golf cart batteries at the very least. Stick a bunch of them in the bed of the chevy luv... And using a diesel vehical to do it seems like a decent idea. Quieter than a generator, and inconspicuous :)As far as blowing the alternators, you might want to look into a field controller for the alternators. Generally, alternators run flat out when the battery needs charging, then taper back when it's full. This only works if you don't deep cycle the batteries though -- using something as simple as a large rheostat in series with the field of the alternator in order to allow setting its maximum current would be good. This is done in the little engine driven units to avoid stalling the engine, but it also keep from blowing the alternator. Inverters are almost all 110 volts here in the US. Many are designed to use a communications cable between two of them to produce 220 volts. You could either rewire the house for 110 volts (if you don't have any 220 volt appliances, and don't have any three wire branch circuits). 220 volt appliances probably won't run off anything except the largest inverters anyway. Or just feed 110 volts into one leg of the circuit, and use grid power if you need something on the other leg -- say a 220 volt power tool or such. On 1/25/06, Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thank you all for your input.It really has me considering possibilities.a new line of thinking is growing in my mind :)a few people have mentioned batteries as a storage facility which would allow a more constant provision of power without running the generator (oralternator) constantly.I like this idea.Zeke wrote:My personal recommendation would be to do a battery/inverter/DC charger system, using a 10 or 20 HP single cylinder diesel engine coupled to analternator to DC charge the batteries for two or three hours a day, thenoperating from the batteries/inverter the rest of the day. My family is in the Auto Parts business, so I am thinking along those linesnow. i am thinking that i can buy a diesel vehicle of some sort.Then Icould accumulate some automotive batteries with a plan to build a battery bank and use the vehicle's alternator to charge them.I could even connectthe batteries so that pairs are in series, add another battery in series tothe vehicle and then upgrade to a 24v alternator.(the starter should spin the engine really fast, then :))I could add a transfer switch to my mainpower feed from the power company, at my fuse box.Then I assume I wouldneed a 24v inverter to go between my battery bank and transfer switch? I like this idea for a few reasons:1. I can probably get a deal on automotive batteries.2. The vehicle can also be used as a vehicle.3. The vehicle can be made to be relatively quiet.4. I can load the battery bank into the vehicle to take power to my parent's house.Charging them as i drive?:)5. Vehicle in driveway would not draw any attention from anyone driving by.6. Biodiesel can be put in vehicle's tank for storage.Can even add anextra tank if desired. 7. Can use the vehicle to pickup used oil.8. I am envisioning something old and raggedy looking, that i wouldn't trustto take me on a long trip but maybe with a few more smokeless hours on theengine?If not, I could probably rebuild it.I have rebuilt a few automotive gasoline engines in my time but never diesel.I am watching anold chevy luv pickup on ebay that might do the trick.chevy luv... lol..never envisioned having one of those.There are a couple of details that I haven't worked out yet, though, and I could use some more input... :)Please bear in mind that I am not an electrician, nor am I an electricalengineer, so please forgive my terminology.1. Power comes to my house as 220V, then split at the fuse box into 110V. (or something like that :))Do I need a DC inverter to output 110V or 220V?2. I have seen alternator's blown out when the load placed on them is toogreat.Is this an issue in my case?In other words if I connect the vehicle's alternator (battery) to a battery bank with ten batteries in it,will it blow out the alternator?20 batteries?1000 batteries?lol...maybe I am getting ahead of myself.thanks, again, everyone for your input! -Mark-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED][mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Zeke YewdallSent: Tuesday, January 24, 2006 7:07 PMTo: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator,input appreciatedYou are right David.Induction generators are essentially the same as ACinduction motors.On 1/24/06, David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Paul S Cantrell wrote: Mark, I agree that a 50 kVA genset is overkill unless you live in a mansion, BUT you can check with your local utility (Reliant? or Coop?) about Net Metering.Since your meter would run
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
-volt DC power to reduce the I-squared R losses. (Lower voltage means higher current and higher current means higher resistance losses in the wire). Blowing an alternator is likely based on load is likely a function of heating. Putting too much current through the alternator will increase the heating of the device (and it gets worse as the efficiency is lower, and automotive alternators are typically low-efficiency). However, assuming you are using batteries of the appropriate voltage rating for the alternator (e.g, 12-volt or 24-volt nominal), even if wired up in series to achieve that voltage, and there is a voltage regulator in the circuit (again typical), then the load should be fairly self-regulating. More batteries will mean more run-time to recharge, or perhaps additional alternators operating in parallel (diode-protected please) to reduce run-time, but increase loading on the engine. However, using a 200 hp engine (at a guess) to drive an alternator or two, likely rated at less than 1 hp each seems a less than ideal arrangement for charging batteries to run an average load (household power) of 1 or 2 kilowatts (with peaks to 15-20 kilowatts possible). The latter figure (peak load) will likely define how big an inverter you will need, and they get pricey fast above 2 kW. If you have access to the utility grid now, I think you will find this to be an expensive undertaking relative to the potential savings. If your concern is power outages, I think you will find a conventional generator to be more cost-effective. Diesel versions exist that you could run using biodiesel. Also portable. You will still need a transfer switch if using a 240-volt version. thanks, again, everyone for your input! -Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Zeke Yewdall Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2006 7:07 PM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator,input appreciated You are right David. Induction generators are essentially the same as AC induction motors. On 1/24/06, David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Paul S Cantrell wrote: Mark, I agree that a 50 kVA genset is overkill unless you live in a mansion, BUT you can check with your local utility (Reliant? or Coop?) about Net Metering. Since your meter would run backward, you could 'store' power into the grid when you run it and pull power from the grid when you aren't. Then during outages you could run it and disconnect from the grid, so you don't electrocute anyone! Anyway, the trick is convincing them that biodiesel will qualify as 'renewable,' which will depend somewhat on whether your account rep is a yokel or a semi-educated yokel. ;-) Is it as simple as this? My understanding is that you can't take your normal genset and connect it to the grid - getting it in phase and keeping it synced is a problem. You CAN just use a standard AC motor and overdrive it - if you turn it a little faster than its designed to run it produces electricity rather than consumes it, and it stays sync'd because the grid is providing the excitation. But that leaves you with a motor to feed the grid and a generator to power the house. Anybody know for sure? --- David -- Darryl McMahon http://www.econogics.com It's your planet. If you won't look after it, who will? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
Good info Darryl. A few additions. There is not much gain from using 24 volts vs. 12 volts as the native voltage. Actually, almost all off grid houses use 48 volts nowadays. Cheaper since equipment is usually limited by the amperage it can take, and if you have a 10kW inverter bank, the cable and circuit breaker sizes are just rediculous at 12 volts. The additional weight will affect the performance and fuel economy of your vehicle adversely. One possible positive is if you can place the battery weight near the drive wheels of a vehicle with traction issues (e.g., pickup trucks in snow/ice conditions). In the the recent solar decathlon competition, each of those houses used between 4,000 and 7,000 lbs of batteries in order to sustain the american lifestyle. However, using a 200 hp engine (at a guess) to drive an alternator or two, likely rated at less than 1 hp each seems a less than ideal The Chevy luv uses an isuzu engine rated at 62 HP. If running at idle or maybe 1,400rpm instead of 3,500rpm, it's probably about 15 or 20HP? Backwoodssolar has some guidelines for how much horsepower for certain alternator sizes. I think it's around 5HP for a normal 50 amp 12 volt alternator. arrangement for charging batteries to run an average load (household power) of 1 or 2 kilowatts (with peaks to 15-20 kilowatts possible). The latter figure (peak load) will likely define how big an inverter you will need, and they get pricey fast above 2 kW. Back in the early 90's a 2kW inverter was considered luxury for off grid houses. Nowadays I see a 7.2kW or 8kW set of inverters most often. I get by fine with 1kW. It all depends on how used to the american lifestyle you are and what you can give up. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
Thanks, Darryl and Zeke! Great information. I agree, now, about the automotive batteries. not good for long term use but i may use a few to test things, at first. hate to invest much money till i see how it will work. I AM on the grid, in a densely populated neighborhood. (try to find a neighborhood, in Houston, which is not...) It's a good size home and is larger than we really need. we want to sell soon, so we can get a smaller, more efficient, home. We currently use a lot of power, in the summer. Central air unit can run round the clock during hot months. Not uncommon to have mid 90 to 100+ degree temps with 100% humidity. Sometimes when I go out at night around midnight it is still 80 degrees out, and i start to sweat immediately. We also have an electric range for cooking.. which is not good but we probably won't convert to gas before we sell. My thoughts were to have a backup power supply (batteries) that I can charge whenever i have fuel and then switch over to them either in an emergency or when we don't have to run the air conditioner. would probably do this at night while we sleep. at that time the only power requirements would be minimal lighting, circulating fan/gas heater on the central air unit, refrigerator, gas hot water heater, alarm system, etc... Of course, when power goes out, we will conserve and sweat like pigs.. :) This is why I originally wanted to get the used ~45kw diesel generator. With that baby I could just flip to switch, run the house even with air conditioner, and save the expense of whatever time I spent off the meter. Also, wouldn't have to wire into specific circuits, just put power to the whole thing. Just too far out of our budget, right now. Another benefit of developing the backup system is that it should give the whole family a better idea of what goes into creating the power, so we should all become more conservative. ie.. if i'm making bd to run a generator/alternator then i will involve the whole family. Another reason i want to get into bd is to determine if we want to sell our gasoline vehicles and buy diesels? What I really need to do, first, i guess is to start making the bd. Then some of my concerns will be addressed. Another reason for my interest and involvement in all of this... and this is the biggy... we want to get out of houston, move someplace safer, with a cooler climate and less population. Hopefully my experiments now will help guide us to a wiser purchase decision, later, which will be much more environmentally friendly and we will stop being part of the problem and become part of the solution. thanks, again! -Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Zeke Yewdall Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2006 10:45 AM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator,input appreciated Good info Darryl. A few additions. There is not much gain from using 24 volts vs. 12 volts as the native voltage. Actually, almost all off grid houses use 48 volts nowadays. Cheaper since equipment is usually limited by the amperage it can take, and if you have a 10kW inverter bank, the cable and circuit breaker sizes are just rediculous at 12 volts. The additional weight will affect the performance and fuel economy of your vehicle adversely. One possible positive is if you can place the battery weight near the drive wheels of a vehicle with traction issues (e.g., pickup trucks in snow/ice conditions). In the the recent solar decathlon competition, each of those houses used between 4,000 and 7,000 lbs of batteries in order to sustain the american lifestyle. However, using a 200 hp engine (at a guess) to drive an alternator or two, likely rated at less than 1 hp each seems a less than ideal The Chevy luv uses an isuzu engine rated at 62 HP. If running at idle or maybe 1,400rpm instead of 3,500rpm, it's probably about 15 or 20HP? Backwoodssolar has some guidelines for how much horsepower for certain alternator sizes. I think it's around 5HP for a normal 50 amp 12 volt alternator. arrangement for charging batteries to run an average load (household power) of 1 or 2 kilowatts (with peaks to 15-20 kilowatts possible). The latter figure (peak load) will likely define how big an inverter you will need, and they get pricey fast above 2 kW. Back in the early 90's a 2kW inverter was considered luxury for off grid houses. Nowadays I see a 7.2kW or 8kW set of inverters most often. I get by fine with 1kW. It all depends on how used to the american lifestyle you are and what you can give up. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
Thanks, everyone for responding. It was a great help! After some consideration, we are going to look at smaller system options. I did speak with the man selling the big one and he wants considerably more than the starting bid price. Looks like it is worth it but more than we need. Zeke Yewdall wrote: My personal recommendation would be to do a battery/inverter/DC charger system, using a 10 or 20 HP single cylinder diesel engine coupled to an alternator to DC charge the batteries for two or three hours a day, then operating from the batteries/inverter the rest of the day. can anyone point me to any links/archives that deal with the above mentioned method? thanks, again. -Mark -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Zeke Yewdall Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2006 9:52 AM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator,input appreciated I don't know about that model of Isuzu engine, but their little truck engines are good, so I would tend to think it's a good engine. A direct injection engine isn't quite as good for straight veggie oil, but will run on biodiesel fine. The capacity seems a little high to me. The problem is that most houses have very non-uniform loads -- averaging around 1600 watts and peaking to 10 or 20kW. Diesel engines like being run between 20% and 80% of rated power. If they sit at less than 20% of power too much, they cannot maintain temperature, and it leads to carbon buildup and wetstacking, in which the exhaust condenses in the exhaust manifold and corrodes the valves. There was an offgrid ranger building and visitors center at a park near here which used a 200kW generator to power it. During the nighttime, the load was only about 10kW, and the generators developed serious wetstacking problems after a few years. Many alaskan villages use diesel generators for power, and they generally won't run them below 25% of rated power. In addition the fuel efficiency in kWh/gallon drops off at low power. My personal recommendation would be to do a battery/inverter/DC charger system, using a 10 or 20 HP single cylinder diesel engine coupled to an alternator to DC charge the batteries for two or three hours a day, then operating from the batteries/inverter the rest of the day. This will cost ALOT more than $3,200 if everything is bought new. But I also estimate that this generator would have been $25,000 new. If you can really get it for $3,200, maybe it's okay to accept the poor efficiency and maintenance issues. Z On 1/20/06, Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Input will be greatly appreciated. I have been considering a purchase of a home emergency backup generator with diesel engine. My plan is to learn to make biodiesel and use it to power the generator. There is a supplier of biodiesel, here in Houston, TX, which i can use as a backup source of fuel. Wish I could say the same for ethanol... sigh I have found this generator on ebay, and it is local to me. This is the ebay link with picture: http://cgi.ebay.com/EMERGENCY-HOME-DIESEL-GENERATOR_W0QQitemZ7583505605QQcat egoryZ106437QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem here is the text included: -- Item Specifics - Generators Type: Trailer MountedPower Source: Diesel Make: IsuzuMax Output (KW): 50.1 - 100 Model: MAGNUMCondition: Used YOU ARE BIDDING ON A MAGNUM 50 TRAILER MOUNTED EMERGENCY HOME BACK-UP GENERATOR. IT HAS REMOTE START CAPABILITIES, 98 GALLON TRAILER FUEL CELL, 4 CYLINDER DIRECT INJECTED ISUZU DIESEL ENGINE, HEIGHT 6' 6, WIDTH 4', LENGTH 8'. NO RESERVE. PLEASE CALL IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. 713-206-5163. ASK FOR JOHN. THANKS --- the starting bid price is $3200, which is a little more than i wanted to pay but the capacity looks really good. 50.1 - 100 kw max capacity?? is that possible in a unit this size? 98 gallon tank.. i like that. Anyone know of any problems i may encounter if i run biodiesel in it? Anyone know of any PROS or CONS of this model? Love this mail group. Everyone seems very knowledgeable and eager to help. Keith, i was reading more about the Journey to Forever project last night. I find it to be a very noble endeavor. I wish you all the best and hope it is a smashing success! best wishes Mark Houston, TX ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
I'd check out homepower.com Especially their older articles (they've become much less techy over the years as the target audience has changed). The system I was referring to is essentially the same as for a wind or PV system, but with a biodiesel generator as the prime mover instead. Having the batteries and inverter does increase the cost and complexity, but allows the use of a smaller generator, with much much less run time (and hence the generator will use less fuel and last much longer. Plus much less noise too). For DC generators, check out backwoodssolar.com -- their kit uses a gas engine, but could easily be used with a small diesel engine too. I see the engines on ebay occasionally. Most of the inverters also allow you to use an AC generator to charge the batteries, but it is often more expensive for a diesel AC generator than a DC generator. On 1/24/06, Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Thanks, everyone for responding.It was a great help!After some consideration, we are going to look at smaller system options.I did speak with the man selling the big one and he wants considerably more than the starting bid price.Looks like it is worth it but more than weneed.Zeke Yewdall wrote:My personal recommendation would be to do a battery/inverter/DC chargersystem, using a 10 or 20 HP single cylinder diesel engine coupled to an alternator to DC charge the batteries for two or three hours a day, thenoperating from the batteries/inverter the rest of the day.can anyone point me to any links/archives that deal with the above mentioned method?thanks, again.-Mark-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED][mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Zeke YewdallSent: Saturday, January 21, 2006 9:52 AMTo: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator,input appreciatedI don't know about that model of Isuzu engine, but their little truckengines are good, so I would tend to think it's a good engine.A directinjection engine isn't quite as good forstraight veggie oil, but will run on biodiesel fine.The capacity seems a little high to me.The problem is that most houseshave very non-uniform loads -- averaging around 1600 watts and peaking to 10or 20kW.Diesel engines like being run between 20% and 80% of rated power. If they sit at less than 20% of power too much, they cannot maintaintemperature, and it leads to carbon buildup and wetstacking, in which theexhaust condenses in the exhaust manifold and corrodes the valves.There was an offgrid ranger building and visitors center at a park near here whichused a 200kW generator to power it.During the nighttime, the load was onlyabout 10kW, and the generators developed serious wetstacking problems after a few years.Many alaskan villages use diesel generators for power, andthey generally won't run them below 25% of rated power.In addition thefuel efficiency in kWh/gallon drops off at low power.My personal recommendation would be to do a battery/inverter/DC charger system, using a 10 or 20 HP single cylinder diesel engine coupled to analternator to DC charge the batteries for two or three hours a day, thenoperating from the batteries/inverter the rest of the day.This will cost ALOT more than $3,200 if everything is bought new.But I also estimate thatthis generator would have been $25,000 new.If you can really get it for$3,200, maybe it's okay to accept the poor efficiency and maintenance issues.ZOn 1/20/06, Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Input will be greatly appreciated.I have been considering a purchase of a home emergency backup generator with diesel engine.My plan is to learn to make biodiesel and use it to powerthe generator.There is a supplier of biodiesel, here in Houston, TX, whichi can use as a backup source of fuel.Wish I could say the same for ethanol... sighI have found this generator on ebay, and it is local to me.This is theebay link with picture:http://cgi.ebay.com/EMERGENCY-HOME-DIESEL-GENERATOR_W0QQitemZ7583505605QQcat egoryZ106437QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemhere is the text included:--Item Specifics - Generators Type:Trailer MountedPower Source:DieselMake:IsuzuMax Output (KW):50.1 - 100Model:MAGNUMCondition:UsedYOU ARE BIDDING ON A MAGNUM 50 TRAILER MOUNTED EMERGENCY HOME BACK-UPGENERATOR. IT HAS REMOTE START CAPABILITIES, 98 GALLON TRAILER FUEL CELL, 4 CYLINDER DIRECT INJECTED ISUZU DIESEL ENGINE, HEIGHT 6' 6, WIDTH 4', LENGTH8'. NO RESERVE. PLEASE CALL IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. 713-206-5163. ASK FORJOHN. THANKS ---the starting bid price is $3200, which is a little more than i wanted to paybut the capacity looks really good. 50.1 - 100 kw max capacity??is thatpossible in a unit this size?98 gallon tank.. i like that. Anyone know of any problems i may encounter if i run biodiesel in it?Anyone know of any
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
Mark,I agree that a 50 kVA genset is overkill unless you live in a mansion, BUT you can check with your local utility (Reliant? or Coop?) about Net Metering. Since your meter would run backward, you could 'store' power into the grid when you run it and pull power from the grid when you aren't. Then during outages you could run it and disconnect from the grid, so you don't electrocute anyone! Anyway, the trick is convincing them that biodiesel will qualify as 'renewable,' which will depend somewhat on whether your account rep is a yokel or a semi-educated yokel. ;-) Also, since you are in 'deregulated' Texas, you might be able to sell your 'green' power to one of the power marketers there. Or, you can keep the green power ticket to yourself! Heck, if the power is out for an extended period, run orange cables to you neighbors' refrigerators and make a lot of friends! Since you only get a few cents per kWh that you put back into the grid and you will pay double that for grid power, your goal each month should be to use as close to zero kWh as possible net from the grid, and your power bill will drop to ~$10. Cutting your power bill from $210 a month to $10 would pay for a $5,000 genset in a little over 2 years with no other benefits or fuel costs considered. Just running it when you are making biodiesel could provide both the heat and power for the process.Nationwide Net Metering is required in the Energy Act of 2005, but local utilities have 3 years to implement programs, so I'm waiting to see how it pans out in South Carolina. Here is an excerpt from http://www.lses.org/netmetering.htmTexas' Net Metering Order : Net metering is ordered by the Public Utility Commission of Texas under Substantive Rules, Section 23.66(f)(4), which became effective in 1986. The order requires utilities to offer a net metering option to QFs of 50 kW or less, using renewable energy resources. Utilities will install a single meter for such customers and allow the meter to turn backward to register the net energy consumption or production by the customers. Net consumption is billed at the applicable tariff and excess generation by the customers during a billing cycle is purchased by utilities at the avoided cost (fuel cost only, no capacity component). Texas initiated the net metering program 10 years ago to promote small wind power and PV markets in the state. There is no statewide limit on the number of customers or total capacity under the net metering program. There are approximately 25 small wind generators currently under the net metering program.More from http://www.gulfcoastchp.org/State/TXand more from DSIRE: http://www.dsireusa.org/library/includes/incentive2.cfm?Incentive_Code=TX02Rstate=TXCurrentPageID=1PUCT Rules:http://www.puc.state.tx.us/rules/subrules/electric/25.242/25.242ei.cfm And lastly:http://www.awea.org/smallwind/texas.htmlOn 1/21/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark, in Houston. 50 to 100 kw is alot more than you would need for theaverage home generator . 4 to 10 would be more realistic.JerryNorthern Wi.On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:39:42 -0600 Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have been considering a purchase of a home emergency backup generator with diesel engine. here is the text included: -- Thanks,PCHe's the kind of a guy who lights up a room just by flicking a switchA little nonsense now and then, is cherished by the wisest men. - Roald Dahl ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
Another issue with net metering will be interconnection standards. Generally if you are connecting a rotating generator to the grid, you will need a level of protective relaying that will be prohibitive for the scale you are talking about -- like $25k or $100k. Using a grid connected inverter will probably be the only way to do it, as those do the utility isolation electronically instead. One reason that utilities have been so resistant to people installing grid connected PV is that they think they are like small generators, which have apparently killed linemen trying to repair downed powerlines in the past. A possible option would be to get a induction generator instead of a synchronous generator, but they are hard to find since they are not self exciting, so therefore aren't useful if the grid goes down. Old wind turbines from the 40's (and even alot from the 80's I think) used them. On 1/24/06, Paul S Cantrell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark,I agree that a 50 kVA genset is overkill unless you live in a mansion, BUT you can check with your local utility (Reliant? or Coop?) about Net Metering. Since your meter would run backward, you could 'store' power into the grid when you run it and pull power from the grid when you aren't. Then during outages you could run it and disconnect from the grid, so you don't electrocute anyone! Anyway, the trick is convincing them that biodiesel will qualify as 'renewable,' which will depend somewhat on whether your account rep is a yokel or a semi-educated yokel. ;-) Also, since you are in 'deregulated' Texas, you might be able to sell your 'green' power to one of the power marketers there. Or, you can keep the green power ticket to yourself! Heck, if the power is out for an extended period, run orange cables to you neighbors' refrigerators and make a lot of friends! Since you only get a few cents per kWh that you put back into the grid and you will pay double that for grid power, your goal each month should be to use as close to zero kWh as possible net from the grid, and your power bill will drop to ~$10. Cutting your power bill from $210 a month to $10 would pay for a $5,000 genset in a little over 2 years with no other benefits or fuel costs considered. Just running it when you are making biodiesel could provide both the heat and power for the process.Nationwide Net Metering is required in the Energy Act of 2005, but local utilities have 3 years to implement programs, so I'm waiting to see how it pans out in South Carolina. Here is an excerpt from http://www.lses.org/netmetering.htm Texas' Net Metering Order : Net metering is ordered by the Public Utility Commission of Texas under Substantive Rules, Section 23.66(f)(4), which became effective in 1986. The order requires utilities to offer a net metering option to QFs of 50 kW or less, using renewable energy resources. Utilities will install a single meter for such customers and allow the meter to turn backward to register the net energy consumption or production by the customers. Net consumption is billed at the applicable tariff and excess generation by the customers during a billing cycle is purchased by utilities at the avoided cost (fuel cost only, no capacity component). Texas initiated the net metering program 10 years ago to promote small wind power and PV markets in the state. There is no statewide limit on the number of customers or total capacity under the net metering program. There are approximately 25 small wind generators currently under the net metering program.More from http://www.gulfcoastchp.org/State/TX and more from DSIRE: http://www.dsireusa.org/library/includes/incentive2.cfm?Incentive_Code=TX02Rstate=TXCurrentPageID=1PUCT Rules: http://www.puc.state.tx.us/rules/subrules/electric/25.242/25.242ei.cfm And lastly:http://www.awea.org/smallwind/texas.html On 1/21/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mark, in Houston. 50 to 100 kw is alot more than you would need for theaverage home generator . 4 to 10 would be more realistic.JerryNorthern Wi.On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:39:42 -0600 Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have been considering a purchase of a home emergency backup generator with diesel engine. here is the text included: -- Thanks,PCHe's the kind of a guy who lights up a room just by flicking a switchA little nonsense now and then, is cherished by the wisest men. - Roald Dahl ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
I built a similar one (gas not diesel). Picture: http://www.mullan.ca/images/gen_2a.jpg There is now a 1800W inverter bolted to the right side (not shown). The battery is not the sole storage device. I clamp on my battery pack deep cycles to this battery to charge them up and/or to support a heavier draw on the large inverter. Picture: http://www.mullan.ca/images/batt_out_small.jpg Comes with it's own connected inverters. This currently works for my needs, expanding as I can. John On 1/24/2006, Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd check out homepower.com Especially their older articles (they've become much less techy over the years as the target audience has changed). For DC generators, check out backwoodssolar.com -- their kit uses a gas engine, but could easily be used with a small diesel engine too. I see the engines on ebay occasionally. Most of the inverters also allow you to use an AC generator to charge the batteries, but it is often more expensive for a diesel AC generator than a DC generator. On 1/24/06, Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After some consideration, we are going to look at smaller system options. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
My friend picked up a Listeroid lister (Indian made lister) 12hp and a 7.5kw generator. It cost him less than 2 grand new. It is great for a few reasons; it has a 24/7 duty cycle, it runs at 600 rpm (muffled properly it is quiet), it runs on veggie oil, and it looks cool. James Demer On 1/24/06, John Mullan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I built a similar one (gas not diesel). Picture: http://www.mullan.ca/images/gen_2a.jpg There is now a 1800W inverter bolted to the right side (not shown). The battery is not the sole storage device. I clamp on my battery pack deep cycles to this battery to charge them up and/or to support a heavier draw on the large inverter. Picture: http://www.mullan.ca/images/batt_out_small.jpg Comes with it's own connected inverters. This currently works for my needs, expanding as I can. John On 1/24/2006, Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd check out homepower.com Especially their older articles (they've become much less techy over the years as the target audience has changed). For DC generators, check out backwoodssolar.com -- their kit uses a gas engine, but could easily be used with a small diesel engine too. I see the engines on ebay occasionally. Most of the inverters also allow you to use an AC generator to charge the batteries, but it is often more expensive for a diesel AC generator than a DC generator. On 1/24/06, Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After some consideration, we are going to look at smaller system options. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
Paul S Cantrell wrote: Mark, I agree that a 50 kVA genset is overkill unless you live in a mansion, BUT you can check with your local utility (Reliant? or Coop?) about Net Metering. Since your meter would run backward, you could 'store' power into the grid when you run it and pull power from the grid when you aren't. Then during outages you could run it and disconnect from the grid, so you don't electrocute anyone! Anyway, the trick is convincing them that biodiesel will qualify as 'renewable,' which will depend somewhat on whether your account rep is a yokel or a semi-educated yokel. ;-) Is it as simple as this? My understanding is that you can't take your normal genset and connect it to the grid - getting it in phase and keeping it synced is a problem. You CAN just use a standard AC motor and overdrive it - if you turn it a little faster than its designed to run it produces electricity rather than consumes it, and it stays sync'd because the grid is providing the excitation. But that leaves you with a motor to feed the grid and a generator to power the house. Anybody know for sure? --- David ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
I have thought about a Lister type and hope to get one in the future. I love their specs AND they can be fitted to provide heat as well as power. John -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of james demer Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2006 7:03 PM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator,input appreciated My friend picked up a Listeroid lister (Indian made lister) 12hp and a 7.5kw generator. It cost him less than 2 grand new. It is great for a few reasons; it has a 24/7 duty cycle, it runs at 600 rpm (muffled properly it is quiet), it runs on veggie oil, and it looks cool. James Demer On 1/24/06, John Mullan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I built a similar one (gas not diesel). Picture: http://www.mullan.ca/images/gen_2a.jpg There is now a 1800W inverter bolted to the right side (not shown). The battery is not the sole storage device. I clamp on my battery pack deep cycles to this battery to charge them up and/or to support a heavier draw on the large inverter. Picture: http://www.mullan.ca/images/batt_out_small.jpg Comes with it's own connected inverters. This currently works for my needs, expanding as I can. John On 1/24/2006, Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'd check out homepower.com Especially their older articles (they've become much less techy over the years as the target audience has changed). For DC generators, check out backwoodssolar.com -- their kit uses a gas engine, but could easily be used with a small diesel engine too. I see the engines on ebay occasionally. Most of the inverters also allow you to use an AC generator to charge the batteries, but it is often more expensive for a diesel AC generator than a DC generator. On 1/24/06, Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After some consideration, we are going to look at smaller system options. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
You are right David. Induction generators are essentially the same as AC induction motors.On 1/24/06, David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Paul S Cantrell wrote: Mark, I agree that a 50 kVA genset is overkill unless you live in a mansion, BUT you can check with your local utility (Reliant? or Coop?) about Net Metering.Since your meter would run backward, you could 'store' power into the grid when you run it and pull power from the grid when you aren't.Then during outages you could run it and disconnect from the grid, so you don't electrocute anyone!Anyway, the trick is convincing them that biodiesel will qualify as 'renewable,' which will depend somewhat on whether your account rep is a yokel or a semi-educated yokel.;-)Is it as simple as this?My understanding is that you can't take yournormal genset and connect it to the grid - getting it in phase and keeping it synced is a problem.You CAN just use a standard AC motor and overdrive it - if you turn ita little faster than its designed to run it produces electricity ratherthan consumes it, and it stays sync'd because the grid is providing the excitation.But that leaves you with a motor to feed the grid and agenerator to power the house.Anybody know for sure?--- David___Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
I don't know about that model of Isuzu engine, but their little truck engines are good, so I would tend to think it's a good engine. A direct injection engine isn't quite as good for straight veggie oil, but will run on biodiesel fine. The capacity seems a little high to me. The problem is that most houses have very non-uniform loads -- averaging around 1600 watts and peaking to 10 or 20kW. Diesel engines like being run between 20% and 80% of rated power. If they sit at less than 20% of power too much, they cannot maintain temperature, and it leads to carbon buildup and wetstacking, in which the exhaust condenses in the exhaust manifold and corrodes the valves. There was an offgrid ranger building and visitors center at a park near here which used a 200kW generator to power it. During the nighttime, the load was only about 10kW, and the generators developed serious wetstacking problems after a few years. Many alaskan villages use diesel generators for power, and they generally won't run them below 25% of rated power. In addition the fuel efficiency in kWh/gallon drops off at low power. My personal recommendation would be to do a battery/inverter/DC charger system, using a 10 or 20 HP single cylinder diesel engine coupled to an alternator to DC charge the batteries for two or three hours a day, then operating from the batteries/inverter the rest of the day. This will cost ALOT more than $3,200 if everything is bought new. But I also estimate that this generator would have been $25,000 new. If you can really get it for $3,200, maybe it's okay to accept the poor efficiency and maintenance issues. ZOn 1/20/06, Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Input will be greatly appreciated.I have been considering a purchase of a home emergency backup generator withdiesel engine.My plan is to learn to make biodiesel and use it to powerthe generator.There is a supplier of biodiesel, here in Houston, TX, which i can use as a backup source of fuel.Wish I could say the same forethanol... sighI have found this generator on ebay, and it is local to me.This is theebay link with picture: http://cgi.ebay.com/EMERGENCY-HOME-DIESEL-GENERATOR_W0QQitemZ7583505605QQcategoryZ106437QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemhere is the text included: --Item Specifics - Generators Type:Trailer MountedPower Source:Diesel Make:IsuzuMax Output (KW):50.1 - 100 Model:MAGNUMCondition:UsedYOU ARE BIDDING ON A MAGNUM 50 TRAILER MOUNTED EMERGENCY HOME BACK-UP GENERATOR. IT HAS REMOTE START CAPABILITIES, 98 GALLON TRAILER FUEL CELL, 4CYLINDER DIRECT INJECTED ISUZU DIESEL ENGINE, HEIGHT 6' 6, WIDTH 4', LENGTH8'. NO RESERVE. PLEASE CALL IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. 713-206-5163. ASK FOR JOHN. THANKS---the starting bid price is $3200, which is a little more than i wanted to paybut the capacity looks really good. 50.1 - 100 kw max capacity??is thatpossible in a unit this size?98 gallon tank.. i like that.Anyone know of any problems i may encounter if i run biodiesel in it?Anyone know of any PROS or CONS of this model? Love this mail group.Everyone seems very knowledgeable and eager to help.Keith, i was reading more about the Journey to Forever project last night.I find it to be a very noble endeavor.I wish you all the best and hope it is a smashing success!best wishesMarkHouston, TX___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
Surfing on the net it is possible to find small residential diesel generators, rated 5.5kW for continuous operationfor $3.000 or less (new). So maybe that's a good option to look at. Cheers! Diego On 1/21/06, Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Input will be greatly appreciated.I have been considering a purchase of a home emergency backup generator with diesel engine.My plan is to learn to make biodiesel and use it to powerthe generator.There is a supplier of biodiesel, here in Houston, TX, whichi can use as a backup source of fuel.Wish I could say the same for ethanol... sighI have found this generator on ebay, and it is local to me.This is theebay link with picture:http://cgi.ebay.com/EMERGENCY-HOME-DIESEL-GENERATOR_W0QQitemZ7583505605QQcat egoryZ106437QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemhere is the text included:--Item Specifics - Generators Type:Trailer MountedPower Source:DieselMake:IsuzuMax Output (KW):50.1 - 100Model:MAGNUMCondition:UsedYOU ARE BIDDING ON A MAGNUM 50 TRAILER MOUNTED EMERGENCY HOME BACK-UPGENERATOR. IT HAS REMOTE START CAPABILITIES, 98 GALLON TRAILER FUEL CELL, 4 CYLINDER DIRECT INJECTED ISUZU DIESEL ENGINE, HEIGHT 6' 6, WIDTH 4', LENGTH8'. NO RESERVE. PLEASE CALL IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. 713-206-5163. ASK FORJOHN. THANKS ---the starting bid price is $3200, which is a little more than i wanted to paybut the capacity looks really good.50.1 - 100 kw max capacity??is thatpossible in a unit this size?98 gallon tank.. i like that. Anyone know of any problems i may encounter if i run biodiesel in it?Anyone know of any PROS or CONS of this model?Love this mail group.Everyone seems very knowledgeable and eager to help. Keith, i was reading more about the Journey to Forever project last night.I find it to be a very noble endeavor.I wish you all the best and hope itis a smashing success!best wishesMarkHouston, TX ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] considering a purchase of a diesel home generator, input appreciated
Mark, in Houston. 50 to 100 kw is alot more than you would need for the average home generator . 4 to 10 would be more realistic. Jerry Northern Wi. On Sat, 21 Jan 2006 00:39:42 -0600 Mark Kennedy [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have been considering a purchase of a home emergency backup generator with diesel engine. here is the text included: - --- -- Item Specifics - Generators Type: Trailer MountedPower Source: Diesel Make: IsuzuMax Output (KW): 50.1 - 100 Model: MAGNUMCondition: Used ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
