Re: [Biofuel] The End of 'Easy Oil'

[Keith Addison]

Hello Lewis

Lewis, please send your messages/replies straight to the list address 
at , there's no need to send them to me 
offlist as well, and I suppose to other list members when they reply 
to you. Thankyou.

>   to  Biofuels List   from  Lewis L Smith
>
>Thanks again to Keith for leads.
>
>I benefit from a stream of current information from a variety of 
>sources and occasionally download stuff for future reference, so 
>don't have to search the archives as much as someone coming fresh 
>upon a subject.

:-)

On the other hand, I keep having to point you at the archives, don't 
I? I don't have the time for that, please do it yourself. Otherwise 
you keep telling us stuff we've already dealt with before. Then the 
list becomes like a man with no memory - stupid, in effect, which 
it's not.

Actually the List rules require you to use the archives, for that reason.

The List rules are here:
http://snipurl.com/1pr2p
[Biofuel] List rules

Please read what it says there about using the list resources.

Because you don't/won't use the archives your posts do indeed look 
like someone coming fresh upon the subject.

Offlist comment from a list member: "Your list contains some of the 
best information I have found on the Internet. The archives are great 
and that is where I spend most of my time acquiring knowledge. This 
information I believe vitally important NOW and am very happy it is 
here. Our future may just depend upon it. Now that is important."

Do you think you know better? You've been demonstrating that you 
don't know better.

Once again, please use the list archives!

>The first of Keith's references sent me a message to the effect that 
>it couldn't be found, but the second one "panned out".

Both the links go to the same place. The first link broke in 
transmission, as often happens with long urls when they're emailed:

>http://www.mail-archive.com/search?q=%22Matthew+Simmons%22&l=sustainab
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>"Matthew Simmons"
>38 matches
>
>If that link breaks try this one:
>http://snipurl.com/1pz4i

So it wasn't that it "couldn't be found", it's that you didn't know 
how to rejoin broken links, which is why I included the snipurl link.

>The first item was a 2004 talk by Simmons in which he mentions the 
>217 conference reports, reading between their lines and his doubts 
>about Saudi reserves, among other items of interest.

There were 37 other items beyond the first one.

>Again I insist that the slope of the world's average decline curve 
>is more important than the particular year in which crude-oil 
>production peaks and that the shape of this slope could have serious 
>consequences for the World.  Since the decline will probably start 
>no later than the year after the year of the peak, the date of the 
>peak is not, to my way of thinking at least, a "moot point".

I didn't say the date of the peak is a moot point, I said the whole 
Peak Oil issue is a moot point, and I said why.

It's not much use disagreeing that it's a moot point while ignoring 
the reasons I said it's a moot point, and cutting the previous post 
so nobody knows who said what.

I'll reinstate the previous post below. I don't think you really 
responded to it.

Similarly, in your previous post you said Michael Klare "makes some 
errors of fact and interpretation" in his article, but you didn't 
establish that, and deleting the article from your response meant 
anyone who wanted to check it was confronted with the unnecessary 
extra task of finding the previous message to compare the two.

They should just take your word for it? That's not how things work 
here, nor anywhere else where facts take precedence over 
personalities. If you say someone is wrong, quote what they said that 
you think is wrong and then explain why it's wrong, preferably with 
references.

>In fact, it would be very helpful to be able to anticipate the year 
>of the peak, although I doubt that we can do so unless the producing 
>countries give up their secrets.

Why would it be helpful, when it's certain that by that time using 
the oil, no matter how much or how little of it there might be, will 
be a prohibitive matter because of the overriding global warming 
issues of releasing fossil-fuel greenhouse gas emissions in an 
already overheated world? What would be helpful then would be great 
advances already made in fuel-use efficiency and in the local supply 
of renewables. How would anticipating the year of the peak help that?

Best

Keith


>Cordially. ###


Previous:

>Hello Lewis
>
>We've had a lot about Matt Simmons in the past, I think most of his
>work's been aired here. Somebody said he sounded just like a Biofuel
>list member! Indeed he did. He even got the Food Miles bit right.
>
>You really should spend more time checking the archives!
>
>Offlist message from list member: "Your list contains some of the
>best information I have found on the Internet. The archives are great
>and that is where I spend most of 

Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor

[John Ferree]

For a veggie farm. . . .
http://www.flyingbeet.com/electricg/
john

Doug Younker wrote:
> Perhaps I'm reading the article too critically. Diesel tractors do not 
> need the PTO to operate cultivation and seeding implements, that I'm 
> aware of, so it would stand to reason an electric tractor wouldn't 
> either. Desi el or electric a PTO will required to operate some crop 
> harvesting implements.  Yes in the past their operation was powered by 
> the wheels of horse pulled ancestors. I would have to think their 
> wouldn't be enough time in a 24 hour day for a modern versions of the to 
> do the amount of work powered equipment in a much shorter, but still 
> plenty long,work day.  The AC and they hydraulics will need power, 
> perhaps the hydraulics will provide enough heat for the cab during the 
> winter.  Certaintly they will be quieter, but hear the chirping birds 
> quit, may be a stretch  I'm sure electric tractors will have to be a 
> part of the solution, so it will be interesting to see how they take 
> shape and if over the road electric tractors will be developed alongside 
> them.
> Doug, N0LKK
> Kansas USA inc.
>
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>
>
>   


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Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor

[Tom Irwin]

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[Biofuel] Who's Really Paying High Prices for Your Pharmaceuticals

[Kirk McLoren]

 ever on the system. Meteorologist Dr. S. 
Jeevananda Reddy -- a former chief technical advisor to the United Nations and 
now a campaigner for tougher policies on pollution in the Patancheru area -- 
told me that the sheer quantity of drugs that plants are producing means that 
they pump out far more waste water than the treatment plant can handle.
  The state permits each company to dispose of only a certain amount of water 
per day, and if its chemical concentration is too high, the company is fined. 
But, said Dr. Reddy, "The fines are peanuts to them." And, of course, the 
effluent is not even tested for presence of pharmaceuticals. The bulk-drug 
plants are often producing at two, three, sometimes ten times the permitted 
capacity.
  Reddy has watched as tanker trucks full of effluent from drug factories are 
turned away by the water treatment plant because their company's daily quota 
has been exceeded. He says that rather than returning to the factory, the 
trucks will often head out into the countryside to dump their load. Those 
wastes would contain, if anything, higher concentrations of pharmaceuticals 
than seen in the Swedish study.
  So when we're raising the alarm over hazardous toys, food and drugs imported 
from China, India or other countries, it's important to remember that it's our 
own insatiable demand for those cheap products that pushes manufacturers into 
using slapdash practices -- and that it's people living and working downstream 
or downwind from the foreign factories who could well be paying the highest 
price of all.
Readers Write: Can Moore's SiCKO Make Health Care Reform Happen?
AlterNet Staff 
  Tax-Financed Health Care: More Bang for the Buck
Johnathon Ross 
  The Health of Nations
Ezra Klein 
  John Edwards Steps into Big Shoes in Crusade Against Poverty
Bill Boyarsky 
  The Stone Age Diet: Why I Eat Like a Caveman
Jimmy Lee Shreeve 

  More stories by Stan Cox 
  




   
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Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor

[Randy]

A set up similar to what diesel railroad locomotives and large earth moving
dump trucks should work well in an AG setting.   They use A diesel engine to
turn a generator and large electric drive axles to provide locomotion.  A
PTO shaft will work just fine if powered by a hydraulic motor powered by
another electric motor operated pump.  Hydraulic motors are already used
routinely to operate grain augers and other remote power applications where
direct shaft PTO's are not convenient or where two implements need to be
powered by the same power unit.

The newest USN and Recreational Cruise ships are being constructed with
electric motors instead of direct propeller shafts. They are also using
revolving "PODS" to eliminate the need for a large underwater rudder system.

Eliminating the heavy direct drive systems also removes unnecessary weight
that will increase cargo capacity of the vehicles.


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[Biofuel] Smashing Capitalism

[Mike Weaver]

Smashing Capitalism

Barbara Ehrenreich
August 20, 2007

Somewhere in the Hamptons a high-roller is cursing his cleaning lady and
shaking his fists at the lawn guys. The American poor, who are usually
tactful enough to remain invisible to the multi-millionaire class, suddenly
leaped onto the scene and started smashing the global financial system.
Incredibly enough, this may be the first case in history in which the
downtrodden manage to bring down an unfair economic system without going to
the trouble of a revolution.

First they stopped paying their mortgages, a move in which they were joined
by many financially stretched middle class folks, though the poor definitely
led the way. All right, these were trick mortgages, many of them designed to
be unaffordable within two years of signing the contract. There were "NINJA"
loans, for example, awarded to people with "no income, no job or assets."
Conservative columnist Niall Fergusen laments the low levels of "economic
literacy" that allowed people to be exploited by sub-prime loans. Why didn't
these low-income folks get lawyers to go over the fine print? And don't they
have personal financial advisors anyway?

Then, in a diabolically clever move, the poor - a category which now roughly
coincides with the working class - stopped shopping. Both Wal-Mart and Home
Depot announced disappointing second quarter performances, plunging the
market into another Arctic-style meltdown. H. Lee Scott, CEO of the
low-wage Wal-Mart empire, admitted with admirable sensitivity, that "it's no
secret that many customers are running out of money at the end of the
month."

I wish I could report that the current attack on capitalism represents a
deliberate strategy on the part of the poor, that there have been secret
meetings in break rooms and parking lots around the country, where cell
leaders issued instructions like, "You, Vinny - don't make any mortgage
payment this month. And Caroline, forget that back-to-school shopping, OK?"
But all the evidence suggests that the current crisis is something the
high-rollers brought down on themselves.

When, for example, the largest private employer in America, which is
Wal-Mart, starts experiencing a shortage of customers, it needs to take a
long, hard look in the mirror. About a century ago, Henry Ford realized that
his company would only prosper if his own workers earned enough to buy
Fords. Wal-Mart, on the other hand, never seemed to figure out that its
cruelly low wages would eventually curtail its own growth, even at the
company's famously discounted prices.

The sad truth is that people earning Wal-Mart-level wages tend to favor the
fashions available at the Salvation Army. Nor do they have much use for
Wal-Mart's other departments, such as Electronics, Lawn and Garden, and
Pharmacy.

It gets worse though. While with one hand the high-rollers, H. Lee Scott
among them, squeezed the American worker's wages, the other hand was
reaching out with the tempting offer of credit. In fact, easy credit became
the American substitute for decent wages. Once you worked for your money,
but now you were supposed to pay for it. Once you could count on earning
enough to save for a home. Now you'll never earn that much, but, as the
lenders were saying - heh, heh-do we have a mortgage for you!

Pay day loans, rent-to-buy furniture and exorbitant credit card interest
rates for the poor were just the beginning. In its May 21st cover story on
"The Poverty Business," Business Week documented the stampede, in the just
the last few years, to lend money to the people who could least afford to
pay the interest: Buy your dream home! Refinance your house! Take on a car
loan even if your credit rating sucks! Financiamos a Todos! Somehow, no one
bothered to figure out where the poor were going to get the money to pay for
all the money they were being offered.

Personally, I prefer my revolutions to be a little more pro-active. There
should be marches and rallies, banners and sit-ins, possibly a nice color
theme like red or orange. Certainly, there should be a vision of what you
intend to replace the bad old system with-European-style social democracy,
Latin American-style socialism, or how about just American capitalism with
some regulation thrown in?

Global capitalism will survive the current credit crisis; already, the
government has rushed in to soothe the feverish markets. But in the long
term, a system that depends on extracting every last cent from the poor
cannot hope for a healthy prognosis. Who would have thought that
foreclosures in Stockton and Cleveland would roil the markets of London and
Shanghai? The poor have risen up and spoken; only it sounds less like a
shout of protest than a low, strangled, cry of pain.

http://ehrenreich.blogs.com/barbaras_blog/2007/08/smashing-capita.html 


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Re: [Biofuel] Smashing Capitalism

[MMBTUPR]

  to Biofuel List  from   Lewis L Smith

I am old enough to remember with affection the pre-WW II Sears catalogue. M 
Weaver is right. Mr. Ford and Mr. Sears had it very clear in their heads that 
mass prosperity, mass production and mass distribution constitute a 
three-legged stool. You can have a healthy economy or an upright stool without 
all three 
legs.

Cordially.   ###


**
 Get a sneak peek of 
the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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[Biofuel] Could Acetone improve mileage

[khamhiane inthava]

Dear members,
   
  I came acrosse several website that claim that Acetone could improve 
significantly mileage. Any one please kindly give comments about this?
   
  Thank you 
   
  Sincerely,
   
  Khamhiane

   
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Re: [Biofuel] Could Acetone improve mileage

[Keith Addison]

Hello Khamhiane

>Dear members,
>
>I came acrosse several website that claim that Acetone could improve 
>significantly mileage. Any one please kindly give comments about 
>this?

And here's a website that will give you some answers:

http://snipurl.com/1q0zx
biofuel
Acetone
182 matches

(Sigh...)

Best

Keith


>Thank you
>
>Sincerely,
>
>Khamhiane


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