Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 3:38 PM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 2 June 2010 14:37, Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com wrote: Is this a characteristic of the feature (that should be tagged), or of the residents (that shouldn't be tagged)? I'd say both... In that case, I'd tag specifically what you mean. For the example given, Some of the residents stay there all the time, some come for visits, use: residents:permanent=yes + residents:temporary=yes. Simple. No need to worry about whether or not this should be called an orphanage or not. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
On Wed, 2 Jun 2010, John Smith wrote: You'd use the length of stay, temporary or permanent to differentiate between them, although some could have facilities to handle both? no we have homes for children who are physically handicapped and live permanently in these facilities, about 5 or 6 kids per house. many of them will have a bed taken on a rotating basis by other kids who normally live at home but have time in the Group Home when parents need a break. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
2010/5/28 Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com: Right idea, but from my perspective landuse=* shouldn't be used to describe an individual feature (like an orphanage), but to describe the use of an area of land. If you want to do tiered tags like this you'd use something more like amenity=residential_home + residential_home=orphanage. I.e. an orphanage is a type of residential_home is a type of amenity. NOT a childrens_home is a type of residential is a type of landuse. +1, definitely. It's very consistent. Anyway, I moved orphanage proposal to 'rejected' status, We can continue discussion at 'residential_home' proposal (http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Residential_home). RFC is open since 2009 but there are still things we need to solve: * name: 'residential_home' or 'assisted_living' (maybe sth. else)? * sub-tagging: 'residents' or main tag value (residential_home=*/assisted_living=*) * sub-tags value 'children'/'seniors'/etc. or 'orphanage'/'nursing home'/etc. (hospice maybe?) ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
On 2 June 2010 11:48, Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com wrote: amenity=assisted_living, because (if?) in all cases you are describing a place where people *live* with *assistance*. I like assisted_living as well. Be aware, though, that it is starting to be used as a marketing term for those places which are not nursing homes, but rather a collection of small houses or apartments, which supply gardening services, maybe a central hall, canteen/restaurant etc, and usually with a minimum age limit. We would have to make sure we cover them as well if we use this term, or we're just going to create confusion. amenity=assisted_living + assisted_living=orphanage, OR amenity=assisted_living + residents=children. Hmm - not all homes for children are for orphans. There is a home near me that is for children/youth with very heavy caring needs, that cannot be handled by their families. Some of the residents stay there all the time, some come for visits when their carers are unavailable (ill, away, or just need a break). If you want to differentiate between one of these and an orphanage, residents=children won't do it. I don't know if we do need to tell the difference, however. Stephen ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
On 2 June 2010 12:21, Stephen Hope slh...@gmail.com wrote: Hmm - not all homes for children are for orphans. There is a home near me that is for children/youth with very heavy caring needs, that cannot be handled by their families. Some of the residents stay there all the time, some come for visits when their carers are unavailable (ill, away, or just need a break). If you want to differentiate between one of these and an orphanage, residents=children won't do it. I don't know if we do need to tell the difference, however. You'd use the length of stay, temporary or permanent to differentiate between them, although some could have facilities to handle both? ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 12:21 PM, Stephen Hope slh...@gmail.com wrote: amenity=assisted_living + assisted_living=orphanage, OR amenity=assisted_living + residents=children. Hmm - not all homes for children are for orphans. There is a home near me that is for children/youth with very heavy caring needs, that cannot be handled by their families. residents:caring_needs=heavy residents:can_be_handled_by_their_families=no Obviously this is tongue-in-cheek, but I hope you see my point. Some of the residents stay there all the time, some come for visits when their carers are unavailable (ill, away, or just need a break). Is this a characteristic of the feature (that should be tagged), or of the residents (that shouldn't be tagged)? ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
On 2 June 2010 14:37, Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com wrote: Is this a characteristic of the feature (that should be tagged), or of the residents (that shouldn't be tagged)? I'd say both... ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
2010/5/27 y...@o2.pl y...@o2.pl: I moved old orphanage draft to RFC, feel free to comment. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Orphanage Can we use some other key instead of yet another amenity=*? In fact there is so many amenities we should perhaps think about splitting them off into other categories... ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
2010/5/27 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: Can we use some other key instead of yet another amenity=*? In fact there is so many amenities we should perhaps think about splitting them off into other categories... Sounds like a good idea. There is also another proposal: residental home (http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Residential_home) with tagging amenity=residential_home + residents=childen/veterans/disabled/etc. Maybe we should merge these proposals. Regards, Paweł Marynowski User:Yarl ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
I agree with Pawel. I'd prefer 'residential home' with residents=children I think use of the word Orphanage has nearly disapeared in the UK because the word means children have permanently lost their parents, but many of children in 'children's homes' may only be there for a short period while their parents sort out some problems. In the UK we use the term 'Childrens Home', but I think using the 'residential home' 'residents=children' is a better way forward. Regards, Jason 2010/5/27 y...@o2.pl y...@o2.pl 2010/5/27 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: Can we use some other key instead of yet another amenity=*? In fact there is so many amenities we should perhaps think about splitting them off into other categories... Sounds like a good idea. There is also another proposal: residental home (http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Residential_home) with tagging amenity=residential_home + residents=childen/veterans/disabled/etc. Maybe we should merge these proposals. Regards, Paweł Marynowski User:Yarl ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
2010/5/27 y...@o2.pl y...@o2.pl 2010/5/27 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: In fact there is so many amenities we should perhaps think about splitting them off into other categories... Sounds like a good idea. No. The amount of values should not influence the key. The question is more to know if we can consider 'orphanage' as an 'amenity' like schools, hospitals, nusing homes, etc. I think it's correct here. Pieren ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
On 28 May 2010 01:10, Pieren pier...@gmail.com wrote: 2010/5/27 y...@o2.pl y...@o2.pl 2010/5/27 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: In fact there is so many amenities we should perhaps think about splitting them off into other categories... Sounds like a good idea. No. The amount of values should not influence the key. The question is more to know if we can consider 'orphanage' as an 'amenity' like schools, hospitals, nusing homes, etc. I think it's correct here. And that's my point, amenity is used too widely, why can't we come up with their own category, like public_services=hospital|school|nursing_home etc etc etc To me a hospital isn't an amenity, a public toilet is an amenity. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
2010/5/27 y...@o2.pl y...@o2.pl: Sounds like a good idea. There is also another proposal: residental home (http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Residential_home) with tagging amenity=residential_home + residents=childen/veterans/disabled/etc. Maybe we should merge these proposals. How about: landuse=residential residential=childrens_home The benefit of two-tiered tags like this is renderers (and other tools) only need to support landuse=residential to get something that's approximately right. Steve ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Orphanage
On Fri, May 28, 2010 at 3:14 PM, Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com wrote: How about: landuse=residential residential=childrens_home The benefit of two-tiered tags like this is renderers (and other tools) only need to support landuse=residential to get something that's approximately right. Right idea, but from my perspective landuse=* shouldn't be used to describe an individual feature (like an orphanage), but to describe the use of an area of land. If you want to do tiered tags like this you'd use something more like amenity=residential_home + residential_home=orphanage. I.e. an orphanage is a type of residential_home is a type of amenity. NOT a childrens_home is a type of residential is a type of landuse. ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
