Re: [OSM-talk] Help to import Rio de Janeiro city data to OSM - misaligned shapefiles

[John Smith]

On 16 May 2010 13:06, Arlindo Pereira  wrote:
> the editor but I can't do anything because the program freezes). How
> can I split it in smaller files for an easier edition?

osmosis

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Re: [OSM-talk] Help to import Rio de Janeiro city data to OSM - misaligned shapefiles

[Arlindo Pereira]

That worked out perfectly, thanks!

http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/6952/capturadetela1.png

Iván, si puedo ir a SotM otra vez, beberemos una cerveza juntos. :)

Now, moving on to the second question: the largest shapefile
(Quadras.shp, with the streets and the blocks) has 68 MB, and after
conversion (and two hours later) it becomes a huge 416 MB .osm file,
and I can't open it with JOSM (ok, after half an hour it loads up on
the editor but I can't do anything because the program freezes). How
can I split it in smaller files for an easier edition?

Thanks again,
Arlindo

2010/5/14 Iván Sánchez Ortega 
>
> El 14/05/2010 12:06, Jukka Rahkonen escribió:
> > Try with +proj=utm +zone=23 +south +ellps=GRS67+towgs84=-66.87,4.37,-38.52
> > Somebody in the internet has used it before
> > http://www.mundogeo.com.br/forum_mensagem.php?topico=1105
>
> And the way to use it in ogr2osm should be something like:
>
> python ogr2osm -p "+proj=utm +zone=23 +south +ellps=GRS67
> +towgs84=-66.87,4.37,-38.52" ciclovias.shp
>
> That will override the projection information contained in the
> shapefile's .prj file.
>
> --
> Iván Sánchez Ortega 
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Garmin Maps

[Steve Bennett]

On Sun, May 16, 2010 at 9:51 AM, Sami Dalouche  wrote:
> What I see is hundreds of small projects or individual people creating

...

> So, I am currently thinking of starting a complementary project to OSM

See the problem here? IMHO if you want to put some effort into this,
the best thing you could do would be to try and
unite/combine/link/organise all those "hundreds of small projects" -
rather than just start another one.

My experience has been that for part of the world, there is a
different project somewhere producing the maps you need. For example,
in australia, it's really easy:
http://www.osmaustralia.org/downloads.php

In the case of Garmin, complication seems to also arise from the fact
that earlier Garmins required special software (like Mapsource) to
load the maps onto the device. Newer ones (like my Oregon 550) are
trivial: simply download a .img file, and copy it into the right
directory.

So, I think there need to be more services of this kind: websites that
regularly (eg, every week or more often) generate .img files of a
given area, in a number of styles (eg, hiking, cycling, driving...)
There is already a central registry of these kinds of sites:

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/OSM_Map_On_Garmin/Download

But it could be improved.

Steve

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Re: [OSM-talk] Garmin Maps

[Sam Vekemans]

Hi,

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 5:48 PM, Sami Dalouche  wrote:



So, if you already have all the rendering machinery in place, I would be
> happy to create the scripts to regularly go fetch the maps you render
> and publish them onto some kind of user-centric website.
> That would be awesome !
>
> sami
>

Yup it would :)  ... yes they are routable, and your talking about 2
different countries and 3 different states, and cycling / hiking / routing /
contour (topographical) which cover a big area.
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=43.41&lon=-74.69&zoom=7&layers=B000FTFT
(zoom in to where you like and click the Permalink button at the bottom
right corner)

Contour + Hiking map/cycling   - non-routable on MapSource is possable
hiking + routable (no contours on MapSource) is possable.

routable + contours on MapSource is not possable   (because of licence &
proprietary software)

However, transparent contour IMG files (that i'm making)  can be used as a
background map (And a contour -only MapSource Installer and/or as available
IMG tiles., for any map that you want. (is also in progress)

Yup, Slowly but surely, this is the goal todo.  In order to get to that
point, there is a WHOLE LOT of technical process that needs to be done.

To talk@ osm:   In other words, I just need to get a .nsis script file
created using ground truth, (just like makemap has).  I can do that myself
with an .iss file, but it will stall & is not automatic,  other than that
were set on the back-end side.   For the front-end.  I have it set to edting
a txt file.  and following dos command prompts.  But thats as technical as i
know how.  (& Because it is using outside programs, the details i'll post on
a blog or something)

Cheers,
Sam
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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

[jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com]

Here is a message from the gnash team that I think is appropriate to forward
to this thread.
thanks,
mike

-- Forwarded message --
From: John Gilmore 
Date: Sun, May 16, 2010 at 2:52 AM
Subject: [Gnash-dev] Gnash appears on Adobe's web site!
To: gnash-...@gnu.org


Adobe has a facetious campaign about how "open" they are, now that
Apple has used its own iron fist to lock out Adobe products from the
iPhone/iPad universe.  Anybody who really knows anything about Adobe
history knows it's a crock of shit -- Adobe only opens when the world
forces them to -- but it's there to fool the rubes.  Anyway, as part
of this campaign, they have publicly admitted that Gnash exists, here:

 http://www.adobe.com/choice/flash.html

They think the existence of Gnash helps to claim that Flash is open,
despite all the years of never publishing specs, and using EULA
anti-reverse-engineering threats.  Then after the open community
reverse engineered it, came the years of Adobe publishing bogus specs
that didn't actually work, and which came with a EULA of their own
that said you could use the specs for any purpose except to build a
competing implementation (which they now claim "Anyone can use without
requiring permission from Adobe"!).  Not to mention all the patent and
codec wars.

Anyway, they end by namechecking "haXe; open source runtimes such as
Gnash; and open source video servers such as Red5."

It's really funny that when the big bully Apple comes after them, they
go running to the free software community for protection.  Maybe
Dmitry Sklyarov can help 'em.  I hear his company has some lawyers who
know how to win cases against big bully companies.

   John




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Re: [OSM-talk] Garmin Maps

[Sami Dalouche]

Hi,

thanks for the prompt reply !

The http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php page contains only
auto-routable maps, right ?

My current need is to get :
- routable maps for Quebec, Vermont, New Hampshire, and NY
- hiking maps for Quebec, Vermont, New Hampshire, and NY

But more generally, I think I would like to (and think it would benefit
the OSM community if it were possible) be able to just go one one
website, that presents me with all the maps I can download for a given
(predefined) area, and quickly load it to my GPS device.

So for example, if I decide to go cycling tomorrow, I'd like to quickly
go to some website that tells me that for the region of Quebec, I can
download :
- cycling maps
- hiking maps (are topographic maps and hiking maps the same ?)
- routing maps

I see my options, choose one or to depending on my needs, load it onto
the GPS, and I'm done. Should not be more complicated than buying the
official garmin maps..

So, if you already have all the rendering machinery in place, I would be
happy to create the scripts to regularly go fetch the maps you render
and publish them onto some kind of user-centric website.
That would be awesome !

sami

On Sat, 2010-05-15 at 17:09 -0700, Sam Vekemans wrote:
> Hi,
> In short, thats what im working on (as well as many others)
> 
> OSM is still in its infancy, we have all of the pieces of the puzzle
> available, but not yet to the point where you can do to the main
> openstreetmap.org page, zoom into an area & click on the 'download
> tab'  (it doesn't exist yet)  and you will get options for downloading
> nice pre-done pdf maps / MapSource Installers .
> 
> What is the exact area you are interested in? (zoom in & permalink)
> 
> I can make a routable -osm installer for that area (just like the
> http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php
> site.)
> 
> I can also produce a set of transparent contour  IMG files, were you
> install those onto the device.
> http://www.img2gps.co.cc/  is a simple windows program to load the IMG
> files to the device.
> 
> There are pre-made Garmin IMG files which are nice 1x1 degree tiles   
> http://touren.mospace.de/kachel.html  (zoom into an area & select the
> OSM icon on the bounding box & submit.
> 
> Cheers,
> Sam
> 
> On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 4:51 PM, Sami Dalouche  wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I just bought a garmin GPS device and thought it would be fun
> to load it
> with OSM maps. (I am especially interested in maps that
> provide me with
> some value while hiking in New Hampshire, Vermont and NY)
> 
> However, after searching a little bit, I came to the
> conclusion that
> populating a GPS device with the right OSM map is definitely
> more suited
> for a hacker than an end-user.
> 
> What I see is hundreds of small projects or individual people
> creating
> incredibly useful work, but good luck finding what is actually
> available
> and what you are looking for. Every google search leads me to
> forum or
> wiki pages that describe (complex) procedures to generate my
> own maps..
> 
> So, I am currently thinking of starting a complementary
> project to OSM
> that would be aimed at Garmin (maybe others later?) GPS
> end-users. You
> know, some kind of website that gives you a direct download
> link to a
> file that is of the right type (Cycling,
> Hiking/Mountainbiking, Routing,
> Topographic) for the right place (Country, province/state).
> 
> In other words, my use case is : Search "free garmin hiking
> maps new
> hampshire" on google, and the first result should bring you a
> simple-to-use download page that provides you with a file to
> copy on
> your SD card.
> 
> So, my questions are :
> 1/ Is there already an OSM subproject or OSM-linked project
> that tries
> to achieve the same goal, and that I might have missed ?
> 2/ Is there anyone who thinks it is worth putting some effort
> into
> this ?
> 3/ Is there anyone interested in helping me achieving this
> simple goal ?
> Any kind of help is welcome, including pointing me to the
> right
> information and spending an hour or so on skype with me to
> kickstart me
> into the OSM jungle.
> 
> thanks,
> Sami
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [OSM-talk] Garmin Maps

[Sam Vekemans]

Hi,
In short, thats what im working on (as well as many others)

OSM is still in its infancy, we have all of the pieces of the puzzle
available, but not yet to the point where you can do to the main
openstreetmap.org page, zoom into an area & click on the 'download tab'  (it
doesn't exist yet)  and you will get options for downloading nice pre-done
pdf maps / MapSource Installers .

What is the exact area you are interested in? (zoom in & permalink)

I can make a routable -osm installer for that area (just like the
http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php
site.)

I can also produce a set of transparent contour  IMG files, were you install
those onto the device.
http://www.img2gps.co.cc/  is a simple windows program to load the IMG files
to the device.

There are pre-made Garmin IMG files which are nice 1x1 degree tiles
http://touren.mospace.de/kachel.html  (zoom into an area & select the OSM
icon on the bounding box & submit.

Cheers,
Sam

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 4:51 PM, Sami Dalouche  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I just bought a garmin GPS device and thought it would be fun to load it
> with OSM maps. (I am especially interested in maps that provide me with
> some value while hiking in New Hampshire, Vermont and NY)
>
> However, after searching a little bit, I came to the conclusion that
> populating a GPS device with the right OSM map is definitely more suited
> for a hacker than an end-user.
>
> What I see is hundreds of small projects or individual people creating
> incredibly useful work, but good luck finding what is actually available
> and what you are looking for. Every google search leads me to forum or
> wiki pages that describe (complex) procedures to generate my own maps..
>
> So, I am currently thinking of starting a complementary project to OSM
> that would be aimed at Garmin (maybe others later?) GPS end-users. You
> know, some kind of website that gives you a direct download link to a
> file that is of the right type (Cycling, Hiking/Mountainbiking, Routing,
> Topographic) for the right place (Country, province/state).
>
> In other words, my use case is : Search "free garmin hiking maps new
> hampshire" on google, and the first result should bring you a
> simple-to-use download page that provides you with a file to copy on
> your SD card.
>
> So, my questions are :
> 1/ Is there already an OSM subproject or OSM-linked project that tries
> to achieve the same goal, and that I might have missed ?
> 2/ Is there anyone who thinks it is worth putting some effort into
> this ?
> 3/ Is there anyone interested in helping me achieving this simple goal ?
> Any kind of help is welcome, including pointing me to the right
> information and spending an hour or so on skype with me to kickstart me
> into the OSM jungle.
>
> thanks,
> Sami
>
>
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Garmin Maps

[Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason]

Yes, such a project would be useful. I suggest you get in contact with
some of the people already running something similar, e.g.:

http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php

That project has selectable maps, a mapsource installer and more.
Presumably it could use some programming help to perhaps make custom
maps.

There's also style support in mkgmap, but I don't know of any nice UI
for setting those styles. Something neat for that would be nice, and
could be used by such a project.

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[OSM-talk] Garmin Maps

[Sami Dalouche]

Hi,

I just bought a garmin GPS device and thought it would be fun to load it
with OSM maps. (I am especially interested in maps that provide me with
some value while hiking in New Hampshire, Vermont and NY)

However, after searching a little bit, I came to the conclusion that
populating a GPS device with the right OSM map is definitely more suited
for a hacker than an end-user.

What I see is hundreds of small projects or individual people creating
incredibly useful work, but good luck finding what is actually available
and what you are looking for. Every google search leads me to forum or
wiki pages that describe (complex) procedures to generate my own maps.. 

So, I am currently thinking of starting a complementary project to OSM
that would be aimed at Garmin (maybe others later?) GPS end-users. You
know, some kind of website that gives you a direct download link to a
file that is of the right type (Cycling, Hiking/Mountainbiking, Routing,
Topographic) for the right place (Country, province/state). 

In other words, my use case is : Search "free garmin hiking maps new
hampshire" on google, and the first result should bring you a
simple-to-use download page that provides you with a file to copy on
your SD card.

So, my questions are :
1/ Is there already an OSM subproject or OSM-linked project that tries
to achieve the same goal, and that I might have missed ?
2/ Is there anyone who thinks it is worth putting some effort into
this ?
3/ Is there anyone interested in helping me achieving this simple goal ?
Any kind of help is welcome, including pointing me to the right
information and spending an hour or so on skype with me to kickstart me
into the OSM jungle.

thanks,
Sami




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Re: [OSM-talk] is there an open database of places?

[Peter Körner]

Am 15.05.2010 21:52, schrieb Patrick Aljord:
> I was reading something about that [1] the other day and I was
> wondering whether OSM had something like that. I know OSM already has
> lots of POI on its maps but it only has the most common ones.
While this may be true for the rendered maps, it is definitive not true 
for the osm database - we have a real big bunch of arcane POIs - just 
recall:

amenity=vending_machine
vending=excrement_bags
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Dog_excrement_bags.jpg

 > Would it
> make sense to have a seperate DB that would store all places? Is there
> already a project that does that?
I don't think so, osm is the best solution for this.

Peter

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Re: [OSM-talk] new logo

[Robert Martinez]

On 05/15/2010 12:47 PM, Steve Bennett wrote:
> On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 6:54 PM, Robert Martinez  wrote:
>
>> If you are missing the geodata - what about the community aspect to the
>> project? is it less impoprtant?
>> There are tons of things that should be represented, too (maybe even
>> harder to integrate than geodata).
>> I chose to stick to the basic aspect of marking things on a map - in
>> order to find what you want, and don't expect from every designer to go
>> for the same approach.
>>  
> I like the logo - it really looks great. But I think there could be
> more "OSM"-ness to it. How about something cute like a person standing
> on a map, drawing a line? The essence to capture is not so much that
> "this is a digital map" or "there is a community behind this map" but
> "this map is being made by people". One person would be sufficient to
> represent that.
>
> Anyway, like I said I like your first draft, but any logo process
> inevitably involves many iterations, with lots of feedback. It would
> be naïve to think one person can, in one iteration, produce *the* logo
> that everyone likes.
>
> Steve
>

Great!

I'm happy to hear that you like the logo.
Regarding your ideas: please understand that I prefer not to 
collectively work on my design here.
There are just too many people with different ideas.
You can rest assured that the logo has gone through numerous iterations 
with feedback, albeit not publically visible.
This isn't a first draft - maybe there is room for changes if decision 
makers like an "OSM design team" (or similar) decide to use my contribution.

p.s.: I think it is naive to think that it is possible to create a logo 
that everyone likes.


Robert


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[OSM-talk] is there an open database of places?

[Patrick Aljord]

Hey all,

I was reading something about that [1] the other day and I was
wondering whether OSM had something like that. I know OSM already has
lots of POI on its maps but it only has the most common ones. Would it
make sense to have a seperate DB that would store all places? Is there
already a project that does that?

Cheers,

Pat

1: http://techcrunch.com/2010/05/08/place-database/

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[John Smith]

On 16 May 2010 02:31, Richard Weait  wrote:
> Adding them to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Attribution seems
> like a good idea, but I see a potential problem.  Have any of the au
> community who are so enthusiastically using nearmap as a source
> considered the effect of the OSM license upgrade to ODbL?  Will all

A couple of Nearmap employees follow the talk-au mailing list:

http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/2009-December/004249.html

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[Richard Weait]

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 6:11 AM, Gregory  wrote:
> "If you derive information from observing our PhotoMaps, and include that
> information in a work, you will own that work, and may distribute it to
> others under a Creative Commons Attribution Share Alike (CC-BY-SA) licence."
> So make sure you add them in the source, and I guess we're assuming that's
> enough attribution.

Adding them to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Attribution seems
like a good idea, but I see a potential problem.  Have any of the au
community who are so enthusiastically using nearmap as a source
considered the effect of the OSM license upgrade to ODbL?  Will all
nearmap-sourced data have to be reverted / removed?  Or has the au
community approached nearmap and received their written consent to
relicense data derived from their images as ODbL?

I see that they mention OpenStreetMapS <-- that terminal "s" again,
most-common typo, ever!  in their terms of use, and they certainly
seem pretty awesome all around.  But what's up with the license
upgrade?

Best regards,
Richard

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[John Smith]

On 15 May 2010 21:29, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer  wrote:
> 2010/5/15 John Smith :
>> Due to all the potential hazardous waste dumped in past years most
>> landfills aren't suitable for much else unless they're properly
>> cleaned up first.
>
>
> quite close to the residences and the lake ;-)
> http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.943519,145.083947&z=19&t=h&nmd=20100416

Yea, so the holes might in fact be them digging up old garbage to fix
up parts of the land fill...

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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

[pavithran]

On 14 May 2010 22:38, Richard Fairhurst  wrote:
> I would encourage people to sign the petition at http://openplayer.net/
> encouraging Adobe to make the Flash Player open source.

Increasing the pressure on adobe ?
Adobe has open sourced flex . There is a video player from flash which
is opensource . Overall some of them might not be purely free software
but adobe definitely is being careful ;)

Other than AJAX is there an opensource alternative in widespread usage ?

Re:flash video I think its going to die as most popular browsers like
FF ,IE,chrome and Safari are supporting HTML5 (M$ and Apple to support
their own codecs/formats )

There are huge set of multimedia & graphic designers living on Adobe
and its products . If they are educated and are made to sign this
petition maybe adobe will listen .

Regards,
Pavithran



-- 
pavithran sakamuri
http://look-pavi.blogspot.com

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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

[Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason]

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 12:17, Frederik Ramm  wrote:
> I'm also very concerned about the amount of dihydrogenmonoxide contained
> in almost any drink you can get nowadays. It is virtually impossible to
> escape the stuff, and people are reported to have died from it already[0].

Dihydrogenmonoxide is even more harmful than Ecstasy.

1. http://www.urban75.com/Drugs/drugxtc1.html



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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

[Elizabeth Dodd]

On Sat, 15 May 2010, Frederik Ramm wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> M∡rtin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> > that's why we call it "sour stuff" in German (Sauerstoff) ;-)
> 
> I'm also very concerned about the amount of dihydrogenmonoxide contained
> in almost any drink you can get nowadays. It is virtually impossible to
> escape the stuff, and people are reported to have died from it already[0].
> 
> Bye
> Frederik
> 
> [0] http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16614865/
> 

http://www.dhmo.org/msdsdhmo.html

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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

[Frederik Ramm]

Hi,

M∡rtin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> that's why we call it "sour stuff" in German (Sauerstoff) ;-)

I'm also very concerned about the amount of dihydrogenmonoxide contained 
in almost any drink you can get nowadays. It is virtually impossible to 
escape the stuff, and people are reported to have died from it already[0].

Bye
Frederik

[0] http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16614865/

-- 
Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"

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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

[M∡rtin Koppenhoefer]

2010/5/15 Liz :
> On Sat, 15 May 2010, Richard Fairhurst wrote:
>>  > It's probably the major source of Malware in Windows
>>
>> Yeah. The major source of drowning in the Atlantic Ocean is water. BAN
>> water!!11!11o...@wtflolccbysa
>>
> don't forget
> oxygen is not only poisonous in some forms but promotes explosions
> so ban it too

that's why we call it "sour stuff" in German (Sauerstoff) ;-)

cheers,
Martin

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Re: [OSM-talk] Villain?

[Nakor]

On 5/15/2010 7:01 AM, Frederik Ramm wrote:
> But if you see such constructs, or even create them by untangling two 
> nodes someone else has erroneously merged, please rectify the 
> situation in a way that does not leave two nodes at the exact same 
> spot. This will only cause the whole thing to repeat itself - plus it 
> is more difficult to edit (how do you grab the "lower" of the two 
> nodes to move it?).
>
> Bye
> Frederik
>
Be assured that whenever I add bridges where there was two nodes at the 
same position. I (re)move the nodes that are at the same position.

   Thanks,

N.

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[M∡rtin Koppenhoefer]

2010/5/15 John Smith :
> Due to all the potential hazardous waste dumped in past years most
> landfills aren't suitable for much else unless they're properly
> cleaned up first.


quite close to the residences and the lake ;-)
http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.943519,145.083947&z=19&t=h&nmd=20100416

cheers,
Martin

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[Liz]

On Sat, 15 May 2010, Chris Hill wrote:
> Steve Bennett wrote:
> > One of my favourite things about working on openstreetmap is just how
> > much you learn about the world...without ever leaving your computer :)
> 
> One of the things I love about OSM is how it has encouraged me to see so
> many new things and learn so much about my local area by getting out,
> away from my computer.
> 
> Cheers, Chris
> 
>
I think that Steve does cycle too



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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[Steve Bennett]

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 8:11 PM, Gregory  wrote:
> "If you derive information from observing our PhotoMaps, and include that
> information in a work, you will own that work, and may distribute it to
> others under a Creative Commons Attribution Share Alike (CC-BY-SA) licence."
> So make sure you add them in the source, and I guess we're assuming that's
> enough attribution.

Are you saying you haven't used nearmap before? Nearmap is now *the*
source for Australian metropolitan imagery - and their imagery is
starting to cover big chunks of the bush. The nearmap people are very
keen for OSM to trace from their data, you don't need to worry about
that.

Much faster than having to visit sites to ask the people there what
kind of site it is :)

Steve

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Re: [OSM-talk] Villain?

[Frederik Ramm]

Hi,

Nakor wrote:
> This is due to the way the data imports coming 
> from TIGER use nodes at the same position for a lot of different things. 
> I have effectively being fixing some of those blind merges, as part of 
> other edits, and I do not see why I should be called a villain for this 
> where I actually FIXED data.

Unless a river changes direction (or properties) exactly where the 
bridge crosses over it, the river does not need - and indeed should not 
have - a node just under the bridge, and unless the bridge is 
curved/angled, it will not need a node just over the river also. The 
same is true for power lines.

I know that the TIGER import was funny in this regard, and it is 
definitely wrong to join such two nodes, and also wrong for the 
validator to highlight them as a problem.

But if you see such constructs, or even create them by untangling two 
nodes someone else has erroneously merged, please rectify the situation 
in a way that does not leave two nodes at the exact same spot. This will 
only cause the whole thing to repeat itself - plus it is more difficult 
to edit (how do you grab the "lower" of the two nodes to move it?).

Bye
Frederik

-- 
Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[Chris Hill]

Steve Bennett wrote:
>
> One of my favourite things about working on openstreetmap is just how
> much you learn about the world...without ever leaving your computer :)
>   
One of the things I love about OSM is how it has encouraged me to see so 
many new things and learn so much about my local area by getting out, 
away from my computer.

Cheers, Chris

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Re: [OSM-talk] new logo

[Steve Bennett]

On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 6:54 PM, Robert Martinez  wrote:
> If you are missing the geodata - what about the community aspect to the
> project? is it less impoprtant?
> There are tons of things that should be represented, too (maybe even
> harder to integrate than geodata).
> I chose to stick to the basic aspect of marking things on a map - in
> order to find what you want, and don't expect from every designer to go
> for the same approach.

I like the logo - it really looks great. But I think there could be
more "OSM"-ness to it. How about something cute like a person standing
on a map, drawing a line? The essence to capture is not so much that
"this is a digital map" or "there is a community behind this map" but
"this map is being made by people". One person would be sufficient to
represent that.

Anyway, like I said I like your first draft, but any logo process
inevitably involves many iterations, with lots of feedback. It would
be naïve to think one person can, in one iteration, produce *the* logo
that everyone likes.

Steve

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Re: [OSM-talk] Villain?

[Serge Wroclawski]

On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 1:09 PM, Nakor  wrote:
>
>> Did you download all existing data in that area and run the validator
>> before uploading your data? This should have told you with a red "No
>> entry" sign in it's report that you were about to upload duplicate nodes.

I suspect the algorithm that's used to determine what is duplicate is
simply overly-sensitive.

In the datasets I'm working with, I'm simplifying and validating data
before submission.

> The thing is unfortunately the validator gives a lot of false positives
> (at least here in the US) and if you blindly merge all nodes you end up
> stiching together a bridge and the road/river/train track going
> underneath to name a few.

+1

> from TIGER use nodes at the same position for a lot of different things.
> I have effectively being fixing some of those blind merges, as part of
> other edits, and I do not see why I should be called a villain for this
> where I actually FIXED data.

Yes, I've been fixing some imported data too.

I am not sure how to react to being on the vilian list, other than
knowing I'm in good company with Nakor and wonderchook.

My suggestions:

1) Please reword the list to not have judgemental label on it. "just the facts"

2) Explain the algorithm. Are you looking for duplicated nodes
litterally by "nodes which are on top of one another" or something
more loose?

3) For those of us who have duplicated nodes still around, make it
easy to download the list and examine it. You're already compiling the
data- just make it available as an OSM file for us to look at in our
favorite OSM editor, please.

- Serge

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[Gregory]

"If you derive information from observing our PhotoMaps, and include that
information in a work, you will own that work, and may distribute it to
others under a Creative Commons Attribution Share Alike
(CC-BY-SA)
 licence."

So make sure you add them in the source, and I guess we're assuming that's
enough attribution.


On 15 May 2010 09:52, John Smith  wrote:

> On 15 May 2010 18:42, Steve Bennett  wrote:
> > Hmm, I guess the giveaway is the loaded truck entering off Old Dandenong
> Rd.
> >
> > OTOH, to the east of that road are a few piles of different kinds of
> dirt:
> > http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.952009,145.101886&z=19&t=h&nmd=20100416
> >
> > So I guess there's a quarry and a landfill?
>
> Depends what they're doing with the site, in recent years many
> landfill sites near large population centres have been turned into
> waste transfer stations and turf grown on top of any existing waste.
>
> Although that site still seems pretty active if you look to the north
> west of that location:
>
> http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.946294,145.092748&z=19&t=h&nmd=20100416
>
> You can see what appears to be waste, and dozers and other heavy
> machinery tending to it.
>
> Also this area:
>
> http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.946763,145.089066&z=20&t=h&nmd=20100416
>
> Could be a recycling section.
>
> Due to all the potential hazardous waste dumped in past years most
> landfills aren't suitable for much else unless they're properly
> cleaned up first.
>
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-- 
Gregory
o...@livingwithdragons.com
http://www.livingwithdragons.com
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Re: [OSM-talk] Villain?

[Nic Roets]

On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 3:18 PM, Nathan Edgars II  wrote:
> It's not so simple. This changeset:
> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/changeset/4300452 made me a
> "villain" when I selectively undid a so-called hero's indiscriminate
> joining of highways to boundaries, power lines, and pipelines:

You mean something like this ?
http://www.jacarandafm.com/kagiso/content/en/jacaranda/jacaranda-news?oid=571531&sn=Detail&pid=399938

> http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/changeset/4175719 . Of course it
> was useless, since another "hero" later came along and screwed it up
> again: http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/changeset/4385668
>
> (Apparently I'm now a "hero" - maybe I should do another unjoining so
> I can be on both lists.)
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[John Smith]

On 15 May 2010 18:42, Steve Bennett  wrote:
> Hmm, I guess the giveaway is the loaded truck entering off Old Dandenong Rd.
>
> OTOH, to the east of that road are a few piles of different kinds of dirt:
> http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.952009,145.101886&z=19&t=h&nmd=20100416
>
> So I guess there's a quarry and a landfill?

Depends what they're doing with the site, in recent years many
landfill sites near large population centres have been turned into
waste transfer stations and turf grown on top of any existing waste.

Although that site still seems pretty active if you look to the north
west of that location:

http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.946294,145.092748&z=19&t=h&nmd=20100416

You can see what appears to be waste, and dozers and other heavy
machinery tending to it.

Also this area:

http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.946763,145.089066&z=20&t=h&nmd=20100416

Could be a recycling section.

Due to all the potential hazardous waste dumped in past years most
landfills aren't suitable for much else unless they're properly
cleaned up first.

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[Steve Bennett]

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 6:30 PM, John Smith  wrote:
> They also use weigh stations to weigh garbage coming into landfills,
> you can see a bunch of big skip bins near by as well.
>
> landuse=landfill

Hmm, I guess the giveaway is the loaded truck entering off Old Dandenong Rd.

OTOH, to the east of that road are a few piles of different kinds of dirt:
http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.952009,145.101886&z=19&t=h&nmd=20100416

So I guess there's a quarry and a landfill?

Steve

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[John Smith]

On 15 May 2010 01:34, Joseph Reeves  wrote:
> I know you don't want specifics, but that one's a quarry:
>
> http://www.nearmap.com/?ll=-37.950822,145.097364&z=19&t=h&nmd=20100416
>
> You can see the weigh station used to work out how much material each
> truck is leaving with, there's also some round piles of material under
> the the tell-tale conveyor belts.
>
> But weight station and buildings by the entrance = quarry.

They also use weigh stations to weigh garbage coming into landfills,
you can see a bunch of big skip bins near by as well.

landuse=landfill

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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

[Richard Fairhurst]

Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote:
> Adobe has explicitly said in the past that they can't open source it
> because they've used a lot of parts in in that they've licensed from
> somewhere else.

http://www.adobe.com/de/products/eula/third_party/flashplayer/

Pretty much all the "all rights reserved" stuff is codecs. Like I say, 
video is moving to HTML5 anyway and shouldn't distract from the wider 
Flash Player.

 > Anyway. Good luck with the petition. Personally I think it's about as
 > likely to succeed as an equivalent petition asking Microsoft to open
 > source Windows. I'd love to be proven wrong, though.

I would hope it's about as likely to succeed as an equivalent petition 
asking Sun to open-source Java. :)

cheers
Richard

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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

[Richard Fairhurst]

john whelan wrote:
> "In order to reduce the threat of successful exploitation of Web
> browsers, administrators should maintain a restrictive policy regarding
> which applications are allowed within the organization. […] Browser
> security features and add-ons should be employed wherever possible to
> *disable JavaScript™, Adobe Flash Player, and other content that may
> present a risk to the user* when visiting untrusted sites"
>
> Simply going to a web site these days is the most common way to get
> infected, once infected then you lose your credit card details, and
> Flash is a very weak link no matter which web browser it is run from.

Yeah but hang on, you're quoting something there that tells you to 
disable JavaScript as well.

This thread is about open-sourcing the Flash Player, and the single best 
way to fix any vulnerabilities in Flash Player would be to open-source it.

cheers
Richard

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Re: [OSM-talk] Flash and open source

[Richard Fairhurst]

John Smith wrote:
> Browser plugin security is a joke and has been for a very long time,
> and as far as I'm aware nothing has been reported publicly that
> anything is being done to fix the situation.

I think (though I'm absolutely no expert on the situation) that Chrome 
and Safari are working towards that. Certainly Google have said that 
they're planning it:

> We expect to work in the near future with the plug-in vendors to
> securely sandbox them as well.

(from 
http://blog.chromium.org/2008/10/new-approach-to-browser-security-google.html 
)

cheers
Richard

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Re: [OSM-talk] Quarry or construction?

[Steve Bennett]

On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 1:34 AM, Joseph Reeves  wrote:
> You can see the weigh station used to work out how much material each
> truck is leaving with, there's also some round piles of material under
> the the tell-tale conveyor belts.
>
> But weight station and buildings by the entrance = quarry.

Ah, that's a good tip, thanks. (I forgot how good the nearmap resolution is...)

One of my favourite things about working on openstreetmap is just how
much you learn about the world...without ever leaving your computer :)

Steve

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