date:20190729

Am Mo., 29. Juli 2019 um 19:00 Uhr schrieb Kathleen Lu via talk <
talk@openstreetmap.org>:

> I personally would much rather have a 101% map than a 1% map.
>



it depends what you want to do with it, for data statistics or geocoding
I'd also prefer a 101% map over a 1% map, but if I were to hike in
difficult environment I'd much rather have a 1% map from OSM than a 101%
map. A 1% map is certainly more inspiring than a 101% map. Probably a map
with 1% roads and road connections that don't exist would make you turn
away and choose a different map.

Cheers,
Martin
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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Yuri Astrakhan

Also, fully accurate data is a myth, even if we only have 1%
completeness. Once data is beyond a certain size, it is guaranteed to be
wrong, simply because humans always make mistakes and things always become
outdated.  We can only discuss how close we are to the ideal "perfect
accuracy", and what is the best method(s) to get there.  Per above, going
from 1% to 101% completeness certainly gets us closer to the perfect
accuracy, especially as John mentioned, with a mobile device it is easier
to flag some minor mistake than to ignore the whole area because it only
has 1% completeness.

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 1:28 PM john whelan  wrote:

> I agree with Kathleen.  Given that smartphones are more common than
> internet connected computers and it is easier to add or change tags on a
> smartphone than add a long highway at least the locals stand more chance
> this way.
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019, 1:00 PM Kathleen Lu via talk, <
> talk@openstreetmap.org> wrote:
>
>> On the other hand, if the map of your area is completely blank, it looks
>> very daunting to a new mapper, who may be discouraged and abandon OSM
>> (either as too difficult to improve and as too poor quality to use).
>> The map is constantly changing because roads and other things on the map
>> are changing in the real world. A city might close off a road and then it
>> will become a "bad" street. It's easier to delete a bad street than to add
>> a bunch of streets, especially when you are surveying on foot and don't
>> have a mouse.
>> I personally would much rather have a 101% map than a 1% map.
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 9:21 AM Joseph Eisenberg <
>> joseph.eisenb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Re: "OSM map with a one percent of roads is far worse than having 101%
>>> of the roads mapped with the help of AI with 1% of extras, because
>>> fixing that 1% is far less work than adding 99% by hand"
>>>
>>> I'm not certain this is true. It might be very difficult to find the
>>> 1% of incorrectly mapped roads; you don't know where to look, and you
>>> must survey on the ground with GPS, and check each road segment to
>>> find the 1% that actually are blocked by a fence or gate or don't
>>> really go through that clump of trees.
>>>
>>> In contrast, when 99% are missing it's very obvious when looking at
>>> the map data. You still have to survey and add the streets, but it may
>>> actually be faster to get to a complete map of your home neighborhood,
>>> than trying to find 10 bad streets out of 1000 segments in your
>>> neighborhood.
>>>
>>> Finally, when you look at the map and it looks 100% complete, you
>>> won't see the need to start mapping and become a totally addicted
>>> OSMer like you will if your village is only 1% mapped, so we may not
>>> get the new contributors that we need to actual maintain the data that
>>> our robot mappers have added.
>>>
>>> Joseph
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> talk@openstreetmap.org
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>>
>> ___
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>>
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[Talk-ht] hebdoOSM Nº 470 2019-07-16-2019-07-22

Bonjour,

Le résumé hebdomadaire n° 470 de l'actualité OpenStreetMap vient de paraître 
*en français*. Un condensé à retrouver sur :

http://www.weeklyosm.eu/fr/archives/12261/

Bonne lecture !

Saviez-vous que vous pouvez vous aussi soumettre des messages pour la note 
hebdomadaire sans être membre ? Il vous suffit de vous connecter sur 
https://osmbc.openstreetmap.de/login avec votre compte OSM. Pour en savoir plus 
sur la rédaction d'un article, cliquez ici: 
http://www.weeklyosm.eu/fr/this-news-should-be-in-weeklyosm

hebdoOSM ? 
Qui : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WeeklyOSM#Available_Languages 
Où : 
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/weeklyosm-is-currently-produced-in_56718#2/8.6/108.3
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[Talk-ca] hebdoOSM Nº 470 2019-07-16-2019-07-22

Bonjour,

Le résumé hebdomadaire n° 470 de l'actualité OpenStreetMap vient de paraître 
*en français*. Un condensé à retrouver sur :

http://www.weeklyosm.eu/fr/archives/12261/

Bonne lecture !

Saviez-vous que vous pouvez vous aussi soumettre des messages pour la note 
hebdomadaire sans être membre ? Il vous suffit de vous connecter sur 
https://osmbc.openstreetmap.de/login avec votre compte OSM. Pour en savoir plus 
sur la rédaction d'un article, cliquez ici: 
http://www.weeklyosm.eu/fr/this-news-should-be-in-weeklyosm

hebdoOSM ? 
Qui : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WeeklyOSM#Available_Languages 
Où : 
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/weeklyosm-is-currently-produced-in_56718#2/8.6/108.3
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[OSM-talk-fr] hebdoOSM Nº 470 2019-07-16-2019-07-22

Bonjour,

Le résumé hebdomadaire n° 470 de l'actualité OpenStreetMap vient de paraître 
*en français*. Un condensé à retrouver sur :

http://www.weeklyosm.eu/fr/archives/12261/

Bonne lecture !

Saviez-vous que vous pouvez vous aussi soumettre des messages pour la note 
hebdomadaire sans être membre ? Il vous suffit de vous connecter sur 
https://osmbc.openstreetmap.de/login avec votre compte OSM. Pour en savoir plus 
sur la rédaction d'un article, cliquez ici: 
http://www.weeklyosm.eu/fr/this-news-should-be-in-weeklyosm

hebdoOSM ? 
Qui : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WeeklyOSM#Available_Languages 
Où : 
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/weeklyosm-is-currently-produced-in_56718#2/8.6/108.3
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[Talk-africa] hebdoOSM Nº 470 2019-07-16-2019-07-22

Bonjour,

Le résumé hebdomadaire n° 470 de l'actualité OpenStreetMap vient de paraître 
*en français*. Un condensé à retrouver sur :

http://www.weeklyosm.eu/fr/archives/12261/

Bonne lecture !

Saviez-vous que vous pouvez vous aussi soumettre des messages pour la note 
hebdomadaire sans être membre ? Il vous suffit de vous connecter sur 
https://osmbc.openstreetmap.de/login avec votre compte OSM. Pour en savoir plus 
sur la rédaction d'un article, cliquez ici: 
http://www.weeklyosm.eu/fr/this-news-should-be-in-weeklyosm

hebdoOSM ? 
Qui : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WeeklyOSM#Available_Languages 
Où : 
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/weeklyosm-is-currently-produced-in_56718#2/8.6/108.3
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Re: [Talk-br] Desafios MapRoulette no Brasil

2019-07-29 Thread Andrew Wiseman por (Talk-br)

Olá OSM Brasil

Eu publiquei um novo desafio MapRoulette, que analisa linhas costeiras que 
podem ser muito longas ou com ângulos agudos. Estes podem ter sido 
digitalizados mal ou com imagens antigas. Há mais detalhes e instruções sobre o 
desafio: https://maproulette.org/challenge/8267

Deixe-me saber se você tiver alguma dúvida or feedback.

Obrigado,

Andrew


Andrew Wiseman |  Maps | iPhone: +1.202.270.4464 | andrew_wise...@apple.com 


> On Feb 26, 2019, at 11:31 AM, Andrew Wiseman por (Talk-br) 
>  wrote:
> 
> Olá OSM Brasil
>  
> Eu sou Andrew Wiseman do Maps time da Apple. Recentemente, usamos nossa 
> ferramenta de análise de dados Atlas (https://github.com/osmlab/atlas 
> ) para examinar alguns tipos de problemas 
> possíveis, como intercessão de construções com estradas, vias de acesso à 
> rodovias que não têm as classificações corretas, formas sobrepostas 
> (geralmente estradas duplicadas) e ângulos da estrada que são muito agudos. 
> Eu postei os resultados dessas verificações no MapRoulette, uma ferramenta 
> que permite que você passe por possíveis problemas um por um e os corrija ou 
> indique que eles não são um problema. Eu queria que você soubesse que eles 
> estão disponíveis no caso de outros quererem tentar consertar alguns deles - 
> eu também pretendo passar por alguns deles.
>  
> No MapRoulette você pode escolher uma tarefa aleatória para corrigir ou 
> clicar em uma específica. Se você quiser executar tarefas em um determinado 
> local, como em algum lugar com o qual esteja familiarizado, clique em "mais 
> opções" e em "carregar tarefas por proximidade".
>  
> As verificações são:
>  
> - Ângulos agudos: https://maproulette.org/mr3/challenge/3666
> - Vias de acesso à rodovias: https://maproulette.org/mr3/challenge/3667
> - Interseções construção-estrada: https://maproulette.org/mr3/challenge/3669
> - Formas sobrepostas: https://maproulette.org/mr3/challenge/3668
>  
> Por favor, deixe-me saber se você tem alguma dúvida ou feedback.
>  
> Obrigado,
>  
> Andrew
> 
> //
> 
> Hello OSM Brazil,
> 
> I’m Andrew Wiseman with Apple’s Maps team. We recently used our Atlas data 
> analysis tool (https://github.com/osmlab/atlas 
> ) to look at a few types of potential 
> issues, such as building-road intersections, highway link roads that don’t 
> have the correct classifications, overlapping ways (usually duplicated roads) 
> and road angles that are too sharp. I've posted the results of those checks 
> on MapRoulette, a tool that lets you go through potential issues one by one 
> and either correct them or indicate they are not a problem. I wanted to let 
> you know they are available in case others wanted to try fixing some of them 
> — I also plan to go through some of them myself. 
> 
> In MapRoulette you can either pick a random task to fix or click on a 
> specific one. If you want to do tasks around a certain location, such as 
> somewhere you are familiar with, you can click “more options” then “load 
> tasks by proximity.” 
> 
> The checks are:
> 
> - Sharp angles: https://maproulette.org/mr3/challenge/3666
> - Highway link roads: https://maproulette.org/mr3/challenge/3667
> - Building-road intersections: https://maproulette.org/mr3/challenge/3669
> - Overlapping ways: https://maproulette.org/mr3/challenge/3668
> 
> Please let me know if you have any questions or feedback.
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Andrew
> 
> 
> 
> Andrew Wiseman |  Maps | iPhone: +1.202.270.4464 | andrew_wise...@apple.com 
> 
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[talk-ph] Project announcement for PhilAWARE, and HOT country team starting in the Philippines

2019-07-29 Thread Paul Uithol


Hi everyone in the OSM Philippines community,

I'd like to introduce a new project Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team will 
be working on in the Philippines, PhilAWARE. This is a local 
installation of DisasterAWARE, a disaster risk reduction and integrated 
early warning and decision support system that also incorporates many 
data layers from OpenStreetMap. Over the past week, we've been working 
here in Manila to set up this new project - there's an article on the 
launch of the program in Manila at 
https://www.pdc.org/philippines-drr-programs-kick-off-2019/.


Our new Country Manager in the Philippines is Nick Brown, and he'll be 
working to set up our team & project in the Philippines. A number of you 
will likely be in Dumaguete later this week; both Nick and Adityo 
Dwijananto (from our Indonesia team) will be attending, to answer any 
questions you might have and discuss more about this project - so please 
feel free to chat to and ask any questions to Nick or Adityo!


We're very happy to finally be able to offer more support of the great 
work that has been happening in the Philippines! Nick can be reached via 
nick.br...@hotosm.org.


thanks,
Paul
--
*Paul Uithol*
Director of Programs

Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team
OpenStreetMap & open data for Humanitarian Response & Development
web  | twitter  | 
facebook  | donate 

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Re: [Talk-at] CS Kommentar durch Problemuser

2019-07-29 Thread Johann Haag

Das mit den „Lichtscheuen Gesindel“ tut mit leid. Ich meinte das keinesfalls 
persönlich sondern synonym für Leute mit keiner ID Verschränkung. Eine solche 
ist bei den gegenständlichen Usern gegeben, und jeder kann sich daher über 
deren tatsächlichen Beteiligung an OSM in Edits und Arbeitsweise ein Bild 
machen. 

Bitte den erwähnten Changeset von weiteren OffTopic Kommentaren verschonen. 
Danke
Johann Haag
ebenfalls auf Twitter

Von meinem iPhone gesendet

> Am 27.07.2019 um 11:32 schrieb gppes_...@web.de:
> 
> Ich verweise auf folgenden CS Kommentar inclusive Beschimpfung:
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/72163441
> 
> Wie lange noch?
> 
> Lg, Gppes
> 
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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread john whelan

I agree with Kathleen.  Given that smartphones are more common than
internet connected computers and it is easier to add or change tags on a
smartphone than add a long highway at least the locals stand more chance
this way.

Cheerio John

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019, 1:00 PM Kathleen Lu via talk, 
wrote:

> On the other hand, if the map of your area is completely blank, it looks
> very daunting to a new mapper, who may be discouraged and abandon OSM
> (either as too difficult to improve and as too poor quality to use).
> The map is constantly changing because roads and other things on the map
> are changing in the real world. A city might close off a road and then it
> will become a "bad" street. It's easier to delete a bad street than to add
> a bunch of streets, especially when you are surveying on foot and don't
> have a mouse.
> I personally would much rather have a 101% map than a 1% map.
>
> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 9:21 AM Joseph Eisenberg <
> joseph.eisenb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Re: "OSM map with a one percent of roads is far worse than having 101%
>> of the roads mapped with the help of AI with 1% of extras, because
>> fixing that 1% is far less work than adding 99% by hand"
>>
>> I'm not certain this is true. It might be very difficult to find the
>> 1% of incorrectly mapped roads; you don't know where to look, and you
>> must survey on the ground with GPS, and check each road segment to
>> find the 1% that actually are blocked by a fence or gate or don't
>> really go through that clump of trees.
>>
>> In contrast, when 99% are missing it's very obvious when looking at
>> the map data. You still have to survey and add the streets, but it may
>> actually be faster to get to a complete map of your home neighborhood,
>> than trying to find 10 bad streets out of 1000 segments in your
>> neighborhood.
>>
>> Finally, when you look at the map and it looks 100% complete, you
>> won't see the need to start mapping and become a totally addicted
>> OSMer like you will if your village is only 1% mapped, so we may not
>> get the new contributors that we need to actual maintain the data that
>> our robot mappers have added.
>>
>> Joseph
>>
>> ___
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>> talk@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>>
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Re: [Talk-at] CS Kommentar durch Problemuser

2019-07-29 Thread Johann Haag

Danke für die Info,
ich mache das dann wohl am besten selbst.
Ich möchte erwähnen dass ich im Tiroler Unterland aktuelle Luftbilder zum 
Auflösen von Importadressen angewandt habe. Ich werde Luzandros Adressen 
entsprechend, in dieser Region in Gebäudepolygonen umsetzen. Ausserhalb des 
Bereiches aktueller Luftbilder wird es von meiner Seite künftig keine 
Adressarbeit mehr geben, ausgenommen hierbei lokales Wissen.
Grüsse

Von meinem iPhone gesendet

> Am 27.07.2019 um 21:57 schrieb Frederik Ramm :
> 
> Hallo,
> 
> der Wunsch von JH, die von ihm "ganz normal gemappten" Edits
> wiederzubekommen, ist verständlich und ich denke, das können wir auch
> umzusetzen versuchen. Ich kümmere mich darum, wenn ich von ihm
> entsprechende Infos bekomme (z.B. "alles Edits in St. Johann, die nicht
> Hausnummern betreffen" oder so). Der Revert war ja recht großzügig,
> vorallem halt, weil er die gleichen Accounts für Importe/mechanische
> Edits und für "normale" Edits genutzt hat.
> 
> Den beleidigenden Kommentar habe ich entfernt.
> 
> Bye
> Frederik
> 
> -- 
> Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"
> 
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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Kathleen Lu via talk

On the other hand, if the map of your area is completely blank, it looks
very daunting to a new mapper, who may be discouraged and abandon OSM
(either as too difficult to improve and as too poor quality to use).
The map is constantly changing because roads and other things on the map
are changing in the real world. A city might close off a road and then it
will become a "bad" street. It's easier to delete a bad street than to add
a bunch of streets, especially when you are surveying on foot and don't
have a mouse.
I personally would much rather have a 101% map than a 1% map.

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 9:21 AM Joseph Eisenberg 
wrote:

> Re: "OSM map with a one percent of roads is far worse than having 101%
> of the roads mapped with the help of AI with 1% of extras, because
> fixing that 1% is far less work than adding 99% by hand"
>
> I'm not certain this is true. It might be very difficult to find the
> 1% of incorrectly mapped roads; you don't know where to look, and you
> must survey on the ground with GPS, and check each road segment to
> find the 1% that actually are blocked by a fence or gate or don't
> really go through that clump of trees.
>
> In contrast, when 99% are missing it's very obvious when looking at
> the map data. You still have to survey and add the streets, but it may
> actually be faster to get to a complete map of your home neighborhood,
> than trying to find 10 bad streets out of 1000 segments in your
> neighborhood.
>
> Finally, when you look at the map and it looks 100% complete, you
> won't see the need to start mapping and become a totally addicted
> OSMer like you will if your village is only 1% mapped, so we may not
> get the new contributors that we need to actual maintain the data that
> our robot mappers have added.
>
> Joseph
>
> ___
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Demande de retours sur l'analyse Osmose d'intégration de la base Sirene

2019-07-29 Thread Frédéric Rodrigo

Le 29/07/2019 à 18:06, Christian Quest a écrit :

Le lun. 29 juil. 2019 à 16:07, Phyks > a écrit :

Salut Fred,

Quelques remontées de plus sur Sirene :

1. J'ai des entreprises radiées qui apparaissent. Par exemple,
https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133361229 mais qui a été
radiée en mars 2019 normalement :
https://www.societe.com/societe/les-p-tites-pupilles-789829991.html.
Peut être que ça vient des données sources qui ne sont pas assez
fraîches ceci dit.

Là aussi WARNING... l'INSEE diffuse désormais toutes les entreprise
(et leurs établissements), actifs ou non (radié, etc).
Je ne sais pas si l'analyse osmose prends bien ça en compte dans les
données source.

Pour le cas présent l'entreprise est toujours active d'après l'INSEE:
https://avis-situation-sirene.insee.fr/ListeSiretToEtab.action?form.siren=789829991=00015

Attention, radié d'un greffe ne veut pas dire que l'entreprise
n'existe plus, elle est peut être rattachée à un autre greffe ;)

Oui, c'est le bazar et difficile de s'y retrouver !

Normalement c'est bon. On ne garde que les etatAdministratifEtablissement=A

2. J'ai des rapprochements non faits liés au type de POI:
- https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133356361
annoté dans OSM
comme un shop=deli.

47.21Z, Commerce de détail de fruits et légumes en magasin spécialisé
non intégré

Ok. j'ajoute shop=deli

https://github.com/osm-fr/osmose-backend/blob/master/merge_data/shop_FR.mapping.json#L194

- https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133363991
annoté dans OSM
comme un amenity=restaurant.

Oui j'ai déjà vu le problème. Il faire comme si restaurant=fast_food

3. J'ai des hôtels qui apparaissent qui n'en sont pas (société
accolé à
un Airbnb ?), par exemple
https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133362002. Le site SIRENE

(https://avis-situation-sirene.insee.fr/ListeSiretToEtab.action?form.nic=00020=432216802)
donne un effectif nul. Peut être qu'on peut les filtrer comme ça ?

Il s'agit d'un entrepreneur individuel... à filtrer globalement de mon
point de vue car cela génère bien trop de bruit.

55.10Z, Hôtels et hébergement similaire non intégré

Ok à filtrer sur trancheEffectifs.

4. J'ai une agence de voyage qui est en fait le siège de MSC Croisière
(https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133364947). Pas trop
d'idées
pour filtrer ça, à part peut être en ayant des valeurs "typiques"
d'effectifs pour différents types de POIs (shop=travel_agency avec
> 100
personnes est sûrement louche).

Oui, je connais le problème. Mais vraiment d'idée pour filtrer ->
faux-positif

5. J'ai des sociétés qui ont été liquidées qui apparaissent
(https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133364905 par exemple, cf
https://www.societe.com/societe/croisiere-jaune-441382231.html), je ne
sais pas trop si ça peut être filtré.

C'est SIRENE qui n'est pas à jour... indiquée comme "actif"

6. social_facility=assisted_living devrait être en synonyme de
social_facility=group_home, cf
https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/3013339 et
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/83234566.

C'est ce que je vois de plus évident pour l'instant et responsable
d'une
bonne majorité de faux positifs. Je pourrais jeter un œil plus dans le
détail.

À ton avis pour tous les cas, c'est détaillé ?

https://github.com/osm-fr/osmose-backend/blob/master/merge_data/shop_FR.mapping.json#L863-L938

J'ai reporté les choses à modifier sur github :

https://github.com/osm-fr/osmose-backend/pull/338

Frédéric.

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Re: [OSM-ja] 京都でOSMお誕生日会を開きます

2019-07-29 Thread yasunari yamashita

山下です。皆さんこんにちわ。

今週末の開催となりました。

OpenStreetMap誕生日 前祝い会！
https://openstreetmap-kansai.connpass.com/event/135834/

みなさんのご参加をお待ちしています！

2019年6月28日(金) 22:22 K.Sakanoshita :
>
> 坂ノ下です。
>
> OpenStreetMapの誕生日は8/9と言うことで、毎年世界各地で
> お誕生日会が開かれているようですね。(OSM Wiki参照）
>
> ただ、日本ではあまりお誕生日会が開かれていない様なので、
> みんなでお祝いしたいと思います。15週年おめでとう！と。
>
> 今年の8/9は平日なので、8/4(日)に開催することにしました。
> 場所は内緒ですが、集合場所はJR京都北にあるローソンです。
>
> 詳細については、以下のサイトでご確認をお願いします。
>
> [OpenStreetMap誕生日 前祝い会！]
> https://openstreetmap-kansai.connpass.com/event/135834/
>
> それでは、みなさんのご参加をお待ちしています。
>
> --
> /*
>   * K.Sakanoshita (http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~saka/)
>   * (Phone) barsa...@gmail.com / (PC) s...@netfort.gr.jp
>   */
>
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-- 
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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Joseph Eisenberg

Re: "OSM map with a one percent of roads is far worse than having 101%
of the roads mapped with the help of AI with 1% of extras, because
fixing that 1% is far less work than adding 99% by hand"

I'm not certain this is true. It might be very difficult to find the
1% of incorrectly mapped roads; you don't know where to look, and you
must survey on the ground with GPS, and check each road segment to
find the 1% that actually are blocked by a fence or gate or don't
really go through that clump of trees.

In contrast, when 99% are missing it's very obvious when looking at
the map data. You still have to survey and add the streets, but it may
actually be faster to get to a complete map of your home neighborhood,
than trying to find 10 bad streets out of 1000 segments in your
neighborhood.

Finally, when you look at the map and it looks 100% complete, you
won't see the need to start mapping and become a totally addicted
OSMer like you will if your village is only 1% mapped, so we may not
get the new contributors that we need to actual maintain the data that
our robot mappers have added.

Joseph

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Re: [Talk-at] mapwith.ai

2019-07-29 Thread nine-osm . org-lists

vari...@mailbox.org wrote on 7/25/19 11:26 PM:
> Die Thailänder und die sind nicht sehr begeistert, wie es aussieht. 
> https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=66900 oder 
> https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=63456 und das liest sich 
> ziemlich fatal. 
> 
> Ich dachte mir erst in Thailand oder Afrika könnte ich mir das schon 
> vorstellen, wo die Ratio Mapper/"zu mappende Sachen" sehr groß ist, nach dem 
> lesen der Threads sieht das nicht so aus.
> 
> Sehr skeptisch.  

Danke fürs Teilen deiner Eindrücke!
LG
Erwin

>> nine-osm.org-li...@sunch.at hat am 25. Juli 2019 um 21:49 geschrieben:
>>
>>
>>
>> Hallo OSM Comunity,
>>
>> FB veröffentlicht AI unterstütztes Map-Tooling via https://mapwith.ai/
>> Heise schrieb gestern darüber:
>> https://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/Map-With-AI-Facebook-unterstuetzt-OpenStreetMap-Community-4478433.html
>>
>> Schon jemand Erfahrungen damit?
>>
>> LG
>> Erwin
>>
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Demande de retours sur l'analyse Osmose d'intégration de la base Sirene

Le lun. 29 juil. 2019 à 16:07, Phyks  a écrit :

> Salut Fred,
>
> Quelques remontées de plus sur Sirene :
>
> 1. J'ai des entreprises radiées qui apparaissent. Par exemple,
> https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133361229 mais qui a été
> radiée en mars 2019 normalement :
> https://www.societe.com/societe/les-p-tites-pupilles-789829991.html.
> Peut être que ça vient des données sources qui ne sont pas assez
> fraîches ceci dit.
>
>
Là aussi WARNING... l'INSEE diffuse désormais toutes les entreprise (et
leurs établissements), actifs ou non (radié, etc).
Je ne sais pas si l'analyse osmose prends bien ça en compte dans les
données source.

Pour le cas présent l'entreprise est toujours active d'après l'INSEE:
https://avis-situation-sirene.insee.fr/ListeSiretToEtab.action?form.siren=789829991=00015

Attention, radié d'un greffe ne veut pas dire que l'entreprise n'existe
plus, elle est peut être rattachée à un autre greffe ;)
Oui, c'est le bazar et difficile de s'y retrouver !

2. J'ai des rapprochements non faits liés au type de POI:
> - https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133356361 annoté
> dans OSM
> comme un shop=deli.
> - https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133363991 annoté
> dans OSM
> comme un amenity=restaurant.
>
> 3. J'ai des hôtels qui apparaissent qui n'en sont pas (société accolé à
> un Airbnb ?), par exemple
> https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133362002. Le site SIRENE
> (
> https://avis-situation-sirene.insee.fr/ListeSiretToEtab.action?form.nic=00020=432216802
> )
> donne un effectif nul. Peut être qu'on peut les filtrer comme ça ?
>
>
Il s'agit d'un entrepreneur individuel... à filtrer globalement de mon
point de vue car cela génère bien trop de bruit.


4. J'ai une agence de voyage qui est en fait le siège de MSC Croisière
> (https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133364947). Pas trop d'idées
> pour filtrer ça, à part peut être en ayant des valeurs "typiques"
> d'effectifs pour différents types de POIs (shop=travel_agency avec > 100
> personnes est sûrement louche).
>
> 5. J'ai des sociétés qui ont été liquidées qui apparaissent
> (https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133364905 par exemple, cf
> https://www.societe.com/societe/croisiere-jaune-441382231.html), je ne
> sais pas trop si ça peut être filtré.
>
>
C'est SIRENE qui n'est pas à jour... indiquée comme "actif"


6. social_facility=assisted_living devrait être en synonyme de
> social_facility=group_home, cf
> https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/3013339 et
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/83234566.
>
>
> C'est ce que je vois de plus évident pour l'instant et responsable d'une
> bonne majorité de faux positifs. Je pourrais jeter un œil plus dans le
> détail.
>
>
-- 
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Re: [Talk-br] Fazendo ilhas

2019-07-29 Thread Paulo Carvalho

Oi, Roberto, creio que tu precisas criar um polígono com furos
(multipolígono), em que os furos são as ilhas.

Na página abaixo há instruções de como estabelecer as relações entre as
linhas de forma a obter o efeito desejado:

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Relation:multipolygon

att,

Paulo Carvalho

Em seg, 29 de jul de 2019 às 10:09, Roberto Carlos Caleffi <
rccale...@gmail.com> escreveu:

> https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/0.2438/-61.7629  Era para aparecer
> ilhas fluviais aqui.
>
> Em seg, 29 de jul de 2019 às 08:06, Adriano Rosa 
> escreveu:
>
>> Manda link do local.
>>
>> Cordialmente,
>>
>> Adriano.
>>
>> _
>> Sempre tenha os seus arquivos quando você precisar deles com @Dropbox.
>> Conta
>> de 2GB é grátis!
>>
>> Acesse: http://db.tt/enaEb5F
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 8:53 AM Roberto Carlos Caleffi <
>> rccale...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Faço ilhas em um riverbank, mas ela não aparece depois de criada, mesma
>>> situação em áreas indígenas.
>>> Estou esquecendo algum comando, alguém me ajuda!
>>> ___
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>>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Yuri Astrakhan

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 6:19 AM Martin Koppenhoefer 
wrote:

> speaking about risks, having an incomplete network of verified, correct
> roads is probably more useful and less troublesome than an "overcomplete"
> one which also contains non-existent roads (e.g. waterways interpreted as
> roads) or shows connections that aren't there in reality.
>

I think this position should be a bit more nuanced.  Taken to absurdity,
OSM map with a one percent of roads is far worse than having 101% of the
roads mapped with the help of AI with 1% of extras, because fixing that 1%
is far less work than adding 99% by hand.  I'm sure we can find a good
balance between both positions.

Thx!
--Yuri
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Demande de retours sur l'analyse Osmose d'intégration de la base Sirene

2019-07-29 Thread Phyks

Salut Fred,

Quelques remontées de plus sur Sirene :

1. J'ai des entreprises radiées qui apparaissent. Par exemple,
https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133361229 mais qui a été
radiée en mars 2019 normalement :
https://www.societe.com/societe/les-p-tites-pupilles-789829991.html.
Peut être que ça vient des données sources qui ne sont pas assez
fraîches ceci dit.

2. J'ai des rapprochements non faits liés au type de POI:
- https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133356361 annoté dans OSM
comme un shop=deli.
- https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133363991 annoté dans OSM
comme un amenity=restaurant.

3. J'ai des hôtels qui apparaissent qui n'en sont pas (société accolé à
un Airbnb ?), par exemple
https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133362002. Le site SIRENE
(https://avis-situation-sirene.insee.fr/ListeSiretToEtab.action?form.nic=00020=432216802)
donne un effectif nul. Peut être qu'on peut les filtrer comme ça ?

4. J'ai une agence de voyage qui est en fait le siège de MSC Croisière
(https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133364947). Pas trop d'idées
pour filtrer ça, à part peut être en ayant des valeurs "typiques"
d'effectifs pour différents types de POIs (shop=travel_agency avec > 100
personnes est sûrement louche).

5. J'ai des sociétés qui ont été liquidées qui apparaissent
(https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/30133364905 par exemple, cf
https://www.societe.com/societe/croisiere-jaune-441382231.html), je ne
sais pas trop si ça peut être filtré.

6. social_facility=assisted_living devrait être en synonyme de
social_facility=group_home, cf
https://osmose.openstreetmap.fr/fr/error/3013339 et
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/83234566.


C'est ce que je vois de plus évident pour l'instant et responsable d'une
bonne majorité de faux positifs. Je pourrais jeter un œil plus dans le
détail.

Bonne journée,
-- 
Phyks

Le 21/07/2019 à 01:10, Frédéric Rodrigo a écrit :
> Le 20/07/2019 à 19:13, Phyks a écrit :
>> Salut,
>>
>> J'ai jeté un œil à Montrouge, il y avait pas mal de faux positifs,
>> principalement des entreprises individuelles positionnées sur
>> l'habitation du propriétaire
> 
> Pour l'instant il n'y a que quelque types d'activités pour les quelles
> les entreprises individuelles sont ignorées.
> 
> On peut le généraliser.
> 
> Des avis sur la question sont bien venu.
> 
> 
>> ou avec des tags proches non trouvés
>> (restaurants / bars notamment).
> 
> Il faut remonter ça pour améliorer le mapping, et avoir moins de faux
> positifs.
> 
> https://github.com/osm-fr/osmose-backend/blob/master/merge_data/shop_FR.mapping.json
> 
> 
> 
>> Il y a pas beaucoup de choses intéressantes une fois ceci filtré,
>> notamment pour les professions libérales (dentistes etc).
>>
>> Deux remarques sur la forme :
>>
>> * dans le frontend, le numéro SIRET est cliquable mais renvoie
>> systématiquement vers une page d'erreur. Ce n'est pas le plus pratique,
>> et j'avais toujours un autre onglet pour chercher les SIRET du coup.
> 
> Normalement c'est déjà corrigé depuis mercredi. Il peut en manquer mais
> ça en trouve aussi.
> 
> 
>> * serait-il possible de systématiquement afficher le nom de l'entreprise
>> dans les erreurs dans le frontend Osmose ? On pourrait économiser
>> quelques clics / recherches sur le SIRET comme ça.
> 
> Quand il y un nom c'est affiché.
> 
> 

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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread Silent Spike

I've seen a suggestion somewhere to contact amazon about the possibility of
running street imagery cameras. Would be a great way to get many local
details available for so-called armchair mappers.

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 2:14 PM Dave F via Talk-GB <
talk-gb@openstreetmap.org> wrote:

> It would be good if they could add address data. Probably not postcodes
> - I assume they're a customer of Royal Mail's PAF, but house numbers &
> names.
>
> DaveF
>
> On 29/07/2019 13:32, Gregory Marler wrote:
> > I've exchanged a number of messages with the Amazon mappers and their
> team
> > lead Jothirnadh. First of all, if anything isn't quite right then I would
> > encourage the person who spots it to...
> > a) contact the editor about it (or better if you post a comment on the
> > changeset)
> > b) add tags yourself to further clarify the way (OSM is a wiki).
> > c) a combination of the above.
> >
> > Amazon are using OpenStreetMap (great) and they are putting in some work
> to
> > improve it (great).
> > They've been a bit behind on widely communicating with the community, but
> > they are slowly getting better. They're also working in a number of
> > countries, where similar concerns are coming up, and they're replying in
> > similar ways. They are keen to learn and do better.
> >
> > Communication certainly helps people get better. Most (all?) of us have
> had
> > something we've learnt from other mappers. Often we don't know a tag is
> > used, or we don't know the map data is used in a certain way.
> >
> > Amazon obviously have their specific interests in mapping, but so do all
> of
> > us. You're unlikely to see me adding tags for voltage of an electricity
> > line, but you may see me add the pylon.
> >
> >
> > Happy mapping everyone,
> > Gregory.
>
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

It would be good if they could add address data. Probably not postcodes 
- I assume they're a customer of Royal Mail's PAF, but house numbers & 
names.


DaveF

On 29/07/2019 13:32, Gregory Marler wrote:

I've exchanged a number of messages with the Amazon mappers and their team
lead Jothirnadh. First of all, if anything isn't quite right then I would
encourage the person who spots it to...
a) contact the editor about it (or better if you post a comment on the
changeset)
b) add tags yourself to further clarify the way (OSM is a wiki).
c) a combination of the above.

Amazon are using OpenStreetMap (great) and they are putting in some work to
improve it (great).
They've been a bit behind on widely communicating with the community, but
they are slowly getting better. They're also working in a number of
countries, where similar concerns are coming up, and they're replying in
similar ways. They are keen to learn and do better.

Communication certainly helps people get better. Most (all?) of us have had
something we've learnt from other mappers. Often we don't know a tag is
used, or we don't know the map data is used in a certain way.

Amazon obviously have their specific interests in mapping, but so do all of
us. You're unlikely to see me adding tags for voltage of an electricity
line, but you may see me add the pylon.


Happy mapping everyone,
Gregory.



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Re: [Talk-br] Fazendo ilhas

2019-07-29 Thread Roberto Carlos Caleffi

https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/0.2438/-61.7629  Era para aparecer
ilhas fluviais aqui.

Em seg, 29 de jul de 2019 às 08:06, Adriano Rosa 
escreveu:

> Manda link do local.
>
> Cordialmente,
>
> Adriano.
>
> _
> Sempre tenha os seus arquivos quando você precisar deles com @Dropbox.
> Conta
> de 2GB é grátis!
>
> Acesse: http://db.tt/enaEb5F
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 8:53 AM Roberto Carlos Caleffi <
> rccale...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Faço ilhas em um riverbank, mas ela não aparece depois de criada, mesma
>> situação em áreas indígenas.
>> Estou esquecendo algum comando, alguém me ajuda!
>> ___
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>>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread Gregory Marler

I've exchanged a number of messages with the Amazon mappers and their team
lead Jothirnadh. First of all, if anything isn't quite right then I would
encourage the person who spots it to...
a) contact the editor about it (or better if you post a comment on the
changeset)
b) add tags yourself to further clarify the way (OSM is a wiki).
c) a combination of the above.

Amazon are using OpenStreetMap (great) and they are putting in some work to
improve it (great).
They've been a bit behind on widely communicating with the community, but
they are slowly getting better. They're also working in a number of
countries, where similar concerns are coming up, and they're replying in
similar ways. They are keen to learn and do better.

Communication certainly helps people get better. Most (all?) of us have had
something we've learnt from other mappers. Often we don't know a tag is
used, or we don't know the map data is used in a certain way.

Amazon obviously have their specific interests in mapping, but so do all of
us. You're unlikely to see me adding tags for voltage of an electricity
line, but you may see me add the pylon.


Happy mapping everyone,
Gregory.



On Mon, 29 Jul 2019 at 13:10, Dave F via Talk-GB 
wrote:

> I'm aware how construction sites work.
>
> Trades will occasionally have small items delivered, especially if
> specialized or in an emergency.  A foreman I know had his kid's
> Christmas present sent to site to keep the surprise.
>
> Please provide an OSM link to the site.
>
> DaveF
>
> On 29/07/2019 12:25, ael via Talk-GB wrote:
> > On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 11:39:11AM +0100, Dave F wrote:
> >> Construction areas aren't inaccessible. They have constant traffic of
> >> deliveries.
> > This construction area is inaccesible for anything but large specialist
> > vehicles with all-terrain tyres. The construction workers are all
> > instructed to ask visitors to leave. There are locked gates, only
> > unlocked for construction vehicles to get through. It is a Health and
> > Safety issue, I suspect, and probably required by their insurance
> > company.  No doubt there are deliveries to the peripheral areas, but
> > that is nearly always by specialist building supplies companies with
> > suitable vehicles. I spoke informally in context, so it seems a bit
> > picky to question this. The particular roads that they marked
> > (residential, as I recall) were at that time bare ground tracks, fenced
> > off and were being used for access to other parts by the construction
> > vehicles.  Those details could not be seen on the satelite imagery which
> > happened to have very recent updates in this area.  Later they will
> > presumably be surfaced and become proper roads: the developers gave me a
> > copy of their plans.  As I recall, they are now tagged corrected as
> > construction roads.  As far as I am concerned, I don't think an access
> > tag on construction roads makes sense in any normal situation.
> > Construction implies that the access will vary over time.
> >
> >> Please provide a link.
> > The link is my personal knowledge and my regular visits on bicycle with
> > gps. I occasionally do enter such areas to get a gps trace in advance of
> > the completion of the roads, but only with great care and caution, and
> > always leave if and when asked to do so. Sometimes site-managers give me
> > permission to collect a trace when I explain what I am doing.
> >
> > Are you telling me that Amazon have driven a large non-construction
> > vehicle on these unfinished roads with locked gates and construction
> > workers around in working hours?
> >
> > ael
> >
> >
> > ___
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>
>
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-- 
Gregory Marler
No More Grapes
07939 689 691
i...@nomoregrapes.com
http://www.nomoregrapes.com
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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

sent from a phone

> On 29. Jul 2019, at 13:58, Maurizio Napolitano  wrote:
> 
> Diciamo che le conseguenze che provocano avere un numero civico nel
> posto sbagliato o un dae che non si trova al suo posto hanno un peso
> molto diverso sulle cause che possono provocare.

io non ho mai capito perché si mettono i DAE, visto che nel caso avessi bisogno 
dovrebbe essere applicato entro 2 minuti. Quanti si devono mettere per averne a 
portata di mano entro 2 minuti?

Ciao Martin 
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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits


I'm aware how construction sites work.

Trades will occasionally have small items delivered, especially if 
specialized or in an emergency.  A foreman I know had his kid's 
Christmas present sent to site to keep the surprise.


Please provide an OSM link to the site.

DaveF

On 29/07/2019 12:25, ael via Talk-GB wrote:

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 11:39:11AM +0100, Dave F wrote:

Construction areas aren't inaccessible. They have constant traffic of
deliveries.

This construction area is inaccesible for anything but large specialist
vehicles with all-terrain tyres. The construction workers are all
instructed to ask visitors to leave. There are locked gates, only
unlocked for construction vehicles to get through. It is a Health and
Safety issue, I suspect, and probably required by their insurance
company.  No doubt there are deliveries to the peripheral areas, but
that is nearly always by specialist building supplies companies with
suitable vehicles. I spoke informally in context, so it seems a bit
picky to question this. The particular roads that they marked
(residential, as I recall) were at that time bare ground tracks, fenced
off and were being used for access to other parts by the construction
vehicles.  Those details could not be seen on the satelite imagery which
happened to have very recent updates in this area.  Later they will
presumably be surfaced and become proper roads: the developers gave me a
copy of their plans.  As I recall, they are now tagged corrected as
construction roads.  As far as I am concerned, I don't think an access
tag on construction roads makes sense in any normal situation.
Construction implies that the access will vary over time.


Please provide a link.

The link is my personal knowledge and my regular visits on bicycle with
gps. I occasionally do enter such areas to get a gps trace in advance of
the completion of the roads, but only with great care and caution, and
always leave if and when asked to do so. Sometimes site-managers give me
permission to collect a trace when I explain what I am doing.

Are you telling me that Amazon have driven a large non-construction
vehicle on these unfinished roads with locked gates and construction
workers around in working hours?

ael


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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Jóhannes Birgir Jensson

Now you are being obtuse.

29. júlí 2019 kl. 11:53, skrifaði "Nuno Caldeira" 
:
> I don't see the attribution on that map, or that website has an
> exception like Facebook seems to have too?
> 
> Oh it does attribute, but you have to scroll down to see it. must be a
> UX mistake...

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Re: [Talk-br] Fazendo ilhas

2019-07-29 Thread Adriano Rosa

Manda link do local.

Cordialmente,

Adriano.

_
Sempre tenha os seus arquivos quando você precisar deles com @Dropbox.
Conta
de 2GB é grátis!

Acesse: http://db.tt/enaEb5F

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 8:53 AM Roberto Carlos Caleffi 
wrote:

> Faço ilhas em um riverbank, mas ela não aparece depois de criada, mesma
> situação em áreas indígenas.
> Estou esquecendo algum comando, alguém me ajuda!
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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Maurizio Napolitano

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 1:53 PM Andreas Lattmann
 wrote:
>
> >Temo che la fatica improba di cui parli porti a non garantire
> >l'aggiornamento dei dati nel tempo :/
>
> Perché?
>
> Penso che una volta che hanno installato il DAE, rimanga li per qualche anno 
> (senza tener conto di atti vandalici, furti ecc.). Credo che sia meno oneroso 
> dell'inserimento dei numeri civici.
> Sbaglio?

Diciamo che le conseguenze che provocano avere un numero civico nel
posto sbagliato o un dae che non si trova al suo posto hanno un peso
molto diverso sulle cause che possono provocare.

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[Talk-br] Fazendo ilhas

2019-07-29 Thread Roberto Carlos Caleffi

Faço ilhas em um riverbank, mas ela não aparece depois de criada, mesma
situação em áreas indígenas.
Estou esquecendo algum comando, alguém me ajuda!
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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Andreas Lattmann

>Temo che la fatica improba di cui parli porti a non garantire
>l'aggiornamento dei dati nel tempo :/

Perché? 

Penso che una volta che hanno installato il DAE, rimanga li per qualche anno 
(senza tener conto di atti vandalici, furti ecc.). Credo che sia meno oneroso 
dell'inserimento dei numeri civici. 
Sbaglio? 


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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Nuno Caldeira



Às 11:02 de 29/07/2019, Naveen Francis escreveu:


On the rhetoric question:-
We are using OSM maps life savings projects. 
https://keralarescue.in/map/ . (2018 Kerala floods maps)

So both quantity and quality are equally important.

I don't see the attribution on that map, or that website has an 
exception like Facebook seems to have too?


Oh it does attribute, but you have to scroll down to see it. must be a 
UX mistake...



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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Maurizio Napolitano

> I DAE del mio Comune sono su entrambe le piattaforme, ma è una fatica
> improba.

Temo che la fatica improba di cui parli porti a non garantire
l'aggiornamento dei dati nel tempo :/

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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Andreas Lattmann

Spesso c'è bisogno di access e opening_hours (quando sono all'interno
>di
>locali non sempre aperti) e location, cioè la posizione esatta... una
>specie di description per trovarli rapidamente tipo "wall mounted,
>column,
>reception desk ecc
>

Di solito discrivo dov'è, inserendolo nel tag defibrillator:location=*, non ho 
verificato se esiste un defibrillator:location:it=* o 
defibrillator:location:en=*
Sapete se c'è? 
Grazie

Andreas

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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Cascafico Giovanni

Spesso c'è bisogno di access e opening_hours (quando sono all'interno di
locali non sempre aperti) e location, cioè la posizione esatta... una
specie di description per trovarli rapidamente tipo "wall mounted, column,
reception desk ecc

Il lun 29 lug 2019, 14:15 Francesco Ansanelli  ha
scritto:

> Buongiorno,
>
> nella mia zona ho visto che ne hanno installato alcuni in luoghi pubblici
> e inoltre messo il cartello DAE affisso all'ingresso di alcune scuole. Nel
> primo caso è utile la posizione esatta, ma temo che per le scuole: non
> essendo raggiungibile da chiunque (o utilizzabile quando sono chiuse) il
> dato sia meno importante. Forse c'è qualcosa da mettere a livello di
> Building?
> Inoltre lo stesso cartello esiste anche davanti alle ASL, cosa che mi
> sembra anche un po' scontata.
>
> Francesco
>
> Il lun 29 lug 2019, 11:09 Matteo Fortini  ha
> scritto:
>
>> Pensa che sono molto pignoli nelle richieste (almeno per quelli che sono
>> forniti da fonti "istituzionali"). C'è anche la possibilità per gli
>> utenti di segnalare, magari sono quelli che non sono precisi (anche se
>> non è scontato).
>>
>> Il 29/07/19 11:06, Andreas Lattmann ha scritto:
>> >> Bisognerebbe poi convincere chi ha dei db completi, come
>> >> https://www.118er.it/dae/dae.asp, ad aprirli. Ci ho provato qualche
>> >> volta, senza successo.
>> >>
>> > Anche se nella mia zona ho visto che non sono posizionati
>> correttamente, non sarebbe male sapere da che fonte hanno preso i dati e
>> chiederne la liberazione.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Il 29 luglio 2019 10:59:42 CEST, Matteo Fortini <
>> matteo.fort...@gmail.com> ha scritto:
>> >> Bisognerebbe poi convincere chi ha dei db completi, come
>> >> https://www.118er.it/dae/dae.asp, ad aprirli. Ci ho provato qualche
>> >> volta, senza successo.
>> >>
>> >> I DAE del mio Comune sono su entrambe le piattaforme, ma è una fatica
>> >> improba.
>> >>
>> >> Il 29/07/19 09:29, Damjan Gerl ha scritto:
>> >>> Certamente da mappare, da usare il tag:
>> >>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:emergency%3Ddefibrillator
>> >>>
>> >>> In Italia ce ne sono 1564 già mappati:
>> >>> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/L8N
>> >>>
>> >>> Ciao
>> >>> Damjan
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> -- Original Header ---
>> >>>
>> >>>   From  : "Lorenzo Rolla" rolla.l...@gmail.com
>> >>> To  : "openstreetmap list - italiano"
>> >> talk-it@openstreetmap.org
>> >>> Cc  :
>> >>> Date  : Mon, 29 Jul 2019 08:59:13 +0200
>> >>> Subject : [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori
>> >>>
>>  Gentilissimi, riteniamo che sia giovevole inserire sulle mappe
>> >> l'esatta
>>  ubicazione dei defibrillatori? Il mio auspicio nasce dalla lettura
>> >> di
>>  questo disegno di legge:
>> 
>> 
>> >>
>> http://documenti.camera.it/leg18/pdl/pdf/leg.18.pdl.camera.181_A.18PDL0069760.pdf
>>  Lieto di leggere le vostre considerazioni. Lorenzo
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>  --
>>  Lorenzo Rolla
>> 
>> >>> ___
>> >>> Talk-it mailing list
>> >>> Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
>> >>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
>> >>
>> >> ___
>> >> Talk-it mailing list
>> >> Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
>> >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
>> > --
>> > 樂
>> >
>> > ___
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>>
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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Francesco Ansanelli

Buongiorno,

nella mia zona ho visto che ne hanno installato alcuni in luoghi pubblici e
inoltre messo il cartello DAE affisso all'ingresso di alcune scuole. Nel
primo caso è utile la posizione esatta, ma temo che per le scuole: non
essendo raggiungibile da chiunque (o utilizzabile quando sono chiuse) il
dato sia meno importante. Forse c'è qualcosa da mettere a livello di
Building?
Inoltre lo stesso cartello esiste anche davanti alle ASL, cosa che mi
sembra anche un po' scontata.

Francesco

Il lun 29 lug 2019, 11:09 Matteo Fortini  ha
scritto:

> Pensa che sono molto pignoli nelle richieste (almeno per quelli che sono
> forniti da fonti "istituzionali"). C'è anche la possibilità per gli
> utenti di segnalare, magari sono quelli che non sono precisi (anche se
> non è scontato).
>
> Il 29/07/19 11:06, Andreas Lattmann ha scritto:
> >> Bisognerebbe poi convincere chi ha dei db completi, come
> >> https://www.118er.it/dae/dae.asp, ad aprirli. Ci ho provato qualche
> >> volta, senza successo.
> >>
> > Anche se nella mia zona ho visto che non sono posizionati correttamente,
> non sarebbe male sapere da che fonte hanno preso i dati e chiederne la
> liberazione.
> >
> >
> >
> > Il 29 luglio 2019 10:59:42 CEST, Matteo Fortini <
> matteo.fort...@gmail.com> ha scritto:
> >> Bisognerebbe poi convincere chi ha dei db completi, come
> >> https://www.118er.it/dae/dae.asp, ad aprirli. Ci ho provato qualche
> >> volta, senza successo.
> >>
> >> I DAE del mio Comune sono su entrambe le piattaforme, ma è una fatica
> >> improba.
> >>
> >> Il 29/07/19 09:29, Damjan Gerl ha scritto:
> >>> Certamente da mappare, da usare il tag:
> >>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:emergency%3Ddefibrillator
> >>>
> >>> In Italia ce ne sono 1564 già mappati:
> >>> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/L8N
> >>>
> >>> Ciao
> >>> Damjan
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -- Original Header ---
> >>>
> >>>   From  : "Lorenzo Rolla" rolla.l...@gmail.com
> >>> To  : "openstreetmap list - italiano"
> >> talk-it@openstreetmap.org
> >>> Cc  :
> >>> Date  : Mon, 29 Jul 2019 08:59:13 +0200
> >>> Subject : [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori
> >>>
>  Gentilissimi, riteniamo che sia giovevole inserire sulle mappe
> >> l'esatta
>  ubicazione dei defibrillatori? Il mio auspicio nasce dalla lettura
> >> di
>  questo disegno di legge:
> 
> 
> >>
> http://documenti.camera.it/leg18/pdl/pdf/leg.18.pdl.camera.181_A.18PDL0069760.pdf
>  Lieto di leggere le vostre considerazioni. Lorenzo
> 
> 
> 
>  --
>  Lorenzo Rolla
> 
> >>> ___
> >>> Talk-it mailing list
> >>> Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
> >>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Talk-it mailing list
> >> Talk-it@openstreetmap.org
> >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
> > --
> > 樂
> >
> > ___
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> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
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>
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Carte des limites de vitesseq

2019-07-29 Thread Eric SIBERT


Le 29/07/2019 à 10:45, Christian Quest a écrit :

HTTPS même 503 pour moi... le service ne semble plus opérationnel... :(


Je pense qu'ils ont laissé tombé. Déjà, avant, ça ramait. Ça ne doit 
plus faire partie de leur business model.


Eric



 > itoworld fournissait des cartes thématiques des données OSM dont la
 > carte des limites de vitesse : http://product.itoworld.com/map/124
 >
 > Un service alternatif?


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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread Martin Wynne


On 29/07/2019 09:35, Andy Robinson wrote:

I've just looked at a number of Amazon Logistics in my local area. A lot of
service roads are getting added which on face value look perhaps to be
driveways but that tag hasn't been added.


Amazon have been asking for help with this, see:

 https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/jguthula/diary/390322

Martin.

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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Frederik Ramm

Hi,

On 29.07.19 11:57, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> Almost a week has passed by. Have their been attempts by the board or a
> working group to get rectifications of the media outlets in order to
> make clear that there is no collaboration between OSM and Facebook for
> this ai project?

The board has neither discussed this nor taken any further steps. I
don't know if any working group has.

Bye
Frederik

-- 
Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"

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Re: [OSM-talk] [Tagging] Specific tag for Satellite Dishes

2019-07-29 Thread Jean-Marc Liotier

On Mon, July 29, 2019 7:03 am, Enock Seth Nyamador wrote:
> I am looking for specific tags for Satellite Dish [1]. I haven't found
> anything near so far. May be am missing something, else it doesn't exist
> and might be useful to propose and come handy in some cases.

Prior discussion about that:
http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.com/quot-satellit-quot-td5934448.html -
inconclusive because there is no consensus about granularity

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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] data Office National des Forêts et OSM

2019-07-29 Thread Jérôme Amagat

Bonjour,
J'avais regardé un peu il y a pas mal de temps et ce n'est pas si simple à
intégré.
Les noms sont ils vraiment des noms. "forêt communale de Machin" est ce que
c'est un nom? pour moi, non. Pour les forets domaniales, vers chez moi oui
mais est ce le cas partout?
Quel tag utilisé? Il y a bien sur landuse=forêt mais que faire lorsqu'il y
a une clairière ou une partie de la "forêt" où il n'y a pas d'arbre?
comment faire lorsque l'on veux séparer plusieurs parties de la forêt avec
leaf_cycle=*?
il y a le tag boundary=protected_area (
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:boundary%3Dprotected_area) mais ces
forêts ne sont pas vraiment protégé?
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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

Construction areas aren't inaccessible. They have constant traffic of 
deliveries.

Please provide a link.

DaveF

On 29/07/2019 11:21, ael wrote:

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 09:42:27AM +0100, Dan S wrote:

"stinks of armchair mapping" - that sounds rather derogatory. My
understanding is that these are organised edits informed in
significant part by Amazon's own GPS logs from their delivery staff.

In the case that I mentioned, it was certainly not from their own GPS
logs. The construction area was inaccesible, even on a bicycle. It
was definitely armchair mapping.

ael


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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits


Andy

There is nothing wrong with adding just highway=service.

If you know that the OSM database can be improved by adding additional 
tags, then do so. (Although I note you're not too sure, yourself)


As I understand it Amazon have gpx traces from their delivery vehicles 
along roads which the general public have little or no access to. Their 
mappers having been adding good detail


Of course, they make mistakes; who doesn't. If you spot any please 
rectify or contact the mapper. I've had good feedback from them.


From the evidence I've no "concerns".

DaveF

On 29/07/2019 09:35, Andy Robinson wrote:

I've just looked at a number of Amazon Logistics in my local area. A lot of
service roads are getting added which on face value look perhaps to be
driveways but that tag hasn't been added. Just stinks of armchair mapping.
The users (three I spotted off the bat) all have the following   "I work for
Amazon Logistics. At Amazon Logistics, we've been utilizing OSM in some
cases related to our delivery programs. In connection with those delivery
programs, we have collected information that we think is valuable to the OSM
community such as names and info about new roads that are not currently in
the map today, new data on turn restrictions, and road connectivity, to name
a few. When we hear feedback, we've been editing to provide that information
for the benefit of the entire OSM user community. If you have more
questions, please contact osm-edit-escalati...@amazon.com" in their username
profiles but there is no link to what's really going on and what the basis
of the edits are.

Anyone else have concerns over benefits?

Cheers
Andy


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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread Dan S

Op ma 29 jul. 2019 om 11:22 schreef ael :
>
> On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 09:42:27AM +0100, Dan S wrote:
> > "stinks of armchair mapping" - that sounds rather derogatory. My
> > understanding is that these are organised edits informed in
> > significant part by Amazon's own GPS logs from their delivery staff.
>
> In the case that I mentioned, it was certainly not from their own GPS
> logs. The construction area was inaccesible, even on a bicycle. It
> was definitely armchair mapping.

That's useful to know, thanks

Dan

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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread ael

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 09:42:27AM +0100, Dan S wrote:
> "stinks of armchair mapping" - that sounds rather derogatory. My
> understanding is that these are organised edits informed in
> significant part by Amazon's own GPS logs from their delivery staff.

In the case that I mentioned, it was certainly not from their own GPS
logs. The construction area was inaccesible, even on a bicycle. It
was definitely armchair mapping.

ael

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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread ael

On Mon, Jul 29, 2019 at 09:35:36AM +0100, Andy Robinson wrote:
> I've just looked at a number of Amazon Logistics in my local area. A lot of
> service roads are getting added which on face value look perhaps to be
>  [snip]
> Anyone else have concerns over benefits?

I noticed a similar problem in a area that I regularly survey. I
contacted them and someone else from Amazon logistics replied
and corrected the mistakes.

Had the original Amazon armchair mapper looked at the history and the source
tags, he/she should have realized that the area was being actively
mapped with regular gps surveys.

Sadly, it is not only Amazon armchair mappers who neglect to do basic checks
before changing things.

So, yes, I have some concerns. But maybe they are doing useful work in
area without local mappers. Perhaps they should be encouraged to be more
careful?

ael

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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

Am Mo., 29. Juli 2019 um 12:05 Uhr schrieb Naveen Francis <
navee...@wikimedia.in>:

> We are using OSM maps life savings projects. https://keralarescue.in/map/ .
> (2018 Kerala floods maps)
> So both quantity and quality are equally important.
>


speaking about risks, having an incomplete network of verified, correct
roads is probably more useful and less troublesome than an "overcomplete"
one which also contains non-existent roads (e.g. waterways interpreted as
roads) or shows connections that aren't there in reality.

Cheers,
Martin
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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Naveen Francis

Thanks Simon for the caution.

Taking the of help AI doesn't mean that we do comprise on the quality.

All the methods for initial road tracing, GPS tracing, Satellite image
tracing or AI-assisted human mapping (which I have tried) has limitations.

On Indian roads, we try to document as much as possible so that we don't
make errors.  

On the rhetoric question:-
We are using OSM maps life savings projects. https://keralarescue.in/map/ .
(2018 Kerala floods maps)
So both quantity and quality are equally important.

Another good thing is we have already implemented your suggestion -
sensible comparison would be completeness measures per road categories

Categories wise completeness
NH : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/India:National_Highways_(statewise)
SH:- https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/India:Roads#State_highways

All the best for fixing Tiger imports.

thanks,
naveenpf


On Sat, Jul 27, 2019 at 4:15 PM Simon Poole  wrote:

>
> Am 26.07.2019 um 19:30 schrieb Naveen Francis:
>
> Including my ₹ 0.10 (Indian ten paisa)
>
> Echoes same thoughts of Brazilian Real.
>
> AI-assisted human mapping tools will be a good aid for the OSM community.
>
> "Map faster, Map better".
>
> 40,00,000 kms to be mapped in India.
> 15 years of OSM mapped 18,00,000 kms.
>
> The (rhetoric) question is, why is this the case?
>
> Because the community in India is still very small relative to the
> population size.
>
> So from where will the additional contributors come from that will turn
> the additional 4 million road geometries in to something really useful?
> There is a real danger of the desire for "completeness" instead of quality
> resulting in multiple TIGER 2.0s, and we are just now slowly working
> ourselves out of the hole we dug (full of good intentions) with the
> original.
>
> Note on the side: outside of raw total  road length, a much more sensible
> comparison would be completeness measures per road categories (which I
> suspect is likely to look far less dramatic) and which might give more
> realistic goals for the community.
>
> Simon
>
>
> thanks,
> naveenpf
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 26, 2019 at 4:42 AM Sérgio V.  wrote:
>
>> Just adding my R$0,02 (Brazilian Real).
>> I guess soon the AI assisted Human mapping will happen, it may be a very
>> good help.
>> But I can't evaluate what's been publicized July 23, 2019 by
>>
>> https://ai.facebook.com/blog/mapping-roads-through-deep-learning-and-weakly-supervised-training
>> "To browse our machine learning road predictions or start mapping with
>> RapiD, please visit mapwith.ai."
>> So at "Map faster, Map better" https://mapwith.ai/#14/6.13864/6.7698 ,
>> I actually can't evaluate any result for roads at max zoom level 14, to
>> see if it's really better. I can just believe it can be.
>>
>> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>>
>> Sérgio - http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/smaprs
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>>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

Am Do., 25. Juli 2019 um 22:06 Uhr schrieb Frederik Ramm <
frede...@remote.org>:

> Hi,
>
> On 7/25/19 17:05, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> > so it is an official OpenStreetMap effort, the OpenStreetMap-Foundation
> > is involved, and this is their statement? This is the impression I would
> > get from reading this paragraph without background information.
>
> No it is not. This press release is on the same level as "Cloudmade's
> OpenStreetMap Project" so many years ago. It would be nice if our
> communications working group had the capacity of rectifying such
> misinformation, or if companies could simply treat us more fairly in
> their never-ending quest for attention,
>


Almost a week has passed by. Have their been attempts by the board or a
working group to get rectifications of the media outlets in order to make
clear that there is no collaboration between OSM and Facebook for this ai
project?

Cheers,
Martin
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Re: [talk-cz] Strava heatmap CZ

2019-07-29 Thread majkaz

Dovoluji si zároveň upozornit na to, že v "cyklo" vrstvě, a tedy i v té "hot" 
začínají přibývat neexistující cesty tam, kde se prohání jezdci na horských 
kolech a kde vytváří segmenty, případně kde se opakovaně projíždí někdo takový, 
co to na Stravu nahrává. Část z toho v terénu v podstatě nemá žádnou stopu - 
jde to jednorázově přes louku nebo pole kolejemi vyjetými od traktoru (za rok 
bude jinde), případně tak zarostlými pěšinami, že po nich zůstávají hodně 
mizivé stopy, nebo po kraji louky, kde žádná pěšina není.
Bohužel se nám tyhle neexistující cesty začínají objevovat v mapě jako track. 
"Svítivost" cesty ve Strava heatmap opravdu ještě neznamená, že tam nějaká 
významná cesta / pěšina opravdu existuje.

Majka
__
> Od: "Tom Ka" 
> Komu: "OpenStreetMap Czech Republic" 
> Datum: 29.07.2019 11:20
> Předmět: Re: [talk-cz] Strava heatmap CZ
>
>Ahoj,
>
>viz. diskuze pri vytvareni vrstvy zde - https://openstreetmap.cz/talkcz/c2551
>
>To co chces je trochu problem, protoze bud tam nebudou zimni veci, coz
>je nekde asi blby, nebo by to musely byt ALL, run, ride, winter (vodni
>asi nevadi) a to uz je fakt hodne. To by byla aktualizace tak jednou
>za rok a i na prostor bych s tim mozna zacal bojovat.

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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread Jez Nicholson

This can be where having the OSMUK organisation comes in useful. It gives a
focal point to discuss organisation to organisation. We will continue to
open a channel of communication.

Personally, I'm excited that Amazon are both users of, and contributing
back to OSM. As long as they behave as a good citizen.

- Jez

On Mon, 29 Jul 2019 10:29 Gareth L,  wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Amazon are indeed adding service roads at quite a pace, although with gps
> from their drivers and aerial imagery to support.
> As noted here
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2019-July/023252.html they
> are responding and soliciting to community feedback on their tagging, which
> I consider quite responsible.
>
> Driveways are a refinement of highway=service, so tagging it as highway
> service strikes me as a decent start to incrementing the detail of the map.
> So far I’ve only seen them add missing ways rather than alter existing
> ones, or revert some tagging they did on the ways they created following
> community feedback.
>
> I agree with you, Andy, that their user profile boilerplate messages could
> be more helpful. An email address isn’t the most transparent way of seeing
> what concerns are being raised.
>
> Gareth
>
> On 29 Jul 2019, at 09:43, Dan S  wrote:
>
> "stinks of armchair mapping" - that sounds rather derogatory. My
> understanding is that these are organised edits informed in
> significant part by Amazon's own GPS logs from their delivery staff.
> (Am I misunderstanding?) If so, referring to it as "armchair" is
> irrelevant; either way, referring to it as "stinks" is just not very
> nice. If they should be adding driveway tags then how about emailing
> their nominated contact address and teaching them the good ways?
>
> Best
> Dan
>
> Op ma 29 jul. 2019 om 09:37 schreef Andy Robinson :
>
>
> I've just looked at a number of Amazon Logistics in my local area. A lot of
>
> service roads are getting added which on face value look perhaps to be
>
> driveways but that tag hasn't been added. Just stinks of armchair mapping.
>
> The users (three I spotted off the bat) all have the following   "I work
> for
>
> Amazon Logistics. At Amazon Logistics, we've been utilizing OSM in some
>
> cases related to our delivery programs. In connection with those delivery
>
> programs, we have collected information that we think is valuable to the
> OSM
>
> community such as names and info about new roads that are not currently in
>
> the map today, new data on turn restrictions, and road connectivity, to
> name
>
> a few. When we hear feedback, we've been editing to provide that
> information
>
> for the benefit of the entire OSM user community. If you have more
>
> questions, please contact osm-edit-escalati...@amazon.com" in their
> username
>
> profiles but there is no link to what's really going on and what the basis
>
> of the edits are.
>
>
> Anyone else have concerns over benefits?
>
>
> Cheers
>
> Andy
>
>
>
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>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread Gareth L

Hello,

Amazon are indeed adding service roads at quite a pace, although with gps from 
their drivers and aerial imagery to support.
As noted here 
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2019-July/023252.html they 
are responding and soliciting to community feedback on their tagging, which I 
consider quite responsible.

Driveways are a refinement of highway=service, so tagging it as highway service 
strikes me as a decent start to incrementing the detail of the map. So far I’ve 
only seen them add missing ways rather than alter existing ones, or revert some 
tagging they did on the ways they created following community feedback.

I agree with you, Andy, that their user profile boilerplate messages could be 
more helpful. An email address isn’t the most transparent way of seeing what 
concerns are being raised.

Gareth

On 29 Jul 2019, at 09:43, Dan S 
mailto:danstowell+...@gmail.com>> wrote:

"stinks of armchair mapping" - that sounds rather derogatory. My
understanding is that these are organised edits informed in
significant part by Amazon's own GPS logs from their delivery staff.
(Am I misunderstanding?) If so, referring to it as "armchair" is
irrelevant; either way, referring to it as "stinks" is just not very
nice. If they should be adding driveway tags then how about emailing
their nominated contact address and teaching them the good ways?

Best
Dan

Op ma 29 jul. 2019 om 09:37 schreef Andy Robinson 
mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com>>:

I've just looked at a number of Amazon Logistics in my local area. A lot of
service roads are getting added which on face value look perhaps to be
driveways but that tag hasn't been added. Just stinks of armchair mapping.
The users (three I spotted off the bat) all have the following   "I work for
Amazon Logistics. At Amazon Logistics, we've been utilizing OSM in some
cases related to our delivery programs. In connection with those delivery
programs, we have collected information that we think is valuable to the OSM
community such as names and info about new roads that are not currently in
the map today, new data on turn restrictions, and road connectivity, to name
a few. When we hear feedback, we've been editing to provide that information
for the benefit of the entire OSM user community. If you have more
questions, please contact 
osm-edit-escalati...@amazon.com" in 
their username
profiles but there is no link to what's really going on and what the basis
of the edits are.

Anyone else have concerns over benefits?

Cheers
Andy


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Re: [talk-cz] Strava heatmap CZ

2019-07-29 Thread Tom Ka

Ahoj,

viz. diskuze pri vytvareni vrstvy zde - https://openstreetmap.cz/talkcz/c2551

To co chces je trochu problem, protoze bud tam nebudou zimni veci, coz
je nekde asi blby, nebo by to musely byt ALL, run, ride, winter (vodni
asi nevadi) a to uz je fakt hodne. To by byla aktualizace tak jednou
za rok a i na prostor bych s tim mozna zacal bojovat.

Barvy jsou dane tim, jak to strava udela, ja to nijak neupravuju a asi
ani rozumne nemuzu, takze by byly vsechny stejnou barvou (barevnym
schematem).

Bye

po 29. 7. 2019 v 10:44 odesílatel Petr Schönmann  napsal:
>
> Ahoj,
> Je rozdělena strava heatmapa i na kolo a beh, nebo existuje pouze vrstva all? 
> Osobně bych uvítal rozdělení a kazdou jinou barvickou.
>
> Dne po 29. 7. 2019 7:34 uživatel Tom Ka  napsal:
>>
>> Ahoj, udelal jsem aktualizaci kopie Strava heatmap pro CZ z 05.2019 na 
>> 07.2019.
>>
>> Bye
>>
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>
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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Matteo Fortini

Pensa che sono molto pignoli nelle richieste (almeno per quelli che sono 
forniti da fonti "istituzionali"). C'è anche la possibilità per gli 
utenti di segnalare, magari sono quelli che non sono precisi (anche se 
non è scontato).


Il 29/07/19 11:06, Andreas Lattmann ha scritto:

Bisognerebbe poi convincere chi ha dei db completi, come
https://www.118er.it/dae/dae.asp, ad aprirli. Ci ho provato qualche
volta, senza successo.


Anche se nella mia zona ho visto che non sono posizionati correttamente, non 
sarebbe male sapere da che fonte hanno preso i dati e chiederne la liberazione.



Il 29 luglio 2019 10:59:42 CEST, Matteo Fortini  ha 
scritto:

Bisognerebbe poi convincere chi ha dei db completi, come
https://www.118er.it/dae/dae.asp, ad aprirli. Ci ho provato qualche
volta, senza successo.

I DAE del mio Comune sono su entrambe le piattaforme, ma è una fatica
improba.

Il 29/07/19 09:29, Damjan Gerl ha scritto:

Certamente da mappare, da usare il tag:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:emergency%3Ddefibrillator

In Italia ce ne sono 1564 già mappati:
https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/L8N

Ciao
Damjan



-- Original Header ---

  From  : "Lorenzo Rolla" rolla.l...@gmail.com
To  : "openstreetmap list - italiano"

talk-it@openstreetmap.org

Cc  :
Date  : Mon, 29 Jul 2019 08:59:13 +0200
Subject : [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori


Gentilissimi, riteniamo che sia giovevole inserire sulle mappe

l'esatta

ubicazione dei defibrillatori? Il mio auspicio nasce dalla lettura

di

questo disegno di legge:



http://documenti.camera.it/leg18/pdl/pdf/leg.18.pdl.camera.181_A.18PDL0069760.pdf

Lieto di leggere le vostre considerazioni. Lorenzo



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樂

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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Andreas Lattmann

>Bisognerebbe poi convincere chi ha dei db completi, come 
>https://www.118er.it/dae/dae.asp, ad aprirli. Ci ho provato qualche 
>volta, senza successo.
>

Anche se nella mia zona ho visto che non sono posizionati correttamente, non 
sarebbe male sapere da che fonte hanno preso i dati e chiederne la liberazione.



Il 29 luglio 2019 10:59:42 CEST, Matteo Fortini  ha 
scritto:
>Bisognerebbe poi convincere chi ha dei db completi, come 
>https://www.118er.it/dae/dae.asp, ad aprirli. Ci ho provato qualche 
>volta, senza successo.
>
>I DAE del mio Comune sono su entrambe le piattaforme, ma è una fatica 
>improba.
>
>Il 29/07/19 09:29, Damjan Gerl ha scritto:
>> Certamente da mappare, da usare il tag:
>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:emergency%3Ddefibrillator
>>
>> In Italia ce ne sono 1564 già mappati:
>> https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/L8N
>>
>> Ciao
>> Damjan
>>
>>
>>
>> -- Original Header ---
>>
>>  From  : "Lorenzo Rolla" rolla.l...@gmail.com
>> To  : "openstreetmap list - italiano"
>talk-it@openstreetmap.org
>> Cc  :
>> Date  : Mon, 29 Jul 2019 08:59:13 +0200
>> Subject : [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori
>>
>>> Gentilissimi, riteniamo che sia giovevole inserire sulle mappe
>l'esatta
>>> ubicazione dei defibrillatori? Il mio auspicio nasce dalla lettura
>di
>>> questo disegno di legge:
>>>
>>>
>http://documenti.camera.it/leg18/pdl/pdf/leg.18.pdl.camera.181_A.18PDL0069760.pdf
>>>
>>> Lieto di leggere le vostre considerazioni. Lorenzo
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Lorenzo Rolla
>>>
>> ___
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Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Matteo Fortini

Bisognerebbe poi convincere chi ha dei db completi, come 
https://www.118er.it/dae/dae.asp, ad aprirli. Ci ho provato qualche 
volta, senza successo.


I DAE del mio Comune sono su entrambe le piattaforme, ma è una fatica 
improba.


Il 29/07/19 09:29, Damjan Gerl ha scritto:

Certamente da mappare, da usare il tag:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:emergency%3Ddefibrillator

In Italia ce ne sono 1564 già mappati:
https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/L8N

Ciao
Damjan



-- Original Header ---

 From  : "Lorenzo Rolla" rolla.l...@gmail.com
To  : "openstreetmap list - italiano" talk-it@openstreetmap.org
Cc  :
Date  : Mon, 29 Jul 2019 08:59:13 +0200
Subject : [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori


Gentilissimi, riteniamo che sia giovevole inserire sulle mappe l'esatta
ubicazione dei defibrillatori? Il mio auspicio nasce dalla lettura di
questo disegno di legge:

http://documenti.camera.it/leg18/pdl/pdf/leg.18.pdl.camera.181_A.18PDL0069760.pdf

Lieto di leggere le vostre considerazioni. Lorenzo



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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Carte des limites de vitesseq

HTTPS même 503 pour moi... le service ne semble plus opérationnel... :(

Le sam. 27 juil. 2019 à 22:18,  a écrit :

> > Von: "Eric SIBERT - courr...@eric.sibert.fr"
> > An: talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
> > Betreff: [OSM-talk-fr] Carte des limites de vitesse
> >
> > Bonsoir,
> >
> > Je continue avec mes questions...
> >
> > itoworld fournissait des cartes thématiques des données OSM dont la
> > carte des limites de vitesse : http://product.itoworld.com/map/124
> >
> > Un service alternatif?
> Tu as essayé en https ?
> Avec JOSM tu peux choisir un coloriage (une feuille de style) mettant en
> valeur les limites de vitesses.
> Suivant ton besoin ça peut être une alternative.
>
> Jean-Yvon
>
>
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Re: [talk-cz] Strava heatmap CZ

2019-07-29 Thread Petr Schönmann

Ahoj,
Je rozdělena strava heatmapa i na kolo a beh, nebo existuje pouze vrstva
all? Osobně bych uvítal rozdělení a kazdou jinou barvickou.

Dne po 29. 7. 2019 7:34 uživatel Tom Ka  napsal:

> Ahoj, udelal jsem aktualizaci kopie Strava heatmap pro CZ z 05.2019 na
> 07.2019.
>
> Bye
>
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Re: [Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread Dan S

"stinks of armchair mapping" - that sounds rather derogatory. My
understanding is that these are organised edits informed in
significant part by Amazon's own GPS logs from their delivery staff.
(Am I misunderstanding?) If so, referring to it as "armchair" is
irrelevant; either way, referring to it as "stinks" is just not very
nice. If they should be adding driveway tags then how about emailing
their nominated contact address and teaching them the good ways?

Best
Dan

Op ma 29 jul. 2019 om 09:37 schreef Andy Robinson :
>
> I've just looked at a number of Amazon Logistics in my local area. A lot of
> service roads are getting added which on face value look perhaps to be
> driveways but that tag hasn't been added. Just stinks of armchair mapping.
> The users (three I spotted off the bat) all have the following   "I work for
> Amazon Logistics. At Amazon Logistics, we've been utilizing OSM in some
> cases related to our delivery programs. In connection with those delivery
> programs, we have collected information that we think is valuable to the OSM
> community such as names and info about new roads that are not currently in
> the map today, new data on turn restrictions, and road connectivity, to name
> a few. When we hear feedback, we've been editing to provide that information
> for the benefit of the entire OSM user community. If you have more
> questions, please contact osm-edit-escalati...@amazon.com" in their username
> profiles but there is no link to what's really going on and what the basis
> of the edits are.
>
> Anyone else have concerns over benefits?
>
> Cheers
> Andy
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Michael Kugelmann


Am 25.07.2019 um 11:36 schrieb Florian Lohoff:

And IIRC it was about a
collaboration with the local community in Thailand which their first aim
was.

I just remember that the "collaboration" in Thailand some time ago
(might be years) was quite poor: by using AI generated data simply
thrown into the database they destroyed a lot of craft-mapped data. But
unfortunately I am not aware how this evolved and about the current
situation. That's the background why I would be very cautious about such
"collaboration statements".


BR,
Michael.


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[Talk-GB] Amazon Logistics edits

2019-07-29 Thread Andy Robinson

I've just looked at a number of Amazon Logistics in my local area. A lot of
service roads are getting added which on face value look perhaps to be
driveways but that tag hasn't been added. Just stinks of armchair mapping.
The users (three I spotted off the bat) all have the following   "I work for
Amazon Logistics. At Amazon Logistics, we've been utilizing OSM in some
cases related to our delivery programs. In connection with those delivery
programs, we have collected information that we think is valuable to the OSM
community such as names and info about new roads that are not currently in
the map today, new data on turn restrictions, and road connectivity, to name
a few. When we hear feedback, we've been editing to provide that information
for the benefit of the entire OSM user community. If you have more
questions, please contact osm-edit-escalati...@amazon.com" in their username
profiles but there is no link to what's really going on and what the basis
of the edits are.

Anyone else have concerns over benefits?

Cheers
Andy


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[OSM-talk-be] GRB import in progress

2019-07-29 Thread joost schouppe

Hi,

Since a month or two, we have been scaling up the building import in
Flanders, based on GRB buildings. We have summarized the instructions in a
ten page presentation, and it is now really easy to get started. You do
need JOSM, but the list of functionalities needed is really limited.
However, we don't want to end up with silly stuff like this [1]. The actual
data integration into OSM is not easy:

- the source data is a bit outdated (we are working on that!), so buildings
might be missing or razed by now. Even when it's not GRB can be behind
reality.
- the GRB buildings have CRAB-addresses merged to them. That merge might be
wrong, so you have to check all buildings! Or the building might have
several entrances, perhaps on more than one street. So then you need to
make address nodes
- the tool makes an educated guess as to what the building type is. But
that guess can be wrong, so again you have to check all the buildings.
There are also some building types (like "verdieping") which need special
attention.
- you have to conflate with existing data (merge histories for existing
buildings; make sure you don't put buildings on top of other objects) and
we expect you to care about ALL the data, not just the building data

Overall, I don't think you can usually properly import more than a few
hundred buildings per hour. But it's nice to see the map fill up with
buildings, and finally have some decent address coverage.

If you would like to join us in mapping the missing buildings in Flanders,
start reading here:

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/AIV_GRB_building_import

We have a support group on Riot where we check each other and are happy to
share tips. You do need JOSM, but the list of functionalities needed is
really limited. So it's a good time to learn how to use it!

It might be easier to learn this in person. Join us at any Meetup in
Flanders or Brussels, there will always be someone who knows about the
import. Or ask us to have a Meetup near you. We're always looking for an
excuse to visit your town :-)

1: https://www.google.com/maps/@43.7199837,6.9785435,18.6z
2: https://www.meetup.com/OpenStreetMap-Belgium/

-- 
Joost Schouppe
OpenStreetMap  |
Twitter  | LinkedIn
 | Meetup

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Re: [Talk-at] CS Kommentar durch Problemuser

2019-07-29 Thread Andreas

Am 27.07.19 um 22:57 schrieb Frederik Ramm:
> Hallo,
> 
> der Wunsch von JH, die von ihm "ganz normal gemappten" Edits
> wiederzubekommen, ist verständlich und ich denke, das können wir auch
> umzusetzen versuchen. 

Kann ich auch verstehen, dass er das gerne behoben sehen würde, aber
macht das die Sache nicht nur noch komplizierter als sie schon ist?

> Ich kümmere mich darum, wenn ich von ihm
> entsprechende Infos bekomme (z.B. "alles Edits in St. Johann, die nicht
> Hausnummern betreffen" oder so). 

Ja ohne Infos von JH würde ich hier eher nix machen.
Sicher sind jetzt vielleicht nützliche und korrekte Infos von ihm
verschwunden, aber sehe es nicht ein, dass sich andere als er darum
kümmern müssen, herauszufinden, was per Import und was manuell
eingearbeitet wurde.

> Der Revert war ja recht großzügig,
> vorallem halt, weil er die gleichen Accounts für Importe/mechanische
> Edits und für "normale" Edits genutzt hat.
> 
> Den beleidigenden Kommentar habe ich entfernt.

schade das so was notwendig ist, danke

lg
geologist



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Re: [OSM-talk] Facebook mapping highways using AI in collaboration with OpenStreetMap

2019-07-29 Thread Mikel Maron

I'd love to move into rational and studied discussion of corporate involvement 
in OSM and the application of machine learning techniques. 
It's easy to get caught up in rhetoric. I dislike "turbocharged" as much as I 
dislike "exploitation". The entire application of machine learning is plagued 
with overblown rhetoric, when after all, it is simply a statistical technique.
OpenStreetMap was founded on equal parts radical, reactionary rhetoric, and 
JFDI. It's also easy to forget how much traditional map making rejected OSM --  
that the craft of surveying is not something to be left to wild hooligans. 
While at the same time the involvement of companies was a critical part of the 
vision since 2004, from helping build software, selling GPS devices, hosting 
servers, and contributing data. And certainly bringing new people into the 
community -- no matter how people find OSM, I have almost universally seen a 
magic gleam in the eye of people who take part, that forms the core of many 
corporate initiatives in OSM. Just because my brain exploded with that vision 
of OSM before I started having the supreme privilege to spend my working days 
on it does not entitle me to some more exalted position.
I wonder if some of us have lost touch with that spirit, as OpenStreetMap has 
succeeded so wildly. I was so absorbed the audacious vision of OSM in 2005, I 
still am regularly shocked that anyone takes OSM seriously. Yes it is radical 
in 2019 to reject corporations and machine learning. But I think we have a lot 
more to offer than conservative rejection; rather we have a wildly successful, 
collaborative, practical approach that puts humans in the fore of complex 
technologies, as the world grapples with very complex times.
The reaction to Facebook's work really confuses me. Have critics of it actually 
tried it? I found it a measured approach, where every edit needs to be examined 
closely by a human and is checked for quality. The advantage of it, where I 
tried it in a dense partially mapped urban settlement, is that it highlighted 
missing streets very well, and made what would have been a maddening squinting 
process a bit smoother and more enjoyable. I still felt satisfaction in what I 
was doing. From talking with folks here in Kenya, there is genuine excitement 
at these new techniques. They've experienced the challenges of creating the 
map, and want to focus and build skills where their human abilities are most 
valuable. 
Now I am not saying that we accept anything without a critical examination. 
Absolutely not! What worries me is that our criticisms are not informed. And 
that there are valuable corporate contributions, and those that are not, and 
the same goes for new technologies.
Yes, there are quality issues. Yes, there are issues of the experience of the 
map and the community we built. Yes, there are serous issues of displacement 
and alienation. What are these specifically, and what are the range of 
responses we can explore together?
To take one example, Simon rightly points out that road geometry is only a 
portion, and perhaps the easiest portion, of what needs mapping. And that 
metrics to measure overall completeness sets real goals for us. How can we 
rally and build community around this? So many of our tools are oriented to 
greenfield mapping. What creative workflows, metrics, analysis and 
visualizations of OSM data can bring the same thrill of creating the map from a 
completely blank slate, to a stage of the map where the base geometry is there?
-Mikel
* Mikel Maron * +14152835207 @mikel s:mikelmaron 

On Saturday, July 27, 2019, 01:43:59 PM GMT+3, Simon Poole  
wrote:  
 
  

 
 Am 26.07.2019 um 19:30 schrieb Naveen Francis:
  
 
Including my ₹ 0.10 (Indian ten paisa)   Echoes same thoughts of Brazilian 
Real.  
  AI-assisted human mapping tools will be a good aid for the OSM community. 
  "Map faster, Map better". 
   
  40,00,000 kms to be mapped in India.  15 years of OSM mapped 18,00,000 kms. 

The (rhetoric) question is, why is this the case?
 
Because the community in India is still very small relative to the population 
size.  
 
 
So from where will the additional contributors come from that will turn the 
additional 4 million road geometries in to something really useful? There is a 
real danger of the desire for "completeness" instead of quality resulting in 
multiple TIGER 2.0s, and we are just now slowly working ourselves out of the 
hole we dug (full of good intentions) with the original.  
 
 
Note on the side: outside of raw total  road length, a much more sensible 
comparison would be completeness measures per road categories (which I suspect 
is likely to look far less dramatic) and which might give more realistic goals 
for the community.
 
Simon

  
   
  thanks,
  naveenpf

  On Fri, Jul 26, 2019 at 4:42 AM Sérgio V.  wrote:
  
  Just adding my R$0,02 (Brazilian Real).
  I guess soon the AI assisted Human mapping will happen, it may be a

Re: [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

2019-07-29 Thread Damjan Gerl

Certamente da mappare, da usare il tag:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:emergency%3Ddefibrillator

In Italia ce ne sono 1564 già mappati:
https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/L8N

Ciao
Damjan



-- Original Header ---

From  : "Lorenzo Rolla" rolla.l...@gmail.com
To  : "openstreetmap list - italiano" talk-it@openstreetmap.org
Cc  : 
Date  : Mon, 29 Jul 2019 08:59:13 +0200
Subject : [Talk-it] DAE - defibrillatori

> Gentilissimi, riteniamo che sia giovevole inserire sulle mappe l'esatta
> ubicazione dei defibrillatori? Il mio auspicio nasce dalla lettura di
> questo disegno di legge:
> 
> http://documenti.camera.it/leg18/pdl/pdf/leg.18.pdl.camera.181_A.18PDL0069760.pdf
> 
> Lieto di leggere le vostre considerazioni. Lorenzo
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Lorenzo Rolla
> 

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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] data Office National des Forêts et OSM

Comme beaucoup de données disponibles en opendata, ces données n'ont pas
fait l'objet d'un import.

Les raisons sont multiples et habituelles:
- il y a déjà des données sur les forêts dans OSM, il faut donc faire une
fusion entre l'existant et la source opendata... ce qui n'est pas simple à
faire automatiquement, donc ça se fait en général manuellement
- les données n'ont pas été repérées au moment de leur ouverture... cas de
plus en plus courant vu l'afflux permanent de nouvelles données opendata.
Il n'y a que les contributeurs amateurs de la thématique qui ont peut être
pu s'y intéresser
- il n'y a pas eu d'évaluation de la qualité et pertinence des données...
- il n'y a pas d'outil facilitant l'intégration de ces données qui a été
mis en place

C'est quand même le premier point le plus important., qui peut s'améliorer
avec le dernier.
Osmose peut servir à faire la comparaison entre ces données et l'existant,
pour faciliter l'intégration des infos, je pense surtout aux noms dans un
premier temps, pour les polygones, ça peut être plus complexe.

PS: OpenStreetMap (sans S)


Le ven. 26 juil. 2019 à 11:05, Jacques Martin <
jacques.martin-20162...@caramail.com> a écrit :

>
> Bonjour
> milles excuses si le sujet a déjà été abordé sur la mailing liste.
>
> L'ONF mets à disposition un jeu de données georeferences sur les forêts
> publiques
> https://www.data.gouv.fr/fr/datasets/forets-publiques-diffusion-publique/
> mais je n'en trouve aucune trace sur openstreetmaps, cad quand je tape le
> nom fourni par l'ONF, rien ne matche sur openstreetmaps.org
> ou inversement quand j'insère les coordonnées géographiques, je suis bien
> en forêt mais je ne retrouve pas de nom.
> Ma question est donc
> Est ce que ces données posent des problèmes au point de ne pas être
> utilisé comme référentiel ?
> Je comprendrais aussi qu'openstreetmaps est un projet basé sur le temps
> libre de chacun et que tout le monde manque de temps.
> bonne journée
>
> Jacques
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>


-- 
Christian Quest - OpenStreetMap France
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Demande de retours sur l'analyse Osmose d'intégration de la base Sirene