Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
Not to bikeshed this, but is the direction of the hinge important? At least around the northwest, due to the prevailing drizzle, cabinet doors on certain utility cabinets open upwards to provide at least some weather protection to the equipment while under maintenance. On Feb 9, 2014 12:43 PM, Murry McEntire murry.mcent...@gmail.com wrote: Street cabinet has no meaning in my region. Looking at manufacturer's sites and google images, I do see the term in use in Britain (and some other places) for above ground enclosures with vertical hinged doors. Did you also mean to include above ground enclosures without hinged doors and subsurface enclosures with a surface door? In the U.S. all types are probably most commonly known as utility boxes. Utility box has other meanings, so is ambiguous, but on a map would likely be interpreted correctly Perhaps someone could chime in with the British term covering all the variations? Murry On Sun, Feb 9, 2014 at 10:31 AM, François Lacombe francois.laco...@telecom-bretagne.eu wrote: Hi, I was pretty frustrated to don't encounter any common tag to map street cabinets (trafic lights control, water metering, phone connection points...) in my city. I was looking for something like man_made=street_cabinet or whatever but it's not widely used in the DB. Should I propose this new value on wiki (with additional tags to specify what kind of street cabinet, obviously) ? It would be interesting to document street cabinets since many of them dangerously deal with pavement accessibility in urban zones. This would be done to prevent specific primary keys about a particular infrastructure to appear on the map. Thanks in advance for any feedback. Cheers. *François Lacombe* francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
On Sun, 9 Feb 2014 18:31:25 +0100, François Lacombe wrote: Hi, I was pretty frustrated to dont encounter any common tag to map street cabinets (trafic lights control, water metering, phone connection points...) in my city. I was looking for something like man_made=street_cabinet or whatever but its not widely used in the DB. I've used utility=cabinet for such things. With additional tags like cabinet=cable_tv ref= -- Jon Stockill li...@stockill.net ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
François Lacombe wrote: For electricity, we do have power=cable_distribution_cabinet but IMHO it's definitely to specific. It would be replaced by man_made=street_cabinet + street_cabinet=power_distribution (+ operator=* + ref=* if applicable) Sounds a very reasonable expansion allowing finer detail to be recorded. And obviously there are traffic control, road lights and all other public facilities. Certainly traffic lights have similar street furniture ... In France, we have kind of postal boxes where a postal service employee deposits letters as for allowing a second person to distribute them later. We have the same thing in the UK as well ... This should probably be in the tagging list ... but I'm probably not alone in not having even joined that :) -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk Rainbow Digital Media - http://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
Well, the proposal has been created and hosted on this page : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Street_cabinet It's obviously a draft yet, many elements are missing. I will ask @tagging a few more additional tags. Thank you for your feedbacks and feel free to use Talk page. Cheers. *François Lacombe* francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com 2014-02-10 9:34 GMT+01:00 Lester Caine les...@lsces.co.uk: François Lacombe wrote: For electricity, we do have power=cable_distribution_cabinet but IMHO it's definitely to specific. It would be replaced by man_made=street_cabinet + street_cabinet=power_distribution (+ operator=* + ref=* if applicable) Sounds a very reasonable expansion allowing finer detail to be recorded. And obviously there are traffic control, road lights and all other public facilities. Certainly traffic lights have similar street furniture ... In France, we have kind of postal boxes where a postal service employee deposits letters as for allowing a second person to distribute them later. We have the same thing in the UK as well ... This should probably be in the tagging list ... but I'm probably not alone in not having even joined that :) -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk Rainbow Digital Media - http://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
For some types of cabinet there’s already tags available, e.g.: Traffic counter: man_made=monitoring_station + monitoring:traffic=* Air quality monitoring: man_made=monitoring_station + monitoring:air_quality=* Cheers, Gregory From: François Lacombe [mailto:francois.laco...@telecom-bretagne.eu] Sent: 10 February 2014 15:38 To: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets Well, the proposal has been created and hosted on this page : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Street_cabinet It's obviously a draft yet, many elements are missing. I will ask @tagging a few more additional tags. Thank you for your feedbacks and feel free to use Talk page. Cheers. François Lacombe francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com 2014-02-10 9:34 GMT+01:00 Lester Caine les...@lsces.co.uk mailto:les...@lsces.co.uk : François Lacombe wrote: For electricity, we do have power=cable_distribution_cabinet but IMHO it's definitely to specific. It would be replaced by man_made=street_cabinet + street_cabinet=power_distribution (+ operator=* + ref=* if applicable) Sounds a very reasonable expansion allowing finer detail to be recorded. And obviously there are traffic control, road lights and all other public facilities. Certainly traffic lights have similar street furniture ... In France, we have kind of postal boxes where a postal service employee deposits letters as for allowing a second person to distribute them later. We have the same thing in the UK as well ... This should probably be in the tagging list ... but I'm probably not alone in not having even joined that :) -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk Rainbow Digital Media - http://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org mailto:talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
Well, I'll update my definition of street_cabinet and thank you to notice me those existing tags. A street cabinet concerned by the proposal differs from a monitoring station : - Monitoring station is only functional without taking size in account. You can't going into a cabinet, it's only a rack where equipments are installed and can be accessed by opening the door. - Monitoring station is dedicated to monitoring when a street cabinet can by used for many other activities (monitoring_station is far more specific than street_cabinet). Knowing that, I won't replace monitoring_station by a specific type of street cabinet. Mappers would use monitoring_station or street_cabinet either depending of what is being mapped. Typically : - Urban air quality monitoring box = man_made=monitoring_station + monitoring:air_quality=yes - Traffic signals common box = man_made=street_cabinet + monitoring:traffic=yes (we don't know if the box is only monitoring or doing control command too). Proposal examples have to show the difference but I miss evocative pictures to illustrate it properly. I'll update the document later, I hope my point is clear here. Cheers. *François Lacombe* francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com 2014-02-10 21:37 GMT+01:00 Gregory Williams greg...@gregorywilliams.me.uk: For some types of cabinet there’s already tags available, e.g.: Traffic counter: man_made=monitoring_station + monitoring:traffic=* Air quality monitoring: man_made=monitoring_station + monitoring:air_quality=* Cheers, Gregory *From:* François Lacombe [mailto:francois.laco...@telecom-bretagne.eu] *Sent:* 10 February 2014 15:38 *To:* talk@openstreetmap.org *Subject:* Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets Well, the proposal has been created and hosted on this page : https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Street_cabinet It's obviously a draft yet, many elements are missing. I will ask @tagging a few more additional tags. Thank you for your feedbacks and feel free to use Talk page. Cheers. *François Lacombe* francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com 2014-02-10 9:34 GMT+01:00 Lester Caine les...@lsces.co.uk: François Lacombe wrote: For electricity, we do have power=cable_distribution_cabinet but IMHO it's definitely to specific. It would be replaced by man_made=street_cabinet + street_cabinet=power_distribution (+ operator=* + ref=* if applicable) Sounds a very reasonable expansion allowing finer detail to be recorded. And obviously there are traffic control, road lights and all other public facilities. Certainly traffic lights have similar street furniture ... In France, we have kind of postal boxes where a postal service employee deposits letters as for allowing a second person to distribute them later. We have the same thing in the UK as well ... This should probably be in the tagging list ... but I'm probably not alone in not having even joined that :) -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk Rainbow Digital Media - http://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] Street cabinets
Hi, I was pretty frustrated to don't encounter any common tag to map street cabinets (trafic lights control, water metering, phone connection points...) in my city. I was looking for something like man_made=street_cabinet or whatever but it's not widely used in the DB. Should I propose this new value on wiki (with additional tags to specify what kind of street cabinet, obviously) ? It would be interesting to document street cabinets since many of them dangerously deal with pavement accessibility in urban zones. This would be done to prevent specific primary keys about a particular infrastructure to appear on the map. Thanks in advance for any feedback. Cheers. *François Lacombe* francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
On Sun, Feb 9, 2014 at 7:42 PM, Murry McEntire murry.mcent...@gmail.com wrote: Street cabinet has no meaning in my region. He's talking about something like this (but outdoor only): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enclosure_%28electrical%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electricalenclosure.JPG Pieren ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
According to Pieren pics, only surface enclosures with vertical hinged doors are concerned by this proposal. For a subsurface enclosure, I would use building=yes + location=underground by default. A subsurface enclosure often offers enough space to go down inside, thus it's more a building than a simple cabinet (where you can't go inside). http://img.directindustry.fr/images_di/photo-g/postes-transformation-enterres-26707-4123999.jpg(an underground electrical substation) For cable drawing rooms like this : http://www.infos-reseaux.com/photos/image/95-chambre-importante It's not big enough to use building but it's definetly not a street cabinet. *François Lacombe* francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com 2014-02-09 21:22 GMT+01:00 Pieren pier...@gmail.com: On Sun, Feb 9, 2014 at 7:42 PM, Murry McEntire murry.mcent...@gmail.com wrote: Street cabinet has no meaning in my region. He's talking about something like this (but outdoor only): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enclosure_%28electrical%29 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electricalenclosure.JPG Pieren ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
On Sun, 2014-02-09 at 11:42 -0700, Murry McEntire wrote: Street cabinet has no meaning in my region. Looking at manufacturer's sites and google images, I do see the term in use in Britain (and some other places) for above ground enclosures with vertical hinged doors. Did you also mean to include above ground enclosures without hinged doors and subsurface enclosures with a surface door? In the U.S. all types are probably most commonly known as utility boxes. Utility box has other meanings, so is ambiguous, but on a map would likely be interpreted correctly Perhaps someone could chime in with the British term covering all the variations? In the UK a cabinet is used primarily for telecoms cabinets. They are quite common, although less common there are gas cabinets. I am not aware of water or electricity having them. In terms of telecoms, the cabinet is where the cable carrying multiple subscriber lines is split to provide individual lines to each house. The word has become more common since the roleout of fibre started. The term commonly used is FTTC (Fibre to the cabinet). In terms of telecoms, a cabinet does not have to be above ground, it can be accessed with removable covers and be below ground. The term cabinet just mean a small cupboard, it is also commonly used for things in the house such as a 'bathroom cabinet'. Phil (trigpoint) On Sun, Feb 9, 2014 at 10:31 AM, François Lacombe francois.laco...@telecom-bretagne.eu wrote: Hi, I was pretty frustrated to don't encounter any common tag to map street cabinets (trafic lights control, water metering, phone connection points...) in my city. I was looking for something like man_made=street_cabinet or whatever but it's not widely used in the DB. Should I propose this new value on wiki (with additional tags to specify what kind of street cabinet, obviously) ? It would be interesting to document street cabinets since many of them dangerously deal with pavement accessibility in urban zones. This would be done to prevent specific primary keys about a particular infrastructure to appear on the map. Thanks in advance for any feedback. Cheers. François Lacombe francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Street cabinets
Thank for those details Philip. How would you call things like that ? https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:French_gas_delivery_point.jpg I would looking for the most general term to add it to man_made and then qualify its nature with a second tag like street_cabinet=* Thirdly, domain-specific tags would do the trick to eventually give details about what is hosted in the cabinet For electricity, we do have power=cable_distribution_cabinet but IMHO it's definitely to specific. It would be replaced by man_made=street_cabinet + street_cabinet=power_distribution (+ operator=* + ref=* if applicable) And obviously there are traffic control, road lights and all other public facilities. In France, we have kind of postal boxes where a postal service employee deposits letters as for allowing a second person to distribute them later. https://www.google.fr/maps/preview/@48.127418,-1.640277,3a,19y,262.9h,69.34t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1s7fn6hRmeXM84TL5rvHcjbg!2e0 *François Lacombe* francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com 2014-02-09 23:08 GMT+01:00 Philip Barnes p...@trigpoint.me.uk: On Sun, 2014-02-09 at 11:42 -0700, Murry McEntire wrote: Street cabinet has no meaning in my region. Looking at manufacturer's sites and google images, I do see the term in use in Britain (and some other places) for above ground enclosures with vertical hinged doors. Did you also mean to include above ground enclosures without hinged doors and subsurface enclosures with a surface door? In the U.S. all types are probably most commonly known as utility boxes. Utility box has other meanings, so is ambiguous, but on a map would likely be interpreted correctly Perhaps someone could chime in with the British term covering all the variations? In the UK a cabinet is used primarily for telecoms cabinets. They are quite common, although less common there are gas cabinets. I am not aware of water or electricity having them. In terms of telecoms, the cabinet is where the cable carrying multiple subscriber lines is split to provide individual lines to each house. The word has become more common since the roleout of fibre started. The term commonly used is FTTC (Fibre to the cabinet). In terms of telecoms, a cabinet does not have to be above ground, it can be accessed with removable covers and be below ground. The term cabinet just mean a small cupboard, it is also commonly used for things in the house such as a 'bathroom cabinet'. Phil (trigpoint) On Sun, Feb 9, 2014 at 10:31 AM, François Lacombe francois.laco...@telecom-bretagne.eu wrote: Hi, I was pretty frustrated to don't encounter any common tag to map street cabinets (trafic lights control, water metering, phone connection points...) in my city. I was looking for something like man_made=street_cabinet or whatever but it's not widely used in the DB. Should I propose this new value on wiki (with additional tags to specify what kind of street cabinet, obviously) ? It would be interesting to document street cabinets since many of them dangerously deal with pavement accessibility in urban zones. This would be done to prevent specific primary keys about a particular infrastructure to appear on the map. Thanks in advance for any feedback. Cheers. François Lacombe francois dot lacombe At telecom-bretagne dot eu http://www.infos-reseaux.com ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
