Re: [Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland

[Matt Riggott]

Hi Morten,

> On 9 Jan 2019, at 11:18, Morten Lange  wrote:
> I agree with Jóhannes that what you propose sounds useul.
> 
> Additionally perhaps OSM editors could be granted permission to copy paths by 
> hand from ja.is   
> Paths that are on the maps of ja.is, but are missing on OSM.

All the data shown on the Já map tiles is Samsýn's, it's not Já's to give away 
unfortunately. You could try asking Samsýn for permission if you haven't 
already.

But the Já maps — all of Samsýn's maps, as far as I know — use the ISN 93 
projection whereas OpenStreetMap uses WGS 84, so the maps aren't directly 
comparable. If you had permission you could use it for reference but using it 
for tracing would only introduce errors.

M.

-- 
Matt Riggott
Programmer / Forritari

https://ja.is/
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Re: [Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland

[Morten Lange]

I agree with Jóhannes that what you propose sounds useul.
Additionally perhaps OSM editors could be granted permission to copy paths by 
hand from ja.is   
Paths that are on the maps of ja.is, but are missing on OSM.
This could be done the other way around as well, provided OSM is credited I 
guess. -- Regards / Kveðja / Hilsen Morten Lange

  From: Jóhannes Birgir Jensson 
 To: OpenStreetMap in Iceland  
 Sent: Tuesday, 8 January 2019, 12:54
 Subject: Re: [Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland
   
This sounds very useful Matt.

I have previously approached ja.is about the 360 imagery on behalf of 
OpenStreetMap á Íslandi and a permission to use it as a data source. The reply 
in 2018 was "not for now - maybe later" so if this is later then it would be 
great.

The GPS traces would be very nice too.

Regarding using LUKR as a source then be advised it is not 100% correct - it 
contains a number of ghost buildings for example (where a zone has been 
approved for a building but it hasn't been built yet). For example in my 
previous residence I had a license to build a garage (with other residents) and 
on LUKR the garage was already built while it still has not moved off the 
drawing board for 20 years.

--JBJ

8. janúar 2019 kl. 11:30, skrifaði "Matt Riggott" :

>> On 5 Jan 2019, at 11:14, Morten Lange  wrote:
>> 
>> It would be great if paths found on ja.is maps could be freely used on 
>> OpenStreetMap, and the other
>> way around. I guess that depends on licensing clauses.
> 
> Hi Morten,
> 
> I agree, it'd be really nice to have that, but you're right to think the 
> licence is too
> prohibitive. The map tiles are produced by Samsýn and they're quite strict on 
> what we can do with
> them. Besides that, the tiles are projected using ISN 93, so using them as an 
> OpenStreetMap layer
> would cause alignment problems.
> 
> But I can think of some ways Já could help OpenStreetMap. First, I could ask 
> for Já to give
> OpenStreetMap explicit permission to use the Já 360 street view photos as a 
> data source. Second, we
> have GPS coordinates from the car that drove around the country taking the Já 
> 360 photos; I could
> ask to be able to publish the GPS data under a permissive licence.
> 
> If any of that sounds useful, let me know.
> 
> M.
> 
> --
> Matt Riggott
> Programmer / Forritari
> 
> https://ja.is
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Re: [Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland

[Jóhannes Birgir Jensson]

This sounds very useful Matt.

I have previously approached ja.is about the 360 imagery on behalf of 
OpenStreetMap á Íslandi and a permission to use it as a data source. The reply 
in 2018 was "not for now - maybe later" so if this is later then it would be 
great.

The GPS traces would be very nice too.

Regarding using LUKR as a source then be advised it is not 100% correct - it 
contains a number of ghost buildings for example (where a zone has been 
approved for a building but it hasn't been built yet). For example in my 
previous residence I had a license to build a garage (with other residents) and 
on LUKR the garage was already built while it still has not moved off the 
drawing board for 20 years.

--JBJ

8. janúar 2019 kl. 11:30, skrifaði "Matt Riggott" :

>> On 5 Jan 2019, at 11:14, Morten Lange  wrote:
>> 
>> It would be great if paths found on ja.is maps could be freely used on 
>> OpenStreetMap, and the other
>> way around. I guess that depends on licensing clauses.
> 
> Hi Morten,
> 
> I agree, it'd be really nice to have that, but you're right to think the 
> licence is too
> prohibitive. The map tiles are produced by Samsýn and they're quite strict on 
> what we can do with
> them. Besides that, the tiles are projected using ISN 93, so using them as an 
> OpenStreetMap layer
> would cause alignment problems.
> 
> But I can think of some ways Já could help OpenStreetMap. First, I could ask 
> for Já to give
> OpenStreetMap explicit permission to use the Já 360 street view photos as a 
> data source. Second, we
> have GPS coordinates from the car that drove around the country taking the Já 
> 360 photos; I could
> ask to be able to publish the GPS data under a permissive licence.
> 
> If any of that sounds useful, let me know.
> 
> M.
> 
> --
> Matt Riggott
> Programmer / Forritari
> 
> https://ja.is
> ___
> Talk-is mailing list
> Talk-is@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-is

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Re: [Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland

[Matt Riggott]

> On 5 Jan 2019, at 11:14, Morten Lange  wrote:
> 
> It would be great if paths found on ja.is maps could be freely used on 
> OpenStreetMap, and the other way around. I guess that depends on licensing 
> clauses. 

Hi Morten,

I agree, it'd be really nice to have that, but you're right to think the 
licence is too prohibitive. The map tiles are produced by Samsýn and they're 
quite strict on what we can do with them. Besides that, the tiles are projected 
using ISN 93, so using them as an OpenStreetMap layer would cause alignment 
problems.

But I can think of some ways Já could help OpenStreetMap. First, I could ask 
for Já to give OpenStreetMap explicit permission to use the Já 360 street view 
photos as a data source. Second, we have GPS coordinates from the car that 
drove around the country taking the Já 360 photos; I could ask to be able to 
publish the GPS data under a permissive licence.

If any of that sounds useful, let me know.

M.

-- 
Matt Riggott
Programmer / Forritari

https://ja.is/
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Re: [Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland

[Morten Lange]

Hi, Matt and Andrew
One area for improvement is the mapping of walking and cycling paths and 
routes. And a few bicycle lanes, bicycle parking, repair stations etc.It would 
be great if paths found on ja.is maps could be freely used on OpenStreetMap, 
and the other way around. I guess that depends on licensing clauses. 
-- Regards / Kveðja / Hilsen Morten Lange

  From: Matt Riggott 
 To: "talk-is@openstreetmap.org"  
 Sent: Thursday, 3 January 2019, 16:11
 Subject: Re: [Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland
   
Hi Andrew,

This is good news. I work for Já (based in Reykjavík) and we also have an 
interest in improving OpenStreetMap data in Iceland, although our changes have 
been ad hoc rather than structured.

The OSM data we've used so far has focused on the road network and building 
geometries. As you say, from this perspective the data is mostly complete, but 
there are some things that could be fixed. Roughly, if we split the country 
into three parts we have Reykjavík and its surrounding municipalities, the 
rural areas and smaller towns that ring the coast, and the uninhabited central 
highlands. The data for Reykjavík is generally excellent, so I would think it's 
the rural/uninhabited areas where most improvements could be made. (Even this 
data is very good though.)

One example we've seen in the small towns and rural areas are misaligned roads. 
They might only be a few metres from their real position, but when you have 
parallel roads in close proximity to one another this can cause GPS coordinates 
to place you on the wrong road. Likewise with misaligned or inaccurate building 
outlines — important to us since we use them to decide which points along the 
road network are visible from a given location.

Then there's the central highlands. The gravel road network here is only 
accessible during the summer and many roads require a four-wheel drive if 
you're driving. I haven't looked much into the data here, but I have an inkling 
that very useful improvements could be made — surface tags especially, but also 
additional routes, accessibility, and road numbers. I'd love to see more detail 
added here.

As for external data, up-to-date imports from the Staðfangaskrá and LUKR 
datasets would be great. The latter is the land information system for 
Reykjavík and surrounding municipalities, and it's extraordinarily detailed 
(down to the road markings painted on roads). Both datasets were imported into 
OSM a long time ago and I don't think they've been revisited since.

I've tried and failed to keep this short, but if you want more information 
please get in touch via email or on this list.

M.

PS. While you're here, there's an error in the Reykjavík coastline in Apple 
Maps that's always irritated me. Compare these:

- https://maps.apple.com/?ll=64.1509,-21.9142
- https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/64.1509/-21.9142

> On 23 Dec 2018, at 02:52, Andrew Wiseman   wrote:
> 
> Hello everyone,
> 
> I’m Andrew with Apple’s Maps team. We’re interested in doing some a few 
> improvements to the OSM data in Iceland, specifically adding some missing 
> buildings, making road network fixes like adding missing roads, making sure 
> intersections are correct, and the like, and some coastline fixes. It looks 
> like the data is mostly complete but I wanted to see if you had any 
> suggestions for places where things might be out of date or inaccurate, or 
> other suggestions or feedback. I also saw that some addresses had been 
> imported from a government dataset 
> (https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Staðfangaskrá_Import), is that still 
> going on?
> 
> Here’s more information about our project: 
> https://github.com/osmlab/appledata/issues/134
> 
> 
> Please let me know if you have any questions or feedback. Also if there is a 
> forum, Telegram or WhatsApp group the community uses, I’d be happy to join 
> and talk there.
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Andrew

-- 
Matt Riggott
Programmer / Forritari

https://ja.is/

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Re: [Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland

[Matt Riggott]

Hi Andrew,

This is good news. I work for Já (based in Reykjavík) and we also have an 
interest in improving OpenStreetMap data in Iceland, although our changes have 
been ad hoc rather than structured.

The OSM data we've used so far has focused on the road network and building 
geometries. As you say, from this perspective the data is mostly complete, but 
there are some things that could be fixed. Roughly, if we split the country 
into three parts we have Reykjavík and its surrounding municipalities, the 
rural areas and smaller towns that ring the coast, and the uninhabited central 
highlands. The data for Reykjavík is generally excellent, so I would think it's 
the rural/uninhabited areas where most improvements could be made. (Even this 
data is very good though.)

One example we've seen in the small towns and rural areas are misaligned roads. 
They might only be a few metres from their real position, but when you have 
parallel roads in close proximity to one another this can cause GPS coordinates 
to place you on the wrong road. Likewise with misaligned or inaccurate building 
outlines — important to us since we use them to decide which points along the 
road network are visible from a given location.

Then there's the central highlands. The gravel road network here is only 
accessible during the summer and many roads require a four-wheel drive if 
you're driving. I haven't looked much into the data here, but I have an inkling 
that very useful improvements could be made — surface tags especially, but also 
additional routes, accessibility, and road numbers. I'd love to see more detail 
added here.

As for external data, up-to-date imports from the Staðfangaskrá and LUKR 
datasets would be great. The latter is the land information system for 
Reykjavík and surrounding municipalities, and it's extraordinarily detailed 
(down to the road markings painted on roads). Both datasets were imported into 
OSM a long time ago and I don't think they've been revisited since.

I've tried and failed to keep this short, but if you want more information 
please get in touch via email or on this list.

M.

PS. While you're here, there's an error in the Reykjavík coastline in Apple 
Maps that's always irritated me. Compare these:

- https://maps.apple.com/?ll=64.1509,-21.9142
- https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/64.1509/-21.9142

> On 23 Dec 2018, at 02:52, Andrew Wiseman   wrote:
> 
> Hello everyone,
> 
> I’m Andrew with Apple’s Maps team. We’re interested in doing some a few 
> improvements to the OSM data in Iceland, specifically adding some missing 
> buildings, making road network fixes like adding missing roads, making sure 
> intersections are correct, and the like, and some coastline fixes. It looks 
> like the data is mostly complete but I wanted to see if you had any 
> suggestions for places where things might be out of date or inaccurate, or 
> other suggestions or feedback. I also saw that some addresses had been 
> imported from a government dataset 
> (https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Staðfangaskrá_Import), is that still 
> going on?
> 
> Here’s more information about our project: 
> https://github.com/osmlab/appledata/issues/134
> 
> 
> Please let me know if you have any questions or feedback. Also if there is a 
> forum, Telegram or WhatsApp group the community uses, I’d be happy to join 
> and talk there.
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> Andrew

-- 
Matt Riggott
Programmer / Forritari

https://ja.is/

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Re: [Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland

[Jóhannes Birgir Jensson]

Hello Andrew.

I'm Jóhannes, current chairman of Hliðskjálf, which as OpenStreetMap á Íslandi 
is the local chapter in Iceland.

We are of course happy for any corrections - just be mindful that you are not 
adding buildings that have been demolished, there is a lot of construction 
going on and many satellite images are very outdated.

Staðfangaskrá import has not been active, we have not analyzed where we are 
missing data currently.

We have a very inactive forum on the official forum list, the meager 
communication that goes on is in comments or on this list.

Happy mapping.

--Jóhannes

23. desember 2018 kl. 2:52, skrifaði "Andrew Wiseman" mailto:andrew_wise...@apple.com?to=%22Andrew%20Wiseman%22%20)>:
Hello everyone,
I’m Andrew with Apple’s Maps team. We’re interested in doing some a few 
improvements to the OSM data in Iceland, specifically adding some missing 
buildings, making road network fixes like adding missing roads, making sure 
intersections are correct, and the like, and some coastline fixes. It looks 
like the data is mostly complete but I wanted to see if you had any suggestions 
for places where things might be out of date or inaccurate, or other 
suggestions or feedback. I also saw that some addresses had been imported from 
a government dataset (https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Staðfangaskrá_Import 
(https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Sta%C3%B0fangaskr%C3%A1_Import)), is that 
still going on? 
Here’s more information about our project: 
https://github.com/osmlab/appledata/issues/134 
(https://github.com/osmlab/appledata/issues/134)  
Please let me know if you have any questions or feedback. Also if there is a 
forum, Telegram or WhatsApp group the community uses, I’d be happy to join and 
talk there. 
Thank you, 
Andrew 
Andrew Wiseman |  Maps | iPhone: +1.202.270.4464 | andrew_wise...@apple.com 
(mailto:andrew_wise...@apple.com)
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[Talk-is] Data improvements in Iceland

[Andrew Wiseman]

Hello everyone,

I’m Andrew with Apple’s Maps team. We’re interested in doing some a few 
improvements to the OSM data in Iceland, specifically adding some missing 
buildings, making road network fixes like adding missing roads, making sure 
intersections are correct, and the like, and some coastline fixes. It looks 
like the data is mostly complete but I wanted to see if you had any suggestions 
for places where things might be out of date or inaccurate, or other 
suggestions or feedback. I also saw that some addresses had been imported from 
a government dataset 
(https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Staðfangaskrá_Import), is that still going 
on?

Here’s more information about our project: 
https://github.com/osmlab/appledata/issues/134

Please let me know if you have any questions or feedback. Also if there is a 
forum, Telegram or WhatsApp group the community uses, I’d be happy to join and 
talk there.

Thank you,

Andrew


Andrew Wiseman |  Maps | iPhone: +1.202.270.4464 | andrew_wise...@apple.com 

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