Re: [Talk-us] Labeling forestry service roads/tracks

[Clifford Snow]

If you are using JOSM there is a USFS road layer. The color of the way
indicates surface and highway classification if I remember correctly. I
posted the legend on Slack a couple of years ago.

The TIGER import data quality varied from region to region. Even today in
Washington State it's bad, so bad that I don't recommend using it. My guess
is that it's low priority for counties to update Feds, especially when
their budgets are already tight. There is even one county in Washington
State that they don't even have a current road layer.

Best,
Clifford

On Sun, Jul 19, 2020 at 3:48 PM  wrote:

> Hi folks,
>
> Editing in Boundary County, Idaho in the Panhandle, I've been extending
> the forest landuse area around Bonners Ferry and have come across a
> difficulty in classifying forest roads.
>
> It seems that many have been automatically imported and have
> highway=residential, which is just plain wrong.
>
> For roads that appear metalled (paved) and/or access mines, quarries,
> communication towers etc. I label highway=service, for roads that are
> unpaved or sometimes seem to almost fade out I label highway=track. For
> roads that appear to be public access (e.g. to go to a lake) but are
> obviously even more minor than tertiary roads I label highway=unclassified.
>
> Is there a more consistent recommended method?
>
> The US Topo map gives forest road references so I add ref FS .
>
> TIGER seems to be at best very coarse, at worst fictional.
>
> Thanks.
>
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Re: [Talk-us] [Talk-us-newyork] Interested in importing address points in New York State

[Skyler Hawthorne]

Fascinating read, thanks so much for the research and the write-up!
--
Skyler
On July 19, 2020 23:12:52 Kevin Kenny  wrote:
On Thu, Jul 16, 2020 at 12:46 PM Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-us 
 wrote:


Once you write this diary entry (or OSM Wiki page) please post

it to the mailing list!

Here you go:  https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/ke9tv/diary/393684

Feel free to repost, wikify, share as appropriate!

Skyler, thanks for trying again to reach out!  I'd written, both email and 
paper, to several people listed as contacts on gis.ny.gov and never 
received a response. You'll notice that I made a copy of the mail on my 
personal site and referenced it as an exhibit in the diary entry.


(PS: I was shouting at the screen as I read that self-congratulatory 
article at https://gis.ny.gov/outreach/gist/fall01.htm)


--

73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin
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Re: [Talk-us] Labeling forestry service roads/tracks

[Kevin Kenny]

On Sun, Jul 19, 2020 at 9:29 PM brad  wrote:

> Thanks for diving in.   If it's a very minor unimproved road and not
> clearly service, I usually tag it track.   I would suggest adding some
> indication of road quality.   If it's an improved gravel road, I consider
> surface=gravel sufficient.   If it's rougher than an improved gravel road,
> surface=unpaved (in my area the surface is usually a mix of dirt, rocks,
> gravel, so unpaved seems best),   and smoothness=very_bad (high clearance),
> or horrible (4wd)  [https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:smoothness],
> or  4wd_only=yes .
>

A nit: most 'improved' gravel roads are surface=compacted.  'gravel' is
like rail ballast; a compacted surface ordinarily has a mix of fine gravel
and even finer material such as sand, and is rolled. Americans will often
refer to a compacted road as a 'dirt' or 'gravel' road but the difference
is like night and day when you're driving on one!

For the rougher stuff, 'smoothness' is essential.  Consider also
'tracktype', which addresses more the firmness of the surface rather than
its smoothness. A clay surface may be lovely in a dry season and impassable
in a wet one, despite having a fast enough slump that the surface is
deceptively smooth.

Some National Forests separate Forest Highway (a regular access road) and
Forest Road (usually a logging track, might be inaccessible in any given
season, and often passable only to logging trucks and similar
high-clearance off-road vehicles). I don't know if any of them overlay the
numbering of the two systems.

_Please_ create route relations!
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Re: [Talk-us] Interested in importing address points in New York State

[Kevin Kenny]

On Thu, Jul 16, 2020 at 12:46 PM Mateusz Konieczny via Talk-us <
talk-us@openstreetmap.org> wrote:

> Once you write this diary entry (or OSM Wiki page) please post
> it to the mailing list!
>

Here you go:  https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/ke9tv/diary/393684

 Feel free to repost, wikify, share as appropriate!

Skyler, thanks for trying again to reach out!  I'd written, both email and
paper, to several people listed as contacts on gis.ny.gov and never
received a response. You'll notice that I made a copy of the mail on my
personal site and referenced it as an exhibit in the diary entry.

(PS: I was shouting at the screen as I read that self-congratulatory
article at https://gis.ny.gov/outreach/gist/fall01.htm)

-- 
73 de ke9tv/2, Kevin
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Re: [Talk-us] Labeling forestry service roads/tracks

[brad]

Thanks for diving in.   If it's a very minor unimproved road and not 
clearly service, I usually tag it track.   I would suggest adding some 
indication of road quality.   If it's an improved gravel road, I 
consider surface=gravel sufficient.   If it's rougher than an improved 
gravel road, surface=unpaved (in my area the surface is usually a mix of 
dirt, rocks, gravel, so unpaved seems best),   and smoothness=very_bad 
(high clearance), or horrible (4wd) 
[https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:smoothness], or 4wd_only=yes .


The USFS motor vehicle use maps (MVUM) are very useful.

I think most of the road signs say FS, and most of the tags in my area 
use FS, but the wiki 
(https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/United_States_roads_tagging#National_Forest_Road_System) 
says to use FR .   I don't know the history, or if it really matters.  
If someone is reading a map & it says FR or FS, they probably won't even 
notice.


Keep this in mind when getting frustrated with the tiger data, I think 
we would have next to nothing if it didn't get imported.


Brad

On 7/19/20 5:50 PM, Dave Swarthout wrote:
Mike, welcome to the real world. Tiger street data is better than 
nothing but not much. It's positionally inaccurate and many roads are 
wrongly classified. a rough guide at best. I do use the Tiger Roads 
2019 overlay to add names to streets and roads though. The names are 
reasonably accurate in my experience.


On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 5:57 AM Mike Thompson > wrote:




On Sun, Jul 19, 2020 at 4:49 PM mailto:tj-osmw...@lowsnr.net>> wrote:

 For
roads that appear to be public access (e.g. to go to a lake)
but are
obviously even more minor than tertiary roads I label
highway=unclassified.

highway=unclassified are for roads that connect small towns, or
for "local traffic", while access to a lake could be considered
"local traffic", I would think it would be better if these would
be highway=service, or highway=track.


The US Topo map gives forest road references so I add ref FS .

That is what I have been doing as well. Some are recommending that
they be made into route relations, which I am starting to do.


TIGER seems to be at best very coarse, at worst fictional.

+1

Mike
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--
Dave Swarthout
Homer, Alaska
Chiang Mai, Thailand
Travel Blog at http://dswarthout.blogspot.com

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Re: [Talk-us] Labeling forestry service roads/tracks

[Dave Swarthout]

Mike, welcome to the real world. Tiger street data is better than nothing
but not much. It's positionally inaccurate and many roads are wrongly
classified. a rough guide at best. I do use the Tiger Roads 2019 overlay to
add names to streets and roads though. The names are reasonably accurate in
my experience.

On Mon, Jul 20, 2020 at 5:57 AM Mike Thompson  wrote:

>
>
> On Sun, Jul 19, 2020 at 4:49 PM  wrote:
>
>>  For
>> roads that appear to be public access (e.g. to go to a lake) but are
>> obviously even more minor than tertiary roads I label
>> highway=unclassified.
>>
> highway=unclassified are for roads that connect small towns, or for "local
> traffic", while access to a lake could be considered "local traffic", I
> would think it would be better if these would be highway=service, or
> highway=track.
>
>
>> The US Topo map gives forest road references so I add ref FS .
>>
> That is what I have been doing as well. Some are recommending that they be
> made into route relations, which I am starting to do.
>
>>
>> TIGER seems to be at best very coarse, at worst fictional.
>>
> +1
>
> Mike
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-- 
Dave Swarthout
Homer, Alaska
Chiang Mai, Thailand
Travel Blog at http://dswarthout.blogspot.com
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Re: [Talk-us] Labeling forestry service roads/tracks

[Mike Thompson]

On Sun, Jul 19, 2020 at 4:49 PM  wrote:

>  For
> roads that appear to be public access (e.g. to go to a lake) but are
> obviously even more minor than tertiary roads I label highway=unclassified.
>
highway=unclassified are for roads that connect small towns, or for "local
traffic", while access to a lake could be considered "local traffic", I
would think it would be better if these would be highway=service, or
highway=track.


> The US Topo map gives forest road references so I add ref FS .
>
That is what I have been doing as well. Some are recommending that they be
made into route relations, which I am starting to do.

>
> TIGER seems to be at best very coarse, at worst fictional.
>
+1

Mike
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[Talk-us] Labeling forestry service roads/tracks

[tj-osmwiki]

Hi folks,

Editing in Boundary County, Idaho in the Panhandle, I've been extending
the forest landuse area around Bonners Ferry and have come across a
difficulty in classifying forest roads.

It seems that many have been automatically imported and have
highway=residential, which is just plain wrong.

For roads that appear metalled (paved) and/or access mines, quarries,
communication towers etc. I label highway=service, for roads that are
unpaved or sometimes seem to almost fade out I label highway=track. For
roads that appear to be public access (e.g. to go to a lake) but are
obviously even more minor than tertiary roads I label highway=unclassified.

Is there a more consistent recommended method?

The US Topo map gives forest road references so I add ref FS .

TIGER seems to be at best very coarse, at worst fictional.

Thanks.

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[Talk-us] weeklyOSM #521 2020-07-07-2020-07-13

[weeklyteam]

The weekly round-up of OSM news, issue # 521,
is now available online in English, giving as always a summary of a lot of 
things happening in the openstreetmap world:

 https://www.weeklyosm.eu/en/archives/13416/

Enjoy! 

Did you know that you can also submit messages for the weeklyOSM? Just log in 
to https://osmbc.openstreetmap.de/login with your OSM account. Read more about 
how to write a post here: 
http://www.weeklyosm.eu/this-news-should-be-in-weeklyosm 

weeklyOSM? 
who: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WeeklyOSM#Available_Languages 
where?: 
https://umap.openstreetmap.fr/en/map/weeklyosm-is-currently-produced-in_56718#2/8.6/108.3
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