[Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
Hi, At past OSM meetups that I've organized, new mappers have asked me what shop=* tags to use for several chain stores in the USA and I had not found any clear or consistent practices of what tags to use for these stores and even as a relatively experienced mapper, I wasn't sure what tags to encourage them to use. I am writing to hear what you've used, which ones are most popular, and perhaps the US community could build a consensus on them (gasp!). For example, several chain stores that we have wondered about include: K-Mart, Target, Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, 'Bed, Bath, and Beyond'; TJ Maxx; Marshall's; Radio Shack; Meijer's; Kohl's; Costco; BJ's; and Big Lots. I know there's taginfo (including one for the US! taginfo.openstreetmap.us) but unfortunately, it doesn't let you find out what tag combinations are being used with a name=* (For example, finding what tag is used most often with name=Dollar-General). Regards, Will Skora ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
Seems the stores you listed are going to have different tags, example the 'dollar' stores are probably best tagged shop=variety_store, the wiki has a pretty extensive list/description of the shop tags here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shop However, I would say that K-Mart, Target, and Wal-Mart (especially the 'super' kind) maybe don't fit any of the documented tags; I think there was some talk about adding a big_box or superstore, maybe hit up the tagging talk-list to see if that's still in the works. =Russ -Original Message- From: Will Skora [mailto:skorasau...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2013 8:49 AM To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org Subject: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States Hi, At past OSM meetups that I've organized, new mappers have asked me what shop=* tags to use for several chain stores in the USA and I had not found any clear or consistent practices of what tags to use for these stores and even as a relatively experienced mapper, I wasn't sure what tags to encourage them to use. I am writing to hear what you've used, which ones are most popular, and perhaps the US community could build a consensus on them (gasp!). For example, several chain stores that we have wondered about include: K-Mart, Target, Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, 'Bed, Bath, and Beyond'; TJ Maxx; Marshall's; Radio Shack; Meijer's; Kohl's; Costco; BJ's; and Big Lots. I know there's taginfo (including one for the US! taginfo.openstreetmap.us) but unfortunately, it doesn't let you find out what tag combinations are being used with a name=* (For example, finding what tag is used most often with name=Dollar-General). Regards, Will Skora ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
Personally, I tag big box stores like Target, KMart, WalMart etc with shop=department_store, just because that seems like the closest fit that isn't too restrictive (they're much more than a supermarket, to my mind). You can pick an area and run Overpass Turbo and see what you get with different tags, for example: http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=department_storekey=shoptemplate=key-value Alternatively, you can run a search by name (ie http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=Targetkey=nametemplate=key-value) and see what you get. I did this in Chicago, and found Targets tagged department_store, supermarket, and hypermarket(!) Brad On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 10:08 AM, Russell Deffner russdeff...@gmail.comwrote: Seems the stores you listed are going to have different tags, example the 'dollar' stores are probably best tagged shop=variety_store, the wiki has a pretty extensive list/description of the shop tags here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shop However, I would say that K-Mart, Target, and Wal-Mart (especially the 'super' kind) maybe don't fit any of the documented tags; I think there was some talk about adding a big_box or superstore, maybe hit up the tagging talk-list to see if that's still in the works. =Russ -Original Message- From: Will Skora [mailto:skorasau...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2013 8:49 AM To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org Subject: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States Hi, At past OSM meetups that I've organized, new mappers have asked me what shop=* tags to use for several chain stores in the USA and I had not found any clear or consistent practices of what tags to use for these stores and even as a relatively experienced mapper, I wasn't sure what tags to encourage them to use. I am writing to hear what you've used, which ones are most popular, and perhaps the US community could build a consensus on them (gasp!). For example, several chain stores that we have wondered about include: K-Mart, Target, Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, 'Bed, Bath, and Beyond'; TJ Maxx; Marshall's; Radio Shack; Meijer's; Kohl's; Costco; BJ's; and Big Lots. I know there's taginfo (including one for the US! taginfo.openstreetmap.us) but unfortunately, it doesn't let you find out what tag combinations are being used with a name=* (For example, finding what tag is used most often with name=Dollar-General). Regards, Will Skora ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
I don't know if it catches all the chains you are interested in, but Aaron Lidman has been collecting the consensus tag schemes for various business names for presets in iD. I think his current compilation is https://github.com/systemed/iD/blob/master/data/name-suggestions.json Eric On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 10:49 AM, Will Skora skorasau...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, At past OSM meetups that I've organized, new mappers have asked me what shop=* tags to use for several chain stores in the USA and I had not found any clear or consistent practices of what tags to use for these stores and even as a relatively experienced mapper, I wasn't sure what tags to encourage them to use. I am writing to hear what you've used, which ones are most popular, and perhaps the US community could build a consensus on them (gasp!). For example, several chain stores that we have wondered about include: K-Mart, Target, Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, 'Bed, Bath, and Beyond'; TJ Maxx; Marshall's; Radio Shack; Meijer's; Kohl's; Costco; BJ's; and Big Lots. I know there's taginfo (including one for the US! taginfo.openstreetmap.us) but unfortunately, it doesn't let you find out what tag combinations are being used with a name=* (For example, finding what tag is used most often with name=Dollar-General). Regards, Will Skora ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
I get this question a lot during mapping parties -- probably because I suggest these sorts of places as a user's first edit. I wonder if we should add presets to iD for these sorts of places with tons of locations (Starbucks, McDonald's, etc.) so that they show up when searched in the preset list by the user. Is that too close to selling out? On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 10:36 AM, Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.comwrote: Personally, I tag big box stores like Target, KMart, WalMart etc with shop=department_store, just because that seems like the closest fit that isn't too restrictive (they're much more than a supermarket, to my mind). You can pick an area and run Overpass Turbo and see what you get with different tags, for example: http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=department_storekey=shoptemplate=key-value Alternatively, you can run a search by name (ie http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=Targetkey=nametemplate=key-value) and see what you get. I did this in Chicago, and found Targets tagged department_store, supermarket, and hypermarket(!) Brad On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 10:08 AM, Russell Deffner russdeff...@gmail.comwrote: Seems the stores you listed are going to have different tags, example the 'dollar' stores are probably best tagged shop=variety_store, the wiki has a pretty extensive list/description of the shop tags here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shop However, I would say that K-Mart, Target, and Wal-Mart (especially the 'super' kind) maybe don't fit any of the documented tags; I think there was some talk about adding a big_box or superstore, maybe hit up the tagging talk-list to see if that's still in the works. =Russ -Original Message- From: Will Skora [mailto:skorasau...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2013 8:49 AM To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org Subject: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States Hi, At past OSM meetups that I've organized, new mappers have asked me what shop=* tags to use for several chain stores in the USA and I had not found any clear or consistent practices of what tags to use for these stores and even as a relatively experienced mapper, I wasn't sure what tags to encourage them to use. I am writing to hear what you've used, which ones are most popular, and perhaps the US community could build a consensus on them (gasp!). For example, several chain stores that we have wondered about include: K-Mart, Target, Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, 'Bed, Bath, and Beyond'; TJ Maxx; Marshall's; Radio Shack; Meijer's; Kohl's; Costco; BJ's; and Big Lots. I know there's taginfo (including one for the US! taginfo.openstreetmap.us) but unfortunately, it doesn't let you find out what tag combinations are being used with a name=* (For example, finding what tag is used most often with name=Dollar-General). Regards, Will Skora ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
I'd tagged a Dollar General and a Family Dollar as shop=convenience but based on Russ's comment decided to change them to variety_store. After I did that, I wondered what the predominate tagging was. First cut was to use taginfo to find all the objects with a name of 'Dollar General' (295 at this time). I was hoping I could just click on the Combinations tab to see what shop values were used. No such luck. So I opened all 295 Dollar General named objects in JOSM and poked around. Found all sorts of tagging including things like shop=Dollar General and amenity=marketplace. Decided to be a bit more rigorous and saved the XML and started doing some greps. Here are some approximate numbers: shop=convenience - 106 shop=variety_store - 66 shop=supermarket - 45 shop=department_store - 35 shop=discount - 14 shop=general - 13 amenity=marketplace - 12 shop=clothes - 3 shop=convenience_store - 1 shop=Dollar Store - 1 shop=gift - 1 Seems like there ought to be a much easier way to do this. Why does combinations come up empty? But it also seems like it is not clear cut that most mappers consider a Dollar General to be a variety store. Does anyone have a quicker and easier way to determine the combination of tags that have been used on objects similar to what one is mapping? -Tod On Wed, December 11, 2013 8:36 am, Brad Neuhauser wrote: Personally, I tag big box stores like Target, KMart, WalMart etc with shop=department_store, just because that seems like the closest fit that isn't too restrictive (they're much more than a supermarket, to my mind). You can pick an area and run Overpass Turbo and see what you get with different tags, for example: http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=department_storekey=shoptemplate=key-value Alternatively, you can run a search by name (ie http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=Targetkey=nametemplate=key-value) and see what you get. I did this in Chicago, and found Targets tagged department_store, supermarket, and hypermarket(!) Brad On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 10:08 AM, Russell Deffner russdeff...@gmail.comwrote: Seems the stores you listed are going to have different tags, example the 'dollar' stores are probably best tagged shop=variety_store, the wiki has a pretty extensive list/description of the shop tags here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shop However, I would say that K-Mart, Target, and Wal-Mart (especially the 'super' kind) maybe don't fit any of the documented tags; I think there was some talk about adding a big_box or superstore, maybe hit up the tagging talk-list to see if that's still in the works. =Russ -Original Message- From: Will Skora [mailto:skorasau...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2013 8:49 AM To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org Subject: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States Hi, At past OSM meetups that I've organized, new mappers have asked me what shop=* tags to use for several chain stores in the USA and I had not found any clear or consistent practices of what tags to use for these stores and even as a relatively experienced mapper, I wasn't sure what tags to encourage them to use. I am writing to hear what you've used, which ones are most popular, and perhaps the US community could build a consensus on them (gasp!). For example, several chain stores that we have wondered about include: K-Mart, Target, Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, 'Bed, Bath, and Beyond'; TJ Maxx; Marshall's; Radio Shack; Meijer's; Kohl's; Costco; BJ's; and Big Lots. I know there's taginfo (including one for the US! taginfo.openstreetmap.us) but unfortunately, it doesn't let you find out what tag combinations are being used with a name=* (For example, finding what tag is used most often with name=Dollar-General). Regards, Will Skora ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
Hey guys, I‘ve tried to solve a mostly related problem in iD last month. I just blogged about it here: https://www.mapbox.com/blog/common-names-in-id/ You can try it out in iD here: http://openstreetmap.us/iD/master Just add geometry, and search for a really common name, like K-Mart, McDonalds, etc.. iD should take care of it for you, using the most used tagging already in OSM. For more detail. I made the name-suggestion-index: https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index which looks at which names/tag combinations are used most often and tries to promote the most used usage of a name. This stuff is more concerned about names, but we’re also merging together different tagging for features. So a place like Subway is used in both amenity=restaurant and amenity=fast_food, we’re looking at the most common usage and ignoring anything else. The ‘most correct’ list of names and tagging is here: https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/name-suggestions.json It’s not great right now but I’m still working on improving it to make iD smarter, and maybe it can be used elsewhere too. It’s mostly a manual process that I’ve been doing for now but I hope to automate it more, and update it with every planet update. Right now we’re only concerned with places with names that have been used more than 50 times, also mostly amenity=* and shop=* tags right now. We had some previous discussions along these lines here: https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/dev/2013-November/027519.html https://github.com/systemed/iD/issues/1949 ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
2013/12/11 Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.com Personally, I tag big box stores like Target, KMart, WalMart etc with shop=department_store, just because that seems like the closest fit that isn't too restrictive (they're much more than a supermarket, to my mind). a supermarket can sell a lot of stuff that is not food and still remain a supermarket, e.g. the bigger ones might also sell clothing or some consumer electronics (tv, pc). A department_store has lots of stuff and lots of salesclerks serving you. kmart vs. http://www.flickr.com/photos/72294117@N03/7645650440/in/photolist-cDBXvj-dq7UY1-ePHTru-bzJeq-bzJiD-cLqWVb-cLqV7E-cLr1dJ-9HVd61-93H2Bi-fqvVSW-fqgRhp-fqgCZF-fqvSz9-fqgDvH-9XxowN-cDBZdU-cz73B1-8pPW7V-gvtUD5-gvtG83-7MJmWf-7MJoSQ-7MEupg-7MJuo7-7MJoKf-7MEpki-7MJrKW-7MEmRp-7MEmtr-7MEB4M-7MJtrd-7MJn5G-7MEBMa-7MEmAt-92tyfy-ePJ3xs-gvubH6-akA57y-ekk8vZ-cgQsed-7Zsd71-cXAMRY-cXAL4q-cXAHio-cXAJiQ-asWMnp-buguzF-bugtMt-c4vfy9-8m1Xv1 department stores: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Central_Department_Store_ZUM_Sofia_20090406_007.JPG http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Harrods%27_Egyptian_room.JPG http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/03/Paris_Lafayette_inside.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:KaDeWe_Deli.JPG generally a department_store has more of the pricier stuff or at least tries not to appear too cheap, while a supermarket tries the opposite: appear as cheap as possible. Also a supermarket will have a huge parking in front of it, while a department store will be found in the city center and will have an underground or parking deck. For those you name I think they would be better classified as supermarkets. cheers, Martin ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
On 12/11/13 2:38 PM, Brad Neuhauser wrote: Martin, I agree with a lot of what you're saying about department stores, but not with what you're calling supermarket. I think the wikipedia entry for supermarkets is good, so will suggest you read that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supermarket As I said, department_store seemed like the best of available options, but not a precise fit. Maybe (to circle back to an earlier part of this thread) we should try to find another term? I'd never heard of hypermarket before today (well, outside of science fiction), but it has a wikipedia article and makes as much sense as anything. That'd probably be something to take to the tagging list... classically, the tier of stores under discussion (k-mart, walmart, target, etc.) are discount department stores or discount stores for short. there's actually some interesting legal history about their existence but it's probably a little offtopic. i'm not sure the distinction is important any more, since higher end department stores are now prone to discount heavily, usually in the form of near-eternal sales. so looking for department store gets you both Walmart and Macy's - most consumers know the difference between the two, at least in their native land. a British user will know perfectly well what Marks Spencer means when they query department_store. richard signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
We should create a general store type value, because Walmart, Supertarget, etc are basically following the Fred Meyer model and Fred Meyer never really stopped calling itself a genderal store until the Kroger merger. Note, I'm only talking about the full-scale Fred Meyer locations (which tend to be around the size and appearance of a Walmart and a Home Depot combined at the stores that sell the complete line that Fred Meyer carries), not what seems to be the vast majority of them anymore these days (especially outside the pacific northwest), which would fall under shop=jewelry very cleanly. On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 10:36 AM, Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.comwrote: Personally, I tag big box stores like Target, KMart, WalMart etc with shop=department_store, just because that seems like the closest fit that isn't too restrictive (they're much more than a supermarket, to my mind). You can pick an area and run Overpass Turbo and see what you get with different tags, for example: http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=department_storekey=shoptemplate=key-value Alternatively, you can run a search by name (ie http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=Targetkey=nametemplate=key-value) and see what you get. I did this in Chicago, and found Targets tagged department_store, supermarket, and hypermarket(!) Brad On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 10:08 AM, Russell Deffner russdeff...@gmail.comwrote: Seems the stores you listed are going to have different tags, example the 'dollar' stores are probably best tagged shop=variety_store, the wiki has a pretty extensive list/description of the shop tags here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shop However, I would say that K-Mart, Target, and Wal-Mart (especially the 'super' kind) maybe don't fit any of the documented tags; I think there was some talk about adding a big_box or superstore, maybe hit up the tagging talk-list to see if that's still in the works. =Russ -Original Message- From: Will Skora [mailto:skorasau...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2013 8:49 AM To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org Subject: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States Hi, At past OSM meetups that I've organized, new mappers have asked me what shop=* tags to use for several chain stores in the USA and I had not found any clear or consistent practices of what tags to use for these stores and even as a relatively experienced mapper, I wasn't sure what tags to encourage them to use. I am writing to hear what you've used, which ones are most popular, and perhaps the US community could build a consensus on them (gasp!). For example, several chain stores that we have wondered about include: K-Mart, Target, Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, 'Bed, Bath, and Beyond'; TJ Maxx; Marshall's; Radio Shack; Meijer's; Kohl's; Costco; BJ's; and Big Lots. I know there's taginfo (including one for the US! taginfo.openstreetmap.us) but unfortunately, it doesn't let you find out what tag combinations are being used with a name=* (For example, finding what tag is used most often with name=Dollar-General). Regards, Will Skora ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
On 12/11/2013 10:49 AM, Will Skora wrote: I know there's taginfo (including one for the US! taginfo.openstreetmap.us) but unfortunately, it doesn't let you find out what tag combinations are being used with a name=* (For example, finding what tag is used most often with name=Dollar-General). One minor problem with determining future tagging based on the frequency of past use is that better tags might be newer. For example, my impression is that shop=variety is newer than shop=department_store. But shop=variety also fits Dollar General much better than department_store IMO, which I had used in the early days. Just an opinion about the superstore that includes a full sized supermarket and full sized non-food department store: it almost merits its own tag, or at least 2 nodes to clearly show the 2 store classes. But then one could also argue to include the in-store bank, hairdresser, nail salon, snack shop, etc as separate nodes. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
On 12/11/13 3:18 PM, Mike N wrote: Just an opinion about the superstore that includes a full sized supermarket and full sized non-food department store: it almost merits its own tag, or at least 2 nodes to clearly show the 2 store classes. But then one could also argue to include the in-store bank, hairdresser, nail salon, snack shop, etc as separate nodes. separate nodes is probably the way to go, actually. a walmart super center consists of a walmart discount department store, a walmart supermarket, and a suite of the various in store services. i think you need a separate node because - citizen's bank, pizza hut, nathan's hot dogs, etc. you should identify the vendors providing the in store services because who they are can matter. richard signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: 2013/12/11 Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.com Personally, I tag big box stores like Target, KMart, WalMart etc with shop=department_store, just because that seems like the closest fit that isn't too restrictive (they're much more than a supermarket, to my mind). a supermarket can sell a lot of stuff that is not food and still remain a supermarket, e.g. the bigger ones might also sell clothing or some consumer electronics (tv, pc). A department_store has lots of stuff and lots of salesclerks serving you. kmart vs. http://www.flickr.com/photos/72294117@N03/7645650440/in/photolist-cDBXvj-dq7UY1-ePHTru-bzJeq-bzJiD-cLqWVb-cLqV7E-cLr1dJ-9HVd61-93H2Bi-fqvVSW-fqgRhp-fqgCZF-fqvSz9-fqgDvH-9XxowN-cDBZdU-cz73B1-8pPW7V-gvtUD5-gvtG83-7MJmWf-7MJoSQ-7MEupg-7MJuo7-7MJoKf-7MEpki-7MJrKW-7MEmRp-7MEmtr-7MEB4M-7MJtrd-7MJn5G-7MEBMa-7MEmAt-92tyfy-ePJ3xs-gvubH6-akA57y-ekk8vZ-cgQsed-7Zsd71-cXAMRY-cXAL4q-cXAHio-cXAJiQ-asWMnp-buguzF-bugtMt-c4vfy9-8m1Xv1 department stores: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Central_Department_Store_ZUM_Sofia_20090406_007.JPG http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Harrods%27_Egyptian_room.JPG http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/03/Paris_Lafayette_inside.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:KaDeWe_Deli.JPG generally a department_store has more of the pricier stuff or at least tries not to appear too cheap, while a supermarket tries the opposite: appear as cheap as possible. Also a supermarket will have a huge parking in front of it, while a department store will be found in the city center and will have an underground or parking deck. For those you name I think they would be better classified as supermarkets. cheers, Martin ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us However, in common usage, supermarket refers to a store where the majority of merchandise sold is food. The big-box stores typically sell some food, but the majority of the merchandise is not food. -- John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
Richard Welty on 2013-12-11: On 12/11/13 3:18 PM, Mike N wrote: Just an opinion about the superstore that includes a full sized supermarket and full sized non-food department store: it almost merits its own tag, or at least 2 nodes to clearly show the 2 store classes. But then one could also argue to include the in-store bank, hairdresser, nail salon, snack shop, etc as separate nodes. separate nodes is probably the way to go, actually. a walmart super center consists of a walmart discount department store, a walmart supermarket, and a suite of the various in store services. i think you need a separate node because - citizen's bank, pizza hut, nathan's hot dogs, etc. you should identify the vendors providing the in store services because who they are can matter. +1, especially since each sub-store may have its own opening hours, website, and phone number. I've also been using separate nodes for pharmacies and banks within supermarkets. ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
Am 11/dic/2013 um 21:26 schrieb Richard Welty rwe...@averillpark.net: a walmart super center consists of a walmart discount department store, a walmart supermarket, and a suite of the various in store services. i think you need a separate node because - citizen's bank, pizza hut, nathan's hot dogs, etc. you should identify the vendors providing the in store services because who they are can matter. are these different from a shopping mall? Maybe that's a new class like shop=super_center (or is this a brand?) or superstore or ... Or maybe an attribute to supermarket? Cheers, Martin ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
On 12/11/13 4:16 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: are these different from a shopping mall? Maybe that's a new class like shop=super_center (or is this a brand?) or superstore or ... Or maybe an attribute to supermarket? shop=super_center would make some sense. basically, they're an even bigger version of the big box, with the discount department store on one side and the supermarket on the other, neither really being dominant. and usually they have some contract vendors for additional services near the exists, like banks, food vendors, opticians, etc. so you could draw one big outline and then nodes for the supermarket, the department_store, and the individual vendors. or you could tag the whole outline with shop=supercenter and then drop nodes for the contractors (amenity=fast_food, name=Pizza Hut and so forth) richard signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
on a tangential but related matter, do we have tagging for the club type shopping venues (e.g. Costco, Sam's Club, B.J.'s Wholesale Club, etc). they are discount department stores of a particularly stripped down nature, but with an annual membership fee. maybe a subtag about membership, perhaps membership_required=yes richard signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
Re: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States
Ian, I had a working list of this stuff, partially built from Paul Norman's list and partially built from Wikipedia. If you tell me a place and a format, I can convert it to that. - Serge On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 11:44 AM, Ian Dees ian.d...@gmail.com wrote: I get this question a lot during mapping parties -- probably because I suggest these sorts of places as a user's first edit. I wonder if we should add presets to iD for these sorts of places with tons of locations (Starbucks, McDonald's, etc.) so that they show up when searched in the preset list by the user. Is that too close to selling out? On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 10:36 AM, Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.com wrote: Personally, I tag big box stores like Target, KMart, WalMart etc with shop=department_store, just because that seems like the closest fit that isn't too restrictive (they're much more than a supermarket, to my mind). You can pick an area and run Overpass Turbo and see what you get with different tags, for example: http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=department_storekey=shoptemplate=key-value Alternatively, you can run a search by name (ie http://overpass-turbo.eu/?value=Targetkey=nametemplate=key-value) and see what you get. I did this in Chicago, and found Targets tagged department_store, supermarket, and hypermarket(!) Brad On Wed, Dec 11, 2013 at 10:08 AM, Russell Deffner russdeff...@gmail.comwrote: Seems the stores you listed are going to have different tags, example the 'dollar' stores are probably best tagged shop=variety_store, the wiki has a pretty extensive list/description of the shop tags here: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:shop However, I would say that K-Mart, Target, and Wal-Mart (especially the 'super' kind) maybe don't fit any of the documented tags; I think there was some talk about adding a big_box or superstore, maybe hit up the tagging talk-list to see if that's still in the works. =Russ -Original Message- From: Will Skora [mailto:skorasau...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2013 8:49 AM To: talk-us@openstreetmap.org Subject: [Talk-us] Tags to use for chain stores in the United States Hi, At past OSM meetups that I've organized, new mappers have asked me what shop=* tags to use for several chain stores in the USA and I had not found any clear or consistent practices of what tags to use for these stores and even as a relatively experienced mapper, I wasn't sure what tags to encourage them to use. I am writing to hear what you've used, which ones are most popular, and perhaps the US community could build a consensus on them (gasp!). For example, several chain stores that we have wondered about include: K-Mart, Target, Wal-Mart, Dollar General, Dollar Tree, Family Dollar, 'Bed, Bath, and Beyond'; TJ Maxx; Marshall's; Radio Shack; Meijer's; Kohl's; Costco; BJ's; and Big Lots. I know there's taginfo (including one for the US! taginfo.openstreetmap.us) but unfortunately, it doesn't let you find out what tag combinations are being used with a name=* (For example, finding what tag is used most often with name=Dollar-General). Regards, Will Skora ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us ___ Talk-us mailing list Talk-us@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-us
