DEAD HORSE (was Re: 1.44)

[Marck D. Pearlstone]

Hi MaXxX,

On 28 May 2000 at 22:30:07 GMT +0200 (which was 21:30 where I
live) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote and made these points on the subject
of "1.44":

M> Hello phil and all you Batters out there.

p>> Yeah the add-on program should have been written by "microsoft" but
p>> they call all these exploits that keep coming out "features" while
p>> denying there is any problem.
M>  (LARGE snip-snip-snip)
p>> Anyway, I've had enough of this.   Maybe what everyone wants is no
p>> privacy, no security, no anonymity a new world order with a dictator,
p>> and sweeping laws against everything.   Continue down the path then...

M> 'xcuse me...
M> ...
M> Excuse me!...
M> ...
M> EXCUSE MEEE!!!...
M> ...
M> HEY! YOU! I'M TALKIN' TO YOU, YOU HEAR ME!??
M> Good.
M> .
M> .
M> Sorry :)
M> Anyway, what did all that M$ talk have to do with Bat? IOW, are you for
M> keeping all the settings in the registry, or not??

Please  move  this thread to TBOT - if you want to discuss it further.
It's gone *way* off topic and is begin to bog down the list. So - it's
a DEAD HORSE here now.

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.\\arck

Marck D. Pearlstone, Consultant Software Engineer
Moderator TBUDL / TBBETA
www: http://www.silverstones.com
PGP key: 

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Re: Address book.

[Tony Boom]

29/05/2000 13:19 GMT.

Hello TBBETA,

  In an attempt to recover some of my email addresses I decided to
  restore the OE5 .wab from the backup I made. Along with this in
  the Windows/Application/Microsoft/Address Book directory was an
  ABD file.

  So, as Jast suggested I used the option in TB to Open an Address
  book. (CTRL+O). This resulted in a completely restored Bat address
  book complete with all my lost templates.

  Now I'm not complaining about this but I'm extremely puzzled as to
  how my Bat ABD got put in the above directory along with OE5's
  address book. What is even more puzzling is why this copy restored
  perfectly and the actual ABD's from TB's directory didn't?


  
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Re: 1.44

[Jast]

Morning Stefan Tanurkov,

> The problem is that a single "stupid" user on a single machine (i.e.
> without administrator) should not have easy access to this feature.

 Okay, but what about the average "knows what he is doing" user (like me)
 I'm educated enough to know what attachments I can open safely and what is
 potentially dangerous. Still, I wouldn't regularly search the registry for
 new entrys that might turn off some annoying confirmation boxes. I do
 believe these settings should at least be documented, otherwise it is not
 more than security through obscurity and nothing but annoying for anyone
 savvy.
 


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Re[8]: 1.44

[tracer]

Hello Stefan Tanurkov,
On Mon, 29 May 2000 08:08:38 +0300 GMT your local time,
which was Monday, May 29, 2000, 12:08:38 PM (GMT+0700) my local time,
Stefan Tanurkov wrote:


> Hello tracer,

t>> But I donot agree having to go into the registry to change it.
t>> There IS an administrators menu somewhere anyway, why not add this to
t>> it?

> The problem is that a single "stupid" user on a single machine (i.e. without
> administrator) should not have easy access to this feature. The only
> thing I can think of is a secret key combination. But using .REG
> files seems to be more practical especially within large networks -
> you do not want to type those values in on each machine even using the
> nicest interface, do you? ;-)

The problem is that I could do that over the network anyway but if
you have administrators settings, normal users shouldnt be able to
change them and also. what about the bulk of email users?
They havent got a clue what they are doing and imagine they test the
Bat as potential emailer and get these warnings and cannot get rid of
them OR modify them.
if I would set up the BAT as administrator they shouldnt be able to
get to any settings even via the registry.
If its their own system, they should have the right to deactivate
things they donot like.
if it means they get caught by a virus, their problem.
If potential customers see those banners they may cost you lost
sales...




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tracer

Using theBAT 1.44 

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Re[8]: 1.44

[Thomas Speer]

Hallo Stefan,

Am 29.05.2000 um 07:08 Uhr, schriebst Du:

ST> Hello tracer,

t>> But I donot agree having to go into the registry to change it.
t>> There IS an administrators menu somewhere anyway, why not add this to
t>> it?

ST> The problem is that a single "stupid" user on a single machine (i.e. without
ST> administrator) should not have easy access to this feature. The only
ST> thing I can think of is a secret key combination. But using .REG
ST> files seems to be more practical especially within large networks -
ST> you do not want to type those values in on each machine even using the
ST> nicest interface, do you? ;-)

I have no Problem with editing the registry, but I know a lot of
users that are using windows quite a lot and haven't even seen the
registry on their system.

These users have grown up with checkboxes and radiobuttons not knowing
about any hidden configfiles they don't need to know

These userers are stetting up the bat on their system and a lot of
them know what files are dangerous and which aren't!

So I would vote for something in the Bats UI (maybe something an admin
could deactivate (grey) in the registry settings :-) )




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--
Okay, who put a "stop payment" on my reality check? 
--
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Re: 1.44

[Christopher J. Trybowski]

Hello tracer,
On Monday, May 29, 2000 you wrote:

t> You would if you are an administrator and have more then one system...

And  you'd  like to click thousands of checkboxes? Hmm, interesting, I
usually do it once, export the registry and import it other systems...

t> imagine the fun if someone writes a virus to just add *.msg to
t> protection for the BAT.
t> First special antibat virus created...

Oh,  gee, big deal. Imagine a virus that removes whole registry branch
"RIT". And what? User runs TB and sees no accounts. That is something!

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Re: 1.44

[Christopher J. Trybowski]

Hello tracer,
On Monday, May 29, 2000 you wrote:

t> But  I  donot  agree  having  to go into the registry to change it.
t> There  IS an administrators menu somewhere anyway, why not add this
t> to it?

I  don't  know  guys  what's  the problem. Is there any? You edit such
properties once and then you can copy them across computers...

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Re: 1.44

[Christopher J. Trybowski]

Hello Thomas,
On Monday, May 29, 2000 you wrote:

TS> Hallo Stefan,

TS> Am 29.05.2000 um 07:08 Uhr, schriebst Du:

ST>> Hello tracer,

t>>> But I donot agree having to go into the registry to change it.
t>>> There IS an administrators menu somewhere anyway, why not add this to
t>>> it?

ST>> The problem is that a single "stupid" user on a single machine (i.e. without
ST>> administrator) should not have easy access to this feature. The only
ST>> thing I can think of is a secret key combination. But using .REG
ST>> files seems to be more practical especially within large networks -
ST>> you do not want to type those values in on each machine even using the
ST>> nicest interface, do you? ;-)

TS> I have no Problem with editing the registry, but I know a lot of
TS> users that are using windows quite a lot and haven't even seen the
TS> registry on their system.

Which  means  that  they green. And such inexperienced users shouldn't
edit   these properties. Besides it's time to learn something at last.
;)

Actually  putting switches in configuration files, and not supplying a
setup  program  (or  dialog  box) is what is common in Linux and other
Unix systems...

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Stef, Max: address book and templates

[Andreas Schwartmann]

Salve to you Bat folks,

I forward a message from Florian Effenberger:
--
Thanks to Andreas Schwartmann for posting this to TBUDL. I have not
much time at the moment to read mailing lists and so I have asked him
to post it for me as he reads TBUDL regularly.

This posting is originated from Florian Effenberger.

Dear The Bat! users and development team,

recently I have developed a little annoying behaviour in The Bat!
1.44. I have three groups in my address book for three types of
customers. I have attached a special template ("You are receiving this
message because you are a customer of...") to the groups.

I expected the following to happen:
- when I write a message to *ALL* users in the group (i.e. the whole
group), the template gets used
- when I write a message to *ONE INDIVIDUAL*, who is coincidentially
also in the group, my normal template gets used

Unfortunately, in both cases the group template gets used. Could you
please change that? Thank you very much in advance!

Sincerely yours,
Florian



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Andreas




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Message created with The Bat 1.44 under Windows 98 4.10 Build 1998
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Re[2]: 1.44

[MaXxX]

Hello Christopher and all you Batters out there.

TS>> I have no Problem with editing the registry, but I know a lot of
TS>> users that are using windows quite a lot and haven't even seen the
TS>> registry on their system.

CJT> Which  means  that  they green. And such inexperienced users shouldn't
CJT> edit   these properties. Besides it's time to learn something at last.
CJT> ;)

Yes - and it's the users that should learn to read. If it says, "DON'T TOUCH
OR YOU'LL MESS UP YOUR COMPUTER", it MEANS it. If a user is stupid enough to
mess it up anyway - then it's their problem. Sure, an administrator should be
able to disable those dangerous options completely - but they definitely
should NOT be disabled by default.
It's like buying a car, you know? Would you want a car that would
automatically slow down to "a default speed safe for you", WITHOUT giving you
an option to push the acceleration anyway?

CJT> Actually  putting switches in configuration files, and not supplying a
CJT> setup  program  (or  dialog  box) is what is common in Linux and other
CJT> Unix systems...

Yep, you're dead right. It's common in Unix systems. But NOT in Windows.

Similarly, an installation that required the user to unzip, compile and link
the application is typical for all Unixes - imagine what would happen if a
Windows user had to COMPILE his newly downloaded program! @_@

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Re: Stef, Max: address book and templates

[Dieter Hummel]

Hello List Members,

on 29.05.2000 at 17:49, Andreas Schwartmann wrote:

> recently I have developed a little annoying behaviour in The Bat!
> 1.44. I have three groups in my address book for three types of

Why  /did/  he  develop  such behavior when he's going to complain about
that afterwards?  ;-/   

Regards
Dieter Hummel

Running TheBat! 1.44 [2E7F60DA] on
Windows NT v4 Build 1381 Service Pack 6

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