Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working
Whoever programmed the PIC in question inverted the signal for some reason. There should be no need for an inverter to use the MAX232 devices, they knew what they were doing when they designed them. If you have an inverted TTL serial signal then you can connect it straight to n RS-232 port and there is a very good change it will just work. They call it TTL level RS-232. BUt if you want to reliable drive a long cable it is best to level convert to true RS-232. But today most re-232 is actually using zero and five volts. -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Nortel/Thunderbolt questions
Hi I believe what you have here is a Trimble / Nortel box rather than a TBolt - is this correct? If so there are a number of differences in what you can and can't do with LH. Also since it's a different design, the filter is set up differently. That said, it should show lock, sats, dac voltage, and status correctly. Bob On Jul 12, 2013, at 3:56 PM, Jim Sanford wb4...@wb4gcs.org wrote: All: My Nortel receiver has been running for 6 days now. I am running the Lady Heather software, but also have TBOLTMON. It shows my position fairly well, but I have seen a negative altitude, and am currently seeing 1565' altitude. Based on local maps and the GPS in the car, I believe the antenna to be no higher than 1280'. I get lock with 4 to 6 satellites colored green. I have seen PHASE LOCKED, but am currently seeing recovery mode and the LOCKED LED on the unit is flashing, which I think I remember means recovery. I have several questions: 1. Sometimes position is displayed in yellow, sometimes in white. What is the significance of the color? 2. I see TC 100.0 sec, DAMP1.200, GAIN 1.2 Hz/v, INIT 3.00V. When I go to KE5FX site, his values for TC, DAMP, Gain and INIT are very different. In particular, if DAMP is damping in a control loop, I am not surprised that my very overdamped unit is not locking. Question: Are these parameters that will converge, or are they parameters I should try to set? The heather.cpp files suggests that they may be settable, but does not say how. 3. On my plot, I see an RMS value in green, which suggests to me that something is happy with the DAC voltage, even if very different from John's. The scale is 10uV/div which suggests to me that it is NOT locked. 4. On my plot, I see an RMS value in yellow, which suggests to me that the temp is OK, but the scale on temp is growing at the momoent, 10mC/div; John's is 50 mC/div, but a much smoother plot than mine. What is this telling me? ROM,RAM, OSC, FPGA, POWER, EEPROM, ANTENNA, ALMANAC, DISCIPLINE, SAVED POSITION status are all OK, even though altitude is bad. Can anyone help me understand what I am seeing, and in particular, why it won't lock, or stay locked, when it is seeing good sat signals? Thanks! Jim wb4...@amsat.org ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working
If a TTL signal does just work with your RS232 receiver, you have a faulty receiver. The receiver is supposed to have a dead zone from +3V to -3V. If you can get the receiver to function with 0V to +3V, it has substandard noise immunity. And then there is the little matter of what will happen to the TTL input being connected to a real RS232 driver when It sees a potential +12V to -12V input. I know that TTL level signals used to work with the original IBM-PC comports, but they were using home made receivers and drivers that did not meet the RS-232 spec. The biggest problem with the MAX232 is its receiver was designed not to the RS232 spec, but rather to work in the same way as the IBM-PC comports. It's RS side threshold is at 1.3V, and it has only 0.5V of hysteresis. It's not a bug, it's a feature? -Chuck Harris Chris Albertson wrote: Whoever programmed the PIC in question inverted the signal for some reason. There should be no need for an inverter to use the MAX232 devices, they knew what they were doing when they designed them. If you have an inverted TTL serial signal then you can connect it straight to n RS-232 port and there is a very good change it will just work. They call it TTL level RS-232. BUt if you want to reliable drive a long cable it is best to level convert to true RS-232. But today most re-232 is actually using zero and five volts. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working
Guys, The PIC in question was knowingly programmed upside down with the N option so it could talk directly to the computer without an RS232 converter. (input side suitably protected from -voltage levels) This works of most PC's which in actuality use 3.3 Volt logic in their RS232 port and input clamp highs/lows to be within the logic family limits. There are two serial port choices for a PIC in the PICAXE/BS2 compilers N and T. From the PICAXE manual. N idles low and T idles high. When using a simple resistor interface use N (inverted) When using a MAX232 type interface use T The bottom line is depending upon what your device is putting out and what you are talking to you may or may not need an inverter for use with the MAX232. Regards, Brian On 7/13/2013 03:10, Chris Albertson wrote: You have it 100% correct. The UT+ uses positive logic are the logic 1 is 5-volts but the RS-232 standard uses negative logic. I think the MAX232 does the conversion correctly EXCEPT if you read the RS-232 standards they use positive logic for the control signals. On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:34 PM, Bob Stewart b...@evoria.net wrote: Hi Brian, That's just strange. There are a whole lot of these MAX232 and MAX3232 devices being sold. Hmm, I'm looking at the UT+ User's Guide, and it lists the voltage levels as follows. These would imply that an inverter is necessary, right? Could it be that someone programmed your PIC upside down - i.e. using negative logic? TTL 0 V to 0.8 V = logic 0 2.4 V to 5.0 V = logic 1 RS-232 (reordered from manual to put logic 0 on top) 5 V to 15 V = logic 0 -5 V to -15 V = logic 1 Bob - AE6RV From: Brian Alsop als...@nc.rr.com To: Bob Stewart b...@evoria.net; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 9:09 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working Hi Bob, Here is my experience. I had a PIC that output RS232 at 0-5 volt levels. It actually worked with my computer directly. When I added a MAX 232 to make the levels something like -10/+10 volts. It didn't work. That's because the MAX232 inverts the polarity. Look at the data sheet, the level converters are clearly inverters. The fix in my case was to invert the RS232 stream output by the PIC and all was fine. I'm not sure exactly what you have but a scope sorts it out quickly. 73 de Brian/K3KO ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2242 / Virus Database: 3204/5987 - Release Date: 07/12/13 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working
Most MAX have two sets and one could use one as an inverter if one does not want to add an extra IC. Bert Kehren In a message dated 7/13/2013 10:09:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, als...@nc.rr.com writes: Guys, The PIC in question was knowingly programmed upside down with the N option so it could talk directly to the computer without an RS232 converter. (input side suitably protected from -voltage levels) This works of most PC's which in actuality use 3.3 Volt logic in their RS232 port and input clamp highs/lows to be within the logic family limits. There are two serial port choices for a PIC in the PICAXE/BS2 compilers N and T. From the PICAXE manual. N idles low and T idles high. When using a simple resistor interface use N (inverted) When using a MAX232 type interface use T The bottom line is depending upon what your device is putting out and what you are talking to you may or may not need an inverter for use with the MAX232. Regards, Brian On 7/13/2013 03:10, Chris Albertson wrote: You have it 100% correct. The UT+ uses positive logic are the logic 1 is 5-volts but the RS-232 standard uses negative logic. I think the MAX232 does the conversion correctly EXCEPT if you read the RS-232 standards they use positive logic for the control signals. On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:34 PM, Bob Stewart b...@evoria.net wrote: Hi Brian, That's just strange. There are a whole lot of these MAX232 and MAX3232 devices being sold. Hmm, I'm looking at the UT+ User's Guide, and it lists the voltage levels as follows. These would imply that an inverter is necessary, right? Could it be that someone programmed your PIC upside down - i.e. using negative logic? TTL 0 V to 0.8 V = logic 0 2.4 V to 5.0 V = logic 1 RS-232 (reordered from manual to put logic 0 on top) 5 V to 15 V = logic 0 -5 V to -15 V = logic 1 Bob - AE6RV From: Brian Alsop als...@nc.rr.com To: Bob Stewart b...@evoria.net; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 9:09 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working Hi Bob, Here is my experience. I had a PIC that output RS232 at 0-5 volt levels. It actually worked with my computer directly. When I added a MAX 232 to make the levels something like -10/+10 volts. It didn't work. That's because the MAX232 inverts the polarity. Look at the data sheet, the level converters are clearly inverters. The fix in my case was to invert the RS232 stream output by the PIC and all was fine. I'm not sure exactly what you have but a scope sorts it out quickly. 73 de Brian/K3KO ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2242 / Virus Database: 3204/5987 - Release Date: 07/12/13 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working
Hi Hooking the ~ +/- 10V output of a MAX 232 to one of it's CMOS logic inputs probably isn't a real good idea. Two resistors and a cheap transistor make a fine inverter in this case. Bob On Jul 13, 2013, at 11:29 AM, ewkeh...@aol.com wrote: Most MAX have two sets and one could use one as an inverter if one does not want to add an extra IC. Bert Kehren In a message dated 7/13/2013 10:09:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, als...@nc.rr.com writes: Guys, The PIC in question was knowingly programmed upside down with the N option so it could talk directly to the computer without an RS232 converter. (input side suitably protected from -voltage levels) This works of most PC's which in actuality use 3.3 Volt logic in their RS232 port and input clamp highs/lows to be within the logic family limits. There are two serial port choices for a PIC in the PICAXE/BS2 compilers N and T. From the PICAXE manual. N idles low and T idles high. When using a simple resistor interface use N (inverted) When using a MAX232 type interface use T The bottom line is depending upon what your device is putting out and what you are talking to you may or may not need an inverter for use with the MAX232. Regards, Brian On 7/13/2013 03:10, Chris Albertson wrote: You have it 100% correct. The UT+ uses positive logic are the logic 1 is 5-volts but the RS-232 standard uses negative logic. I think the MAX232 does the conversion correctly EXCEPT if you read the RS-232 standards they use positive logic for the control signals. On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:34 PM, Bob Stewart b...@evoria.net wrote: Hi Brian, That's just strange. There are a whole lot of these MAX232 and MAX3232 devices being sold. Hmm, I'm looking at the UT+ User's Guide, and it lists the voltage levels as follows. These would imply that an inverter is necessary, right? Could it be that someone programmed your PIC upside down - i.e. using negative logic? TTL 0 V to 0.8 V = logic 0 2.4 V to 5.0 V = logic 1 RS-232 (reordered from manual to put logic 0 on top) 5 V to 15 V = logic 0 -5 V to -15 V = logic 1 Bob - AE6RV From: Brian Alsop als...@nc.rr.com To: Bob Stewart b...@evoria.net; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 9:09 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working Hi Bob, Here is my experience. I had a PIC that output RS232 at 0-5 volt levels. It actually worked with my computer directly. When I added a MAX 232 to make the levels something like -10/+10 volts. It didn't work. That's because the MAX232 inverts the polarity. Look at the data sheet, the level converters are clearly inverters. The fix in my case was to invert the RS232 stream output by the PIC and all was fine. I'm not sure exactly what you have but a scope sorts it out quickly. 73 de Brian/K3KO ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2242 / Virus Database: 3204/5987 - Release Date: 07/12/13 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working
But a diode with two resistors is Bert kehren Sent from Samsung tabletBob Camp li...@rtty.us wrote:Hi Hooking the ~ +/- 10V output of a MAX 232 to one of it's CMOS logic inputs probably isn't a real good idea. Two resistors and a cheap transistor make a fine inverter in this case. Bob On Jul 13, 2013, at 11:29 AM, ewkeh...@aol.com wrote: Most MAX have two sets and one could use one as an inverter if one does not want to add an extra IC. Bert Kehren In a message dated 7/13/2013 10:09:12 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, als...@nc.rr.com writes: Guys, The PIC in question was knowingly programmed upside down with the N option so it could talk directly to the computer without an RS232 converter. (input side suitably protected from -voltage levels) This works of most PC's which in actuality use 3.3 Volt logic in their RS232 port and input clamp highs/lows to be within the logic family limits. There are two serial port choices for a PIC in the PICAXE/BS2 compilers N and T. From the PICAXE manual. N idles low and T idles high. When using a simple resistor interface use N (inverted) When using a MAX232 type interface use T The bottom line is depending upon what your device is putting out and what you are talking to you may or may not need an inverter for use with the MAX232. Regards, Brian On 7/13/2013 03:10, Chris Albertson wrote: You have it 100% correct. The UT+ uses positive logic are the logic 1 is 5-volts but the RS-232 standard uses negative logic. I think the MAX232 does the conversion correctly EXCEPT if you read the RS-232 standards they use positive logic for the control signals. On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 7:34 PM, Bob Stewart b...@evoria.net wrote: Hi Brian, That's just strange. There are a whole lot of these MAX232 and MAX3232 devices being sold. Hmm, I'm looking at the UT+ User's Guide, and it lists the voltage levels as follows. These would imply that an inverter is necessary, right? Could it be that someone programmed your PIC upside down - i.e. using negative logic? TTL 0 V to 0.8 V = logic 0 2.4 V to 5.0 V = logic 1 RS-232 (reordered from manual to put logic 0 on top) 5 V to 15 V = logic 0 -5 V to -15 V = logic 1 Bob - AE6RV From: Brian Alsop als...@nc.rr.com To: Bob Stewart b...@evoria.net; Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 9:09 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working Hi Bob, Here is my experience. I had a PIC that output RS232 at 0-5 volt levels. It actually worked with my computer directly. When I added a MAX 232 to make the levels something like -10/+10 volts. It didn't work. That's because the MAX232 inverts the polarity. Look at the data sheet, the level converters are clearly inverters. The fix in my case was to invert the RS232 stream output by the PIC and all was fine. I'm not sure exactly what you have but a scope sorts it out quickly. 73 de Brian/K3KO ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2242 / Virus Database: 3204/5987 - Release Date: 07/12/13 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] HPZ3816A config - can't enter correct co-ords
On 7/12/2013 10:51 AM, Mark C. Stephens wrote: When I try to enter my antenna location as per surveyor: -33.763698 151.092111 With this scpi command: :GPS:POS S,+33,+79,3.69800E+001,E,+151,+9,+2.11100E+001,+9.45600E+001 For some reason, the Z3816A displays this: LAT S 33:59:36.980 LON E 151:09:21.110 Which is correct except the south should say 33:79:36.980. I can enter lower values that 59 for parameter 3 and it displays correct. Can't seem to find a manual for these chaps either. Shooting off the subject, Just had one arrive with a loose OCXO. Yes loose, the solder joint on the OCXO had broken away from the PCB. The intermittent contact was causing all sorts of chaos. Most noticeably, the red ALARM LED came on, but none of the scpi commands could tell me why. Health monitor reported [ OK ] shrug Anyway, Any idea how I can enter the correct co-ordinates? --marki ___ time-nuts mailing list --time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go tohttps://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. There is only 60 minutes in a degree. thus the 79 minutes in 33:79:36.980 in incorrect. KI6WAS ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] GPDSO is working
On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 6:52 AM, Chuck Harris cfhar...@erols.com wrote: If a TTL signal does just work with your RS232 receiver, you have a faulty receiver. The receiver is supposed to have a dead zone from +3V to -3V. You are 100% correct, almost all modern RS-232 receivers are faultily as you describe and will work with TTL level signals -- Chris Albertson Redondo Beach, California ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Nortel/Thunderbolt questions
Bob: Correct, the Trimble Nortel box. Replaced the old HP antenna with the 26db amplified antenna which came with it, also mounted higher, and more clear of the roof. It is seeing 5 satellites, 3 in yellow, and still says RECOVERY MODE. It also (now) says, SAVED POSITION BAD, which I would expect, with a 300' error in elevation. Jim On 7/13/2013 9:04 AM, Bob Camp wrote: Hi I believe what you have here is a Trimble / Nortel box rather than a TBolt - is this correct? If so there are a number of differences in what you can and can't do with LH. Also since it's a different design, the filter is set up differently. That said, it should show lock, sats, dac voltage, and status correctly. Bob On Jul 12, 2013, at 3:56 PM, Jim Sanford wb4...@wb4gcs.org wrote: All: My Nortel receiver has been running for 6 days now. I am running the Lady Heather software, but also have TBOLTMON. It shows my position fairly well, but I have seen a negative altitude, and am currently seeing 1565' altitude. Based on local maps and the GPS in the car, I believe the antenna to be no higher than 1280'. I get lock with 4 to 6 satellites colored green. I have seen PHASE LOCKED, but am currently seeing recovery mode and the LOCKED LED on the unit is flashing, which I think I remember means recovery. I have several questions: 1. Sometimes position is displayed in yellow, sometimes in white. What is the significance of the color? 2. I see TC 100.0 sec, DAMP1.200, GAIN 1.2 Hz/v, INIT 3.00V. When I go to KE5FX site, his values for TC, DAMP, Gain and INIT are very different. In particular, if DAMP is damping in a control loop, I am not surprised that my very overdamped unit is not locking. Question: Are these parameters that will converge, or are they parameters I should try to set? The heather.cpp files suggests that they may be settable, but does not say how. 3. On my plot, I see an RMS value in green, which suggests to me that something is happy with the DAC voltage, even if very different from John's. The scale is 10uV/div which suggests to me that it is NOT locked. 4. On my plot, I see an RMS value in yellow, which suggests to me that the temp is OK, but the scale on temp is growing at the momoent, 10mC/div; John's is 50 mC/div, but a much smoother plot than mine. What is this telling me? ROM,RAM, OSC, FPGA, POWER, EEPROM, ANTENNA, ALMANAC, DISCIPLINE, SAVED POSITION status are all OK, even though altitude is bad. Can anyone help me understand what I am seeing, and in particular, why it won't lock, or stay locked, when it is seeing good sat signals? Thanks! Jim wb4...@amsat.org ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] UT+ Software for Linux?
OK, this isn't as easy as I thought it would be. Is there any Linux software to interface with the UT+, or will I have to swap out a disk and boot Windows to get the eval software from Synergy-GPS to work? I see some primitive source code on the net but getting anything useful out of that would be a project I just don't want to divert to at the moment. Bob - AE6RV ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Nortel/Thunderbolt questions
Hi On mine, I did a full reset and let them start from a survey. After they figured out where they were, I did the normal stuff to save the position. Bob On Jul 13, 2013, at 5:58 PM, Jim Sanford wb4...@wb4gcs.org wrote: Bob: Correct, the Trimble Nortel box. Replaced the old HP antenna with the 26db amplified antenna which came with it, also mounted higher, and more clear of the roof. It is seeing 5 satellites, 3 in yellow, and still says RECOVERY MODE. It also (now) says, SAVED POSITION BAD, which I would expect, with a 300' error in elevation. Jim On 7/13/2013 9:04 AM, Bob Camp wrote: Hi I believe what you have here is a Trimble / Nortel box rather than a TBolt - is this correct? If so there are a number of differences in what you can and can't do with LH. Also since it's a different design, the filter is set up differently. That said, it should show lock, sats, dac voltage, and status correctly. Bob On Jul 12, 2013, at 3:56 PM, Jim Sanford wb4...@wb4gcs.org wrote: All: My Nortel receiver has been running for 6 days now. I am running the Lady Heather software, but also have TBOLTMON. It shows my position fairly well, but I have seen a negative altitude, and am currently seeing 1565' altitude. Based on local maps and the GPS in the car, I believe the antenna to be no higher than 1280'. I get lock with 4 to 6 satellites colored green. I have seen PHASE LOCKED, but am currently seeing recovery mode and the LOCKED LED on the unit is flashing, which I think I remember means recovery. I have several questions: 1. Sometimes position is displayed in yellow, sometimes in white. What is the significance of the color? 2. I see TC 100.0 sec, DAMP1.200, GAIN 1.2 Hz/v, INIT 3.00V. When I go to KE5FX site, his values for TC, DAMP, Gain and INIT are very different. In particular, if DAMP is damping in a control loop, I am not surprised that my very overdamped unit is not locking. Question: Are these parameters that will converge, or are they parameters I should try to set? The heather.cpp files suggests that they may be settable, but does not say how. 3. On my plot, I see an RMS value in green, which suggests to me that something is happy with the DAC voltage, even if very different from John's. The scale is 10uV/div which suggests to me that it is NOT locked. 4. On my plot, I see an RMS value in yellow, which suggests to me that the temp is OK, but the scale on temp is growing at the momoent, 10mC/div; John's is 50 mC/div, but a much smoother plot than mine. What is this telling me? ROM,RAM, OSC, FPGA, POWER, EEPROM, ANTENNA, ALMANAC, DISCIPLINE, SAVED POSITION status are all OK, even though altitude is bad. Can anyone help me understand what I am seeing, and in particular, why it won't lock, or stay locked, when it is seeing good sat signals? Thanks! Jim wb4...@amsat.org ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Nortel/Thunderbolt questions
I initiated a survey a few hours ago. Now it thinks I'm at 175' altitude (more like 1280') and calls the saved position good. What is the normal stuff to save the position?? Finally, every time that the satellite count changes, there's a huge (150,000 uV or so) excursion in the DAC voltage, so it never converges to small variation like I see when I look at the KE5FX site -- what is this telling me? Thanks, Jim On 7/13/2013 8:44 PM, Bob Camp wrote: Hi On mine, I did a full reset and let them start from a survey. After they figured out where they were, I did the normal stuff to save the position. Bob On Jul 13, 2013, at 5:58 PM, Jim Sanford wb4...@wb4gcs.org wrote: Bob: Correct, the Trimble Nortel box. Replaced the old HP antenna with the 26db amplified antenna which came with it, also mounted higher, and more clear of the roof. It is seeing 5 satellites, 3 in yellow, and still says RECOVERY MODE. It also (now) says, SAVED POSITION BAD, which I would expect, with a 300' error in elevation. Jim On 7/13/2013 9:04 AM, Bob Camp wrote: Hi I believe what you have here is a Trimble / Nortel box rather than a TBolt - is this correct? If so there are a number of differences in what you can and can't do with LH. Also since it's a different design, the filter is set up differently. That said, it should show lock, sats, dac voltage, and status correctly. Bob On Jul 12, 2013, at 3:56 PM, Jim Sanford wb4...@wb4gcs.org wrote: All: My Nortel receiver has been running for 6 days now. I am running the Lady Heather software, but also have TBOLTMON. It shows my position fairly well, but I have seen a negative altitude, and am currently seeing 1565' altitude. Based on local maps and the GPS in the car, I believe the antenna to be no higher than 1280'. I get lock with 4 to 6 satellites colored green. I have seen PHASE LOCKED, but am currently seeing recovery mode and the LOCKED LED on the unit is flashing, which I think I remember means recovery. I have several questions: 1. Sometimes position is displayed in yellow, sometimes in white. What is the significance of the color? 2. I see TC 100.0 sec, DAMP1.200, GAIN 1.2 Hz/v, INIT 3.00V. When I go to KE5FX site, his values for TC, DAMP, Gain and INIT are very different. In particular, if DAMP is damping in a control loop, I am not surprised that my very overdamped unit is not locking. Question: Are these parameters that will converge, or are they parameters I should try to set? The heather.cpp files suggests that they may be settable, but does not say how. 3. On my plot, I see an RMS value in green, which suggests to me that something is happy with the DAC voltage, even if very different from John's. The scale is 10uV/div which suggests to me that it is NOT locked. 4. On my plot, I see an RMS value in yellow, which suggests to me that the temp is OK, but the scale on temp is growing at the momoent, 10mC/div; John's is 50 mC/div, but a much smoother plot than mine. What is this telling me? ROM,RAM, OSC, FPGA, POWER, EEPROM, ANTENNA, ALMANAC, DISCIPLINE, SAVED POSITION status are all OK, even though altitude is bad. Can anyone help me understand what I am seeing, and in particular, why it won't lock, or stay locked, when it is seeing good sat signals? Thanks! Jim wb4...@amsat.org ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Spectrum Analyzer Suggestions
List, I just purchased a HP 3585 spec analyzer on E bay for a reasonable price. I wanted this instead of the 181 series as the range was more to what I’d be using and it was of a newer vintage. The 3585a goes from 10 Hz to 40 MHz which is a most useful range for my purposes. so far, so good. The problem is I didn’t know the beast weighed a svelte 88 pounds! Double Hernia time! What I’d appreciate advice for a used spec analyzer in the $1,000 range that is at least much lighter. A smaller size would also be a benefit. I probably would never use it above 100 MHz. A slightly smaller screen would be OK. Suggestions appreciated. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Spectrum Analyzer Suggestions
Well Perry, You could consider an IFR A-7550 SpecAn. They are not HP but still a decent little SpecAn that is just a bit bigger then a TEK-453 scope. It covers from 100KHz to 1GHz. Shop carefully to make sure you get one with atleast the internal tracking generator option. DO NOT rely on pictures because the tracking generator connector is there even if no option. There is also an internal receiver option, but that only works when you are at zero span and truthfully, not all that useful, but nice to have. It also has an internal battery option, however, the battery pack is quite expensive and unless you actually need it, it is a complete waste of money. If it comes with a battery, expect it to not be in very good shape. The battery pack is made up of large round 2 volt lead acid cells and when left discharged will leak acid. BillWB6BNQ Perry Sandeen wrote: List,  I just purchased a HP 3585 spec analyzer on E bay for a reasonable price. I wanted this instead of the 181 series as the range was more to what I’d be using and it was of a newer vintage. The 3585a goes from 10 Hz to 40 MHz which is a most useful range for my purposes. so far, so good.  The problem is I didn’t know the beast weighed a svelte 88 pounds! Double Hernia time!  What I’d appreciate advice for a used spec analyzer in the $1,000 range that is at least much lighter. A smaller size would also be a benefit.  I probably would never use it above 100 MHz. A slightly smaller screen would be OK.  Suggestions appreciated.  Regards,  Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Spectrum Analyzer Suggestions
Perry, I did not pay attention to bottom frequency of the hp SpecAn in my last post. Do you actually do something below 100KHz ? BillWB6BNQ Perry Sandeen wrote: List,  I just purchased a HP 3585 spec analyzer on E bay for a reasonable price. I wanted this instead of the 181 series as the range was more to what I’d be using and it was of a newer vintage. The 3585a goes from 10 Hz to 40 MHz which is a most useful range for my purposes. so far, so good.  The problem is I didn’t know the beast weighed a svelte 88 pounds! Double Hernia time!  What I’d appreciate advice for a used spec analyzer in the $1,000 range that is at least much lighter. A smaller size would also be a benefit.  I probably would never use it above 100 MHz. A slightly smaller screen would be OK.  Suggestions appreciated.  Regards,  Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Spectrum Analyzer Suggestions
It may be heavy but is a VERY nice analyzer. I have a Tek 495P which is also a very nice analyzer, goes to 1.8 GHz, is smaller and somewhat lighter (portable), and should be findable in nice condition for under $1k. On 7/13/2013 11:09 PM, Perry Sandeen wrote: List, I just purchased a HP 3585 spec analyzer on E bay for a reasonable price. I wanted this instead of the 181 series as the range was more to what I’d be using and it was of a newer vintage. The 3585a goes from 10 Hz to 40 MHz which is a most useful range for my purposes. so far, so good. The problem is I didn’t know the beast weighed a svelte 88 pounds! Double Hernia time! What I’d appreciate advice for a used spec analyzer in the $1,000 range that is at least much lighter. A smaller size would also be a benefit. I probably would never use it above 100 MHz. A slightly smaller screen would be OK. Suggestions appreciated. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1432 / Virus Database: 3204/5989 - Release Date: 07/13/13 ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Spectrum Analyzer Suggestions
Perry I have a 3585A too, The weight isn't so bad once you get used to it. :) Mines on a rack shelf that I can slide it out onto the workbench for maintenance. Performance wise, they are fantastic for phase noise measurement using John Miles's Phase noise software. Although a little slow, It is pretty nice to see what's going on down at 10 Hz. I really can't find a replacement for my 3585A, other than the B model. Also the boards come up cheap on eBay if you need parts. I have almost a complete set of spare boards I bought for 10 bucks each. So all in all, you got yourself a good Analyser, cheap to maintain and good specs. Run it through the performance tests as per the manual, this SA will be a pleasant surprise for you :) -marki -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Perry Sandeen Sent: Sunday, 14 July 2013 1:10 PM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: [time-nuts] Spectrum Analyzer Suggestions List, I just purchased a HP 3585 spec analyzer on E bay for a reasonable price. I wanted this instead of the 181 series as the range was more to what I’d be using and it was of a newer vintage. The 3585a goes from 10 Hz to 40 MHz which is a most useful range for my purposes. so far, so good. The problem is I didn’t know the beast weighed a svelte 88 pounds! Double Hernia time! What I’d appreciate advice for a used spec analyzer in the $1,000 range that is at least much lighter. A smaller size would also be a benefit. I probably would never use it above 100 MHz. A slightly smaller screen would be OK. Suggestions appreciated. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
