Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[shalimr9]

Well, I suffer not only from dislexia, but also blurred vision. It's a 4800A

The meters look the same as the 4805A though.

To my defense, my cardiologist told me last week that my "good" cholesterol was 
too low and he recommended that I drink a glass of red wire with dinner every 
day to raise it (having to say that to a Frenchman, never happened before...) I 
may have over done it a little...

Didier
 
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-Original Message-
From: gsteinb...@aol.com
Sender: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2010 13:18:43 
To: ; 
Reply-To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement

Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re:  Meter face for HP-4805A

 I read 'Vector Voltmeter' and assumed HP 8405A.

Jerry

 



-Original Message-
From: Richard (Rick) Karlquist <rich...@karlquist.com>
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement 
<time-nuts@febo.com>
Cc: gsteinb...@aol.com
Sent: Tue, Oct 12, 2010 8:52 am
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re:  Meter face for HP-4805A

   On 10/12/2010 8:11 AM, gsteinb...@aol.com wrote:?
 >   Just a quick note...?
 >?
 > HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were 
individually produced?
 > for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic 
calibrator.?
 >?
 > An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the 
originals produced?
 > for each unit.?
 >?
 > Jerry?
?
 I'm somewhat skeptical as to whether the 4805 meter is made that way.?
 It is true that the RX meter product made by Boonton Radio (not be be?
 confused with Boonton Electronics) and later bought by HP had custom?
 engraved drums.  However, these were drums, not meter movements.  The?
 meter on the RX meter is of course just a nulling indicator.?
?
 Rick Karlquist N6RK?
  
  

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Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[shalimr9]

Good point, but still a whole lot better than a blank face with paint chips at 
the bottom :)

Didier

Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-Original Message-
From: gsteinb...@aol.com
Sender: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2010 11:11:09 
To: 
Reply-To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement

Subject: [time-nuts] Subject: Re:  Meter face for HP-4805A

 Just a quick note...

HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were individually 
produced
for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic calibrator.

An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the originals 
produced 
for each unit.

Jerry


Message: 2  Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2010 09:29:19 -0400  
From: paul swed <paulsw...@gmail.com>  
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Meter face for HP-4805A  
To: shali...@gmail.com, Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement 
<time-nuts@febo.com>
Didier,  Its subjective then. If its bad enough you take the risk because you 
do know  the process 
will degrade the scale. Essentially when its time to do it you  will. So the 
good news is this. 
With todays tools you can very accurately reproduce the meter scale. I scan 
them at 1200 dpi as 
I just did for the  dymec. I prefer bitmap over jpeg for storing them. 
Additionally with the 
various paint programs that seem to come on every pc today you can always fix 
issues pretty easily. 
Then print to your favorite material which most likely is a white picture 
material. (I like it 
because  its a bit thicker and more stable) Though good quality paper  is 
excellent also.
Hmmm maybe we should send our meter scans to K4BB repository. Heck he has rom 
images.  
Regards Paul. 

 
  

   

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Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[Greg Burnett]

You're correct, John.

Bio on Barney Oliver at:
http://www.hp.com/retiree/history/founders/early_contributors/barney.html

Greg


- Original Message - 
From: "J. Forster" 
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" 

Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 2:21 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A


Thanks, except I remember he went by Barney or Barnie.

-John

=


> P.S. There's a better description (in an article by Bernie Oliver) at:
> http://www.hpl.hp.com/hpjournal/pdfs/IssuePDFs/1961-03.pdf
>
> Greg
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Greg Burnett" 
> To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 2:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A
>
>
> Yeah, I remember from the "good old days", we individually calibrated
> taut-band meter movements with a HP designed servo-meter calibrator. At
> least that's the way we did it for some models. I don't guarantee we did
> it
> that way for all models, though.
>
> The way I remember it, this process (regardless of which division's
> instrument was involved) was performed at HP Loveland.
>
> Disclaimer: My memory might be slightly skewed after all these decades.
>
> For description of the taut-band meter movement calibration, see the HP
> Journal article at:
> http://www.hpl.hp.com/hpjournal/pdfs/IssuePDFs/1966-01.pdf
>
> I do agree with the other post, though, that *any* saved/scanned scale is
> way better than no (or a damaged) scale. In many cases probably a randomly
> scanned scale would match a given meter movement good enough for most our
> purposes.
>
> Greg
>
> - Original Message -
> From: 
> To: 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:11 AM
> Subject: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A
>
>
>  Just a quick note...
>
> HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were
> individually
> produced
> for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic
> calibrator.
>
> An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the
> originals produced
> for each unit.
>
> Jerry
>
> .
>
>
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>
>
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> and follow the instructions there.
>
>



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Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[J. Forster]

Thanks, except I remember he went by Barney or Barnie.

-John

=


> P.S. There's a better description (in an article by Bernie Oliver) at:
> http://www.hpl.hp.com/hpjournal/pdfs/IssuePDFs/1961-03.pdf
>
> Greg
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Greg Burnett" 
> To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"
> 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 2:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A
>
>
> Yeah, I remember from the "good old days", we individually calibrated
> taut-band meter movements with a HP designed servo-meter calibrator. At
> least that's the way we did it for some models. I don't guarantee we did
> it
> that way for all models, though.
>
> The way I remember it, this process (regardless of which division's
> instrument was involved) was performed at HP Loveland.
>
> Disclaimer: My memory might be slightly skewed after all these decades.
>
> For description of the taut-band meter movement calibration, see the HP
> Journal article at:
> http://www.hpl.hp.com/hpjournal/pdfs/IssuePDFs/1966-01.pdf
>
> I do agree with the other post, though, that *any* saved/scanned scale is
> way better than no (or a damaged) scale. In many cases probably a randomly
> scanned scale would match a given meter movement good enough for most our
> purposes.
>
> Greg
>
> - Original Message -
> From: 
> To: 
> Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:11 AM
> Subject: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A
>
>
>  Just a quick note...
>
> HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were
> individually
> produced
> for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic
> calibrator.
>
> An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the
> originals produced
> for each unit.
>
> Jerry
>
> .
>
>
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>
>
> ___
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> To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>
>



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Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[Greg Burnett]

P.S. There's a better description (in an article by Bernie Oliver) at:
http://www.hpl.hp.com/hpjournal/pdfs/IssuePDFs/1961-03.pdf

Greg

- Original Message - 
From: "Greg Burnett" 
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" 

Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 2:07 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A


Yeah, I remember from the "good old days", we individually calibrated
taut-band meter movements with a HP designed servo-meter calibrator. At
least that's the way we did it for some models. I don't guarantee we did it
that way for all models, though.

The way I remember it, this process (regardless of which division's
instrument was involved) was performed at HP Loveland.

Disclaimer: My memory might be slightly skewed after all these decades.

For description of the taut-band meter movement calibration, see the HP
Journal article at:
http://www.hpl.hp.com/hpjournal/pdfs/IssuePDFs/1966-01.pdf

I do agree with the other post, though, that *any* saved/scanned scale is
way better than no (or a damaged) scale. In many cases probably a randomly
scanned scale would match a given meter movement good enough for most our
purposes.

Greg

- Original Message - 
From: 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:11 AM
Subject: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A


 Just a quick note...

HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were individually
produced
for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic calibrator.

An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the
originals produced
for each unit.

Jerry

.


___
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https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
and follow the instructions there. 


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Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[Greg Burnett]

Yeah, I remember from the "good old days", we individually calibrated 
taut-band meter movements with a HP designed servo-meter calibrator. At 
least that's the way we did it for some models. I don't guarantee we did it 
that way for all models, though.

The way I remember it, this process (regardless of which division's 
instrument was involved) was performed at HP Loveland.

Disclaimer: My memory might be slightly skewed after all these decades.

For description of the taut-band meter movement calibration, see the HP 
Journal article at:
http://www.hpl.hp.com/hpjournal/pdfs/IssuePDFs/1966-01.pdf

I do agree with the other post, though, that *any* saved/scanned scale is 
way better than no (or a damaged) scale. In many cases probably a randomly 
scanned scale would match a given meter movement good enough for most our 
purposes.

Greg

- Original Message - 
From: 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:11 AM
Subject: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A


 Just a quick note...

HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were individually 
produced
for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic calibrator.

An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the 
originals produced
for each unit.

Jerry

. 


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Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[gsteinba52]

 I read 'Vector Voltmeter' and assumed HP 8405A.

Jerry

 



-Original Message-
From: Richard (Rick) Karlquist <rich...@karlquist.com>
To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement 
<time-nuts@febo.com>
Cc: gsteinb...@aol.com
Sent: Tue, Oct 12, 2010 8:52 am
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re:  Meter face for HP-4805A

   On 10/12/2010 8:11 AM, gsteinb...@aol.com wrote:?
 >   Just a quick note...?
 >?
 > HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were 
individually produced?
 > for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic 
calibrator.?
 >?
 > An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the 
originals produced?
 > for each unit.?
 >?
 > Jerry?
?
 I'm somewhat skeptical as to whether the 4805 meter is made that way.?
 It is true that the RX meter product made by Boonton Radio (not be be?
 confused with Boonton Electronics) and later bought by HP had custom?
 engraved drums.  However, these were drums, not meter movements.  The?
 meter on the RX meter is of course just a nulling indicator.?
?
 Rick Karlquist N6RK?
  
  

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Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[paul swed]

Jerry thanks and completely understand. But then again a meter with 50% of
its scale missing isn't all that useful either. Its all relative.

On Tue, Oct 12, 2010 at 11:11 AM,  wrote:

> Just a quick note...
>
> HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were individually
> produced
> for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic
> calibrator.
>
> An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the
> originals produced
> for each unit.
>
> Jerry
>
>
> Message: 2  Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2010 09:29:19 -0400
> From: paul swed 
> Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Meter face for HP-4805A
> To: shali...@gmail.com, Discussion of precise time and frequency
> measurement 
> Didier,  Its subjective then. If its bad enough you take the risk because
> you do know  the process
> will degrade the scale. Essentially when its time to do it you  will. So
> the good news is this.
> With todays tools you can very accurately reproduce the meter scale. I scan
> them at 1200 dpi as
> I just did for the  dymec. I prefer bitmap over jpeg for storing them.
> Additionally with the
> various paint programs that seem to come on every pc today you can always
> fix issues pretty easily.
> Then print to your favorite material which most likely is a white picture
> material. (I like it
> because  its a bit thicker and more stable) Though good quality paper  is
> excellent also.
> Hmmm maybe we should send our meter scans to K4BB repository. Heck he has
> rom images.
> Regards Paul.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
> To unsubscribe, go to
> https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts
> and follow the instructions there.
>
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Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[Richard (Rick) Karlquist]

On 10/12/2010 8:11 AM, gsteinb...@aol.com wrote:

  Just a quick note...

HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were individually 
produced
for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic calibrator.

An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the originals 
produced
for each unit.

Jerry


I'm somewhat skeptical as to whether the 4805 meter is made that way.
It is true that the RX meter product made by Boonton Radio (not be be
confused with Boonton Electronics) and later bought by HP had custom
engraved drums.  However, these were drums, not meter movements.  The
meter on the RX meter is of course just a nulling indicator.

Rick Karlquist N6RK

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Re: [time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[Brooke Clarke]

Hi Jerry:

Is there an HP Journal or other article that goes into detail on how 
they did that?


Have Fun,

Brooke Clarke
http://www.PRC68.com


gsteinb...@aol.com wrote:

  Just a quick note...

HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were individually 
produced
for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic calibrator.

An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the originals 
produced
for each unit.

Jerry


Message: 2  Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2010 09:29:19 -0400
From: paul swed
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Meter face for HP-4805A
To: shali...@gmail.com, Discussion of precise time and frequency 
measurement
Didier,  Its subjective then. If its bad enough you take the risk because you 
do know  the process
will degrade the scale. Essentially when its time to do it you  will. So the 
good news is this.
With todays tools you can very accurately reproduce the meter scale. I scan 
them at 1200 dpi as
I just did for the  dymec. I prefer bitmap over jpeg for storing them. 
Additionally with the
various paint programs that seem to come on every pc today you can always fix 
issues pretty easily.
Then print to your favorite material which most likely is a white picture 
material. (I like it
because  its a bit thicker and more stable) Though good quality paper  is 
excellent also.
Hmmm maybe we should send our meter scans to K4BB repository. Heck he has rom 
images.
Regards Paul.






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--
Have Fun,

Brooke Clarke
http://www.PRC68.com


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[time-nuts] Subject: Re: Meter face for HP-4805A

[gsteinba52]

 Just a quick note...

HP was quite proud that scales for their precision meters were individually 
produced
for each movement on a custom made servo controlled photographic calibrator.

An archive might be nice but won't provide the meter accuracy of the originals 
produced 
for each unit.

Jerry


Message: 2  Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2010 09:29:19 -0400  
From: paul swed   
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Meter face for HP-4805A  
To: shali...@gmail.com, Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement 

Didier,  Its subjective then. If its bad enough you take the risk because you 
do know  the process 
will degrade the scale. Essentially when its time to do it you  will. So the 
good news is this. 
With todays tools you can very accurately reproduce the meter scale. I scan 
them at 1200 dpi as 
I just did for the  dymec. I prefer bitmap over jpeg for storing them. 
Additionally with the 
various paint programs that seem to come on every pc today you can always fix 
issues pretty easily. 
Then print to your favorite material which most likely is a white picture 
material. (I like it 
because  its a bit thicker and more stable) Though good quality paper  is 
excellent also.
Hmmm maybe we should send our meter scans to K4BB repository. Heck he has rom 
images.  
Regards Paul. 

 
  

   

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