Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
Free GNU/Linux distributions are here ( https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-distros.html ). BLAG, Dragora, Dynebolic, gNewSense, Guix SD, Musix, Parabola GNU/Linux-libre, Trisquel and Ututo. The list also includes small distributions: libreCMC and ProteanOS.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
I really going to speak on my experience, Most of the freedos programs I have installed are gpl license. Yet when compiling freedos is different from ms-dos in other and many aspectd than ms-dos. You will not see it until you have try it. remenber it is not a linuz-gnu program.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
*Personally*, I would also rephrase the following: #+BEGIN_QUOTE [...] The social movement Stallman started -- the Free Software movement -- predates the Open Source developmental philosophy identified by the Open Source Initiative by over a decade, and the GNU GPL encourages something the open source group eschew: software freedom [...] #+END_QUOTE And change it like so: #+BEGIN_QUOTE [...] The social movement Stallman started -- the Free Software movement -- predates the Open Source developmental method identified by the Open Source Initiative by over a decade, and the GNU GPL encourages something the open source group eschew: the essential freedoms of the software, which is prerequisite for software freedom for the entire society [...] #+END_QUOTE At least for me, this naming change from "software freedom" to "freedom of the software" is important so that people understand that it's not a matter of "being free/libre to use any software or license one wishes to", but a matter of the software having said freedoms, so that the latter matter can be achieved. Also, I don't want to discredit your arguments, because I agree entirely with your arguments, but just for the fun of it: I have changed "Open Source developmental philosophy" to "Open Source developmental method" because I don't believe that open source is a philosophy, because it doesn't question what is moral and ethical or not, contrary to what the free/libre software movement does, see [[https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/google-engineering-talk.html]] and [[https://www.gnu.org/gnu/thegnuproject.html]]. Besides, the open source development method itself choose not to question these matters right from the start when they decided to change their approach towards the general public, see [[https://www.gnu.org/gnu/thegnuproject.html]] and [[https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-source-misses-the-point.html]].
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
You mention this a few times in your post: jodie...@yahoo.com wrote: Any program that works on MS-DOS should also run on FreeDOS. and FreeDOS is a complete, free, DOS-compatible operating system. While we provide some utilities, you should be able to run any program intended for MS-DOS. and It does not have do with Gnu-linux, matter fact. It is a replacement fo MS-DOS [...] You seem to maintain that compatibility with Microsoft's DOS is an advantage because FreeDOS allows users to run non-free software (you cited firmware installers as one such program). But you should read the FSF's language on ReactOS at https://www.gnu.org/distros/common-distros.html#ReactOS which is short so I'll quote it in full here: ReactOS is meant as a free binary compatible replacement for Windows. Use with proprietary software and drivers meant for Windows is one of the stated goals of the project. I believe the FSF points this out because from the perspective of software freedom, it is bad to encourage people to run non-free software except for writing a free replacement of the non-free software. Running non-free software means continuing dependency on non-freedom and that non-free software treats its users unjustly. FreeDOS thus becomes a free means by which users can continue being treated unjustly. Given what you wrote the same would seem to be true of FreeDOS. If it's a stated goal of the FreeDOS project to encourage the user to use proprietary software instead of using FreeDOS to help provide a free software replacement, this could be another reason why FreeDOS would not receive the FSF's endorsement as a recommended free distro despite FreeDOS being licensed to run, share, and modify. And you can view and edit our source code, because all FreeDOS programs are distributed under the GNU General Public License or a similar open source software license. You'd also be better off (particularly here, a mailing list for a GNU/Linux distro that celebrates its connection to promoting software freedom) understanding that the author of the GNU GPL (Richard Stallman) has nothing to do with "open source" and that license's only connection to open source is that it happens to meet the qualifications that group set up. The social movement Stallman started -- the Free Software movement -- predates the Open Source developmental philosophy identified by the Open Source Initiative by over a decade, and the GNU GPL encourages something the open source group eschew: software freedom. In fact Stallman goes around the world giving talks explaining that the open source group is a right-wing reactionary group opposed to software freedom (the very principle he advocates for). You can find recordings of these talks in formats that favor free software at https://audio-video.gnu.org/. It's also a good idea to be specific instead of pointing to 'similar' licenses.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
jade...@openmailbox.org wrote: We use a deblobbed OpenBSD ports tree. When writing about blobs in the context of a BSD system (in particular to a GNU/Linux distro mailing list) I suggest that you clarify which meaning of "blob" you mean in order to avoid the misunderstanding described below. As https://www.gnu.org/distros/common-distros.html#BSD explains: Nonfree firmware programs used with Linux, the kernel, are called “blobs”, and that's how we use the term. In BSD parlance, the term “blob” means something else: a nonfree driver. OpenBSD and perhaps other BSD distributions (called “projects” by BSD developers) have the policy of not including those. That is the right policy, as regards drivers; but when the developers say these distributions “contain no blobs”, it causes a misunderstanding. They are not talking about firmware blobs.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
We use a deblobbed OpenBSD ports tree.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
Free dos it is listed in particular as free but not related with GNU-linux. If you ever study Basic language in your life time then you will see the difference.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
There is a big difference between freedos, and debian. FreeDOS is a complete, free, DOS-compatible operating system that you can use to play classic DOS games, run legacy business software, or develop embedded systems. Any program that works on MS-DOS should also run on FreeDOS. It doesn’t cost anything to download and use FreeDOS. You can also share FreeDOS for others to enjoy! And you can view and edit our source code, because all FreeDOS programs are distributed under the GNU General Public License or a similar open source software license. Is FreeDOS really free? Yes, FreeDOS is really free. It doesn’t cost anything to download and use FreeDOS. You can also share FreeDOS for others to enjoy! And you can view and edit our source code, because all FreeDOS programs are distributed under the GNU General Public License or a similar Open source software license. What programs can I run in FreeDOS? FreeDOS is a complete, free, DOS-compatible operating system. While we provide some utilities, you should be able to run any program intended for MS-DOS. Pretty much any program that works on MS-DOS will work on FreeDOS. You can also use FreeDOS on a network! However, you may experience problems running Windows on FreeDOS. For example, Windows standard-mode works on FreeDOS, but ‘386-mode Windows for Workgroups 3.11 does not. We find most people use FreeDOS to do these things: 1. Play classic DOS games. You can play your favorite DOS games on FreeDOS. And there are a lot of great classic games to play: Wolfenstein 3D, Doom, Commander Keen, Rise of the Triad, Jill of the Jungle, Duke Nukem, and many others! 2. Run legacy software. Need to recover data from an old business program? Or maybe you need to run a report from your old finance system? Just install your legacy software under FreeDOS, and you’ll be good to go! 3. Develop embedded systems. Many embedded systems run on DOS, although modern systems may instead run on Linux. If you support an older embedded system, you might be running DOS. And FreeDOS can fit in very well. Many people also use FreeDOS to install firmware updates on their computers. It does not have do with Gnu-linux, matter fact. It is a replacement fo MS-DOS, EVERYTHING STARTED WHEN EVERYTHING WAS DOS.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
FreeDOS is not listed because it cannot be compiled with free software.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
Maybe the quick answer is, because GNU+Linux is much more stable, complete, useful, functional...than any other free software OS.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
Yes, FreeDOS and Debian are optionally-free, and, in the latter case, the kernel you use doesn't make a difference (since Debian ships with Linux-libre anyway); Debian GNU/Hurd is not on the list for the same reason as Debian GNU/Linux. LibertyBSD's website says that they're still under review, but as other commenters have said, their progress seems to have stalled, which is a shame (it would be nice if the FSF could endorse a BSD OS).
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
* FreeDOS I don't know much about the status as free/libre. Keep in mind that it's the FreeDOS project that has to seek inclusion in the lists of free/libre system distributions. You can influence this by telling the FreeDOS project to consider this and to look for [[https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-distros.html#NewDistro]]. However, I searched for the list archives of the workgroup for free/libre system distributions, and found this issue, which, at the time of writting, affected --- and I assume that still affects --- FreeDOS: [[https://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/gnu-linux-libre/2010-12/msg00048.html]]. * Debian See [[http://www.fsfla.org/pipermail/discusion/2017/006002.html]] and also [[https://www.gnu.org/distros/optionally-free-not-enough.html]]. * LibertyBSD The last communication ([[https://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/gnu-linux-libre/2016-07/msg00020.html]]) was in 2016-07-24, but I'm not sure how far it is now. However, since I don't represent the workgroup itself, then it would be best to ask both LibertyBSD and the workgroup to know what is the status. * Freedombox (bonus) See [[http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/freedombox-discuss/2017-April/007991.html]]. I don't know of any contact made by them so far. -- - [[https://libreplanet.org/wiki/User:Adfeno]] - Palestrante e consultor sobre /software/ livre (não confundir com gratis). - "WhatsApp"? Ele não é livre, por isso não uso. Iguais a ele prefiro GNU Ring, ou Tox. Quer outras formas de contato? Adicione o vCard que está no endereço acima aos teus contatos. - Pretende me enviar arquivos .doc, .ppt, .cdr, ou .mp3? OK, eu aceito, mas não repasso. Entrego apenas em formatos favoráveis ao /software/ livre. Favor entrar em contato em caso de dúvida.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
vitac...@ruggedinbox.com wrote: I know, that FSF recommends fully free GNU+Linux distros. The FSF's free distro guidelines at https://www.gnu.org/distros/free-system-distribution-guidelines.html are OS and kernel agnostic. Even if currently all of the listed systems are GNU/Linux or GNU/GNU Linux-libre systems, a qualifying free distro could be written that has neither GNU nor any free variant of the Linux kernel. But what about FreeDOS, it is also free software. [...] what about LibertyBSD, all these are free software operating systems [...] Have these OSes been submitted for review? And Debian GNU+Hurd? Some of the problems listed on https://www.gnu.org/distros/common-distros.html#Debian seem to apply to all Debian OSes. some are more limited than others [...] The guidelines require free distros to be "complete in themselves and ready to use. If a distribution is incomplete — if it requires further development, or presupposes installing other software as well — then it is not listed here, even if it is free software.". There's an exception to the self-hosting requirement for "small system distributions" as well.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
Does anyone know if they still use the OpenBSD ports tree or do they have their own audited for freedom? I've never used a BSD but my understanding is that non-free software was optionally available through the OpenBSD ports tree.
Re: [Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
I would say that Debian and FreeDOS are not on the list because optionally free is not enough. As for LibertyBSD, they should be on the list of non gnu distros at the least...
[Trisquel-users] FSF and his recommended distributions
I know, that FSF recommends fully free GNU+Linux distros. But what about FreeDOS, it is also free software. And Debian GNU+Hurd? what about LibertyBSD, all these are free software operating systems, allright, some are more limited than others, but still free as in freedom.
