Re: [TruthTalk] Who is Adam?
http://home.earthlink.net/~ldsendowment/lecture.html (Brigham Young - first official script of the endowment- BYU Special Collections,Provo, Utah) Adam was an immortal being when he came on this earth. He had lived on an earth similar to ours; he had received the priesthood and the keys thereof, and had been faithful in all things, and gained his resurrection and his exaltation, and was crowned with glory, immortality, and eternal lives, and was numbered with the Gods (for such he became through his faithfulness), and had begotten all the spirits that were to come to this earth. And Eve our common mother, who is the mother of all living, bore those spirits in the celestial world. And when this earth was organized by Elohim, Jehovah, and Michael http://www.irr.org/mit/WDIST/wdist-ag-contv8p218.html Before Adam fell he was a resurrected man. "Biblical Cosmogony" article, Contributor, vol. 8, p. 218 (1886) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Brigham Young taught, "Elohim, Yahova Michael, were father, Son and grandson. They made this Earth Michael became Adam" Joseph F. Smith Journal, 17 June 1871 "The Father frequently came to visit his son Adam, and talked and walked with him; and the children of Adam were more or less acquainted with their Grandfather, and their children were more or less acquainted with their Great-Grandfather . . ." (Journal of Discourses 9:148, 12 Jan. 1862).If men areto become gods Men should Follow Adam women are to follow Eve BUT One must never believe that Adam ever actually accomplished his godhood? Even if he was partner with Elohim and Jehovah? Where was the Holy Ghost, what was he doing during this time? Why the substitution of Michael/Adam?Who is this Father - Son - GrandSON TRINITY?Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I too should like to hear David's response to this.- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org ; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: March 19, 2006 20:15 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] torrance and logic David , in other posts of the day, I find you saying that yoou and Torrance are in agreement concerninglogic. I may ahve misunderstood your wording, but that was what you said according to my perspective. Below you say this: If you define "rationalist" in the more esoteric sense of the idea that reason is the source of truth, then I do not believe the Holy Spirit is a rationalist. By this definition, I am not a rationalist either. However, I do believe that the Holy Spirit is rational. He also does not lie or employ deception to mislead others. The Holy Spirit uses rational thought to speak to us, and he expects us to include rationality as a basis of belief and action. -- DMTorrance might give caution with these words: ".. we should seek to understand Christ, not by way of observational deductions from his appearances, but in the light of what he is in himself in his internal relations with God, that is, in terms of his intrinsic significance disclosed through his self-witness and self-communication to us in word and deed and reflected through the evangelical tradition of the Gospel in the medium which he created for this purpose in the apostolic foundation of the Church .. When we adopt this kind of approach, whether in natural science or in theology, we find that progress in understanding is necessarily circular. We develop a form of inquiry in which we allow some field of reality to disclose itself to us in the complex of its internal relations or its latent structure, and thus seek to understand it in the light of its own intrinsic intelligibility or logos ..Thus we seek to understand something, not by schematising it to an external or alien framework of thought, but by operating wit h a framework of thought appropriate to it" ---The Mediation of Christ pp 4,5 Yahoo! MailBring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze. Yahoo! Mail Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.
Re: [TruthTalk] Who is Adam?
Dan 7:13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed.LDS Scriptures teach that Adam is the one on the Throne of Revelation Dan 7 as "ancient of days" http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/27DC 27:11 And also with Michael, or Adam, the father of all, the prince of all, the ancient of dayshttp://scriptures.lds.org/dc/116DC 118:1 SPRING Hill is named by the Lord Adam-ondi-Ahman, because, said he, it is the place where Adam shall come to visit his people, or the Ancient of Days shall sit, as spoken of by Daniel the prophet.http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/138DC 138:38 Among the great and mighty ones who were assembled in this vast congregation of the righteous were Father Adam, the Ancient of Days and father of all,http://scriptures.lds.org/bdr/rsrrctnBible Dictionary ( p 761 BD)Heading Ressurection: "Jesus Christ was the first to be resurrected on this earth ,... whereas a resurrection means to become immortal, without blood, yet with a body of flesh and bone."http://scriptures.lds.org/bdf/fllfdmBD p 570 Heading Fal: "Before the fall, Adam and Eve had physical bodies but no blood." Since ressurected Bodies have no blood could you tell me what planet Adam was ressurected on? Was he a god, yet? Was he resurrected before jesus?TPJS p 157 Adam is said to "preside over the spirits of all men" And is the Oldest man therefore ancient of days At the bottom of the page the references given for the Ancient of days includes Rv 5:11 11:19 20:12 In Revelation it is "our God which sitteth upon the throne" Rv 1:4 3:21 7:10,15 14:5 22:1 Again we find the evidence for the Fruit of mormonism in the Standard works which have already been verified by membership vote. This led Brigham and a few others to preach the Doctrine (not theory) of Adam as god. "When our father Adam came into the garden of Eden, he came into it with a celestial body, and brought Eve, one of his wives, with him. He helped to make and organize this world. He is MICHAEL, the Archangel, the ANCIENT OF DAYS! about whom holy men have written and spoken--HE is our FATHER and our GOD, and the only God with whom WE have to do" Young JoD 1:46Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:http://home.earthlink.net/~ldsendowment/lecture.html (Brigham Young - first official script of the endowment- BYU Special Collections,Provo, Utah) Adam was an immortal being when he came on this earth. He had lived on an earth similar to ours; he had received the priesthood and the keys thereof, and had been faithful in all things, and gained his resurrection and his exaltation, and was crowned with glory, immortality, and eternal lives, and was numbered with the Gods (for such he became through his faithfulness), and had begotten all the spirits that were to come to this earth. And Eve our common mother, who is the mother of all living, bore those spirits in the celestial world. And when this earth was organized by Elohim, Jehovah, and Michael http://www.irr.org/mit/WDIST/wdist-ag-contv8p218.html Before Adam fell he was a resurrected man. "Biblical Cosmogony" article, Contributor, vol. 8, p. 218 (1886) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Brigham Young taught, "Elohim, Yahova Michael, were father, Son and grandson. They made this Earth Michael became Adam" Joseph F. Smith Journal, 17 June 1871"The Father frequently came to visit his son Adam, and talked and walked with him; and the children of Adam were more or less acquainted with their Grandfather, and their children were more or less acquainted with their Great-Grandfather . . ." (Journal of Discourses 9:148, 12 Jan. 1862).If men areto become gods Men should Follow Adam women are to follow Eve BUT One must never believe that Adam ever actually accomplished his godhood? Even if he was partner with Elohim and Jehovah? Where was the Holy Ghost, what was he doing during this time? Why the substitution of Michael/Adam?Who is this Father - Son - GrandSON TRINITY?Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I too should like to hear David's response to this.- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org ; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: March 19, 2006 20:15 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] torrance and logic David , in other posts of the day, I find you saying that yoou and Torrance are in agreement concerninglogic. I may ahve misunderstood your wording, but that was what you said according to my perspective. Below you say this: If you define "rationalist" in the more esoteric sense of the idea that reason is the source of truth, then I do not believe the Holy Spirit is a
Re: [TruthTalk] Who is Adam?
Brigham Young taught, "Elohim, Yahova Michael, were father, Son and grandson. They made this Earth Michael became Adam" Joseph F. Smith Journal, 17 June 1871"The Father frequently came to visit his son Adam, and talked and walked with him; and the children of Adam were more or less acquainted with their Grandfather, and their children were more or less acquainted with their Great-Grandfather . . ." (Journal of Discourses 9:148, 12 Jan. 1862).If men areto become gods Men should Follow Adam women are to follow Eve BUT One must never believe that Adam ever actually accomplished his godhood? Even if he was partner with Elohim and Jehovah? Where was the Holy Ghost, what was he doing during this time? Why the substitution of Michael/Adam?Who is this Father - Son - GrandSON TRINITY?Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I too should like to hear David's response to this.- Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org ; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: March 19, 2006 20:15 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] torrance and logic David , in other posts of the day, I find you saying that yoou and Torrance are in agreement concerninglogic. I may ahve misunderstood your wording, but that was what you said according to my perspective. Below you say this: If you define "rationalist" in the more esoteric sense of the idea that reason is the source of truth, then I do not believe the Holy Spirit is a rationalist. By this definition, I am not a rationalist either. However, I do believe that the Holy Spirit is rational. He also does not lie or employ deception to mislead others. The Holy Spirit uses rational thought to speak to us, and he expects us to include rationality as a basis of belief and action. -- DMTorrance might give caution with these words: ".. we should seek to understand Christ, not by way of observational deductions from his appearances, but in the light of what he is in himself in his internal relations with God, that is, in terms of his intrinsic significance disclosed through his self-witness and self-communication to us in word and deed and reflected through the evangelical tradition of the Gospel in the medium which he created for this purpose in the apostolic foundation of the Church .. When we adopt this kind of approach, whether in natural science or in theology, we find that progress in understanding is necessarily circular. We develop a form of inquiry in which we allow some field of reality to disclose itself to us in the complex of its internal relations or its latent structure, and thus seek to understand it in the light of its own intrinsic intelligibility or logos ..Thus we seek to understand something, not by schematising it to an external or alien framework of thought, but by operating wit h a framework of thought appropriate to it" ---The Mediation of Christ pp 4,5 Yahoo! Mail Bring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze.
Re: [TruthTalk] Who is Adam?
Did you mean to attach this post to 'that' post? - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: March 20, 2006 07:36 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Who is Adam? Brigham Young taught, "Elohim, Yahova Michael, were father, Son and grandson. They made this Earth Michael became Adam" Joseph F. Smith Journal, 17 June 1871 "The Father frequently came to visit his son Adam, and talked and walked with him; and the children of Adam were more or less acquainted with their Grandfather, and their children were more or less acquainted with their Great-Grandfather . . ." (Journal of Discourses 9:148, 12 Jan. 1862). If men areto become gods Men should Follow Adam women are to follow Eve BUT One must never believe that Adam ever actually accomplished his godhood? Even if he was partner with Elohim and Jehovah? Where was the Holy Ghost, what was he doing during this time? Why the substitution of Michael/Adam? Who is this Father - Son - GrandSON TRINITY?Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I too should like to hear David's response to this. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org ; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: March 19, 2006 20:15 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] torrance and logic David , in other posts of the day, I find you saying that yoou and Torrance are in agreement concerninglogic. I may ahve misunderstood your wording, but that was what you said according to my perspective. Below you say this: If you define "rationalist" in the more esoteric sense of the idea that reason is the source of truth, then I do not believe the Holy Spirit is a rationalist. By this definition, I am not a rationalist either. However, I do believe that the Holy Spirit is rational. He also does not lie or employ deception to mislead others. The Holy Spirit uses rational thought to speak to us, and he expects us to include rationality as a basis of belief and action. -- DM Torrance might give caution with these words: ".. we should seek to understand Christ, not by way of observational deductions from his appearances, but in the light of what he is in himself in his internal relations with God, that is, in terms of his intrinsic significance disclosed through his self-witness and self-communication to us in word and deed and reflected through the evangelical tradition of the Gospel in the medium which he created for this purpose in the apostolic foundation of the Church .. When we adopt this kind of approach, whether in natural science or in theology, we find that progress in understanding is necessarily circular. We develop a form of inquiry in which we allow some field of reality to disclose itself to us in the complex of its internal relations or its latent structure, and thus seek to understand it in the light of its own intrinsic intelligibility or logos ..Thus we seek to understand something, not by schematising it to an external or alien framework of thought, but by operating wit h a framework of thought appropriate to it" ---The Mediation of Christ pp 4,5 Yahoo! MailBring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze.
