[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-29 Thread Beowulf
I have just upgraded to 11.04, and I am disappointed in Unity. It is
much worse than polished Gnome+Compiz environment, it looks ugly.

I think it is a big error to make Unity default desktop environment.

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-21 Thread Derek
Well, it does save screen real-estate for small screened devices when
working on a few full-screen applications.

Unity might make sense for screen heights of 768 or lower.

On my laptop, where I'm currently alternating between Unity (trying hard to 
like it) and Gnome Classic.  Even if I don't autohide the menu in Gnome 
Classic, so it burns 20px, and use one of the default themes instead of one 
with a thin upper menu, a maximised Firefox window has 695px available to the 
page.  (and yes, I customised a bit.  That could be default for smaller 
screens, but even my linux novice mom figured out how to do something like this 
on her own)
http://m8y.org/tmp/Gnome.png

Now in Unity, that jumps to 718px available to the page, but at the cost of 
losing half the functionality of the top menu.  I'm not thrilled about the cost 
of those 23px, esp since I could reduce that with a different theme.
http://m8y.org/tmp/Unity.png

Now if only patches were submitted to Gnome to allow apps like firefox
to do what they do under windows and put tabs/firefox button on the same
line as windows chrome, then I could keep my main panel functionality
*and* save the pixels.

The other thing I like about Unity is the spotlight search feature -
that is quite nice.  Hopefully it'll be pulled into Gnome.

The app menu is a meh - such things have existed for gnome, I never
found them useful enough to leave active.

So. Saves a bit of vertical space at the cost of features, and has an
awesome search.  There you go. Positive stuff! :)

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-20 Thread Bilal Akhtar
Converse of bug #747140 .

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-20 Thread joopbraak
Yeah, only bug 747140 has no arguments whatsoever.
I would ask the most important question: why is unity better (apart from the 
eye candy), compared to the classis gnome desktop ? Especially considering 
usability and customizability.

It seems like this question has not been thoroughly answered before
deciding to waste valuable developers time on this new product, time
that also could have been spent on solving bugs (of which there are
still many) and adding important lacking features to existing programs.

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-19 Thread Derek
Things I found unpleasant about Unity so far.

Default decorator was straining my intel card and had those hideous
heavy shadows - replacing w/ gtk decorator in gconf for unity (and gnome
classic) fixed, but I should not have had to go to gconf - appears
changing decorator in ccsm no longer works.

Opening multiple terminal windows apparently requires middle click on
the terminal button.  But middle click is something I find hard to do on
a touchpad with no 3rd button.  doubleclick perhaps would have worked,
for now I just right click on the new window.

No applets!  So no cpu frequency applet, no network/cpu/mem monitor,
pretty much no useful customisation of that top bar, and I definitely
care about applets.

If I ran a search for ccsm, but I already had ccsm open behind other
stuff, it popped open the side menu and wiggled the icon, but did not
bring it to foreground.

When I first started Unity I was presented w/ some apps on sidebar w/
identical icons.  In my case, it was system firefox vs one I had
downloaded to desktop.  There was no way to differentiate between them
since I could not:  drag the icon to the desktop or right click on it to
get to properties.   Had to start them one at a time and grep the
process list, then unpin the desktop one.

No way to change icons (again, lack of right click for properties), if
some apps have multiple icons - I had a few of these due to gksudo
calls.

search and sidebar don't seem to theme well.

Stability has improved quite a lot, at least.

I don't like the limitation in customisation of real-estate.  Under
gnome classic, I have all my applets and list of apps and everything
rearranged into a 20px bar on the top, set to autohide.   I can't do
that in Unity, so it actually burns more real estate.

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-18 Thread Bilal Akhtar
Jeff,

Points 2) and 3) of your comment are not a problem anymore in 11.04
Unity. As for 2), the keyboard shortcut for 'Show Desktop' is Super+D .

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-18 Thread andy16666
There really needs to be a way to just pull out the old application
menu. Maybe the new cartoonish search box and huge icons could be gotten
used to, but if there was an obvious way to just browse applications the
same way we used to, it would be a heck of a lot less jarring for those
of us who just want to use the darn thing. Having to click a random icon
and then click a category just doesn't cut it. The pull down categorized
menu is a time tested and fairly efficient way to browse applications,
and I see no good reason to not include it in the unity menu as a fall
back. Not to mention the face that everybody is used to it. :-P

Moreover, human beings get used to a certain pattern when they're trying
to do something, like finding a system setting for example. The system
menu, from my perspective, was one of those things that Ubuntu/Gnome
always got right. When I think setting, I think of the system menu. Now
that's all gone. I have absolutely no idea where to look for those
things. I just have to seriously question how much forethought could has
possibly gone into this project to simply dump such a useful feature and
to not provide anything even resembling it within that huge unity menu.
It's just not good UI design to spend years getting people used to one
way of working, and then not even bother to take account of those usage
patterns when designing the new UI. I hate to bring up MS again, but it
took me all of 2 seconds to find the traditional programs menu after
they brought out the new start menu in Vista/7. Or the control panel.
That's called *forethought*. And to successfully design UIs, you simply
can't ignore your clientel's usage patters which you have put so much
time and effort into fostering. That's just bad design, bad business,
and...wellbad!

I too have missed the minimize all button, but at least Ubuntu has
finally started to incorporate the windows shortcut keys that everyone
is familiar with. I also have to say that I really miss middle click
pasting without having to copy text. To me that was always one of those
little things that made Linux worth using over windows, and it will be
sincerely missed.

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-17 Thread Jeff c
Every Unity installation should come with a bottle of valium. Unity has
turned my computer(that I use for work to make money) into an iPhone and
thus turning ubuntu into a joke.

What I can't stand:

- Applications in the menu have no tree structure. Everything is piled on top 
of each other and makes no sense
- I would like to minimize all my windows and show the desktop, is this even 
possible in unity?
- Why does it take so much work to get to my mounted drives?

Anyway, i'm off to Debian. Been around since Dapper.. It was real!

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Re: [Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-17 Thread Omer Akram
 Anyway, i'm off to Debian. Been around since Dapper.. It was real!

You've been around since Dapper  and you don't even know how to change
session from gdm(password screen) ;)

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-15 Thread andy16666
I can wholeheartedly confirm this issue in 11.04. It's not that it's
totally broken or anything. It's just that it's a design disaster. Even
a simple thing like browsing with the mouse to the program I want is
virtually impossible to figure out, and ends up taking a half dozen
clicks.

The side bar is clunky and I absolutely hate the fact that I have to
scroll along it, even with only a hand full of custom launchers. This UI
may look nice but as a human I can honestly say that it's the worst
desktop UI I've seen in a very long time. I will try to stick it out and
get used to it, but chances are I'll be opting out for the classic Gnome
UI within a week, and contemplating a move to another distro shortly
after.

I realise that the Ubuntu team puts a lot of time and effort into
improving the UI and I don't mean to be critical. But this new Unity
thing just doesn't seem to work for me at any level, and I've been using
Linux as a primary desktop for over 10 years. I'm an IT professional
with two degrees in computer science. In that time I've seen some pretty
terrible UIs, but until now, nothing that feels like it's intentionally
designed to be a barrier between me and accessing and using the programs
on my computer.

I really hope this either gets a major overhaul or gets chucked on the
scrap heap. Because I love Ubuntu but I'm just not sure how long I can
put up with it. While I'm not a fan of Windows, I think they at least
understand that when making a major change like this, that you have to
make absolutely sure that you're not getting in the user's way. I
realise you don't have the kind of testing team it takes to determine
this, so here it is: this interface gets in the user's way! It's a total
fail. And it needs to be dropped until such a time as it doesn't get in
the user's way.

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Re: [Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-05 Thread Mark Shuttleworth
On 05/04/11 15:42, CedricMC wrote:
 Sometimes, I wonder if your intention is to simply replace Gnome Shell
 by Unity as the default desktop shell* or if your intention is more
 ambitious and you plan to develop your own DE (over Wayland, I guess). I
 would prefer the former rather than the latter since it would imply a
 stronger commitment in the collaboration of the Gnome development,
 although from what you say I deduce that you (Canonical and Gnome) have
 strong differences in your points of view.

I certainly never envisaged Unity *outside* of Gnome. However, I think
we may find ourselves there, unexpectedly. Where that goes I cannot
speculate.

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-05 Thread Seth Galitzer
Mark, I'm glad you're taking an interest in this thread.  I'll try to
offer my rational thoughts here.  My first encounter with Unity was
after installing Maverick on my netbook, and I found it horribly
lacking.  I very quickly restored the UNR-style desktop (which I think
is a *great* UI for a small screen, by the way) and have been very happy
with it.

Here are my complaints (opinions) regarding Unity:

1) I think Unity is an interesting platform and I am interested in
seeing how it develops.

2) Pushing what seems at best a beta-quality release as the desktop
default I think was a mistake.  It surely turned off many first-time
users, which is who I think you (we) should be appealing to most.  It
also has surely annoyed many experienced users and Ubuntu supporters.
The high quality we have come to expect from an Ubuntu release in the
last several years appeared to simply be tossed out of the window with
this single choice.  If you wanted beta testers, surely there would have
been a better way to go about getting them.

3) The launcher takes up way too much space on a netbook- (or smaller-)
sized device.  It is always on top with no way to shrink, move, or hide
it.  On a 10 (or smaller) screen, this is .75-1 of horizontal space
that you can never get back.  There is simply not enough space to spare
on a small screen to allow this.  I'm hoping future enhancements will
allow users to adjust this size in the future, which may alleviate this
concern.

4) My very first reaction (after holy cow this is huge and annoying)
was this would be awesome on a touchscreen.  I look forward to seeing
how this could be used in such an environment with future improvements.

5) Linux desktop managers have been trying to copy Windows for years
now.  I have always hated the Start button UI paradigm.  Now it seems
that we are trying to copy OSX.  I've never been a fan of that UI
either, and really have not liked the do-everything taskbar/launcher
paradigm.  If that's what you're going for here, it's not my cuppa tea.
My favorite UI is still the old and venerable fvwm, with a wharf style
launcher.  Maybe that's just me.

For me, the greatest advantage of Linux and desktop distributions is
that they offer me many choices.  I am experienced enough of a Linux
user now that I am capable of making choices with relative ease.  If I
see an application that improves my desktop experience in any way, I am
happy to give it a try.  If I like it enough, I'm happy to switch
permanently.  Right now, I feel that Unity is not quite ready for prime
time, and currently does not have features that would induce me to use
it as my primary desktop shell.

Seth

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-05 Thread Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen
@Erfan, @joopbraak: Thanks for displaying your linguistic eloquence and
constructively help everyone along. Be sure to highlight your
communicative skills on your CVs. We learned a lot from the 10.10
deployment and that's why Unity has received a *massive* overhaul in the
11.04 cycle and if you try the latest beta and apply all the upgrades I
hope you will see the fruits of that labour.

Alternatively if your woes stem from video card driver problems you
might want to try out Unity2D instead which does not require hardware
acceleration (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity2D).

When/if you encounter concrete problems don't hesitate to report them.

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-05 Thread Bilal Akhtar
Mikkel above is right. Unity has been completely re-written from scratch
for Ubuntu 11.04 and its much faster, much more slick and I can tell you
that its better than GNOME-Panel and even netbook-launcher.

BTW, when commenting on bug reports, one must follow the Ubuntu Code of
Conduct http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct . Serious action may be
taken against the violators.

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Re: [Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-05 Thread Mark Shuttleworth
Erfan, I would ask you to try 11.04 Unity, which is a major step forward
from the version we used in 10.10. It would not have been possible to
take that step without the widespread testing we got with Unity in 10.10
Netbook Edition.

So, thank you for your feedback. As others have said, the language and
tone you used are not constructive and not going to influence our
position. You would have more success, if you want to make the
experience better, by focusing on the specific things that can be improved.

Mark

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-05 Thread CedricMC
Although perhaps @Erfan is out of line in his intensity, I have used the
same words myself (see #3) in a softer way. But one should think that,
if FS and OS communities are so quite and polite, why there are some
people that complain in that way? It is a response for their frustration
after having been used by Canonical as guinea pigs. I personally believe
that Unity was (and still is) in a too much early state and that to
release in such a state a software, on which the user experience depends
so much, has been a big mistake and a wrong decision by  Mark
Shuttleworth.

I know that the variety of projects is part of the FS and OS community's
strength, but I did no understand why they begun to work in first place
in this project having already projects like their own netbook-launcher,
Gnome-Do or Docky and, furthermore, with the imminent release of Gnome
Shell (which in my opinion will change the DE and DM paradigm of the
GNU/Linux world).

I really hope that @Mikkel and @Bilal are right and that Unity has been
improved in 11.04, but this does not change what has been done.
Moreover, Canonical has lost part of my confidence with this move (and
others). Even though, I will surely give it a try (hoping it does not
sucks ;) ).

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-05 Thread CedricMC
@Mark Shuttleworth , it is great that you are participating of this
discussion. I would have a question for you. What are the plans of
Ubuntu with Gnome 3.0? Will this affect Unity?

Even though I do not always agree with your point of view (see #11), I
want to thank you for the great job you are doing for the FS, OS,
GNU/Linux communities.

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Re: [Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-05 Thread Mark Shuttleworth
On 05/04/11 12:59, CedricMC wrote:
 @Mark Shuttleworth , it is great that you are participating of this
 discussion. I would have a question for you. What are the plans of
 Ubuntu with Gnome 3.0? Will this affect Unity?

 Even though I do not always agree with your point of view (see #11), I
 want to thank you for the great job you are doing for the FS, OS,
 GNU/Linux communities.


Thanks Cedric.

Gnome will always have a place in Ubuntu, just like KDE and XFCE. We had
very much expected that Unity would be part of Gnome, but strong voices
in Gnome are saying it is not welcome there. We'll work that out in due
course, one way or the other, with the Gnome Foundation. Unity will be
the default environment, but Ubuntu has always risen above differences
like that to be an overall platform which gives you the best of ALL open
source.

Gnome 3 will be no different. We already have a lot of people, Canonical
and community, helping out to get to the point where Ubuntu users can
enjoy Gnome Shell and Gnome 3.

Mark

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-05 Thread CedricMC
Thank you for answering.

Sometimes, I wonder if your intention is to simply replace Gnome Shell
by Unity as the default desktop shell* or if your intention is more
ambitious and you plan to develop your own DE (over Wayland, I guess). I
would prefer the former rather than the latter since it would imply a
stronger commitment in the collaboration of the Gnome development,
although from what you say I deduce that you (Canonical and Gnome) have
strong differences in your points of view.

Despite that I like very much Gnome (and I am excited for its next
release), I also think that KDE and XFCE have a lot of to offer,
specially XFCE when it comes to computers with low resources. I have
also been wondering why did you not use XFCE for the netbook
distribution (maybe the user experience will be strange from desktop to
netbook).

In the next weeks I will give a try to Gnome3, Natty, Unity and even
KDE** and, as you say, I hope to see Gnome3 soon in Ubuntu.

My bests.

Cédric


*: it is in my understanding that Unity is more a desktop shell than a desktop 
environment, correct me if I am wrong.
**: I confess I never liked it too much since I always had bad experiences with 
it.

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-04-04 Thread Erfan
UBUNTU UNITY SUCKS, I think this stupid decision to use unity will turn
away so many new Linux users, even someone like me who uses Linux since
2000. I am switching to OpenSUSE or something else, UBUNTU sucks more
and more every day.

These people seem to agree:
http://www.splitbrain.org/blog/2010-10/25-ubuntu_unity_sucks

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2011-01-14 Thread joopbraak
** Changed in: unity
   Status: Invalid = Opinion

** Changed in: unity (Ubuntu)
   Status: Invalid = Opinion

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2010-11-23 Thread ShackJack
The new interface is rather horrible, IMO... But, no need to downgrade
tho... my fix was easy:

1. Log out and select GNOME Desktop as your session at the login
screen :-)

2. (optional) For maximizing screen space - nuke the bottom panel, add
the window picker (and other desired apps/launchers) to the top panel
and set to autohide.. For additional flair, install the awn
launcher/dock to the bottom and set to autohide. Use Chromium for your
browser, as it tends to be faster and have less Chrome - heh... :-)

(Note: you may need to install compiz or enable compositing for the
window manager)

My netbook runs great with full-GNOME and the Compiz eyecandy - and
looks good doing it, too!

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2010-10-17 Thread Ad1217
Unity is terrible. I cannot configure it, it bogs down my computer,
messes up my applications, and is completely unusable. Just now I was
trying to add a launcher to the panel and, of course, it did not work.
Having some sort of drag-and-drop way to put applications in would
work, but of course, nobody would use that. I am thinking of
downgrading if this is not fixed soon.

** Also affects: unity
   Importance: Undecided
   Status: New

** Changed in: unity (Ubuntu)
   Status: Opinion = Confirmed

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2010-10-17 Thread Vish
Thank you for taking the time to report this bug and helping to make Ubuntu 
better. 
We are closing this bug report because it lists several bugs already reported 
and is a discussion regarding design changes.
Have a look at the other bugs already reported : 
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity

If you are interested in discussing the design changes, kindly write
your concerns to ayat...@lists.launchpad.net, where the developers can
respond.

** Changed in: unity (Ubuntu)
   Status: Confirmed = Invalid

** Changed in: unity
   Status: New = Invalid

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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2010-10-15 Thread CedricMC
Maybe the word sucks is not the best suited for a dissertation, but
joopbraak just made a point saying that unity is still very buggy and
user UNfriendly. Up to now, it has been a pain and, if anything changes
soon, I'm going to downgrade to 10.04.

- Graphic corruption on the tray icons.
- Unity sometimes crashes an restarts (at least).
- Unity sometimes disappears (open firefox, hit F11, close firefox, ups your 
alone...)
- Hard to get on Nautilus, so it is hard to manage files, connect to a remote 
server, etc.
- It steals the super key, so other programs that use it are broken, e.g.: 
gnome-do, emacs, etc.
- Very slow, for instance filtering the program names (gnome-do is much more 
simpler, better, faster, stronger).
- You can no longer use Alt-F2 to run a command.
- Etcetera.

I should also said that I like the whole idea thing of Unity. In
contrast to Toby Murray, I believe that the vertical bar (which is so
similar to Gnome-Do Docky) saves space in widescreen displays. Although
Unity maybe will be a great interface but, right now, it simply sucks.

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Unity sucks
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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2010-10-12 Thread Toby Murray
Yes! I have no desire to give up precious screen real estate to a
permanent vertical bar that behaves like one of the features I HATE from
OSX. Is this program actually running or just 'pinned'?! And why are the
icons moving when I try to click on them?!

Luckily I have figured out how to make things work mostly like they used
to. If it isn't installed already, install the package netbook-launcher-
efl. This should give you a Netbook Edition (2D) option in the list of
available sessions out on the login screen. Choose this session.

By default this session seems kind of broken. At least mine came with
nothing in the top gnome-panel. No window switcher, no notification
area... just the power icon to log out/turn off and the gwibber menu
(yay?). After adding the Window Picker and Notification Area
applets, I am pretty much back to the look of netbook-launcher from
lucid. In fact I think it looks slightly better.

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Unity sucks
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[Bug 648180] Re: Unity sucks

2010-09-26 Thread joopbraak

** Attachment added: Dependencies.txt
   
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/648180/+attachment/1639426/+files/Dependencies.txt

** Changed in: unity (Ubuntu)
   Status: New = Opinion

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