Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[Monte Goulding]

> On 4 May 2016, at 3:12 PM, Peter W A Wood  wrote:
> 
> I think that you have missed out one way to contribute that would be very 
> valuable to both the community and LiveCode. That is writing automatically 
> runnable tests.

I did miss that!

> There is an automated test suite but it is kept under lock and key by 
> LiveCode so that community members cannot contribute by submitting meaningful 
> tests.

Actually this is not true. The tests and test runners are on GitHub and 
therefore contributable (probably not a word???):
 - IDE https://github.com/livecode/livecode-ide/tree/develop/tests (this is 
 - LCB, LCS https://github.com/livecode/livecode/tree/develop/tests

Cheers

Monte
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[Peter W A Wood]

Monte

I think that you have missed out one way to contribute that would be very 
valuable to both the community and LiveCode. That is writing automatically 
runnable tests. There is an automated test suite but it is kept under lock and 
key by LiveCode so that community members cannot contribute by submitting 
meaningful tests.

I built my own simple testing framework 
(https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-MiniTest 
) and have a handful of tests 
(https://github.com/PeterWAWood/LiveCode-Tests 
). (If you run 
the tests, you will see that some of them fail.).

A set of community developed automated tests would be a great resource that 
could be grown over time.

Regards

Peter

> On 4 May 2016, at 12:47, Monte Goulding  wrote:

> There are many ways we can get involved with the development of the platform. 
> All of these have been done by contributors since going open source although 
> I doubt this is a complete list:
> - C/C++/Objective-C/Java
>   - Contribute to the engine code by fixing bugs or adding features
>   - Contribute to the externals that come with LiveCode
>   - Contribute to or implement your own externals and release under a FOSS 
> license
> - LiveCode Builder
>   - Contribute to widgets and libraries that come with LiveCode
>   - Contribute to or implement your own widgets and libraries and release 
> under a FOSS license
> - LiveCode Script
>   - Contribute to the script only stack portions of the IDE (most of the code 
> in LC8)
>   - Contribute to or implement script libraries, frameworks and custom 
> controls and release under a FOSS license
> - Documentation
>   - Edit the dictionary entries and guides
>   - Create new guides and contribute
>   - Create learning resources and release under a FOSS license
>   - Answer questions on stackoverflow, the lists and forums, facebook etc
> - Testing
>   - Write good quality bug reports
>   - Find old reports, test in the latest version and comment with your results
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Monte
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[Monte Goulding]

> On 4 May 2016, at 2:20 PM, JB  wrote:
> And so it is obvious everyone cannot be
> involved in programming the open source
> version for many different reasons.  That
> leaves people little chance to participate
> by adding code.  Use it, point out bugs
> and pay money.  That is not what I was
> hoping for.

There are many ways we can get involved with the development of the platform. 
All of these have been done by contributors since going open source although I 
doubt this is a complete list:
- C/C++/Objective-C/Java
   - Contribute to the engine code by fixing bugs or adding features
   - Contribute to the externals that come with LiveCode
   - Contribute to or implement your own externals and release under a FOSS 
license
- LiveCode Builder
   - Contribute to widgets and libraries that come with LiveCode
   - Contribute to or implement your own widgets and libraries and release 
under a FOSS license
- LiveCode Script
   - Contribute to the script only stack portions of the IDE (most of the code 
in LC8)
   - Contribute to or implement script libraries, frameworks and custom 
controls and release under a FOSS license
- Documentation
   - Edit the dictionary entries and guides
   - Create new guides and contribute
   - Create learning resources and release under a FOSS license
   - Answer questions on stackoverflow, the lists and forums, facebook etc
- Testing
   - Write good quality bug reports
   - Find old reports, test in the latest version and comment with your results
   
Cheers

Monte
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[Kaveh Bazargan]

The fact that is so much discussion about the licenses shows there is a
problem. LiveCode's pricing has been complex as long as I can remember.
Most software you pay once, it's yours, you get free updates, and if there
is a major upgrade, you pay for upgrade. Big, terrible companies like Adobe
are entrenched in the market and can charge what they want. LiveCode is no
Adobe yet!

On 4 May 2016 at 09:50, JB  wrote:

> I think the community version would have
> more community involvement if they gave
> people more externals to show them how
> to create externals.
>
> I get the feeling tje mothership does not
> want community advancement externals.
>
> And so it is obvious everyone cannot be
> involved in programming the open source
> version for many different reasons.  That
> leaves people little chance to participate
> by adding code.  Use it, point out bugs
> and pay money.  That is not what I was
> hoping for.
>
> JB
>
>
>
>
>
> > On May 3, 2016, at 7:56 PM, Robert Mann  wrote:
> >
> > I goes one of the central issue of a community version.. is.. community!?
> >
> > How to make people feel member of the community? get them involved?
> >
> > One way of doing that is to let people buy something maybe not much, but
> > something. That was the idea of the pay once upgrade when you feel which
> was
> > tried before.
> >
> > Paradoxically, with the community version, the more we move ahead from
> the
> > great community foundation kickstart, the less there may be a feel of
> > community!!?? what do you think?
> >
> > So maybe the question about Open source Edition and revenue? could be
> > rephrased to something different like :: Open source edition and BENEFITS
> > (of all kinds to the livecode ecosystem) ???
> >
> > As an example, I'm pretty sure that many of us really like that
> > language/tool and would take some time to promote it e.g. at schools.
> That
> > would need organization and incentives, like.. the benefit of more
> > affordable  commercial license schemes that could even be traded to help
> out
> > people start up something. And that would cost nothing and could be an
> > important medium term benefit.
> >
> > On the whole, i feel mothership is kind of into  shyzophrenic situation
> ::
> > the move to open source certainly was a generous move, event though at
> that
> > time it may just have been death and exit otherwise. And the other hand
> we
> > feel a commercial pressure with prices going up and up for the little
> rock
> > of commercial folks.
> >
> > I was surprised to see that the "community" developments fundings were
> not
> > so successful. it was a way of carrying forward the initial kickstart
> move.
> > Maybe that should be tried agin, possibly with a different organization :
> > would it change the results if the community participated to selection of
> > developments proposed? or even.. drove them!? well hum, that would be
> > revolution that would imp lie seeing up some kind of representation of
> that
> > community.
> >
> > Livecode Community could be well used for a lot of "community" actions in
> > our societies. I though personally of attending the "units debuts comity
> of
> > computing" in Paris just to talk to them about livecode because they
> need to
> > build a set of tools and livecode community would be just right. and that
> > would greatly expose livecode (they gather 250 geeks from Paris..
> > imagine..).
> >
> > Now that mothership has embarked on the community track, the next step
> could
> > well be to get together some kind of representation of the group to
> > exchange, meet, discuss and relay etc with the objective to establish
> such a
> > community feeling??
> >
> > And that could have a huge potential to motivate, generate many actions
> that
> > bring those many benefits, that are hard to see yet with a close view to
> > revenues.
> > My cents!
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > View this message in context:
> http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revenue-and-the-Open-Source-edition-tp4704079p4704180.html
> > Sent from the Revolution - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> >
> > ___
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-- 
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Director
River Valley Technologies
@kaveh1000
+44 7771 824 111
www.rivervalleytechnologies.com
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[JB]

I think the community version would have
more community involvement if they gave
people more externals to show them how
to create externals.

I get the feeling tje mothership does not
want community advancement externals.

And so it is obvious everyone cannot be
involved in programming the open source
version for many different reasons.  That
leaves people little chance to participate
by adding code.  Use it, point out bugs
and pay money.  That is not what I was
hoping for.

JB





> On May 3, 2016, at 7:56 PM, Robert Mann  wrote:
> 
> I goes one of the central issue of a community version.. is.. community!?
> 
> How to make people feel member of the community? get them involved?
> 
> One way of doing that is to let people buy something maybe not much, but
> something. That was the idea of the pay once upgrade when you feel which was
> tried before. 
> 
> Paradoxically, with the community version, the more we move ahead from the
> great community foundation kickstart, the less there may be a feel of
> community!!?? what do you think?
> 
> So maybe the question about Open source Edition and revenue? could be
> rephrased to something different like :: Open source edition and BENEFITS
> (of all kinds to the livecode ecosystem) ???
> 
> As an example, I'm pretty sure that many of us really like that
> language/tool and would take some time to promote it e.g. at schools. That
> would need organization and incentives, like.. the benefit of more
> affordable  commercial license schemes that could even be traded to help out
> people start up something. And that would cost nothing and could be an
> important medium term benefit.
> 
> On the whole, i feel mothership is kind of into  shyzophrenic situation ::
> the move to open source certainly was a generous move, event though at that
> time it may just have been death and exit otherwise. And the other hand we
> feel a commercial pressure with prices going up and up for the little rock
> of commercial folks.
> 
> I was surprised to see that the "community" developments fundings were not
> so successful. it was a way of carrying forward the initial kickstart move.
> Maybe that should be tried agin, possibly with a different organization :
> would it change the results if the community participated to selection of
> developments proposed? or even.. drove them!? well hum, that would be
> revolution that would imp lie seeing up some kind of representation of that
> community.
> 
> Livecode Community could be well used for a lot of "community" actions in
> our societies. I though personally of attending the "units debuts comity of
> computing" in Paris just to talk to them about livecode because they need to
> build a set of tools and livecode community would be just right. and that
> would greatly expose livecode (they gather 250 geeks from Paris..
> imagine..). 
> 
> Now that mothership has embarked on the community track, the next step could
> well be to get together some kind of representation of the group to
> exchange, meet, discuss and relay etc with the objective to establish such a
> community feeling??
> 
> And that could have a huge potential to motivate, generate many actions that
> bring those many benefits, that are hard to see yet with a close view to
> revenues.
> My cents!
> 
> 
> 
> --
> View this message in context: 
> http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revenue-and-the-Open-Source-edition-tp4704079p4704180.html
> Sent from the Revolution - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> 
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[Robert Mann]

I goes one of the central issue of a community version.. is.. community!?

How to make people feel member of the community? get them involved?

One way of doing that is to let people buy something maybe not much, but
something. That was the idea of the pay once upgrade when you feel which was
tried before. 

Paradoxically, with the community version, the more we move ahead from the
great community foundation kickstart, the less there may be a feel of
community!!?? what do you think?

So maybe the question about Open source Edition and revenue? could be
rephrased to something different like :: Open source edition and BENEFITS
(of all kinds to the livecode ecosystem) ???

As an example, I'm pretty sure that many of us really like that
language/tool and would take some time to promote it e.g. at schools. That
would need organization and incentives, like.. the benefit of more
affordable  commercial license schemes that could even be traded to help out
people start up something. And that would cost nothing and could be an
important medium term benefit.

On the whole, i feel mothership is kind of into  shyzophrenic situation ::
the move to open source certainly was a generous move, event though at that
time it may just have been death and exit otherwise. And the other hand we
feel a commercial pressure with prices going up and up for the little rock
of commercial folks.

I was surprised to see that the "community" developments fundings were not
so successful. it was a way of carrying forward the initial kickstart move.
Maybe that should be tried agin, possibly with a different organization :
would it change the results if the community participated to selection of
developments proposed? or even.. drove them!? well hum, that would be
revolution that would imp lie seeing up some kind of representation of that
community.

Livecode Community could be well used for a lot of "community" actions in
our societies. I though personally of attending the "units debuts comity of
computing" in Paris just to talk to them about livecode because they need to
build a set of tools and livecode community would be just right. and that
would greatly expose livecode (they gather 250 geeks from Paris..
imagine..). 

Now that mothership has embarked on the community track, the next step could
well be to get together some kind of representation of the group to
exchange, meet, discuss and relay etc with the objective to establish such a
community feeling??

And that could have a huge potential to motivate, generate many actions that
bring those many benefits, that are hard to see yet with a close view to
revenues.
My cents!



--
View this message in context: 
http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Revenue-and-the-Open-Source-edition-tp4704079p4704180.html
Sent from the Revolution - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Re: drawing tools in LC 8

[Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami]

On 5/3/16, 11:01 AM, "use-livecode on behalf of Devin Asay" 
 wrote:



>I have the same question as Richard—are you talking about drawing (graphics) 
>tools or painting (image) tools? I think you’re referring to paint tools. In 
>that case I can confirm—the brush, spray can, and eraser tools seem to have no 
>effect. Definitely worth a bug report.
>

All of the above… from a “kid’s” point of view they are all the same… you put 
pixels on the canvas.

But yes..it does seem it is the paint tools that are broken…

So this thread should probably have been “Paint tools” 

I will “bug it”

Tks
BR
>
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Re: Doing Maths in Hex

[Mark Wieder]

On 05/03/2016 11:53 AM, [-hh] wrote:

Bonjour Thierry,

Perfect.
But now, of course, the question arises, how to do that in base 42 ;-)


return (6 * 8)

--
 Mark Wieder
 ahsoftw...@gmail.com

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Re: Doing Maths in Hex

[Bob Sneidar]

Don't do that. You'll break the universe.

Bob S


On May 3, 2016, at 11:53 , [-hh] 
> wrote:

Bonjour Thierry,

Perfect.
But now, of course, the question arises, how to do that in base 42 ;-)

Hermann

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Re: Clearing local variables

[Bob Sneidar]

I do the exact same thing Peter. I learned this when I was developing for a 
dBase accounting application. All their control structures and terminations 
were commented quite extensively, and I was able to learn dBase and their code 
specifically because they did.

Bob S


On Apr 30, 2016, at 06:31 , Peter M. Brigham 
> wrote:

I generally do the same thing with nested repeats, but my comments are 
different:

On Apr 30, 2016, at 2:13 AM, Kay C Lan wrote:

put 0 into tCounter
repeat with a = 1 to 10
repeat with b = 1 to 10
  repeat with c = 1 to 10
repeat with d = 1 to 10
  repeat with e = 1 to 10
add 1 to tCounter
-- do stuff with variables here
  end repeat  -- e = 1 to 10
  -- more processing
end repeat  -- d = 1 to 10
-- more processing
  end repeat  -- c = 1 to 10
  -- more processing
end repeat  -- b = 1 to 10
-- more processing
end repeat  -- a = 1 to 10

-- Peter

Peter M. Brigham
pmb...@gmail.com
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Re: LiveCode Externals etc (was Re: Rust externals [was: Being a developer after 40])

[Richard Gaskin]

Ben Rubinstein wrote:

> ...is there anyway an explanation of the differences and
> relationships between:
>
> - widgets
Custom controls written in LiveCode Builder with advanced
rendering and packaging.

> - libraries
Can be written in either LiveCode Script or LiveCode Builder.
Note that Builder now has some access to OS APIs, so if your
library needs that you'll write it in LC Builder.

> - externals
Written in C or other low-level language that can compile to
machine code with the Externals SDK

> - plugins
Any stack present in the Plugins folder so it can be opened
from the IDE's Development -> Plugins menu, usually custom
development tools.


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.

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Re: Error, but no error?

[Dan Friedman]

Mark,

I just tried your suggestion and I got the same empty "Errors" dialog, and the 
execution did not halt at all, same as before.

What does this mean?

-Dan



> Dan,
> 
> There is a good chance that the problem is in the IDE. Put true into 
> gRevDevelopment, turn on the Script Debug Mode (Development menu) and 
> try again. Does the debug window appear and where does the execution halt?
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Mark Schonewille
> 
> 
>> Greetings!
>> 
>> I am having a problem tracking down a bug.  But the real problem is that the 
>> LC's error dialog is showing empty.  I put this in my stack script:
>> 
>> on errorDialog pExecutionError, pParseError
>>  answer pExecutionError & pParseError
>> end errorDialog
>> 
>> It does fire, but both pExecutionError and pParseError are empty.  I put in 
>> a breakpoint, and checked the contents of pExecutionError and pParseError 
>> and they are both empty!
>> 
>> I get the same result in both 7.0.1 and 7.0.4.
>> 
>> Any thoughts?
>> 
>> 
>> Thanks in advance,
>> -Dan


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Re: Error, but no error?

[Mark Schonewille]

Dan,

There is a good chance that the problem is in the IDE. Put true into 
gRevDevelopment, turn on the Script Debug Mode (Development menu) and 
try again. Does the debug window appear and where does the execution halt?


Kind regards,

Mark Schonewille
http://economy-x-talk.com
https://www.facebook.com/marksch

Buy the most extensive book on the
LiveCode language:
http://livecodebeginner.economy-x-talk.com

Op 03-May-16 om 23:51 schreef Dan Friedman:

Greetings!

I am having a problem tracking down a bug.  But the real problem is that the 
LC's error dialog is showing empty.  I put this in my stack script:

on errorDialog pExecutionError, pParseError
  answer pExecutionError & pParseError
end errorDialog

It does fire, but both pExecutionError and pParseError are empty.  I put in a 
breakpoint, and checked the contents of pExecutionError and pParseError and 
they are both empty!

I get the same result in both 7.0.1 and 7.0.4.

Any thoughts?


Thanks in advance,
-Dan
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Re: LiveCode Externals etc (was Re: Rust externals [was: Being a developer after 40])

[Ben Rubinstein]

To be precise:


LiveCode 2.7.x or later (any edition should do)
Visual C++ 2005 – any edition including Express (if you want to build
externals on Windows)
XCode 2.4.x (if want to build externals on Mac OS X)


(At least it exists now - when I last posted to this list in despair 
(09/10/2015 18:45), it had gone missing altogether.)


On a slightly adjusted topic - one of those questions I've been feeling too 
stupid to ask but would really appreciate - is there anyway an explanation of 
the differences and relationships between:

- widgets
- libraries
- externals
- plugins

?

Ben

On 02/05/2016 19:29, Matthias Rebbe wrote:

If i remember right, the lesson about creating an external used xCode 3 or so.
And the screenshots did not match current xCode version. But i might be wrong.






Am 02.05.2016 um 17:23 schrieb Richard Gaskin :

Matthias Rebbe wrote:

An updated lesson about how to create an external using the current
Xcode versions, would be helpful. ;)


To help guide that effort, where is the current lesson not working out?

--
Richard Gaskin
Fourth World Systems
Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web

ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com



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Error, but no error?

[Dan Friedman]

Greetings!

I am having a problem tracking down a bug.  But the real problem is that the 
LC's error dialog is showing empty.  I put this in my stack script:

on errorDialog pExecutionError, pParseError
  answer pExecutionError & pParseError
end errorDialog

It does fire, but both pExecutionError and pParseError are empty.  I put in a 
breakpoint, and checked the contents of pExecutionError and pParseError and 
they are both empty!

I get the same result in both 7.0.1 and 7.0.4.

Any thoughts?


Thanks in advance,
-Dan
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Re: drawing tools in LC 8

[Devin Asay]

> On May 3, 2016, at 11:51 AM, Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami  
> wrote:
> 
> I’m looking forward to a small coloring/drawing module for our big app.  
> Little hacking today:
> 
> Today I tried clicking on the pen tool and drawing.. It auto created an 
> object that takes up the entire card and not just where I drew. So I created 
> an image object first, then tried the tools. Pen tool works.
> 
> Then I switched to the brush tool and started to brush.. .nothing happened, 
> but when I used the bucket tool the image filled with color.   Then I 
> switched to the eraser nothing happened. Switch back to pen tool, oops the 
> tools palette is stuck on the brush…I have to click the pointer tool once, 
> browse tool and back again.. .now I can click the pen again,, brush, eraser 
> and spray do not work.
> 
> OK, it has been literally years since I touched these tools  am I doing 
> something wrong ?or are these seriously messed up in the IDE on Mac?
> 
> Can you test/confirm/deny on your machine?
> 
> If so I will report as a bug.

BR-

I have the same question as Richard—are you talking about drawing (graphics) 
tools or painting (image) tools? I think you’re referring to paint tools. In 
that case I can confirm—the brush, spray can, and eraser tools seem to have no 
effect. Definitely worth a bug report.

Devin

Devin Asay
Office of Digital Humanities
Brigham Young University

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Re: Doing Maths in Hex

[[-hh]]

Bonjour Thierry,

Perfect.
But now, of course, the question arises, how to do that in base 42 ;-)

Hermann

Thierry Douez wrote
> .. and before the next question will arise:
> ​
> 
> put addHexy( "20F", "4CD", "10", "3AB")
> 
> function addHexy
>local T
>repeat with i = 1 to paramCount()
>   add baseConvert(  param( i) ,16,10) to T
>end repeat
>return baseconvert( T, 10, 16)
> end addHexy
> 
> ​Thierry
> ​





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Re: drawing tools in LC 8

[Richard Gaskin]

Do you want drawing tools or painting tools?

--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com

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Re: drawing tools in LC 8

[RM]

Quite honestly I don't think they have been touched for donkey's ages,
and they are not much use as they are at present.

Richmond.

On 3.05.2016 20:51, Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami wrote:

I’m looking forward to a small coloring/drawing module for our big app.  Little 
hacking today:

Today I tried clicking on the pen tool and drawing.. It auto created an object 
that takes up the entire card and not just where I drew. So I created an image 
object first, then tried the tools. Pen tool works.

Then I switched to the brush tool and started to brush.. .nothing happened, but 
when I used the bucket tool the image filled with color.   Then I switched to 
the eraser nothing happened. Switch back to pen tool, oops the tools palette is 
stuck on the brush…I have to click the pointer tool once, browse tool and back 
again.. .now I can click the pen again,, brush, eraser and spray do not work.

OK, it has been literally years since I touched these tools  am I doing 
something wrong ?or are these seriously messed up in the IDE on Mac?

Can you test/confirm/deny on your machine?

  If so I will report as a bug.

BR

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drawing tools in LC 8

[Sannyasin Brahmanathaswami]

I’m looking forward to a small coloring/drawing module for our big app.  Little 
hacking today:

Today I tried clicking on the pen tool and drawing.. It auto created an object 
that takes up the entire card and not just where I drew. So I created an image 
object first, then tried the tools. Pen tool works.

Then I switched to the brush tool and started to brush.. .nothing happened, but 
when I used the bucket tool the image filled with color.   Then I switched to 
the eraser nothing happened. Switch back to pen tool, oops the tools palette is 
stuck on the brush…I have to click the pointer tool once, browse tool and back 
again.. .now I can click the pen again,, brush, eraser and spray do not work.

OK, it has been literally years since I touched these tools  am I doing 
something wrong ?or are these seriously messed up in the IDE on Mac?

Can you test/confirm/deny on your machine?

 If so I will report as a bug.

BR

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Re: Doing Maths in Hex

[Thierry Douez]

> > and with a bit of factoring...
> >
> >   put addHex( "20F", "4CD")
> >
> >
> > function addHex v1, v2
> >   local d1, d2
> >   put baseConvert( v1,16,10)  into d1
> >   put baseConvert( v2,16,10)  into d2
> >   return baseconvert( d1 + d2, 10, 16)
> > end addHex
> >
> > Thierry
>
> Well done, Thierry!
>
> Devin
>

​Thanks Devin :)

and before the next cquestion will arises:
​

put addHexy( "20F", "4CD", "10", "3AB")

function addHexy
   local T
   repeat with i = 1 to paramCount()
  add baseConvert(  param( i) ,16,10) to T
   end repeat
   return baseconvert( T, 10, 16)
end addHexy


​Thierry
​


Thierry Douez - http://sunny-tdz.com
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Re: Doing Maths in Hex

[Devin Asay]

> On May 3, 2016, at 11:13 AM, Thierry Douez  wrote:
> 
> and with a bit of factoring...
> 
>   put addHex( "20F", "4CD")
> 
> 
> function addHex v1, v2
>   local d1, d2
>   put baseConvert( v1,16,10)  into d1
>   put baseConvert( v2,16,10)  into d2
>   return baseconvert( d1 + d2, 10, 16)
> end addHex
> 
> Thierry

Well done, Thierry!

Devin


Devin Asay
Office of Digital Humanities
Brigham Young University


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Re: Doing Maths in Hex

[Thierry Douez]

and with a bit of factoring...

   put addHex( "20F", "4CD")


function addHex v1, v2
   local d1, d2
   put baseConvert( v1,16,10)  into d1
   put baseConvert( v2,16,10)  into d2
   return baseconvert( d1 + d2, 10, 16)
end addHex

Thierry



2016-05-03 18:13 GMT+02:00 Devin Asay :

>
> > On May 3, 2016, at 9:32 AM, dunbarx  wrote:
> >
> > Richmond.
> >
> > LC cannot add "20F" to "4CD". You need to use "baseConvert". Not onerous
> at
> > all, really.
>
> put baseConvert(baseConvert("20F",16,10) + baseConvert("4CD",16,10),10,16)
>
> devin
>
>

-- 

Thierry Douez - http://sunny-tdz.com
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Re: Endless discussion on licensing and pricing

[Mike Kerner]

As a paying customer, I can confirm, that we do receive surveys.  It might
be three or four per year, and the questions might not always be the ones I
wish were being asked, but we are being queried.

On Tue, May 3, 2016 at 11:39 AM, Bob Sneidar 
wrote:

> I'd like to remind everyone that there is another aspect to developing in
> livecode which probably keeps us all engaged, beyond the profit potential:
> It's damned fun! I doubt I will ever be able to produce a commercially
> marketable application, and yet I have writted a number of useful
> aplications, one which I use every day, and the company I work for wants to
> integrate into their workflow. How do you put a price on that?
>
> Bob S
>
>
>
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-- 
On the first day, God created the heavens and the Earth
On the second day, God created the oceans.
On the third day, God put the animals on hold for a few hours,
   and did a little diving.
And God said, "This is good."
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Re: Doing Maths in Hex

[Devin Asay]

> On May 3, 2016, at 9:32 AM, dunbarx  wrote:
> 
> Richmond.
> 
> LC cannot add "20F" to "4CD". You need to use "baseConvert". Not onerous at
> all, really.

put baseConvert(baseConvert("20F",16,10) + baseConvert("4CD",16,10),10,16)

devin


Devin Asay
Office of Digital Humanities
Brigham Young University


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Re: Doing Maths in Hex

[dunbarx]

Richmond.

LC cannot add "20F" to "4CD". You need to use "baseConvert". Not onerous at
all, really.

Craig



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View this message in context: 
http://runtime-revolution.278305.n4.nabble.com/Doing-Maths-in-Hex-tp4704028p4704160.html
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Re: Endless discussion on licensing and pricing

[Bob Sneidar]

I'd like to remind everyone that there is another aspect to developing in 
livecode which probably keeps us all engaged, beyond the profit potential: It's 
damned fun! I doubt I will ever be able to produce a commercially marketable 
application, and yet I have writted a number of useful aplications, one which I 
use every day, and the company I work for wants to integrate into their 
workflow. How do you put a price on that? 

Bob S



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Re: Hexier and Hexier

[Bob Sneidar]

With a little extra work you could make that work from any base to any base. 

Bob S


> On Apr 30, 2016, at 08:18 , RM  wrote:
> 
> That's me, the ultimate Hex-object of 2016.
> 
> However, as it is that time of the month I'm not really feeling Hexxy at all,
> so I wrote a little something for those, who like me, while not needing a cold
> shower could do with the odd Decimal number here and there:
> 
> http://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?f=8=27163
> 
> Love, "Pin Up" Richmond.
> 
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Re: Endless discussion on licensing and pricing (was: Standalones on el Capitan?)

[Bob Sneidar]

On May 2, 2016, at 05:56 , Paul Dupuis 
> wrote:

For every organization delivering a product, that organization has to
make the product's cost vs value work for THEM. If they charge too
little, they go out of business. If they charge too much, no one buys
it.

This assumes that the two overlap, which is no guarantee. There are scenarios 
where NO retail price can compensate you adequately for your cost, given a 
known demand. This is why business ventures are always a risk.

Bob S


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Re: Doing Maths in Hex

[Bob Sneidar]

When I did my IP subnet calculator, there were some things that required 
binary, like determining what part of the IP address was the network address, 
and other operations required decimal. Of course, that was a unique problem as 
each octet is a discreet value, and not part of a *total* address. It's 
actually 2 addresses, the bit length of each defined by the mask. Still, when I 
needed to do calculations, I needed to do them in decimal.

Bob S


On May 1, 2016, at 02:04 , RM 
> wrote:

Is it possible for Livecode to do Mathematics in Hexadecimal?

Or, am I going to have to shove Hex numbers through a Hex-to-Decimal meat 
grinder,
do the Math(s) and then shove the result through a Decimal-to-Hex meat grinder 
. . .

. . . all going to be a pain-in-the-b quite frankly (especially if one is a 
vegetarian and doesn't
have a meat grinder).

Richmond.

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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[JB]

You are correct!

I helped fund the open source and never
made any complaints about it and am not
complaining now.

JB



> On May 3, 2016, at 5:13 AM, Monte Goulding  wrote:
> 
> 
>> On 3 May 2016, at 10:07 PM, JB  wrote:
>> 
>> We paid for the code and we were given
>> a link to download the code to be used as
>> open source code.  We did not make any
>> agreement to fund its development.
> 
> My point was different people may have contributed to the Kickstarter for 
> different reasons as the open source version wasn’t the only thing on offer. 
> Either way it sounds like you are happy you got what you paid for so that’s 
> great!
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Monte
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[Monte Goulding]

> On 3 May 2016, at 10:07 PM, JB  wrote:
> 
> We paid for the code and we were given
> a link to download the code to be used as
> open source code.  We did not make any
> agreement to fund its development.

My point was different people may have contributed to the Kickstarter for 
different reasons as the open source version wasn’t the only thing on offer. 
Either way it sounds like you are happy you got what you paid for so that’s 
great!

Cheers

Monte
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[JB]

We paid for the code and we were given
a link to download the code to be used as
open source code.  We did not make any
agreement to fund its development.

JB



> On May 2, 2016, at 3:35 PM, Monte Goulding  wrote:
> 
> Aha... Was the Kickstarter for open source or for the refactor? When you 
> consider that the vast majority of Kickstarter funding came from discounted 
> licenses were we finding development or taking advantage of discounts? I 
> personally made one of the highest contributions of everyone to the 
> Kickstarter (US$5000) and believe that has been repaid many times over. It is 
> an incredibly generous thing to release your hard earned intellectual 
> property under an open source licence and I don't think that should be taken 
> for granted.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 3 May 2016, at 8:15 AM, JB  wrote:
>> 
>> If I remember correctly we paid around
>> one million dollars for it.
> 
> 
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Re: revBrowser, bataBase and LC 7.1.3 on Android 5.1.1 or 6

[Peter TB Brett]

On 02/05/2016 22:57, Alain Vezina wrote:

Hi all,

On Android 5.1.1 and 6 the revBrowser and DataBase librairies don’t work with 
LC 7.1.3.  I use SQLite

Anybody else had the same experience?

Should I send a bug report?


Yes please!

  Peter

--
Dr Peter Brett 
LiveCode Open Source Team

LiveCode 2016 Conference: https://livecode.com/edinburgh-2016/

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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[RM]

From a purely selfish point of view (what, me, surely not?) I stated I 
wanted to PAY for something
PERMANENT because I develop ONLY for desktop (and possibly HTML%) 
deployment.


This is where we might need to discuss the sort of folowing scenario:

1. Permanent version that deploys standalones only for desktops (and 
HTML5 ?).


2. "Rentable" version that deploys standalones only to tablets (iOS, 
Android).


3. All-singing-all-dancing version at a high price (and there's room for 
a rent/buy fight there).


"a software tool which is maintained and upgraded regularly, even if 
that means that i have to pay for it."


If there were a reasonable price for a permanent version, and upgrades 
were then offered at, let's say, 20% of the price
of the permanent version to those who ALREADY HAD PURCHASED the 
permanent version . . . ?


Then the end-user can decide whether the new features enabled in an 
upgrade are worth upgrading to

or not just yet.

This is a model used by very many software vendors.

 Richmond.

On 3.05.2016 10:56, Matthias Rebbe wrote:

I am stuck between a rock and a hard place.

On one hand i would prefer a pay once use for ever license model.
On the other i want a software tool which is maintained  and upgraded 
regularly, even if that means that i have to pay for it.

I remember discussions when the old “pay once use that version forever, but you 
can pay for updates” license model were active.
The people were moaning that the tool they just  had purchased some months or 
weeks ago, was upgraded and the upgrade was not free.
I remember discussions about the price for the yearly upgrade fee of Revolution 
standard and Enterprise.

Regarding the discussion about the possibility to deploy to iOS for 
semi-professionals and hobbyists:
With the current situation how often xCode is upgraded and how often therefore 
Livecode needs to be fixed to work again with that xCode version, i really do not 
see any advantage for such a "pay once use forever” license without having the 
opportunity  to subscribe to a software maintenance plan.
But even with such an option to subscribe to such a plan, the discussion starts 
over and over again as soon as  an xCode version is released which is not 
working with older “not upgraded” LC versions.


Matthias




Matthias Rebbe
Bramkampsieke 13
32312 Lübbecke
Tel +49 5741 31
+49 160 5504462
Fax: +49 5741 310002
eMail: matth...@m-r-d.de 

BR5 Konverter - BR5 -> MP3 
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[Matthias Rebbe]

I am stuck between a rock and a hard place.

On one hand i would prefer a pay once use for ever license model.
On the other i want a software tool which is maintained  and upgraded 
regularly, even if that means that i have to pay for it.

I remember discussions when the old “pay once use that version forever, but you 
can pay for updates” license model were active.
The people were moaning that the tool they just  had purchased some months or 
weeks ago, was upgraded and the upgrade was not free.
I remember discussions about the price for the yearly upgrade fee of Revolution 
standard and Enterprise.

Regarding the discussion about the possibility to deploy to iOS for 
semi-professionals and hobbyists:
With the current situation how often xCode is upgraded and how often therefore 
Livecode needs to be fixed to work again with that xCode version, i really do 
not see any advantage for such a "pay once use forever” license without having 
the opportunity  to subscribe to a software maintenance plan.
But even with such an option to subscribe to such a plan, the discussion starts 
over and over again as soon as  an xCode version is released which is not 
working with older “not upgraded” LC versions.


Matthias




Matthias Rebbe
Bramkampsieke 13
32312 Lübbecke
Tel +49 5741 31
+49 160 5504462
Fax: +49 5741 310002
eMail: matth...@m-r-d.de 

BR5 Konverter - BR5 -> MP3 
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[RM]

On 3.05.2016 00:50, Monte Goulding wrote:

One thing that nobody seems to have pointed out is the current price is not $999. 
As Peter commented (and a number of people seem to have read in a snippy tone 
unfortunately) the price rises have been and continue to be well telegraphed with 
the opportunity to lock in the current price. Regardless of that though I do tend 
to agree that those with turnover of under $2 or so (and not really likely to 
expand that) looking at > 5% of that going as an expense on development 
platform would struggle to justify it. In those cases they would either need to 
look at other platforms or determine if they can obtain equivalent revenue by 
changing their business model to use the GPL version. How LiveCode capture the 
$200 per year or so those users might have on offer without sacrificing revenue 
from those with higher turnover is something I'm sure is under consideration. Note 
that I'm not really including those that have a reasonable prospect of revenue 
growth because they can probably tap in

to public and private sources of startup support.

That presupposes that the time one is offered to "lock" is convenient for
the developer and that she has the money to do that at that point.

And "public and private sources of startup support" is a very 
USA-Western European-centric view of things.
For the sake of argument, if one were to mention that phrase to someone 
living in the Dominican Republic,
Brazil or Bulgaria (Now why would I pick those 3 countries, I wonder?) 
they might look at you fairly blankly.


"Private joke" for Andre: Hey, let's phone up Dilma Rousseff and ask her 
for a quick $2,000 to fund our startup.


Richmond.



Cheers

Monte

Sent from my iPhone


On 3 May 2016, at 1:40 AM, RM  wrote:

With the exception of the PDF reader (as you pointed out) for development 
purposes there is no real difference between Livecode versions
(and I am aware that you are pushing for further differentiation, and I 
understand your rationale), so paying $999 for a year for something whose
single difference fron the FREE version is the ability to protect ones' code 
really does not seem justifiable.


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Re: [OT] Atkinson Interview, Pt 2

[RM]

On 3.05.2016 05:48, Lynn Fredricks wrote:

I like that Atkinson revealed he got the idea for HyperCard
while dropping LSD.
Thirty years later we're still using a descendant of that idea.
Are we experiencing a perpetual flashback?

Nah, Flash is something else!

Flash is somewhere between PCP and sniffing glue, and too much peer
pressure.


Thank goodness Livecode does not play hell with one's
nasal membranes.

R.


Best regards,

Lynn Fredricks
Paradigma Software
http://www.paradigmasoft.com

Valentina SQL Server: The Ultra-fast, Royalty Free Database Server


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Re: [OT] Atkinson Interview, Pt 2

[RM]

Aah, maybe that's why I have so much creative block : I don't drop LSD.

Maybe they could add LSD tablets to the Commercial version of Livecode
as an extra incentive . . .

Richmond.

On 3.05.2016 00:58, Jim Lambert wrote:

I like that Atkinson revealed he got the idea for HyperCard while dropping LSD.
Thirty years later we’re still using a descendant of that idea.
Are we experiencing a perpetual flashback?

Nah, Flash is something else!

Jim Lambert
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Re: Revenue and the Open Source edition

[RM]

Um: think very closely about "look at Naomi Campbell" :)

Richmond.

On 2.05.2016 23:16, Peter M. Brigham wrote:

Richmond, as soon as I wrote that I just knew it would be a set-up line for you.

-- Peter

Peter M. Brigham
pmb...@gmail.com


On May 2, 2016, at 4:05 PM, RM wrote:


The Scots have been running the world for at least 300 years.

Why do you think that about 50% of all Canadians, and a very large number of 
Americans have Scots names?

After all, just look at Naomi Campbell!

Richmond.

On 2.05.2016 22:46, Peter M. Brigham wrote:


On May 2, 2016, at 3:44 PM, Peter TB Brett wrote:


On 02/05/2016 20:20, Peter M. Brigham wrote:

Back in the day, Apple marketed heavily to the teaching/educational
market, and the result was a generation of kids who grew up using
Macs. IMO, Edinburgh would do well to try to get LC used by as many
teachers at the middle school and high school level as possible (and
why not grade school too?) -- the multiplier effect here would be
enormous. I would think that a special pricing scheme for educators
would be an extremely good investment in the long run, even if there
were scanty short-run returns.

There already is a very heavily discounted scheme for education, which includes 
course materials.  It's accessible right from the front page of the website.

LiveCode is very widely used in Scottish schools.

Good. I was not aware of that. Go LC!!! In 10 years the Scots will be running 
the world!

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