Re: Android Speed Woes

[Pi Digital via use-livecode]

That’s perfect and very near the results we’d expect to see. So it narrows it 
down to display. 

What’s inside the groups and what settings do they have? If there are images 
what quality setting do they have, normal better or best? Any scaling factors 
anywhere? Rotations? Anti-aliasing? Shapes, widgets or paths? Borders, effects 
(shadow, glow, overlay). Theoretically these settings would affect both iOS and 
Android but as we are seeing it only on Android we need to narrow it down to 
see what specifically is causing the issue. 

To start, try setting any images to mid quality (not normal or best). I’ve 
occasionally seen this performs best (especially recently on HTML5 deployment). 

Sean 

> On 30 Aug 2019, at 01:15, Dan Friedman via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Mark,
> 
> put the milliseconds into m
> put "" into jones
> repeat 1
>put "a" after jones
> end repeat
> put jones into pFart
> put the milliseconds - m into m
> answer m
> 
> iMac = 1
> Moto G5 = 16
> Moto G6 = 10
> iPhone X = 7
> 
> -Dan
> 


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Re: Android Speed Woes

[Dan Friedman via use-livecode]

Mark,

put the milliseconds into m
put "" into jones
repeat 1
put "a" after jones
end repeat
put jones into pFart
put the milliseconds - m into m
answer m

iMac = 1
Moto G5 = 16
Moto G6 = 10
iPhone X = 7

-Dan
 

On 8/29/19, 5:09 PM, "use-livecode on behalf of Mark Wieder via use-livecode" 
 wrote:

On 8/29/19 4:40 PM, Dan Friedman via use-livecode wrote:
> Sean,
> 
>>> Another test would be to see how fast it creates a variable with 10,000 
characters using a repeat loop ...
> 
> put "" into jones
> repeat 1
> put "a" after jones
> end repeat
> put the milliseconds into m
> put jones into pFart
> put the milliseconds - m into m
> answer m

You really want to store the milliseconds *before* the repeat loop to 
have any chance of seeing a difference.

-- 
  Mark Wieder
  ahsoftw...@gmail.com

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Re: Android Speed Woes

[Mark Wieder via use-livecode]

On 8/29/19 4:40 PM, Dan Friedman via use-livecode wrote:

Sean,


Another test would be to see how fast it creates a variable with 10,000 
characters using a repeat loop ...


put "" into jones
repeat 1
put "a" after jones
end repeat
put the milliseconds into m
put jones into pFart
put the milliseconds - m into m
answer m


You really want to store the milliseconds *before* the repeat loop to 
have any chance of seeing a difference.


--
 Mark Wieder
 ahsoftw...@gmail.com

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Re: Android Speed Woes

[J. Landman Gay via use-livecode]

Looks like we should be comparing GPUs instead of CPUs.

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
On August 29, 2019 6:42:09 PM Dan Friedman via use-livecode 
 wrote:



Sean,

Another test would be to see how fast it creates a variable with 10,000 
characters using a repeat loop ...


put "" into jones
repeat 1
  put "a" after jones
end repeat
put the milliseconds into m
put jones into pFart
put the milliseconds - m into m
answer m

iMac = 1
Moto G5 = 0
Moto G6 = 0
iPhone X = 0


-Dan


On 8/29/19, 4:10 PM, "use-livecode on behalf of Pi Digital via 
use-livecode" use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:


   Dan is talking 500 times difference in response tho. That’s a bit more 
   substantial. Plus speed degradation to a device designed to run Android 7.0 
   shouldn’t be to that degree either, for display or under the hood. The G5 
   has an octo 1.4ghz, the iPhoneX is 6core 2.39, only 4 times as fast (8-10 
   times offscreen), not 200-500. \?/


   Dan,
   Another test would be to see how fast it creates a variable with 10,000 
   characters using a repeat loop then how long to copy that to another 
   variable. If the numbers are wildly different to the iPhone’s and desktop’s 
   then maybe Jacque is on to something and it is a device specific lag. 
   Otherwise it’s likely a display issue, which could be device specific but 
   could equally be something deeper worth looking into.


   Sean

   > On 29 Aug 2019, at 23:23, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
wrote:

   >
   > I'd say it's the phone. The Moto G5 has a budget processor and an old 
   version of Android OS. An iPhoneX is newer and much faster so it isn't 
   really a fair comparison.



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Re: Android Speed Woes

[Dan Friedman via use-livecode]

Sean,

>>Another test would be to see how fast it creates a variable with 10,000 
>>characters using a repeat loop ...

put "" into jones
repeat 1
   put "a" after jones
end repeat
put the milliseconds into m
put jones into pFart
put the milliseconds - m into m
answer m

iMac = 1
Moto G5 = 0 
Moto G6 = 0
iPhone X = 0


-Dan
 

On 8/29/19, 4:10 PM, "use-livecode on behalf of Pi Digital via use-livecode" 
 wrote:

Dan is talking 500 times difference in response tho. That’s a bit more 
substantial. Plus speed degradation to a device designed to run Android 7.0 
shouldn’t be to that degree either, for display or under the hood. The G5 has 
an octo 1.4ghz, the iPhoneX is 6core 2.39, only 4 times as fast (8-10 times 
offscreen), not 200-500. \?/

Dan,
Another test would be to see how fast it creates a variable with 10,000 
characters using a repeat loop then how long to copy that to another variable. 
If the numbers are wildly different to the iPhone’s and desktop’s then maybe 
Jacque is on to something and it is a device specific lag. Otherwise it’s 
likely a display issue, which could be device specific but could equally be 
something deeper worth looking into. 

Sean

> On 29 Aug 2019, at 23:23, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
 wrote:
> 
> I'd say it's the phone. The Moto G5 has a budget processor and an old 
version of Android OS. An iPhoneX is newer and much faster so it isn't really a 
fair comparison. 


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Re: Android Speed Woes

[Dan Friedman via use-livecode]

Sean,

I wouldn't say AR is non-functional.  When I enable it I do see a difference.  
Although, in almost all cases it makes it worse.  I see jerky scrolling and 
screen artifacts.
I am using 9.5.0 Business.   I compiled the app in 9.0.4 Indy, and m=562.   
Interesting that I just tried it on a Moto G6 and m=585.  Slower than the G5!

>> Is this timing consistent if triggered by a button?
That's how I am firing this.

>> What timing do you get with lock screen muted?
If I comment out the lock screens, I get m=756 (Moto G5)

-Dan

On 8/29/19, 2:40 PM, "use-livecode on behalf of Pi Digital via use-livecode" 
 wrote:

Hi Dan

I don’t think this is fully related to your issue based on the script you 
show but...

I’ve been doing extensive testing this week and have come close to the 
conclusion now that AcceleratedRendering is completely non functional for all 
platforms. However, I’ve got a feeling that none of my recent emails to LC on 
the matter have got through during their outage. 

Is no one else seeing this loss in performance? So far all my tests have 
shown it to be affecting every platform standalone and the IDE. 

Back to your issue, Dan. 
What version LC are you using?
Is this timing consistent if triggered by a button?
What timing do you get with lock screen muted?

Also, put the timer calculation to a variable to ensure it is not the 
answer dialogue itself producing erroneous timings. 

NB. Additionally, if your groups are not moving up down left right then 
they are best set to static rather than dynamic or scrolling. This won’t be 
affecting your performance in this instance but worth noting. It’s only useful 
setting it to ‘dynamic’ if the values, text or images are changing 
frequently/rapidly or moving about the display. 

Sean Cole
Pi Digital Prod Ltd

> On 29 Aug 2019, at 21:24, Dan Friedman via use-livecode 
 wrote:
> 
> Hello again!   I am have a tough time getting things to run snappy on an 
Android device.  It's blazing fast on my computer, and more than acceptable on 
my iPhone, but on any android device, it's slow... noticeably sluggish.   The 
issue is mainly hiding/showing groups.  For example:
> 
> put the milliseconds into m
> lock screen --for visual effect in rect (the rect of grc "ne_BG") 
//removed the animation for speed testing
> hide grp "ne_mainControls"
> show grp "ne_repeatG"
> unlock screen --with visual effect push left
> answer (the milliseconds - m)
> 
> The result of m is:
> iMac = 10
> iOS = 1   (iPhoneX)
> Android = 516  (Moto G5 Plus Android 7.0)
> 
> The groups contain no images or complex graphics.  Just some buttons and 
fields.
> 
> I have tried it with and without acceleratedRendering.  Actually, with 
acceleratedRendering enabled it took longer, m=558.
> 
> I have it setup like this:
> Card "calendar"
>   Group "newEventG"  --> layerMode set to "Container"
>  Group "ne_mainControls"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"
>  Group " ne_repeatG"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"
> 
> Any thoughts or advice?  Most other functions are working within 
acceptable ranges/speeds.
> 
> -Dan
> 
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Re: Android Speed Woes

[Pi Digital via use-livecode]

Dan is talking 500 times difference in response tho. That’s a bit more 
substantial. Plus speed degradation to a device designed to run Android 7.0 
shouldn’t be to that degree either, for display or under the hood. The G5 has 
an octo 1.4ghz, the iPhoneX is 6core 2.39, only 4 times as fast (8-10 times 
offscreen), not 200-500. \?/

Dan,
Another test would be to see how fast it creates a variable with 10,000 
characters using a repeat loop then how long to copy that to another variable. 
If the numbers are wildly different to the iPhone’s and desktop’s then maybe 
Jacque is on to something and it is a device specific lag. Otherwise it’s 
likely a display issue, which could be device specific but could equally be 
something deeper worth looking into. 

Sean

> On 29 Aug 2019, at 23:23, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I'd say it's the phone. The Moto G5 has a budget processor and an old version 
> of Android OS. An iPhoneX is newer and much faster so it isn't really a fair 
> comparison. 


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Re: Android Speed Woes

[Sean Cole (Pi) via use-livecode]

Just for your future reference, MarkWs excellent description about AccRend:
http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-livecode/2017-May/236782.html

Sean



> > On 29 Aug 2019, at 21:24, Dan Friedman via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> >
> > I have tried it with and without acceleratedRendering.  Actually, with
> acceleratedRendering enabled it took longer, m=558.
> >
> > I have it setup like this:
> > Card "calendar"
> >   Group "newEventG"  --> layerMode set to "Container"
> >  Group "ne_mainControls"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"
> >  Group " ne_repeatG"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"
> >
> > Any thoughts or advice?  Most other functions are working within
> acceptable ranges/speeds.
> >
> > -Dan
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Re: Android Speed Woes

[J. Landman Gay via use-livecode]

I'd say it's the phone. The Moto G5 has a budget processor and an old 
version of Android OS. An iPhoneX is newer and much faster so it isn't 
really a fair comparison. My Pixel has a much faster processor running 
the latest OS and is quite snappy; my Samsung S5 is old and slow and 
responds as such.


I develop with my Pixel and test with the Samsung to see how bad it 
gets. The up side is that users of older or budget phones are used to 
the response times and may not notice. But if you can find a higher-end 
test device, it's useful to compare.


On 8/29/19 3:24 PM, Dan Friedman via use-livecode wrote:

Hello again!   I am have a tough time getting things to run snappy on an 
Android device.  It's blazing fast on my computer, and more than acceptable on 
my iPhone, but on any android device, it's slow... noticeably sluggish.   The 
issue is mainly hiding/showing groups.  For example:

put the milliseconds into m
lock screen --for visual effect in rect (the rect of grc "ne_BG") //removed the 
animation for speed testing
hide grp "ne_mainControls"
show grp "ne_repeatG"
unlock screen --with visual effect push left
answer (the milliseconds - m)

The result of m is:
iMac = 10
iOS = 1   (iPhoneX)
Android = 516  (Moto G5 Plus Android 7.0)

The groups contain no images or complex graphics.  Just some buttons and fields.

I have tried it with and without acceleratedRendering.  Actually, with 
acceleratedRendering enabled it took longer, m=558.

I have it setup like this:
Card "calendar"
Group "newEventG"  --> layerMode set to "Container"
   Group "ne_mainControls"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"
   Group " ne_repeatG"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"

Any thoughts or advice?  Most other functions are working within acceptable 
ranges/speeds.

-Dan

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--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com

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Troubleshooting the IDE

[Brian Snipes via use-livecode]

Can anyone point me to resources for debugging the IDE code itself? 
There is an issue with LC on the Plasma desktop on Linux where the tool 
pallete just disappears making it darned hard to use the tools. I've 
asked in the forum about it before but there isn't an answer that solves 
the issue. I opened a bug report ( 
https://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=22321 ) but it was closed 
since I am not running Ubuntu. I am going to try it on Ubuntu with 
Plasma installed (my default is Arch but it happens on other distros 
such as openSuse) but I don't have hopes that the issue won't be closed 
again since the Ubuntu default DE in the old 16.04 support distro is 
Unity and if I install Plasma from the package manager it probably won't 
be considered 'supported'. If you look at the video attachment to my bug 
report, you will see the issue in Plasma. I have never come across this 
issue in any other application in Plasma.


Thanks,
Brian


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Re: Android Speed Woes

[Pi Digital via use-livecode]

Hi Dan

I don’t think this is fully related to your issue based on the script you show 
but...

I’ve been doing extensive testing this week and have come close to the 
conclusion now that AcceleratedRendering is completely non functional for all 
platforms. However, I’ve got a feeling that none of my recent emails to LC on 
the matter have got through during their outage. 

Is no one else seeing this loss in performance? So far all my tests have shown 
it to be affecting every platform standalone and the IDE. 

Back to your issue, Dan. 
What version LC are you using?
Is this timing consistent if triggered by a button?
What timing do you get with lock screen muted?

Also, put the timer calculation to a variable to ensure it is not the answer 
dialogue itself producing erroneous timings. 

NB. Additionally, if your groups are not moving up down left right then they 
are best set to static rather than dynamic or scrolling. This won’t be 
affecting your performance in this instance but worth noting. It’s only useful 
setting it to ‘dynamic’ if the values, text or images are changing 
frequently/rapidly or moving about the display. 

Sean Cole
Pi Digital Prod Ltd

> On 29 Aug 2019, at 21:24, Dan Friedman via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hello again!   I am have a tough time getting things to run snappy on an 
> Android device.  It's blazing fast on my computer, and more than acceptable 
> on my iPhone, but on any android device, it's slow... noticeably sluggish.   
> The issue is mainly hiding/showing groups.  For example:
> 
> put the milliseconds into m
> lock screen --for visual effect in rect (the rect of grc "ne_BG") //removed 
> the animation for speed testing
> hide grp "ne_mainControls"
> show grp "ne_repeatG"
> unlock screen --with visual effect push left
> answer (the milliseconds - m)
> 
> The result of m is:
> iMac = 10
> iOS = 1   (iPhoneX)
> Android = 516  (Moto G5 Plus Android 7.0)
> 
> The groups contain no images or complex graphics.  Just some buttons and 
> fields.
> 
> I have tried it with and without acceleratedRendering.  Actually, with 
> acceleratedRendering enabled it took longer, m=558.
> 
> I have it setup like this:
> Card "calendar"
>   Group "newEventG"  --> layerMode set to "Container"
>  Group "ne_mainControls"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"
>  Group " ne_repeatG"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"
> 
> Any thoughts or advice?  Most other functions are working within acceptable 
> ranges/speeds.
> 
> -Dan
> 
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> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your subscription 
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Re: Native HTML5 field

[Pi Digital via use-livecode]

Thanks H

Now all I need to do is figure out some way of making this into a usable 
DataGrid

Sean

> On 29 Aug 2019, at 19:13, Ralph DiMola via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Not to mention multi level Ctl-z undo's! Nice... Thank You.
> 
> Ralph DiMola
> IT Director
> Evergreen Information Services
> rdim...@evergreeninfo.net
> Phone: 518-636-3998 Ex:11
> Cell: 518-796-9332
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf 
> Of hh via use-livecode
> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 1:42 PM
> To: use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> Cc: hh
> Subject: Native HTML5 field
> 
> One shouldn't go for months without a gift (for some of you). Here is its.
> 
> * Native HTML5 Field v_101 (for HTML5 standalones )* This works with Chrome, 
> Firefox and Safari on Mac, Windows and linux.
> (With Firefox are problems when dragging from one field to the other).
> 
> Test it from
> (US) http://hh.on-rev.com/html5/index-large.html#as
> (EU) http://hyperhh.de/html5/index-large.html#as
> 
> KEYBOARD. You have UTF-8 input (incl. using dead keys) support, you can 
> navigate with the arrow keys, home and page keys and scroll using the mouse 
> wheel. You can also use the virtual keyboard.
> 
> RICH TEXT. There is a set of LC buttons that allow to set styles for the 
> selection (in both fields). The buttons have tooltips attached.
> 
> You have (for selected parts of the field) • align left, center, right and 
> justified • bold, italic, underline and strikeTrough style • indent in/out • 
> ordered and bullet lists • set foreColor and backColor of the field and of 
> selections • superscripts and subscripts • a style eraser (remove styles from 
> selection) • wrap/nowrap • hyphenation (CSS, english) • multiple Undo and Redo
> 
> Currently there is only one textFont for both fields (either 'Mono=Courier'
> or 'Sans=Verdana'). And there is only one textSize (14pt). I'll add support 
> for textFont and textSize and more styles in the next version.
> 
> CLIPBOARD. We have full access to the system clipboard (styled Text only).
> Use cmd-A, cmd-X, cmd-C, cmd-V as usual or do it using the context menu.
> 
> DRAG/DROP. Drag from one field to the other or drag the file icon of an
> UTF-8 file from the desktop to the fields (or from the fields to any app that 
> accepts text drops.
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Android Speed Woes

[Dan Friedman via use-livecode]

Hello again!   I am have a tough time getting things to run snappy on an 
Android device.  It's blazing fast on my computer, and more than acceptable on 
my iPhone, but on any android device, it's slow... noticeably sluggish.   The 
issue is mainly hiding/showing groups.  For example:

put the milliseconds into m
lock screen --for visual effect in rect (the rect of grc "ne_BG") //removed the 
animation for speed testing
hide grp "ne_mainControls"
show grp "ne_repeatG"
unlock screen --with visual effect push left
answer (the milliseconds - m)

The result of m is:
iMac = 10
iOS = 1   (iPhoneX)
Android = 516  (Moto G5 Plus Android 7.0)

The groups contain no images or complex graphics.  Just some buttons and fields.

I have tried it with and without acceleratedRendering.  Actually, with 
acceleratedRendering enabled it took longer, m=558.

I have it setup like this:
Card "calendar"
   Group "newEventG"  --> layerMode set to "Container"
  Group "ne_mainControls"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"
  Group " ne_repeatG"  --> layerMode set to "Dynamic"

Any thoughts or advice?  Most other functions are working within acceptable 
ranges/speeds.

-Dan

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RE: Native HTML5 field

[Ralph DiMola via use-livecode]

Not to mention multi level Ctl-z undo's! Nice... Thank You.

Ralph DiMola
IT Director
Evergreen Information Services
rdim...@evergreeninfo.net
Phone: 518-636-3998 Ex:11
Cell: 518-796-9332


-Original Message-
From: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf Of 
hh via use-livecode
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 1:42 PM
To: use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
Cc: hh
Subject: Native HTML5 field

One shouldn't go for months without a gift (for some of you). Here is its.

* Native HTML5 Field v_101 (for HTML5 standalones )* This works with Chrome, 
Firefox and Safari on Mac, Windows and linux.
(With Firefox are problems when dragging from one field to the other).

Test it from
(US) http://hh.on-rev.com/html5/index-large.html#as
(EU) http://hyperhh.de/html5/index-large.html#as

KEYBOARD. You have UTF-8 input (incl. using dead keys) support, you can 
navigate with the arrow keys, home and page keys and scroll using the mouse 
wheel. You can also use the virtual keyboard.

RICH TEXT. There is a set of LC buttons that allow to set styles for the 
selection (in both fields). The buttons have tooltips attached.

You have (for selected parts of the field) • align left, center, right and 
justified • bold, italic, underline and strikeTrough style • indent in/out • 
ordered and bullet lists • set foreColor and backColor of the field and of 
selections • superscripts and subscripts • a style eraser (remove styles from 
selection) • wrap/nowrap • hyphenation (CSS, english) • multiple Undo and Redo

Currently there is only one textFont for both fields (either 'Mono=Courier'
or 'Sans=Verdana'). And there is only one textSize (14pt). I'll add support for 
textFont and textSize and more styles in the next version.

CLIPBOARD. We have full access to the system clipboard (styled Text only).
Use cmd-A, cmd-X, cmd-C, cmd-V as usual or do it using the context menu.

DRAG/DROP. Drag from one field to the other or drag the file icon of an
UTF-8 file from the desktop to the fields (or from the fields to any app that 
accepts text drops.
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Native HTML5 field

[hh via use-livecode]

One shouldn't go for months without a gift (for some of you). Here is its.

* Native HTML5 Field v_101 (for HTML5 standalones )*
This works with Chrome, Firefox and Safari on Mac, Windows and linux.
(With Firefox are problems when dragging from one field to the other).

Test it from
(US) http://hh.on-rev.com/html5/index-large.html#as
(EU) http://hyperhh.de/html5/index-large.html#as

KEYBOARD. You have UTF-8 input (incl. using dead keys) support, you can
navigate with the arrow keys, home and page keys and scroll using the
mouse wheel. You can also use the virtual keyboard.

RICH TEXT. There is a set of LC buttons that allow to set styles for the
selection (in both fields). The buttons have tooltips attached.

You have (for selected parts of the field)
• align left, center, right and justified
• bold, italic, underline and strikeTrough style
• indent in/out
• ordered and bullet lists
• set foreColor and backColor of the field and of selections
• superscripts and subscripts
• a style eraser (remove styles from selection)
• wrap/nowrap
• hyphenation (CSS, english)
• multiple Undo and Redo

Currently there is only one textFont for both fields (either 'Mono=Courier'
or 'Sans=Verdana'). And there is only one textSize (14pt). I'll add support
for textFont and textSize and more styles in the next version.

CLIPBOARD. We have full access to the system clipboard (styled Text only).
Use cmd-A, cmd-X, cmd-C, cmd-V as usual or do it using the context menu.

DRAG/DROP. Drag from one field to the other or drag the file icon of an
UTF-8 file from the desktop to the fields (or from the fields to any app
that accepts text drops.
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Re: Maintenance forever?

[Rick Harrison via use-livecode]

They said they had a RAID that failed that caused a mess.
One still has to do backups for any RAID for that reason.
Even if they were just using Time Machine to perform a
backup of their RAID they only would lose a maximum
of one hour’s worth of data.  If they were doing transaction
logging they wouldn’t lose more than 1 transaction.
They could have been up and running again pronto.

Just my 2 cents for the day.

Let’s hope things improve soon.

Rick


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Re: Another list test

[Dr. Hawkins via use-livecode]

On Aug 29, 2019, at 7:40 AM, Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
 wrote:
> 
> If an SMTP relay cannon contact the destination mail server, there usually is 
> a time period in which it will retry.


By the time someone takes a cannon to a server, it’s usually to late to retry!

:)



— 
Richard E. Hawkins, Esq.
The Hawkins Law Firm
3430 E. Flamingo Rd.
Suite 232
Las Vegas, NV  89121
(702) 508-8462

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Re: Another list test

[J. Landman Gay via use-livecode]

When my posts wouldn't send I got an error reply from my mail server about 
an "unknown user". So I don't think the list server ate the message, the 
post couldn't be delivered at all.


--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
On August 29, 2019 11:09:55 AM "Sean Cole \(Pi\) via use-livecode" 
 wrote:



Was it bouncing the messages? How can we check if a message was
sent/received during this time? Is there an archive we can view?

Sean Cole
*Pi Digital Productions Ltd*
www.pidigital.co.uk
+44(1634)402193
+44(7702)116447
'Don't try to think outside the box. Just remember the truth: There is no
box!'
'For then you realise it is not the box you are trying to look outside of,
but it is yourself!'

eMail Ts & Cs    Pi Digital
Productions Ltd is a UK registered limited company, no. 5255609


On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 at 16:26, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:


The list was down for 2 days due to the server move so there won't be any
mail to restore. I think we all suffered from withdrawal symptoms. I
myself
was forced to read Twitter during the interim and I fear for my health now.

--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
On August 29, 2019 9:35:44 AM Graham Samuel via use-livecode
 wrote:

> For me there is a gap for 25 and 26 August - absolutely nothing. Will
posts
> from those dates reappear?
>
> Graham
>
>> On 27 Aug 2019, at 12:35, R.H. via use-livecode
>>  wrote:
>>
>> I am still not receiving any message through email since last week.
>>
>> Roland
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Re: Maintenance forever?

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

Well to be fair, you can always go back to your sent mail folder and resend. I 
reiterate that if the SMTP relay you use cannot contact another server, it will 
typically attempt to resend for a period of time. If it fails, your SMTP server 
*may* alert you to the fact, depending on how it's configured. Most SMTP relays 
will send you an email that what you sent was undeliverable. I do not 
understand what people mean by, "the List Server ate the emails". If it's 
inaccessible, that of course cannot happen. 

Bob S


> On Aug 29, 2019, at 08:22 , hh via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> To do the same things twice or three times is OK
> if some people have difficulties to do their job.
> 
> But that's going too far now.
> 
> After close to a week the "maintenance" people are
> still exercising only.
> 
> Many posts are lost in forums and use-list.
> No upload to livecodeshare is possible.
> Nearly no progress in other LC fields but LCFM.
> 
> I say goodbye until next year, perhaps it is done
> until then?


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Re: Another list test

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]



> On Aug 29, 2019, at 07:40 , Bob Sneidar via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> If an SMTP relay cannon contact the destination mail server, there usually is 
> a time period in which it will retry. Sometimes it can be as long as 2 or 3 
> days. 
> 
> Bob S
> 
> 
>> On Aug 29, 2019, at 07:36 , Graham Samuel via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> And another thing - my two test emails were not sent today but on 27th 
>> August, so they have been spinning about in cyberspace for a couple of days. 
>> Is this normal?
>> 
>> Graham
> 
> 
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Re: OT: I just bought one of these

[Sean Cole (Pi) via use-livecode]

I've watched some reviews since and it's not that great actually as it
can't run linux itself. It's not quite a raspberry pi and something more
than a Micro controller. But, even worse than that is the support. The
instructions are near non-existent and in some form of Chinglish. Plus,
unlike RP and Arduino, they'll drop support once they bring out the v3.
It's a kickstarter type thing where they cash in then drop it. It's fun to
play with but not sure it's worth the hassle for anything more than a toy.
Unfortunately! Coz it does look like it could be amazing! By the time
you've added on all of the cables and external devices to make it
worthwhile though, it negates the form factor.

Sean


On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 at 17:06, Mark Wieder via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> On 8/24/19 3:58 AM, Pi Digital via use-livecode wrote:
> > Wow! What an amazing form factor. It’s beautiful. The only down side is
> it’s only got 128MB of memory. That means it’s going to be flip-flopping on
> virtual memory all the time. So make sure you use a micro U3 SDXC >150Mbps
> card. I’ve seen a hack to mount it inside the case.
>
> No worries. It can handle up to 2TB storage. I'm looking forward to
> getting my hands on this thing.
>
> --
>   Mark Wieder
>   ahsoftw...@gmail.com
>
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Re: OT: I just bought one of these

[Dar Scott Consulting via use-livecode]

I got this for the lab bench (and Windows 10 testing).
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01AT394A4


> On Aug 29, 2019, at 10:06 AM, Mark Wieder via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> On 8/24/19 3:58 AM, Pi Digital via use-livecode wrote:
>> Wow! What an amazing form factor. It’s beautiful. The only down side is it’s 
>> only got 128MB of memory. That means it’s going to be flip-flopping on 
>> virtual memory all the time. So make sure you use a micro U3 SDXC >150Mbps 
>> card. I’ve seen a hack to mount it inside the case.
> 
> No worries. It can handle up to 2TB storage. I'm looking forward to getting 
> my hands on this thing.
> 
> -- 
> Mark Wieder
> ahsoftw...@gmail.com
> 
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> 


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Re: Datagrid2 Form view slow down.

[Sean Cole (Pi) via use-livecode]

Hi Mark Waddingham,

This message didn't get through befroe, apparently, due to your servers
being down (just another thing to cause us stress...). So here's what I sent


Thank you for you very comprehensive response. It does help me understand a
great deal more about the innards of the data grid.

However, I have been running my grid in an 800x600 window. I had restarted
fresh with a new template stack and new row template. The template has the
original BG untouched. The original field renamed, and repositioned, and
two others copied from it and repositioned. (Later I had a rounded
rectangle added which sits behind the last field but this made no
difference to performance). The row height is set to 30. No layout control
other than for the data content. Minimal layout set to true. I kept it
basic as it could be. But it still stutters on scroll with or without
Accelerated rendering on. So, in my very humble opinion, something is still
'up'! I don't know what it is but Form view is definitely not operating up
to par for some reason.

As suggested, I have had to spend considerable more time coding my own data
grid. This has held us up no end as a result. Again. Especially as, because
HTML5 deployment is broken so much, that I have to manually code nearly all
key and mouse operations that come in (delete, backspace, escape, arrows,
mouse-scroll, double-click, cut, copy, paste, - anything other than a-Z,0-9
pretty much). And geometry doesn't work either for HTML5 so I have to code
resize for almost every object manually. It is getting tiresome and tedious
just how much in LC does not work! I'm am very nearly at burnout stage from
it - Again! LC almost killed me last year and it is trying really hard to
do it to me again it seems.

Try it, see for yourself!

Thanks (semi-hysterically) again.


Sean Cole
*Pi Digital Productions Ltd*
www.pidigital.co.uk
+44(1634)402193
+44(7702)116447
'Don't try to think outside the box. Just remember the truth: There is no
box!'
'For then you realise it is not the box you are trying to look outside of,
but it is yourself!'

eMail Ts & Cs    Pi Digital
Productions Ltd is a UK registered limited company, no. 5255609


On Tue, 27 Aug 2019 at 15:10, Sean Cole (Pi)  wrote:

> Hi Mark,
>
> Thank you for you very comprehensive response. It does help me understand
> a great deal more about the innards of the data grid.
>
> However, I have been running my grid in an 800x600 window. I had restarted
> fresh with a new template stack and new row template. The template has the
> original BG untouched. The original field renamed, and repositioned, and
> two others copied from it and repositioned. (Later I had a rounded
> rectangle added which sits behind the last field but this made no
> difference to performance). The row height is set to 30. No layout control
> other than for the data content. Minimal layout set to true. I kept it
> basic as it could be. But it still stutters on scroll with or without
> Accelerated rendering on. So, in my very humble opinion, something is still
> 'up'! I don't know what it is but Form view is definitly not operating up
> to par for some reason.
>
> As suggested, I have had to spend considerable more time coding my own
> data grid. This has held us up no end as a result. Again. Especially as,
> because HTML5 deployment is broken so much, that I have to manually code
> nearly all key and mouse operations that come in (delete, backspace,
> escape, arrows, mouse-scroll, double-click, cut, copy, paste, - anything
> other than a-Z,0-9 pretty much). And geometry doesn't work either for HTML5
> so I have to code resize for almost every object manually. It is getting
> tiresome and tedious just how much in LC does not work! I'm am very nearly
> at burnout stage from it - Again! LC almost killed me last year and it is
> trying really hard to do it to me again it seems.
>
> Try it, see for yourself!
>
> Thanks (semi-hysterically) again.
>
> Sean Cole
> *Pi Digital Productions Ltd*
> www.pidigital.co.uk
> +44(1634)402193
> +44(7702)116447
> 'Don't try to think outside the box. Just remember the truth: There is no
> box!'
> 'For then you realise it is not the box you are trying to look outside of,
> but it is yourself!'
>
> eMail Ts & Cs    Pi Digital
> Productions Ltd is a UK registered limited company, no. 5255609
>
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Re: Maintenance forever?

[Sean Cole (Pi) via use-livecode]

Hehe. I feel your pain. Daily. Dang their lack of resources and staff. I am
pretty much working entirely with workarounds at the moment to really,
really, insanely, inanely basic, stuff. Like keys other than a-Z,0-9
actually functioning! or datagrids going faster than a x386 displaying 8k!

I'm just tired and sick of being sick and tired. But, like you, I don't
expect to see any change, not while their friends at FM are 'effectively'
calling the shots, overriding any other priorities with their own (likely).
Everything else is effectively on hold for now.

Sean


On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 at 16:22, hh via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> To do the same things twice or three times is OK if some people have
> difficulties to do their job.
>
> But that's going too far now.
>
> After close to a week the "maintenance" people are still exercising only.
>
> Many posts are lost in forums and use-list. No upload to livecodeshare is
> possible. Nearly no progress in other LC fields but LCFM.
>
> I say goodbye until next year, perhaps it is done until then?
>
>
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Re: Another list test

[Sean Cole (Pi) via use-livecode]

Was it bouncing the messages? How can we check if a message was
sent/received during this time? Is there an archive we can view?

Sean Cole
*Pi Digital Productions Ltd*
www.pidigital.co.uk
+44(1634)402193
+44(7702)116447
'Don't try to think outside the box. Just remember the truth: There is no
box!'
'For then you realise it is not the box you are trying to look outside of,
but it is yourself!'

eMail Ts & Cs    Pi Digital
Productions Ltd is a UK registered limited company, no. 5255609


On Thu, 29 Aug 2019 at 16:26, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> The list was down for 2 days due to the server move so there won't be any
> mail to restore. I think we all suffered from withdrawal symptoms. I
> myself
> was forced to read Twitter during the interim and I fear for my health now.
>
> --
> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
> HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
> On August 29, 2019 9:35:44 AM Graham Samuel via use-livecode
>  wrote:
>
> > For me there is a gap for 25 and 26 August - absolutely nothing. Will
> posts
> > from those dates reappear?
> >
> > Graham
> >
> >> On 27 Aug 2019, at 12:35, R.H. via use-livecode
> >>  wrote:
> >>
> >> I am still not receiving any message through email since last week.
> >>
> >> Roland
> >> ___
> >> use-livecode mailing list
> >> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com
> >> Please visit this url to subscribe, unsubscribe and manage your
> >> subscription preferences:
> >> http://lists.runrev.com/mailman/listinfo/use-livecode
> >
> >
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>
>
>
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Re: Another list test

[Mark Wieder via use-livecode]

On 8/29/19 8:26 AM, J. Landman Gay via use-livecode wrote:
The list was down for 2 days due to the server move so there won't be 
any mail to restore.


Right. But during that time the listserv just ate incoming emails, mine 
included.


--
 Mark Wieder
 ahsoftw...@gmail.com

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Re: OT: I just bought one of these

[Mark Wieder via use-livecode]

On 8/24/19 3:58 AM, Pi Digital via use-livecode wrote:

Wow! What an amazing form factor. It’s beautiful. The only down side is it’s only 
got 128MB of memory. That means it’s going to be flip-flopping on virtual memory 
all the time. So make sure you use a micro U3 SDXC >150Mbps card. I’ve seen a 
hack to mount it inside the case.


No worries. It can handle up to 2TB storage. I'm looking forward to 
getting my hands on this thing.


--
 Mark Wieder
 ahsoftw...@gmail.com

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Re: Another list test

[J. Landman Gay via use-livecode]

The list was down for 2 days due to the server move so there won't be any 
mail to restore. I think we all suffered from withdrawal symptoms. I myself 
was forced to read Twitter during the interim and I fear for my health now.


--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
On August 29, 2019 9:35:44 AM Graham Samuel via use-livecode 
 wrote:


For me there is a gap for 25 and 26 August - absolutely nothing. Will posts 
from those dates reappear?


Graham

On 27 Aug 2019, at 12:35, R.H. via use-livecode 
 wrote:


I am still not receiving any message through email since last week.

Roland
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Maintenance forever?

[hh via use-livecode]

To do the same things twice or three times is OK
if some people have difficulties to do their job.

But that's going too far now.

After close to a week the "maintenance" people are
still exercising only.

Many posts are lost in forums and use-list.
No upload to livecodeshare is possible.
Nearly no progress in other LC fields but LCFM.

I say goodbye until next year, perhaps it is done
until then?


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Re: Another list test

[Bob Sneidar via use-livecode]

If an SMTP relay cannon contact the destination mail server, there usually is a 
time period in which it will retry. Sometimes it can be as long as 2 or 3 days. 

Bob S


> On Aug 29, 2019, at 07:36 , Graham Samuel via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> And another thing - my two test emails were not sent today but on 27th 
> August, so they have been spinning about in cyberspace for a couple of days. 
> Is this normal?
> 
> Graham


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Re: Another list test

[Graham Samuel via use-livecode]

And another thing - my two test emails were not sent today but on 27th August, 
so they have been spinning about in cyberspace for a couple of days. Is this 
normal?

Graham

> On 27 Aug 2019, at 13:00, Graham Samuel via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> For me there is a gap for 25 and 26 August - absolutely nothing. Will posts 
> from those dates reappear?
> 
> Graham
> 
>> On 27 Aug 2019, at 12:35, R.H. via use-livecode 
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> I am still not receiving any message through email since last week.
>> 
>> Roland
>> ___
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Re: Another list test

[Graham Samuel via use-livecode]

For me there is a gap for 25 and 26 August - absolutely nothing. Will posts 
from those dates reappear?

Graham

> On 27 Aug 2019, at 12:35, R.H. via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I am still not receiving any message through email since last week.
> 
> Roland
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Test

[Graham Samuel via use-livecode]

I haven’t seen any mails from the list since 24 August. Just testing. Please 
ignore.

Graham
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Re: checking we're still here

[Heather Laine via use-livecode]

Yes, that's up and running now. 

Regards,

Heather

Heather Laine
Customer Services Manager
LiveCode Ltd
www.livecode.com



> On 29 Aug 2019, at 14:38, Ralph DiMola via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> Yes...
> 
> Is the QCC website update completed?
> 
> Ralph DiMola
> IT Director
> Evergreen Information Services
> rdim...@evergreeninfo.net
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf
> Of Heather Laine via use-livecode
> Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 9:26 AM
> To: How to use LiveCode
> Cc: Heather Laine
> Subject: checking we're still here
> 
> Been a bit quiet today. 
> 
> Is the list still getting messages?
> 
> 
> Heather Laine
> Customer Services Manager
> LiveCode Ltd
> www.livecode.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
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RE: checking we're still here

[Ralph DiMola via use-livecode]

Yes...

Is the QCC website update completed?

Ralph DiMola
IT Director
Evergreen Information Services
rdim...@evergreeninfo.net

-Original Message-
From: use-livecode [mailto:use-livecode-boun...@lists.runrev.com] On Behalf
Of Heather Laine via use-livecode
Sent: Thursday, August 29, 2019 9:26 AM
To: How to use LiveCode
Cc: Heather Laine
Subject: checking we're still here

Been a bit quiet today. 

Is the list still getting messages?


Heather Laine
Customer Services Manager
LiveCode Ltd
www.livecode.com




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checking we're still here

[Heather Laine via use-livecode]

Been a bit quiet today. 

Is the list still getting messages?


Heather Laine
Customer Services Manager
LiveCode Ltd
www.livecode.com




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