Re: revHTTP

[Brian Milby via use-livecode]

Hopefully the UX in DP9 will improve this issue.  The drop-down menu for
APIs will scroll if taller than the window height.

On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 5:48 PM, Andre Garzia via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> Hey Monte,
>
> The built-in LC dictionary UI is not good.
> For example, on my Surface 4 Pro, I can't change the little dropdown to
> select the httpd API as the popup list is larger than my screen and does
> not scroll with the trackpad.
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Re: revHTTP

[Monte Goulding via use-livecode]

Thanks for your thoughts Andre

> On 2 Aug 2017, at 8:48 am, Andre Garzia  wrote:
> 
> Yes, I can give more details, I am not talking about library documentation as 
> it is generated by lcdoc but the overall state of the documentation. The main 
> issue for me is a UX one. The built-in LC dictionary UI is not good. For 
> example, on my Surface 4 Pro, I can't change the little dropdown to select 
> the httpd API as the popup list is larger than my screen and does not scroll 
> with the trackpad.

Yes, we know this is not right. Plans are afoot to merge all the extension APIs 
into the LiveCode script one which will solve the problem above.

> That is just an example, a simple list of opportunities for enhancement would 
> be:
> 
> * Provide sample stacks for all LC dictionary entries (multiple entries can 
> share the same sample but no entry can be without at least one sample). The 
> sample stacks need to be something that the person can click and run.

Yes we need some kind of related resources thing where we can setup two way 
links between in a lesson, example stack or interactive tutorial. 

I’ve opened a report here http://quality.livecode.com/show_bug.cgi?id=20215 


My suggestion is the tags be expanded to all resources rather than just api so 
it’s easy to setup a blob of resources about a thing.

> * A better wiki or comment system.

We are encouraging people that have something to contribute to do so directly 
to the document as that way it both gets reviewed and more visibility. I know 
this presents a bit of a hurdle for some potential contributors but it also 
means there isn’t yet another place for good information to get lost in.

> * Libraries need to be more discoverable.

Indeed (mentioned above)
> 
> Right now we have documentation spread all over the place. There are things 
> in release notes, things in emails, stuff in the dictionary, stuff only on 
> the website, and finding things is quite hard. The navigation is challenging, 
> for example, searching httpd on the website yields nothing. I had to go to 
> github and look for the source.

In the past it was possible for stuff to be in the release notes but not 
documented in the dictionary but that shouldn’t be the case with anything new 
and anything that is not in the API please open a report on.

We know we need to do better with the docs, however, there are a *lot* of them 
so community contributions really do need to be a big part of getting them 
right.  Adding tags is a good place to start.

Cheers

Monte

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Re: revHTTP

[Monte Goulding via use-livecode]

> On 2 Aug 2017, at 8:57 am, Andre Garzia via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I just looked at the source code for the new httpd library, it is quite
> similar in "what it is doing" to mchttpd and my own revhttpd. Basically
> both of them use LC to accept and process requests. I had the impression
> that the new library was using some C/C++ based implementation.
> 
> The implementation Monte made is very minimalist and elegant. It is easy to
> follow and can even serve as a base for more ambitious projects. It suffers
> from the same problems as mchttpd and revhttpd though which is, it can't
> handle any form of concurrency. If your callback handler blocks, there is a
> great chance that any other requests will be discarded (unless LC is
> actually buffering and queueing them which would be awesome and also solve
> the same issue on the other implementations).

It is only really intended to be a simple implementation to use to serve 
something on localhost. As I mentioned previously it was only implemented for 
serving a HTML5 standalone in one of our test tools but generalised into a 
library for reuse for a number of things (HTML5 deploy library & FileMaker 
plugin web view, users serving things like reports in a local browser). I would 
not use it on a public webserver although it probably could handle some low 
traffic. It has not had any load testing done on it but I’m really not sure why 
it would drop requests unless the client has a very short timeout or each 
request takes a long time to handle. Of course if there’s a thousand requests 
coming in a second or something you’re on your own ;-)

Cheers

Monte
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Re: revHTTP

[Andre Garzia via use-livecode]

Thats how I feel too :-)

Em 1 de ago de 2017 20:04, "J. Landman Gay via use-livecode" <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> escreveu:

> On 8/1/17 5:48 PM, Andre Garzia via use-livecode wrote:
>
>> Right now we have documentation spread all over the place. There are
>> things
>> in release notes, things in emails, stuff in the dictionary, stuff only on
>> the website, and finding things is quite hard.
>>
>
> I read the release notes with every new version, but what happens to me
> often is that I'll find something new I'm interested in but later I can't
> remember what it's called. By the time I need to use it, I've forgotten
> what I need to look up in the dictionary. It's hard to locate a feature if
> you can't remember even a part of the name.
>
> --
> Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
> HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com
>
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Re: revHTTP

[J. Landman Gay via use-livecode]

On 8/1/17 5:48 PM, Andre Garzia via use-livecode wrote:

Right now we have documentation spread all over the place. There are things
in release notes, things in emails, stuff in the dictionary, stuff only on
the website, and finding things is quite hard.


I read the release notes with every new version, but what happens to me 
often is that I'll find something new I'm interested in but later I 
can't remember what it's called. By the time I need to use it, I've 
forgotten what I need to look up in the dictionary. It's hard to locate 
a feature if you can't remember even a part of the name.


--
Jacqueline Landman Gay | jac...@hyperactivesw.com
HyperActive Software   | http://www.hyperactivesw.com

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Re: revHTTP

[Mark Wieder via use-livecode]

On 08/01/2017 03:48 PM, Andre Garzia via use-livecode wrote:


Right now we have documentation spread all over the place. There are things
in release notes, things in emails, stuff in the dictionary, stuff only on
the website, and finding things is quite hard. The navigation is
challenging, for example, searching httpd on the website yields nothing. I
had to go to github and look for the source.


+1

--
 Mark Wieder
 ahsoftw...@gmail.com

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Re: revHTTP

[Andre Garzia via use-livecode]

Friends,

I just looked at the source code for the new httpd library, it is quite
similar in "what it is doing" to mchttpd and my own revhttpd. Basically
both of them use LC to accept and process requests. I had the impression
that the new library was using some C/C++ based implementation.

The implementation Monte made is very minimalist and elegant. It is easy to
follow and can even serve as a base for more ambitious projects. It suffers
from the same problems as mchttpd and revhttpd though which is, it can't
handle any form of concurrency. If your callback handler blocks, there is a
great chance that any other requests will be discarded (unless LC is
actually buffering and queueing them which would be awesome and also solve
the same issue on the other implementations).

om om
andre

On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 5:33 PM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> On 31/07/2017 21:18, Monte Goulding via use-livecode wrote:
>
> Hi Alex
>>
>> You could use the new httpd library that is already included in LiveCode
>> 9 for this. Indeed this is what it was created for. We build a standalone
>> with all our tests and serve it with the library.
>>
> Yep - found it, and now playing with it. As I said in the other email, I
> couldn't find the docs, but simply ticking "Show IDE Stacks in Lists" and
> then using the project browser got me there. I love Livecode - there's
> always another way :-)
>
>>   What would be ideal is to create a deploy library similar to the the
>> iOS and Android ones. That way the Test button would build and launch the
>> standalone in your browser.
>>
>> That would be useful - but it's not what I have in mind.
>
> I'll describe what I'm trying to do in a separate rant 
>
> Thanks - and thanks for all the help, Monte, Richard, Matthias.
> -- Alex.
>
>
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Re: revHTTP

[Andre Garzia via use-livecode]

Hey Monte,

Yes, I can give more details, I am not talking about library documentation
as it is generated by lcdoc but the overall state of the documentation. The
main issue for me is a UX one. The built-in LC dictionary UI is not good.
For example, on my Surface 4 Pro, I can't change the little dropdown to
select the httpd API as the popup list is larger than my screen and does
not scroll with the trackpad. That is just an example, a simple list of
opportunities for enhancement would be:

* Provide sample stacks for all LC dictionary entries (multiple entries can
share the same sample but no entry can be without at least one sample). The
sample stacks need to be something that the person can click and run.
* A better wiki or comment system.
* Libraries need to be more discoverable.

Right now we have documentation spread all over the place. There are things
in release notes, things in emails, stuff in the dictionary, stuff only on
the website, and finding things is quite hard. The navigation is
challenging, for example, searching httpd on the website yields nothing. I
had to go to github and look for the source.

om om
andre

On Tue, Aug 1, 2017 at 5:18 PM, Monte Goulding via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

>
> > On 2 Aug 2017, at 4:02 am, Andre Garzia via use-livecode <
> use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> >
> > I wish there was a more comprehensive documentation effort going on.
>
> Hi Andre
>
> Can you give a little more detail on your complaint here. All our new
> libraries are documented with lcdoc block comments which are extracted
> during the build and appear in the documentation. At the moment you need to
> choose the extension you are interested in as they don’t appear in the
> LiveCode Script api but in the future we will change this so all things
> available from LiveCode script are in the LiveCode Script API section.
>
> Cheers
>
> Monte
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Re: revHTTP

[Alex Tweedly via use-livecode]

On 31/07/2017 21:18, Monte Goulding via use-livecode wrote:


Hi Alex

You could use the new httpd library that is already included in LiveCode 9 for 
this. Indeed this is what it was created for. We build a standalone with all 
our tests and serve it with the library.
Yep - found it, and now playing with it. As I said in the other email, I 
couldn't find the docs, but simply ticking "Show IDE Stacks in Lists" 
and then using the project browser got me there. I love Livecode - 
there's always another way :-)

  What would be ideal is to create a deploy library similar to the the iOS and 
Android ones. That way the Test button would build and launch the standalone in 
your browser.


That would be useful - but it's not what I have in mind.

I'll describe what I'm trying to do in a separate rant 

Thanks - and thanks for all the help, Monte, Richard, Matthias.
-- Alex.

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Re: revHTTP

[Alex Tweedly via use-livecode]

I have to admit, I had the same complaint as Andre - I didn't see 
anything about it in the dictionary.


OK, now that I've looked harder, I see them :-)

But I had no idea there was library documentation within the "API" 
drop-down.



Brings up another question - I see there's a 'getopt' library for 
parsing command line arguments, but I can't find a way to run with 
command line arguments. I thought it was, in my case, 
/Livecode-Indy -u myscript.lc


but that simply says "Startup error - cannot run in command line mode"

Is there some other new way to do this ?

-- Alex.


On 01/08/2017 21:18, Monte Goulding via use-livecode wrote:

On 2 Aug 2017, at 4:02 am, Andre Garzia via use-livecode 
 wrote:

I wish there was a more comprehensive documentation effort going on.

Hi Andre

Can you give a little more detail on your complaint here. All our new libraries 
are documented with lcdoc block comments which are extracted during the build 
and appear in the documentation. At the moment you need to choose the extension 
you are interested in as they don’t appear in the LiveCode Script api but in 
the future we will change this so all things available from LiveCode script are 
in the LiveCode Script API section.

Cheers

Monte
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Re: revHTTP

[Alex Tweedly via use-livecode]

Thanks Andre.

I hadn't even known there was a new httpd library; now that I do know 
about it, I'm pretty sure that's the best place to start (indeed, the 
comments in the library include enough of a 'how to use' sample that you 
can just copy/paste, fix up a couple of typos and have a working very 
simple server).


I'm pretty sure that'll give me what I want - and I'm now just playing 
with adding a couple of mini features to it.


Thanks

Alex.


On 01/08/2017 19:02, Andre Garzia wrote:

Hey Alex,

I have multiple sources for it here. This is in the most recent location:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0636wl30z4btg1u/RevHTTP.zip?dl=0

Be aware that this httpd was never safe. It handles only one 
connection at a time. We can build better stuff these days. I haven't 
tested the new httpd library, I actually have a lot of difficulty in 
keeping up to date with the recent libraries in LC because the docs 
are spread in release notes. I wish there was a more comprehensive 
documentation effort going on.


om om
andre

On Mon, Jul 31, 2017 at 4:22 PM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode 
<use-livecode@lists.runrev.com <mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>> 
wrote:


Does anyone have a copy of (or a currently working link to)
Andre's revHTTP ?

Thanks

Alex

P.S. I'm thinking of making a script-only stack that is a UI-free
Simple HTTP server - and then suggesting to Livecode Ltd that the
HTML5 deployment guide recommend it rather than the Python
SimpleHTTPServer solution currently suggested. Building this on
top of Andre's core code would probably mean I'd get a working
version, without too many bugs, much more quickly than if I do it
myself.

P.P.S and as a bonus, I'd then be able to add the bridge/relay
function easily, so I can download off-domain web pages for my
little app :-)


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Re: revHTTP

[Monte Goulding via use-livecode]

> On 2 Aug 2017, at 4:02 am, Andre Garzia via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> I wish there was a more comprehensive documentation effort going on.

Hi Andre

Can you give a little more detail on your complaint here. All our new libraries 
are documented with lcdoc block comments which are extracted during the build 
and appear in the documentation. At the moment you need to choose the extension 
you are interested in as they don’t appear in the LiveCode Script api but in 
the future we will change this so all things available from LiveCode script are 
in the LiveCode Script API section.

Cheers

Monte
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Re: revHTTP

[Andre Garzia via use-livecode]

Hey Alex,

I have multiple sources for it here. This is in the most recent location:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/0636wl30z4btg1u/RevHTTP.zip?dl=0

Be aware that this httpd was never safe. It handles only one connection at
a time. We can build better stuff these days. I haven't tested the new
httpd library, I actually have a lot of difficulty in keeping up to date
with the recent libraries in LC because the docs are spread in release
notes. I wish there was a more comprehensive documentation effort going on.

om om
andre

On Mon, Jul 31, 2017 at 4:22 PM, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode <
use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:

> Does anyone have a copy of (or a currently working link to) Andre's
> revHTTP ?
>
> Thanks
>
> Alex
>
> P.S. I'm thinking of making a script-only stack that is a UI-free Simple
> HTTP server - and then suggesting to Livecode Ltd that the HTML5 deployment
> guide recommend it rather than the Python SimpleHTTPServer solution
> currently suggested. Building this on top of Andre's core code would
> probably mean I'd get a working version, without too many bugs, much more
> quickly than if I do it myself.
>
> P.P.S and as a bonus, I'd then be able to add the bridge/relay function
> easily, so I can download off-domain web pages for my little app :-)
>
>
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Re: revHTTP

[Monte Goulding via use-livecode]

> On 1 Aug 2017, at 6:34 am, Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> it´s include in LC 9 DP7 and up.
> 
> Please note that you have to manually load it with
> start using stack "httpd"
> 
> This is a known issue and was mentioned in the “Known issues” in the release 
> emails, but unfortunately not in the release notes.

That will be fixed in dp-9.

Cheers

Monte
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Re: revHTTP

[Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode]

Hi Alex,

it´s include in LC 9 DP7 and up.

Please note that you have to manually load it with
start using stack "httpd"

This is a known issue and was mentioned in the “Known issues” in the release 
emails, but unfortunately not in the release notes.

Matthias Rebbe
+49 5741 31
‌matthiasrebbe.eu <http://matthiasrebbe.eu/>‌

> Am 31.07.2017 um 22:18 schrieb Monte Goulding via use-livecode 
> <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com <mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>>:
> 
> Hi Alex
> 
> You could use the new httpd library that is already included in LiveCode 9 
> for this. Indeed this is what it was created for. We build a standalone with 
> all our tests and serve it with the library. What would be ideal is to create 
> a deploy library similar to the the iOS and Android ones. That way the Test 
> button would build and launch the standalone in your browser. 
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Monte
> 
>> On 1 Aug 2017, at 5:22 am, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode 
>> <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com <mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> Does anyone have a copy of (or a currently working link to) Andre's revHTTP ?
>> 
>> Thanks
>> 
>> Alex
>> 
>> P.S. I'm thinking of making a script-only stack that is a UI-free Simple 
>> HTTP server - and then suggesting to Livecode Ltd that the HTML5 deployment 
>> guide recommend it rather than the Python SimpleHTTPServer solution 
>> currently suggested. Building this on top of Andre's core code would 
>> probably mean I'd get a working version, without too many bugs, much more 
>> quickly than if I do it myself.
>> 
>> P.P.S and as a bonus, I'd then be able to add the bridge/relay function 
>> easily, so I can download off-domain web pages for my little app :-)
>> 
>> 
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Re: revHTTP

[Monte Goulding via use-livecode]

Hi Alex

You could use the new httpd library that is already included in LiveCode 9 for 
this. Indeed this is what it was created for. We build a standalone with all 
our tests and serve it with the library. What would be ideal is to create a 
deploy library similar to the the iOS and Android ones. That way the Test 
button would build and launch the standalone in your browser. 

Cheers

Monte

> On 1 Aug 2017, at 5:22 am, Alex Tweedly via use-livecode 
> <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com> wrote:
> 
> Does anyone have a copy of (or a currently working link to) Andre's revHTTP ?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Alex
> 
> P.S. I'm thinking of making a script-only stack that is a UI-free Simple HTTP 
> server - and then suggesting to Livecode Ltd that the HTML5 deployment guide 
> recommend it rather than the Python SimpleHTTPServer solution currently 
> suggested. Building this on top of Andre's core code would probably mean I'd 
> get a working version, without too many bugs, much more quickly than if I do 
> it myself.
> 
> P.P.S and as a bonus, I'd then be able to add the bridge/relay function 
> easily, so I can download off-domain web pages for my little app :-)
> 
> 
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Re: revHTTP

[Matthias Rebbe via use-livecode]

https://bitbucket.org/andregarzia/revonrockets/src/b4262227f94fd5b4efec828b3c0e88650e222e49/RevHTTP/?at=default
 
<https://bitbucket.org/andregarzia/revonrockets/src/b4262227f94fd5b4efec828b3c0e88650e222e49/RevHTTP/?at=default>


Matthias Rebbe
+49 5741 31
‌matthiasrebbe.eu <http://matthiasrebbe.eu/>‌

> Am 31.07.2017 um 21:22 schrieb Alex Tweedly via use-livecode 
> <use-livecode@lists.runrev.com <mailto:use-livecode@lists.runrev.com>>:
> 
> Does anyone have a copy of (or a currently working link to) Andre's revHTTP ?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Alex
> 
> P.S. I'm thinking of making a script-only stack that is a UI-free Simple HTTP 
> server - and then suggesting to Livecode Ltd that the HTML5 deployment guide 
> recommend it rather than the Python SimpleHTTPServer solution currently 
> suggested. Building this on top of Andre's core code would probably mean I'd 
> get a working version, without too many bugs, much more quickly than if I do 
> it myself.
> 
> P.P.S and as a bonus, I'd then be able to add the bridge/relay function 
> easily, so I can download off-domain web pages for my little app :-)
> 
> 
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Matthias Rebbe
+49 5741 31
‌matthiasrebbe.eu <http://matthiasrebbe.eu/>‌

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Re: revHTTP

[Richard Gaskin via use-livecode]

Alex Tweedly wrote:
> Does anyone have a copy of (or a currently working link to) Andre's
> revHTTP ?

Andre stopped work on that a long time ago, and I haven't seen it linked 
into his current site.


I also made a fork of the original mchttpd, and here's a copy with 
minimal changes to allow it to work with modern browsers:

<http://fourthworld.net/lc/mchttpd-4W.zip>

I have a newer one I started poking around in that had some performance 
improvements that made it half as fast as Apache, but since Apache is 
already done and twice as fast I stopped working on it.


More recently we have yet another, from Monte:
<http://lists.runrev.com/pipermail/use-livecode/2017-July/239327.html>

That was is reported to be somewhere in the LC install, but I haven't 
turned it up either locally or at Github. I'm sure it's there, but a lot 
of stuff is there. :)


--
 Richard Gaskin
 Fourth World Systems
 Software Design and Development for the Desktop, Mobile, and the Web
 
 ambassa...@fourthworld.comhttp://www.FourthWorld.com

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revHTTP

[Alex Tweedly via use-livecode]

Does anyone have a copy of (or a currently working link to) Andre's 
revHTTP ?


Thanks

Alex

P.S. I'm thinking of making a script-only stack that is a UI-free Simple 
HTTP server - and then suggesting to Livecode Ltd that the HTML5 
deployment guide recommend it rather than the Python SimpleHTTPServer 
solution currently suggested. Building this on top of Andre's core code 
would probably mean I'd get a working version, without too many bugs, 
much more quickly than if I do it myself.


P.P.S and as a bonus, I'd then be able to add the bridge/relay function 
easily, so I can download off-domain web pages for my little app :-)



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