Re: [libreoffice-users] Feature Request: Lack of Outliner Functionality a Deal Breaker for Me
Le 11/10/2013 00:09, CougarB a écrit : When I was a full-time journalist in the 1980s, I became very successful using a dedicated outliner called PCOutline. When all the major Word Processers came along--MS Word, Word Perfect, etc, the lack of outliner functionality kept me with my archaic outliner until MS Word beat the functionality of PCOutline. As a partial workaround, did you try the menu File Send Create AutoAbstract... ? Best regards JBF -- Seuls des formats ouverts peuvent assurer la pérennité de vos documents. -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] Feature Request: Lack of Outliner Functionality a Deal Breaker for Me
On 10/10/2013, CougarB couga...@gmail.com wrote: I used outlining as my main method of work when a full-time technical writer in the 90s (e.g., Fujitsu Software in San Jose). While working for a java house, I was so influenced by the negative developer reactions to MS, that I've been wishing to move to OpenOffice or LibraOffice ever since they came along. But you don't have the functionality that I need, and furthermore, the discussions of outlining on this forum seem to miss the whole point, from my point of view. There are many outliner tools out there, why use a word-processor when a text editor such as Leo or Jedit can achieve outline functionality? Alternatively, use LO writer styles and the navigator toolbar. -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] Feature Request: Lack of Outliner Functionality a Deal Breaker for Me
On 10/10/2013 10:50 PM, Kracked_P_P---webmaster wrote: I am not a Macro person, but I wonder how much of this can be done with Macros. This is where it would have been extremely useful to have access to source code for OOo extensions. Everything requested was not only doable, but done by people using OOo 2.x, and the appropriate extensions. Those extensions were, naturally enough, broken in OOo 3.x. Use Running Headers, configure Outline Numbering appropriately, and use Navigator to move the paragraphs around, will take care of the first request. I've forgotten what the name of the extension that provided the functionality described in the second and third request. :( Adroit use of Navigator almost suffices for that functionality. Navigator does have its annoyances, chief of which is collapsing when switching between different objects within the document. jonathon -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] Feature Request: Lack of Outliner Functionality a Deal Breaker for Me
I Know that the DEVs do not have much time to read these posts, but I hoped that some poeple on this list might know enough about the Macros to know if it was possible. Since I am not on the DEVs list, maybe someone can forward the original posting to their list I did not know a feature request was to go onto the BUGS tracking system. I thought it was just for posting bugs that crop up in a version. On 10/10/2013 07:20 PM, Joel Madero wrote: Just a friendly reminder that devs rarely track this mailing list. If you have a feature request it belongs on our bug tracker (bugs.freedesktop.org) else it will never get implemented. Best, Joel On 10/10/2013 03:50 PM, Kracked_P_P---webmaster wrote: I am not a Macro person, but I wonder how much of this can be done with Macros. I know one book writer that does a great deal of his work through macros he created over the years. He could not find any word processor package that did what he wanted so he learned to write macros. First with Star Office, then OOo, and now using LO on his Linux system. I do not remember all of the things he wrote about in his author's notes before he got into his e-newsletter, but one time he did talk about all of the things he needed to be done and went out to find a package that could do it through the macros. The last author's notes was about getting OOo running on a new Linux system. That was when it was in the late 1.x stage or early 2.x one. Just about 2 years ago, I found out he switched to LO. He no longer writes/co-writes 4 to 6 books a year, but he still does a few, now that he is in his late 70's. So Those who are really good at writing Macros, how much of the info below can be taken care of through some type of macros? On 10/10/2013 06:09 PM, CougarB wrote: When I was a full-time journalist in the 1980s, I became very successful using a dedicated outliner called PCOutline. When all the major Word Processers came along--MS Word, Word Perfect, etc, the lack of outliner functionality kept me with my archaic outliner until MS Word beat the functionality of PCOutline. I used outlining as my main method of work when a full-time technical writer in the 90s (e.g., Fujitsu Software in San Jose). While working for a java house, I was so influenced by the negative developer reactions to MS, that I've been wishing to move to OpenOffice or LibraOffice ever since they came along. But you don't have the functionality that I need, and furthermore, the discussions of outlining on this forum seem to miss the whole point, from my point of view. I'm a very motivated wannabe LibraOffice user who currently can't make the switch, because although I'm retired and writing fiction, the power of an outliner for writing in all genres is something I can't live without. So my reasons are complex--sorry about that--but tl:dr will not allow you to understand them. Please take the time. I really want to quit Microsoft Office forever and ever and ever. Thanx. The first functionality I need might seem mickey mouse, but it's the foundation for everything else. This is that in Word's outliner view, there's a button in front of every paragraph that I can drag and drop up and down. It's like cut and paste, but a lot faster. Combined with other features, it's extremely powerful. The second functionality I need is to be able to collapse things. In an article of 25 paragraphs, I can hide every line except the first line of the paragraph, thus allowing me to see the entire article of 25 paragraphs on the screen at the same time. This allows me to completely rearrange the entire article by drop and drag. For editing a single sentence or paragraph, I insert a return between sentences, phrases, and even words, drop and drag these elements into a new order, and delete the returns. Voila! A much better constructed paragraph or sentence in a snap. The third functionality is to collapse things within headers. For instance, if I've interviewed a dozen people for an article or if I've brainstormed 5 pages of random ideas for a blog or a chapter in a novel, I create headers for different topics and then drag and drop paragraphs, quotes, ideas, etc into the headers or buckets I've created. When one header becomes too full and fills too much of the screen, I collapse it, so that it hides all the paragraphs already there, which cleans up the screen. When I'm done with this step, I have half a dozen headers, under which are many different ideas, all of which are completely hidden. So I drag and drop my half a dozen headers into the correct order. Then I open the first main header and create a bunch of subheaders. Once this is done, I reorganize all of the points in this first section into subsections or sub-buckets, collapsing them all as needed until everything is organized into a number of different subheaders. At this point, I can rearrange all of these
[libreoffice-users] Feature Request: Lack of Outliner Functionality a Deal Breaker for Me
When I was a full-time journalist in the 1980s, I became very successful using a dedicated outliner called PCOutline. When all the major Word Processers came along--MS Word, Word Perfect, etc, the lack of outliner functionality kept me with my archaic outliner until MS Word beat the functionality of PCOutline. I used outlining as my main method of work when a full-time technical writer in the 90s (e.g., Fujitsu Software in San Jose). While working for a java house, I was so influenced by the negative developer reactions to MS, that I've been wishing to move to OpenOffice or LibraOffice ever since they came along. But you don't have the functionality that I need, and furthermore, the discussions of outlining on this forum seem to miss the whole point, from my point of view. I'm a very motivated wannabe LibraOffice user who currently can't make the switch, because although I'm retired and writing fiction, the power of an outliner for writing in all genres is something I can't live without. So my reasons are complex--sorry about that--but tl:dr will not allow you to understand them. Please take the time. I really want to quit Microsoft Office forever and ever and ever. Thanx. The first functionality I need might seem mickey mouse, but it's the foundation for everything else. This is that in Word's outliner view, there's a button in front of every paragraph that I can drag and drop up and down. It's like cut and paste, but a lot faster. Combined with other features, it's extremely powerful. The second functionality I need is to be able to collapse things. In an article of 25 paragraphs, I can hide every line except the first line of the paragraph, thus allowing me to see the entire article of 25 paragraphs on the screen at the same time. This allows me to completely rearrange the entire article by drop and drag. For editing a single sentence or paragraph, I insert a return between sentences, phrases, and even words, drop and drag these elements into a new order, and delete the returns. Voila! A much better constructed paragraph or sentence in a snap. The third functionality is to collapse things within headers. For instance, if I've interviewed a dozen people for an article or if I've brainstormed 5 pages of random ideas for a blog or a chapter in a novel, I create headers for different topics and then drag and drop paragraphs, quotes, ideas, etc into the headers or buckets I've created. When one header becomes too full and fills too much of the screen, I collapse it, so that it hides all the paragraphs already there, which cleans up the screen. When I'm done with this step, I have half a dozen headers, under which are many different ideas, all of which are completely hidden. So I drag and drop my half a dozen headers into the correct order. Then I open the first main header and create a bunch of subheaders. Once this is done, I reorganize all of the points in this first section into subsections or sub-buckets, collapsing them all as needed until everything is organized into a number of different subheaders. At this point, I can rearrange all of these subheaders into the best order that they belong in. I can even drag a subheader into a different main heading if I choose, where it will remain as a separate section. I can repeat this process as many levels as I wish. This feature in MS Word is fractal to nine levels. From a chaotic mixture of confusion emerges order, insight, and wisdom--in one single step. As a technical writer, I used to sit in a brainstorming meetings, write down every developer idea as fast as I could (including those I didn't understand at all), type it all sequentially, and then very quickly organize all of the ideas into a coherent whole. The developers thought I actually knew how to program. (Mwah-hah-hah!) I could never have done that with LibreOffice as it's now configured or OpenOffice, either. Without my Word outliner, I would have been a shitty technical writer, and I would never have been able to write the developer guides I wrote. As a creative writer today, I currently have a dozen projects that are percolating, as well as one major project that I'm focusing on. I just brainstorm for anything that comes up, drag the ideas into the proper buckets, and I never lose anything of value. (Yes, the word never is absolutely accurate.) It's like having a Super Power that's available to everyone, but no one knows how to get it. Currently, this Super Power is only available in MS Word. Please make it possible for me to migrate to LibreOffice without losing my Super Powers. And please make these Super Powers available to the world. Doing so could cause the entire planet to evolve into better writers. You can help eliminate crappy writing! Until you do this, LibreOffice is like Kryptonite to me. I can't come near it, even though I truly want to. I beg of you: Please help poor little Cougar quit his addiction to Micro$oft! (Yeah, I know. Outliners do not eliminate the
Re: [libreoffice-users] Feature Request: Lack of Outliner Functionality a Deal Breaker for Me
I've been using opml editor (on Windows, unfortunately) which seems to do all these things. Once stuff is in place it can be copied and pasted into a LO document, I believe. I've even been able to do a bit in Text Pad with indents and then copying it into the opml editor creates a good outline. I think Scrivener is based on opml and has all of the functionality you mention. There seems to be a beta version of Scrivener for Linux; it's well established for Windows and Mac; and I think once the outlining is done the finished document exports to LO or M$ Word. On Thu, 2013-10-10 at 15:09 -0700, CougarB wrote: When I was a full-time journalist in the 1980s, I became very successful using a dedicated outliner called PCOutline. When all the major Word Processers came along--MS Word, Word Perfect, etc, the lack of outliner functionality kept me with my archaic outliner until MS Word beat the functionality of PCOutline. I used outlining as my main method of work when a full-time technical writer in the 90s (e.g., Fujitsu Software in San Jose). While working for a java house, I was so influenced by the negative developer reactions to MS, that I've been wishing to move to OpenOffice or LibraOffice ever since they came along. But you don't have the functionality that I need, and furthermore, the discussions of outlining on this forum seem to miss the whole point, from my point of view. I'm a very motivated wannabe LibraOffice user who currently can't make the switch, because although I'm retired and writing fiction, the power of an outliner for writing in all genres is something I can't live without. So my reasons are complex--sorry about that--but tl:dr will not allow you to understand them. Please take the time. I really want to quit Microsoft Office forever and ever and ever. Thanx. The first functionality I need might seem mickey mouse, but it's the foundation for everything else. This is that in Word's outliner view, there's a button in front of every paragraph that I can drag and drop up and down. It's like cut and paste, but a lot faster. Combined with other features, it's extremely powerful. The second functionality I need is to be able to collapse things. In an article of 25 paragraphs, I can hide every line except the first line of the paragraph, thus allowing me to see the entire article of 25 paragraphs on the screen at the same time. This allows me to completely rearrange the entire article by drop and drag. For editing a single sentence or paragraph, I insert a return between sentences, phrases, and even words, drop and drag these elements into a new order, and delete the returns. Voila! A much better constructed paragraph or sentence in a snap. The third functionality is to collapse things within headers. For instance, if I've interviewed a dozen people for an article or if I've brainstormed 5 pages of random ideas for a blog or a chapter in a novel, I create headers for different topics and then drag and drop paragraphs, quotes, ideas, etc into the headers or buckets I've created. When one header becomes too full and fills too much of the screen, I collapse it, so that it hides all the paragraphs already there, which cleans up the screen. When I'm done with this step, I have half a dozen headers, under which are many different ideas, all of which are completely hidden. So I drag and drop my half a dozen headers into the correct order. Then I open the first main header and create a bunch of subheaders. Once this is done, I reorganize all of the points in this first section into subsections or sub-buckets, collapsing them all as needed until everything is organized into a number of different subheaders. At this point, I can rearrange all of these subheaders into the best order that they belong in. I can even drag a subheader into a different main heading if I choose, where it will remain as a separate section. I can repeat this process as many levels as I wish. This feature in MS Word is fractal to nine levels. From a chaotic mixture of confusion emerges order, insight, and wisdom--in one single step. As a technical writer, I used to sit in a brainstorming meetings, write down every developer idea as fast as I could (including those I didn't understand at all), type it all sequentially, and then very quickly organize all of the ideas into a coherent whole. The developers thought I actually knew how to program. (Mwah-hah-hah!) I could never have done that with LibreOffice as it's now configured or OpenOffice, either. Without my Word outliner, I would have been a shitty technical writer, and I would never have been able to write the developer guides I wrote. As a creative writer today, I currently have a dozen projects that are percolating, as well as one major project that I'm focusing on. I just brainstorm for anything that comes up, drag the ideas into the proper buckets, and I never lose anything of value.
Re: [libreoffice-users] Feature Request: Lack of Outliner Functionality a Deal Breaker for Me
Just a friendly reminder that devs rarely track this mailing list. If you have a feature request it belongs on our bug tracker (bugs.freedesktop.org) else it will never get implemented. Best, Joel On 10/10/2013 03:50 PM, Kracked_P_P---webmaster wrote: I am not a Macro person, but I wonder how much of this can be done with Macros. I know one book writer that does a great deal of his work through macros he created over the years. He could not find any word processor package that did what he wanted so he learned to write macros. First with Star Office, then OOo, and now using LO on his Linux system. I do not remember all of the things he wrote about in his author's notes before he got into his e-newsletter, but one time he did talk about all of the things he needed to be done and went out to find a package that could do it through the macros. The last author's notes was about getting OOo running on a new Linux system. That was when it was in the late 1.x stage or early 2.x one. Just about 2 years ago, I found out he switched to LO. He no longer writes/co-writes 4 to 6 books a year, but he still does a few, now that he is in his late 70's. So Those who are really good at writing Macros, how much of the info below can be taken care of through some type of macros? On 10/10/2013 06:09 PM, CougarB wrote: When I was a full-time journalist in the 1980s, I became very successful using a dedicated outliner called PCOutline. When all the major Word Processers came along--MS Word, Word Perfect, etc, the lack of outliner functionality kept me with my archaic outliner until MS Word beat the functionality of PCOutline. I used outlining as my main method of work when a full-time technical writer in the 90s (e.g., Fujitsu Software in San Jose). While working for a java house, I was so influenced by the negative developer reactions to MS, that I've been wishing to move to OpenOffice or LibraOffice ever since they came along. But you don't have the functionality that I need, and furthermore, the discussions of outlining on this forum seem to miss the whole point, from my point of view. I'm a very motivated wannabe LibraOffice user who currently can't make the switch, because although I'm retired and writing fiction, the power of an outliner for writing in all genres is something I can't live without. So my reasons are complex--sorry about that--but tl:dr will not allow you to understand them. Please take the time. I really want to quit Microsoft Office forever and ever and ever. Thanx. The first functionality I need might seem mickey mouse, but it's the foundation for everything else. This is that in Word's outliner view, there's a button in front of every paragraph that I can drag and drop up and down. It's like cut and paste, but a lot faster. Combined with other features, it's extremely powerful. The second functionality I need is to be able to collapse things. In an article of 25 paragraphs, I can hide every line except the first line of the paragraph, thus allowing me to see the entire article of 25 paragraphs on the screen at the same time. This allows me to completely rearrange the entire article by drop and drag. For editing a single sentence or paragraph, I insert a return between sentences, phrases, and even words, drop and drag these elements into a new order, and delete the returns. Voila! A much better constructed paragraph or sentence in a snap. The third functionality is to collapse things within headers. For instance, if I've interviewed a dozen people for an article or if I've brainstormed 5 pages of random ideas for a blog or a chapter in a novel, I create headers for different topics and then drag and drop paragraphs, quotes, ideas, etc into the headers or buckets I've created. When one header becomes too full and fills too much of the screen, I collapse it, so that it hides all the paragraphs already there, which cleans up the screen. When I'm done with this step, I have half a dozen headers, under which are many different ideas, all of which are completely hidden. So I drag and drop my half a dozen headers into the correct order. Then I open the first main header and create a bunch of subheaders. Once this is done, I reorganize all of the points in this first section into subsections or sub-buckets, collapsing them all as needed until everything is organized into a number of different subheaders. At this point, I can rearrange all of these subheaders into the best order that they belong in. I can even drag a subheader into a different main heading if I choose, where it will remain as a separate section. I can repeat this process as many levels as I wish. This feature in MS Word is fractal to nine levels. From a chaotic mixture of confusion emerges order, insight, and wisdom--in one single step. As a technical writer, I used to sit in a brainstorming meetings, write down every developer idea as fast as I could (including those I didn't understand at all), type it all
