Re: What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Cameron Simpson]

On 25Dec2019 00:22, Patrick O'Callaghan  wrote:

On Wed, 2019-12-25 at 08:51 +1100, Cameron Simpson wrote:

Histbackup is here:

  https://bitbucket.org/cameron_simpson/css/src/tip/bin/histbackup

There are plenty of other similar tools.


I use rsnapshot, which seems quite similar. Any thoughts on pros/cons
versus histbackup?


I wrote histbackup, so it does what I want with some handy (to me) 
features (symlink-if-unchanged, "named" symlink to latest backup and 
specific backups, second pass if we hit the hardlink limit, etc).


I haven't an opinion about rsnapshot, as I've not had cause to use it.

Is there anything you wish rsnapshot did?

Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Tim via users]

On Wed, 2019-12-25 at 08:51 +1100, Cameron Simpson wrote:
> if you have multiple external drives (eg multiple backup drives 
> for space reasons, or both the 1 and 2 copies plugged in at once) I 
> recommend doing the backups in series, not in parallel; I've a little
> 4 port USB4 hub and have had bad experiences trying to run both
> drives at once - might be lack of power, might be dodgy hardware,
> might be USB driver issues. Anyway, I/O errors ensued.

I've always had foulups when doing lots of data across USB (especially
when that was masses of small files).  Partway through something would
stuff up, transfers would jam or abort, and there'd be a pile of
corrupted data.  I've come to a few conclusions:

Drives powered from your computer's USB socket are a bad idea.  Drives
with their own good quality power supplies are better (though there's a
lot with crappy supplies).

Drives in tiny cases, drives with bad heat dissipation, are bad news. 
The drives overheat when continuously churning data through for a
while.

If I ever had to copy a lot of data from one USB drive to another USB
drive, that nearly always ended in tears.  I don't think some computers
are capable of prolonged throughput of data across USB.
 
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Re: windows 10 virtual machine sound?

[Ed Greshko]

On 2019-12-25 09:25, Tom Horsley wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Dec 2019 09:18:32 +0800
> Ed Greshko wrote:
>
>> A trivial workaround that I always use is that I start Windows 10 from the 
>> Virt-Manager, wait a bit,
>> then open the display.  I've done this to avoid the frustration of trying to 
>> fix this trivial issue.  :-)
> I just found the sound control panel and unchecked the "Play
> startup sound" checkbox :-). Seems to have worked.
>

So, it is better to give than to receive?

Merry Christmas.

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Re: windows 10 virtual machine sound?

[Tom Horsley]

On Wed, 25 Dec 2019 09:18:32 +0800
Ed Greshko wrote:

> A trivial workaround that I always use is that I start Windows 10 from the 
> Virt-Manager, wait a bit,
> then open the display.  I've done this to avoid the frustration of trying to 
> fix this trivial issue.  :-)

I just found the sound control panel and unchecked the "Play
startup sound" checkbox :-). Seems to have worked.
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Re: windows 10 virtual machine sound?

[Ed Greshko]

On 2019-12-25 08:57, Tom Horsley wrote:
> This trivial issue has bugged me since I first ran a windows VM:
>
> When windows starts up and plays the silly startup sound. it
> sounds absolutely dreadful like it is being clipped and bursts
> of static introduced at random times.
>
> Is there any way to get more reliable audio while windows
> is busy starting up? Sound is much better after the machine
> has fully booted.

A trivial workaround that I always use is that I start Windows 10 from the 
Virt-Manager, wait a bit,
then open the display.  I've done this to avoid the frustration of trying to 
fix this trivial issue.  :-)


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windows 10 virtual machine sound?

[Tom Horsley]

This trivial issue has bugged me since I first ran a windows VM:

When windows starts up and plays the silly startup sound. it
sounds absolutely dreadful like it is being clipped and bursts
of static introduced at random times.

Is there any way to get more reliable audio while windows
is busy starting up? Sound is much better after the machine
has fully booted.

Just a trivia question for Christmas :-).
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Re: 24 hour time again -

[Ed Greshko]

On 2019-12-25 08:26, Doug McGarrett wrote:
>
>
> On 12/24/2019 06:58 PM, Bob Goodwin wrote:
>>
>> On 2019-12-24 18:40, Ed Greshko wrote:
>>> What is LC_TYPE?.
>>
>> Something from my subconscious apparently ...
>>
>> LC_TIME="C" works and I get 24 hour time after rebooting.
>>
>> Thank you
>>
> I'd like to have 24 hour time also but this theme has confused me.
> If I could JUST put LC_TIME="C" and have it work, where would I enter
> this command?

Well, if you want this to be "globally" for a user you'd add

export LC_TIME=C

to your ~/.bash_profile file.

However, to have an effect withing thunderbird you'd have to take the 
additional step
of editing its preferences for Date and Time Formatting and check the box for
Regional Setting locale which should show "und" when t-bird is started with 
LC_TIME=C

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Re: 24 hour time again -

[Doug McGarrett]

On 12/24/2019 06:58 PM, Bob Goodwin wrote:


On 2019-12-24 18:40, Ed Greshko wrote:

What is LC_TYPE?.


Something from my subconscious apparently ...

LC_TIME="C" works and I get 24 hour time after rebooting.

Thank you


I'd like to have 24 hour time also but this theme has confused me.
If I could JUST put LC_TIME="C" and have it work, where would I enter
this command?
--doug
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Re: What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Wed, 2019-12-25 at 08:51 +1100, Cameron Simpson wrote:
> Histbackup is here:
> 
>   https://bitbucket.org/cameron_simpson/css/src/tip/bin/histbackup
> 
> There are plenty of other similar tools.

I use rsnapshot, which seems quite similar. Any thoughts on pros/cons
versus histbackup?

poc
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Re: 24 hour time again -

[Ed Greshko]

On 2019-12-25 08:07, Samuel Sieb wrote:
> On 12/24/19 3:40 PM, Ed Greshko wrote:
>> OK, why did you not enter the command as I typed it?  It would have avoided 
>> any issues of what the PID is.
>>
>> Anyway, the PID is 1652 but your next command is wrong
>>
>> It should have been
>>
>> cat /proc1652/environ | grep "LC_TIME=[Cc]" ; echo $?
>
> You dropped a slash.  Wouldn't it be easier to just do "grep -z LC_TIME= 
> /proc/1652/environ"?  That way if it doesn't match, then you will also know 
> what it is.  I did figure out why you had the echo after and I adjusted my 
> grep command to account for that.  The environ "file" is zero-terminated 
> strings which grep by default assumes to be binary.  The "-z" makes it 
> consider nulls as newlines.
>
> $ grep -z LC_TIME /proc/$$/environ
> LC_TIME=en_US.UTF-8

Thanks for that.  Yes.  As always I claim 07:00 responses and no coffee.  :-)

How about

grep -z LC_TIME= /proc/`pidof thunderbird`/environ

?


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Re: 24 hour time again -

[Samuel Sieb]

On 12/24/19 3:40 PM, Ed Greshko wrote:

OK, why did you not enter the command as I typed it?  It would have avoided any 
issues of what the PID is.

Anyway, the PID is 1652 but your next command is wrong

It should have been

cat /proc1652/environ | grep "LC_TIME=[Cc]" ; echo $?


You dropped a slash.  Wouldn't it be easier to just do "grep -z LC_TIME= 
/proc/1652/environ"?  That way if it doesn't match, then you will also 
know what it is.  I did figure out why you had the echo after and I 
adjusted my grep command to account for that.  The environ "file" is 
zero-terminated strings which grep by default assumes to be binary.  The 
"-z" makes it consider nulls as newlines.


$ grep -z LC_TIME /proc/$$/environ
LC_TIME=en_US.UTF-8
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Re: 24 hour time again -

[Samuel Sieb]

On 12/24/19 3:24 PM, Bob Goodwin wrote:

[bobg@Workstation-2 ~]$ ps ax  | grep thunderbird
    1652 ?    Sl 0:50 /usr/lib64/thunderbird/thunderbird
    2431 pts/1    S+ 0:00 grep --color=auto thunderbird

[bobg@Workstation-2 ~]$ cat /proc/$1652/environ | grep "LC_TIME=[Cc]" ; 
echo $?

cat: /proc/652/environ: No such file or directory
1


Why did you put the $ in there?  Notice which directory you ended up 
with: /proc/652/environ.  Bash substituted for the $1 which is empty.

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Re: 24 hour time again -

[Bob Goodwin]

On 2019-12-24 18:40, Ed Greshko wrote:

What is LC_TYPE?.


Something from my subconscious apparently ...

LC_TIME="C" works and I get 24 hour time after rebooting.

Thank you

--
Bob Goodwin - Zuni, Virginia,
Fedora Linux-31 XFCE
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Re: 24 hour time again -

[Ed Greshko]

On 2019-12-25 07:24, Bob Goodwin wrote:
>
> On 2019-12-24 17:56, Ed Greshko wrote:
>> It sounds as if you're not running with the environment variable LC_TIME=C.
>>
>> What does the followng LONG command string return?
>>
>> xx=`pidof thunderbird` ; cat/proc/$xx/environ | grep "LC_TIME=[Cc]" ; echo $?
>>
>> -
>
> .
>
> Well I do have this which I hope runs after rebooted:
>
> [bobg@Workstation-2 ~]$ cat /home/bobg/.bashrc
> # .bashrc
>
> # Source global definitions
> if [ -f /etc/bashrc ]; then
>     . /etc/bashrc
> fi
>
> # User specific environment
> if ! [[ "$PATH" =~ "$HOME/.local/bin:$HOME/bin:" ]]
> then
>     PATH="$HOME/.local/bin:$HOME/bin:$PATH"
> fi
> export PATH
>
> # Uncomment the following line if you don't like systemctl's auto-paging 
> feature:
> # export SYSTEMD_PAGER=
>
> # User specific aliases and functions
>
> export LC_TYPE="C"

What is LC_TYPE?


>
> And I.m not certain I got the pid right but this is what I see:
>
> [bobg@Workstation-2 ~]$ ps ax  | grep thunderbird
>    1652 ?    Sl 0:50 /usr/lib64/thunderbird/thunderbird
>    2431 pts/1    S+ 0:00 grep --color=auto thunderbird
>
> [bobg@Workstation-2 ~]$ cat /proc/$1652/environ | grep "LC_TIME=[Cc]" ; echo 
> $?
> cat: /proc/652/environ: No such file or directory
> 1
>


OK, why did you not enter the command as I typed it?  It would have avoided any 
issues of what the PID is.

Anyway, the PID is 1652 but your next command is wrong

It should have been

cat /proc1652/environ | grep "LC_TIME=[Cc]" ; echo $?



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Re: 24 hour time again -

[Bob Goodwin]

On 2019-12-24 17:56, Ed Greshko wrote:

It sounds as if you're not running with the environment variable LC_TIME=C.

What does the followng LONG command string return?

xx=`pidof thunderbird` ; cat/proc/$xx/environ | grep "LC_TIME=[Cc]" ; echo $?

-


.

Well I do have this which I hope runs after rebooted:

[bobg@Workstation-2 ~]$ cat /home/bobg/.bashrc
# .bashrc

# Source global definitions
if [ -f /etc/bashrc ]; then
    . /etc/bashrc
fi

# User specific environment
if ! [[ "$PATH" =~ "$HOME/.local/bin:$HOME/bin:" ]]
then
    PATH="$HOME/.local/bin:$HOME/bin:$PATH"
fi
export PATH

# Uncomment the following line if you don't like systemctl's auto-paging 
feature:

# export SYSTEMD_PAGER=

# User specific aliases and functions

export LC_TYPE="C"

And I.m not certain I got the pid right but this is what I see:

[bobg@Workstation-2 ~]$ ps ax  | grep thunderbird
   1652 ?    Sl 0:50 /usr/lib64/thunderbird/thunderbird
   2431 pts/1    S+ 0:00 grep --color=auto thunderbird

[bobg@Workstation-2 ~]$ cat /proc/$1652/environ | grep "LC_TIME=[Cc]" ; 
echo $?

cat: /proc/652/environ: No such file or directory
1

--
Bob Goodwin - Zuni, Virginia,
Fedora Linux-31 XFCE
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Re: 24 hour time again -

[Ed Greshko]

On 2019-12-25 04:22, Bob Goodwin wrote:
> On a new fedora 31 installed this week and updated i am unable to get 
> Thunderbird-68.3.1 to display a message list using 24 hour time.
>
> The Date and  Time Regional setting can not be changed from US English to und 
> as expected. I've tried downgrading Thunderbird, and rebooted the system, 
> nothing has helped.
>
> This computer, with the same settings, displays the time in 24 hour format.
>
> I haven't been able to work this out so perhaps someone has a suggestion ... 

It sounds as if you're not running with the environment variable LC_TIME=C.

What does the followng LONG command string return?

xx=`pidof thunderbird` ; cat /proc/$xx/environ | grep "LC_TIME=[Cc]" ; echo $?

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Re: What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Javier Perez]

Thanks !

On Tue, Dec 24, 2019, 16:56 Cameron Simpson  wrote:

> Oh yes, one more thing. If you do the RAID1 thing: either make a shiny
> new RAID1 and copy to it, or practice the transition with test drives.
> Do not risk your high value data by trying to "in place RAID1" it.
>
> Cheers,
> Cameron Simpson 
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su vs logut/login (was: character display quality difference)

[Cameron Simpson]

between users.  [SOLVED]
Reply-To:
In-Reply-To: <2d98c6ff-5924-9b60-d2d8-2b0899cd6...@comcast.net>

On 21Dec2019 10:53, home user  wrote:
In the testing for this thread, I mostly fully signed off one account 
and fully logged in to the other rather than using "su".  For renaming 
and "ls" kinds of things, I did use "su". But for viewing, 
screen-capturing, and the localectl and locale commands, I wasn't sure, 
so I did the full logout and login.

(the question)
For what is "su" good enough, and for what is the full logout and 
login needed?  A full detailed list is impractical, but could someone 
provide some good guiding principles?


It depends solely on what needs initialising.

An su will produce a new shell with the latest environment settings. So 
you can test terminal level locale changes etc. If you _invoke_ a new 
GUI programme from that shell, it should inherit this stuff too.


A GUI logout/login will initialise the desktop, which tends to happen 
before any terminal shell. So if you're fiddling GUI stuff and _not_ 
invoking programmes from a shell, the thing you've invoking them from 
needs to see the changes. For a GUI, that tends to mean restarting the 
desktop (since you invoke GUI programmes from desktop 
buttons/icons/menus usually). And a logout/login restarts the desktop.


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: Adding a disk to existing BTRFS

[Cameron Simpson]

On 23Dec2019 11:45, Chris Murphy  wrote:

On Sun, Dec 22, 2019 at 12:52 AM Javier Perez  wrote:
Also, before I add a new device, do I have to partition the drive or 
does btrfs take over all these duties (partitioning, formating) when 
it adds the device to the filesystem?


Partitioning is optional. Drives I dedicate for one task only, I do
not partition. If I use them for other things, or might use them for
other things, then I partition them.


My personal habit is otherwise: I always partition. This means all my 
drives are partitioned, causing less confusion.


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Cameron Simpson]

Oh yes, one more thing. If you do the RAID1 thing: either make a shiny 
new RAID1 and copy to it, or practice the transition with test drives.  
Do not risk your high value data by trying to "in place RAID1" it.


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Cameron Simpson]

On 24Dec2019 14:47, Javier Perez  wrote:

I have my /home partition on a 2TB HDD drive about half full. Should be
doing regular backups but not in the habit.

What is better?
A. Purchase a second 2TB to create a Raid1 mirror or
B. Purchase a second 4TB drive for backup purposes.

If case B, should I get a USB3.0 adapter or similar so that I could just
plug the HDD, let it do the backup and unplug and store it? Or is it better
to install it on another networked pc and do it through the network?

Is there a better, easier, less troublesome option to keep the data safe
that does not involve the cloud?

This is a home network


As pointed out, these are 2 different requirements. My recommendation: 
do both. (Yes, more $s, alas.)


Let me describe our home setup.

Our personal machines are Macs which we backup with TimeMachine to 
drives which generally live in a drawer (i.e. not online, and less 
visible to theft).


Our home server and media machine is an Ubuntu Linux box. The main 
storage area is a pair of 8TB drives in RAID1. We like RAID1 because it 
means that a single drive works standalone, even without RAID - RAID5 
etc distributes the data more complexly. This makes RAID1 handy for 
recovery in another machine (eg plugged into a USB cradle).


If you have RAID1 I recommend you have a cron job to monitor it. I run 
my chkmdstat script once every 5 minutes; it is silent when things are 
good and thus generates an email if a drive fails:


 https://bitbucket.org/cameron_simpson/css/src/tip/bin/chkmdstat

We back up the main area to external USB3 drives (we like WD 
MyPassports, but there are equivalent products for similar prices; a 
nice USB powered 2TB or 4TB drive). We keep 2 backups: an "online" one 
which is updated regularly and an "offline" one which lives in a drawer 
where accidents won't happen to it.


You'll notice that 2TB < 8TB. (WD now sell a 4TB MyPassport, but that is 
still <8TB.)


We divide the main area into different areas for backup (I'm in the 
midst of changing this to use a tagging scheme instead of directory 
layout) and backup some areas to backup A, some to backup B and so 
forth. This manages the space requirement. It sounds like your home 
machine is small enough to fit in a single external drive, so you are 
spared this pain.


I use histbackup for these backups; it is an rsync wrapper which keeps 
multiple historic backups as hardlinked trees named after the backup 
date.  So a new backup goes: hard link the last tree to the new tree and 
rsync into it. Since rsync makes new files for changes this keeps the 
hard links for unchanged files and makes shiny new files for changes, so 
the cost is incremental.


Histbackup is here:

 https://bitbucket.org/cameron_simpson/css/src/tip/bin/histbackup

There are plenty of other similar tools.

These days, to reduce the likelihood of accidental damage to the backups 
I like to have the "A1" backup plugged in but not mounted ("A2" is the 
second copy which lives in a drawer).  This also has the advantage that 
provided a backup is not running you are free to unplug or plug in the 
external drive at will, because it is unmounted.


The backup script has the form:

   if mount /mnt/backupA
   then
   histbackup into /mnt/backupA/area from /app8tb/area
   umount /mnt/backupA
   fi

(Obviously the real script reads mountpoints and areas in a loop to do 
several backups.)


My fstab has lines for each backup drive, eg:

   LABEL=ARCHIVE_1A   /mnt/archive1_a   xfs user,noauto,noatime 
   0 0

so that the mounts work; you just have to label the USB drive 
filesystems when you make them. I also put a little paper sticker on 
each drive to describe it.


Finally, if you have multiple external drives (eg multiple backup drives 
for space reasons, or both the 1 and 2 copies plugged in at once) I 
recommend doing the backups in series, not in parallel; I've a little 4 
port USB4 hub and have had bad experiences trying to run both drives at 
once - might be lack of power, might be dodgy hardware, might be USB 
driver issues. Anyway, I/O errors ensued.


Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
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Re: What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Javier Perez]

On Tue, Dec 24, 2019, 15:29 Patrick O'Callaghan 
wrote:

> On Tue, 2019-12-24 at 14:47 -0500, Javier Perez wrote:
> > Hi
> > I have my /home partition on a 2TB HDD drive about half full. Should be
> > doing regular backups but not in the habit.
> >
> > What is better?
> > A. Purchase a second 2TB to create a Raid1 mirror or
> > B. Purchase a second 4TB drive for backup purposes.
>
> These are two different things with different objectives.


> Understood. But in order of importance which would go first? Seems to me
like backup should take precedence over Mirroring the data if I look
forward to preserve it.


> If case B, should I get a USB3.0 adapter or similar so that I could just
> > plug the HDD, let it do the backup and unplug and store it? Or is it
> better
> > to install it on another networked pc and do it through the network?
>
> Either. I use a NAS on my LAN, but it's an old machine with only
> 100Mbps Ethernet and an obsolete version of Debian. I don't want to buy
> a new NAS so I'm seriously thinking of just using a local disk, which
> would also be easier to configure.
>
> Your preferred backup software may be important, e.g. s/w that assumes
> the backup is on a directly-accesible filesystem can really hammer your
> network if you just mount the remote drive with NFS, even if it's just
> verifying that nothing has changed.
>
> > Is there a better, easier, less troublesome option to keep the data safe
> > that does not involve the cloud?
>
> You need to give more detail of your exact requirements, e.g. how much
> data? How often do you want to back it up? How long do you want to keep
> it? Are you backing up multiple machines or just one? If the former,
> are some of these running Windows or other non-Linux software?
>
> poc
>
Mine is an all linux network.
The data exist on two machines. Machine A has about 500GB
Machine B has about 1T but it is mostly my CD and DVD collection. if
something happens to it I can always rip it again (assuming the original
media did not go kaput).
Machine B is a "like to have". Machine A I'd rather try not to lose.
JP

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Re: What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Gordon Messmer]

On 12/24/19 11:47 AM, Javier Perez wrote:
I have my /home partition on a 2TB HDD drive about half full. Should 
be doing regular backups but not in the habit.


What is better?
A. Purchase a second 2TB to create a Raid1 mirror or
B. Purchase a second 4TB drive for backup purposes.



That depends on whether you want a) that computer to continue working 
without interruption if a hard drive fails, or b) you want to be able to 
rebuild the computer if a hard drive fails, or to be able to recover 
data if it's accidentally removed, or to restore an old version of data 
for any reason.


If you don't have regular, scheduled, automatic backups, then I would 
personally prioritize B much higher than A.



If case B, should I get a USB3.0 adapter or similar so that I could 
just plug the HDD, let it do the backup and unplug and store it? Or is 
it better to install it on another networked pc and do it through the 
network?



A directly-attached backup can be deleted by some types of accidental 
removal of the data you want ("rm -rf /*").  A computer system should 
have at least one backup that isn't mounted in the local filesystem.



Is there a better, easier, less troublesome option to keep the data 
safe that does not involve the cloud?



Backups are probably the only purpose where I recommend "the cloud" 
without reservation.  Storage costs are typically lower than you'll get 
on purchases of your own, and backups are more likely to survive events 
like fire and theft.


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After upgrade or fresh install to Fedora 31, long time to login, then grey srceen after login, system unusable

[Mr Brian Domenick]

Hi,

i have been having problems upgrading or installing Fedora 31 on an HP 
360 Spectre Laptop.


Description of problem: After an upgrade or fresh install to fc31 I get 
long delay to X login, then after login I get grey screen. On my 
original attempt, it started properly once, I was going to FC32 and it 
let me login and I was able to perform an upgrade to FC32. When I didn't 
like that I did a fresh install to FC31 and saw the problem. Virtual 
terminals were also unavailable. I then did a fresh install of FC30 that 
went okay although I think that it's a little slow to get to the login 
prompt, but after I login things work okay. I then upgraded to FC31 that 
version and saw the same delay and grey screen after login as before. I 
then went back to FC30 and I will include some info from FC30


[brian@localhost ~]$ inxi -GxxSMza System: Host: localhost.localdomain 
Kernel: 5.3.16-200.fc30.x86_64 x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc v: 9.2.1 
parameters: BOOT_IMAGE=(hd0,gpt2)/vmlinuz-5.3.16-200.fc30.x86_64 
root=UUID=b6536622-cf7c-4017-a3ef-3d3787173fb2 ro 
resume=/dev/mapper/luks-323281ed-242f-40db-85cb-75ab350dbb43 
rd.lvm.lv=fedora/root 
rd.luks.uuid=luks-9df55de6-b8fe-4b3a-a5d3-6f0005285968 
rd.lvm.lv=fedora/swap 
rd.luks.uuid=luks-323281ed-242f-40db-85cb-75ab350dbb43 rhgb quiet 
Desktop: Gnome 3.32.2 wm: gnome-shell dm: GDM Distro: Fedora release 30 
(Thirty) Machine: Type: Convertible System: HP product: HP Spectre x360 
Convertible 15-ch0xx v: N/A serial:  Chassis: type: 31 serial: 
 Mobo: HP model: 83BA v: 57.20 serial:  UEFI: AMI v: 
F.04 date: 01/23/2018 Graphics: Device-1: Intel UHD Graphics 620 vendor: 
Hewlett-Packard driver: i915 v: kernel bus ID: 00:02.0 chip ID: 
8086:5917 Device-2: NVIDIA GP108M [GeForce MX150] vendor: 
Hewlett-Packard driver: nouveau v: kernel bus ID: 01:00.0 chip ID: 
10de:1d10 Display: wayland server: Fedora Project X.org 1.20.5 driver: 
nouveau compositor: gnome-shell resolution: 3840x2160~60Hz OpenGL: 
renderer: Mesa DRI Intel UHD Graphics 620 (Kabylake GT2) v: 4.5 Mesa 
19.1.8 compat-v: 3.0 direct render: Yes Version-Release number of 
selected component (if applicable): FC31 How reproducible: Every time. 
Steps to Reproduce: 1.Install or upgrade on my laptop 2. 3.


Thanks in advance for any assistance you can provide,

Brian


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Re: What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Tue, 2019-12-24 at 14:47 -0500, Javier Perez wrote:
> Hi
> I have my /home partition on a 2TB HDD drive about half full. Should be
> doing regular backups but not in the habit.
> 
> What is better?
> A. Purchase a second 2TB to create a Raid1 mirror or
> B. Purchase a second 4TB drive for backup purposes.

These are two different things with different objectives. RAID is not a
backup solution, it's a data-loss recovery solution (i.e. for hardware-
related problems). If you accidentally delete an important file, RAID
in itself is not going to help you recover it (though it might if you
have a journalled filesystem and take regular snapshots), but a backup
will do that if it's configured properly.

> If case B, should I get a USB3.0 adapter or similar so that I could just
> plug the HDD, let it do the backup and unplug and store it? Or is it better
> to install it on another networked pc and do it through the network?

Either. I use a NAS on my LAN, but it's an old machine with only
100Mbps Ethernet and an obsolete version of Debian. I don't want to buy
a new NAS so I'm seriously thinking of just using a local disk, which
would also be easier to configure.

Your preferred backup software may be important, e.g. s/w that assumes
the backup is on a directly-accesible filesystem can really hammer your
network if you just mount the remote drive with NFS, even if it's just
verifying that nothing has changed.

> Is there a better, easier, less troublesome option to keep the data safe
> that does not involve the cloud?

You need to give more detail of your exact requirements, e.g. how much
data? How often do you want to back it up? How long do you want to keep
it? Are you backing up multiple machines or just one? If the former,
are some of these running Windows or other non-Linux software?

poc
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Re: module load failure on boot

[Frank McCormick]

On 12/24/19 2:36 PM, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 12/24/19 11:20 AM, Frank McCormick wrote:
BTW, systemd-modules-load.service doe not make any mention of 
directories with lists of kernel modules??


# cat /usr/lib/systemd/system/systemd-modules-load.service

[...snip...]

[Unit]
Description=Load Kernel Modules
Documentation=man:systemd-modules-load.service(8) man:modules-load.d(5)
DefaultDependencies=no
Conflicts=shutdown.target
Before=sysinit.target shutdown.target
ConditionCapability=CAP_SYS_MODULE
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/lib/modules-load.d
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/usr/lib/modules-load.d
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/usr/local/lib/modules-load.d
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/etc/modules-load.d
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/run/modules-load.d

# ls /usr/lib/modules-load.d
open-vm-tools.conf  soundtracker.conf

# cat /usr/lib/modules-load.d/soundtracker.conf
snd_pcm_oss





  There are none so blind as those who will not see :)

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24 hour time again -

[Bob Goodwin]

On a new fedora 31 installed this week and updated i am unable to get 
Thunderbird-68.3.1 to display a message list using 24 hour time.


The Date and  Time Regional setting can not be changed from US English 
to und as expected. I've tried downgrading Thunderbird, and rebooted the 
system, nothing has helped.


This computer, with the same settings, displays the time in 24 hour format.

I haven't been able to work this out so perhaps someone has a suggestion ...

--
Bob Goodwin - Zuni, Virginia,
Fedora Linux-31 XFCE
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What is better a 2nd drive for Raid 1 or a backup one?

[Javier Perez]

Hi
I have my /home partition on a 2TB HDD drive about half full. Should be
doing regular backups but not in the habit.

What is better?
A. Purchase a second 2TB to create a Raid1 mirror or
B. Purchase a second 4TB drive for backup purposes.

If case B, should I get a USB3.0 adapter or similar so that I could just
plug the HDD, let it do the backup and unplug and store it? Or is it better
to install it on another networked pc and do it through the network?

Is there a better, easier, less troublesome option to keep the data safe
that does not involve the cloud?

This is a home network

Thanks


-- 
--
 /\_/\
 |O O|  pepeb...@gmail.com
  Javier Perez
   While the night runs
   toward the day...
  m m   Pepebuho watches
from his high perch.
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Re: Adding a disk to existing BTRFS

[Javier Perez]

Thanks!

On Mon, Dec 23, 2019 at 1:45 PM Chris Murphy 
wrote:

> On Sun, Dec 22, 2019 at 12:52 AM Javier Perez  wrote:
> >
> > Hi
> > My home partition is on a 2T HDD using btrfs
> >
> > I am reading the material at
> > http://btrfs.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Using_Btrfs_with_Multiple_Devices
> > but still I am not that clear on some items.
> >
> > If I want to to add a second 2T drive to work as a mirror (RAID1) it
> looks like I do not have to invoke mdadm or anything similar, it seems like
> btrfs will handle it all internally. Am I understanding this right?
>
> Correct.
>
> >
> > Also, before I add a new device, do I have to partition the drive or
> does btrfs take over all these duties (partitioning, formating) when it
> adds the device to the filesystem?
>
> Partitioning is optional. Drives I dedicate for one task only, I do
> not partition. If I use them for other things, or might use them for
> other things, then I partition them.
>
> The add command formats the new device and resizes the file system:
> # btrfs device add /dev/sdX /mountpoint
>
> The balance command with a convert filter changes the profile for
> specified block groups, and does replication:
> # btrfs balance start -dconvert=raid1 -mconvert=raid1 /mountpoint
>
>
> > What has been the experience like with such a system?
>
> Gotcha 1: applies to mdadm and LVM raid as well as Btrfs, is that it's
> really common for mismatching drive SCT ERC and kernel SCSI block
> command timer. That is, there is a drive error timeout and a kernel
> block device error timeout. The drive's timeout must be less than the
> kernel, or valuable information is lost that prevents self-healing,
> allows bad sectors to accumulate, and eventually there will be data
> loss. The thing is, the defaults are often wrong: consumer hard drives
> often have very long SCT ERC, typically it's disabled, making for
> really impressive timeouts in excess of 1 minute (some suggest it can
> be 2 or 3 minutes), whereas the kernel command timeout is 30 seconds.
> Ideally, use 'smartctl -l scterc' to set the SCT ERC to something like
> 7 seconds, this can also be set using a udev rule pointed to the
> device by-id using serial number or wwn. You want the drive firmware
> to give up on read errors quickly, that way it reports the bad
> sector's LBA to the kernel, which in turn can find a good copy (raid1,
> 5, 6 or DUP profiles on Btrfs) and overwrite the bad sector thereby
> fixing it. If the drive doesn't support SCT ERC, then you'll need to
> increase the kernel's command timer. This is a kernel setting, but it
> is per block device. And raise the value to something fairly
> incredible, like 180 seconds. That means worst case scenario, a
> marginally bad sector results in possibly a 3 minute hang until the
> drive gives up, and reports a read error - and then it gets fixed up.
>
> It seems esoteric, but really it's pernicious and common in the data
> loss cases reported on linux-raid@ where they have the most experience
> with RAID. But it applies the same to Btrfs.
>
> More info here:
> https://raid.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Timeout_Mismatch
>
> Gotcha 2, 3, 4:  Device failures mean multiple gotchas all at once, so
> you kinda need a plan how to deal with this so you aren't freaking out
> if it happens. Panic often leads to user induced data loss. If in
> doubt, you are best off doing nothing and asking. Both linux-btrfs@
> list and #btrfs on IRC freenode.net are approachable for this.
>
> Gotcha: If a device dies, you're not likely to see any indication of
> failure unless you're looking at kernel messages, and see a ton of
> Btrfs complaints. Like, several scary red warnings *per* lost write.
> If a drive dies, there will quickly be thousands of these. Whether you
> do or don't notice this, the next time you reboot...
>
> Gotcha: By default, Btrfs fails to mount if it can't find all devices.
> This is because there are consequences to degraded operation, and it
> requires user interaction to make sure its all resolved. But because
> such mounts fail, there's a udev rule to wait for all Btrfs member
> devices, that way small delays between multiple devices appearing,
> don't result in failed mounts. But there's no timeout for this udev
> rule, near as I can tell:
>
> This is the rule
> /usr/lib/udev/rules.d/64-btrfs.rules
>
> So now you're stuck in this startup hang.
>
> If it's just a case of the device accidentally missing, it's safe to
> reconnect it, and then startup will proceed normally.
>
> Otherwise, you need a way to get unstuck.
>
> I'm improvising here, but what you want to do is remove the suspect
> drive, (temporarily) disable this udev rule, so that it *will* try to
> mount /home, and also you could change the fstab to add the "degraded"
> option so that the mount attempt won't fail. Now at least you can boot
> and work while degraded until you get a chance to really fix the
> problem. A degraded /home operation isn't any more risky than a single
> device /home 

Re: module load failure on boot

[Samuel Sieb]

On 12/24/19 11:20 AM, Frank McCormick wrote:
BTW, systemd-modules-load.service doe not make any mention of 
directories with lists of kernel modules??


# cat /usr/lib/systemd/system/systemd-modules-load.service

[...snip...]

[Unit]
Description=Load Kernel Modules
Documentation=man:systemd-modules-load.service(8) man:modules-load.d(5)
DefaultDependencies=no
Conflicts=shutdown.target
Before=sysinit.target shutdown.target
ConditionCapability=CAP_SYS_MODULE
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/lib/modules-load.d
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/usr/lib/modules-load.d
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/usr/local/lib/modules-load.d
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/etc/modules-load.d
ConditionDirectoryNotEmpty=|/run/modules-load.d

# ls /usr/lib/modules-load.d
open-vm-tools.conf  soundtracker.conf

# cat /usr/lib/modules-load.d/soundtracker.conf
snd_pcm_oss
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Re: module load failure on boot

[Frank McCormick]

On 12/24/19 12:57 PM, Samuel Sieb wrote:

On 12/24/19 8:02 AM, Frank wrote:
I am running a freshly updated Fedora 31. I noticed this morning that 
the systemd-modules-load.service failed. I saw it on boot


and later in the journal log.

There is no explanation why it failed, just the notification.


I've seen this for a long time on multiple computers, but haven't 
bothered to take the time to figure it out.  Although now that I check 
it, it was successful on this computer.  Look in the service file 
/usr/lib/systemd/system/systemd-modules-load.service to see the list of 
directories and check which modules it would be trying to load.

___




  I have since discovered that the problem originates from Grub loading 
the wrong kernel which is another problem  I have to solve.
I run two Linux distros on this computer (in addition to Windows 10), 
Debian Sid and Fedora.  I have been installing grub from Debian into 
/dev/sda, the main disk. I suspect the problem exists because the Debian 
version of update-grub (to create the new grub.cfg file) sorts the 
Fedora Kernels in the wrong order, putting the recovery entry first, 
then the oldest kernel followed by the newest kernel. So just hitting 
the Grub entry for Fedora on booting results (sometimes) in the oldest 
kernel, or occasionally the recovery entry.


I'll have to take this up with users on the Debian list.

BTW, systemd-modules-load.service doe not make any mention of 
directories with lists of kernel modules??


Sorry for the noise.
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Re: grub.cfg and kernel video resolution

[stan via users]

On Tue, 24 Dec 2019 10:32:48 -0500
Robert McBroom via users  wrote:

> With the deprecating of the "vga=791" specification, what is the
> method of passing the video resolution to the kernel in a text mode
> boot?  The setting in grub.cfg gives the grub menu resolution but the
> kernel drops back to 640x480 when it starts unless the vga
> specification is added to the command line.

I think you want to look at 
man 5 console-setup

I don't specify any size in /etc/vconsole.conf or
/etc/default/console-setup though, and my F31 comes up using the max
resolution for my monitor in multiuser.  Maybe you have some lingering
setup information on your system?

My /etc/default/console-setup:

# CONFIGURATION FILE FOR SETUPCON

# Consult the console-setup(5) manual page.

ACTIVE_CONSOLES=guess

CHARMAP=guess

CODESET=guess
FONTFACE=TerminusBold
FONTSIZE=16

VIDEOMODE=

# The following is an example how to use a braille font
# FONT='lat9w-08.psf.gz brl-8x8.psf'
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Re: module load failure on boot

[Samuel Sieb]

On 12/24/19 8:02 AM, Frank wrote:
I am running a freshly updated Fedora 31. I noticed this morning that 
the systemd-modules-load.service failed. I saw it on boot


and later in the journal log.

There is no explanation why it failed, just the notification.


I've seen this for a long time on multiple computers, but haven't 
bothered to take the time to figure it out.  Although now that I check 
it, it was successful on this computer.  Look in the service file 
/usr/lib/systemd/system/systemd-modules-load.service to see the list of 
directories and check which modules it would be trying to load.

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[389-users] Re: Connections Opened but No BIND Received

[Trevor Fong]

I was looking at the RH DS docs and found this page on enabling auto tuning
of threads
https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_directory_server/10/html/performance_tuning_guide/ds-threads
It mentions DS 10.11.  Does anyone know if that covers the version of 389
DS I'm running: 389-Directory/1.3.9.1 B2019.164.1418?

Thanks,
Trev

On Tue, 24 Dec 2019 at 08:37, Trevor Fong  wrote:

> Also,
> It could be a temporary situation caused by some long running searches;
> I'm crawling the logs, but they're volumous and trying to make
> correspondences between 4 servers is confusing and time consuming.  I'm
> sure I'm missing stuff.  Would you have any advice on what to check for?
> Those 4 hubs are fronted by a load-balancer.
> nsslapd-enable-nunc-stans is off
> The servers involved aren't hanging, just some connections intermittently;
> other connections still happen fine while the one that hangs waits for
> timeout, so taking a pstack or gdb won't necessarily show anything.
> > check for LDAP server descriptors and system entropy.
> How do I go about checking on this?
>
> Thanks,
> Trev
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[389-users] Re: Connections Opened but No BIND Received

[Trevor Fong]

Also,
It could be a temporary situation caused by some long running searches; I'm 
crawling the logs, but they're volumous and trying to make correspondences 
between 4 servers is confusing and time consuming.  I'm sure I'm missing stuff. 
 Would you have any advice on what to check for?
Those 4 hubs are fronted by a load-balancer. 
nsslapd-enable-nunc-stans is off
The servers involved aren't hanging, just some connections intermittently; 
other connections still happen fine while the one that hangs waits for timeout, 
so taking a pstack or gdb won't necessarily show anything.
> check for LDAP server descriptors and system entropy.
How do I go about checking on this?

Thanks,
Trev
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[389-users] Re: Connections Opened but No BIND Received

[Trevor Fong]

Hi Marc,

Thanks for your response.
Yes - it's always the 4 hubs that are responsible for authentication.  
Apart from the following recurring errors in the errors log, there aren't any 
other signs of stress on the system - CPU and memory look OK; nothing 
unexpected in /var/log/messages:

[24/Dec/2019:07:55:36.298853461 -0800] - ERR - NSMMReplicationPlugin - 
bind_and_check_pwp - agmt="cn=hub-" (:636) - Replication 
bind with SIMPLE auth failed: LDAP error -5 (Timed out) ()
[24/Dec/2019:07:55:39.323604233 -0800] - INFO - NSMMReplicationPlugin - 
bind_and_check_pwp - agmt="cn=hub-" (:636): Replication 
bind with SIMPLE auth resumed

Thanks,
Trev
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Re: Attribute 2xDP on video cards, can't find a description

[Robert McBroom via users]

On 12/23/19 11:39 PM, Ed Greshko wrote:

On 2019-12-24 12:22, Robert McBroom via users wrote:

Subject says it.  Google just gives devices no discussion.


I have no idea what you're asking.

You want to find a Video card with 2 Display Port outputs?

Just getting lost in the abbreviations.  Looking at the possibility of 
upgrading to a new system and kept seeing this specification on them.  
Google did not expand the search from the abbreviation.  Going around in 
circles in Tom's Hardware finally pulled up the words "Display Port".  
From there I could find the description results.

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module load failure on boot

[Frank]

I am running a freshly updated Fedora 31. I noticed this morning that 
the systemd-modules-load.service failed. I saw it on boot


and later in the journal log.

There is no explanation why it failed, just the notification.


[frank@franklin ~]$ systemctl status systemd-modules-load.service
● systemd-modules-load.service - Load Kernel Modules
   Loaded: loaded 
(/usr/lib/systemd/system/systemd-modules-load.service; static; vendor 
preset: disabled)
   Active: failed (Result: exit-code) since Tue 2019-12-24 10:44:34 
EST; 5min ago

 Docs: man:systemd-modules-load.service(8)
   man:modules-load.d(5)
  Process: 750 ExecStart=/usr/lib/systemd/systemd-modules-load 
(code=exited, status=1/FAILURE)

 Main PID: 750 (code=exited, status=1/FAILURE)
  CPU: 9ms


How can I debug this ?


Thanks



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grub.cfg and kernel video resolution

[Robert McBroom via users]

With the deprecating of the "vga=791" specification, what is the method 
of passing the video resolution to the kernel in a text mode boot?  The 
setting in grub.cfg gives the grub menu resolution but the kernel drops 
back to 640x480 when it starts unless the vga specification is added to 
the command line.


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Re: OT: help conditioning on multiple fields using procmail

[Ranjan Maitra]

Thank you all for your suggestions. I am a little lost because none of them 
have done what I want to do. So, let me explain what I am trying to do.

I am getting all my e-mail forwarded from u...@outlook.com to another e-mail 
address, say: u...@gmail.com.

I send myself outgoing e-mails (BCc'ed). These all come from the same e-mail 
address, that is mine.

Almost all forwarded e-mails have a Resent-From: field set to be: 
u...@outlook.com in the mail envelope. However, not all of them. Some of these 
e-mails (appears to be the ones sent within my organization) do not have this 
field even though they are also forwarded.

I want to use procmail to store all the mails (and only those e-mails) with the 
From: u...@outlook.com to my $HOME/Mail/sent folder.

How do I do this? I don't know if this matters but I use: 'procmail -d %s' when 
procmail is invoked by my fetchmail.

Many thanks and best wishes,
Ranjan







On Mon, 23 Dec 2019 22:55:25 -0600 Ranjan Maitra  wrote:

> Thank you for your help and in detailing the process. Adding the colon to the 
> From: does not prevent e-mail having the Resent-From set at the same e-mail 
> address.
>
> I am trying out your other suggestion.
>
> Thanks again!
>
> Best wishes,
> Ranjan
>
>
> On Tue, 24 Dec 2019 12:09:38 +0900 "Stephen J. Turnbull"  
> wrote:
>
> > Ranjan Maitra writes:
> >
> >  > So, I use in my .procmailrc:
> >  >
> >  > :0:
> >  > *^From.*u...@outlook.com
> >  > $HOME/Mail/sent/.
> >  >
> >  > And it used to work fine. However, recently I have also started
> >  > forwarding my e-mail from the address: u...@outlook.com and what is
> >  > happening is that the e-mail envelope of every forwarded message
> >  > now contains the header: Resent-From.*u...@outlook.com so all
> >  > forwarded e-mail is being saved to the sent folder.
> >
> > Based on your report, one possibility is that your recipe is catching
> > the "Unix From" line (also called "envelope From line"), which has the
> > form
> >
> > From  u...@wherever.dom 
> >
> > and is prepended to emails saved in so-called mbox format.  (This is
> > not part of the RFC 5322 Internet Message Format.  It is specific to
> > the way mail is handled locally by *some* configurations of *some*
> > message delivery agents.  It is not normally displayed by mail
> > clients.)  If this is the case, changing the recipe to
> >
> > :0:
> > *^From:.*u...@outlook.com
> > $HOME/Mail/sent/.
> >
> > (change is colon after From) should catch only messages with an RFC
> > 5322 From "u...@outlook.com".
> >
> >  > Is it possible to have a double condition? That is something that
> >  > says that if both Resent-From and From have *u...@outlook.com, then
> >  > it should go to the sent-folder. In other words, is it possible to
> >  > use a AND or OR or Negation condition.
> >
> > I'll answer the question, but first I gotta preach. ;-)  When you
> > don't understand the problem, it is bad practice to ask questions in
> > the form "how do I do ...", because respondents are likely to focus on
> > the how of doing what you specifically asked, not on solving your
> > problem.  That's OK in some sense, you'll learn something, but it's
> > likely to be frustrating when you do what you're told and it doesn't
> > solve the underlying problem.
> >
> > To AND conditions:
> >
> > :0:
> > * ^From:.*u...@outlook.com
> > * ^Resent-From:.*u...@outlook.com
> > $HOME/Mail/sent/.
> >
> > and BOTH conditions must match the header of the email.  To OR
> > conditions, use separate recipes.
> >
> > :0:
> > * ^From:.*u...@outlook.com
> > $HOME/Mail/sent/.
> >
> > :0:
> > * ^Resent-From:.*u...@outlook.com
> > $HOME/Mail/sent/.
> >
> > and if either condition matches the header of the mail, the mail will
> > be saved in $HOME/Mail/sent/. .  Most procmail recipes terminate
> > processing on match, so order can matter (but does not in this case
> > because there are no side effects and the action is the same).  To
> > NEGATE a condition, use ! in the recipe:
> >
> > :0:
> > * ! ^Resent-From:.*u...@outlook.com
> > $HOME/Mail/sent/.
> >
> > sending anything NOT Resent-From u...@outlook.com to .../sent/.
> >
> > The recipe that MIGHT do what you want if the colon suggestion doesn't
> > work:
> >
> > :0:
> > * ^From.*u...@outlook.com
> > * ! ^Resent-From.*u...@outlook.com
> > $HOME/Mail/sent/.
> >
> > (look Ma, no colons!, and the Resent-From condition is negated).
> >
> > HTH
> >
> > Steve
> > XEmacs Project
> > GNU Mailman Project
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Re: Attribute 2xDP on video cards, can't find a description

[George N. White III]

On Tue, 24 Dec 2019 at 00:40, Ed Greshko  wrote:

> On 2019-12-24 12:22, Robert McBroom via users wrote:
> > Subject says it.  Google just gives devices no discussion.
> >
>
> I have no idea what you're asking.
>
> You want to find a Video card with 2 Display Port outputs?
>

If you want to drive two displays, Display Port

Multi-Stream Transport (MST)

is a
thing.  It requires either a display with two DP connectors (in and out) or
a
separate hub .   Linux
support for MST has had glitches
.

*The key to getting good answers is to ask good questions*



-- 
George N. White III
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Re: How to fix "dnf autoremove" on my system?

[Manuel Reimer]

On 23.12.19 22:52, Samuel Sieb wrote:
Why do you think your package database is corrupted?  If it's because of 
this autoremove issue, then you don't really have a problem.


What I want to do is to clean up my installed packages. I want to get 
rid of packages that have been left in the past while upgrading between 
releases. Especially packages that have been installed as dependency of 
long gone packages.


That's what I thought "dnf autoremove" could help with.

I think the metadata store is different between yum and dnf, so if you 
initially installed with yum, then dnf won't have all the right info.


Doesn't this make the whole idea of replacing yum with dnf a pretty bad 
thing? I thought dnf would start with the last yum database right away 
or they even share the same databases. Isn't yum just a wrapper for dnf 
on current Fedora installations?


Why are you trying to do this?  There is no easy way to mark the 
necessary packages.  It's a very manual process and somewhat specific to 
the person doing it.  Unless you have a specific concern, it's not worth 
it.


I want to clean up the system. It runs for several years now (without 
major problems) but I want to swap the hard drive with an SSD and remove 
some unused stuff before copying the system to the new drive.


I guess a good start could be to install a fresh Fedora installation in 
a virtual machine and get a list of explicitly installed packages from 
that. If I mark all these as explicitly installed on the other machine, 
I think the "autoremove" list could be way shorter.


Manuel
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