Re: opinions: backups

[Richard Shaw]

On Tue, Aug 16, 2022 at 5:23 PM Bill Cunningham 
wrote:

> On 8/16/2022 5:24 PM, Barry Scott wrote:
>
> On 16 Aug 2022, at 19:27, Neal Becker  wrote:
>
> I use borg and am very happy with it.  As Chris, I only backup /home,
> everything else is replaceable.  Oh, I occasionally make a backup of /etc
> also.
>
>
> I back /home and /etc because if I missed a config change then I need /etc
> to rebuild.
> As pointed out a list of installed packages is use full to backup as well.
> I put that info in a file in /etc.
>
> That's a good idea. I truthfully don't use users because no one but me
> uses my machine. I know everyone says use a normal user and just sudo into
> root. But all I access is in root anyway, so I just login. I too just
> backup what I want at this point. Is it safe btw to erase all the invisible
> files in the /home root directory? Bash scripts and all? I erase a few root
> scripts that applications make and send to /~ but I am very careful.
>
>Does anyone still use clonzilla or partimage? They are a bit aged.
>

I wouldn't use them for general backup purposes but clonezilla is still a
good choice when upgrading a drive.  I might consider using one of them to
back up a whole system when it's a utility or micro server, but backing up
a whole desktop system seems like a waste of disk space unless you just
have money to burn.

Thanks,
Richard
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Bill Cunningham]

On 8/16/2022 5:24 PM, Barry Scott wrote:




On 16 Aug 2022, at 19:27, Neal Becker  wrote:

I use borg and am very happy with it.  As Chris, I only backup /home, 
everything else is replaceable.  Oh, I occasionally make a backup of 
/etc also.


I back /home and /etc because if I missed a config change then I need 
/etc to rebuild.

As pointed out a list of installed packages is use full to backup as well.
I put that info in a file in /etc.

That's a good idea. I truthfully don't use users because no one but me 
uses my machine. I know everyone says use a normal user and just sudo 
into root. But all I access is in root anyway, so I just login. I too 
just backup what I want at this point. Is it safe btw to erase all the 
invisible files in the /home root directory? Bash scripts and all? I 
erase a few root scripts that applications make and send to /~ but I am 
very careful.


   Does anyone still use clonzilla or partimage? They are a bit aged.

(I keep all config in a svn repo - so should not need the /etc backup. 
But sometimes
I miss an edit that matters and the /etc backup is noise compared to 
/home).


Some times I have critical app data in /var and back that up as needed.

Barry


___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Barry Scott]

> On 16 Aug 2022, at 19:27, Neal Becker  wrote:
> 
> I use borg and am very happy with it.  As Chris, I only backup /home, 
> everything else is replaceable.  Oh, I occasionally make a backup of /etc 
> also.

I back /home and /etc because if I missed a config change then I need /etc to 
rebuild.
As pointed out a list of installed packages is use full to backup as well.
I put that info in a file in /etc.

(I keep all config in a svn repo - so should not need the /etc backup. But 
sometimes
I miss an edit that matters and the /etc backup is noise compared to /home).

Some times I have critical app data in /var and back that up as needed.

Barry



> 
> On Tue, Aug 16, 2022 at 6:05 AM Patrick O'Callaghan  > wrote:
> On Sun, 2022-08-14 at 21:04 -0500, Richard Shaw wrote:
> > On Sun, Aug 14, 2022 at 7:29 PM Cameron Simpson  > >
> > wrote:
> > 
> > > On 14Aug2022 15:22, Emmett Culley  > > >
> > > wrote:
> > > > I've been using BackupPC for many years.  It can use rsync via
> > > > ssh for
> > > > remote backups or rsync directly for local (LAN) backup.  It can
> > > > automatically dedup as well.
> > > 
> > > We had a client using BackupPC. Maybe for a single PC it works
> > > well.
> > > They were backing up several (well over 10) PCs to a NAS. It
> > > hammered
> > > the system in both I/O and CPU. Combined with some (old kernel)
> > > filesystem bugs, it would mangle the filesystem. It seems to do the
> > > rsync protocol _in Perl_ at the BackupPC end, and uses an elaborate
> > > hash-named file tree for the deduplication function. It needed a
> > > special
> > > web interface to browse/restore.
> > > 
> > > It kind of works, but does not scale.
> > > 
> > 
> > Looks like you haven't taken a look in a while.  BackupPC 3.x used a
> > perl
> > version of rsync to add the extra stuff it needed to work, but
> > BackupPC 4.x
> > (which has been released for a few years now) forked rsync to provide
> > the
> > magic. It also now uses sqlite instead of hard links to manage
> > deduplication.
> > 
> > I only backup about 6 computers but it's for a home environment. I've
> > currently got 6.36TB backed up only consuming 675GB of space.
> 
> Just for comparison, using Borg my backup info shows:
> 
> Original size  Compressed sizeDeduplicated size
>   2.91 TB  2.23 TB121.89 GB
> 
> (i.e. the actual disk usage is 121.89GB)
> 
> That currently holds 22 backup sets (monthly, weekly and daily) going
> back a couple of years.
> 
> poc
> ___
> users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org 
> 
> To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org 
> 
> Fedora Code of Conduct: 
> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ 
> 
> List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines 
> 
> List Archives: 
> https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org 
> 
> Do not reply to spam, report it: 
> https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Those who don't understand recursion are doomed to repeat it
> ___
> users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
> Fedora Code of Conduct: 
> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
> List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
> List Archives: 
> https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> Do not reply to spam, report it: 
> https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Neal Becker]

I use borg and am very happy with it.  As Chris, I only backup /home,
everything else is replaceable.  Oh, I occasionally make a backup of /etc
also.

On Tue, Aug 16, 2022 at 6:05 AM Patrick O'Callaghan 
wrote:

> On Sun, 2022-08-14 at 21:04 -0500, Richard Shaw wrote:
> > On Sun, Aug 14, 2022 at 7:29 PM Cameron Simpson 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > On 14Aug2022 15:22, Emmett Culley 
> > > wrote:
> > > > I've been using BackupPC for many years.  It can use rsync via
> > > > ssh for
> > > > remote backups or rsync directly for local (LAN) backup.  It can
> > > > automatically dedup as well.
> > >
> > > We had a client using BackupPC. Maybe for a single PC it works
> > > well.
> > > They were backing up several (well over 10) PCs to a NAS. It
> > > hammered
> > > the system in both I/O and CPU. Combined with some (old kernel)
> > > filesystem bugs, it would mangle the filesystem. It seems to do the
> > > rsync protocol _in Perl_ at the BackupPC end, and uses an elaborate
> > > hash-named file tree for the deduplication function. It needed a
> > > special
> > > web interface to browse/restore.
> > >
> > > It kind of works, but does not scale.
> > >
> >
> > Looks like you haven't taken a look in a while.  BackupPC 3.x used a
> > perl
> > version of rsync to add the extra stuff it needed to work, but
> > BackupPC 4.x
> > (which has been released for a few years now) forked rsync to provide
> > the
> > magic. It also now uses sqlite instead of hard links to manage
> > deduplication.
> >
> > I only backup about 6 computers but it's for a home environment. I've
> > currently got 6.36TB backed up only consuming 675GB of space.
>
> Just for comparison, using Borg my backup info shows:
>
> Original size  Compressed sizeDeduplicated size
>   2.91 TB  2.23 TB121.89 GB
>
> (i.e. the actual disk usage is 121.89GB)
>
> That currently holds 22 backup sets (monthly, weekly and daily) going
> back a couple of years.
>
> poc
> ___
> users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
> Fedora Code of Conduct:
> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
> List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
> List Archives:
> https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> Do not reply to spam, report it:
> https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue
>


-- 
*Those who don't understand recursion are doomed to repeat it*
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Sun, 2022-08-14 at 21:04 -0500, Richard Shaw wrote:
> On Sun, Aug 14, 2022 at 7:29 PM Cameron Simpson 
> wrote:
> 
> > On 14Aug2022 15:22, Emmett Culley 
> > wrote:
> > > I've been using BackupPC for many years.  It can use rsync via
> > > ssh for
> > > remote backups or rsync directly for local (LAN) backup.  It can
> > > automatically dedup as well.
> > 
> > We had a client using BackupPC. Maybe for a single PC it works
> > well.
> > They were backing up several (well over 10) PCs to a NAS. It
> > hammered
> > the system in both I/O and CPU. Combined with some (old kernel)
> > filesystem bugs, it would mangle the filesystem. It seems to do the
> > rsync protocol _in Perl_ at the BackupPC end, and uses an elaborate
> > hash-named file tree for the deduplication function. It needed a
> > special
> > web interface to browse/restore.
> > 
> > It kind of works, but does not scale.
> > 
> 
> Looks like you haven't taken a look in a while.  BackupPC 3.x used a
> perl
> version of rsync to add the extra stuff it needed to work, but
> BackupPC 4.x
> (which has been released for a few years now) forked rsync to provide
> the
> magic. It also now uses sqlite instead of hard links to manage
> deduplication.
> 
> I only backup about 6 computers but it's for a home environment. I've
> currently got 6.36TB backed up only consuming 675GB of space.

Just for comparison, using Borg my backup info shows:

Original size  Compressed sizeDeduplicated size
  2.91 TB  2.23 TB121.89 GB

(i.e. the actual disk usage is 121.89GB)

That currently holds 22 backup sets (monthly, weekly and daily) going
back a couple of years.

poc
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Chris Murphy]

On Mon, Aug 15, 2022, at 2:32 PM, Bill Cunningham wrote:
> On 8/15/2022 12:17 PM, Chris Murphy wrote:
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 14, 2022, at 5:08 PM, Bill Cunningham wrote:
>>> I just thought I would ask for opinions on backups that people use.
>>> I have thought about the old fashioned dump/restore; IDK if that would
>>> be good for modern use or not. My system isn't really that big. My
>>> allotted size is 30 Gig, and it's not full. There's dar and xar and
>>> fsarchiver. There's backing up with btrfs too.
>> I mainly backup just /home because I consider everything else replaceable. 
>> So for that it's

> I want to keep my valuable info and get rid of everything else. But not 
> have to go through downloading and manually running dnf every time for 
> the rpms I individually install. There's quite a few of them. Are you 
> uploading to a server online? Or copying to another partition formatted 
> with btrfs?

This command is an Intel NUC on the local network, and /srv/backups is a Btrfs 
formatted volume.

$ sudo btrfs send -p home.20220810 home.20220815 | ssh chris@fnuc.local "sudo 
btrfs receive /srv/backups/fovo/"

Although when I'm traveling it looks a bit differently because I'll use a 
locally attached USB stick:

$ sudo btrfs send -p home.20220810 home.20220815 | sudo btrfs receive 
/run/chris/backups/fovo/


Because the "root" subvolume contains everything, including logs and VM images 
if you use virt-manager, databases, it can actually go through quite a bit of 
churn. Probably more than the typical "home".

-- 
Chris Murphy
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Chris Murphy]

On Sun, Aug 14, 2022, at 5:08 PM, Bill Cunningham wrote:
> I just thought I would ask for opinions on backups that people use. 
> I have thought about the old fashioned dump/restore; IDK if that would 
> be good for modern use or not. My system isn't really that big. My 
> allotted size is 30 Gig, and it's not full. There's dar and xar and 
> fsarchiver. There's backing up with btrfs too.

I mainly backup just /home because I consider everything else replaceable. So 
for that it's

# mount /dev/nvme0n1p5 /mnt   ##mount top-level of btrfs
# cd /mnt
# btrfs sub snap -r home home.20220815
$ sudo btrfs send -p home.20220810 home.20220815 | ssh chris@fnuc.local "sudo 
btrfs receive /srv/backups/fovo/"

That's it. Incremental backup using btrfs send/receive over ssh, where 
/srv/backups/fovo is also btrfs. These are quite cheap because no deep 
traversal is required on either side. Btrfs keeps a generation number on each 
file, so it's cheap for it to locate files that differ. This cheapness also 
applies to rename and moving files, if you move a big file, most other methods 
require delete in one location and copy to another location, whereas btrfs sees 
that it's moved on the source and merely moves it on the destination.

Ok that's not entirely it. There is clean up. You can keep them around as long 
as you want with no ill impact, but when you decide to clean up, you can remove 
all the snapshots except the most recently sent, i.e. you want a common 
snapshot on the local and remote systems, in order to preserve the ability to 
do an incremental send/receive. The same goes for the remote - you can keep 
those indefinitely, limited only by space available. Or clean them up leaving 
just one in common with send and receive sides.

>
>      I am thinking about back ups of the whole system and rpms I have 
> installed. And maybe not backing up logs, old settings like are stored 
> in the root directory of the user(s) and root account.

You could also employ the same technique above to the "root" subvolume. But 
it'll include logs unless you split that out with a separate subvolume in the 
top-level along side root and home subvolumes, and add to fstab so it mounts at 
/var/log

I really don't often backup / though. What I do tend to do semi-often is 
replicate a root between systems, virtual and real. The part I like about 
send/receive here, even though it's not any faster than rsync or even cp -a, is 
that everything is preserved: permissions, owner, selinux labels, all of the 
time stamps (otime, atime, mtime, ctime); I just don't have to think about it.

I could use btrbk to help automate all of this, but what can I say, I'm a bit 
lazy and I'd have to think about it a little bit.

It really is cheap enough you could kick off a backup every 10 minutes if you 
want. It'd take a couple seconds for it to figure out what's changed and 
whether the parent snapshot is already on the destination. And then it's just 
the time to transfer the data that's changed. So for a single file changed in 
10 minutes, it could take just a couple seconds.




-- 
Chris Murphy
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Michael D. Setzer II via users]

On 14 Aug 2022 at 17:08, Bill Cunningham wrote:

Date sent:  Sun, 14 Aug 2022 17:08:23 -0400
To: users@lists.fedoraproject.org
From:   Bill Cunningham 

Subject:opinions: backups
Send reply to:  Community support for Fedora 
users 

>      I just thought I would ask for opinions on backups that people use. 
> I have thought about the old fashioned dump/restore; IDK if that would 
> be good for modern use or not. My system isn't really that big. My 
> allotted size is 30 Gig, and it's not full. There's dar and xar and 
> fsarchiver. There's backing up with btrfs too.
> 
>      I am thinking about back ups of the whole system and rpms I have 
> installed. And maybe not backing up logs, old settings like are stored 
> in the root directory of the user(s) and root account.
> 
>      Does anyone use any of these or other backups? I just want to save 
> my rpms and not have to download all from scratch. IDK if dar or dump 
> would backup things like /sys or other system directories. I have 
> created dump backups but not really restored from scratch.
> 

There have been a lot of replies, but I'll add an option 
that probable isn't a full solution. I've been the 
maintainer of G4L project on sourceforge since 2004. I 
build in on my Fedora 35 system at moment for next 
version. Last release version was built on Fedora 34. 

It is a bare metal backup system by default, making disk 
or partition backups that can be restored. Basically a dd 
image compressed using lzop or gzip. Can back to local 
disk or via network (default is ftp using ncftp). Does have 
fsarchiver include, but only tested it once. Had a user 
request adding it, so didn't and did hear it worked will for 
him. But being a bare metal backup, it copies everything. 
Clearing unused sectors before greatly reduces size of 
image. Using lzop is faster than using gzip, and image 
only slightly larger. Do a image every few months, but 
use rsync to copy critical directories between machine for  
things that need more often backups..

Recently migrated 3 machines from regular hard disk to 
ssd disk using clone option. With 1T drives it took 4 to 7 
hours, so speed is dependent on unbuffers speed. Made 
the mistake of hooking an ssd disk via a usb 2 adapter on 
the one that took 7 hours, but notebook only had 1 disk 
bay..

Kernels are built from source kernel.org, and try to 
include most disk and network controller. Boots from CD, 
or from USB, and can be added to a regular grub2 menu 
with 40_custom addition. Has a UEFI boot option, but 
haven't figured how to do a UEFI boot from grub2 setup.

Is text based using dialog screen.

Before retiring used it at college a lot. Could restore 
Windows 10 partition in about 10 minutes. Whole disk 
took about 45 minutes with Windows 10 and Fedora.
Also, used udpcast to image one system in lab to other 19 
machines using the multi-cast in about 45 minutes.

There is also G4U, Clonezilla and other similar programs.


> Bill
> 
> ___
> users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
> Fedora Code of Conduct: 
> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
> List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
> List Archives: 
> https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> Do not reply to spam, report it: 
> https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue


++
 Michael D. Setzer II - Computer Science Instructor 
(Retired) 
 mailto:mi...@guam.net
 mailto:msetze...@gmail.com
 Guam - Where America's Day Begins
 G4L Disk Imaging Project maintainer 
 http://sourceforge.net/projects/g4l/
++


___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Cameron Simpson]

On 14Aug2022 15:22, Emmett Culley  wrote:
>I've been using BackupPC for many years.  It can use rsync via ssh for 
>remote backups or rsync directly for local (LAN) backup.  It can 
>automatically dedup as well.

We had a client using BackupPC. Maybe for a single PC it works well.  
They were backing up several (well over 10) PCs to a NAS. It hammered 
the system in both I/O and CPU. Combined with some (old kernel) 
filesystem bugs, it would mangle the filesystem. It seems to do the 
rsync protocol _in Perl_ at the BackupPC end, and uses an elaborate 
hash-named file tree for the deduplication function. It needed a special 
web interface to browse/restore.

It kind of works, but does not scale.

Now we use histbackup (disclaimer: a script of my own similar in use and 
implementation to rsnapshot). The backups are MUCH faster and we haven't 
had the (again, ancient kernel) filesystem bugs at all. because even 
though we run the backups in series, it is still much faster.

Basic scheme is:
- a directory per target (machine:subdir)
- timestampted hardlinked subtrees in each of the targets
Hardlink the previous backup to a new tree for today's backup, rsync 
from the target into the new tree.

rsnapshot does the same kind of thing and modern rsync even has a mode 
to do the "new hard link tree and sync" part of this as a command line 
switch.

The trees are just... directory trees you can cd around in etc.

We NFS export them from the NAS read only so they can be directly 
browsed. Because its NFS, the UIDs etc are identical and therefore 
people can't brwose stuff they can't browse in the live filesystems 
anyway.

These days I use this script:
https://github.com/cameron-simpson/css/blob/main/bin-cs/run-backups
for my personal backups. I'm usually prepared to rebuilt an utterly 
failed machine instead of restoring an OS from backup.

Cheers,
Cameron Simpson 
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Emmett Culley via users]

On 8/14/22 2:08 PM, Bill Cunningham wrote:

     I just thought I would ask for opinions on backups that people use. I have 
thought about the old fashioned dump/restore; IDK if that would be good for 
modern use or not. My system isn't really that big. My allotted size is 30 Gig, 
and it's not full. There's dar and xar and fsarchiver. There's backing up with 
btrfs too.

     I am thinking about back ups of the whole system and rpms I have 
installed. And maybe not backing up logs, old settings like are stored in the 
root directory of the user(s) and root account.

     Does anyone use any of these or other backups? I just want to save my rpms 
and not have to download all from scratch. IDK if dar or dump would backup 
things like /sys or other system directories. I have created dump backups but 
not really restored from scratch.

Bill


I've been using BackupPC for many years.  It can use rsync via ssh for remote 
backups or rsync directly for local (LAN) backup.  It can automatically dedup 
as well.

I use it to do daily incremental backups and weekly full backups for 12 
systems, Four locally and eight remotely.  A couple of years ago my workshop, 
office and server room was destroyed in a fire.  Because I had recent backups I 
was able to get the four servers I lost back on-line and fully functional after 
only a single day scrambling to get new hardware and rebuild the backup server. 
 Note that I send compressed archive copies to a remote server and that is what 
I used to restore the primary backup server.
 
I have never had a problem with backups and have successfully restored complete servers and individual filesor  directories for many years.  My current primary backup server is running on CentOS 7 and has been since CentOS 7 was first available, and on CentOS 6 before that.  My secondary backup server is on my local Fedora workstation.


I'll be building a new backup server, probably on Rocky Linux 9, soon.  I 
cannot imagine using anything but BackupPC.

As for you wanting to backup your system's RPM files, BackupPC can be 
configured to backup an entire server or workstation, or only parts of them 
including individual files.  For example I backup only /etc, /home and a few 
other critical directories on four servers, and for each of them I cause a 
daily database dump and create a list of packages currently installed, that 
also get backed up.  It can take longer to restore those servers, but as they 
are not critical infrastructure, I wouldn't matter much if they were down for a 
day or two while we procure and rebuild those servers.

https://backuppc.github.io/backuppc/

Emmett

___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Patrick O'Callaghan]

On Sun, 2022-08-14 at 17:08 -0400, Bill Cunningham wrote:
>  I just thought I would ask for opinions on backups that people
> use. 
> I have thought about the old fashioned dump/restore; IDK if that
> would 
> be good for modern use or not. My system isn't really that big. My 
> allotted size is 30 Gig, and it's not full. There's dar and xar and 
> fsarchiver. There's backing up with btrfs too.
> 
>  I am thinking about back ups of the whole system and rpms I have
> installed. And maybe not backing up logs, old settings like are
> stored 
> in the root directory of the user(s) and root account.
> 
>  Does anyone use any of these or other backups? I just want to
> save 
> my rpms and not have to download all from scratch. IDK if dar or dump
> would backup things like /sys or other system directories. I have 
> created dump backups but not really restored from scratch.

I used to use rsnapshot, which is basically a front-end to rsync, and
it worked pretty well. Nowadays I use BorgBackup because it does
compression and de-duplication. My backup device is a pair of old HDDs
mounted on a USB3 dock and formatted as a BTRFS filesystem with Raid-1.

poc
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Tom Horsley]

On Sun, 14 Aug 2022 17:08:23 -0400
Bill Cunningham wrote:

> Does anyone use any of these or other backups?

My main backup is rsyncing everything to a big old NAS I put together
from an old PC and truenas software. I use the --link-dest option
to get a complete copy of everything on every backup (with 99% of it
just being hard links to the previous days backup).

Unless you are on dial up or something, the least of your problems
will be re-downloading all the rpms. I just keep a list of rpms
using:

 rpm -q --qf "%{NAME}.%{ARCH}\n" -a > f36-rpms.txt

and update it every day on cron (and that list gets backed up
along with everything else).
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Geoffrey Leach]

On Sun, 14 Aug 2022 17:08:23 -0400
Bill Cunningham  wrote:

>      I just thought I would ask for opinions on backups that people
> use. I have thought about the old fashioned dump/restore; IDK if that
> would be good for modern use or not. My system isn't really that big.
> My allotted size is 30 Gig, and it's not full. There's dar and xar
> and fsarchiver. There's backing up with btrfs too.
> 
>      I am thinking about back ups of the whole system and rpms I have 
> installed. And maybe not backing up logs, old settings like are
> stored in the root directory of the user(s) and root account.
> 
>      Does anyone use any of these or other backups? I just want to
> save my rpms and not have to download all from scratch. IDK if dar or
> dump would backup things like /sys or other system directories. I
> have created dump backups but not really restored from scratch.
> 
rsync with directory-specific excludes. All directories to be backed-up
in their own partitions, so as to avoid rpm-loaded code, which can 
be restored from the web.
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

Re: opinions: backups

[Barry]

> On 14 Aug 2022, at 22:08, Bill Cunningham  wrote:
> 
> I just thought I would ask for opinions on backups that people use. I 
> have thought about the old fashioned dump/restore; IDK if that would be good 
> for modern use or not. My system isn't really that big. My allotted size is 
> 30 Gig, and it's not full. There's dar and xar and fsarchiver. There's 
> backing up with btrfs too.
> 
> I am thinking about back ups of the whole system and rpms I have 
> installed. And maybe not backing up logs, old settings like are stored in the 
> root directory of the user(s) and root account.
> 
> Does anyone use any of these or other backups? I just want to save my 
> rpms and not have to download all from scratch. IDK if dar or dump would 
> backup things like /sys or other system directories. I have created dump 
> backups but not really restored from scratch.

Have a look at duplicity, it works well.
I use it to back from to my file server.
You can use it to run frequently, I run it every hour.
That provides Mac like time machine features.

Barry

> 
> Bill
> 
> ___
> users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
> Fedora Code of Conduct: 
> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
> List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
> List Archives: 
> https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
> Do not reply to spam, report it: 
> https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue
___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

opinions: backups

[Bill Cunningham]

    I just thought I would ask for opinions on backups that people use. 
I have thought about the old fashioned dump/restore; IDK if that would 
be good for modern use or not. My system isn't really that big. My 
allotted size is 30 Gig, and it's not full. There's dar and xar and 
fsarchiver. There's backing up with btrfs too.


    I am thinking about back ups of the whole system and rpms I have 
installed. And maybe not backing up logs, old settings like are stored 
in the root directory of the user(s) and root account.


    Does anyone use any of these or other backups? I just want to save 
my rpms and not have to download all from scratch. IDK if dar or dump 
would backup things like /sys or other system directories. I have 
created dump backups but not really restored from scratch.


Bill

___
users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org
To unsubscribe send an email to users-le...@lists.fedoraproject.org
Fedora Code of Conduct: 
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
List Archives: 
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Do not reply to spam, report it: 
https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue