Re: [VFB] More or Less? add 'D'

2015-10-29 Thread Michael Bliss
Don,

I like the idea but maybe a simplification to it would suit me better.  I
can buy my license on-line.  No need to wait in lines anymore.  Not sure
about the other states but it is coming.  How about an on-line test with
links to find the right answer but you would have to read.  Some simple
videos could be made to show right and wrongs with questions after.  Simple
and cheap (maybe)

Mike

On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 5:41 PM, Ed Roden  wrote:

> Excellent!
>
>
> On Wednesday, October 28, 2015, Don Ordes  wrote:
>
>> *A balance of A & B,* and *education* for the newly interested- not only
>> in fly-fishing and fly-tying, but in stream/lake/water etiquette (including
>> manners).  Greed seems to be the root of many evils, and it’s partner is
>> selfishness. We need both growth and control, and there may be a way.
>>
>> ‘River rage’ has become like road-rage. Too many people with un-relieved
>> stresses (and medications) floating a river to relieve stress and then a
>> few adding stress to everyone else they cross paths with. Bad mix with some
>> bad experiences and then people start packing things besides lunches.
>>
>> *A thought for some yay or nay consideration?*
>> *‘D’*   Should fly-fishing have a special fishing license *sticker*
>> (like a conservation sticker) that gives the holder *added fishing
>> privileges* when fly-fishing (as in C&R only areas or floating rivers),
>> but in return requiring a mandatory education class (water safety, laws and
>> etiquette, C&R practice) to go along with it, and before any technical
>> training like casting.
>>
>> *Necessity-* Waters are over-crowded with regular fisherpersons, along
>> with uneducated people or people without self-control and bad manners. Some
>> fishermen drink to excess before fishing and lose judgment abilities while
>> on the water (even wading a stream).
>> *Reasoning-* Hunters get a hunting course to get a hunting stamp to
>> carry a gun. Fishermen are also arming themselves- whether for self defense
>> or to prove a point. Different world.
>> *Benefit-:*
>> *First,* may serve as a screening or weeding-out process to refine the
>> ranks of fly-fishers.
>> *Second,* would serve to educate fly-fisherpersons, and give them pride
>> of distinction and an awareness of good manners.
>> *Third,* would give them something to lose if they cross the line and
>> get caught (or get reported). Having your fly-fishing tag revoked would be
>> for guides and fishers alike, and could motivate people to be more civil
>> and act more responsibly.
>> *Fourth-* Would add jobs and services to the fly shops ($$), plus the
>> responsibility of refining the growing ranks that they need for business,
>> while relieving some of the problems encountered in the field. Does no good
>> to grow the ranks if you also grow the problem. Shops benefit and have the
>> responsibility.
>> *Fifth-* Shops would adopt some policies to help out *in return* for the
>> business benefits they receive by growing the ranks, namely some things
>> that help with the over-crowding (and problems) created by the growing
>> ranks. Along with fishing reports could be a fisherman number report,
>> giving some crowding statistics and recommended windows of opportunity. As
>> the ranks grow and hostilities flare, this may become a necessity. And if
>> over-crowding is normal, like on season-opening day, fishers know what to
>> expect and are educated.
>> *State Game and Fish involvement?* To be discussed.
>> *Federal Involvement*- none. State issues.
>> *The guiding industry* -many times based out of shops, but not always.
>> They add to the problem by bringing clients into other systems (rather than
>> home waters) that are already over-crowded.
>>
>> *Counter-point*- another cost and regulation in an already regulated,
>> expensive hobby.
>>
>> *Would the good outweigh the bad?* Hunters have to do it- why not
>> fly-fishers? What about lure and bait-chuckers? Should they educate and
>> stamp up to the plate?  ug...
>>
>> I also believe that if you’re going to benefit financially from this
>> sport industry, you also have an interest and responsibility to grow it
>> responsibly, or lose clients. Stamps would be a way to provide for some of
>> the cost of education, which is never a bad thing.
>>
>> Again, *two sides*- *your thoughts*?  (I’d spring for the sticker if it
>> was a state requirement.)
>>
>> DonO
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Neville Gosling
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2015 3:03 PM
>>

Re: [VFB] More or Less? add 'D'

2015-10-29 Thread Ed Roden
Excellent!

On Wednesday, October 28, 2015, Don Ordes  wrote:

> *A balance of A & B,* and *education* for the newly interested- not only
> in fly-fishing and fly-tying, but in stream/lake/water etiquette (including
> manners).  Greed seems to be the root of many evils, and it’s partner is
> selfishness. We need both growth and control, and there may be a way.
>
> ‘River rage’ has become like road-rage. Too many people with un-relieved
> stresses (and medications) floating a river to relieve stress and then a
> few adding stress to everyone else they cross paths with. Bad mix with some
> bad experiences and then people start packing things besides lunches.
>
> *A thought for some yay or nay consideration?*
> *‘D’*   Should fly-fishing have a special fishing license *sticker* (like
> a conservation sticker) that gives the holder *added fishing privileges*
> when fly-fishing (as in C&R only areas or floating rivers), but in return
> requiring a mandatory education class (water safety, laws and etiquette,
> C&R practice) to go along with it, and before any technical training like
> casting.
>
> *Necessity-* Waters are over-crowded with regular fisherpersons, along
> with uneducated people or people without self-control and bad manners. Some
> fishermen drink to excess before fishing and lose judgment abilities while
> on the water (even wading a stream).
> *Reasoning-* Hunters get a hunting course to get a hunting stamp to carry
> a gun. Fishermen are also arming themselves- whether for self defense or to
> prove a point. Different world.
> *Benefit-:*
> *First,* may serve as a screening or weeding-out process to refine the
> ranks of fly-fishers.
> *Second,* would serve to educate fly-fisherpersons, and give them pride
> of distinction and an awareness of good manners.
> *Third,* would give them something to lose if they cross the line and get
> caught (or get reported). Having your fly-fishing tag revoked would be for
> guides and fishers alike, and could motivate people to be more civil and
> act more responsibly.
> *Fourth-* Would add jobs and services to the fly shops ($$), plus the
> responsibility of refining the growing ranks that they need for business,
> while relieving some of the problems encountered in the field. Does no good
> to grow the ranks if you also grow the problem. Shops benefit and have the
> responsibility.
> *Fifth-* Shops would adopt some policies to help out *in return* for the
> business benefits they receive by growing the ranks, namely some things
> that help with the over-crowding (and problems) created by the growing
> ranks. Along with fishing reports could be a fisherman number report,
> giving some crowding statistics and recommended windows of opportunity. As
> the ranks grow and hostilities flare, this may become a necessity. And if
> over-crowding is normal, like on season-opening day, fishers know what to
> expect and are educated.
> *State Game and Fish involvement?* To be discussed.
> *Federal Involvement*- none. State issues.
> *The guiding industry* -many times based out of shops, but not always.
> They add to the problem by bringing clients into other systems (rather than
> home waters) that are already over-crowded.
>
> *Counter-point*- another cost and regulation in an already regulated,
> expensive hobby.
>
> *Would the good outweigh the bad?* Hunters have to do it- why not
> fly-fishers? What about lure and bait-chuckers? Should they educate and
> stamp up to the plate?  ug...
>
> I also believe that if you’re going to benefit financially from this sport
> industry, you also have an interest and responsibility to grow it
> responsibly, or lose clients. Stamps would be a way to provide for some of
> the cost of education, which is never a bad thing.
>
> Again, *two sides*- *your thoughts*?  (I’d spring for the sticker if it
> was a state requirement.)
>
> DonO
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Neville Gosling
> Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2015 3:03 PM
> To: VFB
> Subject: [VFB] More or Less?
>
> Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time
> and dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
> a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number
> one priority.
> b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not
> merrier.
> c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs
> for more solitude.
>
>
> Neville (Nev) Gosling
>
> I was wishin’ I was fishin’
>
>
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the "VFB Mail"
> group.
>
> To post to this group, send email to vfb-mail@googlegroups.com
> 
&g

Re: [VFB] More or Less? add 'D'

2015-10-28 Thread Don Ordes
A balance of A & B, and education for the newly interested- not only in 
fly-fishing and fly-tying, but in stream/lake/water etiquette (including 
manners).  Greed seems to be the root of many evils, and it’s partner is 
selfishness. We need both growth and control, and there may be a way.

‘River rage’ has become like road-rage. Too many people with un-relieved 
stresses (and medications) floating a river to relieve stress and then a few 
adding stress to everyone else they cross paths with. Bad mix with some bad 
experiences and then people start packing things besides lunches.

A thought for some yay or nay consideration?
‘D’   Should fly-fishing have a special fishing license sticker (like a 
conservation sticker) that gives the holder added fishing privileges when 
fly-fishing (as in C&R only areas or floating rivers), but in return requiring 
a mandatory education class (water safety, laws and etiquette, C&R practice) to 
go along with it, and before any technical training like casting.

Necessity- Waters are over-crowded with regular fisherpersons, along with 
uneducated people or people without self-control and bad manners. Some 
fishermen drink to excess before fishing and lose judgment abilities while on 
the water (even wading a stream). 
Reasoning- Hunters get a hunting course to get a hunting stamp to carry a gun. 
Fishermen are also arming themselves- whether for self defense or to prove a 
point. Different world.
Benefit-:
First, may serve as a screening or weeding-out process to refine the ranks of 
fly-fishers.
Second, would serve to educate fly-fisherpersons, and give them pride of 
distinction and an awareness of good manners.
Third, would give them something to lose if they cross the line and get caught 
(or get reported). Having your fly-fishing tag revoked would be for guides and 
fishers alike, and could motivate people to be more civil and act more 
responsibly. 
Fourth- Would add jobs and services to the fly shops ($$), plus the 
responsibility of refining the growing ranks that they need for business, while 
relieving some of the problems encountered in the field. Does no good to grow 
the ranks if you also grow the problem. Shops benefit and have the 
responsibility.
Fifth- Shops would adopt some policies to help out in return for the business 
benefits they receive by growing the ranks, namely some things that help with 
the over-crowding (and problems) created by the growing ranks. Along with 
fishing reports could be a fisherman number report, giving some crowding 
statistics and recommended windows of opportunity. As the ranks grow and 
hostilities flare, this may become a necessity. And if over-crowding is normal, 
like on season-opening day, fishers know what to expect and are educated.
State Game and Fish involvement? To be discussed.
Federal Involvement- none. State issues.
The guiding industry -many times based out of shops, but not always. They add 
to the problem by bringing clients into other systems (rather than home waters) 
that are already over-crowded.

Counter-point- another cost and regulation in an already regulated, expensive 
hobby.

Would the good outweigh the bad? Hunters have to do it- why not fly-fishers? 
What about lure and bait-chuckers? Should they educate and stamp up to the 
plate?  ug...

I also believe that if you’re going to benefit financially from this sport 
industry, you also have an interest and responsibility to grow it responsibly, 
or lose clients. Stamps would be a way to provide for some of the cost of 
education, which is never a bad thing.

Again, two sides- your thoughts?  (I’d spring for the sticker if it was a state 
requirement.) 

DonO


-Original Message- 
From: Neville Gosling 
Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2015 3:03 PM 
To: VFB 
Subject: [VFB] More or Less? 

Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time and 
dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number one 
priority.
b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not merrier.
c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs for 
more solitude.


Neville (Nev) Gosling

I was wishin’ I was fishin’



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Re: [VFB] More or Less?

2015-10-28 Thread Woodenlegs
A

On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 4:03 PM, Neville Gosling 
wrote:

> Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time
> and dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
> a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number
> one priority.
> b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not
> merrier.
> c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs
> for more solitude.
>
>
> Neville (Nev) Gosling
>
> I was wishin’ I was fishin’
>
>
>
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Re: [VFB] More or Less?

2015-10-28 Thread 'Rick Zieger' via VFB Mail
a.   I don't see a lot of younger fly fishes.  
Rick 
   From: Neville Gosling 
 To: VFB  
 Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2015 4:03 PM
 Subject: [VFB] More or Less?
   
Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time and 
dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number one 
priority.
b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not merrier.
c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs for 
more solitude.


Neville (Nev) Gosling

I was wishin’ I was fishin’



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Re: [VFB] More or Less?

2015-10-28 Thread 'Anthony Spezio' via VFB Mail
When all the outdoor magazines raved about the Trout fishing here on the White 
the bait chuckers came in droves,They litterly ruined the river. I like to see 
more Flyfishers that would accept things as they are.The river is now 
overcrowded and a lot of dead fish on the bottom from poor catch and release 
methods.Tony 


 On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 7:19 AM, Ed Roden  
wrote:
   

 I will add a d. Individuals such as us can grow the sport more effectively. 
Take somebody fishing today!
Ed Roden
Email: flyfished at gmail dot comTwitter: @flyfishedmittenstateangler.com
Henrietta Lange: The true test of a commander is when he is as frightened and 
confused as those who look up to him. In that moment, when you can't find it in 
yourself, you will find it in them. That's leadership.
On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 5:03 PM, Neville Gosling  wrote:

Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time and 
dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number one 
priority.
b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not merrier.
c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs for 
more solitude.


Neville (Nev) Gosling

I was wishin’ I was fishin’



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Re: [VFB] More or Less?

2015-10-28 Thread Ed Roden
I will add a d. Individuals such as us can grow the sport more effectively.
Take somebody fishing today!

Ed Roden
Email: flyfished at gmail dot com
Twitter: @flyfished
mittenstateangler.com

Henrietta Lange: The true test of a commander is when he is as frightened
and confused as those who look up to him. In that moment, when you can't
find it in yourself, you will find it in them. That's leadership.

On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 5:03 PM, Neville Gosling 
wrote:

> Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time
> and dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
> a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number
> one priority.
> b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not
> merrier.
> c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs
> for more solitude.
>
>
> Neville (Nev) Gosling
>
> I was wishin’ I was fishin’
>
>
>
> --
> --
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> group.
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Re: [VFB] More or Less?

2015-10-27 Thread Michael Bliss
I know that I am bad but "B"

On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 3:03 PM, Neville Gosling 
wrote:

> Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time
> and dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
> a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number
> one priority.
> b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not
> merrier.
> c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs
> for more solitude.
>
>
> Neville (Nev) Gosling
>
> I was wishin’ I was fishin’
>
>
>
> --
> --
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> group.
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-- 
Mike Bliss

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Re: [VFB] More or Less?

2015-10-27 Thread Phxflytyer
Nev:

Since I work at Bass Pro, I find that more then half of the people that come in 
to the Fly Shop want to learn how to fly fish. Another 25% are experienced and 
come in for replacement items and the rest are what we call" Looky-loos. 
Even the Look-loos are told that we can teach them when they are ready to learn.

Most people think that casting is too complicated. 
I stand at the front of the shop when we are not busy, casting a fly rod 
demonstrating how easy it can be.
People stand and watch and can't believe how easy it really is.


Sent from my iPad

Thank You,
Alan Di Somma
Phoenix, AZ.

Some mistakes are just too much fun to make only once.



> On Oct 27, 2015, at 2:03 PM, Neville Gosling  wrote:
> 
> Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time 
> and dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
> a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number one 
> priority.
> b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not 
> merrier.
> c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs for 
> more solitude.
> 
> 
> Neville (Nev) Gosling
> 
> I was wishin’ I was fishin’
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
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Re: [VFB] More or Less?

2015-10-27 Thread Donna Crowell
A

 Donna...

On Tue, Oct 27, 2015 at 5:03 PM, Neville Gosling 
wrote:

> Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time
> and dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
> a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number
> one priority.
> b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not
> merrier.
> c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs
> for more solitude.
>
>
> Neville (Nev) Gosling
>
> I was wishin’ I was fishin’
>
>
>
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[VFB] More or Less?

2015-10-27 Thread Neville Gosling
Do you think the fly fishing industry, as a whole, should invest more time and 
dollars into recruiting new participants to the sport of fly fishing?
a. Absolutely. We need more people fishing, and that should be our number one 
priority.
b. Absolutely not. The waters are crowded enough as it is. More is not merrier.
c. The business owner in me says grow the sport; the angler in me longs for 
more solitude.


Neville (Nev) Gosling

I was wishin’ I was fishin’



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