[Vo]:chromium and helium
I need some advice and help. I've identified a possibility that Chromium may be important in some of the water fuel and hydrogen boosting work. Its not provn yet but we need tests to check a few variables. * I need a test for chromium (III) in solution. * I need a test for chromium (VI) a known carcinagenic form of chromium. Just to make sure the back yard experimentors are not at risk. * There is a possibility that one of these technologies is a cold fusion cell, nickel light water. We need a test for helium in the exhaust. We need to build the equivilent of a flow calorimeterfor a HHO. It all needs to be reasonably cheap because the HHO people aren't rich. I'm broke. :-( And yes I am considdering the blacklight process.
[Vo]:google 10^100th
Some will know that Google is running a competition where people submit ideas for world changing projects and the top ten projects get funding from them. I have 5 submissions in. http://www.project10tothe100.com/index.html * A perennial polyculture harvester for grains that are not dried on the stem. The wet green grain, seeds etc is wet processed directly into noodles, textured protein or pellets on the machine. Millions of tons of crops are lost because they don't dry for harvest. It also allows many grass species that are rich foods but not yet domestic grain to become new foods. Most can't be harvested using current technologies. Perennial polycultures protect and nurture the soil much more than annual grains. * Farming the sea with a system using floating plastic ponds with buoyant water plants growing in fresh fertilized water. Some have seen my page on that: http://www.geocities.com/vacoyecology/Bubble_ponds_fluke_boats.html * A free market way to create millions of hectares of private wilderness parks, endangered species habitat and wildlife corridors sparsely occupied cemeteries. One to ten graves per hectare instead of one grave every metre of path. The deceased would buy on a Funeral plan and some of the money would be banked so the interest could cover maintenance. * A farm scale air well that condenses water from the air using solar power, cheap materials and cheap heat pumps. Not quite water for every farm but it would drought proof some farms and provide enough water and emergency irrigated feed to keep breading stock and orchards going in a drought. * A radical idea to have all government departments, programs etc listed as tax deductible charities and to make the donations to them anonymous. This creates something like a fiscal free market. I allocate my tax as I please and the parliament goes back to being a house of review with out the pork barrel and endless fighting. Anything I have missed or ignored is covered by others or by the remaining general revenue. It's proposed as an experiment at the local government level. I have a web page covering the same concept at all levels. http://www.geocities.com/vacoyecology/PAYERDFS.html Not sure they will win but its worth a try. I believe that while there's only 10 prizes that hundreds of the projects will be taken up because the projects are so public.
Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?
Robin When Mills talks about an energy hole he is *not* talking about a missing electron as in a hole in a semi-conductor. He simply means an energy sink or sump (like a hole in the ground). What you are saying then is that he may be employing a fairly well-known term of physics in a non-scientific way to shoehorn a result into a theory. Problem is - physicists have spent a lot of time on the imaginary particle called the hole and the analysis all revolves around applied electric fields to positively charged holes which can be modeled using Coulomb's law etc. When you start adding or removing non-electron specific energy (heat), the result is a less effective electrical theory since heat can be removed in very small quanta independently of electrons. Essentially there is little predictive value which I can see to the 27.2 eV in the expanded instance where heat or other energy (acceleration) can added or subtracted in order to make a fit (deeper hole for instance) - and this is probably why Ed thinks it is basically a hit-or-miss situation. This is probably why Mills in the previous decade never seriously considered sodium, and it also could mean that if you find a metal that forms an electron hole at say 27.8 eV (copper++ ?) which is not close enough by itself, then you might be able to manufacture a better fit by cooling the experiment - or alternatively in other cases apply acceleration to increase the sink. Matter of fact - makes one wonder if a Farnswoth Fusor, made with a copper spherical electrode, would perfom better (produce more neutrons) if it were kept at cryogenic temps. Jones
Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?
The Mills interpretation does not make chemical sense. Normally, NaH decomposes into H2 and Na metal when this happens at high temperature. This is an ionic bonded compound, which means the bonding electron moves from an orbit main associated with H to an orbit mainly associated with Na. Decomposition causes a reverse of this situation. What extraordinary event or process would change this expected and observed process? It is not logical to assume an event just because it is required to fit your theory. Like the requirement in cold fusion, the process used to explain the process must also be observed and be consistent with events not associated with the phenomenon. Regards, Ed On Oct 23, 2008, at 4:23 PM, Robin van Spaandonk wrote: In reply to Mike Carrell's message of Thu, 23 Oct 2008 15:48:33 -0400: Hi, [snip] There is something much simpler. NaH is formed by reactions given from NaOH coating of the R-Ni and heating. At some point the NaH decomposes, releasing Na and H atoms in close proximity, whereby Na++ then catalyses the H producing H[1/3]. There are aspects of this which puzzle me. [snip] According to Randy, the NaH decomposes directly in Na+++ + H[1/3] + 3e- . Na++ is not a catalyst. (The ionization energy is 71.641 eV). In going from H[1] to H[1/3] the H requires an energy hole of 54.4. eV. This is the sum of the first and second ionization energies of Na (5.1391 eV 47.286 eV resp.) and the energy required to break NaH into atoms (about 1.98 eV). IOW the molecule can decompose directly into the final products, and in so doing provides its own energy hole. This is probably why it is so effective (the coupling is all internal within the molecule). BTW the whole hydrino reaction actually produces 108.8 eV, so the difference between the total energy released and the energy hole (54.4 eV) will likely be released as additional kinetic energy IMO. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?
One more 'flash from the past' on Robin's mention of an energy sink being like a hole in the ground. (how quickly we forget) This might also serve as some insight wrt Ed's comment. There is a geometric dimension to a 27.2 eV 'hole' if one wishes to consider the wavelength of UV photon radiation at this level. Methinks it is about 46 nm - which is well within the capability of micro-lithography at chip labs these days. Could it be that the Raney nickel being used was chosen, inadvertently or specifically - to have an average pore size near this dimension (46 nm) ? If so, then this makes a lot more sense as a package or as a system which can be scaled up - as this gives you the first level of 'shrinkage' very cheaply so to speak ... simply apply a positive charge to a geometric hole instead of 'manufacturing' one. And it could well be that after the first redundant level has been reached without recourse to adding massive amounts of energy, that everything works much smoother thereafter. The really interesting thing, from the perspective of LENR is that if it a geometric hole of this size (46 nm) works for protium, then it should also work for deuterium and could possibly increase the reaction rate when there is Pd in there instead of NaH. Why? Well for one thing - since the atomic volume of the deuteron is reduced by a factor of 8 (the cube of halving the diameter) then as much as 8 times more deuterium should fit into a Pd matrix (than normal) and there is evidence that higher loading is more active. This might also favor titanium instead of Pd as the active matrix - since its lower loading level would not be the limiting factor it is now, and since it is much cheaper. Plus - it is also possible that the Raney metal alone will be very active with deuterium. Mills may have opened a Pandora's box of LENR sectrets. Jones
Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?
On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 11:03 AM, Jones Beene [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mills may have opened a Pandora's box of LENR sectrets. SECTrets? If this was unintentional, you might want to keep an eye on your subconscious. And why not? Your printer is watching you: http://www.boingboing.net/2008/10/23/howto-read-the-secre.html Terry
Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?
Ha! Yes I saw with horror that my spell checker had failed me once again, but too late to change things g Not sure what exactly - the subconscious 'bleed' is related-to: sect sextet or even sex although I'm pretty sure which one uncle Siggy would choose... - Original Message From: Terry Blanton [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 11:03 AM, Jones Beene [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mills may have opened a Pandora's box of LENR sectrets. SECTrets? If this was unintentional, you might want to keep an eye on your subconscious. And why not? Your printer is watching you: http://www.boingboing.net/2008/10/23/howto-read-the-secre.html Terry
[Vo]:Electron Power Systems Technology
http://www.electronpowersystems.com/Technology.htm
Re: [Vo]:chromium and helium
Unequivocal production of helium is difficult to detect because it is present in trace amounts in the atmosphere. Detection will not be cheap unless you can produce it by the baloon-full. Mike Carrell - Original Message - From: Wesley Bruce [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Sent: Friday, October 24, 2008 5:55 AM Subject: [Vo]:chromium and helium I need some advice and help. I've identified a possibility that Chromium may be important in some of the water fuel and hydrogen boosting work. Its not provn yet but we need tests to check a few variables. * I need a test for chromium (III) in solution. * I need a test for chromium (VI) a known carcinagenic form of chromium. Just to make sure the back yard experimentors are not at risk. * There is a possibility that one of these technologies is a cold fusion cell, nickel light water. We need a test for helium in the exhaust. We need to build the equivilent of a flow calorimeterfor a HHO. It all needs to be reasonably cheap because the HHO people aren't rich. I'm broke. :-( And yes I am considdering the blacklight process. This Email has been scanned for all viruses by Medford Leas I.T. Department.
Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?
To: Robin van Spaandonk Jones Beene Ed Storms Scott Little [and lurkers] This has been a very useful discussion. If you have not done so, I recommend downloading http://www.blacklightpower.com/papers/WFC102308WebS.pdf and printing pages 10-14 and 48. Figure 7 on p48 is a scan of NaH using Differential Scanning Clorimetry. It is most instructive. At 350 C there is endothermic decompoisition of NaH. Beginning at 640 C is a very strong exothermic reaction, which I think is conventionally unexpected. The NaH was in 760 Torr He. The reactions involved in the test cell are complex, and discussed on pp 10-12, equations 23-35. The next-to-bottom paragraph of p11 is specially interesting. NaH apparently qulaifies as a catalyst because heating can intiate a reaction resulting in H[1/3] which is a hydrino catalyst. It still is not clear to me where the 54.35 eV for ionizing Na to catalyze H comes from. However, the exothermic reaction of Fig 7 stands as an experimental fact which must be dealt with. There is a lot going on here, which is why I suggest study of this paper. The magnitude of the energy release and power exceeds all LENR experiments [except possibly accidents, which are not repeatable]. Mike Carrell
Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?
In reply to Jones Beene's message of Fri, 24 Oct 2008 07:25:36 -0700 (PDT): Hi, [snip] Robin When Mills talks about an energy hole he is *not* talking about a missing electron as in a hole in a semi-conductor. He simply means an energy sink or sump (like a hole in the ground). What you are saying then is that he may be employing a fairly well-known term of physics in a non-scientific way to shoehorn a result into a theory. I agree that the choice of term was not particularly wise, however he has been using it since the beginning, so it isn't true that he is depending upon it to shoehorn a result into a theory. Problem is - physicists have spent a lot of time on the imaginary particle called the hole and the analysis all revolves around applied electric fields to positively charged holes which can be modeled using Coulomb's law etc. When you start adding or removing non-electron specific energy (heat), the result is a less effective electrical theory since heat can be removed in very small quanta independently of electrons. Essentially there is little predictive value which I can see to the 27.2 eV in the expanded instance where heat or other energy (acceleration) can added or subtracted in order to make a fit (deeper hole for instance) - and this is probably why Ed thinks it is basically a hit-or-miss situation. Mills has from the beginning said that kinetic energy of the particles can make slight adjustments to the specific energy of a given energy hole in order to ensure a perfect match. IOW the resonance condition is only satisfied when a perfect match occurs, but that is never the case for any of the Mills catalysts. That's why small kinetic energy adjustments make the reaction work anyway. The fact that there is a distribution of particle energies in any substance, means that there are always a few that have just the right energy to compensate for the slight mismatch between the required energy sink size, and the actual size provided by the catalyst. This is probably why Mills in the previous decade never seriously considered sodium, and it also could mean that if you find a metal that forms an electron hole at say 27.8 eV (copper++ ?) which is not close enough by itself, then you might be able to manufacture a better fit by cooling the experiment - or alternatively in other cases apply acceleration to increase the sink. See above. Matter of fact - makes one wonder if a Farnswoth Fusor, made with a copper spherical electrode, would perfom better (produce more neutrons) if it were kept at cryogenic temps. I have 20.292 eV for the second ionization energy of Cu, and 36.83 eV for the third. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Vo]:Interesting blog in BLP process
One of the more interesting (even rational) blogs I've recently read on BLP's recent announcements. see: http://pipeline.corante.com/archives/2008/10/24/blacklight_power_responds.php Derek Lowe, the blogger, remains skeptical, but is still interested in seeing what what develops. FROM Derek Lowe: ...An Arkansan by birth, got his BA from Hendrix College and his PhD in organic chemistry from Duke before spending time in Germany on a Humboldt Fellowship on his post-doc. He's worked for several major pharmaceutical companies since 1989 on drug discovery projects against schizophrenia, Alzheimer's, diabetes, osteoporosis and other diseases. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?
In reply to Mike Carrell's message of Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:54:12 -0400: Hi, [snip] To: Robin van Spaandonk Jones Beene Ed Storms Scott Little [and lurkers] This has been a very useful discussion. If you have not done so, I recommend downloading http://www.blacklightpower.com/papers/WFC102308WebS.pdf and printing pages 10-14 and 48. Figure 7 on p48 is a scan of NaH using Differential Scanning Clorimetry. It is most instructive. At 350 C there is endothermic decompoisition of NaH. Beginning at 640 C is a very strong exothermic reaction, which I think is conventionally unexpected. The NaH was in 760 Torr He. This is unfortunate given that He+ is also a catalyst. The reactions involved in the test cell are complex, and discussed on pp 10-12, equations 23-35. The next-to-bottom paragraph of p11 is specially interesting. NaH apparently qulaifies as a catalyst because heating can intiate a reaction resulting in H[1/3] which is a hydrino catalyst. That is secondary. The primary reason it qualifies as a catalyst is that the sum of the three components of the dissociation energy into the specified components adds to 54.35 eV, which is a close match for 54.4 eV. It still is not clear to me where the 54.35 eV for ionizing Na to catalyze H comes from. Mills has this weird way of writing his equations. Note that the Hydrino reaction itself on the right hand side of equation 23 actually produces 108.8 eV, half of which goes into the electron hole, and the other half of which is just direct free energy. Any one else would just have written eq. 23 with an excess of 54.45 eV on the right hand side, and nothing on the left. He writes it the way he does, in order to indicate that the energy release occurs in 2 phases, the first resonant energy dump into the hole (which in this case is 54.35 eV), and the second phase release, which is likely in the form of kinetic energy. However don't mistake the 54.35 eV on the left as external input to the reaction. It isn't. (it's just a quantity of -54.35 eV that Mills has transferred from the right hand side of the equation to the left hand side). What he should have done was: NaH - Na++ + 2 e- -54.35 eV + H[1/3] + 108.8 eV (note that the net on the right hand side is 54.45 eV) This makes it obvious that 54.35 eV is needed to break up the molecule, while the shrinkage yields a total of 108.8 eV. After the Hydrino forming reaction is complete, there is still free Na++ in the environment, and when this reacquires its missing electrons and recombines with a free H atom, to form a new molecule of NaH, a total of 54.35 eV is released. So in total for the two reactions (23 24) we get 54.45 (from 23) and 54.35 (from 24) = 108.8, which is precisely the total released during Hydrino formation. To make a long story short, when the Hydrino forms, part of the energy released is stored in chemical form (Na++ etc.) and part is released directly to the environment. The part stored in chemical form is then shortly (and separately) also released to the environment as per equ. 24. [snip] Regards, Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [Vo]:Banking on BLP?
In reply to Edmund Storms's message of Fri, 24 Oct 2008 16:05:50 -0600: Hi, [snip] I think you are close to describing the process, Robin. Simply decomposing NaH cannot result in hydrinos because the expected ion is not formed. Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, unless someone explicitly looked for it under the right conditions, and didn't find it. On the other hand, as you suggest, if the decomposition occurs on the Ni surface, the Na will have a complex ion state because it now is an absorbed atom, not a free, isolated atom. In addition, the electron that is promoted to a higher level has a place to go, i.e. into the conduction band of the Ni. The only problem is achieving a match between the energy change of the promoted electron and the energy shrinkage of the hydrino electron. I suspect you are needlessly multiplying entities. ;) IOW Mills provides a catalyst that has the necessary property, and gets the expected result. Why is it so hard to accept that he might be right? Granted spectroscopic results indicating presence of Na++ would go a long way to proving him right. Now for a question. Why must the electron that is promoted always come from a level that is observed to form an ion during normal ionization? Personally, I don't think it does, and have previously suggested that Li, which has an x-ray absorption energy of 54.75 eV, may be an example of this. However Na doesn't appear to fit the bill. For example, removal of a 2p electron from Na++ would occur during normal ionization, but is this happening here? No, but then Na++ is not the catalyst either. The whole molecule is the catalyst. BTW the third ionization energy of Na is 71.641 eV, and none of the immediate reactions have enough energy to do this. Only a further reaction of H[1/3] to a lower level would provide such energy. (3-4 yields 95 eV). In other words, why can't a 1s electron be removed from a neutral Na without the 2p electron being affected. After the 1s electron is removed, a 2p electron would take its place and release a small amount of energy as X-rays. This energy would be a byproduct of the process just like the hydrino energy. Do you know how much energy is required to remove a 1s electron from nearly neutral Na? 1073 eV. (K shell x-ray absorption energy). The process gets more unknown because the electron would be promoted into the conduction band, which has a lower energy than vacuum. In other words, perhaps Mills has the right process but is using the wrong electron promotion process to describe it simply because the wrong promotion gives the expected energy. If so, then I think you need to come up with an alternative (and the numbers to back it up). The work function of the metal might be a good place to start, however in this case we're looking at an alloy/compound, which complicates matters. [snip] Regards, Robin van Spaandonk [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[Vo]:Video of BLP Replication at Rowen University on BLP website
http://www.blacklightpower.com/Documentary%20Video/blacklight_experiment_video_v2.wmv
