Re: [Vo]:More on the WuFlu conspiracy theory

[Jonathan Berry]

The fatality rate can increase x7 when there isn't healthcare.

https://youtu.be/gojy7ChZ8h8?t=721

So 2% x 7 = 14% fatality!

Now maybe the 2% figure is already increased by including Hubei, but
the point is that the death rate is going to be a whole lot higher
than many think if this gets bad

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 10:58 AM Jones Beene  wrote:
>
> An effective and inexpensive treatment this virus is once again being 
> promoted by the L Pauling crowd... this time, maybe more strongly than ever.
>
> These zealots may not be medically correct - as the evidence goes both ways 
> and is heavily anecdotal - but make no mistake, the C industry is a billion 
> dollar success and growing in the USA - even despite not winning the battle 
> for mainstream "professional" acceptance.
>
> The public likes Vitamin C,  even if the MDs are skeptical and YouTube and 
> the social networks are flooded with mostly positive info.
>
> Bottom line ... valid evidence or not... count me in (to start mega-dosing 
> with C), if the virus should spread to my county... which it probably will.
>
>
>   Jonathan Berry wrote:
>
>
> The other side of this is that the severe cases with treatment can
> often be prevented from turning into fatalities.
>

Re: [Vo]:More on the WuFlu conspiracy theory

[Jones Beene]

 An effective and inexpensive treatment this virus is once again being promoted 
by the L Pauling crowd... this time, maybe more strongly than ever.

These zealots may not be medically correct - as the evidence goes both ways and 
is heavily anecdotal - but make no mistake, the C industry is a billion dollar 
success and growing in the USA - even despite not winning the battle for 
mainstream "professional" acceptance. 

The public likes Vitamin C,  even if the MDs are skeptical and YouTube and the 
social networks are flooded with mostly positive info.

Bottom line ... valid evidence or not... count me in (to start mega-dosing with 
C), if the virus should spread to my county... which it probably will.


     Jonathan Berry wrote:  
 
 The other side of this is that the severe cases with treatment can
often be prevented from turning into fatalities.
  

Re: [Vo]:More on the WuFlu conspiracy theory

[Jonathan Berry]

The other side of this is that the severe cases with treatment can
often be prevented from turning into fatalities.
But, when this wipes out the ability to get any medical help, the
death rate is going to go a lot closer to the rate of severe cases.

And that is a much much higher percentage than those who die.

In Wuhan according to China's own figures the percentage killed by the
Virus is 4% because of just this reality, and it could go higher or
already be higher.

On Wed, Feb 19, 2020 at 9:20 AM Jed Rothwell  wrote:
>
> Jürg Wyttenbach  wrote:
>
>> But mortality is 2,3% for confirmed severe cases only not for the
>>
>> average infected ones. This, so far,  looks like being well below
>> influenza.
>
>
> I do not think so. I believe the 2.3% projection is for all cases, but I 
> agree it is probably too high. Because uncounted infections are more 
> prevalent than uncounted or misattributed deaths.
>
> Influenza is 0.1%. There is no way this is "well below" that. At least 1,770 
> people have died. If the rate is 0.1%, that means 1.8 million people have 
> been infected. That is implausible. They say there are 71,000 cases.
>
> The NY Times says:
>
> "An analysis of 44,672 coronavirus patients in China whose diagnoses were 
> confirmed by laboratory testing has found that 1,023 had died by Feb. 11, 
> which suggests a fatality rate of 2.3 percent."
>
>
> I doubt all 44,672 of those cases were severe. That would be very badly done 
> epidemiology. The people doing the study will try to find a representative 
> sample of patients, from mild to severe. As you see, the sample includes most 
> of the known patients and deaths on record.
>

Re: [Vo]:More on the WuFlu conspiracy theory

[Jed Rothwell]

Jürg Wyttenbach  wrote:

But mortality is 2,3% for confirmed severe cases only not for the
>
average infected ones. This, so far,  looks like being well below
> influenza.
>

I do not think so. I believe the 2.3% projection is for all cases, but I
agree it is probably too high. Because uncounted infections are more
prevalent than uncounted or misattributed deaths.

Influenza is 0.1%. There is no way this is "well below" that. At least
1,770 people have died. If the rate is 0.1%, that means 1.8 million people
have been infected. That is implausible. They say there are 71,000 cases.

The NY Times says:

"An analysis of 44,672 coronavirus patients in China whose diagnoses were
confirmed by laboratory testing has found that 1,023 had died by Feb. 11,
which suggests a fatality rate of 2.3 percent."


I doubt all 44,672 of those cases were severe. That would be very badly
done epidemiology. The people doing the study will try to find a
representative sample of patients, from mild to severe. As you see, the
sample includes most of the known patients and deaths on record.

[Vo]:Fwd: Darpa project now public

[Frank Znidarsic]

I closed out this one. ..
I now consider this first effort to be abandoned.  I as the inventor need to 
obtain considerately more credibility in order to peruse such goals.  My book 
alone will not do it.  My work is under review at the National Science 
Foundation.  A positive review may allow my efforts to be the basis of an 
experimental campaign.  I expect no such positive responce. 
Right now as a retired perhaps I should stick with what I know best; hanging 
out at Starbucks.  I will let you know if anything significant happens.
Frank Znidarsic

RE: [Vo]:More on the WuFlu conspiracy theory

[bobcook39...@hotmail.com]

Jones—

Nice find RE the biology item you identified written by a Wuhan scientist etal 
some years ago.

The current interview Dr Tara O'Toole: The CIA, National Security And 
Preventing The Next Pandemic – YouTube m is also informative regarding a
Possible basis for Sen. Cotton’s comments about WuFlu.

There are an increasing number of “dots” in understanding the current 
Coronavirus  outbreak/pandemic now being diagnosed worldwide.

The 1981 novel about a virus developed in Wuhan, China, a  virus called 
Wuhan-400 makes people terribly ill … by Dean Koontz,is a story with close 
similarity to current events!!!

Bob Cook




From: Jones Beene
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2020 12:42 PM
To: vortex
Subject: [Vo]:More on the WuFlu conspiracy theory

U.S. Senator Tom Cotton (R-AR) has generated a lot of negative flak for 
promoting the idea that the WuFlu virus was a inadvertent release of a Chinese 
bioweapon. Could he know something that we do not?

Doubt it... but  Consider this paper on virus-engineering, published in a 
well-known journal almost 10 years ago !

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs00705-010-0729-6

Essentially, the article has been claimed to provide a recipe for how to alter 
(or weaponize) the SARS virus using coronavirus proteins. The two are very 
similar.

Is there a connection to the present situation - or is Sen Cotton being 
irresponsible in blaming China? (or both?)

Notably one of the authors of the paper is a professor at the Wuhan Institute 
of Virology (his name is Dr. Shengli Shi)

Re: [Vo]:More on the WuFlu conspiracy theory

[Jürg Wyttenbach]

Am 18.02.20 um 16:49 schrieb Jed Rothwell:
"The virus. They are working hard. Looks like by April, you know in 
theory, when it gets a little warmer it miraculously goes away. Hope 
that's true! Rough stuff, I tell you. Rough, rough stuff."


This scenario is totally fringe as on the cruise ship at Yokohama the 
inside temperature is more than spring average and all folks on the ship 
did/will more or less get it.


But mortality is 2,3% for confirmed severe cases only not for the 
average infected ones. This, so far,  looks like being well below 
influenza.



J.W.

--
Jürg Wyttenbach
Bifangstr.22
8910 Affoltern a.A.
044 760 14 18
079 246 36 06

Re: [Vo]:More on the WuFlu conspiracy theory

[Jed Rothwell]

Here is the latest news about the coronavirus pandemic.

The New York Times reports the mortality rate is now estimated at 2.3% by
the Chinese CDC. That compares to the rate of 0.1 for ordinary influenza.
The Times also reports that the Director of a hospital in Wuhan has died of
the disease. That is ominous because presumably he got the best possible
care. People who get first-class medical care seldom die from ordinary
influenza.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/18/world/asia/china-coronavirus.html

Courtesy of the Bloomberg campaign, here is Pres. Trump's take on the
coronavirus. Here is what Trump said in recent video:

"The virus. They are working hard. Looks like by April, you know in theory,
when it gets a little warmer it miraculously goes away. Hope that's true!
Rough stuff, I tell you. Rough, rough stuff."

Trump plans to cut the CDC and other world health budgets by $3 billion.

https://twitter.com/Mike2020/status/1227320432405221377

If an ordinary person on the bus said something like this, you would think
he is drunk or crazy, and you would move away from him.

It is true that influenza epidemics tend to abate in warmer months, but
they do not miraculously go away. Here is the mortality rate per month for
the 1918 - 1919 influenza epidemic in England:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu#/media/File:1918_spanish_flu_waves.gif