Re: Notes on ICCF12 from T. J. Dolan
In reply to Stephen A. Lawrence's message of Thu, 22 Dec 2005 22:39:04 -0500: Hi, [snip] >The numbers on this one sound fabulous: 600% excess heat sounds >stunning. Is this paper online? I didn't see it in the index, though >there appears to be other "superwave" stuff from El-Boher on your site >going back at least to ICCF-10. > >Anyone got any idea where "breakeven" is for a "typical" cold fusion >cell? (Yes, I know, they're all different, there is no "typical" >cell...) At what level of excess heat is total energy in likely to be >less than recoverable energy out? (For that matter, what's the right >way to even ask the question? It's pretty obvious what "breakeven" is >for hot fusion, but for CF it seems a bit less clear.) > >In other words, is 600% excess heat anywhere near "breakeven"? [snip] Clearly it depends on what you want to do, and the output temperature of the cell. At face value, 600% is clearly way above break even, however that's electrical energy in and thermal energy out. A reverse cycle heat exchanger can do nearly this well. If all you want do is create warm water, then this would probably be commercial right now. If you want to produce enough electricity to power the device itself, then you need to look at the Carnot efficiency of the device (TH-TL)/TH. Having determined the Carnot efficiency, you probably need to divide this by about a factor of 2 to get somewhere close to real conversion efficiency. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://users.bigpond.net.au/rvanspaa/ Competition provides the motivation, Cooperation provides the means.
Re: Notes on ICCF12 from T. J. Dolan
A couple items on the list caught my eye.
Jed Rothwell wrote:
Notes from the 12th International Conference on Condensed Matter Nuclear
Sciences
November 27 – December 2, 2005, Yokohama
T. J. Dolan
The following brief summary refers to only some of the 60 papers
presented at the conference.
Experiments
Yasuhiro Iwamura (Mitsubishi Heavy Industries) presented more data on
transmutations of Cs to Pm, Ba to Sm, and Sr to Mo, using a variety of
diagnostic techniques, including a detailed surface mapping using a
synchrotron microbeam (100 x 100 micrometers). They found that the
transmutations occurred in small concentrated sites on the surface.
Afterward I asked him what labs have reproduced some of his
transmutations, and he said Osaka University, Shizuoka University,
Francesco Celani (Italy), and NRL (in progress).
A. Kitamura (Kobe University) coated films on the vacuum side of the Pd
foil (Iwamura coated the gas side) and reported transmutation of Sr into
Mo.
Irina Savvatimova (“Luch” Institute, Moscow) reported transmutation of
Ba into Sm.
A. El-Boher (Energetics Technologies, Israel) used "superwave"
modulation of the current in electrolysis cells to increase yield. He
achieved 600% excess heat for 24 hours, and 150% for 134 hours. Irving
Dardik (a physician) developed the superwave technique with regard to
curing human illnesses, and it is found to have applications in several
fields.
The numbers on this one sound fabulous: 600% excess heat sounds
stunning. Is this paper online? I didn't see it in the index, though
there appears to be other "superwave" stuff from El-Boher on your site
going back at least to ICCF-10.
Anyone got any idea where "breakeven" is for a "typical" cold fusion
cell? (Yes, I know, they're all different, there is no "typical"
cell...) At what level of excess heat is total energy in likely to be
less than recoverable energy out? (For that matter, what's the right
way to even ask the question? It's pretty obvious what "breakeven" is
for hot fusion, but for CF it seems a bit less clear.)
In other words, is 600% excess heat anywhere near "breakeven"?
Vittorio Violante (ENEA, Italy) used a HeNe laser to enhance excess
power generation during electrochemical loading.
Yoshiaki Arata (Osaka University) observed intense heat generation
during ingress of deuterium into a thin cylinder containing Pd
nanoparticles.
Alexander Karabut ("Luch" laboratory, Russia) observed excess heat
generation and transmutations during deuterium glow discharges, but not
during Kr or Xe discharges. Using spark mass spectrometry, SIMS, and
secondary neutral mass spectrometry they identified the emergence of
many impurities, including abnormal isotope ratios for several elements.
They also observed emission of gamma rays and x-rays.
Andrei Lipson and George Miley (Lebedev Institute, Moscow, and
University of Illinois) reported emissions of energetic protons and
alpha particles during controlled exothermic deuterium desorption from
the surface of a Pd/PdO:Dx heterostructure. Using CR-39 detectors they
found 1-3 MeV proton tracks and 11-16 MeV alpha tracks, with a yield
about 0.005 alphas/cm2-s, reproducible during about 20 experiments. They
also reported data indicating superconductivity in Pd hydride and
deuteride.
This appears to be a PowerPoint slide set. Is there a paper to go with it?
The slides are fascinating, though, sad to say, mostly pretty
incomprehensible to this yokel. I had no idea that signs of
superconductivity had been observed in loaded Pd, but it appears from
your index that there are hints of this going back to at least ICCF-10.
Might it be possible to parley this aspect into back-door access to
"conventional money" for research into CF, I wonder? 30K for a
transition temperature isn't exactly sweltering, but it still qualifies
as HT and it's totally different from "conventional HT superconductors",
I think, and that should interest people.
For that matter, is that possibly what Lipson and Miley are already
doing...?
[ snip snip ]
Summary
In his summary of the ICCF-12 conference Prof. Xing-Zhong Li said that
CMNS has three “legs”:
·excess heat generation
·nuclear reaction products & transmutations
·good reproducibility.
Many experiments have achieved the first two legs, but reproducibility
has only been demonstrated in a few experiments, such as those of
Iwamura. Prof. Arata is building a larger device (3 x 30 cm) to
demonstrate reliable higher power operation.
That will be really interesting! I have no idea if using Pd as a sort
of catalyst for high-temp D2 gas will every produce useful energy, but
the tiny amounts I've read about it make it sound like the process may
be a lot more reproducible than the wet-cell CF.
Re: Notes on ICCF12 from T. J. Dolan
Jed Rothwell wrote: OrionWorks wrote: This post is primarily directed to both Jed, Steven Krivit, Jed, in the past you have lamented the fact that you feared CF research may be dieing a slow death, particularly due to what you have perceived is a lack of necessary infusion of young scientists into this risky & controversial field. IOW, at present dabbling in CF may be considered, professionally speaking, too risky a step for most career oriented scientists to seriously consider. Never the less, the latest posts (and supplied links) by Jed and Steve seem to indicate a number of interesting results derived from ICCF12. There has been progress and there are promising new results. On the other hand, I did not see any young people at the conference. All the presenters have attended previous conferences and presented similar results. Over the past year, several more researchers retired or died. The field still seems be drifting inexorably toward extinction, simply because people grow old and die. From the beginning, cold fusion supporters have been older than those who attack the field. The 2000 dollar air fair on top of the conferrence fees stopped me. And I'm nearly a younger CF researcher. I have about a dozen younger people in my network that are listening but they to don't know how to go from being a CF watcher to being a CF doer. We need entry level CF experiments and some way to link newer people up to the older teams to train up the pool of understudies. There has been no change in the political situation. Journals such as Nature and Scientific American still attack cold fusion as viciously as ever. The 2004 Department of Energy review had no effect. As far as I know cold fusion is still too risky for a career oriented scientist, or indeed any any scientist or businessman who is not retired or independently wealthy. Perhaps something is happening behind the scenes, but I would not know about that. Frankly, all of the secret research projects that have come to light so far have been unimpressive. I do not think this research can thrive in secret, but only in an open academic environment in which results are shared and experiments subject to open criticism and peer review. Australia is having a big fight about nuclear waste disposal sites and power reactors. I think I might put in a submission about the Lenr nuclear waste disposal option. I've just got a reply from two ministers, or their advisors, on my previous enquries indicating complete ignorance on lenr. That's not opposition! It seems they haven't even heard the argument againts CF. In such ignorance glows a glimmer of hope. If they don't know there's a fight they may listen long enough to hear the truth. I need to be able to hand them copies of the papers not references. And I need a proof read submission. I also need a new suit I suspect. Wish me luck. Which Papers would you suggest? - Jed
Re: Notes on ICCF12 from T. J. Dolan
OrionWorks wrote: This post is primarily directed to both Jed, Steven Krivit, Jed, in the past you have lamented the fact that you feared CF research may be dieing a slow death, particularly due to what you have perceived is a lack of necessary infusion of young scientists into this risky & controversial field. IOW, at present dabbling in CF may be considered, professionally speaking, too risky a step for most career oriented scientists to seriously consider. Never the less, the latest posts (and supplied links) by Jed and Steve seem to indicate a number of interesting results derived from ICCF12. There has been progress and there are promising new results. On the other hand, I did not see any young people at the conference. All the presenters have attended previous conferences and presented similar results. Over the past year, several more researchers retired or died. The field still seems be drifting inexorably toward extinction, simply because people grow old and die. From the beginning, cold fusion supporters have been older than those who attack the field. There has been no change in the political situation. Journals such as Nature and Scientific American still attack cold fusion as viciously as ever. The 2004 Department of Energy review had no effect. As far as I know cold fusion is still too risky for a career oriented scientist, or indeed any any scientist or businessman who is not retired or independently wealthy. Perhaps something is happening behind the scenes, but I would not know about that. Frankly, all of the secret research projects that have come to light so far have been unimpressive. I do not think this research can thrive in secret, but only in an open academic environment in which results are shared and experiments subject to open criticism and peer review. - Jed
Re: Notes on ICCF12 from T. J. Dolan
Yes, I think the owls are dying. Maybe it's bird flu. http://www.sonomacountyfreepress.com/bohos/bohofact.html "The rooster says 'cock-a-doodle-do'. The nymph says 'any ole cock'l do'." http://imdb.com/title/tt0102802/ Interesting word: 'illuminates'. -Original Message- From: Steven Krivit I'm going to release something now that partially illuminates where some of my optimism comes from. I will eventually name the source, but not now. He said, just about a year ago, "Have no doubt. We are going to win this war, after losing every battle." It's a most interesting and stunning quote, certainly. For now though, I have nothing more to say about it. The cake is still baking. ___ Try the New Netscape Mail Today! Virtually Spam-Free | More Storage | Import Your Contact List http://mail.netscape.com
Re: Notes on ICCF12 from T. J. Dolan
Hi Steven, I'm quite optimistic. Though the best work appears to be happening under the radar. The smart people, unlike those who promote their companies and technologies through Web sites which I will not name, recognize the need to obtain irrefutable results and are working towards that end. They are painfully aware of both the paradigm-breaking nature of this science, and also aware of the threat to incumbent energy enterprises. More mainstream journals are starting to accept cf papers. Sooner or later a mainstream journal is going to do a major story on LENR transmutation. It's inevitable. The nice thing about the transmutation results, as pointed out by Iwamura, is that unlike heat, the evidence is not transient. So it's easy to validate. I asked Dave Nagel's perspective relative to the promise of cold fusion this last week. He replied with a quote from some other military leader whose name I don't remember, who said. "I'm very good at predicting what things will happen in the future. But I'm not so good at predicting when they will happen." I'm going to release something now that partially illuminates where some of my optimism comes from. I will eventually name the source, but not now. He said, just about a year ago, "Have no doubt. We are going to win this war, after losing every battle." It's a most interesting and stunning quote, certainly. For now though, I have nothing more to say about it. The cake is still baking. From my view, the public really doesn't give a damn about the injustices to good science, to good scientists and to research which will inevitably provide for a benefit for all humanity. The general public, predominately, wants results -- but does not want to pay for them. Fortunately, a few wise, wealthy people have better vision than most of the public and are positioning themselves strategically in support of this research, and in doing so, will grace mankind with the tools and energy to continue civilization. Once that happens, it will be up to the social scientists, policy-makers and NGOs to see that the new source of energy is used wisely and appropriately. s At 08:12 AM 12/8/2005, you wrote: This post is primarily directed to both Jed, Steven Krivit, Jed, in the past you have lamented the fact that you feared CF research may be dieing a slow death, particularly due to what you have perceived is a lack of necessary infusion of young scientists into this risky & controversial field. IOW, at present dabbling in CF may be considered, professionally speaking, too risky a step for most career oriented scientists to seriously consider. Never the less, the latest posts (and supplied links) by Jed and Steve seem to indicate a number of interesting results derived from ICCF12. Seems to me that progress, albeit perhaps too slow for most of us to appreciate, continues. Jed, Do you continue to remain pessimistic? Steve, what's you thoughts on this? What about the commercial development component? Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com
Notes on ICCF12 from T. J. Dolan
Notes from the 12th International Conference on
Condensed Matter Nuclear Sciences
November 27 December 2, 2005, Yokohama
T. J. Dolan
The following brief summary refers to only some
of the 60 papers presented at the conference.
Experiments
Yasuhiro Iwamura (Mitsubishi Heavy Industries)
presented more data on transmutations of Cs to
Pm, Ba to Sm, and Sr to Mo, using a variety of
diagnostic techniques, including a detailed
surface mapping using a synchrotron microbeam
(100 x 100 micrometers). They found that the
transmutations occurred in small concentrated
sites on the surface. Afterward I asked him what
labs have reproduced some of his transmutations,
and he said Osaka University, Shizuoka
University, Francesco Celani (Italy), and NRL (in progress).
A. Kitamura (Kobe University) coated films on the
vacuum side of the Pd foil (Iwamura coated the
gas side) and reported transmutation of Sr into Mo.
Irina Savvatimova (Luch Institute, Moscow)
reported transmutation of Ba into Sm.
A. El-Boher (Energetics Technologies, Israel)
used "superwave" modulation of the current in
electrolysis cells to increase yield. He achieved
600% excess heat for 24 hours, and 150% for 134
hours. Irving Dardik (a physician) developed the
superwave technique with regard to curing human
illnesses, and it is found to have applications in several fields.
Vittorio Violante (ENEA, Italy) used a HeNe laser
to enhance excess power generation during electrochemical loading.
Yoshiaki Arata (Osaka University) observed
intense heat generation during ingress of
deuterium into a thin cylinder containing Pd nanoparticles.
Alexander Karabut ("Luch" laboratory, Russia)
observed excess heat generation and
transmutations during deuterium glow discharges,
but not during Kr or Xe discharges. Using spark
mass spectrometry, SIMS, and secondary neutral
mass spectrometry they identified the emergence
of many impurities, including abnormal isotope
ratios for several elements. They also observed
emission of gamma rays and x-rays.
Andrei Lipson and George Miley (Lebedev
Institute, Moscow, and University of Illinois)
reported emissions of energetic protons and alpha
particles during controlled exothermic deuterium
desorption from the surface of a Pd/PdO:Dx
heterostructure. Using CR-39 detectors they
found 1-3 MeV proton tracks and 11-16 MeV alpha
tracks, with a yield about 0.005 alphas/cm2-s,
reproducible during about 20 experiments. They
also reported data indicating superconductivity in Pd hydride and deuteride.
Francesco Celani (Frascati, Italy) told how they
coated Pd wires with Pd-silicate to produce
fractal nanostructures and enhance deuterium loading.
Vladimir Vysotskii (Kiev) and Alla Kornilova
(Moscow) reported that Mn-55 was transmuted into
Fe-57 in a solution of MnSO4 in heavy water plus
nutrients and microbes, and the yield after 30
days was about 10-6. In light water no Fe-57 was
produced. They have published a book on this topic.
Experiments at Iwate University were not yet
successful. During the discussion I pointed out
that oxides of calcium, strontium, and barium are
used in commercial vacuum tube cathodes, and that
great care must be taken in vacuum tube
manufacture to avoid impurities like oil, which
can poison their thermal emissivity. Experiments
that attempt to emulate the transmutation data of
Iwamura may fail if they do not bake out the
sample in a very clean high vacuum system.
Mike McKubre (SRI) presented new data to clarify
the relationship between the electrical
resistance ratio R/Ro of Pd and the fractional
loading of deuterium near N(d)/N(Pd) ~ 1.
Jean-Francois Fauvarque (Laboratoire
dElectrochemis Industrielle, France) reported
reproducible heat generation during electrolysis
with a tungsten cathode. At 350 V the output
energy was 1.3 to 1.4 times the input energy.
Tadahiko Mizuno (Hokkaido University) described
an electrolysis experiment in which the cathode
overheated and exploded. After 300 J electrical
input, the output heat plus explosion energy
totaled about 0.24 MJ. Analysis of the tungsten
cathode revealed deposits of Ca, S, and other
elements, but no residual radioactivity.
There is a new collaboration between Italy and
Japan (Takahashi, Celani, Iwamura) to try to
transmute radioactive isotopes such as Cs-137 and
Sr-90 into stable isotopes, which could have
application for remediation of radioactive
wastes. I. Goryachev (Kurchatov Institute) is
also studying the possibility of waste remediation.
Jean-Paul Biberian (Marseille, France) heated a
clean Pd foil to 500 C, cooled and sanded it,
heated again to 500 C, and coated it with Zn, Pb,
or Li. When the coated foil was immersed in
deuterium gas it loaded quickly and generated excess heat.
Steve Krivit (New Energy Times) and Vladimir
Vysotskii (Kiev) told of experiments by A.
Koldomasov (Russia), Hyunik Yang (Hy-En Research
Co.) and others in
Re: Notes on ICCF12 from T. J. Dolan
This post is primarily directed to both Jed, Steven Krivit, Jed, in the past you have lamented the fact that you feared CF research may be dieing a slow death, particularly due to what you have perceived is a lack of necessary infusion of young scientists into this risky & controversial field. IOW, at present dabbling in CF may be considered, professionally speaking, too risky a step for most career oriented scientists to seriously consider. Never the less, the latest posts (and supplied links) by Jed and Steve seem to indicate a number of interesting results derived from ICCF12. Seems to me that progress, albeit perhaps too slow for most of us to appreciate, continues. Jed, Do you continue to remain pessimistic? Steve, what's you thoughts on this? What about the commercial development component? Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com
Re: Notes on ICCF12 from T. J. Dolan
Andrei Lipson and George Miley (University of Illinois) showed that the walls of high-power tokamaks like ITER could be damaged by low energy nuclear reactions induced by implanted deuterium and tritium. Isn't that an ironic hoot...? ITER ($10 billion) will possibly fail because of irresponsible disregard of LENR reactions... which BTW would likely be in commercial use (LENR) by now - had a tenth of that enormous cost for hot fusion - been substituted over the last decade.
