Re: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
WOOT! I for one think that the immigration and naturalization act was the biggest stain on the face of our constitution and declaration to ever be passed as law. My mother immigrated legally from canada, my fathers family came over before it WAS the united states, and they just, came. no legal or illegal about it. So many others came through ellis island where you told your name, drew an x, and boom, you're an American. That is how we are SUPPOSED to be. No racism, religionism, favoritism, paperwork, quotas and limits. Come be an American, chase that dream, live the good life! ALL men are created equal motherfuckers, not just the ones that got here before we decided to bar the door and man the gates. On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 4:22 PM, grok g...@resist.ca wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 As the smoke cleared, Jeff Fink rev...@ptd.net mounted the barricade and roared out: I have a friend Jozef from Slovakia back when it was Czechoslovakia. He was in med school intending to be a doctor. He ran afoul of the communist government on faith issues, was removed from med school and assigned to be an X-ray technician (no freedom of choice here). That may not sound too bad to some people on this forum, but what you don't know is that, at that time, eastern European facilities used no shielding: X-ray technician was a death sentence. (Isn't communism wonderful?) Soon after, he escaped to freedom in the US where he could be what he wanted. First thing: this was not communism, or even socialism. It was what we call _stalinism_, for want of a better word. Second thing: I think your friend is a liar. By the way, he immigrated legally. Jeff What, like cuban boat people, or pro-U.S. terrorists? Pfft. FUCK bourgeois legality. I'd help a mexican sneak over the U.S. border ANY day. And twice on sundays. Having been an illegal alien myself, for that matter. - -- grok. - -- Build the North America-wide General Strike. TODO el poder a los consejos y las comunas. TOUT le pouvoir aux conseils et communes. ALL power to the councils and communes. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkn6MqIACgkQXo3EtEYbt3GQ3ACgqBVSySa4uBjEBMxbQP2oJBZH Bo0AoJAZ3NN/pBgA3JdQhOf8N+VjPqyF =uEHB -END PGP SIGNATURE-
Re: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
I think what troubles many Americans on a deeper level is why some immigrants don't stay. ;-) Harry - Original Message - From: leaking pen itsat...@gmail.com Date: Friday, May 1, 2009 8:26 am Subject: Re: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity WOOT! I for one think that the immigration and naturalization act was the biggest stain on the face of our constitution and declaration to ever be passed as law. My mother immigrated legally from canada, my fathers family came over before it WAS the united states, and they just, came. no legal or illegal about it. So many others came through ellis island where you told your name, drew an x, and boom, you're an American. That is how we are SUPPOSED to be. No racism, religionism, favoritism, paperwork, quotas and limits. Come be an American, chase that dream, live the good life! ALL men are created equal motherfuckers, not just the ones that got here before we decided to bar the door and man the gates. On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 4:22 PM, grok g...@resist.ca wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 As the smoke cleared, Jeff Fink rev...@ptd.net mounted the barricade and roared out: I have a friend Jozef from Slovakia back when it was Czechoslovakia. He was in med school intending to be a doctor. He ran afoul of the communist government on faith issues, was removed from med school and assigned to be an X-ray technician (no freedom of choice here). That may not sound too bad to some people on this forum, but what you don't know is that, at that time, eastern European facilities used no shielding: X-ray technician was a death sentence. (Isn't communism wonderful?) Soon after, he escaped to freedom in the US where he could be what he wanted. First thing: this was not communism, or even socialism. It was what we call _stalinism_, for want of a better word. Second thing: I think your friend is a liar. By the way, he immigrated legally. Jeff What, like cuban boat people, or pro-U.S. terrorists? Pfft. FUCK bourgeois legality. I'd help a mexican sneak over the U.S. border ANY day. And twice on sundays. Having been an illegal alien myself, for that matter. - -- grok. - -- Build the North America-wide General Strike. TODO el poder a los consejos y las comunas. TOUT le pouvoir aux conseils et communes. ALL power to the councils and communes. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkn6MqIACgkQXo3EtEYbt3GQ3ACgqBVSySa4uBjEBMxbQP2oJBZH Bo0AoJAZ3NN/pBgA3JdQhOf8N+VjPqyF =uEHB -END PGP SIGNATURE-
Re: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
Because we make it a living hell for them, so they make some money, head back, and then try to use that money t buck the system and get in legally. On Fri, May 1, 2009 at 9:05 AM, Harry Veeder hvee...@ncf.ca wrote: I think what troubles many Americans on a deeper level is why some immigrants don't stay. ;-) Harry - Original Message - From: leaking pen itsat...@gmail.com Date: Friday, May 1, 2009 8:26 am Subject: Re: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity WOOT! I for one think that the immigration and naturalization act was the biggest stain on the face of our constitution and declaration to ever be passed as law. My mother immigrated legally from canada, my fathers family came over before it WAS the united states, and they just, came. no legal or illegal about it. So many others came through ellis island where you told your name, drew an x, and boom, you're an American. That is how we are SUPPOSED to be. No racism, religionism, favoritism, paperwork, quotas and limits. Come be an American, chase that dream, live the good life! ALL men are created equal motherfuckers, not just the ones that got here before we decided to bar the door and man the gates. On Thu, Apr 30, 2009 at 4:22 PM, grok g...@resist.ca wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 As the smoke cleared, Jeff Fink rev...@ptd.net mounted the barricade and roared out: I have a friend Jozef from Slovakia back when it was Czechoslovakia. He was in med school intending to be a doctor. He ran afoul of the communist government on faith issues, was removed from med school and assigned to be an X-ray technician (no freedom of choice here). That may not sound too bad to some people on this forum, but what you don't know is that, at that time, eastern European facilities used no shielding: X-ray technician was a death sentence. (Isn't communism wonderful?) Soon after, he escaped to freedom in the US where he could be what he wanted. First thing: this was not communism, or even socialism. It was what we call _stalinism_, for want of a better word. Second thing: I think your friend is a liar. By the way, he immigrated legally. Jeff What, like cuban boat people, or pro-U.S. terrorists? Pfft. FUCK bourgeois legality. I'd help a mexican sneak over the U.S. border ANY day. And twice on sundays. Having been an illegal alien myself, for that matter. - -- grok. - -- Build the North America-wide General Strike. TODO el poder a los consejos y las comunas. TOUT le pouvoir aux conseils et communes. ALL power to the councils and communes. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkn6MqIACgkQXo3EtEYbt3GQ3ACgqBVSySa4uBjEBMxbQP2oJBZH Bo0AoJAZ3NN/pBgA3JdQhOf8N+VjPqyF =uEHB -END PGP SIGNATURE-
Re: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 As the smoke cleared, Harry Veeder hvee...@ncf.ca mounted the barricade and roared out: I think what troubles many Americans on a deeper level is why some immigrants don't stay. ;-) Harry - Original Message - From: leaking pen itsat...@gmail.com Date: Friday, May 1, 2009 8:26 am Subject: Re: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity WOOT! I for one think that the immigration and naturalization act was the biggest stain on the face of our constitution and declaration to ever be passed as law. My mother immigrated legally from canada, my fathers family came over before it WAS the united states, and they just, came. no legal or illegal about it. So many others came through ellis island where you told your name, drew an x, and boom, you're an American. That is how we are SUPPOSED to be. No racism, religionism, favoritism, paperwork, quotas and limits. Come be an American, chase that dream, live the good life! ALL men are created equal motherfuckers, not just the ones that got here before we decided to bar the door and man the gates. You can also approach this from the criminal illegality, in front of all Humanity, how the euro settler states simply stole this land from the peoples already living here -- and slaughtered and enslaved them to boot. And for that matter: how their (intellectual) descendants are STILL committing both heinous and petty crimes against the survivors to this very day! All this a massive crime which still must be paid for -- as must also the atomic bombing of Nippon, and the saturation strategic bombing of the european Axis cities. Etc. Etc. Since we're talking what's legal here. Pfft. Maybe you want to live in a police state. I don't. - -- grok. - -- Build the North America-wide General Strike. TODO el poder a los consejos y las comunas. TOUT le pouvoir aux conseils et communes. ALL power to the councils and communes. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkn7JdQACgkQXo3EtEYbt3EhvQCcDkX+vOzW/YIr4KMc8pNUKHXS OtIAoKreiuYx0fSf23Yt6f0ebxL7ICrI =RO1R -END PGP SIGNATURE-
Re: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
- Original Message - From: Jeff Fink rev...@ptd.net Date: Thursday, April 30, 2009 10:06 am Subject: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity -Original Message- From: Jeff Fink [mailto:rev...@ptd.net] Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2009 10:02 AM To: 'g...@resist.ca' Subject: RE: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity -Original Message- From: grok [mailto:g...@resist.ca] Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 10:56 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Fact is, socialism is about Fairness AND Freedom -- because for one thing: being fair is all about being free. Think about it. I just got finished thinking about it. There is no freedom in socialism. Freedom and equality are mutually exclusive concepts unless you limit the definition of equality to equal opportunity rather than equal result. Equal opportunity allows us the freedom to prosper from hard work or suffer the consequences of laziness. With real freedom, some people will get ahead of others. Some call this unfair. They want equality of result without the effort. They want the results of someone else's effort to flow into their pockets, and that is what I call wealth redistribution, and that is what I call unfair. Too many people are riding on the wagon, leaving fewer and fewer to pull the wagon. Many of us in the harness, who are straining and sweating under the load, are beginning to look over our shoulder and see the huge crowd lounging and partying in the wagon, and they are saying, Why am I doing all this work. This is unfair. If we can't ride in the wagon perhaps we should at least have a tea party. Jeff how do you measure person's effort? by a person's income? Harry
RE: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
how do you measure person's effort? by a person's income? Harry Effort is what is required to put an ability or talent to work. Except for the severely handicapped, we all have things we can do, whether it be picking berries out of someone's field or picking tumors out of someone's brain. The market place determines the value of a person's ability. We all seek to use our ability where it is valued the most. We want to make the most money for our effort. If farmer A is paying me $6.00 an hour to pick berries, and I hear that farmer B down the road is hiring for $6.50 per hour, I'm going to quit farmer A and hire on with farmer B, as long as I have the freedom to choose where I work. Can a migrant worker who is dissatisfied with $6.50 per hour become a brain surgeon? Only in America! I read about it in Reader's Digest. This is a first class example of equal opportunity, but it took tremendous effort to make this migrant worker's desire a reality, and so it should. If you are going under the knife, do you want this guy, or someone who got his degree the easy way? I have a friend Jozef from Slovakia back when it was Czechoslovakia. He was in med school intending to be a doctor. He ran afoul of the communist government on faith issues, was removed from med school and assigned to be an X-ray technician (no freedom of choice here). That may not sound too bad to some people on this forum, but what you don't know is that, at that time, eastern European facilities used no shielding: X-ray technician was a death sentence. (Isn't communism wonderful?) Soon after, he escaped to freedom in the US where he could be what he wanted. By the way, he immigrated legally. Jeff
Re: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 As the smoke cleared, Jeff Fink rev...@ptd.net mounted the barricade and roared out: I have a friend Jozef from Slovakia back when it was Czechoslovakia. He was in med school intending to be a doctor. He ran afoul of the communist government on faith issues, was removed from med school and assigned to be an X-ray technician (no freedom of choice here). That may not sound too bad to some people on this forum, but what you don't know is that, at that time, eastern European facilities used no shielding: X-ray technician was a death sentence. (Isn't communism wonderful?) Soon after, he escaped to freedom in the US where he could be what he wanted. First thing: this was not communism, or even socialism. It was what we call _stalinism_, for want of a better word. Second thing: I think your friend is a liar. By the way, he immigrated legally. Jeff What, like cuban boat people, or pro-U.S. terrorists? Pfft. FUCK bourgeois legality. I'd help a mexican sneak over the U.S. border ANY day. And twice on sundays. Having been an illegal alien myself, for that matter. - -- grok. - -- Build the North America-wide General Strike. TODO el poder a los consejos y las comunas. TOUT le pouvoir aux conseils et communes. ALL power to the councils and communes. -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAkn6MqIACgkQXo3EtEYbt3GQ3ACgqBVSySa4uBjEBMxbQP2oJBZH Bo0AoJAZ3NN/pBgA3JdQhOf8N+VjPqyF =uEHB -END PGP SIGNATURE-
Re: RE: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
- Original Message - From: Jeff Fink rev...@ptd.net Date: Thursday, April 30, 2009 3:46 pm Subject: RE: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity how do you measure person's effort? by a person's income? Harry Effort is what is required to put an ability or talent to work. Except for the severely handicapped, we all have things we can do, whether it be picking berries out of someone's field or picking tumors out of someone'sbrain. The market place determines the value of a person's ability. The ability to carry a financial burden seems to be the most valued ability these days. The ability to shoulder other kinds of burdens seems to be devalued. We all seek to use our ability where it is valued the most. We want to make the most money for our effort. If farmer A is paying me $6.00 an hour to pick berries, and I hear that farmer B down the road is hiring for $6.50 perhour, I'm going to quit farmer A and hire on with farmer B, as long as I have the freedom to choose where I work. Can a migrant worker who is dissatisfied with $6.50 per hour become a brain surgeon? Only in America! I read about it in Reader's Digest. This is a first class example of equal opportunity, but it took tremendouseffort to make this migrant worker's desire a reality, and so it should. If you are going under the knife, do you want this guy, or someone who got his degree the easy way? What is the easy way? I have a friend Jozef from Slovakia back when it was Czechoslovakia. He was in med school intending to be a doctor. He ran afoul of the communist government on faith issues, was removed from med school and assigned to be an X-ray technician (no freedom of choice here). That may not sound too bad to some people on this forum, but what you don't know is that, at that time, eastern European facilities used no shielding: X-ray technician was a death sentence. (Isn't communism wonderful?) Soon after, he escaped to freedomin the US where he could be what he wanted. By the way, he immigrated legally. So in your mind people will only make an effort when they are also working to meet a financial obligation. Harry
RE: RE: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity
-Original Message- From: Harry Veeder [mailto:hvee...@ncf.ca] Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2009 8:27 PM To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Subject: Re: RE: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity - Original Message - From: Jeff Fink rev...@ptd.net Date: Thursday, April 30, 2009 3:46 pm Subject: RE: FW: [Vo]:[OT] H1N1 Synchronicity how do you measure person's effort? by a person's income? Harry Effort is what is required to put an ability or talent to work. Except for the severely handicapped, we all have things we can do, whether it be picking berries out of someone's field or picking tumors out of someone'sbrain. The market place determines the value of a person's ability. The ability to carry a financial burden seems to be the most valued ability these days. The ability to shoulder other kinds of burdens seems to be devalued. We all seek to use our ability where it is valued the most. We want to make the most money for our effort. If farmer A is paying me $6.00 an hour to pick berries, and I hear that farmer B down the road is hiring for $6.50 perhour, I'm going to quit farmer A and hire on with farmer B, as long as I have the freedom to choose where I work. Can a migrant worker who is dissatisfied with $6.50 per hour become a brain surgeon? Only in America! I read about it in Reader's Digest. This is a first class example of equal opportunity, but it took tremendouseffort to make this migrant worker's desire a reality, and so it should. If you are going under the knife, do you want this guy, or someone who got his degree the easy way? What is the easy way? Perhaps I should have said easier, like having parents who pay your way through school. I have a friend Jozef from Slovakia back when it was Czechoslovakia. He was in med school intending to be a doctor. He ran afoul of the communist government on faith issues, was removed from med school and assigned to be an X-ray technician (no freedom of choice here). That may not sound too bad to some people on this forum, but what you don't know is that, at that time, eastern European facilities used no shielding: X-ray technician was a death sentence. (Isn't communism wonderful?) Soon after, he escaped to freedomin the US where he could be what he wanted. By the way, he immigrated legally. So in your mind people will only make an effort when they are also working to meet a financial obligation. Harry Effort follows motivation. There are all kinds of motivations with financial perhaps being the most prevalent. Jeff
