RE: [Vo]:SRI Case Expt 4He
From: Steven Krivit http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2010/SRI-Case-Repl/SRI-Case.shtml Has anybody ever noticed that 2 out of 3 runs that show 4He growth in the SRI Case replication show a peak and then a decrease in 4He? This is a helium leak-tight chamber. Where does the 4He go? Two explanations come to mind. 1)There is no such thing as leak proof for helium - in the ppb range, and that is why it is called leak-tight. A few ppb per week would be expected. 2)The measurement itself removes the missing helium which otherwise would be flat.
Re: [Vo]:SRI Case Expt 4He
On Feb 24, 2010, at 7:37 PM, Steven Krivit wrote: http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2010/SRI-Case-Repl/SRI-Case.shtml Has anybody ever noticed that 2 out of 3 runs that show 4He growth in the SRI Case replication show a peak and then a decrease in 4He? This is a helium leak-tight chamber. Where does the 4He go? s The helium flows out of the cell with the evolved H2 and O2 gasses. If helium production slows and cell gas production remains constant then the concentration of helium in the gas produced diminishes. Modeling this over time is not so simple in the real case, as it is a multi-compartment flow model, and one in which one of the flow compartments (the Pd) performs in an unpredictable manner. To answer your question more directly, the helium continually flows out of the cell with the effluent, which is sampled periodically. If helium production stops, then the helium concentration necessarily must eventually drop to zero because the cell gas is continually produced and water is periodically added to the electrolyte to continue operation. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
Re: [Vo]:SRI Case Expt 4He
Steven Krivit wrote: http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2010/SRI-Case-Repl/SRI-Case.shtml Has anybody ever noticed that 2 out of 3 runs that show 4He growth in the SRI Case replication show a peak and then a decrease in 4He? Yes. Many people have noted this. At ICCF-15 Tom Passell distributed a paper about this, which McKubre and Storms disagreed with. As I recall he said the helium was there all along and it was freed up and then sequestered again. This is a helium leak-tight chamber. Nothing is perfectly leak-tight, and helium is the most difficult element to contain, according to Morrison. The steel cylinders used by Miles contained the stuff for months with remarkably little leaking, but they were less complicated than a working cell. For Run SC4.2, they drew 9 samples. Anything you can draw a sample out of 9 times is bound to leak. Where does the 4He go? I do not know. I think that is unclear to the researchers. I think it is either sequestered or leaked. I do not think it is lost to the sampling technique, per Jones Beene, but I could be wrong about that. Since the concentration is above atmosphere (5 ppm), any leaks would be out, not in. No doubt there is some freeing up followed by sequestering going on here, as you see from SC1, in which the helium level fluctuates slightly below 1 ppm. It can't be leaking out, since this is so far below atmospheric concentration. It can only leak in. This is the first question regarding helium that you have raised that is not answered, or at least addressed to my satisfaction, in the literature. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:SRI Case Expt 4He
Horace Heffner wrote: Has anybody ever noticed that 2 out of 3 runs that show 4He growth in the SRI Case replication show a peak and then a decrease in 4He? . . . The helium flows out of the cell with the evolved H2 and O2 gasses. Nope. This is the Case cell: D2 gas loaded, no evolved gas. This is done with a direct, on-line, high-resolution mass spectrometric measurement of [4He]. I figure something like that has gotta leak. I mean, it must leak more than a simple collection flask that you send off to the Bureau of Mines. Those tubes running up to a mass spectrometer with Swarlok connections can't be as air-tight as a flask. The last experiment shown in this paper is the Arata double-structured cathode. That's really a gas loading experiment, not electrolysis. From the perspective of a helium study it is more like gas loading. The helium should be trapped inside the double structure walls. The latest Arata experiments are gas loading no matter how you look at them. This paper covers a lot of ground in 9 pages. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:SRI Case Expt 4He
On Feb 24, 2010, at 7:37 PM, Steven Krivit wrote: http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2010/SRI-Case-Repl/SRI-Case.shtml Has anybody ever noticed that 2 out of 3 runs that show 4He growth in the SRI Case replication show a peak and then a decrease in 4He? This is a helium leak-tight chamber. Where does the 4He go? s Oooops! I didn't notice the subject was on the Case experiment. Best regards, Horace Heffner http://www.mtaonline.net/~hheffner/
