Re: [Wikidata-l] Is an ecosystem of Wikidatas possible?
I think it is not about a file being or not the best to reprensent something, it is about can commons gain something by being in wikidata. And I think it is the case : wikidata will give very powerful tools, with properties to classify and describe files, and queries to find which files matches some criteria which could help users to find what they want. Of course the amount of work to describe precisely each file is gigantic, so this system will not be available at his full potential, but we can be sure that we can build something stricty better that the current category system with a very limited cost since wikidata is already there and is planned to interract with commons. And the availability of wikidata items will for example a very fine graine matching of some schéma with their topic, so we can for example find every illustration used for a mathematical topic, whatever it is about a very specific theorem, work can be tedious to do with the current system as the classification is higher grained. 2013/6/22 Jane Darnell jane...@gmail.com I was thinking about items vs properties and Commons. I am not sure a F entity is necessary. In theory, each file on Commons can be linked to another one, and each item on WikiData can be linked to another one, but those links do not necessarily need to interconnect with Commons. If a Commons file is not the best promoted image of a certain WikiData item, then in my mind it does not need to be in WikiData. Here is an example of what I mean: This is an image of an engraving of Dirk van Hoogstraten: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Dirk_van_hoogstraten_by_arnold_houbraken.JPG He has a WikiData (person) item that could link to that image here: http://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q5280895 The image file is derived from this file: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Schouburg_I_Plate_I_Leonard_Bramer_-_Dirk_van_Hoogstraten_-_Salomon_de_Bray.jpg which is a page from a 3-volume book about artists that has a WikiData (book) item (that could use the titlepage of the first volume as linked image). The picture of Hoogstraten on that page was also used later by another engraver in a later book about artists: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Schouburg_I_Plate_I_Leonard_Bramer_-_Dirk_van_Hoogstraten_-_Salomon_de_Bray.jpg This second book also has a Wikidata (book) item, and the authors of both books have WikiData (person) items, and so do the engravers of the original engravings. If the original drawing of Dirk Hoogstraten ever comes to light, then that image could be promoted to best image of Dirk Hoogstraten, and this one can remain on commons, but does not need to be linked to WikiData, or do you think there is a need for this file to have its own F status in WikiData? 2013/6/21, David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com: On Wed, Jun 19, 2013 at 11:15 AM, Denny Vrandečić denny.vrande...@wikimedia.de wrote: I agree that the different projects have different requirements. But I think we should strive for a small number of Wikidatas - you could have made the same argument for Commons, after all. The two projects that might need it most are Wikivoyage (hotel/restaurant listings) and Wikiquote (semantic quotes), though in the end they could be included in Wikidata with different entity types. Wikisource is aligned with the existence of source items in Wikidata, so other than having a S namespace for sources (or not) and adapting the extension to work in Wikisource, there is not much need of development from the Wikidata side. See more here: https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Wikisource Right now, I think there is a need for Commons to have better support for data - we are working on a proposal text for that - and Wiktionary - as it is really a different system - needs some special treatments - we have just send a proposal text for that. The Wiktionary proposal is a great start. I'm excited about the Commons proposal. It would be fabulous to have an F entity type for files :) (You can always go further and say but it would be better if we supported Wikibooks with structured data about the books and its chapters etc., but at some point you need to weigh implementation effort and cost and the expected benefit) Wikibooks (user-generated text-books) is a special case, a bit different from Wikisource (digital versions of existing sources). However both can be treated in a similar way. I agree that the potential benefit of linking chapters wouldn't be that high. Cheers, Micru ___ Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l ___ Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Re: [Wikidata-l] Is an ecosystem of Wikidatas possible?
On Sat, Jun 22, 2013 at 1:49 AM, Jane Darnell jane...@gmail.com wrote: [...] do you think there is a need for this file to have its own F status in WikiData? Yes. The reason to have file entities is mainly to have a platform that can store semantic descriptions of a file. For text searches in classical terms it doesn't matter much, but to search things like: - portrait engravings by artists born in Dordrecht - depictions of Dutch poets born between 1600 and 1700 For these kind of searches, the only possible way to return relevant results is to store the information a semantic way as Wikidata does. As Thomas pointed out, the task to transition to the new method looks somewhat daunting, luckily here there is not much trouble using bots to automate the task filling out the properties of the 17M files. The case of image promotion I think it is a different issue that would require some tagging (maybe best depiction of) or a simple voting system (like in youtube, reddit, etc). It is also important to note that the old issue of sexual content in Commons [1] has gained *a lot* of traction lately since the last three op-ed's questioning/defending its suistainability [2] [3]. Basically there is a need that the searches show what you are looking for and not some other random content. The urgency to present a solution is very high at the moment, a matter of weeks before starting organizing WikiLoveMonuments with a cleaned reputation, so I hope that Wikidata can present a proposal soon that I am sure will be better than this other proposal [4] Cheers, Micru [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2010-05-10/Commons_deletions [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2013-06-12/Op-ed [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2013-06-19/Op-ed [4] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Requests_for_comment/Image_information ___ Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l
Re: [Wikidata-l] Is an ecosystem of Wikidatas possible?
Dear David, Denny and Wikidatans, Thanks for this email thread. I'd like to float a proposal for this ecosystem of Wikidatas vis-a-vis World University and School, (which is like Wikipedia with MIT OCW), with our plans for a wiki school or online, Creative Commons' licensed university (with free, online, C.C., MIT-centric, university degrees planned) in all 7,105+ languages and 204+ countries. C.C. WUaS hopes to engage Wikidata, as well. I've begun a link on the WUaS, wiki, Subjects' page called Wikidata databases and ecosystem, - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/Subjects- which can easily become an extensible, wiki, subject page itself (using a modified version of Wikidata with the WUaS SUBJECT TEMPLATE - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/SUBJECT_TEMPLATE) in all languages and countries, to link all the (small number of) Wikidatas that emerge. (Check out this extensible, WUaS, wiki SUBJECT TEMPLATE, since it has many of the possible categories mentioned above in this email thread). Here is the beginning, Languages' wiki page at WUaS - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/Languages - eventually to link all languages, each as a school or university. And here is the beginning Nation States' wiki page at WUaS - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/Nation_States - eventually to link all nation states, each as a school or university. The wiki, extensible, WUaS all-languages' (7,105 per Ethnologue) and all-nation states' (204 per The Olympics) approach has the merit of potentially including all emergent Wikidatas in all languages (for an universal translator - http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/WUaS_Universal_Translator), and in all nation states for legal questions, in a way that fully supports the amazing interlingual Wikidata (which is planned for Wikipedia's 285 languages +), and also, - since many/most of these Wikidatas may be data about generative shared knowledge - will therefore fit well with World University and School which is for open, free, wiki, people-to-people teaching and learning. Best regards, Scott On Sat, Jun 22, 2013 at 6:42 AM, David Cuenca dacu...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Jun 22, 2013 at 1:49 AM, Jane Darnell jane...@gmail.com wrote: [...] do you think there is a need for this file to have its own F status in WikiData? Yes. The reason to have file entities is mainly to have a platform that can store semantic descriptions of a file. For text searches in classical terms it doesn't matter much, but to search things like: - portrait engravings by artists born in Dordrecht - depictions of Dutch poets born between 1600 and 1700 For these kind of searches, the only possible way to return relevant results is to store the information a semantic way as Wikidata does. As Thomas pointed out, the task to transition to the new method looks somewhat daunting, luckily here there is not much trouble using bots to automate the task filling out the properties of the 17M files. The case of image promotion I think it is a different issue that would require some tagging (maybe best depiction of) or a simple voting system (like in youtube, reddit, etc). It is also important to note that the old issue of sexual content in Commons [1] has gained *a lot* of traction lately since the last three op-ed's questioning/defending its suistainability [2] [3]. Basically there is a need that the searches show what you are looking for and not some other random content. The urgency to present a solution is very high at the moment, a matter of weeks before starting organizing WikiLoveMonuments with a cleaned reputation, so I hope that Wikidata can present a proposal soon that I am sure will be better than this other proposal [4] Cheers, Micru [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2010-05-10/Commons_deletions [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2013-06-12/Op-ed [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikipedia_Signpost/2013-06-19/Op-ed [4] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Requests_for_comment/Image_information ___ Wikidata-l mailing list Wikidata-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata-l -- Scott MacLeod Founder President http://scottmacleod.com -- World University and School (like Wikipedia with MIT OpenCourseWare) http://worlduniversity.wikia.com/wiki/Subjects World University and School is a 501 (c) (3) tax-exempt, educational organization. P.O. Box 442, (86 Ridgecrest Road), Canyon, CA 94516 415 480 4577 worldunivand...@scottmacleod.com worlduniversityandsch...@gmail.com Skype: scottm100 Google + main, WUaS page: https://plus.google.com/u/0/b/108179352492243955816/108179352492243955816/posts Please contribute, and invite friends to contribute, tax deductibly, via PayPal and credit card: http://scottmacleod.com/worlduniversityandschool.htm. World University and School is sending you this because of
