Re: [Wikimedia-l] Proposal for a multilingual Wikipedia

[Samuel Klein]

Great!  The time seems right.  Is the idea to begin with P1.1 and P1.2, on
a test wiki, and have a branch of abstracttext that anyone can submit
functions to, while working on the proposal and setting this up formally as
a sibling projet?

Is there anything Wikispore could do to help get something like this
underway?  //S

On Tue, May 5, 2020 at 3:28 PM Denny Vrandečić  wrote:

> Hello all,
>
> after talking about it a few times here, the official proposal for creating
> the multilingual Wikipedia proposal is now on Meta.
>
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikilambda
>
> The idea is to create abstract, language-independent content in Wikidata,
> and then translate it into natural language using function. These functions
> will be defined and maintained in a new Wikimedia project, which I
> preliminary called Wikilambda.
>
> Wikilambda will be a new Wikimedia project that allows to create, maintain,
> catalog, and evaluate functions about all kind of things. You can find a
> lot of further details in the link above. If you have any questions, I am
> happy to answer them.
>
> The official project proposal process basically says, make the proposal
> here, and then go and tell everyone, and at some point, the Board might
> look at this and say, yes good idea.
>
> So I would love to collect many of your voices and support signatures, so
> that I can go to the Board and tell them look at this :) So please sign
> here:
>
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikilambda
>
> Thank you,
> Denny
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[John Erling Blad]

It happen after a reboot where the browsers was reset.
No, I did not take a screenshot.

On Tue, May 5, 2020 at 7:43 PM Samuel Klein  wrote:

> >
> > This is a complaint about multiple banners on the same page.
>
>
>
> > I believe it would be better to put the add on the lower part of the
> > viewport, for all users, and for a limited time. Posting ads at random
> > locations
>
>
> I couldn't figure out how to experience this feature -- can you share a
> screenshot?
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Updates from Wikimedia Foundation Board

[Pine W]

I mostly agree with Risker up until her last paragraph.

It is true that Wikipedia has received a some positive  coverage in
the press recently. I think that this is largely due to the good work
of employees in WMF's Technology and Audiences departments, and
volunteers who participate in subjects that are related to Covid-19.
Although there has been some recent and probably justified criticism
on this list of WMF's fundraising, I ask us to remember that this
fundraising brings financial support for Technology and Audiences
employees.

I am not a fan of the WMF Board making surprise decisions, nor of the
WMF Board unilaterally deciding to change the timing for elections for
what should be community-appointed seats. I wish that WMF would get
out of the habit of making unilateral decisions that pertain to
community governance.

Pine
( https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Pine )

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[Wikimedia-l] Proposal for a multilingual Wikipedia

[Denny Vrandečić]

Hello all,

after talking about it a few times here, the official proposal for creating
the multilingual Wikipedia proposal is now on Meta.

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikilambda

The idea is to create abstract, language-independent content in Wikidata,
and then translate it into natural language using function. These functions
will be defined and maintained in a new Wikimedia project, which I
preliminary called Wikilambda.

Wikilambda will be a new Wikimedia project that allows to create, maintain,
catalog, and evaluate functions about all kind of things. You can find a
lot of further details in the link above. If you have any questions, I am
happy to answer them.

The official project proposal process basically says, make the proposal
here, and then go and tell everyone, and at some point, the Board might
look at this and say, yes good idea.

So I would love to collect many of your voices and support signatures, so
that I can go to the Board and tell them look at this :) So please sign
here:

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Wikilambda

Thank you,
Denny
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[Samuel Klein]

>
> This is a complaint about multiple banners on the same page.



> I believe it would be better to put the add on the lower part of the
> viewport, for all users, and for a limited time. Posting ads at random
> locations


I couldn't figure out how to experience this feature -- can you share a
screenshot?
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[John Erling Blad]

One of the browsers are set up with forced session cookies and web storage,
and also to block third parties. It breaks several features, also central
login. I have reported it as an issue, but none has bothered to create a
fix.

I believe it would be better to put the add on the lower part of the
viewport, for all users, and for a limited time. Posting ads at random
locations and disrupting (terrorizing) the readers is not a good idea.

On Tue, May 5, 2020 at 12:04 AM Samuel Klein  wrote:

> >
> > If you're browsing in a private-window, this means the browser cannot
> > remember (save in a cookie) that you clicked "close" or saw the banner
> > already, hence you might be seeing more banners than most readers would.
> >
>
> Worth mentioning each time it comes up:
> This seems like an instance of where tracking interactions w/ a given {IP,
> day} or {hash of browser fingerprint+IP+daily salt} would vastly outweigh
> the challenges.  We can support private browsing, or any kind of browsing,
> without creating a painful experience [which is also... not likely to
> result in a donation].
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[Gerard Meijssen]

Hoi,
To me this is similar to the argument why we do not really raise funds in
some countries that "are poor". Some people are poor, certainly, but many
others are not. The argument that we can afford has a relation to our
aspirations, ambitions what can we do better, more particularly in the
countries where people are stuck in their homes. If anything this is the
time to adapt to changing circumstances. People are at home, there is this
"captive audience" with many people that are helped mentally when they have
something worthwhile to do.

We can reach out for readers, editors and donors.
Thanks,
   GerardM


On Tue, 5 May 2020 at 14:58, WereSpielChequers 
wrote:

> Given the large reserves that the WMF carries, and the savings from
> cancelling events such as Wikimania 2020, I would have thought that the WMF
> was one organisation that could afford to pause its fundraising for a few
> months. At least in countries where the economy is in freefall.
>
> In a few months time lots of people will still be in a financial mess. But
> the large number of people who are currently going to be worried about
> their financial future will hopefully be divided into those who have kept
> their jobs. or got new ones and those who were right to be worried.
> Hopefully some of those who come through this financially OK will be in a
> position to donate.
>
> WSC
>
> On Tue, 5 May 2020 at 11:25, 
> wrote:
>
> > Send Wikimedia-l mailing list submissions to
> > wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > wikimedia-l-ow...@lists.wikimedia.org
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Wikimedia-l digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> >1. Annoying ads (John Erling Blad)
> >2. Re: Annoying ads (Benjamin Ikuta)
> >3. Re: Annoying ads (Robert Fernandez)
> >4. Re: Annoying ads (Pierre-Yves Beaudouin)
> >5. Re: Annoying ads (Nick Wilson (Quiddity))
> >6. Re: Annoying ads (Samuel Klein)
> >7. Re: Annoying ads (Paulo Santos Perneta)
> >8. Re: Annoying ads (Paulo Santos Perneta)
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Mon, 4 May 2020 16:55:50 +0200
> > From: John Erling Blad 
> > To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
> > Subject: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads
> > Message-ID:
> >  > 5ggwunkrfg6ejjsn6sb1rbf1h_fnyphpd_wjr5ot...@mail.gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
> >
> > Often I surf Wikipedia without being logged in, and so I did right now. I
> > got the usual banners, but this time they popped up repeatedly in several
> > locations. This quickly gets extremely annoying, and I find it unwise.
> > Create one banner, and stick with that. Several banners are simply way
> over
> > the top.
> >
> > /jeblad
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > *
> >
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[John Erling Blad]

Thanks, but I do know how to log in at Wikipedia, its about 15 years since
I started editing.

This is a complaint about multiple banners on the same page.

On Mon, May 4, 2020 at 11:02 PM Nick Wilson (Quiddity) <
nwil...@wikimedia.org> wrote:

> Hi John, thank you for the feedback.
>
> The banners you see are continually changing, as we refine our designs
> based on feedback and efficacy. Donation banners are inherently disruptive,
> on any site. We try to minimize the annoyance whilst also maximizing the
> effectiveness in order to show as few banners as possible. It's a difficult
> balance, and feedback like yours, and the emails and comments we get from
> readers, help us out over time.
>
> If you don’t want to see fundraising banners, there are a few options: You
> can login to Wikipedia, or click the "close" button in a banner, or visit
> our donor thank you page.[1]
>
> If you're browsing in a private-window, this means the browser cannot
> remember (save in a cookie) that you clicked "close" or saw the banner
> already, hence you might be seeing more banners than most readers would.
>
> Thanks again,
> Nick
>
> [1] https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/Thank_You
>
> On Mon, May 4, 2020 at 7:56 AM John Erling Blad  wrote:
>
> > Often I surf Wikipedia without being logged in, and so I did right now. I
> > got the usual banners, but this time they popped up repeatedly in several
> > locations. This quickly gets extremely annoying, and I find it unwise.
> > Create one banner, and stick with that. Several banners are simply way
> over
> > the top.
> >
> > /jeblad
> > ___
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> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
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> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > 
>
>
>
> --
> Nick "Quiddity" Wilson (he/him)
> Community Relations Specialist
> Wikimedia Foundation
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[John Erling Blad]

I am nearly always logged in, but I also quite frequently open browser
windows where I am not logged in. It might have something to do with who I
am and what I do.

On Mon, May 4, 2020 at 5:27 PM Robert Fernandez 
wrote:

> I know this might sound crazy, but have you considered logging in?
>
> On Mon, May 4, 2020 at 10:56 AM John Erling Blad  wrote:
>
> > Often I surf Wikipedia without being logged in, and so I did right now. I
> > got the usual banners, but this time they popped up repeatedly in several
> > locations. This quickly gets extremely annoying, and I find it unwise.
> > Create one banner, and stick with that. Several banners are simply way
> over
> > the top.
> >
> > /jeblad
> > ___
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[WereSpielChequers]

Given the large reserves that the WMF carries, and the savings from
cancelling events such as Wikimania 2020, I would have thought that the WMF
was one organisation that could afford to pause its fundraising for a few
months. At least in countries where the economy is in freefall.

In a few months time lots of people will still be in a financial mess. But
the large number of people who are currently going to be worried about
their financial future will hopefully be divided into those who have kept
their jobs. or got new ones and those who were right to be worried.
Hopefully some of those who come through this financially OK will be in a
position to donate.

WSC

On Tue, 5 May 2020 at 11:25, 
wrote:

> Send Wikimedia-l mailing list submissions to
> wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> wikimedia-l-ow...@lists.wikimedia.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Wikimedia-l digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>1. Annoying ads (John Erling Blad)
>2. Re: Annoying ads (Benjamin Ikuta)
>3. Re: Annoying ads (Robert Fernandez)
>4. Re: Annoying ads (Pierre-Yves Beaudouin)
>5. Re: Annoying ads (Nick Wilson (Quiddity))
>6. Re: Annoying ads (Samuel Klein)
>7. Re: Annoying ads (Paulo Santos Perneta)
>8. Re: Annoying ads (Paulo Santos Perneta)
>
>
> --
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 4 May 2020 16:55:50 +0200
> From: John Erling Blad 
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List 
> Subject: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads
> Message-ID:
>  5ggwunkrfg6ejjsn6sb1rbf1h_fnyphpd_wjr5ot...@mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> Often I surf Wikipedia without being logged in, and so I did right now. I
> got the usual banners, but this time they popped up repeatedly in several
> locations. This quickly gets extremely annoying, and I find it unwise.
> Create one banner, and stick with that. Several banners are simply way over
> the top.
>
> /jeblad
>
>
> --
>
> *
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[Enock Seth Nyamador]

Do we already have a script or checkbox somewhere to disable banners?

Best,

Am Di., 5. Mai 2020 um 10:25 Uhr schrieb Paulo Santos Perneta <
paulospern...@gmail.com>:

> Why do you ask? Unregistered readers are some kind of inferior creatures
> not worth of any attention?
> Registering an account and logging in is optional in Wikimedia.
>
> Paulo
>
> Robert Fernandez  escreveu no dia segunda,
> 4/05/2020 à(s) 16:27:
>
> > I know this might sound crazy, but have you considered logging in?
> >
> > On Mon, May 4, 2020 at 10:56 AM John Erling Blad 
> wrote:
> >
> > > Often I surf Wikipedia without being logged in, and so I did right
> now. I
> > > got the usual banners, but this time they popped up repeatedly in
> several
> > > locations. This quickly gets extremely annoying, and I find it unwise.
> > > Create one banner, and stick with that. Several banners are simply way
> > over
> > > the top.
> > >
> > > /jeblad
> > > ___
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> > > 
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-- 
-Enock
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[Paulo Santos Perneta]

Why do you ask? Unregistered readers are some kind of inferior creatures
not worth of any attention?
Registering an account and logging in is optional in Wikimedia.

Paulo

Robert Fernandez  escreveu no dia segunda,
4/05/2020 à(s) 16:27:

> I know this might sound crazy, but have you considered logging in?
>
> On Mon, May 4, 2020 at 10:56 AM John Erling Blad  wrote:
>
> > Often I surf Wikipedia without being logged in, and so I did right now. I
> > got the usual banners, but this time they popped up repeatedly in several
> > locations. This quickly gets extremely annoying, and I find it unwise.
> > Create one banner, and stick with that. Several banners are simply way
> over
> > the top.
> >
> > /jeblad
> > ___
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Annoying ads

[Paulo Santos Perneta]

In the first days of the pandemic, while trying to read info on my
cellphone, where I'm usually logged out, I was bombed first with that ugly
black thing signed by Katherine Maher, then in the next page I navigated
to, with a red message directed at "my friend from Portugal", both of them
asking money using the context of the pandemic. Which I found not only
annoying but on a bad taste.

It seems to only affect wiki.en, but it is still quite annoying, as I read
it often using the cellphone.

On the other hand, if WMF insists in that strategy, maybe it means it's
working somehow? But there must be less aggressive ways of reaching to the
people...

Best,
Paulo

John Erling Blad  escreveu no dia segunda, 4/05/2020 à(s)
15:56:

> Often I surf Wikipedia without being logged in, and so I did right now. I
> got the usual banners, but this time they popped up repeatedly in several
> locations. This quickly gets extremely annoying, and I find it unwise.
> Create one banner, and stick with that. Several banners are simply way over
> the top.
>
> /jeblad
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