[WISPA] Rime Ice?
Anyone have to deal with rime ice on antenna's? We need to build a PTP link that will be on a top of a mountain that's notorious for rime Ice. It would be a 5GHz link with sturdy 3ft radome but I'm not aware at what effect rime ice might have on 5GHz signal if any? Googling hasn't really bought up any decent info. Thanks, Bret WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Rime Ice?
With a radome, the ice shouldn't be too much of an issue unless it gets really thick. I had some dished here in Texas that I did not put radomes on, thinking that the one or two days of ice we get a year would not matter. With about 1/2 inch of ice directly on the end of the feed, my throughput went to nothing. I added a radome and then next ice storm with about the same covering of ice had no effect and my throughput remained constant. I would go with a radome with even a possibility of ice. Cameron On Mon, Jan 30, 2012 at 12:55 PM, Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.comwrote: Anyone have to deal with rime ice on antenna's? We need to build a PTP link that will be on a top of a mountain that's notorious for rime Ice. It would be a 5GHz link with sturdy 3ft radome but I'm not aware at what effect rime ice might have on 5GHz signal if any? Googling hasn't really bought up any decent info. Thanks, Bret WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Rime Ice?
Yeah, being in New England area we use Radome's on most of radios on high locations, but this one would be on top of a ski mountain and there are other cell phone provider antenna's up there covered pretty think with rime ice. I know in general ice doesn't attenuate 5Ghz too bad, but it looks like the build up can be extensive here. Started to look for heated radome's but again came up empty. Might be one of those deals where we try it and see what happens. Bret On 01/30/2012 02:02 PM, Cameron Crum wrote: With a radome, the ice shouldn't be too much of an issue unless it gets really thick. I had some dished here in Texas that I did not put radomes on, thinking that the one or two days of ice we get a year would not matter. With about 1/2 inch of ice directly on the end of the feed, my throughput went to nothing. I added a radome and then next ice storm with about the same covering of ice had no effect and my throughput remained constant. I would go with a radome with even a possibility of ice. Cameron On Mon, Jan 30, 2012 at 12:55 PM, Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.com mailto:bcl...@spectraaccess.com wrote: Anyone have to deal with rime ice on antenna's? We need to build a PTP link that will be on a top of a mountain that's notorious for rime Ice. It would be a 5GHz link with sturdy 3ft radome but I'm not aware at what effect rime ice might have on 5GHz signal if any? Googling hasn't really bought up any decent info. Thanks, Bret WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org mailto:wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Rime Ice?
Use Travis Johnson's method of putting a black thick mil trash bag on it...the blowing in the wind will shake loose any potential for rime ice. Regards, Chuck On Mon, Jan 30, 2012 at 3:01 PM, Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.comwrote: Yeah, being in New England area we use Radome's on most of radios on high locations, but this one would be on top of a ski mountain and there are other cell phone provider antenna's up there covered pretty think with rime ice. I know in general ice doesn't attenuate 5Ghz too bad, but it looks like the build up can be extensive here. Started to look for heated radome's but again came up empty. Might be one of those deals where we try it and see what happens. Bret On 01/30/2012 02:02 PM, Cameron Crum wrote: With a radome, the ice shouldn't be too much of an issue unless it gets really thick. I had some dished here in Texas that I did not put radomes on, thinking that the one or two days of ice we get a year would not matter. With about 1/2 inch of ice directly on the end of the feed, my throughput went to nothing. I added a radome and then next ice storm with about the same covering of ice had no effect and my throughput remained constant. I would go with a radome with even a possibility of ice. Cameron On Mon, Jan 30, 2012 at 12:55 PM, Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.comwrote: Anyone have to deal with rime ice on antenna's? We need to build a PTP link that will be on a top of a mountain that's notorious for rime Ice. It would be a 5GHz link with sturdy 3ft radome but I'm not aware at what effect rime ice might have on 5GHz signal if any? Googling hasn't really bought up any decent info. Thanks, Bret WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Rime Ice?
Interesting idea, Bret On 01/30/2012 03:04 PM, Chuck Hogg wrote: Use Travis Johnson's method of putting a black thick mil trash bag on it...the blowing in the wind will shake loose any potential for rime ice. Regards, Chuck On Mon, Jan 30, 2012 at 3:01 PM, Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.com mailto:bcl...@spectraaccess.com wrote: Yeah, being in New England area we use Radome's on most of radios on high locations, but this one would be on top of a ski mountain and there are other cell phone provider antenna's up there covered pretty think with rime ice. I know in general ice doesn't attenuate 5Ghz too bad, but it looks like the build up can be extensive here. Started to look for heated radome's but again came up empty. Might be one of those deals where we try it and see what happens. Bret On 01/30/2012 02:02 PM, Cameron Crum wrote: With a radome, the ice shouldn't be too much of an issue unless it gets really thick. I had some dished here in Texas that I did not put radomes on, thinking that the one or two days of ice we get a year would not matter. With about 1/2 inch of ice directly on the end of the feed, my throughput went to nothing. I added a radome and then next ice storm with about the same covering of ice had no effect and my throughput remained constant. I would go with a radome with even a possibility of ice. Cameron On Mon, Jan 30, 2012 at 12:55 PM, Bret Clark bcl...@spectraaccess.com mailto:bcl...@spectraaccess.com wrote: Anyone have to deal with rime ice on antenna's? We need to build a PTP link that will be on a top of a mountain that's notorious for rime Ice. It would be a 5GHz link with sturdy 3ft radome but I'm not aware at what effect rime ice might have on 5GHz signal if any? Googling hasn't really bought up any decent info. Thanks, Bret WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org mailto:wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org mailto:wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers
Update after more work today. Replaced all the electronics at one end early this morning. No real change. Replace the cable and antenna at that end this afternoon. When we got there the link was running with RSSI of around 67/70 and CCQ in the 50's both ways. Aligned the antenna and I watch the stats for a while while the climber we getting the old antenna off of the tower. Signal strength went to around 57/65 and quality was running in the high 80s to mid 90s. Thought it was fixed. Climber finished attaching new cable to tower as he came down. When He got to the bottom I checked things again. Signals are 67/70 and CCQ is all over the place. I have seen the CCQ jump from 90 to 14 at least once this evening. It didn't drop the link at 14, rather it climbed back up to nearly 80 and then dropped. I am at a complete loss as to what is going on. Oh, the last time I looked, noise floor was around -100 so SNR is running 30 to 40. On 1/29/2012 10:16 PM, Scott Reed wrote: Planned for tomorrow. On 1/29/2012 10:04 PM, Daniel White wrote: Maybe your replacement hardware is bad too. Have you tried another set? Daniel White (303) 746-3590 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 7:19 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers One end is just us and the 4 other links there are fine. The other is is us and at least 2 other WISPS, an FM repeater station, some public service repeaters, some commercial 2-way repeaters and ... Just looking at the tower, I don't think there is anything new, but I will ask the tower owner tomorrow. We changed everything at one end and all but the cable at the other. Other 5GHz links we have for either tower do not show symptoms of interference, but that does not mean that isn't our problem. On 1/28/2012 8:31 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: If you replaced all gear and even tried a different coax in place of the 60' of LMR then it would have to be some kind of noise, coming in via the power lines or radiated. Who else is on the tower? Did you only replace/try different gear on one tower or did you try both ends? Have you done any spectral analysis? Greg On Jan 28, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Scott Reed wrote: I have a link that went bonkers last Saturday or Sunday and it has me stumped. RB433AH with XR5 at each end. Signals running around -69/-71. CCQ is the goofy one. Most of the time one direction is in the 50% range, but varies quite a bit. The other direction ranges from 16% to 100%. Generally if I see it getting close to 100% I know the link is going to drop. It comes right back up, usually at about 50%. I have tried 20MHz channels, 10MHz channels, 5MHz channels with about the same results from all. I have tried 5.2-5.3 frequencies and 5.7-5.8 frequencies. The higher frequencies work better, but still not well. All of the hardware except one 60' piece of LMR as been replaced. Ask me some questions and offer some suggestions as this one has me totally stumped. -- Scott Reed Owner NewWays Networking, LLC Wireless Networking Network Design, Installation and Administration Mikrotik Advanced Certified www.nwwnet.net (765) 855-1060 (765) 439-4253 (855) 231-6239 - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1901 / Virus Database: 2109/4772 - Release Date: 01/28/12 -- Scott Reed Owner NewWays Networking, LLC Wireless Networking Network Design, Installation and Administration Mikrotik Advanced Certified www.nwwnet.net (765) 855-1060 (765) 439-4253 (855) 231-6239 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA
Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers
To me, that really sounds like interference. Don't look at the noise floor. Get a UBNT in spectrum analyzer mode, and let it run for a little bit. I bet you find something bleeding over the frequency. Eric -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Monday, January 30, 2012 7:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers Update after more work today. Replaced all the electronics at one end early this morning. No real change. Replace the cable and antenna at that end this afternoon. When we got there the link was running with RSSI of around 67/70 and CCQ in the 50's both ways. Aligned the antenna and I watch the stats for a while while the climber we getting the old antenna off of the tower. Signal strength went to around 57/65 and quality was running in the high 80s to mid 90s. Thought it was fixed. Climber finished attaching new cable to tower as he came down. When He got to the bottom I checked things again. Signals are 67/70 and CCQ is all over the place. I have seen the CCQ jump from 90 to 14 at least once this evening. It didn't drop the link at 14, rather it climbed back up to nearly 80 and then dropped. I am at a complete loss as to what is going on. Oh, the last time I looked, noise floor was around -100 so SNR is running 30 to 40. On 1/29/2012 10:16 PM, Scott Reed wrote: Planned for tomorrow. On 1/29/2012 10:04 PM, Daniel White wrote: Maybe your replacement hardware is bad too. Have you tried another set? Daniel White (303) 746-3590 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 7:19 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers One end is just us and the 4 other links there are fine. The other is is us and at least 2 other WISPS, an FM repeater station, some public service repeaters, some commercial 2-way repeaters and ... Just looking at the tower, I don't think there is anything new, but I will ask the tower owner tomorrow. We changed everything at one end and all but the cable at the other. Other 5GHz links we have for either tower do not show symptoms of interference, but that does not mean that isn't our problem. On 1/28/2012 8:31 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: If you replaced all gear and even tried a different coax in place of the 60' of LMR then it would have to be some kind of noise, coming in via the power lines or radiated. Who else is on the tower? Did you only replace/try different gear on one tower or did you try both ends? Have you done any spectral analysis? Greg On Jan 28, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Scott Reed wrote: I have a link that went bonkers last Saturday or Sunday and it has me stumped. RB433AH with XR5 at each end. Signals running around -69/-71. CCQ is the goofy one. Most of the time one direction is in the 50% range, but varies quite a bit. The other direction ranges from 16% to 100%. Generally if I see it getting close to 100% I know the link is going to drop. It comes right back up, usually at about 50%. I have tried 20MHz channels, 10MHz channels, 5MHz channels with about the same results from all. I have tried 5.2-5.3 frequencies and 5.7-5.8 frequencies. The higher frequencies work better, but still not well. All of the hardware except one 60' piece of LMR as been replaced. Ask me some questions and offer some suggestions as this one has me totally stumped. -- Scott Reed Owner NewWays Networking, LLC Wireless Networking Network Design, Installation and Administration Mikrotik Advanced Certified www.nwwnet.net (765) 855-1060 (765) 439-4253 (855) 231-6239 - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1901 / Virus Database: 2109/4772 - Release Date: 01/28/12 -- Scott Reed Owner NewWays Networking, LLC Wireless Networking Network Design, Installation and Administration Mikrotik Advanced Certified www.nwwnet.net (765) 855-1060 (765) 439-4253 (855) 231-6239
Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers
+1 on getting something that does spectral analysis. Any new neighbors on the tower you're sharing? Any new gear they might have turned up? Greg On Jan 30, 2012, at 8:08 PM, Eric Rogers wrote: To me, that really sounds like interference. Don't look at the noise floor. Get a UBNT in spectrum analyzer mode, and let it run for a little bit. I bet you find something bleeding over the frequency. Eric -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Monday, January 30, 2012 7:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers Update after more work today. Replaced all the electronics at one end early this morning. No real change. Replace the cable and antenna at that end this afternoon. When we got there the link was running with RSSI of around 67/70 and CCQ in the 50's both ways. Aligned the antenna and I watch the stats for a while while the climber we getting the old antenna off of the tower. Signal strength went to around 57/65 and quality was running in the high 80s to mid 90s. Thought it was fixed. Climber finished attaching new cable to tower as he came down. When He got to the bottom I checked things again. Signals are 67/70 and CCQ is all over the place. I have seen the CCQ jump from 90 to 14 at least once this evening. It didn't drop the link at 14, rather it climbed back up to nearly 80 and then dropped. I am at a complete loss as to what is going on. Oh, the last time I looked, noise floor was around -100 so SNR is running 30 to 40. On 1/29/2012 10:16 PM, Scott Reed wrote: Planned for tomorrow. On 1/29/2012 10:04 PM, Daniel White wrote: Maybe your replacement hardware is bad too. Have you tried another set? Daniel White (303) 746-3590 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 7:19 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers One end is just us and the 4 other links there are fine. The other is is us and at least 2 other WISPS, an FM repeater station, some public service repeaters, some commercial 2-way repeaters and ... Just looking at the tower, I don't think there is anything new, but I will ask the tower owner tomorrow. We changed everything at one end and all but the cable at the other. Other 5GHz links we have for either tower do not show symptoms of interference, but that does not mean that isn't our problem. On 1/28/2012 8:31 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: If you replaced all gear and even tried a different coax in place of the 60' of LMR then it would have to be some kind of noise, coming in via the power lines or radiated. Who else is on the tower? Did you only replace/try different gear on one tower or did you try both ends? Have you done any spectral analysis? Greg On Jan 28, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Scott Reed wrote: I have a link that went bonkers last Saturday or Sunday and it has me stumped. RB433AH with XR5 at each end. Signals running around -69/-71. CCQ is the goofy one. Most of the time one direction is in the 50% range, but varies quite a bit. The other direction ranges from 16% to 100%. Generally if I see it getting close to 100% I know the link is going to drop. It comes right back up, usually at about 50%. I have tried 20MHz channels, 10MHz channels, 5MHz channels with about the same results from all. I have tried 5.2-5.3 frequencies and 5.7-5.8 frequencies. The higher frequencies work better, but still not well. All of the hardware except one 60' piece of LMR as been replaced. Ask me some questions and offer some suggestions as this one has me totally stumped. -- Scott Reed Owner NewWays Networking, LLC Wireless Networking Network Design, Installation and Administration Mikrotik Advanced Certified www.nwwnet.net (765) 855-1060 (765) 439-4253 (855) 231-6239 - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1901 / Virus Database: 2109/4772 - Release Date:
Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers
I will certainly be getting a UBNT something on at least one tower to see what is going on. I did e-mail the big tower owner about changes on it. I know we are the only operation on the smaller tower. On 1/30/2012 8:32 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: +1 on getting something that does spectral analysis. Any new neighbors on the tower you're sharing? Any new gear they might have turned up? Greg On Jan 30, 2012, at 8:08 PM, Eric Rogers wrote: To me, that really sounds like interference. Don't look at the noise floor. Get a UBNT in spectrum analyzer mode, and let it run for a little bit. I bet you find something bleeding over the frequency. Eric -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Monday, January 30, 2012 7:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers Update after more work today. Replaced all the electronics at one end early this morning. No real change. Replace the cable and antenna at that end this afternoon. When we got there the link was running with RSSI of around 67/70 and CCQ in the 50's both ways. Aligned the antenna and I watch the stats for a while while the climber we getting the old antenna off of the tower. Signal strength went to around 57/65 and quality was running in the high 80s to mid 90s. Thought it was fixed. Climber finished attaching new cable to tower as he came down. When He got to the bottom I checked things again. Signals are 67/70 and CCQ is all over the place. I have seen the CCQ jump from 90 to 14 at least once this evening. It didn't drop the link at 14, rather it climbed back up to nearly 80 and then dropped. I am at a complete loss as to what is going on. Oh, the last time I looked, noise floor was around -100 so SNR is running 30 to 40. On 1/29/2012 10:16 PM, Scott Reed wrote: Planned for tomorrow. On 1/29/2012 10:04 PM, Daniel White wrote: Maybe your replacement hardware is bad too. Have you tried another set? Daniel White (303) 746-3590 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 7:19 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers One end is just us and the 4 other links there are fine. The other is is us and at least 2 other WISPS, an FM repeater station, some public service repeaters, some commercial 2-way repeaters and ... Just looking at the tower, I don't think there is anything new, but I will ask the tower owner tomorrow. We changed everything at one end and all but the cable at the other. Other 5GHz links we have for either tower do not show symptoms of interference, but that does not mean that isn't our problem. On 1/28/2012 8:31 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: If you replaced all gear and even tried a different coax in place of the 60' of LMR then it would have to be some kind of noise, coming in via the power lines or radiated. Who else is on the tower? Did you only replace/try different gear on one tower or did you try both ends? Have you done any spectral analysis? Greg On Jan 28, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Scott Reed wrote: I have a link that went bonkers last Saturday or Sunday and it has me stumped. RB433AH with XR5 at each end. Signals running around -69/-71. CCQ is the goofy one. Most of the time one direction is in the 50% range, but varies quite a bit. The other direction ranges from 16% to 100%. Generally if I see it getting close to 100% I know the link is going to drop. It comes right back up, usually at about 50%. I have tried 20MHz channels, 10MHz channels, 5MHz channels with about the same results from all. I have tried 5.2-5.3 frequencies and 5.7-5.8 frequencies. The higher frequencies work better, but still not well. All of the hardware except one 60' piece of LMR as been replaced. Ask me some questions and offer some suggestions as this one has me totally stumped. -- Scott Reed Owner NewWays Networking, LLC Wireless Networking Network Design, Installation and Administration Mikrotik Advanced Certified www.nwwnet.net (765) 855-1060 (765) 439-4253 (855) 231-6239 - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers
Scott, I've seen this with 2.4 ubnt and the airview results were misleading Trial and error was the only thing that helped me find the best channel... Spent the better part of two days fighting it. I put too must faith on the spectrum analysis and it sent me chasing my tail. Sent from my android device. -Original Message- From: Scott Reed sr...@nwwnet.net To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Mon, 30 Jan 2012 8:55 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers I will certainly be getting a UBNT something on at least one tower to see what is going on. I did e-mail the big tower owner about changes on it. I know we are the only operation on the smaller tower. On 1/30/2012 8:32 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: +1 on getting something that does spectral analysis. Any new neighbors on the tower you're sharing? Any new gear they might have turned up? Greg On Jan 30, 2012, at 8:08 PM, Eric Rogers wrote: To me, that really sounds like interference. Don't look at the noise floor. Get a UBNT in spectrum analyzer mode, and let it run for a little bit. I bet you find something bleeding over the frequency. Eric -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Monday, January 30, 2012 7:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers Update after more work today. Replaced all the electronics at one end early this morning. No real change. Replace the cable and antenna at that end this afternoon. When we got there the link was running with RSSI of around 67/70 and CCQ in the 50's both ways. Aligned the antenna and I watch the stats for a while while the climber we getting the old antenna off of the tower. Signal strength went to around 57/65 and quality was running in the high 80s to mid 90s. Thought it was fixed. Climber finished attaching new cable to tower as he came down. When He got to the bottom I checked things again. Signals are 67/70 and CCQ is all over the place. I have seen the CCQ jump from 90 to 14 at least once this evening. It didn't drop the link at 14, rather it climbed back up to nearly 80 and then dropped. I am at a complete loss as to what is going on. Oh, the last time I looked, noise floor was around -100 so SNR is running 30 to 40. On 1/29/2012 10:16 PM, Scott Reed wrote: Planned for tomorrow. On 1/29/2012 10:04 PM, Daniel White wrote: Maybe your replacement hardware is bad too. Have you tried another set? Daniel White (303) 746-3590 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 7:19 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers One end is just us and the 4 other links there are fine. The other is is us and at least 2 other WISPS, an FM repeater station, some public service repeaters, some commercial 2-way repeaters and ... Just looking at the tower, I don't think there is anything new, but I will ask the tower owner tomorrow. We changed everything at one end and all but the cable at the other. Other 5GHz links we have for either tower do not show symptoms of interference, but that does not mean that isn't our problem. On 1/28/2012 8:31 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: If you replaced all gear and even tried a different coax in place of the 60' of LMR then it would have to be some kind of noise, coming in via the power lines or radiated. Who else is on the tower? Did you only replace/try different gear on one tower or did you try both ends? Have you done any spectral analysis? Greg On Jan 28, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Scott Reed wrote: I have a link that went bonkers last Saturday or Sunday and it has me stumped. RB433AH with XR5 at each end. Signals running around -69/-71. CCQ is the goofy one. Most of the time one direction is in the 50% range, but varies quite a bit. The other direction ranges from 16% to 100%. Generally if I see it getting close to 100% I know the link is going to drop. It comes right back up, usually at about 50%. I have tried 20MHz channels, 10MHz channels, 5MHz channels with about the same results from all. I have tried 5.2-5.3 frequencies and 5.7-5.8 frequencies. The higher frequencies work better, but still not well. All of the hardware except one 60' piece of LMR as been replaced. Ask me some questions and offer some suggestions as this one has me totally stumped. -- Scott Reed Owner NewWays Networking, LLC Wireless Networking Network Design, Installation and Administration Mikrotik Advanced Certified www.nwwnet.net (765) 855-1060 (765) 439-4253 (855) 231-6239 - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - ---
Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers
I do want to look at it, but I have tried these links in the 5.3 range just to see what happened. No real difference, so I am not yet convinced that interference is it, but I can not come up with anything else. On 1/30/2012 9:41 PM, gregosb...@onlyinternet.net wrote: Scott, I've seen this with 2.4 ubnt and the airview results were misleading Trial and error was the only thing that helped me find the best channel... Spent the better part of two days fighting it. I put too must faith on the spectrum analysis and it sent me chasing my tail. Sent from my android device. -Original Message- From: Scott Reed sr...@nwwnet.net To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Mon, 30 Jan 2012 8:55 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers I will certainly be getting a UBNT something on at least one tower to see what is going on. I did e-mail the big tower owner about changes on it. I know we are the only operation on the smaller tower. On 1/30/2012 8:32 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: +1 on getting something that does spectral analysis. Any new neighbors on the tower you're sharing? Any new gear they might have turned up? Greg On Jan 30, 2012, at 8:08 PM, Eric Rogers wrote: To me, that really sounds like interference. Don't look at the noise floor. Get a UBNT in spectrum analyzer mode, and let it run for a little bit. I bet you find something bleeding over the frequency. Eric -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Monday, January 30, 2012 7:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers Update after more work today. Replaced all the electronics at one end early this morning. No real change. Replace the cable and antenna at that end this afternoon. When we got there the link was running with RSSI of around 67/70 and CCQ in the 50's both ways. Aligned the antenna and I watch the stats for a while while the climber we getting the old antenna off of the tower. Signal strength went to around 57/65 and quality was running in the high 80s to mid 90s. Thought it was fixed. Climber finished attaching new cable to tower as he came down. When He got to the bottom I checked things again. Signals are 67/70 and CCQ is all over the place. I have seen the CCQ jump from 90 to 14 at least once this evening. It didn't drop the link at 14, rather it climbed back up to nearly 80 and then dropped. I am at a complete loss as to what is going on. Oh, the last time I looked, noise floor was around -100 so SNR is running 30 to 40. On 1/29/2012 10:16 PM, Scott Reed wrote: Planned for tomorrow. On 1/29/2012 10:04 PM, Daniel White wrote: Maybe your replacement hardware is bad too. Have you tried another set? Daniel White (303) 746-3590 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 7:19 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers One end is just us and the 4 other links there are fine. The other is is us and at least 2 other WISPS, an FM repeater station, some public service repeaters, some commercial 2-way repeaters and ... Just looking at the tower, I don't think there is anything new, but I will ask the tower owner tomorrow. We changed everything at one end and all but the cable at the other. Other 5GHz links we have for either tower do not show symptoms of interference, but that does not mean that isn't our problem. On 1/28/2012 8:31 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: If you replaced all gear and even tried a different coax in place of the 60' of LMR then it would have to be some kind of noise, coming in via the power lines or radiated. Who else is on the tower? Did you only replace/try different gear on one tower or did you try both ends? Have you done any spectral analysis? Greg On Jan 28, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Scott Reed wrote: I have a link that went bonkers last Saturday or Sunday and it has me stumped. RB433AH with XR5 at each end. Signals running around -69/-71. CCQ is the goofy one. Most of the time one direction is in the 50% range, but varies quite a bit. The other direction ranges from 16% to 100%. Generally if I see it getting close to 100% I know the link is going to drop. It comes right back up, usually at about 50%. I have tried 20MHz channels, 10MHz channels, 5MHz channels with about the same results from all. I have tried 5.2-5.3 frequencies and 5.7-5.8 frequencies. The higher frequencies work better, but still not well. All of the hardware except one 60' piece of LMR as been replaced. Ask me some questions and offer some suggestions as this one has me totally stumped. -- Scott Reed Owner NewWays Networking, LLC Wireless Networking Network Design, Installation and Administration Mikrotik Advanced Certified www.nwwnet.net (765) 855-1060
Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers
Scott, Can you give us an idea of link distance and antennas you are using. Is the 30' piece of LMR400 a factory made jumper of did you put the connectors on? Weatherproofing? Lightning arrestors? Pigtail jumpers? Trying to get an idea of what your link budget should be and where you stand now. You have said you have changed all the hardware except the LMR400. What hardware do you have and what have you changed. Let us know -B- On 1/30/2012 10:06 PM, Scott Reed wrote: I do want to look at it, but I have tried these links in the 5.3 range just to see what happened. No real difference, so I am not yet convinced that interference is it, but I can not come up with anything else. On 1/30/2012 9:41 PM, gregosb...@onlyinternet.net wrote: Scott, I've seen this with 2.4 ubnt and the airview results were misleading Trial and error was the only thing that helped me find the best channel... Spent the better part of two days fighting it. I put too must faith on the spectrum analysis and it sent me chasing my tail. Sent from my android device. -Original Message- From: Scott Reed sr...@nwwnet.net To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Mon, 30 Jan 2012 8:55 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers I will certainly be getting a UBNT something on at least one tower to see what is going on. I did e-mail the big tower owner about changes on it. I know we are the only operation on the smaller tower. On 1/30/2012 8:32 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: +1 on getting something that does spectral analysis. Any new neighbors on the tower you're sharing? Any new gear they might have turned up? Greg On Jan 30, 2012, at 8:08 PM, Eric Rogers wrote: To me, that really sounds like interference. Don't look at the noise floor. Get a UBNT in spectrum analyzer mode, and let it run for a little bit. I bet you find something bleeding over the frequency. Eric -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Monday, January 30, 2012 7:28 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers Update after more work today. Replaced all the electronics at one end early this morning. No real change. Replace the cable and antenna at that end this afternoon. When we got there the link was running with RSSI of around 67/70 and CCQ in the 50's both ways. Aligned the antenna and I watch the stats for a while while the climber we getting the old antenna off of the tower. Signal strength went to around 57/65 and quality was running in the high 80s to mid 90s. Thought it was fixed. Climber finished attaching new cable to tower as he came down. When He got to the bottom I checked things again. Signals are 67/70 and CCQ is all over the place. I have seen the CCQ jump from 90 to 14 at least once this evening. It didn't drop the link at 14, rather it climbed back up to nearly 80 and then dropped. I am at a complete loss as to what is going on. Oh, the last time I looked, noise floor was around -100 so SNR is running 30 to 40. On 1/29/2012 10:16 PM, Scott Reed wrote: Planned for tomorrow. On 1/29/2012 10:04 PM, Daniel White wrote: Maybe your replacement hardware is bad too. Have you tried another set? Daniel White (303) 746-3590 -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scott Reed Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2012 7:19 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers One end is just us and the 4 other links there are fine. The other is is us and at least 2 other WISPS, an FM repeater station, some public service repeaters, some commercial 2-way repeaters and ... Just looking at the tower, I don't think there is anything new, but I will ask the tower owner tomorrow. We changed everything at one end and all but the cable at the other. Other 5GHz links we have for either tower do not show symptoms of interference, but that does not mean that isn't our problem. On 1/28/2012 8:31 PM, Greg Ihnen wrote: If you replaced all gear and even tried a different coax in place of the 60' of LMR then it would have to be some kind of noise, coming in via the power lines or radiated. Who else is on the tower? Did you only replace/try different gear on one tower or did you try both ends? Have you done any spectral analysis? Greg On Jan 28, 2012, at 5:35 PM, Scott Reed wrote: I have a link that went bonkers last Saturday or Sunday and it has me stumped. RB433AH with XR5 at each end. Signals running around -69/-71. CCQ is the goofy one. Most of the time one direction is in the 50% range, but varies quite a bit. The other direction ranges from 16% to 100%. Generally if I see it getting close to 100% I know the link is going to drop. It comes right back up, usually at about 50%. I have tried 20MHz channels, 10MHz channels,
Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers
Interference. Don't believe the noise floor reading. I do not think it is implemented correctly on the Atheros chip. On 1/30/2012 4:28 PM, Scott Reed wrote: Update after more work today. Replaced all the electronics at one end early this morning. No real change. Replace the cable and antenna at that end this afternoon. When we got there the link was running with RSSI of around 67/70 and CCQ in the 50's both ways. Aligned the antenna and I watch the stats for a while while the climber we getting the old antenna off of the tower. Signal strength went to around 57/65 and quality was running in the high 80s to mid 90s. Thought it was fixed. Climber finished attaching new cable to tower as he came down. When He got to the bottom I checked things again. Signals are 67/70 and CCQ is all over the place. I have seen the CCQ jump from 90 to 14 at least once this evening. It didn't drop the link at 14, rather it climbed back up to nearly 80 and then dropped. I am at a complete loss as to what is going on. Oh, the last time I looked, noise floor was around -100 so SNR is running 30 to 40. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Backhaul Link gone bonkers
You can with the newer stuff in MT and Ubnt. The noise floor in not spectrum scan modes is complete garbage, like you say. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Jan 30, 2012 11:41 PM, Gary Garrett ggarr...@nidaho.net wrote: Interference. Don't believe the noise floor reading. I do not think it is implemented correctly on the Atheros chip. On 1/30/2012 4:28 PM, Scott Reed wrote: Update after more work today. Replaced all the electronics at one end early this morning. No real change. Replace the cable and antenna at that end this afternoon. When we got there the link was running with RSSI of around 67/70 and CCQ in the 50's both ways. Aligned the antenna and I watch the stats for a while while the climber we getting the old antenna off of the tower. Signal strength went to around 57/65 and quality was running in the high 80s to mid 90s. Thought it was fixed. Climber finished attaching new cable to tower as he came down. When He got to the bottom I checked things again. Signals are 67/70 and CCQ is all over the place. I have seen the CCQ jump from 90 to 14 at least once this evening. It didn't drop the link at 14, rather it climbed back up to nearly 80 and then dropped. I am at a complete loss as to what is going on. Oh, the last time I looked, noise floor was around -100 so SNR is running 30 to 40. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
