Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
There is two paths to take young kirk.
Wise one is to avoid that path altogether.
Confucius say better to consult your cpa than your lawyer
{BONG}
Kurt Fankhauser wrote:
Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the
right
to impose an imcome tax...
I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to
pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think
they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out
on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just
type income tax on Youtube.
Kurt Fankhauser
WAVELINC
P.O. Box 126
Bucyrus, OH 44820
419-562-6405
www.wavelinc.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests
which they will use against you.
Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around...
Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right
to impose an imcome tax...
I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone...
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Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
That was what Wesley Snipes thought... -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2008 1:27 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests which they will use against you. Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around... Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Compensation yes, I'm not convinced it's always just. I have a particular problem when property is taken from one private citizen to be given to another (redevelopment). -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:47 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach without just compensation It is taken every day of the week. And we always provide just compensation - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 9:26 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach ...nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation. I don't consider that negotiable. Just wanted to be clear with you about what part I referred to. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Chuck McCown - 2 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 8:13 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I think you should re-read the constitution. Interstate commerce, eminent domain. I can come (as a public utility) and TAKE your property. Read it. 5th amendment. (not just for pleading the fifth). (And I have done this in the past when forced into it). You want to use the commons of the nation, prepare to be regulated. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 7:54 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Below. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Chuck McCown [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Friday, May 16, 2008 11:19 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Hold your horses there a bit, the FCC is tasked to produce the highest and best use for the public commonly held electromagnetic spectrum. This is accomplished by mandating we work for free? I'm sorry, Did you not read the Consitution? My time, my labor, my work, my intellectual property, my money, etc, ARE NEVER TO BE TAKEN. They have a stewardship and are trying to do their job. And? We exist due to the relaxation of their modulation regulations and the fact they continually elbow the hams off their turf. This is covered by the legal doctrine of the commons. I can remember when spread spectrum was not allowed (not too long ago). I can remember when the ISM bands were created. The FCC is our friend, whether or not you believe it. Friend? NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! NEVER! If you ever think that, you have become a comfortable slave. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ - --- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ - --- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- -- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -- -- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Sigh, I'm glad you are the moderator Rick. Ron Wallace Hahnron, Inc. 220 S. Jackson Dt. Addison, MI 49220 Phone: (517)547-8410 Mobile: (517)605-4542 e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Rick Harnish [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 04:16 PM To: ''WISPA General List'' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach It looks like Mark from Neofast is back disguised as muddyfrogwater. How fun is this? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:49 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. T he only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it. This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 peo ple in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes To: 'WISPA General List' Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1 :19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers. Is WISPA going to lobby
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. That is why Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years... On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 12:27 AM, Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests which they will use against you. Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around... Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Victoria Proffer CEO St. Louis Broadband Visit us @ www.StLBroadband.com 314-974-5600 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Your wrong, Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years because a JURY felt he should. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Victoria Proffer Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 10:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. That is why Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years... On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 12:27 AM, Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests which they will use against you. Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around... Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Victoria Proffer CEO St. Louis Broadband Visit us @ www.StLBroadband.com 314-974-5600 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Then The JURY members were uneducated boobs... a little reading and it is very evident he should not be in jail.part of the scare tactic the IRS uses every yearsad but true If one wanted to read more http://www.originalintent.org/ Chuck Moses -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser Sent: May 19, 2008 10:45 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Your wrong, Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years because a JURY felt he should. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Victoria Proffer Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 10:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. That is why Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years... On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 12:27 AM, Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests which they will use against you. Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around... Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Victoria Proffer CEO St. Louis Broadband Visit us @ www.StLBroadband.com 314-974-5600 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ __ NOD32 3110 (20080519) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Why is he in jail then? Bad lawyer? He should get Tony Montana's lawyer ... he's so good, that by tomorrow morning all the IRS would be working in Alaska Gino A. Villarini [EMAIL PROTECTED] Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of CHUCK M Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 2:00 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Then The JURY members were uneducated boobs... a little reading and it is very evident he should not be in jail.part of the scare tactic the IRS uses every yearsad but true If one wanted to read more http://www.originalintent.org/ Chuck Moses -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser Sent: May 19, 2008 10:45 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Your wrong, Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years because a JURY felt he should. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Victoria Proffer Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 10:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. That is why Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years... On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 12:27 AM, Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests which they will use against you. Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around... Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Victoria Proffer CEO St. Louis Broadband Visit us @ www.StLBroadband.com 314-974-5600 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ __ NOD32 3110 (20080519) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Hey don't get me wrong, when I know that the Federal Reserve is a private banking institute that only a few privileged benefit from its existence, I have to say that there is room for improvement in this country. When I understand the Constitution as it was meant to be understood and then look at the acts of Congress and the office of the Chief Commander, again I know that there is room for improvement. However, this thread is not about that at all, it is about the FCC imposing certain reporting on ISPs, WISPs, etc. to show where there needs to be room for improvement in this country. I have to agree with Scriv on most of this, but if it is the FCC's intention to shift the change of responsibility and put a lot of burdensome paperwork on to the ISP, than there needs to be some sort of compensation. I don't mean necessarily in a monetary commitment, but maybe spectrum, tax breaks, etc. Just my opinion. On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 12:45 PM, Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Your wrong, Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years because a JURY felt he should. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Victoria Proffer Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 10:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. That is why Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years... On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 12:27 AM, Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests which they will use against you. Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around... Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Victoria Proffer CEO St. Louis Broadband Visit us @ www.StLBroadband.com 314-974-5600 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Victoria Proffer CEO St. Louis Broadband Visit us @ www.StLBroadband.com 314-974-5600
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
When ya'll get done jawjacking about crap that isn't going to get to a solution I could use some guidence about this. (There are no plans to create Block level boundary files.) http://www.census.gov/geo/www/cob/bdy_files.html With this info we can put together a self indexing program that only needs the information you allready have. It's not that big of deal provided we don't have to pay for the census data. Frank - Original Message - From: CHUCK M [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 11:00 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Then The JURY members were uneducated boobs... a little reading and it is very evident he should not be in jail.part of the scare tactic the IRS uses every yearsad but true If one wanted to read more http://www.originalintent.org/ Chuck Moses -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser Sent: May 19, 2008 10:45 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Your wrong, Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years because a JURY felt he should. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Victoria Proffer Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 10:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. That is why Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years... On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 12:27 AM, Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests which they will use against you. Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around... Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Victoria Proffer CEO St. Louis Broadband Visit us @ www.StLBroadband.com 314-974-5600 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ __ NOD32 3110 (20080519) Information
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
a google earth census data viewer, along with info on how it was created: http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1697,2102559,00.asp On May 19, 2008, at 5:52 PM, Frank Crawford wrote: When ya'll get done jawjacking about crap that isn't going to get to a solution I could use some guidence about this. (There are no plans to create Block level boundary files.) http://www.census.gov/geo/www/cob/bdy_files.html With this info we can put together a self indexing program that only needs the information you allready have. It's not that big of deal provided we don't have to pay for the census data. Frank - Original Message - From: CHUCK M [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 11:00 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Then The JURY members were uneducated boobs... a little reading and it is very evident he should not be in jail.part of the scare tactic the IRS uses every yearsad but true If one wanted to read more http://www.originalintent.org/ Chuck Moses -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser Sent: May 19, 2008 10:45 AM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Your wrong, Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years because a JURY felt he should. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Victoria Proffer Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 10:38 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. That is why Wesley Snipes is going to jail for 3 years... On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 12:27 AM, Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests which they will use against you. Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around... Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Victoria Proffer CEO St. Louis Broadband Visit us @ www.StLBroadband.com 314-974-5600 WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers. Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to sell us down the river by lobbying for it? It seemed that no organized resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from bankruptcy court to show for it. Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over and getting reamed? insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Rick Harnish [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 6:03 AM Subject: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/?p=215FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Filed under: HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/?cat=1General at 7:02 am HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/?p=215#respond;(no comments) HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/wp-admin/post.php?action=editpost=215;(e) WASHINGTON-As expected, federal regulators on Wednesday voted to overhaul the way they measure how widely broadband
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
It looks like Mark from Neofast is back disguised as muddyfrogwater. How fun is this? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:49 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers. Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to sell us down the river by lobbying for it? It seemed that no organized resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with mountains
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
ROFL LMFAO !!! I forgot about Mark form NeoFast, that's too funny... Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Harnish Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 4:16 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach It looks like Mark from Neofast is back disguised as muddyfrogwater. How fun is this? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:49 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour intensive for anyone with more than 20
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
It's actually fairly trivial to geocode street (billing?) addresses with something like Google Maps.. to a level that's certainly more precise than census divisions. By trivial, I mean - I hacked together a Python/javascript webapp to do just this a few weeks ago, in a few hours (including the time to look at the Google Maps API ) for a different project. and my background is architecture... not a programming. As someone else pointed out, if the FCC can't provide a tool to do this, I will personally set something up, host it, and offer my services for beer. :) - Japhy On Sun, May 18, 2008 at 4:22 PM, Kurt Fankhauser [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ROFL LMFAO !!! I forgot about Mark form NeoFast, that's too funny... Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Rick Harnish Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 4:16 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach It looks like Mark from Neofast is back disguised as muddyfrogwater. How fun is this? -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:49 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
ROFL LMFAO !!! I forgot about Mark form NeoFast, that's too funny... I was wondering how long it'd be before someone started making Mark sock-puppet jokes. This new fellow, like Mark, does occasionally make some valid points, he just goes about making them in a very silly way. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
I was just going to say that... -- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Rick Harnish [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 8:14 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach It is Mark http://www.muddyfrogwater.us -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David E. Smith Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 9:11 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach ROFL LMFAO !!! I forgot about Mark form NeoFast, that's too funny... I was wondering how long it'd be before someone started making Mark sock-puppet jokes. This new fellow, like Mark, does occasionally make some valid points, he just goes about making them in a very silly way. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.20/1453 - Release Date: 5/18/2008 9:31 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.20/1453 - Release Date: 5/18/2008 9:31 AM WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Hi John. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: John Scrivner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Sunday, May 18, 2008 10:18 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I usually bite my tongue when I see people who have a holy war mentality against any government involvement in industry. This is usually because I tend to agree in keeping a light touch in regulation. I have to speak up though when I am being lumped into a category of lobotomized sheep. That is going too far. You're the arbiter of the what's reasonable? I am going to tell you what is going to happen to you if you do not spend a little time learning how to tell the FCC who and where you are serving broadband. I am also going to tell you why they are asking. If you do not like my answers then feel free to debate them. Please refrain from referring to me or WISPA as lobotomized sheep. I will not take it well if you use such derogatory terms to paint a picture of me and my organization. I didn't know you owned WISPA. It's not yours. When WISPA started, I actually believed you were a man of principle and judgement. I thought it in good hands. I even thought we agreed on fundamental principles about the nation and govenrment and politics. Here is what will happen if you ignore the FCC request for information. The FCC will do nothing. They will not fine you. They will not hunt you down. They will also not help you. You will be invisible to the FCC. Congratulations. You will not be recognized on the federal level as being part of the industry. All your hard work will count for nothing in DC. John: It never, ever, ever, EVER will. Nothing I do or you do, all of us collectively do will ever get me or any other person anything more than a little adrenaline bump for being in the halls of power. We can brown-nose and play nice forever, and even if we somehow manage to get some person friendly to our cause... The next personell change wipes it all out. We'll have given, they'll have taken, and NOTHING will have changed except that. We'll still be left with the obligations, and any so-called good will will be as transitory as a snowflake in hell. The long-term effects of your cloaking will be much more insidious. Government reports and policy over time will be in part based on the results of your inaction. When larger telcos ask for tax relief and subsidies for building out broadband into unserved areas they will use the fact that your area is NOT served as justification for having Uncle Sam pay them to build out your area. USF reformation for broadband funding will be targeted to help others, who report broadband coverage, to build out your area. The USDA will allow funding to go to larger broadband companies to build your area since reports show it is not being served. The big bad government and telcos will then be out to get you. Why? Because you are invisible and they are using that against you. Who is at fault when that happens? It will be a bit like complaining that someone runs over you while you are dressed in black walking down the middle of the road at night. We can take and embrace EVERY bit of manure and every mandate the FCC or anyone else hands out smiling and pretending to love it and the EXACT same outcome will still occur. Now I am going to tell you why they want this information. The FCC wants this information because they have to measure this. It is a matter of law. The federal government monitors itself on many levels. In the FCC's case they are looking at broadband coverage to see if they are doing their job to make sure that our country has access to broadband. There is law in place to make them provide this data. The older reports were criticized by many for not telling the whole story. This led to them asking for more information. Yes, we're all familiar with the process... at least the public part of it, that got us where we are. I look at broadband reporting different than you do. I want more spectrum. I want protections for the spectrum I use. I want to see us have the FCC as our friend if we have interference issues. I also know that they are the stewards of the public spectrum I use. I did not have to pay billions of dollars to use it. Broadband reporting helps them to see if the spectrum we have is being used to serve broadband. If we report customer growth using spectrum then we show the system works. And we can live with this illusion for how long? Congressional mandate created 3650, if memory serves. Can you tell us, to this date, what all the reporting and accepting mandates without question or objection got us? MORE OF THE SAME. Precisely. Nothing more, nothing less.What's on the horizon that will be a reward for all of this? Absolutely NOTHING. The hope of loans or grants from the government
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I don't know if you are aware of this but there is no law requiring you to pay income tax, have you ever read any of the U.S. code? Why do you think they want to pass a federal sales tax so bad, cause all this is coming out on the internet and people are starting to stop paying the income tax. Just type income tax on Youtube. Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chuck McCown - 2 Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 12:53 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach While at it, bill the IRS for your time in filling out their data requests which they will use against you. Ditto the census bureau, you must be really steamed when they roll around... Or perhaps you are one of those that doesn't believe the govt has the right to impose an imcome tax... I feel godwins law about to be invoked. Tinfoil hats anyone... WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
I happen to agree with you on this. Completely. I also don't think it's any business of the politicians whether or not I were a seat belt. But I've gotten tired of paying the tickets so I wear one. Vote out the incumbents until there are so many new people in office that they spend all of their time learning how things work and don't have time to screw with us. Until that's done though, lets deal with reality. marlon - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:49 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
OTS--- Congrats on the Lifetime Achievement of WISP, Mr. Schaffer. You most certainly deserve it! On Thu, May 15, 2008 at 10:10 PM, Marlon K. Schafer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I happen to agree with you on this. Completely. I also don't think it's any business of the politicians whether or not I were a seat belt. But I've gotten tired of paying the tickets so I wear one. Vote out the incumbents until there are so many new people in office that they spend all of their time learning how things work and don't have time to screw with us. Until that's done though, lets deal with reality. marlon - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:49 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers. Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to sell us down the river by lobbying for it? It seemed that no organized resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from bankruptcy court to show for it. Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over and getting reamed? insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Rick Harnish [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 6:03 AM Subject: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/?p=215FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Filed under: HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/?cat=1General at 7:02 am HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/?p=215#respond;(no comments) HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/wp-admin/post.php?action=editpost=215;(e) WASHINGTON-As expected, federal regulators on Wednesday voted to overhaul the way they measure how widely broadband is available across the United States. For years, the Federal Communications Commission has been drawing up reports on the state of U.S. Internet access availability based on methodology that considers 200 kilobits per second (Kbps) service to be high speed-and such access to be widely available even in ZIP codes that may, in reality, house only one connection. The decision to move away from that methodology is potentially significant. Critics, both inside and outside the agency, have charged that the inadequacy of data that the FCC collects semiannually from Internet service providers hinders both the government's ability to set smart pro-broadband policies and could slow investment on the technology side. It could also help federal regulators determine whether HYPERLINK http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9897103-7.htmlthe United States is really as far behind in broadband penetration as some international studies have suggested during the past few years. If not for good government data, our economy would come to a screeching halt, said Commissioner Michael Copps, a Democrat. For example, manufacturers depend on unemployment and gross domestic product figures to set their production targets, and schools and hospitals rely on U.S. Census numbers to project demand for their services, he said. When companies and investors put money into e-commerce or voice over Internet Protocol or Internet video.they need to know what kind of broadband infrastructure America actually has, Copps said. Democratic Commissioner Jonathan Adelstein said, This is really the first step toward the national broadband strategy that we so desperately need. Despite his support for the new data collection method, FCC Chairman Kevin Martin said he believes the United States has made incredible strides in broadband deployment since he joined the commission in 2001, with the number of lines growing from 9 million to more than 100 million. Still, he acknowledged, there is certainly more work to be done. The FCC, as is typical, won't release the full text of the changes it adopted for a few weeks, but here's
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers. Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to sell us down the river by lobbying for it? It seemed that no organized resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from bankruptcy court to show for it. Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over and getting reamed? insert witty tagline here
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
I guess a benefit I can see (out west here) is that we constantly hear of the need for government to step in and provide broadband because of the lack of such. If there was a comprehensive coverage map, projects like UTOPIA, iProvo and Philladelphia/Earthlink might not ever launch. They might be more inclined to allow WISPs to become ETC and USF eligible as well as become RUS borrowers and POLRs. But first we have to prove we are getting the job done. Coverage maps are one way to prove that. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 2:49 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
I kinda think that the news about municipal operatoins would provide reasonable evidence why public provision of such is is SUCH a bad idea... insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Chuck McCown - 2 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:56 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I guess a benefit I can see (out west here) is that we constantly hear of the need for government to step in and provide broadband because of the lack of such. If there was a comprehensive coverage map, projects like UTOPIA, iProvo and Philladelphia/Earthlink might not ever launch. They might be more inclined to allow WISPs to become ETC and USF eligible as well as become RUS borrowers and POLRs. But first we have to prove we are getting the job done. Coverage maps are one way to prove that. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 2:49 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Steve, This data is not being reported by census tracts I believe it is supposed to be done to the census block or block group which is a much smaller area. I'll dig around for the free on line sources to see if there is a way to do this by anyone without having GIS software. If I dig that up I'll post some links. Thank You, Brian Webster www.wirelessmapping.com http://www.wirelessmapping.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Steve Barnes Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:19 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers. Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to sell us down the river by lobbying for it? It seemed that no organized resistance existed for the first mandate to report, and unless we start defending ourselves from the do-gooders in DC, we're going to end up with mountains of work and nothing but a headache and some legal papers from bankruptcy court to show for it. Every industry I know of is VEHEMENT in telling the federal goverment to back off from mandates... Why does the ISP industry just keep rolling over and getting reamed? insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Rick Harnish [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 6:03 AM Subject: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/?p=215FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Filed under: HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/?cat=1General at 7:02 am HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/?p=215#respond;(no comments) HYPERLINK http://www.wispa.org/wp-admin/post.php?action=editpost=215;(e) WASHINGTON-As expected, federal regulators on Wednesday voted to overhaul the way they measure how widely broadband is available across the United States. For years, the Federal Communications Commission has been drawing up reports on the state of U.S. Internet access availability based on methodology that considers 200 kilobits per second (Kbps) service to be high speed-and such access to be widely available even in ZIP codes that may, in reality, house only one connection. The decision to move away from that methodology is potentially significant. Critics, both inside and outside the agency, have charged that the inadequacy of data that the FCC collects semiannually from Internet service providers hinders both the government's ability to set smart pro-broadband policies and could slow investment on the technology side. It could also help federal regulators determine whether HYPERLINK http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9897103-7.htmlthe United States is really as far behind in broadband penetration as some international studies have suggested during the past few years. If not for good government data, our economy would come to a screeching halt, said Commissioner Michael Copps, a Democrat. For example, manufacturers depend on unemployment and gross domestic product figures to set their production targets, and schools and hospitals rely on U.S. Census numbers to project demand for their services, he said. When companies and investors put money into e-commerce or voice over Internet Protocol or Internet video.they need to know what kind of broadband infrastructure America actually has
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
Well based on your comments I can certainly understand your point of view and frustrations. I was just trying to help out and assist WISP's so they can easily comply with the new requirements. Thank You, Brian Webster www.wirelessmapping.com http://www.wirelessmapping.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 4:49 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Im going to repost a response I made privately, leaving off the other person... I want to be clear what's really bothering me lately. == Maybe I should be more clear. I fail to see why I should have to conduct even 1 minute's free labor... The results of which are going to result absolutely NO benefit to me, and then we'll all get to see some politicians claim credit for the spread of broadband, even though that spread has been solely the result of some of us working our butts off, and risking our own money and 12 hour days. I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. I doubt any of us, save a handful who cover large areas, could benefit at all. I know I make my expansions based on on-the-ground efforts, going to door to door and finding out who has broadband, who doesn't and then figuring out how to fill the gaps, some of which are as small as a housing development with 10 houses in it.This will never be figured out by the FCC or any agency. I'm DOING the work that needs to be done. Why on earth should I do free labor while doing it? But I'll bet that on a more macro scale, all we do is provide the directions for bigger guys deciding what towns or cities to deploy in without spending a dime in research. I know I buy a lot of $140 (and climbing) tanks of diesel to find areas not covered and then cover them, and then go to door to door to sign up people. I have perhaps 20,000 people in my targeted market, which covers everything from farms and vineyards to forested mountains, and it's an hour and a half to drive across from the farthest customers now, and in a fe months it's going to be close to two hours. So, why on earth should I then be required to expend more time and effort and possibly money, just to tell someone else where to go for free? Perhaps I'm just irked because the heavy hand of both state and federal govenrments is coming down on a lot of what we do - I may soon need a contractor's license and AND hire a licensed electrician... to be a WISP, of all things. If that's the case, my customers will become unserved. And there is NOBODY in my corner fighting this either federally or at the state level. Rather, every organization I've uncovered is just nodding and smiling like some lobotomized sheep. insert witty tagline here - Original Message - From: Steve Barnes [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'WISPA General List' wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:19 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I agree, I would also like to know the position of WISPA. It looks like another great way for some company to make extra income off of my already short bottom line. The current reporting is a pain but can be completed in an hour or so. I am not privileged to have GIS software and data setting around for all my data to interface with. Besides in my area the census track is larger then the ZIP's. So they will get less exact data. Steve Barnes Executive Manager PCS-WIN RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service (765)584-2288 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 3:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA]FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach I'm curious to know WISPA's official position on this is. Looking back in the archives, I see little discussion about this, but the only way this information is going to be obtained, is if ISP's are required to determine the location of each census unit and then plot on maps of the census unit each customer and count them up. At this moment, I have no idea what a census unit is, how it is determined, or even how to find out that information, much less plot hundreds of customers spread over thousands of square miles. Frankly, I haven't the time. Unless software exists to automate this, this is going to be rather man-hour intensive for anyone with more than 20 broadband customers. Is WISPA going to lobby to defend us from this big pile of free labor the FCC wants us to do so they can claim political credit, or are they going to sell us down the river by lobbying
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
I can find absolutely no reason to think that ANY of us are going to benefit from this. The only people who could possibly benefit, would be the Qwest's and the Clearwires of the world, who have publicly financed expansion research done for them. If the collated data are made publicly available, there's no reason you can't gain exactly the same benefits as 'they' do. This is assuming data are made available at a sufficiently granular level as to be of benefit to anyone; to the best of my knowledge, this hasn't been the case in the past. As an aside, at least on the old FCC 477, you have the option of requesting that your company's data not be publicly disclosed. I'm not immediately sure why anyone would choose that option, but it's there. David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach
So we will have to report all connections that are 768k or higher? Does that mean if we have customers hooked up with 750k connections that we don't have to file? Kurt Fankhauser WAVELINC P.O. Box 126 Bucyrus, OH 44820 419-562-6405 www.wavelinc.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 2:09 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC approves new method for tracking broadband's reach Notice he says with the number of lines growing from 9 million to more than 100 million. Unless I feel asleep, wireless uses no lines, but that statement comes from where Martin is in bed with the telcos...for some reason he refuses to understand that there are other providers TRYING to offer broadband besides telcos and DSL. -- Original Message -- From: Rick Harnish [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Date: Sat, 10 May 2008 09:03:44 -0400 Despite his support for the new data collection method, FCC Chairman Kevin Martin said he believes the United States has made incredible strides in broadband deployment since he joined the commission in 2001, with the number of lines growing from 9 million to more than 100 million. Still, he acknowledged, there is certainly more work to be done. Dial-Up Internet service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $9.99/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
