Re: [WISPA] Topic change - Trade Association Was: Report: FCC to PunishComcast Over Web Blocking

2008-07-14 Thread Ryan Langseth
Can we please kill this thread,  nothing new has been said in it in the 
last three days (or year...),  its redundant and repetitive. 

Ryan

-- 
Ryan Langseth
System Administrator
InvisiMax
email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
phone: 218.745.6030
Cell: 701.739.1577




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Re: [WISPA] Topic change - Trade Association Was: Report: FCC to PunishComcast Over Web Blocking

2008-07-12 Thread reader


insert witty tagline here

- Original Message - 
From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 8:53 AM
Subject: [WISPA] Topic change - Trade Association Was: Report: FCC to 
PunishComcast Over Web Blocking



 I will got out here and say it. There is NO excuse not to support WISPA, 
 NONE! So for all of you on this general list not
 supporting WISPA, you are losing out on an opportunity to make your 
 livelihood last and support your families for years to
 come. $25 a month is a small price to pay for some representation in a 
 industry that is supporting yourself and families. I
 am sure you can find that much on wasted expenses every month.


Yes, there is.   Until the current leadership gets their head out of the 
sand and starts fighting FOR US, instead of playing the FCC's patsy, I will 
not give them another dollar.

When the boys came back from DC and posting to the lists that CALEA and 
the reporting mandates were good things, I could no longer in good 
conscience give them another dollar to use to use AGAINST US.   Whatever 
they did or said in DC on that topic, IN NO WAY REPRESENTED ME OR THE 
INTERESTS OF MY BUSINESS OR MY FUTURE.

When I saw certain WISPA leadership glom onto the idea of a CALEA mandate 
being an opportunity to extract more money and blackmail more memberships, I 
was immediately convinced that they were in it FOR THEM, and not us.I 
even saw posting by someone who said that CALEA would be good for WISPA. 
Not good for the members = good for WISPA?

Hell NO!  I will not play that game.

We got local, state and federal governemnt playing that game, why would I 
voluntarily add WISPA to it?





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Re: [WISPA] Topic change - Trade Association Was: Report: FCC to PunishComcast Over Web Blocking

2008-07-12 Thread Tom DeReggi
Frank,

 I agree. Very well said. Great analogy with the Auto industry, ISPs are not 
that different in that respect.
Nothing I can say to add, I think you covered it.

As for the ISPCON Donated membership.
I'm glad you brought it up. My take on it was... How come nobody stood up to 
defend the value of a membership? (That included me). I think, it just took 
us all by surprise.  In hind site, I wish I said something. After the fact, 
I thought of about 50 things I could have said. What I will say now is, I 
thought is was a VERY GENEROUS offer, and a great way to show support for 
WISPA.  I do personally thank you for all your support.  And I personally 
look forward to the insight you will bring us, to help WISPA unite our 
industry.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL  Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: Frank Muto [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2008 10:53 AM
Subject: [WISPA] Topic change - Trade Association Was: Report: FCC to 
PunishComcast Over Web Blocking


 Tom,
 I'll answer your question and I need to change up the topic. In part I 
 agree and I am not set against working this out, but
 Martin is setting up some bad and continuing precedence on how the FCC is 
 working within their legal purview. He is already
 on the hot seat with Congress on some of his actions.

 Topic Change:

 I can guarantee you, I will be all over any actions that effect my current 
 business, as I was unfortunately too late to make
 any difference saving our wireline business. Even when I co-founded the 
 WBIA back in Oct 2004, I knew it was too late, but I
 have learned a great deal from it.

 My take away was how much the deck is stacked against when your peers 
 don't give a hoot and unite under a common cause. But
 even when we showed the willingness to do something, we were able assembly 
 a consult of people to help us guide our efforts.
 Peter R., Jim Garrett and a few others can attest to what my co-founder 
 Cynthia de Lorenzi and myself were able to
 accomplish.

 Even though the RBOC's had tacit agreements underlying their competitive 
 opportunities. XO had their say about this,
 http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2005_Oct_21/ai_n15728657

 They are using even more group power between them against the CableCo's 
 with a new service called, http://movearoo.com/.
 Essentially this is a new wrapper around a company called 
 www.WhiteFence.com, and is powered by WhiteFence.

 That said, the Wi-Fi industry IMO is heading down the same path unless the 
 alleged thousands of Wireless providers, big and
 small all get together under a common effort. This goes without saying 
 that the vendor's themselves get with it as well.

 I'll assume there is enough purchasing power to make a difference, that 
 could effect how companies view their relationships
 with the wireless industry. Prior to my ISP life, I came from the 
 Independent automotive service industry, dealing in
 replacement parts and service spanning some 30 years. I can honestly tell 
 you if were not for the trade associations in every
 state, you may not be able to purchase replacement parts or take your auto 
 to a neighborhood service center.

 We fought for many years in keeping open trade in automotive service 
 industry. Even when your car was going electronic and
 computerized, the automakers tried keeping us out of the game. But, our 
 purchasing power with the tool companies and
 replacement parts industries, provided us with a significant amount of 
 leverage in keeping the big automakers from locking us
 out within their own monopoly.

 Trade associations can make a world of difference, but only when everyone 
 joins in. And there is NO excuse, NONE, ZIPPO, NADA
 for even a one-man shop or mom  pop shops from joining WISPA. We had 
 thousands of independent auto centers from one-man
 operations and up joining in on supporting our efforts to keep their 
 livelihoods as safe as possible.

 I will got out here and say it. There is NO excuse not to support WISPA, 
 NONE! So for all of you on this general list not
 supporting WISPA, you are losing out on an opportunity to make your 
 livelihood last and support your families for years to
 come. $25 a month is a small price to pay for some representation in a 
 industry that is supporting yourself and families. I
 am sure you can find that much on wasted expenses every month.

 It is also time for WISPA to come to grips with what they have 
 accomplished over the past year and stop walking over eggs
 shells, thinking that you may hurt someone's feelings. STOP working for 
 FREE! It is my opinion, that even though WISPA is a
 trade association, albeit a 503(c)6, it is still a business. A business 
 that needs capital to operate for the benefit of the
 members. And a business that should be working for those members and be 
 paid for their efforts. A business that continues to
 operate on a volunteer