Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
Congress, FBI, FEMA, FCC (then the different divisions within the FCC), etc. In some areas we aren't yet a player and in others, WISPs have been a player for several years. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: John Scrivner j...@mvn.net To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 11:14:05 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! What's that supposed to mean? Scriv On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 9:13 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net wrote: I guess the reference to not being a government player back then depends on what entity you're talking about. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org , WISPA's FCC Committee fcccommit...@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:51:32 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I see sending any kind of WISPA release as just election-year political gamesmanship that is likely to hurt us more than help us. This so-called tax is just being shifted from voice to broadband. The FCC's job (as mandated by Congress) is to extend broadband to everyone. Further, I don't agree that the FCC is trying to put us out of business. The USF tables have been heavily tilted against us because in the past (like 5 years ago) WISPs were not a player at the government level. We were not organized enough then to show up and make our voice heard. Now we are organized, our voice is being heard and we're making pretty decent headway. I'd say we stick to our business of advocating effectively to advance our industry and leave the tax and spend gamesmanship to the professional politicians. jack On 8/29/2012 11:24 AM, Forbes Mercy wrote: I wonder if it would benefit us to send a New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word tax and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://www.linktechs.net ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5231 - Release Date: 08/28/12 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
I thought only Congress could make tax rules. Does the current law allow the FCC to impose USF on whatever they want? On 8/29/2012 4:40 PM, Jack Unger wrote: I also think it's a tax too. I just don't think we should lose our cool and do destructive things that could hurt our industry just because it's a tax. On 8/29/2012 1:27 PM, Jeff Broadwick - Lists wrote: I agree with your conclusions Jack, but it is absolutely a tax. Regards, Jeff Sales Manager, Blue Technology 574-935-8484 x106 (US/Can) 574-220-7826 (Cell) +1 574-935-8484 (Int'l) From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jack Unger Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 3:52 PM To: WISPA General List; WISPA's FCC Committee Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I see sending any kind of WISPA "release" as just election-year political gamesmanship that is likely to hurt us more than help us. This so-called "tax" is just being shifted from voice to broadband. The FCC's job (as mandated by Congress) is to extend broadband to everyone. Further, I don't agree that the FCC is trying to put us out of business. The USF tables have been heavily tilted against us because in the past (like 5 years ago) WISPs were not a "player" at the government level. We were not organized enough then to show up and make our voice heard. Now we are organized, our voice is being heard and we're making pretty decent headway. I'd say we stick to our business of advocating effectively to advance our industry and leave the "tax and spend" gamesmanship to the professional politicians. jack On 8/29/2012 11:24 AM, Forbes Mercy wrote: I wonder if it would benefit us to send a "New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You" release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word "tax" and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
At 8/30/2012 09:07 AM, you wrote: I thought only Congress could make tax rules. Does the current law allow the FCC to impose USF on whatever they want? Of course they do. USF is part of TA96. It is not labeled tax because it doesn't go through the Treasury and the General Fund, but is privately administered by USAC on contract to the FCC. That way Congress could say that it wasn't a tax. And to be honest, it was replacing a different cross-subsidy mechanism that was even more broken. On 8/29/2012 4:40 PM, Jack Unger wrote: I also think it's a tax too. I just don't think we should lose our cool and do destructive things that could hurt our industry just because it's a tax. On 8/29/2012 1:27 PM, Jeff Broadwick - Lists wrote: I agree with your conclusions Jack, but it is absolutely a tax. Regards, Jeff Sales Manager, Blue Technology 574-935-8484 x106 (US/Can) 574-220-7826 (Cell) +1 574-935-8484 (Int'l) -- From: mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.orgwireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jack Unger Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 3:52 PM To: WISPA General List; WISPA's FCC Committee Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I see sending any kind of WISPA release as just election-year political gamesmanship that is likely to hurt us more than help us. This so-called tax is just being shifted from voice to broadband. The FCC's job (as mandated by Congress) is to extend broadband to everyone. Further, I don't agree that the FCC is trying to put us out of business. The USF tables have been heavily tilted against us because in the past (like 5 years ago) WISPs were not a player at the government level. We were not organized enough then to show up and make our voice heard. Now we are organized, our voice is being heard and we're making pretty decent headway. I'd say we stick to our business of advocating effectively to advance our industry and leave the tax and spend gamesmanship to the professional politicians. jack On 8/29/2012 11:24 AM, Forbes Mercy wrote: I wonder if it would benefit us to send a New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word tax and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.comhttp://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://www.linktechs.net/http://www.linktechs.net [] ___ Wireless mailing list mailto:Wireless@wispa.orgWireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 http://www.ask-wi.comwww.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 mailto:jun...@ask-wi.comjun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list mailto:Wireless@wispa.orgWireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.comwww.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5231 - Release Date: 08/28/12 ___ Wireless mailing list mailto:Wireless@wispa.orgWireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 http://www.ask-wi.comwww.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 mailto:jun...@ask-wi.comjun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
Chris, Let me reason this out with you and Jack. I've always felt WISPA is too conservative in simply making filings and a rare visit. I've felt that education of our Congressional members has helped them remember us when staff reviews new laws. What we haven't done is bear any pressure or seek to make our issues into the public consciousness. This is an election year, a rare moment when small issues become campaign promises (whether kept or not). I will only touch on politics for a moment, keep in mind a Democrat FCC Chairman is proud that he converted USF to CAF and seeks to expand it's revenue by adding broadband. The Republicans are screaming for 'no new tax' issues, just last night Ryan called out Corporate Welfare. Here we are with this huge outdated tax and the FCC wants to make it bigger by taxing a whole new industry. The main points we can make are: 1) Congress said no tax on the Internet and now the FCC wants to go around them and tax the Internet anyway 2) 100% of the new tax would go to corporate welfare not directly helping a single tax payer, it's socialized Internet 3) The Telco industry isn't even a Broadband company, they are a telephone company no more than cable is an Internet company. At least cable got investors to build their networks, telco wants the government to pay for all of their expansion. 4) The cost of Wireless to expand to areas is a fraction of the cost of wireline but is being completely left out. I think a properly briefed politician could get excited about helping to push our agenda, make it public and dramatically raise the profile of our discussion. Imagine a politician who took a pledge of no new taxes having to take on the burden of having approved a new tax in CAF. There is nothing radical about taking advantage of opportunities and the election cycle seems primed for our issues. Politics is always a radical and risky proposition but no one here has yet to say how this will hurt us other to say it's risky. I'm all ears. Forbes On 8/29/2012 11:37 AM, chris cooper wrote: I wouldnt do that in the pre election climate. It seems like it could be taken a couple of different ways, any one of which might alienate 50% of your customers. cc -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Forbes Mercy Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org; fcccommit...@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I wonder if it would benefit us to send a "New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You" release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word "tax" and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
Forbes There are roughly 60 days left before the election. I doubt I could get the local dog catcher candidate to take a policy position 60 days out from the election, much less a complicated position. The election has the nation polarized. In Ohio the race is neck and neck +/- a few points. I figure that represents my customers pretty well. If I believe that the lobbying efforts would be fruitless, why would I expose my business to retribution by alienating members of one party or the other? Just doesn't make sense to me. Chris -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Forbes Mercy Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2012 2:40 PM To: wireless@wispa.org; Legislative Activity for WISPA Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! Chris, Let me reason this out with you and Jack. I've always felt WISPA is too conservative in simply making filings and a rare visit. I've felt that education of our Congressional members has helped them remember us when staff reviews new laws. What we haven't done is bear any pressure or seek to make our issues into the public consciousness. This is an election year, a rare moment when small issues become campaign promises (whether kept or not). I will only touch on politics for a moment, keep in mind a Democrat FCC Chairman is proud that he converted USF to CAF and seeks to expand it's revenue by adding broadband. The Republicans are screaming for 'no new tax' issues, just last night Ryan called out Corporate Welfare. Here we are with this huge outdated tax and the FCC wants to make it bigger by taxing a whole new industry. The main points we can make are: 1) Congress said no tax on the Internet and now the FCC wants to go around them and tax the Internet anyway 2) 100% of the new tax would go to corporate welfare not directly helping a single tax payer, it's socialized Internet 3) The Telco industry isn't even a Broadband company, they are a telephone company no more than cable is an Internet company. At least cable got investors to build their networks, telco wants the government to pay for all of their expansion. 4) The cost of Wireless to expand to areas is a fraction of the cost of wireline but is being completely left out. I think a properly briefed politician could get excited about helping to push our agenda, make it public and dramatically raise the profile of our discussion. Imagine a politician who took a pledge of no new taxes having to take on the burden of having approved a new tax in CAF. There is nothing radical about taking advantage of opportunities and the election cycle seems primed for our issues. Politics is always a radical and risky proposition but no one here has yet to say how this will hurt us other to say it's risky. I'm all ears. Forbes On 8/29/2012 11:37 AM, chris cooper wrote: I wouldn't do that in the pre election climate. It seems like it could be taken a couple of different ways, any one of which might alienate 50% of your customers. cc -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Forbes Mercy Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org; fcccommit...@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I wonder if it would benefit us to send a New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word tax and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://towercoverage.com/ http://www.linktechs.net http://www.linktechs.net/ ___
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
+1 no corporate welfare! On Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 12:39 PM, Forbes Mercy forbes.me...@wabroadband.com wrote: Chris, Let me reason this out with you and Jack. I've always felt WISPA is too conservative in simply making filings and a rare visit. I've felt that education of our Congressional members has helped them remember us when staff reviews new laws. What we haven't done is bear any pressure or seek to make our issues into the public consciousness. This is an election year, a rare moment when small issues become campaign promises (whether kept or not). I will only touch on politics for a moment, keep in mind a Democrat FCC Chairman is proud that he converted USF to CAF and seeks to expand it's revenue by adding broadband. The Republicans are screaming for 'no new tax' issues, just last night Ryan called out Corporate Welfare. Here we are with this huge outdated tax and the FCC wants to make it bigger by taxing a whole new industry. The main points we can make are: 1) Congress said no tax on the Internet and now the FCC wants to go around them and tax the Internet anyway 2) 100% of the new tax would go to corporate welfare not directly helping a single tax payer, it's socialized Internet 3) The Telco industry isn't even a Broadband company, they are a telephone company no more than cable is an Internet company. At least cable got investors to build their networks, telco wants the government to pay for all of their expansion. 4) The cost of Wireless to expand to areas is a fraction of the cost of wireline but is being completely left out. I think a properly briefed politician could get excited about helping to push our agenda, make it public and dramatically raise the profile of our discussion. Imagine a politician who took a pledge of no new taxes having to take on the burden of having approved a new tax in CAF. There is nothing radical about taking advantage of opportunities and the election cycle seems primed for our issues. Politics is always a radical and risky proposition but no one here has yet to say how this will hurt us other to say it's risky. I'm all ears. Forbes On 8/29/2012 11:37 AM, chris cooper wrote: I wouldn’t do that in the pre election climate. It seems like it could be taken a couple of different ways, any one of which might alienate 50% of your customers. ** ** cc ** ** -Original Message- *From:* wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.orgwireless-boun...@wispa.org] *On Behalf Of *Forbes Mercy *Sent:* Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:25 PM *To:* wireless@wispa.org; fcccommit...@wispa.org *Subject:* Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! ** ** I wonder if it would benefit us to send a New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word tax and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/** ** ** ** Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://www.linktechs.net ** ** ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ** ** ** ** ** ** ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
I wonder if it would benefit us to send a "New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You" release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word "tax" and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://www.linktechs.net ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks" Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5231 - Release Date: 08/28/12 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
I wouldn't do that in the pre election climate. It seems like it could be taken a couple of different ways, any one of which might alienate 50% of your customers. cc -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Forbes Mercy Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:25 PM To: wireless@wispa.org; fcccommit...@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I wonder if it would benefit us to send a New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word tax and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://towercoverage.com/ http://www.linktechs.net http://www.linktechs.net/ ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5231 - Release Date: 08/28/12 inline: image001.jpg___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
I see sending any kind of WISPA "release" as just election-year political gamesmanship that is likely to hurt us more than help us. This so-called "tax" is just being shifted from voice to broadband. The FCC's job (as mandated by Congress) is to extend broadband to everyone. Further, I don't agree that the FCC is trying to put us out of business. The USF tables have been heavily tilted against us because in the past (like 5 years ago) WISPs were not a "player" at the government level. We were not organized enough then to show up and make our voice heard. Now we are organized, our voice is being heard and we're making pretty decent headway. I'd say we stick to our business of advocating effectively to advance our industry and leave the "tax and spend" gamesmanship to the professional politicians. jack On 8/29/2012 11:24 AM, Forbes Mercy wrote: I wonder if it would benefit us to send a "New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You" release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word "tax" and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://www.linktechs.net ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks" Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5231 - Release Date: 08/28/12 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks" Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
I agree with your conclusions Jack, but it is absolutely a tax. Regards, Jeff Sales Manager, Blue Technology 574-935-8484 x106 (US/Can) 574-220-7826 (Cell) +1 574-935-8484 (Int'l) _ From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jack Unger Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 3:52 PM To: WISPA General List; WISPA's FCC Committee Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I see sending any kind of WISPA release as just election-year political gamesmanship that is likely to hurt us more than help us. This so-called tax is just being shifted from voice to broadband. The FCC's job (as mandated by Congress) is to extend broadband to everyone. Further, I don't agree that the FCC is trying to put us out of business. The USF tables have been heavily tilted against us because in the past (like 5 years ago) WISPs were not a player at the government level. We were not organized enough then to show up and make our voice heard. Now we are organized, our voice is being heard and we're making pretty decent headway. I'd say we stick to our business of advocating effectively to advance our industry and leave the tax and spend gamesmanship to the professional politicians. jack On 8/29/2012 11:24 AM, Forbes Mercy wrote: I wonder if it would benefit us to send a New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word tax and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://towercoverage.com/ http://www.linktechs.net http://www.linktechs.net/ ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5231 - Release Date: 08/28/12 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com inline: image001.jpg___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
I also think it's a tax too. I just don't think we should lose our cool and do destructive things that could hurt our industry just because it's a tax. On 8/29/2012 1:27 PM, Jeff Broadwick - Lists wrote: I agree with your conclusions Jack, but it is absolutely a tax. Regards, Jeff Sales Manager, Blue Technology 574-935-8484 x106 (US/Can) 574-220-7826 (Cell) +1 574-935-8484 (Int'l) From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Jack Unger Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 3:52 PM To: WISPA General List; WISPA's FCC Committee Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I see sending any kind of WISPA "release" as just election-year political gamesmanship that is likely to hurt us more than help us. This so-called "tax" is just being shifted from voice to broadband. The FCC's job (as mandated by Congress) is to extend broadband to everyone. Further, I don't agree that the FCC is trying to put us out of business. The USF tables have been heavily tilted against us because in the past (like 5 years ago) WISPs were not a "player" at the government level. We were not organized enough then to show up and make our voice heard. Now we are organized, our voice is being heard and we're making pretty decent headway. I'd say we stick to our business of advocating effectively to advance our industry and leave the "tax and spend" gamesmanship to the professional politicians. jack On 8/29/2012 11:24 AM, Forbes Mercy wrote: I wonder if it would benefit us to send a "New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You" release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word "tax" and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://www.linktechs.net
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
I guess the reference to not being a government player back then depends on what entity you're talking about. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org, WISPA's FCC Committee fcccommit...@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:51:32 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I see sending any kind of WISPA release as just election-year political gamesmanship that is likely to hurt us more than help us. This so-called tax is just being shifted from voice to broadband. The FCC's job (as mandated by Congress) is to extend broadband to everyone. Further, I don't agree that the FCC is trying to put us out of business. The USF tables have been heavily tilted against us because in the past (like 5 years ago) WISPs were not a player at the government level. We were not organized enough then to show up and make our voice heard. Now we are organized, our voice is being heard and we're making pretty decent headway. I'd say we stick to our business of advocating effectively to advance our industry and leave the tax and spend gamesmanship to the professional politicians. jack On 8/29/2012 11:24 AM, Forbes Mercy wrote: I wonder if it would benefit us to send a New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word tax and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://www.linktechs.net ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5231 - Release Date: 08/28/12 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
What's that supposed to mean? Scriv On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 9:13 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.netwrote: I guess the reference to not being a government player back then depends on what entity you're talking about. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com - Original Message - From: Jack Unger jun...@ask-wi.com To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org, WISPA's FCC Committee fcccommit...@wispa.org Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2012 2:51:32 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! I see sending any kind of WISPA release as just election-year political gamesmanship that is likely to hurt us more than help us. This so-called tax is just being shifted from voice to broadband. The FCC's job (as mandated by Congress) is to extend broadband to everyone. Further, I don't agree that the FCC is trying to put us out of business. The USF tables have been heavily tilted against us because in the past (like 5 years ago) WISPs were not a player at the government level. We were not organized enough then to show up and make our voice heard. Now we are organized, our voice is being heard and we're making pretty decent headway. I'd say we stick to our business of advocating effectively to advance our industry and leave the tax and spend gamesmanship to the professional politicians. jack On 8/29/2012 11:24 AM, Forbes Mercy wrote: I wonder if it would benefit us to send a New Tax Coming to a Constituent Near You release where in this era of taxes being waged to pay off debt, a new tax is being proposed by the FCC to the broadband industry which will only serve to subsidize the telephone industry with broadband deriving zero benefit? Instead of defensive it's a pro-active move where politicians running under a no new taxes platform will have to roll it in. I know the FCC wouldn't be thrilled with us but we've felt all along the USF to CAF conversion was just the FCC helping the Telco industry to do a hostile takeover of our broadband industry with government aid and we shouldn't be afraid to say it. Forbes On 8/28/2012 2:28 PM, Jack Unger wrote: Throw out that word tax and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://www.linktechs.net ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2197 / Virus Database: 2437/5231 - Release Date: 08/28/12 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
At 8/28/2012 04:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message Content-Type: multipart/related; type=multipart/alternative; boundary=_=_NextPart_001_01CD855A.858D9814 http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ It's jut an idiotic screed from an idiotic extreme right-wing website that looks at everything through red-colored conspiracy glasses. USF was created by Congress in TA96 as a way to pay for telephone service in rural areas, mostly in fact red states, by taxing everyone, but mostly from blue states. At the time, all that officially mattered was POTS. (However, any facilities that could carry POTS could be subsidized, including Fiber to the Ranch. Only the actual ISP content was not subsidized.) Now POTS is declining so the FCC has decided that something called broadband should be subsidized instead. Now the right thing would have been to subsidize the telecommunications part of the service (basic service, el broadband) and allow open access competition to use it by ISPs and other content providers (la broadband). But the Bells wanted vertical integration to keep off those pesky ISPs. So the Cheney-Rove FCC revoked Computer II/III and took away the right of ISPs to use common carrier telco facilities, except dial-up. The Genechowski FCC then decided that this vertically-integrated broadband was more important than dial tone and so it will get the subsidies. The actual subsidy flow was capped so it, and the tax rate, will be lower than it would have been otherwise under the pre-2011 blank check USF. So money will flow from New York, Massachusetts, California, New Jersey, Rhode Island, and other states that are either a) almost all Bell or b) low cost, and go to Mississippi, Wyoming, Alaska, Iowa, the Dakotas, Idaho, Puerto Rico, and Utah, to name some big per-capita recipient states. This is hardly robbing the poor to give to the rich. It's a direct result of the two senators per state rule and the negotiations that led to the Telecom Act, a subsidy to rural states. WISPs are caught in the middle since they're the unsubsidized companies proving that in many places it is possible to do the job far more cheaply than the subsidy whores can do it. The FCC recognized that with the unsubsidized competitor rule that CenturyLink is trying to overturn. It's not perfect but WISPA did an excellent job of lobbying, certainly by the standards of the otherwise-does-a-great-possum-imitation ISP industry. So it could have been a lot worse -- the old USF would have funded ILECs to compete with WISPs anyway, and did so in some locations. -- Fred Goldsteink1io fgoldstein at ionary.com ionary Consulting http://www.ionary.com/ +1 617 795 2701 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
Funny, I don't recall rove or cheney heading the fcc. How about we dump all the taxes or fees or whatever they want to call it and really label the playing field? On Tuesday, August 28, 2012, Fred Goldstein fgoldst...@ionary.com wrote: At 8/28/2012 04:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message Content-Type: multipart/related; type=multipart/alternative; boundary=_=_NextPart_001_01CD855A.858D9814 http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ It's jut an idiotic screed from an idiotic extreme right-wing website that looks at everything through red-colored conspiracy glasses. USF was created by Congress in TA96 as a way to pay for telephone service in rural areas, mostly in fact red states, by taxing everyone, but mostly from blue states. At the time, all that officially mattered was POTS. (However, any facilities that could carry POTS could be subsidized, including Fiber to the Ranch. Only the actual ISP content was not subsidized.) Now POTS is declining so the FCC has decided that something called broadband should be subsidized instead. Now the right thing would have been to subsidize the telecommunications part of the service (basic service, el broadband) and allow open access competition to use it by ISPs and other content providers (la broadband). But the Bells wanted vertical integration to keep off those pesky ISPs. So the Cheney-Rove FCC revoked Computer II/III and took away the right of ISPs to use common carrier telco facilities, except dial-up. The Genechowski FCC then decided that this vertically-integrated broadband was more important than dial tone and so it will get the subsidies. The actual subsidy flow was capped so it, and the tax rate, will be lower than it would have been otherwise under the pre-2011 blank check USF. So money will flow from New York, Massachusetts, California, New Jersey, Rhode Island, and other states that are either a) almost all Bell or b) low cost, and go to Mississippi, Wyoming, Alaska, Iowa, the Dakotas, Idaho, Puerto Rico, and Utah, to name some big per-capita recipient states. This is hardly robbing the poor to give to the rich. It's a direct result of the two senators per state rule and the negotiations that led to the Telecom Act, a subsidy to rural states. WISPs are caught in the middle since they're the unsubsidized companies proving that in many places it is possible to do the job far more cheaply than the subsidy whores can do it. The FCC recognized that with the unsubsidized competitor rule that CenturyLink is trying to overturn. It's not perfect but WISPA did an excellent job of lobbying, certainly by the standards of the otherwise-does-a-great-possum-imitation ISP industry. So it could have been a lot worse -- the old USF would have funded ILECs to compete with WISPs anyway, and did so in some locations. -- Fred Goldsteink1io fgoldstein at ionary.com ionary Consultinghttp://www.ionary.com/ +1 617 795 2701 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
Elections in 70 days -- Sent from BlackBerry device Aleksander Freylekhman Sales Director North America Axxcelera Broadband Wireless a Moseley Company T: +1 (804) 864-4125 M: +1 (440) 220-2192 afreylekh...@axxcelera.com www.axxcelera.com From: Cameron Crum [mailto:cc...@wispmon.com] Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2012 05:15 PM To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich! Funny, I don't recall rove or cheney heading the fcc. How about we dump all the taxes or fees or whatever they want to call it and really label the playing field? On Tuesday, August 28, 2012, Fred Goldstein fgoldst...@ionary.commailto:fgoldst...@ionary.com wrote: At 8/28/2012 04:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message Content-Type: multipart/related; type=multipart/alternative; boundary=_=_NextPart_001_01CD855A.858D9814 http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ It's jut an idiotic screed from an idiotic extreme right-wing website that looks at everything through red-colored conspiracy glasses. USF was created by Congress in TA96 as a way to pay for telephone service in rural areas, mostly in fact red states, by taxing everyone, but mostly from blue states. At the time, all that officially mattered was POTS. (However, any facilities that could carry POTS could be subsidized, including Fiber to the Ranch. Only the actual ISP content was not subsidized.) Now POTS is declining so the FCC has decided that something called broadband should be subsidized instead. Now the right thing would have been to subsidize the telecommunications part of the service (basic service, el broadband) and allow open access competition to use it by ISPs and other content providers (la broadband). But the Bells wanted vertical integration to keep off those pesky ISPs. So the Cheney-Rove FCC revoked Computer II/III and took away the right of ISPs to use common carrier telco facilities, except dial-up. The Genechowski FCC then decided that this vertically-integrated broadband was more important than dial tone and so it will get the subsidies. The actual subsidy flow was capped so it, and the tax rate, will be lower than it would have been otherwise under the pre-2011 blank check USF. So money will flow from New York, Massachusetts, California, New Jersey, Rhode Island, and other states that are either a) almost all Bell or b) low cost, and go to Mississippi, Wyoming, Alaska, Iowa, the Dakotas, Idaho, Puerto Rico, and Utah, to name some big per-capita recipient states. This is hardly robbing the poor to give to the rich. It's a direct result of the two senators per state rule and the negotiations that led to the Telecom Act, a subsidy to rural states. WISPs are caught in the middle since they're the unsubsidized companies proving that in many places it is possible to do the job far more cheaply than the subsidy whores can do it. The FCC recognized that with the unsubsidized competitor rule that CenturyLink is trying to overturn. It's not perfect but WISPA did an excellent job of lobbying, certainly by the standards of the otherwise-does-a-great-possum-imitation ISP industry. So it could have been a lot worse -- the old USF would have funded ILECs to compete with WISPs anyway, and did so in some locations. -- Fred Goldsteink1io fgoldstein at ionary.comhttp://ionary.com ionary Consultinghttp://www.ionary.com/ +1 617 795 2701 ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Re: [WISPA] Oh Great take from the poor and give to the rich!
Throw out that word "tax" and everyone gets all excited but this is really old news and not really any news at all. Just the transition of the USF program (subsidies to extend phone service to rural areas) into the CAF program where the subsidies will now go to extend broadband service to the boonies. WISPA has made a ton of FCC filings on this already. Most of them are defensive in nature (preventing WISPs from being overbuilt) but a few are offensive - trying to open up the possibilities for WISPs that want subsidies (most don't) to get them. jack On 8/28/2012 1:20 PM, Jim Patient wrote: http://www.ijreview.com/2012/08/13896-fcc-may-soon-tax-internet-service/ Jim Patient Link Technologies, Inc. 314-735-0270 x102 http://wlan1.com http://towercoverage.com http://www.linktechs.net ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless -- Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. Author (2003) - "Deploying License-Free Wireless Wide-Area Networks" Serving the WISP Community since 1993 www.ask-wi.com 760-678-5033 jun...@ask-wi.com ___ Wireless mailing list Wireless@wispa.org http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
