[WSG] Accessibility and "fly out" menus

[Mary-Anne . Nayler]

I was wondering how members here feel about the accessibility of "Fly Out" 
menus. The type I'm talking about are CSS based, ie no JavaScript but I'd 
be interested to hear what people think about those that utilise 
JavaScript. 


~~
Mary-Anne Nayler
Senior Web Designer/Developer
Web Services Section
Medicare Australia
(02) 6124 6681






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Re: [WSG] intuitive text resizer for accessibility toolbar

[Felix Miata]

On 2007/06/21 00:12 (GMT-0400) Benedict Wyss apparently typed:

> I just searched on google and found a couple that left me feeling rather
> mentally limp, so your my next port of call.

> please pass back links to a text resizer that has the following ability:

I think what you want is to reinvent the wheel and clutter your page 
duplicating browser tools. One job of a modern web browser to provide its user 
with whatever text size adjustment is required to
make a page comfortable and/or usable. They all provide by default a size 
determined by scientific tests to be a size that works well for the broadest 
range of users, along with at least one tool to
tailor it to personal whim. Presumably each user has either already done so or 
found doing so unnecessary. All you need to do is accommodate them all by 
leaving the base size as you found it and
setting only contextual sizes relative to the base size presumptively chosen by 
each individual user. http://www.w3.org/QA/Tips/font-size 
http://www.lighthouse.org/accessibility/
http://www.informationarchitects.jp/100e2r?v=4
-- 
"Respect everyone." I Peter 2:17 NIV

 Team OS/2 ** Reg. Linux User #211409

Felix Miata  ***  http://mrmazda.no-ip.com/


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Re: [WSG] intuitive text resizer for accessibility toolbar

[Benedict Wyss]

To expand a bit further:

What is the standard?

  - multiple inc/decreases?
  - restore or not to restore?
  - a single increase and a single decrease?
  - no decrease?
  - simple v complex JS?
  - no inc or decrease? even

I also need to change the sizes of multiple elements in the main content
area only. ie: h1,2,3,4 and p, for starters.

Cheers,

On 6/21/07, Benedict Wyss <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:


Hi all,

I just searched on google and found a couple that left me feeling rather
mentally limp, so your my next port of call.

please pass back links to a text resizer that has the following ability:

   - specify tags
   - specify divs
   - decent instruction, not weak attempts
   - leave me feeling warm and fuzzy inside ;-)

thanks in advance,

Ben

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RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Thierry Koblentz]

> On Behalf Of Mike at Green-Beast.com
> I'm sort of just catching the end of this, but are you guys talking
> about
> something like what I did on my daughter's blog [1]?
> 
> [1] http://sarahcherim.com/ (look at the "Contribution Cow" on the
> sidebar)
> 
> I didn't use button (not sure if that's was the point or just making
> clickable image/text form posting).

Hi Mike,
That's a nice trick. As a side note, I think you could drop the "for"
attribute as you have the input element inside the label.

---
Regards,
Thierry | www.TJKDesign.com






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Re: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Mike at Green-Beast.com]

Thierry Koblentz wrote:
> I came up with this:
> http://www.tjkdesign.com/lab/button.asp
> But it requires to move the text out of the button :(

I'm sort of just catching the end of this, but are you guys talking about 
something like what I did on my daughter's blog [1]?

[1] http://sarahcherim.com/ (look at the "Contribution Cow" on the sidebar)

I didn't use button (not sure if that's was the point or just making 
clickable image/text form posting).

Cheers.
Mike Cherim

PS. Just a little disclaimer, looking at the image/text form on that site I 
realized I should have used a legend instead of the heading. It's not 
clickable in Opera either, by the way -- just the image.
 



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RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Thierry Koblentz]

> On Behalf Of Sander Aarts
> Thierry Koblentz schreef:
> > I came up with this:
> > http://www.tjkdesign.com/lab/button.asp
> > But it requires to move the text out of the button :(
> >
> 
> In Opera (9.21) not all of the text is clickable.

Hi Sander, thanks for the feedback. 
I just checked in Opera 8.5 and it is even worst, the whole button area is
clickable, which means much more than just the text. It seems that from v8.5
to v9.21 they went from one extreme to the other :)

---
Regards,
Thierry | www.TJKDesign.com






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[WSG] intuitive text resizer for accessibility toolbar

[Benedict Wyss]

Hi all,

I just searched on google and found a couple that left me feeling rather
mentally limp, so your my next port of call.

please pass back links to a text resizer that has the following ability:

  - specify tags
  - specify divs
  - decent instruction, not weak attempts
  - leave me feeling warm and fuzzy inside ;-)

thanks in advance,

Ben


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Re: Re : [WSG] Safari now on Windows

[Sander Aarts]

Pierre-Henri Lavigne schreef:

The staff members of your enterprise in charge of selling services / web sites 
can use the following text as an argument to not support IE Mac:
http://www.microsoft.com/mac/products/internetexplorer/internetexplorer.aspx?pid=internetexplorer
  
They only recommend Safari and not Firefox or Opera of course as Safari 
is (or was) no competition on Windows. I wonder if they keep 
recommending it now this has changed and Safari may even trigger some 
interest in Apple/MacOS from Windows users.


cheers,
Sander


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Re: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Sander Aarts]

Thierry Koblentz schreef:

I came up with this:
http://www.tjkdesign.com/lab/button.asp
But it requires to move the text out of the button :(
  


In Opera (9.21) not all of the text is clickable.


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[WSG] Business case for web standards

[Jon Whitehead]

Hi all

a uk wiki - business case for standards
http://icant.co.uk/webstandardsforbusiness/pmwiki.php

cheers

Jon


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Re : [WSG] Safari now on Windows

[Pierre-Henri Lavigne]

The staff members of your enterprise in charge of selling services / web sites 
can use the following text as an argument to not support IE Mac:
http://www.microsoft.com/mac/products/internetexplorer/internetexplorer.aspx?pid=internetexplorer
You can easily hide css by using the @import url('single_quote_hack.css');

About OS 9 users, from some tests I did at work, Mozilla has a better rendering 
than IE 5 Mac. (Not objective tests) Due to lack of interests, mozilla stopped 
it at the version 1.2. I guess you can easily find it thanks to google  - 
keyword : mozilla-macos9-1.2.1-stub.bin . It has been removed from the official 
archives on mozilla.org since they recommend iCab : 
http://www.mozilla.org/download.html#os9

Regards,




Åkeson Chihiro


Some exist through what they do...


We exist through what we are


Tel: +33 (0)6.18.75.32.67

- Message initial 
De : Michael MD <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
À : wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Envoyé le : mardi 12 juin 2007, 04 h 21 min 05 s
Objet : Re: [WSG] Safari now on Windows

>I recommend it to all those developers that are stuck in a Windows 
>environment - I have already fixed a few bugs I would have had to use my 
>bosses Mac to >find!
>My only concern is that at the moment, I can get away with "It might not 
>look 100% in Safari, but it still works..." With Safari on Iphone, 
>something which is >almost guaranteed to be a raging success, I'm pretty 
>sure I wont be able to use that defense forever.


I bought a second-hand Mac G4 from a friend last year so I could test with 
Mac browsers.

On most things I checked I did not see much difference in the rendering of 
pages in Safari compared to Firefox... I normally have much more trouble 
with IE.


iPhone might be a different thing altogether ..
 just because a page renders nicely in Safari on a desktop machine doesn't 
necessarely mean it is going to be very usable on a tiny screen!
(I haven't yet seen an iPhone but I assume the screen would be small like a 
mobile phone screen...?)

Speaking of Mac browsers -
a friend called me on the weekend and said he can't find anything newer than 
IE5 for OS9 but won't upgrade to OSX because it would be way too slow on his 
G3. (and he doesn't have the money to buy a new machine)
now that is something to think about! 







  Combattez les méchants pourriels... Le filtre SpamGuard vous aide à 
lutter efficacement contre les pourriels sur le Tout-nouveau Yahoo! Courriel

http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=40705/*http://mrd.mail.yahoo.com/try_beta?.intl=cf



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RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Thierry Koblentz]

> On Behalf Of Richard Ishida
 
> Thanks, Thierry.  Yes, I'm beginning to conclude that that's the only
> thing
> that I can do, too.  It doesn't really solve the problem though, when
> you
> have flexibility wrt box size or fonts, accessibility zooming, etc.  Oh
> well...

I came up with this:
http://www.tjkdesign.com/lab/button.asp
But it requires to move the text out of the button :(

---
Regards,
Thierry | www.TJKDesign.com






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RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Richard Ishida]

Thanks, Thierry.  Yes, I'm beginning to conclude that that's the only thing
that I can do, too.  It doesn't really solve the problem though, when you
have flexibility wrt box size or fonts, accessibility zooming, etc.  Oh
well...

Glad you enjoyed the talk.

Cheers, RI


Richard Ishida
Internationalization Lead
W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)
 
http://www.w3.org/People/Ishida/
http://www.w3.org/International/
http://people.w3.org/rishida/blog/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/
 
 

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Thierry Koblentz
> Sent: 20 June 2007 18:46
> To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> Subject: RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?
> 
> > On Behalf Of Richard Ishida
> > Hmm. On the other hand..
> > 
> > It works fine in Firefox, Opera, Safari (Win), but not in IE :((
> > 
> > Grr.
> 
> AFAIK, the only thing that works in IE is to use a  
> within the string...
> 
> OT: really enjoyed your presentation at @media in San 
> Francisco the other week :-)
> 
> ---
> Regards,
> Thierry | www.TJKDesign.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 



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RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Richard Ishida]

Thanks, Nick.

I did have the attribute set already, but it doesn't seem to help.  Here is
my code now:


 Envianos un
comentario


 


And my CSS:

.container button.interaction {
  font-size: 130%;
  color: #e70;
  background-color: #ff; 
  border: 0; 
  margin: 0; 
  padding: 0;
  text-align: left; /* for IE */
  cursor: pointer;
  max-width: 100%;
  }

IE still truncates the French, rather than wrapping it.  I will probably
have to resort to using , but that's far from ideal for boxes with
some flex to them or when users may have different fonts etc.

RI


Richard Ishida
Internationalization Lead
W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)
 
http://www.w3.org/People/Ishida/
http://www.w3.org/International/
http://people.w3.org/rishida/blog/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/
 
 

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nick Fitzsimons
> Sent: 20 June 2007 18:17
> To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> Subject: Re: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?
> 
> On 20 Jun 2007, at 17:37:59, Richard Ishida wrote:
> 
> > Hmm. On the other hand..
> >
> > It works fine in Firefox, Opera, Safari (Win), but not in IE :((
> >
> > Grr.
> 
> Have you specified the "type" attribute with value "submit"? 
> Although the spec states that this is the default, IE 
> defaults to the value "button" instead. Specifying the 
> attribute should get it working in IE.
> 
> OT: really enjoyed your presentation at @media in London the 
> other week :-)
> 
> HTH,
> 
> Nick.
> --
> Nick Fitzsimons
> http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ***
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RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Thierry Koblentz]

> On Behalf Of Richard Ishida
> Hmm. On the other hand..
> 
> It works fine in Firefox, Opera, Safari (Win), but not in IE :((
> 
> Grr.

AFAIK, the only thing that works in IE is to use a  within the
string...

OT: really enjoyed your presentation at @media in San Francisco the other
week :-)

---
Regards,
Thierry | www.TJKDesign.com






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Re: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Nick Fitzsimons]

On 20 Jun 2007, at 17:37:59, Richard Ishida wrote:


Hmm. On the other hand..

It works fine in Firefox, Opera, Safari (Win), but not in IE :((

Grr.


Have you specified the "type" attribute with value "submit"? Although  
the spec states that this is the default, IE defaults to the value  
"button" instead. Specifying the attribute should get it working in IE.


OT: really enjoyed your presentation at @media in London the other  
week :-)


HTH,

Nick.
--
Nick Fitzsimons
http://www.nickfitz.co.uk/





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Re: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Alan Trick]

I don't know if this is important to you, but you should really use GET,
not POST. POST is supposed to be used when you're actually doing
something to a page like submitting data. There, you're just getting a
form. See http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec9.html

Alan Trick

Richard Ishida wrote:
> I put together a box that expands to accommodate larger text in translation, 
> but I forgot that text on a submit button doesn't wrap :O 
> 
> Original: 
> http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.en.php#endlinks (see 
> the box to the right)
> First problematic translation: 
> http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.fr.php#endlinks
> 
> I want the text "Send us a comment" to look like a link, but trigger a POST, 
> so I put the text in a submit button and styled it. Unfortunately the longer 
> translations won't wrap that way.
> 
> 
> 
>  type="hidden">
>  value="http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.fr.php"; 
> type="hidden">
>  
> 
> 
> Does anyone know a better way to do this?  I was hoping to avoid using 
> JavaScript, if possible.
> 
> Cheers,
> RI
> 
> 
> 
> Richard Ishida
> Internationalization Lead
> W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)



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Description: OpenPGP digital signature

RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Thierry Koblentz]

> On Behalf Of Chris Taylor
> Have you tried the  element? As far as I know that can be
> styled
> pretty much how you want. I used it on this page:
> http://www.searchandgo.com/weather/United-States/New-York-City/ - the
> "New
> York City exchange rates" text on the left is a button.

Clever...
I'd add a "cursor:pointer" declaration to give pointing device users a clue
that this text is "clickable".

---
Regards,
Thierry | www.TJKDesign.com





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RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Richard Ishida]

Hmm. On the other hand..

It works fine in Firefox, Opera, Safari (Win), but not in IE :((

Grr.

RI


Richard Ishida
Internationalization Lead
W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)
 
http://www.w3.org/People/Ishida/
http://www.w3.org/International/
http://people.w3.org/rishida/blog/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/
 
 

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard Ishida
> Sent: 20 June 2007 17:08
> To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> Subject: RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?
> 
> Aha!  Yes, that seems to do the job, if I set an appropriate 
> width.  Many thanks, Chris.
> 
> What a great list this is.
> 
> RI
> 
> 
> Richard Ishida
> Internationalization Lead
> W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)
>  
> http://www.w3.org/People/Ishida/
> http://www.w3.org/International/
> http://people.w3.org/rishida/blog/
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/
>  
>  
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chris Taylor
> > Sent: 20 June 2007 16:11
> > To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> > Subject: RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?
> > 
> > Have you tried the  element? As far as I know that can be 
> > styled pretty much how you want. I used it on this page:
> > http://www.searchandgo.com/weather/United-States/New-York-City
> / - the "New York City exchange rates" text on the left is a > button.
> > 
> > I may have missed the point of your question, of course. It happens 
> > regularly with me.
> > 
> > Chris
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard Ishida
> > Sent: 20 June 2007 15:52
> > To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> > Subject: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?
> > 
> > I put together a box that expands to accommodate larger text in 
> > translation, but I forgot that text on a submit button 
> doesn't wrap :O
> > 
> > Original:
> > http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.en.ph
> p#endlinks
> > (see the box to the right)
> > First problematic translation:
> > http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.fr.ph
> p#endlinks
> > 
> > I want the text "Send us a comment" to look like a link, 
> but trigger a 
> > POST, so I put the text in a submit button and styled it. 
> > Unfortunately the longer translations won't wrap that way.
> > 
> >  > method="post">  > type="submit">  > value="/International/questions/qa-css-charset.en.php"
> > type="hidden">
> >  > value="http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charse
> t.fr.php"
> > type="hidden">
> >  
> > 
> > Does anyone know a better way to do this?  I was hoping to 
> avoid using 
> > JavaScript, if possible.
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > RI
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Richard Ishida
> > Internationalization Lead
> > W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)
> >  
> > http://www.w3.org/People/Ishida/
> > http://www.w3.org/International/
> > http://people.w3.org/rishida/blog/
> > http://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/
> >  
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ***
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RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Richard Ishida]

Aha!  Yes, that seems to do the job, if I set an appropriate width.  Many
thanks, Chris.

What a great list this is.

RI


Richard Ishida
Internationalization Lead
W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)
 
http://www.w3.org/People/Ishida/
http://www.w3.org/International/
http://people.w3.org/rishida/blog/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/
 
 

> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Chris Taylor
> Sent: 20 June 2007 16:11
> To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> Subject: RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?
> 
> Have you tried the  element? As far as I know that 
> can be styled pretty much how you want. I used it on this page:
> http://www.searchandgo.com/weather/United-States/New-York-City
/ - the "New York City exchange rates" text on the left is a > button.
> 
> I may have missed the point of your question, of course. It 
> happens regularly with me.
> 
> Chris
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard Ishida
> Sent: 20 June 2007 15:52
> To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
> Subject: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?
> 
> I put together a box that expands to accommodate larger text 
> in translation, but I forgot that text on a submit button 
> doesn't wrap :O 
> 
> Original:
> http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.en.ph
p#endlinks
> (see the box to the right)
> First problematic translation:
> http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.fr.ph
p#endlinks
> 
> I want the text "Send us a comment" to look like a link, but 
> trigger a POST, so I put the text in a submit button and 
> styled it. Unfortunately the longer translations won't wrap that way.
> 
>  method="post">   value="/International/questions/qa-css-charset.en.php"
> type="hidden">
>  value="http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charse
t.fr.php"
> type="hidden">
>  
> 
> Does anyone know a better way to do this?  I was hoping to 
> avoid using JavaScript, if possible.
> 
> Cheers,
> RI
> 
> 
> 
> Richard Ishida
> Internationalization Lead
> W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)
>  
> http://www.w3.org/People/Ishida/
> http://www.w3.org/International/
> http://people.w3.org/rishida/blog/
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/
>  
> 
> 
> 
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RE: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Chris Taylor]

Have you tried the  element? As far as I know that can be styled
pretty much how you want. I used it on this page:
http://www.searchandgo.com/weather/United-States/New-York-City/ - the "New
York City exchange rates" text on the left is a button.

I may have missed the point of your question, of course. It happens
regularly with me.

Chris



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Richard Ishida
Sent: 20 June 2007 15:52
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

I put together a box that expands to accommodate larger text in translation,
but I forgot that text on a submit button doesn't wrap :O 

Original:
http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.en.php#endlinks
(see the box to the right)
First problematic translation:
http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.fr.php#endlinks

I want the text "Send us a comment" to look like a link, but trigger a POST,
so I put the text in a submit button and styled it. Unfortunately the longer
translations won't wrap that way.




http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.fr.php";
type="hidden">
 


Does anyone know a better way to do this?  I was hoping to avoid using
JavaScript, if possible.

Cheers,
RI



Richard Ishida
Internationalization Lead
W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)
 
http://www.w3.org/People/Ishida/
http://www.w3.org/International/
http://people.w3.org/rishida/blog/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/
 



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[WSG] Triggering POSTs with links?

[Richard Ishida]

I put together a box that expands to accommodate larger text in translation, 
but I forgot that text on a submit button doesn't wrap :O 

Original: 
http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.en.php#endlinks (see 
the box to the right)
First problematic translation: 
http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.fr.php#endlinks

I want the text "Send us a comment" to look like a link, but trigger a POST, so 
I put the text in a submit button and styled it. Unfortunately the longer 
translations won't wrap that way.




http://www.w3.org/International/questions/qa-css-charset.fr.php"; 
type="hidden">
 


Does anyone know a better way to do this?  I was hoping to avoid using 
JavaScript, if possible.

Cheers,
RI



Richard Ishida
Internationalization Lead
W3C (World Wide Web Consortium)
 
http://www.w3.org/People/Ishida/
http://www.w3.org/International/
http://people.w3.org/rishida/blog/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ishida/
 



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RE: [WSG] Certifications / Exams / Accreditations / Qualifications

[Web Man Walking]

Hi

Thanks for your reply.  I was kind of thinking the same thing as you and a
wee bit investigation revealed not a lot.  I am indeed in the UK (Scotland)
and have a degree in Computer Science from way back :-)

You may be right about the portfolio and keeping up to date but some way to
qualify this might be nice.  I have not checked on the MS Cert's recently
but last time I did look they were based on MS products.

E. 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of James Leslie
Sent: 20 June 2007 14:06
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] Certifications / Exams / Accreditations / Qualifications

I was wondering If anyone could suggest any credible certifications, exams,
qualifications etc. in:

 * Web Standards
 * Accessibility
 * SEO
 * Site Building / Design
 * etc.

That would be worthwhile taking/having on my CV as well as being useful from
a learning point of view.  I have an old MCP+SB from a few years ago but
it's all changed now :-)


Hi,

I noticed that you are based in the UK, and to be honest, there aren't
really any certificates that count for anything here, aside from possibly a
degree/masters in Computer Science or similar.

I changed career about 4 years ago to web design after playing around with
it for a couple of years as a hobby and was looking for courses as you
describe. The only thing I really found was CIW (certified internet
webmaster) courses, which I duly took. They were pretty basic and only
covered stuff I could have got from half a £10 book. I then found that I had
to explain what these 'qualifications' were at every job interview I had...
No-one had heard of them. On a positive note, I guess they improved my
confidence towards my work.

>From personal experience, I found that the UK market is pretty keen on
accessibility and standards so I worked hard at trying to understand these
areas and building up a decent portfolio. A portfolio is much more important
than a CV nowadays.

I am now involved in our recruitment process and tend to be much more
interested in whether candidates read lists such as this one, read/write
blogs, go to conferences, etc than if they have a degree or other
certificate.

The web moves so quickly that what is relevant now may be irrelevant in a
years time (tabindex and accesskeys being 2 things that pop to the front of
my mind as fairly recent examples of this phenomenon).

Hope that helps

James





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RE: [WSG] Certifications / Exams / Accreditations / Qualifications

[James Leslie]

I was wondering If anyone could suggest any credible certifications, exams, 
qualifications etc. in:

 * Web Standards
 * Accessibility
 * SEO
 * Site Building / Design
 * etc.

That would be worthwhile taking/having on my CV as well as being useful from a 
learning point of view.  I have an old MCP+SB from a few years ago but it's all 
changed now :-)


Hi,

I noticed that you are based in the UK, and to be honest, there aren't really 
any certificates that count for anything here, aside from possibly a 
degree/masters in Computer Science or similar.

I changed career about 4 years ago to web design after playing around with it 
for a couple of years as a hobby and was looking for courses as you describe. 
The only thing I really found was CIW (certified internet webmaster) courses, 
which I duly took. They were pretty basic and only covered stuff I could have 
got from half a £10 book. I then found that I had to explain what these 
'qualifications' were at every job interview I had... No-one had heard of them. 
On a positive note, I guess they improved my confidence towards my work.

>From personal experience, I found that the UK market is pretty keen on 
>accessibility and standards so I worked hard at trying to understand these 
>areas and building up a decent portfolio. A portfolio is much more important 
>than a CV nowadays.

I am now involved in our recruitment process and tend to be much more 
interested in whether candidates read lists such as this one, read/write blogs, 
go to conferences, etc than if they have a degree or other certificate.

The web moves so quickly that what is relevant now may be irrelevant in a years 
time (tabindex and accesskeys being 2 things that pop to the front of my mind 
as fairly recent examples of this phenomenon).

Hope that helps

James





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[WSG] Certifications / Exams / Accreditations / Qualifications

[Web Man Walking]

Hello

I was wondering If anyone could suggest any credible certifications, exams,
qualifications etc. in:

 * Web Standards
 * Accessibility
 * SEO
 * Site Building / Design
 * etc.

That would be worthwhile taking/having on my CV as well as being useful from
a learning point of view.  I have an old MCP+SB from a few years ago but
it's all changed now :-)

Thank you.

!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!

Chris & Ed successfully ran the 2007 Edinburgh
Marathon for the Meningitis Research
Foundation

We are still looking for sponsors!

Our Progress:   http://wmwmarathon.com/
Sponsor Us: http://justgiving.com/wmwmarathon

!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!*!

Regards

Ed Henderson

Web Man Walking - web design & usability experts
t: 0131 669 8800
m: 0781 253 6964
f: 0797 062 1532
e: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
w: web-man-walking.com
a: 48 Eastfield, Edinburgh, EH15 2PN
skype: webmanwalking
msn: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
"New technology, old fashioned service"




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Re: [WSG] JavaScript gurus - exercise in vanity

[Josh Suggs]

Sam Stephenson, author of the Prototype JavaScript framework
Thomas Fuchs, author of script.aculo.us

On 6/19/07, Keryx Web <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Hello all!

Who, in your opinion, are the 5 best JavaScript gurus?

This is a question that might seem silly, but there is actually a great
deal of thought behind it. I am working on a paper at university level,
that intends to describe the benefits of unobtrusive DOM-scripting,
compared to old school inaccessible DHTML or badly written AJAX apps. I
intend use arguments such as "the leading experts say..." and "the most
esteemed writers - such as N.N. and N.N. - argue that..."

A guru would be someone that has consistently lead the way through
developing ground-breaking patterns and/or top notch apps and who has
written about it in books and/or on the web. Someone who is regarded as
a master by his (or her) peers. Some geniuses may be working in
obscurity - so this is not a a competition as to who is the "best"
developer.

And yes, I realize that all answers will be subjective and IMHO...

I will kick off this discussion with my list:

1. Brendan Eich - he invented the language and leads it's continual
development into JS 2. Hard to ignore.

2. Douglas Crockford. JSLint, JSMin, JSON; inheritance,
public/private/privileged methods... and a superb lecturer.

3. David Flanagan. Only author recommended by DC! At least until
recently. But the Rhino book is still the seminal work on JS - right?

4. Dean Edwards. Inventor of numerous genial projects (Base, CSSQuery,
Packer...) Nice blog that is always a learning experience to read. He
tends to be read by many pros.

5. PPK. He has been running quirksmode fore quite some time now. Main
author of WASP's JavaScript Manifesto. Author of the best JS book from a
  pedagogic POV.

Apologies to anyone not on my list...


@listdad: If this is off-topic, please say so.

@rest: If this discussion is considered OT, you may answer me in private.


Lars Gunther


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--

8^)

Cheers-
Josh


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RE: [WSG] fieldset for single input field

[Chris Taylor]

Unless there's something a bit weird happening*, I'd say don't wrap each
form input in it's own fieldset. A fieldset is meant to group several
related form elements together (see:
http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/interact/forms.html#h-17.10 "The FIELDSET element
allows authors to group thematically related controls and labels.").

* For example if you're building a dynamic form generator it could be that a
particular form has several required sections, each displayed as a fieldset,
but that the author only puts one form field in a section. Therefore one
field in the fieldset. Just a thought.

Regards

Chris


-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of ben van 't ende [netcreators]
Sent: 20 June 2007 09:01
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] fieldset for single input field

Hi,

We are building a form generator for a CMS (TYPO3). The question came to our
mind if it would be necessary to wrap a single input field in a fieldset. To
my
best of knowledge a fieldset is meant to group fields.

gRTz

ben
-- 
netcreators :: creation and innovation
www.netcreators.com -  www.typo3.nl


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Re: [WSG]shorthand doesn't work for bg position (was auto-hiding bottom part of bg image when resizing fontsize

[Tee G. Peng]

On Jun 20, 2007, at 1:18 AM, Philippe Wittenbergh wrote:




your stylesheet for that page has this:
background-position:fixed;
'fixed is an invalid value for background-position.
You are probably trying to specify 'background-attachment:fixed';

Maybe take 5 minutes to actually read the css 2.1 specs ?



Thanks for the reminder! yes I need to be reminded again and again :)

I *did* read it though, and actually wrote back again. Not sure about  
others, but my message usually shows up at least 10 minutes later  
(sometime longer) on this list, so you probably didn't see that  
message coming in when you wrote.


tee


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Re: [WSG]shorthand doesn't work for bg position (was auto-hiding bottom part of bg image when resizing fontsize

[Philippe Wittenbergh]

On Jun 20, 2007, at 4:46 PM, Tee G. Peng wrote:

I forgot to mention, in the below page, if you make the screen  
shorter show that it shows vertical srollbar, and try scroll the  
page, you can see there 'writing, coaching...' headline image being  
moved.


No the headline image (tagline.jpg) scroll as expected, it is inline  
in the html.
Your background image is fixed: pinned to the viewport. That is what  
it says in your stylesheet (css/global2.css):
#container {background: url(../images/pic.jpg) no-repeat 459px top  
fixed;}




Here is the test page:
http://project.lotusseedsdesign.com/wandahennig/index2.html





In this page,  http://project.lotusseedsdesign.com/wandahennig/
where I removed 'fixed' in the background property, and have it  
replaced in 'background-position', the headline image doesn't move.


That background image is _not_ 'fixed', it scrolls with the page,  
which is what you want. And the headline image, like above also  
scrolls with the viewport.


your stylesheet for that page has this:
background-position:fixed;
'fixed is an invalid value for background-position.
You are probably trying to specify 'background-attachment:fixed';

Maybe take 5 minutes to actually read the css 2.1 specs ?



(don't rely to much on blog posts. Those are about cats.)
Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh






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Re: [WSG]shorthand doesn't work for bg position (was auto-hiding bottom part of bg image when resizing fontsize

[Tee G. Peng]

On Jun 20, 2007, at 12:46 AM, Tee G. Peng wrote:



In this page,  http://project.lotusseedsdesign.com/wandahennig/
where I removed 'fixed' in the background property, and have it  
replaced in 'background-position', the headline image doesn't move.


Am I missing something obvious?


OK, I think I found the answer, because 'fixed' is not a background- 
position value so browsers simply ingored it, and 'fixed' was not  
needed at all for background property in this case.


tee


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[WSG] fieldset for single input field

[ben van 't ende [netcreators]]

Hi,

We are building a form generator for a CMS (TYPO3). The question came to our
mind if it would be necessary to wrap a single input field in a fieldset. To my
best of knowledge a fieldset is meant to group fields.

gRTz

ben
-- 
netcreators :: creation and innovation
www.netcreators.com -  www.typo3.nl


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Re: [WSG]shorthand doesn't work for bg position (was auto-hiding bottom part of bg image when resizing fontsize

[Tee G. Peng]

Hi Philipe,

I forgot to mention, in the below page, if you make the screen  
shorter show that it shows vertical srollbar, and try scroll the  
page, you can see there 'writing, coaching...' headline image being  
moved.




Here is the test page:
http://project.lotusseedsdesign.com/wandahennig/index2.html





In this page,  http://project.lotusseedsdesign.com/wandahennig/
where I removed 'fixed' in the background property, and have it  
replaced in 'background-position', the headline image doesn't move.


Am I missing something obvious?

tee



But don't forget that 'fixed' means fixed to the viewport.

Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh






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Re: [WSG]shorthand doesn't work for bg position (was auto-hiding bottom part of bg image when resizing fontsize

[Philippe Wittenbergh]

On Jun 20, 2007, at 3:57 PM, Tee G. Peng wrote:

Strange! it really doesn't work for me for my testing in Safair,  
Firefox and Opera.
I tried placing 'fixed' before and after the 'no-repeat', also  
after the x/y positions.


Here is the test page:
http://project.lotusseedsdesign.com/wandahennig/index2.html


There is a fixed background image (a sepia-toned image of a lady) on  
that page.
There are no problems with the order of values in the shorthand  
declaration.

See the syntax in:


But don't forget that 'fixed' means fixed to the viewport.

Philippe
---
Philippe Wittenbergh






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Re: [WSG]shorthand doesn't work for bg position (was auto-hiding bottom part of bg image when resizing fontsize

[Tee G. Peng]

On Jun 18, 2007, at 12:24 PM, Robert O'Rourke wrote:



By the way, I have a question regarding fixed background position

it doesn't work in this way in Safari and Firefox either.
#container {background: url(image.jpg) fixed no-repeat}
so I changed to
 #container {background-position: fixed}


Im pretty sure it was working for me in Firefox just before... the  
background image scrolled with the page. Not sure why it wouldn't  
have worked for you.


Rob, I meant to reply this yesterday.

Strange! it really doesn't work for me for my testing in Safair,  
Firefox and Opera.
I tried placing 'fixed' before and after the 'no-repeat', also after  
the x/y positions.


Here is the test page:
http://project.lotusseedsdesign.com/wandahennig/index2.html


Accroding to CSS shothand guide, placing the 'fixed' in the  
background should work.

http://www.dustindiaz.com/css-shorthand/

#container {background: url(../images/pic.jpg) fixed no-repeat 459px  
top  ; /* I was certain it worked for body {background: url(../images/ 
pic.jpg) fixed no-repeat 459px top} in the first version I posted for  
help, but I tested it now in body, it doesn't work anymore.  
Unfortunately I can't duplicate what I did with entire style sheet */


and here is the working one where I removed the 'fixed' from  
background property

http://project.lotusseedsdesign.com/wandahennig

#container {background: url(../images/pic.jpg) no-repeat 459px top;
background-position:fixed;
width: 999px; text-align: left;}

 Can someone explains why it has this behaviour? I am trying to  
think maybe it has a dependency and inheritance, when, for instance,  
a relative position is declared somewhere. Hmmm, if I don't get an  
answer to feed my curoisty from you gurus, I will need to run more  
tests to find the answer myself.


Thanks!

tee



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